TED: COMING UP NEXT ON "ARIZONA HORIZON," THE INCREASING CONTROVERSY OVER THE USE OF FLOCK CAMERAS IN ARIZONA.

>>> ALSO TONIGHT, WE'LL LOOK AT THE IMPACT OF ANOTHER HIKE IN TARIFFS ON CANADIAN GOODS.

>>> AND THE BLACK THEATRE TROUPE OPENS THIS SEASON WITH A PLAY THAT FOCUSES ON THE IMPACT OF WRONGFUL CONVICTIONS.

THOSE STORIES AND MORE NEXT ON "ARIZONA HORIZON."

.

TED: GOOD EVENING, AND WELCOME TO "ARIZONA HORIZON."

I'M TED SIMONS.

CONCERNS OVER FLOCK CAMERAS ARE INCREASING AFTER REPORTS THAT SOME MEMBERS OF LAW ENFORCEMENT ARE USING THE AUTOMATED LICENSE PLATE READERS TO TRACK CURRENT, FORMER SPOUSES AND PARTNERS.

CONCERN IS HOW THE DATA IS KEPT AND WHO HAS ACCESS TO THE DATA.

JOINING US NOW IS ATTORNEY BOB McWHIRTER.

I DIDN'T KNOW WHAT A FLOCK CAMERA WAS A FEW MONTHS AGO, GIVE ME A DEFINITION, WHAT'S A FLOCK CAMERA?

>> IT'S A NETWORK OF CAMERAS PUT IN DIFFERENT CITIES.

GENERALLY CITIES, POLICE DEPARTMENTS CONTRACT WITH THE COMPANY.

IT'S CALLED FLOCK, THE NAME OF THE COMPANY.

THEY HAVE THE CAMERAS POSITIONED ALL AROUND THE CITY, AND THEY COLLECT DATA.

SO PRESUMABLY THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO BE USED FOR LAW ENFORCEMENT, SOMEBODY COMMITS A CRIME, THEY CAN KIND OF TRIANGULATE WHERE THIS IS AND GET THE CAMERA INFORMATION AND HAVE YOU VIDEO EVIDENCE OF WHAT OCCURRED.

I HAD ONE CASE, FOR INSTANCE, WHERE CERTAIN PERSON WAS ACCUSED OF ROBBING A PAWNSHOP WITH ONE CAR, SWITCHED TO ANOTHER CAR, AND THE POLICE MAINTAINED THEY HAVE A CAMERA OF THE SWITCH OF THE CARS FROM ONE CAR TO THE OTHER CAR.

THAT'S HOW IT WOULD BE USED.

IT WOULD BE MILES AWAY, BUT THEY WERE ABLE TO TRIANGULATE THAT INFORMATION.

>> THE MAKE, THE MODEL, THE COLOR, ANY DENTS, STICKERS.

IT'S GOOD AT IDENTIFYING THAT VEHICLE.

>> ABSOLUTELY.

IT HITS THE LICENSE PLATE, THE COLOR OF THE CAR.

LOOK, THINK OF THE FLOCK CAMERA AS A POLICE OFFICER SITTING ON A POLE 24/7, WITHOUT THE OVERTIME COSTS.

SITTING ON A POLE AND HE'S WATCHING EVERYTHING, AND HE'S RECORDING IT, AND YOU COULD ACCESS THAT RECORDING LATER ON, AND THAT'S WHAT A FLOCK CAMERA DOES.

THAT'S THE BEST VIEW OF THAT.

TED: SO WHAT HAPPENS TO THIS INFORMATION?

LET'S SAY THE POLICE DEPARTMENT LOOKS IT OVER, THEY FIND WHAT THEY WANT, DON'T FIND WHAT THEY WANT.

WHAT HAPPENS TO THE DATA?

WHERE IS IT GOING AND WHO HAS ACCESS?

>> SITS AROUND IN A DATABASE, PRESUMABLY, FOREVER.

THEY USE A.I.-GENERATED PROGRAMS TO TRIANGULATE AND CO-RELATE THE INFORMATION.

YOU PUT IN THE INFORMATION, CERTAIN PERSON, THIS HEIGHT, THIS HEIGHT, AND SPEWS OUT THE POSSIBILITIES THROUGH THE A.I.

PROGRAMMING.

THAT'S WHAT COMES UP AND THE POLICE VIEW IT AND CAN BE USED AS EVIDENCE.

TED: I'VE HEARD ABOUT ONLINE VIDEOS OF HACKERS.

THEY'RE GETTING INTO THESE LIVE CAMERA FEEDS.

I MEAN, HOW SECURE IS THIS STUFF?

IT'S GOING TO BE THERE FOREVER, HOW SECURE IS FOREVER?

>> WELL, THERE IS EXACTLY THE WORD.

I DON'T BELIEVE THERE'S A CONSTITUTIONAL ISSUE FOR HAVING THE FLOCK CAMERA, YOU DON'T HAVE EXPECTATION OF PRIVACY IN WHAT YOU DO IN THE PUBLIC, WHICH CAN BE FRIGHTENING FOR SOME OF US GIVEN WHAT WE'VE DONE IN PUBLIC.

YOU DON'T HAVE THE EXPECTATION OF PRIVACY IN THAT.

ONCE THE DATA IS TAKEN BACK AND OTHER PEOPLE CAN ACCESS IT FOR IMPROPER USES, SOMEBODY WHO HACKS IN, A PRIVATE PERSON HAS A VENDETTA AGAINST YOU OR A POLICE OFFICER CHASING AN EX-GIRLFRIEND, THAT IS JUST TERRIBLE.

WHAT IF IT GOES TO THE NEXT LEVEL, SOMEBODY IN POWER WANTS TO USE IT ON A POLITICAL OPPONENT AND GETS THAT INFORMATION.

THE CONSTITUTIONAL PROBLEMS CAN COME IN THE WAY THE INFORMATION IS STORED AND THEN LATER USED.

THERE'S WHERE PRIVACY CONCERNS HAPPEN YOU.

>> GAVE A SITUATION, A HYPOTHETICAL THAT IS ACTUALLY REALTIME WITH LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS TRACKING EXES, TRACKING SPOUSES, TRACKING ALL SORTS OF FOLKS.

MISUSING THIS SYSTEM.

IT'S ONE OF THE REASONS, SOUNDS LIKE A LOT OF CITIES THOUGHT THIS WAS A GREAT IDEA, NOW THEY WANT OUT.

>> THEY WANT OUT.

TROUBLE IS CONTROLLING ALL THAT DATA CAN BE EXPENSIVE AND CAN BE JUST FRAUGHT WITH PERIL FOR A CITY AND CIVIL LIABILITY.

YOU DON'T CONTROL THAT POLICE OFFICER AND THEY'RE USING IT AGAINST SOMEONE THEY DON'T LIKE, THERE'S A BIG FAT LAWSUIT AGAINST THE CITY.

TED: ARE THE CAMERAS HELPING TO FIGHT CRIME?

ARE THEY HELPING TO FIND MISSING PERSONS?

TRACKING SUSPECTS?

THESE SORTS OF THINGS?

>> YES, THEY ARE HAVING SUCCESS AT THAT.

THE QUESTION REALLY BECOMES: IS THE DETRIMENT OF THIS TECHNOLOGY WORTH THE BENEFIT OF THE TECHNOLOGY?

THAT'S WHERE IT COMES DOWN TO.

DO YOU REALLY WANT A SOCIETY WHERE ABSOLUTELY EVERYTHING YOU DO FOREVER IS ON A DATABASE THAT SOMEBODY CAN HACK INTO AND FIND?

IS THAT WORTH THE BENEFIT THAT YOU GET FROM MAYBE FINDING AN EXTRA ESCAPEE FROM A BANK ROBBERY?

IS IT WORTH IT.

TED: THE AGE-OLD QUESTION, IS THERE A COMPROMISE BETWEEN SAFETY AND SECURITY?

>> THE ONLY WAY, DEFINING THE MINUTIA TO HOW THE INFORMATION IS USED.

TED: WITH THAT IN MIND, IT SOUNDS LIKE IT'S A DOWNWARD TRAJECTORY NOW.

WHAT DO I HAVE NOW, 90 CITIES IN AMERICA WALKED AWAY IN AUGUST ALONE FROM USING FLOCK CAMERAS.

WHAT'S THE FUTURE OF THIS TECHNOLOGY?

>> I THINK IT'S HERE TO STAY.

WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN AFTER FLOCK CAMERAS, SEEMS TO HAVE BEEN A THING THE LAST TWO WEEKS.

WHAT IF IT GOES OF IMAGINATION AND THEY PICK IT UP AT A DISCOUNT.

THIS IS RELATED TO THE IDEA OF PHOTO RADAR, AND IT'S CLOSELY RELATED.

PHOTO RADAR HAS BEEN PROVEN TO CREATE MORE SAFE ROADS, COLLECT FINES AND ACTUALLY HAVE ENFORCEMENT, IT'S SHOWN THAT PEOPLE DON'T WANT THE LAWS ENFORCED THE WAY THEY'RE WRITTEN BECAUSE IT'S MORE EFFECTIVE THAN A COP SITTING ON A CORNER, AND I THINK THERE'S A CO-RELATION BETWEEN FLOCK CAMERAS AND THE FEELINGS PEOPLE HAVE ABOUT PHOTO RADAR.

TED: INTERESTING.

THE FEELINGS ABOUT PHOTO RADAR, I KNOW THAT CROWD, AND I KNOW PEOPLE, AND I'M NOT CRAZY ABOUT SEEING ALL THESE THINGS FLASHING AROUND AS WELL.

WITH FLOCK CAMERAS, IT SEEMS LIKE A DIFFERENT TECHNOLOGY, BUT IT'S KIND OF THE SAME.

>> IT'S ON STEROIDS.

PHOTO RADAR ON STEROIDS LOOKING AT EVERYTHING YOU'VE DONE, THAT'S THE DIFFERENCE.

TED: LAST QUESTION, AS FAR AS CONSTITUTIONAL ASPECTS, COURT PROCEEDINGS.

FLOCK CAMERAS, HOW WILL THEY BE USED?

HOW WILL THE TECHNOLOGY BE INCORPORATEED?

>> INTERESTING CASES OUT OF THE SUPREME COURT.

THE U.S.

SUPREME COURT CAME OUT WITH CARPENTER V. U.S.

HAD TO DO WITH A TELEPHONE AND THE HEAD OF A BANK ROBBERY GANG HAD TO BE ONE BLOCK AWAY FROM BANK ROBBERS AND USED TOWERS TO TRIANGULATE WHERE HE WAS, THE SUPREME COURT SAID THAT IS A SEARCH UNDER THE FOURTH AMENDMENT.

YOU NEEDED TO GET A WARRANT.

THIS YEAR THEY HAD CARTHY V. UNITED STATES WHICH USED GEOFENCES, THEY GO TO GOOGLE AND DEA NONMIZING YOU, ALL OF MY DATABASE IS UP THERE AND THE SUPREME COURT ALSO SAID THAT'S A SEARCH INTO THE FOURTH AMENDMENT.

SO THAT'S KIND OF THE CONSTITUTIONAL GROUNDWORK, AND THE QUESTION IS HOW DO FLOCK CAMERAS COME IN WITH THE DATA?

DO YOU NEED TO HAVE A WARRANT TO GET THIS?

ET CETERA.

PROBABLY NOT, BUT IMPLICATING THE SAME ISSUES.

TED: WE'LL HEAR MUCH MORE ABOUT IT.

BOB McWHIRTER, ATTORNEY, FRIEND OF THE PROGRAM.

GOOD TO SEE YOU.

>> ALWAYS A PLNONMYSELF .

>>> .

TED: PRESIDENT TRUMP'S RECENT ANNOUNCEMENT THAT THE U.S.

WILL IMPOSE A 50% TARIFF ON SOME CANADIAN GOODS WAS ANSWERED BY CANADA IMPOSING RETALIATORY TARIFFS ON U.S.

GOODS HEADING NORTH.

IT'S SHAPING UP TO A TRADE WAR THAT FURTHER FRACTIONS RELATIONS BETWEEN HISTORICALLY FRIENDLY COUNTRIES.

WE WELCOME JOHN VON HEYKING OF ASU'S ECONOMIC SCHOOL OF THOUGHT AND LEADERSHIP.

GOOD TO SEE YOU.

>> THANK YOU, GOOD TO BE HERE.

TED: WHERE DOES IT STAND WHERE WE SIT BETWEEN THE UNITED STATES AND CANADA REGARDING TARIFFS?

>> I THINK WE'RE IN AN UNCERTAIN ZONE FOR THE NEXT FEW WEEKS, BUT THE SIGNS THAT THE TWO SIDES ARE MOVING CLOSER TOGETHER AGAIN.

MUCH OF THEIR PAIR OF CAN BE EXPLAINED BY SHORT-TERM ELECTORAL POLITICS.

SO ON THE AMERICAN SIDE, YOU'VE GOT MIDTERM ELECTIONS AND A LOT OF THOSE ARE CLOSE RACES IN STATES THAT ARE AFFECTED BY THE TARIFF DISCUSSIONS.

THE STEELWORKERS, AUTO WORKERS, STATES LIKE MICHIGAN, OHIO, PENNSYLVANIA, THOSE ARE QUITE CLOSE RACES, AND IF YOU PAY ATTENTION TO THE COUNTERTARIFFS OR THE TARIFFS THE CANADIANS HAVE IMPOSED, THEY TARGET THOSE STATES AS A WAY OF NUDGING THINGS.

TED: YES.

>> YEAH.

YEAH.

ON THE CANADIAN SIDE, JUST LAST NIGHT ACTUALLY, CANADA HAD THREE BYELECTIONS, SO THE AMERICAN VERSION OF THAT WOULD BE SPECIAL ELECTIONS.

SOMEBODY RESIGNS FROM OFFICE.

AN OFFCYCLE ELECTION.

ALL THREE OF THE BYELECTIONS WERE HEAVILY AFFECTED BY THE TARIFF DISCUSSIONS.

JUST AS ONE LITTLE FACTOID, IN QUEBEC, THE PERSON WHO WON IS A LOBBYIST FOR THE DAIRY PRODUCERS, IT IS A KEY FLASH POINT BETWEEN MARK CARNEY, PRIME MINISTER OF CANADA, HAS HIS EYE ON SHORT-TERM ELECTORAL GAINS, NOW HAVING WON ALL THE THREE BYELECTIONS, HE HAS A STRONGER MAJORITY.

I THINK THAT WILL CALM THINGS DOWN ON THE CANADIAN SIDE.

MIGHT HAVE TO WAIT LONGER TO SEE HOW THE MIDTERMS PLAY OUT FOR THE ADMINISTRATION.

TED: PRESIDENT TRUMP SAYS WE DON'T NEED CANADA.

THEY NEED US, AND HE CALLS THEM AMONG THE WORST NATIONS IN THE WORLD TO DEAL WITH.

IS THIS BLUSTER?

HOW SERIOUS DO WE TAKE?

IS THIS NEGOTIATING?

YOU KNOW, THIS IS LIKE SCHOOL YARD STUFF HERE, BUT HE IS THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES.

>> YEAH.

IT'S PROBABLY A LOT OF BLUSTER, BUT A LOT OF THE ISSUES THAT THEY'RE DEALING WITH, AMERICAN SIDE, HAVE BEEN CONCERNED ABOUT FOR A VERY LONG TIME.

SO TAKE SUPPLY MANAGEMENT OVER DAIRY PRODUCTS.

THAT GOES BACK AT LEAST TO THE CLINTON ADMINISTRATION EXPRESSING CONCERN OVER THAT.

SO THE LAST FEW PRESIDENCIES, THOSE TRADE IRRITANTS HAVE BEEN IGNORED OR AT LEAST NOT REALLY PRESSED BY THE AMERICAN SIDE, BUT BECAUSE OF THE PRIORITIES OF THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION, THEY BROUGHT SOME OF THESE TO THE FOREFRONT, AND THAT'S CHANGED THE DYNAMIC, BUT GOING FORWARD, THERE'S STILL BROAD TERM TRADE IRRITANTS, WHETHER YOU ARE THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION OR ANOTHER ADMINISTRATION.

TED: WE HAD A REPUBLICAN CANDIDATE FOR CONGRESS DURING OUR "CANDIDATES IN CONVERSATION," I ASKED ABOUT THE IDEA OF LAKE AMERICA, CHANGING THE NAME OF A GREAT LAKE, TO CALL IT LAKE AMERICA.

HE ALMOST LAUGHED IT OFF, AND SAID IT'S JUST A NEGOTIATING PLOY, HE'S DOING THAT TO YANK CHAINS IN ORDER TO GET WHAT HE WANTS.

IS THAT WHERE WE ARE RIGHT NOW?

>> MR.

TRUMP SPENDS A LOT OF TIME WITH MEAN TWEETS.

[ LAUGHTER ] >> SO FOR WHATEVER REASON HE USED THAT AS A USEFUL NEGOTIATING TACTIC TO KIND OF CREATE CHAOS.

ON THE CANADIAN SIDE, THEY FALL FOR IT.

SO THE CANADIANS HAVE DEMONSTRATED THEMSELVES GOING BACK SEVERAL MONTHS THAT MAYBE THEY'RE A LITTLE THIN SKINNED.

HE KNOWS HOW TO GET A RISE OUT OF THEM AND CONTRAST WITH HOW THE MEXICANS RESPOND, MR.

TRUMP SAID MUCH MORE OFFENSIVE THINGS TO THE MEXICANS AND THE MEXICANS ARE JUST SORT OF IGNORE IT.

TED: LIKE THE GULF OF AMERICA, THEY DON'T CARE TOO MUCH ABOUT THAT.

>> THEY'RE A LITTLE MORE COOLHEADED, AND ONE OF THE REASONS FOR THAT DIFFERENCE IS THE CANADIAN FEDERAL GOVERNMENT BASES MORE OF ITS POPULARITY ON SORT OF STANDING UP TO AMERICA.

THERE'S A KIND OF ANTI-AMERICAN SENTIMENT AND CERTAIN SECTORS, ESPECIALLY IN THE GREAT LAKES REGION THAT APPARENTLY PRESIDENT SHEINBAUM OF MEXICO DOESN'T HAVE TO RELY ON THAT AS MUCH, EVEN THOUGH MEXICO HAS LOTS OF HISTORY WITH AMERICA.

TED: BUSINESS COSTS, CONSUMER PRICES, WHAT IS THE ECONOMIC IMPACT OF ALL THIS BACK AND FORTH INCREASING TARIFFS?

>> HIGHER PRICES ACROSS THE BOARD, OR FOR MANY PRODUCTS.

PROBABLY THE NOT FUNNIEST, BUT THE QUIRKIEST PRODUCT IS GOING TO BE THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION HAS PUT -- WILL PUT A 50% TARIFF ON A CERTAIN PRODUCT THAT GOES INTO TOILET PAPER, SO AMERICANS CAN EXPECT HIGHER PRICES FOR TOILET PAPER BECAUSE THE CANADIAN PRODUCT THAT GOES INTO IT IS USED TO MAKE IT SOFT, AND APPARENTLY THE AMERICAN ALTERNATIVES ARE A LITTLE ROUGH.

TED: SO THE TOILET PAPER GAP.

>> THERE WILL BE A TOILET PAPER GAP.

AMERICANS CAN EXPECT MORE EXPENSIVE TOILET PAPER AMONGST OTHERS.

TED: WITH THAT SAID, MOVED ALONG HERE, IS THIS OVERALL MUCH ADO ABOUT NOT MUCH?

I MEAN, IN SIX MONTHS FROM NOW, ARE WE LOOKING AT THIS AND LIKE, I CAN'T BELIEVE ALL THAT HUBBUB, THEY'VE GONE THE BACK TOGETHER AND IT'S KUMBAYA?

>> THERE'S AN ARGUMENT TO BE MADE THAT THE CANADIANS WALKED AWAY FROM A NOT BAD DEAL, SO EVEN THOUGH THERE'S TARIFFS, THE TARIFFS WERE, IN A SENSE, MOST-FAVORED NATION STATUS FOR THE CANADIANS.

THEY WERE LOOKING AT THE LOWEST TARIFF RATES PRETTY MUCH OF ANY NATION TO GAIN ACCESS TO THE AMERICAN MARKET.

I THINK CANADIANS HAVEN'T QUITE WRAPPED THEIR HEAD AROUND THE FACT THAT TARIFFS HERE TO STAY FOR THE LONG TIME.

IT'S NOT JUST TRUMP.

I THINK SOME COMMENTATORS IN CANADA ARE SPEAKING UP AND SAY IF THERE'S A DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENT IN 2029, DON'T EXPECT THE TARIFFS TO GO AWAY.

THESE ARE POPULAR IN CERTAIN SWING STATES, AND PART OF THE CHANGE OF THE AMERICAN ELECTORAL COALITION.

TED: NOT GO AWAY BUT MAYBE EASED A LITTLE BIT?

>> PERHAPS.

THAT GETS INTO THE PERSONALITIES INVOLVED.

TED: YEAH.

>> YEAH.

YEAH.

THE ADVANTAGE OF TARIFFS IS HIDDEN TAX.

INSOFAR AS AMERICA HAS A SERIOUS DEBT PROBLEM AND YOU'RE NOT GOING TO CUT SPENDING TO SOLVE IT, YOU DON'T WANT TO RAISE TAXES TO SOLVE, IT TARIFFS ARE A NICE SORT OF SECRET WAY TO PAY THOSE TAXES.

TED: THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

JOHN VON HEYKING, ASU SCHOOL OF CIVIC AND ECONOMIC THOUGHT.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

>> GREAT TO BE HERE.

.

TED: THE BLACK THEATRE TROUPE IS OPENING ITS SEASON WITH A PERFORMANCE OF "THE EXONERATED," A PLAY BASED ON THE TRUE STORIES OF SIX WRONGFULLY CONVICTED PEOPLE WHO SPENT YEARS ON DEATH ROW.

PLAYWRIGHTS TRAVELED ACROSS THE COUNTRY TO SPEAK WITH 40 PEOPLE WRONGLY SENTENCED AND LATER FREED.

MATTHEW WIENER IS THE DIRECTOR OF "THE EXONERATED" AND DAVID HEMPHILL IS EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF THE BLACK THEATRE TROUPE.

WELCOME BACK.

GOOD TO HAVE YOU BOTH HERE.

>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

TED: DAVID, GET TO YOU IN A SECOND, SINCE YOU'RE DIRECTING THIS, WHAT ARE WE WALKING INTO HERE?

WHAT KIND OF PLAY IS THIS?

>> WELL, IT'S KIND OF A DOCUDRAMA OF SORTS, AND IT'S A PLAY THAT IS BASED ON REAL PEOPLE AND REAL SITUATIONS.

THE PLAYWRIGHTS SPENT A LOT OF TIME, I THINK, CRAFTING IT, SO IT IS EDITED IN A WAY, BUT BASICALLY IT'S A STORY OF SIX PEOPLE, AND THEIR LIVES BEFORE DEATH ROW, ON DEATH ROW AND AFTER THEY GOT OFF DEATH ROW, AND THE PLAY IS NOT -- IT DOESN'T LEAN INTO ITS OWN SADNESS BECAUSE THESE PEOPLE ARE VERY STRONG.

THEY'RE WARRIORS, THEY'RE SURVIVORS.

THERE IS HUMOR IN THE PLAY, AND THERE'S A LOT OF PASSION IN THE PLAY, AND I THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, PLAYS ARE OFTEN TRYING TO GET PEOPLE TO CHANGE THEIR BEHAVIOR.

>> RIGHT.

>> AND I THINK THIS IS GOING TO MAKE PEOPLE THINK TWICE ABOUT DEATH ROW.

TED: DAVID, WHY WAS THIS PLAY SELECTED TO OPEN THIS SEASON?

>> WELL, I THINK I SELECTED IT BECAUSE IT IS VERY MUCH IN LINE WITH ONE OF OUR MAIN TENETS, WHICH IS RESILIENCE.

IT'S A VERY, VERY GOOD STORY OF RESILIENCE.

LIKE MATTHEW SAID, WE DON'T WANT PEOPLE TO THINK ABOUT SADNESS ABOUT IT.

IT'S ABOUT RESILIENCE.

IT'S ALMOST LIKE WITH OUR COMPANY, YOU GO THROUGH SOMETHING AND MERGE ON THE OTHER SIDE STRONGER.

AND THAT WAS ONE OF THE THINGS WE SELECTED IT FOR THE OPENING OF THE SEASON, OUR 57th SEASON.

TED: INTERESTING.

I WONDER WHY ARE CERTAIN PLAYS SELECTED FOR CERTAIN TIMES AND CERTAIN EVENTS AND THERE WAS OBVIOUSLY DELIBERATION GOING ON HERE?

>> THERE WAS, INDEED.

MATTHEW AND I TALKED ABOUT IT FOR QUITE AWHILE.

WE GO VERY FAR BACK.

ONE OF OUR VERY FIRST JOINT PRODUCTIONS, IN THE 90s WHEN BLACK THEATRE TROUPE WAS A FLEDGLING WAS WITH MATTHEW'S COMPANY.

THERE WAS A PLAY WRITTEN THAT MATTHEW -- WE ALL PARTICIPATED IN, IT WAS GREAT.

TED: THAT'S GREAT.

I WANT TO GET BACK TO "THE EXONERATED."

WE TALKED ABOUT THIS IS INFORMATION, PEOPLE INTERVIEWED, PEOPLE'S STORIES.

HOW DO YOU TURN THAT INTO A THEATER PERFORMANCE?

>> THAT'S REALLY INTERESTING BECAUSE WHEN THE PLAY WAS ORIGINALLY CONCEIVED, IT WAS DONE ALMOST LIKE READER'S THEATER, IT WAS DONE AS A READING.

THEY BROUGHT IN BIG STARS AND THAT WAS THE APPEAL.

SO ONE OF THE CHALLENGES THAT WE'VE BEEN HAVING WITH THIS CAST, AND I HAVE TEN MAGNIFICENT ACTORS INVOLVED, HOW DO WE WEAVE THE STORIES TOGETHER IN A THEATRICAL ADVENTURE?

THAT IS ONE OF THE CHALLENGES TO KEEP THE AUDIENCE MOVING AND KNOWING THAT THEY DON'T KNOW WHAT COMES NEXT.

TED: DO YOU GET HELP FROM PREVIOUS -- THIS WAS A MADE-FOR-TV SPECIAL HERE, DOES THAT KIND OF THING HELP YOU OR DOES THAT THING GET IN YOUR WAY IN A LITTLE BIT?

>> I HAVE NOT SEEN IT BUT READ THE PLAY COUNTLESS TIMES, AND I READ ABOUT THE PLAY.

I THINK THAT I HAD SOME IDEAS GOING INTO IT, AND THE CAST BRINGS A LOT OF LIFE AND A LOT OF THEIR OWN INTUITION AND THEIR OWN INTERPRETATIONS, AND IT'S BEEN PRETTY GRAND WORKING WITH THESE ARTISTS.

TED: YOU HAD A CHANCE TO SEE THE REHEARSALS.

IS IT WHAT YOU WANT?

BECAUSE AGAIN, SOMETHING THAT'S PERFORMED IN DIFFERENT WAYS, ARE WE GOING TO SEE A BLACK THEATRE TROUPE STAMP ON THIS?

>> YEAH, YOU CERTAINLY WILL.

MOST IMPORTANTLY, AS YOU ASKED MATTHEW, DID THE PREVIOUS STORIES OR PRODUCTIONS INFLUENCE HIM?

THEY DIDN'T INFLUENCE ME IN ANY PARTICULAR WAY EXCEPT THAT I WANTED TO SEE OUR STAMP ON IT.

I WANTED TO SEE HOW IT COULD BE DONE ON A SCALE THAT WAS DIFFERENT THAN THE SIMPLE READER'S THEATER AND THAT SORT OF THING LIKE THAT, AND THAT'S WHAT IT IS.

IT'S GOING TO BE VERY GOOD.

TED: WHAT DO YOU WANT PEOPLE THAT ATTEND THE PERFORMANCES?

WHAT DO YOU WANT THEM TO TAKE WITH THEM AS THEY LEAVE THE THEATER?

>> MOST IMPORTANTLY, I THINK THE THING THEY SHOULD TAKE THAT WE WOULD HOPE THEY TAKE IS THE POWER OF RESILIENCE.

PEOPLE CAN CHANGE, LIVES CAN CHANGE, SITUATIONS CAN CHANGE, AND WE WOULD HOPE IT WOULD TAKE THAT WITH THEM, AND MOST IMPORTANTLY, WE HOPE THEY TAKE BECOMING INVOLVED IN THE VARIOUS CIVIL RIGHTS ACTIVITIES, ET CETERA, THAT THIS PLAY REPRESENTS.

TED: MATTHEW, IS THERE A FINE LINE BETWEEN ART AND PERFORMANCE, ACTIVISM AND TRYING TO GET A POINT ACROSS?

>> I THINK THAT ALL ART IS ACTUALLY POLITICAL.

THE FACT THAT WE KIND OF GATHER PEOPLE TOGETHER AND TELL A STORY HAS THE ABILITY TO CHANGE PEOPLE'S MINDS.

WHAT THE PLAY IS SHINING LIGHT ON SOCIAL JUSTICE AND THE CRIMINAL JUSTICE SYSTEM, AND ESPECIALLY ON CAPITAL PUNISHMENT.

CAPITAL PUNISHMENT, THERE IS NO COMING BACK FROM IT, AND THAT WE KNOW THERE HAVE BEEN PEOPLE PUT TO THE -- AND HAVE BEEN INNOCENT.

THIS IS THE STORY OF SIX PEOPLE WHO WERE INNOCENT AND ON DEATH ROW FOR YEARS AND YEARS AND YEARS.

TED: "THE EXONERATED" OPENS ON SEPTEMBER 11, BLACK THEATRE TROUPE.

GOOD LUCK, BREAK A LEG.

GOOD TO HAVE YOU BOTH HERE.

>> THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU.

TED: AND THAT IS IT FOR NOW.

I'M TED SIMONS.

THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.