>> From WXXI News.

This is Connections.

I'm Evan Dawson.

Our connection this hour was made at an olive garden near you.

The restaurant chain that's known for unlimited salad and bread and 2000 calorie pasta dishes is cutting back.

Here's how CNN described it last month.

Quote Olive garden, which is traditionally seen success from its annual unlimited pasta promotion, recently noticed the opposite trend.

Some customers actually wanted less food.

Last quarter, the restaurant chain tested a new menu section at a little less than half of its locations.

Smaller portions, along with reduced prices for seven of its dinner entrees.

The trial was designed to appeal to cash conscious customers who've been cutting eating out from their budgets, hurting restaurant profits.

It was a success.

Customer feedback was positive.

The chain's internal affordability metric jumped 15%, and early signs showed that the new menu was not only bringing diners back, but perhaps even turning them into regulars.

End quote.

Meanwhile, The New York Times reports that mid-priced steakhouses and fine dining establishments are trying to figure out how to cover their rising costs without scaring away customers and the rising cost of all kinds of food products is affecting coffeehouses, bakeries.

This hour, we're looking at what a local.

What a number of local businesses are doing to try to hang in there, keep customers coming back and survive this extended period of inflation and high prices.

We've noticed local businesses reaching out directly to customers on their social media, explaining how rough the past year has been.

We've invited some who are making that kind of painfully honest outreach.

We're going to welcome them now in the studio.

Let me welcome Art Rogers, chef and owner of Lento Restaurant.

Welcome back to the program.

>> Thank you.

Great to be here.

>> Across the table is Kelly Scott, co-owner of Get Caked Bakery.

Hi, Kelly.

Thanks for being here.

Thank you.

And there's Rory Van Grol, owner and operator of Ugly Duck Coffee.

Welcome to you as well.

>> Thanks for having me.

>> 2025 in a year in in a word, 2025 was what Rory.?

>> Anxious.

>> Anxious.

Okay, Kelly.

>> Challenging.

>> Challenging.

Art.

>> Yeah.

Anxious is Good stressful?

Yeah.

>> Stressful.

Okay, so all three of you, in your own ways.

we're going to share with our audience what you have been doing to let people know not only what you're going through, but how you're trying to work with them to, to make sure they have good experience with you.

They can get what they want.

They can keep coming back.

You can stay in business.

and I know it's tough.

Art.

You sent a rather lengthy note directly to your customers, and I want you to summarize that for our audience.

What did you tell people?

>> So I you know, I listened to WXXI exclusively, and over the course of the year, I listened to things like marketplace and other business things and just gleaned what was happening with consumers overall in America and in Rochester.

I learned a lot of things on Connections as well.

so I just sat down at the starting of the year and was like, if this is what is affecting people's decisions, to go out to dinner is I am going to try and hit all those trends that kind of like what you just said about the Olive garden.

I wasn't even aware of that until right now.

But if it could make the portions a little bit smaller for price conscious people, hopefully that will lead to an increase in volume because people will be like, well, now maybe Lento isn't a special occasion restaurant that's so expensive.

We can go there more often when we're just want to go out on like a Friday night dinner.

and I, I did there is an uptick in single dining and people looking for smaller portions.

They can go out and not have such a huge portion that they can't finish.

So I took that into consideration as well as the no.

And low ABV.

drinks as well.

Those were the three main things that I took away as trends moving into 2026.

>> There's a lot of restaurants and no shade, by the way.

I mean, like I'm just observing something here, but there's a lot of restaurants where you can't get a steak for under $50.

Now there's a number of entrees, 40, 50, $60.

You write to your customers starting in 2026, we are readjusting our menu so there are no items over $35.

and I know $35 for some people.

Still a lot of money, but that's the high point, correct.

That signal is meant to say, what I mean, essentially what you've been saying, which is that we're trying to be affordable enough that you can come here regularly, not once a year, not zero times a year.

>> Exactly.

Yes.

Okay.

Yes.

>> What is the feedback from your customers been so far?

>> from what I've been told on all our social media, it's been quite positive.

We were pretty busy last week.

there was a play at the auditorium, so I think that drove in a lot of people.

But we had a decent week last week, and a lot of people did say that they saw the memo that I wrote online and that brought them in or reminded them of Lento and, you know, sort of put it back on their radar and, you know, it wasn't uncommon for people to be like, haven't been here in five, ten years.

And, you know, we sort of forgot about you.

And now we're back in your consciousness and we like this, this statement.

And so, yeah, I think it's been positive so far.

>> I was I was at a family Christmas party and we were playing a family game, a family feud, and one of the items, one of the Family Feud categories was fill in this skinny blank.

You know, I'm thinking I'm not thinking skinny dipping because I'm a good, upstanding person, but I'm thinking of lots of things.

But one of the younger women in our family immediately said, Skinnylicious.

And we're like, what?

Like Cheesecake Factory?

That's that's the Skinnylicious menu.

So it's been a while since I've to me you're at Lento all the time.

You're not at the chains, man.

So it'd been years since I've been to a Cheesecake Factory, but I look up the Skinnylicious menu, and there they still have 900 calorie.

I mean, like, there's, I mean, not all of them.

There's some that's a lot less.

Right?

But I remember when the first Cheesecake Factory opened in Rochester area, I was working local commercial television news.

This was a pretty big news story.

When new chains come in and talking to the first people who went there for a news story, the refrain was this.

This place is amazing.

The portions are huge, the portions are huge, the portions are huge.

Whether it's a piece of cheesecake, a burger, whatever what you are saying to your customers is we're going to reduce the size of portions, partially to cut the cost down for you, the price, but also because people have been asking you or telling you, I can't even finish sometimes.

And that's not always a pleasurable experience.

So are we entering a new era in dining where people are going to not just say, well, the portions huge, but instead of it's more appropriate.

It's also fairly priced.

Do you think this is a temporary blip, or is that where we're going?

>> I'd like to think that's where it's going.

I mean, that's how I like to eat.

If you're going out to a nice restaurant, I like to be able to order everything on the menu.

And if everything on the menu is humongous, you're not going to be able to do that.

so that that was part of my thinking.

I don't like I'm probably in the minority saying this, but I, I will complain if the portions are too big not to the restaurant, but later I'll be like, oh, everything was delicious.

Those portions were way too big.

Like we could have had, you know, way more interesting things on the menu.

But I'm stuffed and.

I'm hoping that's a trend.

or a way people are thinking now when they go out for dining.

and just to something that you said, the two things, actually we didn't reduce the portions on everything some of the stuff, I just lowered the prices, some of the stuff we did lower the portions to match the prices.

So it's not like shrinkflation.

Okay.

You know?

Okay.

and also Lento opened the same month as that Cheesecake Factory that you.

>> 2007.

>> Yeah.

And I remember calling the Cheesecake Factory when we had an empty restaurant and they're like, oh, yeah, it's like two, 2.5 hour wait.

And I was like, oh my God, I can't believe this.

>> I'm not.

I'm laughing because you have such.

>> A deadpan way.

>> Like, it's funny now, but like, I'm not laughing like that's a real plight for you.

>> It was at the time I was like, yeah, this is unbelievable.

But yeah.

So yeah, we're been hanging in there with The Cheesecake Factory.

>> For nearly 20 years.

>> Yeah, yeah.

>> You're gonna turn 20 next year.

You're hanging in there.

Yeah.

Okay.

I'm going to turn to your colleagues.

But, but, but to kind of finish off a couple of points here, some of the items on the menu, you simply just cut prices you said didn't change the portion size.

>> That's right.

>> Okay.

Your margins are already tight.

>> Yep.

>> Okay.

How tight is it going to be then.

>> Well, it's a bit of a risk.

I'm hoping it, you know, it'll even out by having a higher volume of customers if more people come in, you know, that leads to more revenue.

And that should.

Solve that problem.

But obviously, I have no idea if it's going to drive more people in.

So, yeah, there is an unknown factor here.

>> Okay.

and then the other point I wonder what you think about is if people say, look, you can bring me a burger the size of an aircraft carrier, I'll just have half of it for lunch tomorrow and I get more for my money.

What do you think?

>> I'm never going to get those customers.

>> That's not.

Those people aren't going to Lento.

>> Correct.

I don't think so.

>> Okay.

Yeah.

well, interestingly enough Rory Van Grol at Ugly Duck Coffee, you wanted to break down for your clientele.

The actual cost component by component of a latte.

What?

Which I thought is a really interesting educational exercise.

Why did you do that?

>> Well, I made a post and someone asked what it would cost, and so regardless, I in good faith I did it.

Someone was like, this is a bot.

Like no one's, you know, this is just a random thing.

And I was like, well, it's good practice.

Anyway to look into it first of the year to like re-analyze your costs and look at what you're paying.

And so I just did a general like quick look at numbers and, and threw it out there, put it together and just so people could see what the actual cost might look like to the drinks or beverages that you're consuming.

>>, are what does a latte cost in your shop?

>> 525 including tax.

>> Can you walk us through some of the components then?

>> Well, I mean, you're so you know, what we add is labor.

and so we factor in like a four minute time in that sometimes it's more.

>> And I realized that.

And I recognize that.

And I feel grateful for the folks that do support us.

And that's amazing.

and we source coffee.

That's a specialty coffee that is, you know, better than most, not all, but most.

You know, and that's what we lean into.

and we hopefully prepare that in a way that people really connect to people.

so our margin is less and we're not necessarily that profit margin that I think a lot of folks in our industry have baked into the 30, 30, 30, ten, like the ten is nonexistent anymore.

>> Hold on.

30, 30, 30, ten.

You want to do a quick explanation?

>> Yeah.

So, I mean, you're doing 30% cost of goods, 30% payroll, 30% overhead, essentially.

>> And then 10%.

>> And 10% profit.

>> Profit, ideally.

>> Yeah.

I you know, ideally in the grand scheme of world, but I don't think there's many folks, especially small businesses that are taking 10% profit.

>> Okay.

That's a no over there.

No no art 10%.

That's the margin is not double digits okay.

So the margins are really tight.

What was the response from your customers learning about those components.

>> Overall great.

>> People appreciate.

>> Yeah absolutely I think I think people were coming into the shop and they were like this was amazing.

This was really nice to to see.

And and gave perspective on what their drinks go to, what their cost is going to.

>> So why not charge six bucks for a latte?

>> I mean, you can, but here's the here's the thing where you get in coffee, you can get there, right?

So if you're adding a flavor, you can get there very easily.

If you're if you're raising the price you can or raising the the size of beverage you can get there.

so it the scale goes up for us where, you know, maybe at the restaurant, you're not ordering an extra large steak, but people can order a large coffee or a large latte, and they're getting to that point.

And I don't think people are going to feel good about spending more all the time.

so it's that volume based metric.

>> What else have you been doing to reach out to customers and communicate with them?

About what what's going on?

>> I think for for us at Ugly Duck Coffee, just just to be authentic, you know, support our team as much, as much as we can and lean into that and allow our team to be their authentic selves.

And I think our team communicates that and lives that and feels good about working in the space that they are, and that allows people to feel good about coming in, that they know that their team is the team at the shop, is taking care of.

>> Well, we're going to ask all of our guests coming up here.

I'm very curious to know what costs the most for the products that they are bringing in.

Where are their biggest profit margin is and what they think customers would say if prices went up even more?

let's get let's get Kelly's take on this.

Kelly is Kelly Scott, co-owner of Get Caked Bakery.

Yep.

And you've been in business for how long now?

>> About to hit 13 years.

>> 13 years?

Because ugly Duck is.

How long?

Ten years.

And going to be 20 years in 2027 for Lento.

So it's.

>> 20 years and 22.

Yes.

>> Correct.

So you're coming up on 19.

>> Years 19.

Yep.

>> So 13 years for you, Kelly.

How was that 2025 stressful, anxious.

>> Challenging.

Definitely very challenging.

>> what was it like?

>> It just, you know, around every corner, just one more challenge and one more thing to either fix or one more problem to sort out.

You know, whether that's cost of ingredients or, you know, with the accessibility of ingredients as well.

we bake everything from scratch.

So I can't just, you know, rely on like a box mix or anything like that.

So, for example, last year we had our shortening supplier because we use vegetable shortening for our frosting.

They changed where they got it from and the taste was completely different.

It tasted like tomatoes and I can't have frosting that tastes like tomatoes.

So I had to completely.

>> Like a.

>> Dealbreaker, right?

So I had to completely source a new product, like a completely new shortening, and then figure out how all that is going to work with all the rest of the baked goods, because it changes consistency of the frosting.

And I could go on and on, but there's so many things like that that just they all have to line up perfectly.

And over the last few years.

But last year in particular is just, you know, all of those little things just seemed to be so much harder to get into place, to line everything up and make everything happen.

>> So what did you do to communicate with your customers?

>> Well, I mean, we have last year we increased the price on some of our custom goods which we felt was a lot, you know, more easy, easily justifiable since it's custom items.

and I was really hoping, you know, to hold off on raising prices for as long as possible.

so we went all last year with, without raising any in-store prices, making it almost two full years before we had increased any prices in the store.

and then at the end of this year, we looked at everything and our expenses and like the like Rory was saying, the 30, 30, ten model ideally that's there, but right now it's just not realistic.

I mean, we're looking at like a 1% of leftover money that you can then use for research and development.

>> Or I'm looking at your pie.

So you put together this pie.

>> I did I made a little.

>> Cake, a pie for a pie chart or a cake chart or whatever this.

>> Is I did, and I just like my I mean, it's it's it's basic.

It's it's vague.

I didn't obviously put everything in there, but like, my employees, I, they deserve the world.

You know, they're the ones who are there making my dream come true every day.

And so over the last year or two, the staff that I've had have gone up over $3 in their wages.

I just gave all of my staff another full dollar raise at the beginning of the year, because the people are so important to what I do, not just, you know, for the talent and everything.

but because I can trust them.

And so my labor costs have skyrocketed.

>> That's the biggest part of the pie right now.

Yeah.

Looks like it's fully a third or so.

>> Oh, yeah, I'd say I'd say my labor cost is right around like, 30 to 33%.

Okay.

and then everything else as far as cost of ingredients, that has definitely increased.

>> Yeah.

The next biggest piece of cake or pie would a little bit less than letters rent utilities.

And then similar to that, a little bit smaller than that, maybe a sixth of the pie is ingredients.

Yeah.

Then you've got miscellaneous operating costs and then you've got this tiny little slice left for R&D, new equipment, emergencies, et cetera.

Yep.

Ideally that'd be a bigger slice.

>> Ideally it'd be much bigger.

For example, last week I had one of my ovens go down.

I've had I've had this oven for going on 13 years.

So I'm like, okay, these things happen.

Let's see if there's a way I can fix it.

Fortunately, my husband is brilliant with mechanics and whatnot, and he was able to figure it out.

It was one of the contacts that turns the oven on to make it heat.

It was a $300 fix versus a brand new oven, which could have been how much money?

How much?

right now with oven that I would want to replace, it'd be about $12,000.

and I just replaced three refrigerators this last year as well, because I had two refrigerators die on the same week as well.

So, like, it's just, you know, these things, these things just add up so quickly and, you know, you, you think you're going to have.

Oh, yeah.

We we profited this month.

Hopefully that means we'll be good for the end of the year.

And then you get to the end of the year and you're like, oh yeah, I have to take, you know, we have all of these things that we have to account for.

And now it just it limits your ability to like, I can't look at hiring anybody right now to get myself to work on the business instead of working in the business.

It's just not feasible to hire somebody else right now.

And that's part of the problem.

>> So what have your customers told you about this pie chart?

Cake chart, that sort of this radical transparency that you wanted them to know what you're going through?

What have they said?

>> Yeah, I mean, I've always like everybody else in here.

I've always tried to be really honest and upfront with the customers about what's going on.

a lot of our customers, some of them, to be honest, did not even notice a price change.

Some of them have said, oh, you finally raised your prices because we were really, really low on certain things.

Like you could get a six pack of cupcakes for just 20 bucks.

and they're like all kinds of crazy different cupcakes.

and that even now, after I've raised my prices, I'm still the lowest in the city, not counting Wegmans and grocery stores.

But as far as, like, handcrafted baked goods as far as that goes.

>> Have you had any complaints about the raising of prices?

>> Not really.

I've had a couple of people who've been like, okay, I understand, and that might it might change exactly how much they get.

But I've actually seen an increase in how many people are coming in, and not just since I raised my prices, but over the last year or so, I've seen an increase in people who are coming in, but a little bit of like less in what they're spending.

So I'm like art.

I'm trying to find things for them that, you know, are like nice little add on things or like affordable smaller desserts or, you know, just alternatives.

like we're also looking at shifting how we sell our cookies.

we originally we have been for years we've been selling big individual cookies individually sealed, and they're just not moving as fast as I want them to be.

>> How much for a cookie?

>> It's right now.

It's 225 for a cookie, and I lose money.

>> Yeah, I was going to say, I mean, depending on the size of the cookie, that's.

Yeah, I mean, I'm not making.

>> Any money.

>> I remember one of my favorite restaurants back in the day, John Vito and and oh, Bigelow's John has since passed away and was a great, great guy.

a really funny, acerbic, smart guy and made great soups and sandwiches.

But he had a cookie, like the size of a human head.

But it was delicious.

And it was a buck.

And I remember telling him this 20 years ago.

>> Like, that's crazy.

>> I said, John, you got to raise your prices on the cookies here, man.

Like, I feel like I'm stealing from you.

And he said, I run the books and I know the strategy here.

You got to trust me.

And I'm like, okay, so cookies might be it might be a loss leader for him, but that's not the main part of his business.

I get it, he's working on something.

So for you, the cookie you're losing money.

>> On right now, cookies are our loss leader.

That is how it's been for a long time.

And it breaks our heart because, like, I actually started my business doing cookies, and then I transitioned into doing cakes and stuff, and then it became Get Caked.

>> So what's your best margin item?

>> Cupcakes.

>> Cupcakes is where you make your money.

>> Or macarons.

>> Okay, believe it or not, Rory at Ugly Duck Coffee the best margin item on the menu.

>> on our menu.

great question.

I would say in the summer, probably our slushy because it's a specialty thing.

And then I would say the best margin would be your in-house mug of coffee.

>> Just drip coffee.

Not a special.

Yeah.

>> Yeah, yeah, just drip coffee.

>> Okay.

Art at Lento.

What's the best when people order this item, you know, at least you're not losing money.

You might be making money.

What is it?

>> Soup.

>> Soup?

>> Yeah, that goes for every restaurant.

>> Because the soup is a low cost item to make.

Yeah.

>> Okay.

Yeah, yeah.

>> Okay.

the part of the reason I ask is I got a note from a listener who said, sorry.

Now I'm digging through here.

We love Lento.

We go a few times per month.

I'm wondering what is the best way to help them.

Is there a certain night or time that they need to fill?

We love all the food.

Are there certain items that are better margins for them?

I guess the same could be asked of any of the guests.

So what would you say to this person?

>> Oh wow, what an interesting question.

>> That's a real I know who this person is, by the way.

They're not related to you.

That's just a real person.

>> Yeah.

Geez.

well, Wednesdays or Thursdays because, you know, people go out on Friday and Saturday, at least in the type of business that I'm in.

I would say Tuesdays as well.

We do our dollar Oysters special on Tuesdays, and we don't need much, much help getting people in the door for that.

So we're already booked tonight until 8:00.

In this frigid weather in January selling raw oysters.

So.

Yeah.

No, just order what you want when you're in.

I don't want you to order something for my benefit order.

What's going to make you happy and what you think is delicious on the menu?

>> I mean, how your squash blossoms.

Is that a good return item?

You have them for, like, two weeks a year.

>> Yeah.

Yeah, those are good.

Yeah.

>> They they're gone already.

>> Oh, they've been gone for a while.

Yeah.

Squash blossom season is over.

>> It's a. short it's a short little window.

>> Yeah.

>> Okay.

>> Would you save for folks to be flexible and dine later?

>> Yes.

>> Yeah, that's an interesting one.

You mean go out to eat later?

>> Yes.

Thank you.

Rory.

>> I mean, you're saying you're booked until 8:00, but I know notoriously in Rochester, people have a window of wanting to eat between six and at sit at six and seven.

>> Yes, he's.

>> And rarely do they ever like push back.

>> We're like the opposite of Europeans in that way.

>> Yes, yes.

>> We are not a late crowd.

So you're saying go later or.

>> Yeah.

630. everyone needs there's some unwritten rule in Rochester.

Like we have to eat at six 36.

45 is too late.

615 is too early.

Like everybody, we always have a huge push in our reservation right at 630.

So, yeah, branch out, come in early, come in late.

We'd love to have you.

>> Instead of I mean, I noticed that like, people will would come into a restaurant that you would say they're a 15, 20 minute wait, they would leave to go find another restaurant rather than sit and wait.

15 do.

>> The opportunity cost in their head, like it's going to take me 20 minutes to find another?

>> They would not do that.

>> It's a protest.

They want that 630 seating.

>> They gotta have it.

>> Go 8:00.

Make art happy.

Go at 9:00.

Can you see somebody at nine?

Sure.

9:00.

>> Yeah.

We won't be out of oysters.

>> Who are these vampires?

9:00.

>> I don't know.

>> So that's.

Look at Rory stepping in to help art.

>> Thank you.

Rory.

Yes?

Well said.

>> You need a marketing course there.

All right.

Rory, that was very helpful for art.

Well, now I'm going to ask the same question of you.

So for your customers who love you, what can they do to support you better?

>> I mean, I think a no cost way to support any, any local business is to tell a friend, you know, if you don't use social media, you know, bring somebody with you the next time you come in or bring them a coffee.

If you're going into the office that you know as a treat for somebody else, extend that that fortitude that you love about your local businesses forward.

You know, I think that's shared on social media.

Sure.

But like your physical presence of coming in is is great.

>> I'm gonna I'm gonna one up that one, physically pull a friend out of a Starbucks and take them into a small local coffee shop.

>> I mean, you know, for I think any of us local businesses, we're not competing against each other.

We're competing against the other corporate entities around us.

You know, like, you know, multiple smaller coffee shops opening.

It's it's not against me.

It's against the entities of what's around us, you know?

So like, it's The cheesecake Factory's and art's case, you know, it's.

>> The Starbucks and yours.

>> Yeah.

You know, the Dunkin Donuts, like all those, like, there's there's a market share.

There's a reason why there's a lot of coffee shops.

There's a reason why there's lots of restaurants.

It's people want to go out to eat.

And people are just, you know, sometimes you have to wedge yourself in there and give yourself the identity of, of who you are so people can connect with you.

>> That's well said.

Kelly.

What can people do to support you better?

>> Yeah, just like you know, Rory said.

so non a way you can do it without spending any money would be just, you know, tell a friend, let's say, you know, you had your birthday or you had a graduation and you got one of our cakes, you know, someone is having another party, you know, hey, I know this place where you can get it.

You know better than Wegmans.

It's actually baked fresh.

No offense.

Wegmans.

you know.

>> This is the first Wegmans shade we've gotten in a while.

This is pretty spicy.

>> No, but, you know, just support like that.

You know, if you.

Another great thing that is really great for us is if you have a great experience somewhere, leave a five star review.

And, you know, or if you don't have a good experience, don't leave a bad review.

Try and contact the place and talk about it, and maybe suggest, you know, hey, this is an issue I had.

Or, you know, if the person really cares about the business, they're going to do all they can to try and make it better.

>> I think that's also well said.

So after we take our break, I've got some more emails to share.

I am going to ask our guests, a couple of our listeners have emailed to ask have tariffs or just inflation affected just your regular prices?

I mean, I'm sure the answer is yes, but we're going to talk about how we're talking to Kelly Scott, co-owner of Get Caked Bakery Rory Van Grol, the owner and operator of Ugly Duck Coffee Art Rogers, the chef and owner of Lento Restaurant.

It has been a very difficult 2025, and they're all communicating with their clienteles in different ways as they move through 2026, trying some different things and trying to be transparent about what they're going through.

So let's take this break.

We'll come right back to your questions.

I'm Evan Dawson Wednesday on the next Connections, the Trump administration was looking at a way to try to lower the costs for homebuyers and homeowners.

50 year mortgages instead of 30.

Now, a lot of advisors have told the president this is a bad idea, and there have to be other ways to lower costs in the home market.

Well, what are those ways?

Is anything changing?

We'll take a look.

Wednesday.

>> Support for your public radio station comes from our members and from Mary Cariola center, proud supporter of Connections with Evan Dawson.

Believing an informed and engaged community is a connected one.

Mary Cariola.

>> This is Connections.

I'm Evan Dawson Isaac says.

Kudos to Art, Rory and Kelly just want to send big kudos to your guests.

I've been a long time customer at Ugly Duck Coffee and Lento and Get Caked made a wonderful birthday cake for my mother's birthday a couple of years ago.

I frequently go to various coffee shops in the area for meetings, and very few are on par with Ugly Duck.

It's especially disappointing when I pay more at another place and the latte is mediocre.

We also love Lento a lot.

We love going there for special occasions as well as nights when we don't want to cook at home.

The experience is always great.

I love supporting local businesses and restaurants where I know they are committed to quality and taking care of their staff.

That's from Isaac.

Now, as much as all of our guests, I'm sure appreciate that.

Isaac, I do want to point out, Art said at the in your email to your customers.

One of the goals is to be less of the special occasion place and more of the third place.

More of the regular stop for folks that's not a criticism of Isaac, of course, but tell me more about what you meant when you told your customers.

here's what you said.

the changes you were talking about will help change the perception of Lento as an expensive, special occasion restaurant and encourage you to consider us as that third space to grab a drink and a bite after work by yourself with a group, or still for celebrating that special occasion.

So tell me more about that.

>> Yeah.

So that was another trend that I heard was happening 2025, 2026 sort of tying into people wanting to go out by themselves.

Also there's like a loneliness epidemic in America.

And I'm not on social media, but from what I hear, everyone is just on their phone all the time.

There's a lack of human connection.

so I wanted to make an accessible menu where people could go after work and be like, hey, let's get a drink and a or a and not be like, oh, Lento is too fancy for that kind of thing.

Just sort of put it on people's map as a place that they can go.

And decompress after work with their friends or by themselves, or as a couple, and not just be like, oh, we can only go to Lento on our anniversary or birthday.

>> Yeah.

>> Okay.

Yeah, yeah.

>> Fair enough.

And maybe related to that, Chris writes to say, I feel like such a big part of the discussion regarding dining out costs is frequency.

When I was growing up, we went out to eat as a family for special occasions a few times a year.

Now, in my 40s, I somehow find myself going out a couple times a week while the cost of individual nights out are something to be mindful of, I'm also being more cognizant of how often I'm out.

That's from Chris.

>> Yeah, I think that's been happening for forever.

I don't know how old Chris is, but I mean, people are going out to eat more, which is of course, great for me as a restaurant owner.

But I mean, you've seen this explosion in even at Wegmans with six, $6 to go meals.

And just in the past decade, people getting food that they can take and take home and not cook I'm guessing it has something to do with how we all just work constantly and there's no time to cook.

>> You get nods across the table on that one.

Art.

Yeah, yeah.

>> so yeah, to Chris's point, I think just people's dining habits have just changed organically just because of the way life is now.

>> I mean, I don't know about if you guys are ever even home at dinner hours, but how often I think, well, this is what I'm going to make for dinner.

And then all these other things happen and there's a six month old yelling, and then you're starting to make dinner at about 830 or 9:00 at night.

And you're like, I could do cereal.

>> I guess that's what we're doing.

>> I mean, it's yeah.

No, it's it's it's wild.

It's a challenge.

okay.

A couple other emails here for art, here's a way to get singles out to your establishment.

A book at the bar, special.

Invite individuals to enjoy your menu over a book without having to over order sharing sized sharing sized dishes or feel on the spot for showing up alone or feeling forced to chat with the bartender.

This solves for affordability.

Creates new opportunity to boost your numbers, and touches a new body of potential customers.

And this is signed a newly single person.

>> that's actually a really good idea, and we've been getting a lot of people reaching out with similar ideas like that of having like, a communal table.

So it's we're right now we're just brainstorming a way to do something like that.

emailers idea to, to try and encourage people to come out to meet other people and not have to, like, buy.

>> Or just be with themselves.

Right.

You said that singles hanging out?

>> Sure.

Yeah.

Correct.

But if you could bring in many singles of people that have, like, a shared interest, like a book you know, that sort of helps solve that loneliness epidemic thing.

And people might make a new friend.

And, you know, that's kind of what I was going for with that, that angle of it.

>> I do think to Art's point I do think all three of you are contributing to keeping people connected in different ways.

And we're feeling very disconnected.

I mean, you've got what percentage of your customers I've asked you this before, what percentage in any given day would you say you recognize people in your shop?

What percentage like as regular semi-regulars, even if you don't know.

>> Them, do I recognize them?

I would say probably 80%.

Whether they know or not.

>> 80%.

That is a huge number.

So you've got a lot of people who are who see you with routine.

Yeah.

So you're obviously an important place for people.

Are you cognizant of the value of that beyond just the coffee?

Are you cognizant of the value in society of of having these spaces personally?

>> Yeah, I mean, I've been a part of that routine.

Right.

seeing families or scale it even back further, seeing single folks, then those folks dating them, folks getting coupled and then having kids and having families and watching those kids grow up.

I mean, you know, that's amazing.

And I'm sure Art and Kelly have been a part of that, too.

I mean, that's so beautiful.

And to be able to just have a seat at that table to see that exist is amazing.

It brings warmness to me.

and the fact that whether that's a weekly occurrence or monthly occurrence, whether those folks come in daily, you know, you you witness that growth.

And that's special.

and that's community, right?

And that's a part of the fabric that we're all a part of.

And that's what we want to be a part of, whether that's partnering with other local businesses for our baked goods or, you know the folks that made our furniture or, you know, there's a web that it's not just a business, it's our partners in that business.

fabric.

so, like when a local business closes, it's not just us closing, it's that has a ripple effect along the path that we're a part of.

>> Kelly, how often do you feel like you know your customers?

>> I, I usually recognize a lot of people.

we have so many people, though.

Like some some of them only come in once a year, you know, for that special birthday cake.

so I want to say I recognize at least like, 50 to 60% of them.

but I also, I know a lot of people by name, not by face, because I'm a behind the scenes a lot of the time.

So I'll see, like, orders that come in and I'll say, oh, this person orders all the time, but I might not know what they look like.

so I it's it's especially important to me.

I mean, every single person that comes in, you know, I'm just so appreciative that they're doing that, that I'm always going to remember that person, regardless of whether or not you know, it was a good experience.

Most of them are good experience, obviously, but but yeah, I it's important to make that connection, you know.

>> Well, here is a former Lento server and an ugly addict, Carly, who says smaller portions are magic.

She says, Evan, I would happily drink a European sized coffee five six ounces any day, but often I can't find anything under eight ounces.

If I'm lucky, I was in Trieste, Italy in October.

The city is famous for the Capone B, a single shot of espresso with a little milk foam in a tiny glass called a bicchieri, often served with a chaser of chocolate sauce.

It's still 1 to 2.

People go cafe to cafe through the morning, sometimes to 3 to 4 in a day.

This allows people to spread resources, socialize more, try more roasting styles and breathe life into their city.

This is certainly a way for downtown cafes to support each other.

Cappo and B club.

Let's go!

That's what Carly says.

Okay, what do you think?

What do you think?

The coffee man in the group.

>> I mean, interesting, I know that there is laws in effect in Italy to stymie the cost of coffee in certain areas.

So that might be a reason why that that is a shared cost that those folks can't raise their prices anymore.

>> Interesting.

>> Yeah.

So depending on everyone's coffee's are in the coffee industry.

We're not a roaster, so our costs are higher.

So other folks that are coffee shops that are roasting their coffee, their coffees are lower, their price is lower.

>> So certainly I remember the Paul Rudd scene.

Actually, I haven't even seen the movie.

I've seen the scene where he's going off on the Starbucks coffee sizes, the venti and the grande, whatever.

I mean, trust me, it's a great scene with Paul Rudd and he's being a total jerk in the scene.

But but it's funny, but part of his point is like, we're talking about a lot of ounces here.

I mean, are we over consuming in terms of portion?

>> I mean, yes.

>> Yeah, absolutely.

>> I mean, just like just like Art was saying, like, I think the the perfect meal out and I'm with art, it's like I typically complain about how big a portion is.

I don't want to take things home as a leftovers, like I want to consume everything in front of me, and I want to have room for dessert, you know what I mean?

Like, that's what I would want going out to eat.

I think we Americanize and we want more.

Whether or not we even consume it.

And I think that is a cultural thing.

I think we're also open to more experiences when we're traveling or vacationing or in Europe.

And we don't want that in our routine necessarily.

When we come back to it.

>> What do you think, Kelly?

>> No, I agree my husband's European, so I, you know, the whole Americanized everything is bigger, you know, portions.

People just want more for less.

That's I think that's just culturally what it's been built up to.

I feel like for at least the last 20 or 30 years of my life.

>> Boy, there was a few years in there where I thought, the Europeans, like your husband, were going to win, and we were going to go to a European style tipping model, but that never happened here, that that seems to have died away, that movement.

Yeah.

Okay.

Interesting.

all right.

Do your phone calls.

Robert in Fairport.

Hello, Robert.

Go ahead.

>> Yeah.

Thanks for taking my call.

a couple things.

first off, the smaller portions, the Cheesecake Factory, GLP-1 are driving a lot of this.

You can't.

>> That's interesting.

Yeah.

>> You know, they can't eat these huge portions.

your coffee guy, I mean, coffee's been on a tear because of crop failures in West Africa.

West, not West Africa, but in the coffee growing regions around the world.

There's been a lot of crop failures and stuff there, but the real question is the effect of the minimum wage.

I mean, since you know, December 20th and 2021, it was 1320.

It's 16.

Now.

I'm not sure that's restaurants, but that's outside of New York City.

That's like a 21% increase in four years.

>> Yeah.

So, Robert, thank you.

And there's tipped workers in this state have historically had a different situation.

Let me just first say, before I let our guests talk about minimum wage, that there is actual research building on Robert's point about GLP ones that is affecting the way American diners are demanding portions bigger or smaller, and they're looking for smaller because they have smaller appetites.

So as the ozempic's of the world proliferate, it is actually affecting restaurants.

And I mean, again, I don't want to overstate it, but a number of national publications have looked at this.

Have you?

Is that too early to say, or do you have you experienced that at Lento?

>> No, that's news to me.

But it makes perfect sense.

>> Right.

So okay, so now he's wondering about minimum wage.

And Robert is right, that minimum wage has been going up in New York state.

tipped wages still lower, right.

Is that correct?

>> Everybody here lower.

But it's still it's high.

>> What's the tipped wage tipped workers wage.

>> 12 ish.

Something like that.

>> 1150 I mean, so I'm in a different situation because I don't necessarily have servers.

My employees still get tips, but they make a very high hourly wage as well.

>> Okay.

Art.

So but Robert's implying though that that's put more of a squeeze on businesses.

>> Do you agree.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I mean just like Kelly was saying before, labor is always been our number one cost.

Yeah.

because just like Kelly, we make everything from scratch.

So we have a ton of labor.

do.

>> You think the wage is unreasonable?

>> I don't know, I don't know how large my employees are living.

I don't think they're living large.

>> I mean, I know my employees aren't living too large, but, you know, having been on the other side as an employee you know, and then seeing their struggles and now being an employer and seeing their struggles.

I think that the increase was definitely needed.

I mean, I think we all know that everything has gotten more expensive.

you know, and so with inflation, you know, if we're going to increase costs of everything else that we're buying and that we're selling, then we need to give them more money to.

>> I don't think it's unreasonable, but I don't know.

I'm not not a politician.

>> Right.

Yeah.

Sam.

>> Rory, what do you think?

>> I'm happy to pay my team more.

Yeah.

I you know, I think that they're the value they bring to our business is is amazing.

And the minimum wage for us is $16 an hour.

and then we add on to that however we can.

And what makes sense to us so I'm happy to pay as much as I can to our team.

and I would just say, like, as far as the coffee producing like the, the comment about that.

I mean, it's an agricultural product.

So, I mean, you're going to have ebbs and flows in that realm as far as the growing regions and what's capable there.

>> Robert.

Thank you.

Dan in Rochester, co-owner of Angelina's in the South Wedge, called in to echo Art's thoughts on maybe offering smaller portions and encouraging more singles to feel comfortable coming out and dining.

So we'll see.

This would be an interesting year.

We'll check in.

Yeah, six, 12 months.

I think we'll have more of a sample size.

So thank you for that, Dan.

And then a couple of emails just asking if tariffs have affected your prices, tariffs, any effect Rory.

>> Absolutely.

How I mean so we use BI we use biodegradable compostable cups.

those are not made in the U.S.

We have seen that price triple since 2020.

So and no costs have gone down since Covid.

and then the tariffs that got tacked on to coffee producing countries, you know Brazil, for example, is between a 40 and 50% tariff.

you won't see any regulation until that, even though it was dropped.

technically, I mean, those green coffees have already been boughten.

So nine months from when that tariff was quote, unquote dropped is when you'll see maybe some sort of like adjustment.

for those coffee producing countries.

>> Well, listen, the purpose is to manufacture at home.

So it's about time.

Our mountains are in western New York, are growing coffee?

>> Yeah, let's let's get on that.

Okay.

>> Kelly.

Tariffs effect on you.

>> Yeah 100%.

How?

cocoa powder being in chocolate in general, being a huge one since we don't produce it here.

and you know, not just with the ethics involved, but with the accessibility of chocolate you know, so that tariff, the it's at least quadrupled in price.

yeah.

Oh, yeah.

Wow.

Oh, chocolate.

Yeah.

sugar.

canola oil.

palm shortening.

lots of soy shortening available.

But we don't, you know, I have a lot of people who are soy free, so I have to look at alternatives for that.

you know, and then little things a lot of little things, like decorative additions and you know, obscure cake details that I need to procure or make myself.

That's just all gone up.

>> Okay.

Art Rogers at Lento tariffs.

Have they affected you?

>> not as much as these two.

I buy coffee and I buy chocolate, and they are both expensive, but obviously not to the extent of my fellow guests here.

but yes, like Kelly said, like disposable gloves, fryer oil, things like that.

I don't know if that's tariffs or just corporate greed because those like Rory was saying they doubled, tripled during Covid and then they just left them there.

Kosher salt, diamond crystal, kosher salt.

It's insanely expensive.

I don't know what's going on.

but yeah, mostly like little things like that.

>> What about the price of meat?

Beef?

>> because I buy all my meat from local farmers.

It's always been exquisitely expensive.

and I haven't seen much change in that.

>> The last time we talked, that was the same kind of story.

So that hasn't moved too much from, you.

>> Know, because I don't buy on the.

>> So but meat has always been pretty expensive for you because you're buying locally.

>> From small local farms.

Oh, yeah.

So expensive.

>> And you put it right on the menu.

>> You know where it's coming from.

>> You know where it's coming from.

So you're not buying from CAFOs in the Midwest, and all of a sudden prices are going up.

>> No.

>> Okay.

what else is what's the most expensive item that you have to work with regularly?

>> chocolate.

>> Chocolate.

>> Yeah.

It's insane.

Like she said, it's like four times.

We were just talking about it when we were waiting to come on the show.

It's.

>> How do you make a chocolate dessert?

>> Carefully, with no waste.

>> You can't waste chocolate anymore.

>> Wow.

Or maybe make dessert without chocolate.

>> Yeah.

It's coming.

I mean, it just keeps going up and up, and I think it's environmental factors, and there probably are tariffs because chocolate doesn't just come from one place.

But yeah, it's it's really high.

>> Is chocolate number one for you.

>> Yeah.

Probably if you're at a single the ingredients I mean my flour has gone, you know, 3 to 4 times the price.

It was, you know, everything has a bag of sugar used to cost $19.

Now it's 60.

So.

Wow.

Yeah.

>> Wow.

What about you?

Most expensive item?

>> probably milk.

And that includes alternative milks, too.

>> Yeah.

>> Yeah.

>> I was told all these prices had gone down.

Guys.

Lies not not happening.

All right, so in our last 90s, then, you know, we're gonna see.

And I appreciate Dan from Angelina's and frankly, small businesses across the region maybe listening going, yeah, we're kind of in a similar boat that that was the point today.

Not to not to advertise three businesses, but to tell a fuller story of the marketplace.

And so you understand what your local small business owners, especially in food and beverage, are going through.

It's not easy.

do you expect one year from today still be going strong?

Are you worried at all about being able to sustain what you're doing?

Rory.

>> We'll be here.

You're going to be.

I mean, I'm obviously worried in what capacity, but, I mean, I'm worried more in the sense of, like, I just want to take care of my people.

>> Okay.

Kelly, what about you?

>> Yeah.

You know, we'll be here.

worried about again, like Rory said, how you know, how much basically will be left over to keep us pushing forward and keep, you know, expanding new things.

But, you know, we're just going to keep plugging along.

>> Art Rogers.

>> Yeah.

As long as you folks keep coming out to eat, we'll keep plugging along.

And I mean, that's we need you to come out and support our businesses.

That's the only way we're going to survive.

>> How long did it take you to make that first million?

>> Still working on that?

>> Small businesses.

I mean, it's I know it's tough and I just want to I spend a lot of love to small business owners across our region.

Hasn't been an easy stretch of years.

The last year in particular has been really hard.

But good luck to you.

And maybe if you're going out to eat as our Rory said, go late.

everybody's going at 630.

Art Rogers.

Chef and owner of Lento restaurant in the Village Gate.

Thank you for being here.

Thank you.

Kelly Scott, co-owner of Get Caked Bakery.

Where are you located?

>> Right in the village gate, right down the hall from Lento.

>> You guys are neighbors?

>> Yep.

>> How about that?

Thanks for being here.

Thank you.

Rory Van Grol.

Ugly Duck Coffee.

Where are you located?

>> 89 Charlotte Street.

right behind Red and over by the little theater.

>> Thanks for being here, as always.

>> Thanks for having me.

>> And from all of us at Connections.

Thanks for watching, listening, finding us on whatever platforms you're finding us on.

I'm Evan Dawson.

And from all of us.

We'll be back with you tomorrow on member supported public media.

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