THIS PROGRAM IS MADE BY MPT TO ENRICH THE DIVERSE COMMUNITIES THROUGHOUT OUR STATE AND IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE GENEROUS SUPPORT OF OUR MEMBERS.

THANK YOU.

CONNECTING MARYLANDERS TO THEIR GOVERNMENT, THIS IS "STATE CIRCLE".

>> Jeff: WELCOME TO "STATE CIRCLE".

COMING UP, VETERANS LEADING THE WAY ON DIABETES RESEARCH.

>> I THINK THEY ARE DOING SUCH A NOTABLE CONTRIBUTION TO SCIENCE.

>> Jeff: AND ARE THE ECONOMIC ODDS STILL STACKED AGAINST WOMEN?

>> WE CAN BE A SUPER 80s CAREER WOMAN AND WE CAN ALSO BE AN INSTAGRAMMABLE WIFE AT HOME.

>> Jeff: WE BEGIN WITH THE NEED FOR SPEED GOVERNOR MOORE'S MESSAGE IN SIGNING AN EXECUTIVE ORDER TO ACCELERATE THE CONSTRUCTION OF NEW HOUSING AROUND THE STATE.

[♪♪] OUR NEWSMAKER IS JAKE DAY THE SECRETARY OF THE DEPARTMENT OF HOUSING AND COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT.

Mr.

SECRETARY, THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

>> JEFF, ALWAYS A PLEASURE GOOD TO BE WITH YOU.

>> Jeff: WE WILL GET INTO THE DETAILS OF THE GOVERNOR'S EXECUTIVE ORDER LET'S START WITH THE BIG PICTURE ON HOUSING.

WHAT ARE THE MAJOR CONCERNS RIGHT NOW?

>> WELL, I THINK, EVERY FAMILY IN THE STATE OF MARYLAND HAS EXPERIENCED HOUSING UNAFFORDABILITY AT SOME DEGREE IT AFFECTS THEM WHETHER IT'S THEIR RENT THEIR HOMES THAT THEY ARE LOOKING AT PURCHASING OR THEIR HOME THAT THEY CURRENTLY LIVE IN AND THEIR MORTGAGE BILL.

THAT HOUSING AFFORDABILITY CRISIS DIDN'T COME FROM NOWHERE.

IT'S BEEN BUILDING SINCE 2008 SINCE THE FINANCIAL CRISIS THAT OUR NATION FACED.

AND WE'VE UNDER PRODUCED HOUSING EVER SINCE TO SOME DEGREE TO A SIGNIFICANT DEGREE, SUPPLY AND DEMAND FACTORS IN.

AND THAT HIGH DEMAND ULTIMATELY MEANS WE ARE A HIGH COST HOUSING COST STATE.

AND WE NEED TO ADDRESS IT.

>> Jeff: WHAT WOULD THE GOVERNOR'S ORDER DO?

>> SO THE GOVERNOR'S ORDER DOES A COUPLE OF THINGS.

FIRST OF ALL, IT ACKNOWLEDGES SOMETHING THAT THE GOVERNOR HAS ACKNOWLEDGED TIME AND AGAIN, SINCE HIS FIRST LEGISLATIVE SESSION WHICH IS THAT 96,000 UNIT HOUSING SHORTAGE THAT WE FACE AS A STATE DESPERATELY NEEDS GOVERNMENT ATTENTION AND LEADERSHIP.

AND SO WHAT THIS EXECUTIVE ORDER DOES IT BUILDS ON THE SUCCESSFUL HOUSING PACKAGE THAT THE GOVERNOR LED AND THAT WAS PASSED AND SIGNED INTO LAW IN 2024 AND IT DOES THAT BY ONE, DIRECTING STATE AGENCIES TO WORK TOGETHER TO MORE QUICKLY DISPOSE OF STATE LAND FOR HOUSING DEVELOPMENT.

NOW, THIS IS ONLY STATE LAND APPROPRIATE FOR HOUSING DEVELOPMENT.

IT IS NOT AS IF IT OPENS UP PARKS OR PRESERVED LAND.

ONLY APPROPRIATE STATE OWNED LAND FOR HOUSING DEVELOPMENT.

SECOND, IT CREATES A HOUSING OMBUDSMAN A STATE AGENCY LEADER WHO WILL WORK WITH LOCAL GOVERNMENTS, DEVELOPERS AND STATE GOVERNMENT AGENCIES TO PROBLEM SOLVE, TO UNSTICK THINGS THAT GET STUCK IN THE PROCESS.

THIRD, IT MANDATES THAT STATE AGENCIES LIKE THE MARYLAND DEPARTMENT OF THE ENVIRONMENT, MARYLAND DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION, DEPARTMENT OF NATURAL RESOURCES, THAT THEY ISSUE PERMITS FASTER AND THEY SUBMIT A PLAN TO THE GOVERNOR BY NOVEMBER FOR HOW THEY ARE GOING TO DO THAT AND ULTIMATELY IMPLEMENT BY MARCH.

QUICK TURN AROUND.

AND IT FOCUSES ON A COUPLE OF THINGS.

NUMBER ONE, ON ENSURING THAT THIRD PARTY PERMITTING IS ACCEPTABLE TO EACH OF THOSE AGENCIES.

NUMBER TWO, THAT REVIEWS ARE DONE CONCURRENTLY AND NOT SEQUENTIAL HADLY.

AND THREE, THAT WE DIGITIZE YOU WOULDN'T BELIEVE THE AMOUNT OF PAPER WE STILL REQUIRE DEVELOPERS TO SUBMIT TO STATE AGENCIES.

THE NEXT THING IT DOES, IT DICTATES THAT MY DEPARTMENT MOVE FASTER ON FINANCING HOUSING.

SO IT ASKS US TO SHORTEN OUR TIMELINES.

AND THEN IT SHIFTS FROM STATE GOVERNMENT TO LOCAL GOVERNMENT AND IT SAYS THAT WE'RE GOING TO PROVIDE HOUSING PRODUCTION TARGETS TO EVERY COUNTY AND MUNICIPALITY WITH ZONING AND PERMITTING AUTHORITY TO SAY THIS CRISIS IS NOT JUST A STATE CRISIS, BUT THAT IT LIVES BLOCK BY BLOCK, NEIGHBORHOOD BY NEIGHBORHOOD, JURISDICTION BY JURISDICTION, IT TARGETS DOWN TO THE JURISDICTIONS PARTICULAR NUMBER OF UNITS THEY NEED TO PRODUCE AND THEN IT WILL HONOR THEM WITH LEADERSHIP AWARDS FOR THOSE THAT EITHER MEET THEIR HOUSING PRODUCTION TARGETS OR START ADOPTING POLICIES TO GET THERE THERE.

>> Jeff: LET ME PICK UP ON THE FINANCING PART OF THAT, BECAUSE I'M FAMILIAR WITH THE AREA CLOSE TO HOWARD COUNTY HOSPITAL IN COLUMBIA WITHIN A FEW BLOCKS OF THE HOSPITAL IN DIFFERENT DIRECTIONS THERE ARE THREE BIG APARTMENT PROJECTS BEING BUILT.

AND I THINK THE SIGN OUT FRONT SAYS FUNDING BY HOUSING AND COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT ON AT LEAST A COUPLE OF THOSE.

ENTERPRISE FOUNDATION MAYBE INVOLVED.

WHERE YOU ARE FUNDING IT, HOW DOES THAT WORK?

>> THAT IS A GREAT QUESTION.

IT'S INCREDIBLY COMPLICATED.

LOOK, THERE IS, I THINK, A MAJOR REAR TO CAL BATTLE THAT IS FOUGHT AROUND AFFORDABLE HOUSING AND THAT TERM AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

AND SOME PEOPLE WILL SAY WELL THAT IS NOT AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

I LIKE TO BREAK IT DOWN AS CAPITAL A AND LOWER A AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

WHAT I MEAN IS THAT EVERY PRICE POINT THERE ARE PEOPLE WITH A PARTICULAR INCOME THAT IT'S SUITED FOR.

AND AS LESS AND LESS HOUSING IS AVAILABLE FOR MANY OF THE PEOPLE WHO LIVE IN MARYLAND, IN A PARTICULAR JURISDICTION THERE IS LESS LITTLE A AFFORDABLE HOUSING AT THAT TIME MAYBE MARKET RATE HOUSING BUT IT NEEDS TO BE PRODUCED AT A PRICE POINT THAT IS AFFORDABLE FOR ALL OF US.

THE REGULATORY OBSTACLES TO HOUSING PRODUCTION ARE WHAT LIMITS THAT AFFORDABILITY.

MEANING THAT EVERY TIME YOU ADD TIME AND MONEY AND COST TO A PROCESS, IT MEANS THAT THE ONLY THINGS THAT START GETTING THROUGH ARE AT A HIGH PRICE POINT.

SOMEBODY HAS TO MAKE YOUR MONEY BACK.

>> Jeff: IF THE STATE IS PUTTING MONEY INTO A PROJECT DOES IT AUTOMATICALLY HAVE TO HAVE A LOW AND MODERATE INCOME COMPONENT?

>> NOT ALWAYS.

BUT MOST OF WHAT WE DO IS THAT, YES.

AND THAT IS WHAT I WOULD CALL YES, WE DO INCOME RESTRICTED AFFORDABLE HOUSING, CAPITAL A AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

YOU'VE HEARD PEOPLE REFER TO THIS AS SECTION 8 AND THEY ARE REFERRING TO THE DEMAND SIDE OR THE VOUCHER THAT SOMEONE USES TO PAY.

WE FINANCE THAT.

WE FINANCE HOUSING.

AND WE USE THE FEDERAL LOW INCOME HOUSING TAX CREDIT THERE ARE TWO VERSIONS OF THAT BUT WE USE THAT TO LEVERAGE EQUITY INTO THE DEAL.

SO IT'S VERY COMPLICATED.

THEY USE SYNDICATORS THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING DEVELOPERS AND ENTERPRISE IS ONE OF THOSE.

AND WE ARE THE BROKER OF THOSE TAX CREDITS AND WE PUT IN ADDITIONAL DEBT REFERRED TO AS SOFT DEBT INTO THE DEALS THAT IS STATE APPROPRIATED MONEY THAT WE PUT INTO THE DEALS TO TRY TO MAKE THEM WHOLE BECAUSE THE TAX CREDITS CAN'T GET THE DEAL DONE BY ITSELF.

SO IT'S DIFFICULT TO EXECUTE.

>> Jeff: DRIVING BY THE BUILDINGS, ONE IS ALMOST DONE AND IT LOOKS GREAT.

THE OTHER THING IS THE INCREDIBLE SPEED WITH WHICH THEY CAN PUT TOGETHER ONE OF THESE FOUR OR FIVE STOREY APARTMENT BUILDINGS I DON'T KNOW IF THAT IS CAUSE FOR OPTIMISM BUT THEY WORK REALLY FAST.

>> WELL, I THINK YOU'VE IDENTIFIED TWO REALLY CRITICAL THINGS.

ON SPEED THAT IS THE IT TAKES YEARS TO GET AN AFFORDABLE HOUSING DEVELOPMENT DONE.

BUT IT DOESN'T TAKE YEARS TO BUILD WHAT THAT TELLS US IS THAT GOVERNMENT PROCESS IS THE TIMELINE TO GET THINGS DONE AND TO ME AS A FORMER LOCAL ELECTED OFFICIAL AND A GUY WHO MANAGES PROCESSES THAT IS UP ACCEPTABLE.

WE CAN'T BE THE REASON THINGS TAKE SO LONG TO GET SOMETHING DONE AND THE SECOND THING THEY LOOK GOOD.

I CAN'T TELL YOU HOW IMPORTANT THAT IS.

THE PERCEPTION PEOPLE HAVE ABOUT AFFORDABLE HOUSING I BELIEVE WE BUILD A LOT OF JUNK FOR DECADES WE BUILT THINGS DEVOID OF CHARACTER AND QUALITY AND DETAIL AND POOR PEOPLE LIVE HERE AND DON'T DESERVE THE DIGNITY OF GOOD DESIGN.

AND WHAT DOES THE AVERAGE PASSERBY READ THAT AS?

THAT'S A POOR QUALITY BUILDING.

AND POOR PEOPLE LIVE THERE.

AND THUS I DON'T WANT IT IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD.

IF THERE IS RESISTANCE TO AFFORDABLE HOUSING BEING IN YOUR COMMUNITY TODAY, I THINK THAT HAS EVERYTHING TO DO WITH HOW WE BUILT THINGS FOR A LONGTIME.

>> Jeff: LAST LEGISLATIVE SESSION, LOCAL OFFICIALS AS YOU USED TO BE, PUSHED BACK A LITTLE BIT ON THE HOUSING BILL AND, I THINK, IT WAS ABOUT LOCAL CONTROL, ZONING AND THAT SORT OF THING.

AND, I THINK, THAT PART OF THE BILL FAILED.

DO YOU HAVE A WAY TO BRING THAT BACK DIFFERENTLY IN THE NEXT SESSION?

>> WELL, NUMBER ONE WE'RE STARTING BY BRINGING IT BACK IN THE FORM THAT IT WAS AMENDED TO.

WHICH WAS ACCEPTABLE TO MOST OF THE LEGISLATORS WE WERE WORKING WITH.

IT IS DIFFERENT THAN WHAT WE STARTED WITH IT IS MODIFIED BILL.

THAT IS THE DEMOCRATIC PROCESS WE WANT TO LISTEN TO OUR LEGISLATORS WHO REPRESENT THE PEOPLE IN THEIR JURISDICTIONS.

AND I THINK THAT IS IMPORTANT.

NOW, ALSO HAS TO BE BALANCED AGAINST PUBLIC POLICY PRIORITIES.

AS A MAYOR, I WORKED VERY HARD TO TRY TO GROW MY ECONOMY AND GROW ENOUGH HOUSING THAT IT COULD BE AFFORDABLE FOR ALL THE PEOPLE IN MY COMMUNITY.

THOSE WHO ARE RESISTING AT THAT TIME FOR THE SAKE OF CONTROL, I THINK ARE MISSING ON THE MORE IMPORTANT PUBLIC POLICY PRIORITY WHICH IS TO HOUSE PEOPLE.

I THINK THAT HAS TO BE THE END OBJECTIVE AND THIS IS LIKE A VERY, VERY CRITICAL GAME OF MUSICAL CHAIRS.

WHEN WE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH HOUSING SOMEBODY GETS LEFT OUT AND WHEN THEY GET LEFT OUT THEY ARE USUALLY THE MOST VULNERABLE PEOPLE WITH DISABILITIES, SENIORS, VETERANS AND ACCOMPANIED CHILDREN.

WE HAVE AN OBLIGATION TO ADDRESS THAT PUBLIC POLICY PRIORITY AS WELL.

>> Jeff: TIME FOR A SENTENCE OR TWO, TRANSIT ORIENTED DEVELOPMENT MAKES SENSE FOR A LOT OF REASONS IS THAT A PART OF THE PACKAGE?

>> IT'S THE NUMBER ONE ELEMENT, THE FIRST ELEMENT IN THE PACKAGE DIRECT THE GOVERNOR DIRECTS THE MARYLAND DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION AND DHC TO WORK TOGETHER TO BUILD MORE TRANSIT ORIENTED DEVELOPMENT ON SURFACE PARKING LOTS AROUND RAIL STATIONS.

>> Jeff: SECRETARY JAKE DAY, Mr.

SECRETARY APPRECIATE YOUR TIME.

THANK YOU.

>> ALWAYS A PLEASURE, JEFF, THANK YOU.

[♪♪] >> Jeff: NOW WITH OUR SALUTE TO VETERANS, HERE'S NANCY YAMADA.

>> I GO BACK TO WORK IF I COULD.

>> AT 91 JIM CARNEY IS THE PICTURE OF HEALTH DESPITE HAVING TYPE ONE DIABETES.

HE CREDITS IN LARGE PART THE DIABETES EDUCATOR AT THE V.A.

SYSTEM IN BALTIMORE AND THE TECHNOLOGY THAT MONITORS HIS BLOOD SUGAR FOR HELPING HIM MANAGE HIS LIFELONG CONDITION.

>> SHE TAUGHT ME TO BASICALLY IN MY HANDS, THAT I'M THE ONE THAT CONTROLS IT.

AND I HAVE TO TAKE CARE OF MYSELF AND LOOK OUT FOR THAT FIRST.

>> PEOPLE DON'T ALWAYS TAKE INTO ACCOUNT HOW LIFE CHANGING TYPE ONE DIABETES AS A DIAGNOSIS IS IF YOU ARE NOT GIVING THE SUPPORT UP FRONT THAT CHANGES THE TRAJECTORY HOW WELL YOU CAN BE CONTROLLED AND MANAGED.

>> SHE HAS CONDUCTED A NUMBER OF STUDIES ON NEW AND EMERGING TECHNOLOGIES USED TO MANAGE TYPE ONE AND TYPE TWO DIABETES WHICH IS CHARACTERIZED BY ELEVATED BLOOD SUGAR.

OVER TIME, IT CAN DAMAGE THE HEART, BLOOD VESSELS EYES AND KIDNEY WHY MONITORING GLUE CLOSE LEVELS IS IMPORTANT.

>> ONE OF THE BIGGEST ADVANCEMENTS WAS THE USE OF GLUCOSE MONITORING DEVICES AND THEY MEASURE BLOOD SUGAR 24/7 AND DISPLAY THE DATA TO A DEVICE WHETHER THAT WE A PHONE OR SOME SORT OF MONITORING DEVICE AND THAT ALLOWS US TO SEE WHAT THE SUGARS ARE DOING.

AND THAT ALLOWS YOU TO SEE WHEN ARE THEY DROPPING LOW WHEN ARE THEY AT THE HIGHEST AND TAILOR THE REGIMENT TO THOSE NEEDS.

BEYOND THAT THE DOCTOR STUDIED WHETHER CERTAIN DEVICES ARE SAFE AND EFFECTIVE FOR BOTH TYPE ONE AND TYPE TWO DIABETES.

>> SOME OF THE TRIALS INCLUDE USING A SMART INSULIN PEN TO SEE IF IT'S BETTER THAN TRADITIONAL INSULIN PENTOSE MANAGE BROOD SUGARS.

>> ALL OF THE PATIENTS IN THE STUDIES ARE VETERANS WHO HAVE VOLUNTEERED TO SERVE THEIR COUNTRY IN MORE WAYS THAN ONE.

>> I THINK THEY ARE DOING SUCH A NOTABLE CONTRIBUTION TO SCIENCE AND TO IMPROVE THE QUALITY OF LIFE FOR OTHERS.

>> INCLUDING HERSELF.

THE DOCTOR WAS DIAGNOSED WITH TYPE ONE DIABETES WHEN SHE WAS 24 YEARS OLD.

JIM CREDITS HER FOR ENCOURAGING HIM TO STAY ACTIVE AND EMBRACE TECHNOLOGY.

>> I HAVE TO THIS IS IT WILL LEAVE YOU IN THE DUST.

WHEN THEY INTRODUCED ME TO CONSTANT GLUCOSE MONITORING IT MADE A BIG DIFFERENCE.

>> I'M NANCY YAMADA FOR "STATE CIRCLE".

[♪♪] >> Jeff: NOW, ON THE BOOK PETE WE'RE JOINED BY CORRINE LOW ASSOCIATE PROFESSOR AT THE WHARTON SCHOOL AT THE UNIVERSITY OF PENNSYLVANIA AND AUTHOR OF HAVING IT ALL.

THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

THE PROMOTIONAL LINE FOR THE BOOK SAYS THE ODDS ARE STILL STACKED AGAINST WOMEN WE HAVE THE DATA TO PROVE IT.

AND WE HAVE THE POWER TO CHANGE IT.

SO LET'S START WITH THE ODDS BEING STACKED AGAINST WOMEN.

YOU'RE THINKING ECONOMICALLY?

>> YES, EXACTLY.

I MEAN WHAT WE'RE SEEING IS WOMEN ARE FACING UNSUSTAINABLE DEMANDS AT HOME AND WORK AND I POINT TO THE FACT THAT GENDER CONVERGED IN THE WORKPLACE WE'RE TRYING TO FIND CAREER SUCCESS AND YET AT THE SAME TIME WOMEN ARE FACING DISCRIMINATION, WE'RE FACING OTHER PROBLEMS IN THE WORKPLACE AND AT HOME, WE DON'T HAVE THE SUPPORT BECAUSE MEN'S TIME DOING HOUSEWORK HAS STAYED THE SAME SINCE THE 1970s.

AND YOU ADD TO THAT THAT WE SPEND TWICE AS MUCH TIME WITH OUR KIDS AS OUR OWN MOTHERS DID AND IT DOESN'T ADD UP.

>> Jeff: I DO NOT HAVE DATA HOW MUCH TIME I'M SPENDING ON HOUSEWORK BUT WHAT DO THE DATA SHOW AND HOW DO YOU GET DATA ON THIS?

>> I USED THE AMERICAN TIME USE SURVEY THEY ASK AMERICAN HOUSEHOLDS TO DOCUMENT HOW THEY ARE SPENDING THEIR TIME.

AND WHAT WE SEE IS THAT MEN'S TIME DOING HOUSEWORK HAS BEEN STAGNANT AND WE ALSO SEE THAT WITHIN COUPLES WHEN WOMEN START EARNING MORE, MEN'S TIME DOING HOUSEWORK DOESN'T RESPOND BY INCREASING.

WOMEN END UP IN THE POSITION OF WINNING THE BREAD AND BAKING IT, TOO.

SO FOR THE WOMEN OUT THERE WHO ARE FEELING LIKE WHY AM I SO TIRED AND STRESSED OUT IT'S NOT YOU, IT'S NOT IN YOUR HEAD IT'S IN THE DATA AND MY BOOK FACING THAT REALITY TRIES TO GIVE STRATEGIES FOR WOMEN TO RECLAIM THEIR TIME AND HOPEFULLY THEIR HAPPINESS.

>> Jeff: TELL US ABOUT THE STRATEGIES.

BECAUSE THE LAST PART OF THE PROMOTIONAL MATERIAL SAID WE HAVE THE POWER TO CHANGE IT.

>> YES.

I THINK ONCE YOU KNOW THAT IT JUST DOESN'T ADD UP FOR WOMEN YOU HAVE PERMISSION TO NAVIGATE THIS HOWEVER WORKS FOR YOU.

AND I THINK THERE IS A LOT OF POTENTIAL WIN-WIN SOLUTIONS AVAILABLE.

I THINK WE'RE SCARED TO GET A GOOD DEAL FOR OURSELVES BECAUSE WE DON'T WANT TO GIVE SOMEONE ELSE A BAD DEAL BUT IT DOESN'T HAVE TO BE THAT WAY.

YOUR HUSBAND OR YOUR SPOUSE DOES NOT WANT TO BE A LOW LEVEL JUNIOR EMPLOYEE AT HOME EITHER.

SO PROMOTE HIM TO CO-C.E.O.

SO YOU CAN TAKE REAL JOINT OWNERSHIP OF THE WORK TO BE DONE AND YOU CAN LET GO OF THE MENTAL LOAD.

EVEN WITH OUR KIDS ALL THIS TIME WE'RE SPENDING WE HAVE TO ASK WHERE ARE WE ACTUALLY GETTING THE RETURN ON THE TIME THAT WE'RE PUTTING IN.

AND SO FOR ME, THE BIGGEST CURE FOR MY MOM GUILT WAS SEEING THE RELATIONSHIP WITH MY SON BLOSSOM ONCE I SET LIMITS AND STARTED GETTING MY OWN NEEDS MET BECAUSE I WAS ABLE TO BE A CALMER AND MORE PATIENT PARENT.

YOUR KIDS WOULD RATHER HAVE YOU BE ABLE TO BE CALM AND PATIENT WITH THEM AND SIT ON THE FLOOR AND PLAY A BOARD GAME RATHER THAN MAKE YOURSELF CRAZY BECAUSE YOU ARE DRIVING THIS WAY AND THAT WAY TO EIGHT MILLION ACTIVITIES AND TRYING TO MAKE THEM HOMEMADE BABY FOOD OR WHATEVER IT IS THAT YOU THINK THAT THEY NEED.

SO THE TIME DOESN'T ADD UP.

WE NEED TO SAY NO AND RECLAIM MORE TIME FOR OURSELVES AND THE BOOK HAS STRATEGIES TO DO THAT.

>> Jeff: I HEARD YOU SAY THE HAND DECORATED CUPCAKES AND THAT.

MAYBE A RELIC OF PEOPLE'S CHILDHOODS THEY GREW UP WITH A GRANDMOTHER DOING SOMETHING SPECIAL FEEL LIKE THEY HAVE TO DO IT THE SAME WAY.

>> YES, I THINK IT'S THAT AND LOOKING TO REFERENCE POINTS OF WOMEN WHO MAYBE WEREN'T TRYING TO ACHIEVE THE SAME THING IN THEIR CAREERS THIS IDEA THAT WE CAN BE A SUPER 80s CAREER WOMAN AND WE CAN ALSO BE AN INSTAGRAMMABLE WIFE AT HOME.

THOSE ARE TWO SEPARATE FULL-TIME JOBS AND THEY DON'T ADD UP IN ONE DAY.

THE INFLUENCE CAN BE WOMEN FROM THE PAST WHO DIDN'T HAVE A CAREER BUT THE WOMEN ON INSTAGRAM WHO ARE PROJECTING AS THOUGH THIS IS SOMETHING YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO DO IN YOUR DOMESTIC LIFE WHEN IN REALITY THIS IS THEIR CAREER.

FOR THEM THERE IS NOT A TRADE-OFF BETWEEN THOSE ESTHETIC MARKERS OF THIS BEAUTIFUL LIFE AND THE LIFE THEY ARE TRYING TO PURSUE BECAUSE IT IS THEIR CAREER.

>> Jeff: I'M HEARING A LITTLE BIT OF AN INDICTMENT OF TODAY'S MEN NOT PULLING THEIR WEIGHT AT HOME.

IS THAT UNIVERSAL DO YOU THINK?

>> WELL, I DON'T THINK I WANT TO BLAME MEN BUT I THINK WE NEED A WAKE-UP CALL AND DATA CAN BE IMPORTANT FOR DOING THAT.

ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I RECOMMEND THAT COUPLES DO IS THEY TRY TRACKING THEIR TIME AND GETTING DATA WITHIN THEIR HOUSEHOLDS.

A LOT OF TIMES DADS AND MEN THEY WANT TO DO HALF, BUT THEY ARE DOING HALF OF THE THINGS THEY KNOW ABOUT WHICH IS THE TIP OF THE ICEBERG THEN THAT ICEBERG UNDERNEATH THE SURFACE.

DAD SAYS I'M DOING HALF OF THE SCHOOL DROP-OFFS BUT MOM KNOWS TO GET TO THE DROP-OFF SHE HAD TO BUY THE CLOTHES IN THE RIGHT SIZE AND PACK THE LUNCHES AND SETUP AFTER SCHOOL CARE AND PLAY DATES.

THERE'S ALL THE THINGS UNDER THE SURFACE.

TRACKING YOUR TIME GETTING DATA IN THE HOUSEHOLD CAN MAKE THAT INVISIBLE LABOR VISIBLE.

IT'S ABOUT ACKNOWLEDGING REALITIES AND SHIFTING THEM.

>> Jeff: SOUNDS LIKE AN OPPORTUNITY TO DESIGN THE HAVING IT ALL APP THAT TRACKS THE HOUSEWORK THAT YOU ARE DOING AND YOUR SPOUSE.

>> YEAH, I LOVE THAT IDEA.

MAYBE THERE IS A BUSINESS IDEA BUT I DO HAVE ON MY WEBSITE, CORRINE LOW.COM I HAVE THE TIME TRACKING SPREAD SHEET THAT YOU CAN USE IF YOU WANT THE DATA WITHIN YOUR HOUSEHOLD AND IT IS A GREAT EXERCISE FOR COUPLES TO TRY.

AND I THINK EVEN FOR INDIVIDUALS THINKING ABOUT HOW DO THEY SPEND THEIR TIME AND HOW DOES IT ALIGN WITH THEIR OBJECTIVES.

WHEN I ASK PEOPLE TO PICTURE IF MONEY WERE NO OBJECT HOW WOULD YOU SPEND YOUR TIME?

THEY RARELY SAY WELL, MAKE SURE TO GET THE REPORTS DONE FOR MY BOSS AND OFTEN SAY THEY WOULD SPEND TIME IN PURSUITS THAT THEY ENJOY, HOBBIES, LEISURE ACTIVITIES OR SPENDING TIME WITH THEIR LOVED ONES.

WHAT THAT TELLS ME IS THAT YOU CAN BE PRODUCTIVE JUST BY SPENDING YOUR TIME THAT WAY.

SO ONE WAY TO BE PRODUCTIVE IS TO WORK AND GET MONEY AND BUY SOMETHING THAT BRINGS YOU VALUE IF SPENDING TIME IN PEENINGFUL WAYS BRINGS YOU VALUE IT'S ALSO PRODUCTIVE TO SPEND TIME THAT WAY.

I AM AN ECONOMIST TELL YOU IT'S PRODUCTIVE TO SPEND TIME ON THINGS YOU ENJOY AND MANDATORY FOR US TO TAKE CARE OF OURSELVES AND NOT BE SO EXHAUSTED AND UNHAPPY BECAUSE THE DATA SHOWS WOMEN'S HAPPINESS HAS BEEN IN DECLINE AS THEY JUGGLE SO MANY THINGS.

>> Jeff: THAT IS FASCINATING AND GOES BACK TO THE TITLE OF HAVING IT ALL.

IS IT POSSIBLE TO HAVE IT ALL?

>> WHAT I SAY IN THE BOOK IS THAT IF HAVING IT ALL TO YOU IS THIS PERRIST IDEAL THAT YOU ARE GOING TO BE PERFECT IN THE CAREER AND HOME DOMAIN IT'S NOT POSSIBLE TO DO THAT BECAUSE WE ONLY HAVE 24 HOURS IN A DAY.

BUT WE CAN GET WHAT WE NEED.

WE CAN GET CLOSE TO THAT BY REALLY FOCUSING ON WHAT WE VALUE.

I CALL THAT HAVING IT ALMOST AND I THINK THAT IS POSSIBLE AND POSSIBLE FOR EVERY WOMAN AND I HOPE MY BOOK HELPS THEM GET THERE.

>> Jeff: WHEN DID YOU DECIDE THERE WAS A BOOK TO BE WRITTEN AND HOW MUCH OF THE INSPIRATION FOR IT WAS ACADEMIC VERSUS PERSONAL?

YOU ARE A NEW MOTHER?

>> BOTH THINGS.

I AM A NEW MOM AND OLD MOM IN THE SENSE I HAVE AN EIGHT-YEAR-OLD AND FOUR-MONTH-OLD.

WHEN I HAD THE EIGHT-YEAR-OLD I WAS IN THE THICK OF THE SQUEEZE WHERE WORK PRESSURES AND HOME PRESSURES WERE PUSHING DOWN ALL AT ONCE I WAS EXHAUSTED.

AND WHEN I STARTED LOOKING AT TIME USE DATA IN MY WORK AS AN ECONOMIST AND SEEING THE WAY OUR TIME USE HAS CHANGED OVER TIME AND SEEING THIS FACT AS I SAID, WE SPEND TWICE AS MUCH TIME WITH OUR KIDS AS PARENTS A GENERATION AGO.

I REALIZED IT'S NOT JUST ME.

THERE ARE THESE STRUCTURAL FORCES MAKING ME FEEL THAT WAY.

SO THEN I FELT LIKE I NEED TO GET THIS INFORMATION OUT THERE TO EVERY WOMAN WHO IS FEELING THIS WAY THEY SHOULD KNOW IT'S NOT THAT THEY ARE UNIQUELY FAILING IS WE'RE TRYING TO DO SOMETHING THAT IS REALLY IMPOSSIBLE.

AND IT THEN GIVES YOU PERMISSION TO NAVIGATE IT IN THE WAY THAT WORKS FOR YOU.

I HAVE A NEW BABY AND THIS TIME AROUND I'M MAKING DIFFERENT CHOICES AND IT FEELS DIFFERENT.

>> Jeff: I'M FEELING GUILTY TAKING 10 MINUTES OF YOUR TIME OVER ZOOM THIS IS OKAY?

>> ABSOLUTELY.

BECAUSE YOU KNOW, I TALKING ABOUT THIS WORK AND GETTING THE WORKOUT TO WOMEN TO HELP THAT IS PART OF WHAT I VALUE THIS IS BRINGING ME JOY RIGHT NOW.

>> Jeff: I'M GLAD TO HEAR IT'S JOYFUL.

I REMEMBER HEARING A SENIOR WALL STREET EXECUTIVE WOMAN YEARS AGO TALKING ABOUT AND YOU ARE FOCUSED ON THE DOMESTIC SIDE ASSUMING THE WORK SIDE IS EQUAL HER POINT WAS SHE BEFORE SHE GOT TO THE OFFICE, SHE HAD TO INVEST A LOT OF TIME IN HAIR AND MAKEUP WHICH THE MEN IN THE OFFICE DID NOT.

AND IT MAY SOUND LIKE IT WAS A FRIVOLOUS THING BUT YOU NEED TO LOOK YOUR BEST AND BE IN CHARACTER ESPECIALLY IN THE ZOOM AGE.

IS THAT PART OF THE EQUATION?

>> YEAH, I THINK YOU ARE RIGHT THERE ARE DOUBLE STANDARDS WHERE WOMEN HAVE TO PUT IN MORE EFFORT AND APPEARANCE IS ONE OF THEM AND THERE ARE OTHER AREAS THAT I TALK ABOUT IN THE BOOK THE ADVICE WE'VE BEEN GIVING TO WOMEN IN BUSINESS BOOKS IS LEAN IN.

ACT MORE LIKE A MAN.

BE MORE AGGRESSIVE OR STRONGER NEGOTIATORS.

AND WHAT THE EVIDENCE SHOWS BECAUSE WOMEN ARE GOING TO BE TREATED DIFFERENTLY THAT IS NOT NECESSARILY GOOD ADVICE.

THE ADVICE I GIVE INSTEAD IS FOR WOMEN TO FIND THE AREAS THAT THEY EXCEL, FIND WHAT ARE THEIR SUPERPOWERS AND NOT BE AFRAID TO BRING AT THAT TIME TO THE TABLE.

THE DATA DOES NOT SUPPORT THAT WE NEED TO ACT LIKE MEN TO GET AHEAD OR IS THAT POSSIBLE GIVEN WE FACE THE DIFFERENT CONSTRAINTS AND EXPECTATIONS.

>> Jeff: AND BEFORE WE GO, WE WANT TO SELL BOOKS GIVE US BOTTOM LINE ADVICE FOR WOMEN.

WHAT SHOULD THEY CONSIDER DOING DIFFERENTLY?

>> YEAH, WHAT I WANT YOU TO DO IS TO FIGURE OUT WHAT MAKES YOU HAPPY, WHAT BRINGS YOU VALUE, WHAT IS MOST IMPORTANT TO YOU AND I WANT YOU TO BE RELENTLESS IN TRYING TO NEGOTIATE A GOOD DEAL FOR YOURSELF AT HOME AND WORK.

BECAUSE YOU DESERVE TO HAVE YOUR NEEDS MET.

I TALK ABOUT WOMEN FORGETTING THEY ARE A MEMBER OF THE HOUSEHOLD AND I LIVED THAT.

I WAS MAKING EVERYTHING WORK FOR EVERYBODY ELSE AND DIDN'T WORK FOR ME.

IF IT'S NOT WORKING FOR YOU IT'S NOT WORKING FOR THE FAMILY.

I NEED YOU TO EMBRACE THAT YOU ARE A MEMBER OF THE HOUSEHOLD THAT DESERVES TO HAVE YOUR NEEDS MET AND FIND WAYS TO DO THAT.

>> Jeff: CORRINE LOW IS THE AUTHOR OF HAVING IT ALL.

WE APPRECIATE YOUR TIME.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

>> THANK YOU SO MUCH AND THE BOOK IS OUT NOW AND I HOPE WE CAN CONTINUE THE CONVERSATION.

>> Jeff: AND THAT IS "STATE CIRCLE" FOR THIS WEEK.

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[♪♪]