A group of frustrated Ohioans want to ban property taxes.

The Cleveland Clinic will soon require co-pays before the doctor will see you and for the class of 2025.

Some advice from all of us.

Ideas is next.

Hello and welcome to Ideas.

I'm Mike McIntyre.

Thank you so much for joining us.

One thing your neighbors like to complain about and maybe you, too.

Is property taxes.

Who likes paying those?

But do we hate them enough to kill them?

An effort to eliminate property taxes with a constitutional amendment gained momentum this week.

If you want to see a doctor at the Cleveland Clinic, with some exceptions, you'll have to fork over your co-pay first or the appointment will be canceled.

Critics say the policy can negatively affect health care for people living paycheck to paycheck.

Cleveland residents do a lot of complaining about the neighbors.

When the neighbors are different every weekend and often rowdy.

Cleveland City Council is looking to crack down on short term rentals like Airbnb.

And every year I cobble together a message for graduates based on responses.

I get on social media asking for one line of advice.

Today, we offer this year's crowdsourced commencement speech.

Joining me for the roundtable from Ideastream Public Media, Akron Canton reporter Anna Huntsman from the Marshall Project, Cleveland editor in chief Phil Trexler, and in Columbus, her last appearance before some well-deserved time off, Statehouse news bureau chief Karen Kasler.

Let's get ready to roundtable backers of a grassroots effort to eliminate property taxes in Ohio.

Got the green light this week to start collecting signatures to put a constitutional amendment on the ballot.

Karen This is truly a grassroots effort without any major financial backing at this point.

It makes for a tough road, though, to get on the ballot.

Yeah, and that's why I would suggest people not think about how they're going to use all that property tax money that they're currently spending on property taxes, because this is a big hill to climb.

I mean, like you said, this group does not have any major financial backers, any big organizations, which is the case for a lot of groups that are just citizens that are getting together to try to change something.

This group kind of started as a grassroots group that one of the people involved who came to the ballot board this week, which is one of the steps in the process, is from Timberlake in Lake County, which is not a real big community.

But the idea is something that I think reaches across a lot of different people's perspectives because property taxes have been really high in a way.

We're all on fixed income, so we're all those of us who pay property taxes are looking at them thinking, how can I continue to afford this?

And the legislature doesn't appear to be doing anything.

There were some committee hearings last year.

There was a proposal of as a list of recommendations on how the legislature could make some changes.

And so far, none of that's happened.

What's interesting, you mentioned the Timberlake mayor, John Mara.

You know, he admits steep climb.

We don't have the resources.

We don't have time to set things up.

But his point was and this a quote from him, I'm a man of faith and I believe with God all things are possible.

So apparently it's a faith effort.

Yeah, but also the reality is here that we're talking about 443,000 valid signatures, which means you've got to get a lot more than that to make sure that your signatures are valid by the first week of July.

And if you don't have the money to pay circulators to go out and get those signatures, you don't have a big organization behind you that's helping with petitions and circulating them.

It's really difficult.

And they're also saying that they may aim for next year's ballot if they can't get to this year's ballot.

The longer the period is from the time you gather signatures till you turn them in, the more likely it is that people move.

They drop off the voting rolls and then of course, those aren't valid signatures.

So it's a really difficult process.

So let's talk about the idea, though, because it may not be the money, but the message might resonate.

A lot of people are upset with property taxes they might not be thinking through.

Then what happens?

You know, it's not like you're going to have all this extra money.

The taxes are going to have to come from somewhere to pay for schools and for emergency services, etc..

So the question then is, what has the legislature done to respond to these kinds of criticisms if it doesn't want to eliminate property taxes?

There was the cap on carryover for schools.

I don't know how much of that does, but there are other things that the legislature is doing because it's heard these complaints.

There have been all sorts of ideas discussed capping property taxes, means testing, doing all sorts of things that again, there were bills that had been proposed that would do all these things, but they just haven't moved forward.

And part of the problem is because property taxes are so complicated, because they affect schools, they affect law enforcement, libraries, all of these areas, voters approve property taxes to help take care of those things.

If you start changing those property taxes, then you change those other things.

So it's kind of like dominoes.

You hit one and then the rest of them go.

And so trying to figure out exactly what the balance would be to come up with something that really does help taxpayers but does not hurt all those other entities that depend on property taxes is the issue.

And I think, you know, this is the kind of thing that could, though, if they really have an effort that gains momentum, maybe it will push lawmakers to do something beyond that 30% cash reserve cap that's in the budget for school districts, which school districts say is going to be financially devastating for them.

That's the measure that would require school districts that they're holding more than 30% of their budget in cash.

They have to refund the rest of its taxpayers.

But districts are saying that within the second year of the budget, they could be in the red because of that, because there's a lot of reasons they're holding that cash.

There already are a lot of caveats, though.

It's not as though you pay taxes on 100% of your property's value.

There are limits, there are caps, there are exemptions.

So all of that already exists, doesn't it?

Yeah.

And you know, this is a problem that's been building for many, many years.

And as is the case with a lot of problems that build up over time, solving them is not something that you can just take an ax to and expect that there won't be significant repercussions.

And so this idea of getting rid of property taxes sounds like a great one.

But again, the impact on government will be a big deal.

And Speaker Matt Hoffman was saying, you know, it's the idea of what do people want to pay for?

And this was a discussion that we were having about iGaming and expanding gambling, which we'll talk about here, I think in a little bit.

But the idea of where do you raise money from people for the services that they want but they don't necessarily want to pay for.

So that's the challenge.

You get rid of the payment for something, but you still want the service.

Well, how are you going to have the service?

Interesting point.

Absolutely.

And also, I should remind people that schools that's in the Constitution, so you've got to find a way to have a system of common schools and pay for that.

And so, you know, there are there's and everybody wants to be able to call 911.

When a family member passes out or your house is on fire, and if there's no funding for that, what are you going to do?

the Cleveland Clinic is set to change its co-pay collection policy June 1st.

You want to see a doctor?

Unless it's an emergency or a few other exceptions, you have to hand over co-pay first.

Right now you have the option of paying or being billed later for it.

And other hospitals have done this.

Some locals don't they?

You can pay your co-pay as part of your whole bill.

But what'll happen if you are not flush that day or you don't have your credit card or your check or checkbook or your or cash in your pocket, if you show up at your visit and can't pay the 30 bucks or whatever it might be, what happens?

Your visit will be canceled outright or rescheduled.

And Mike, I don't know.

The last time you've had to reschedule a doctor appointment or even scheduled one at one of the major hospital systems in Cleveland.

It is not easy to get in pretty quickly when you reschedule.

Sometimes they're scheduling out several weeks.

So that's actually or month.

Yes, exactly.

So that's actually one of the concerns that has been brought up in response to this new policy is some folks I mean, this is not for, as you mentioned, emergency purposes, but just seeing your doctor annually, that's preventative care.

And sometimes things can be caught in those appointments.

So people are saying, you know, if you have to delay a couple of weeks, you're delaying care.

Yeah.

And sometimes you're already waiting months for that appointment.

It finally comes.

And then if you can't pay, then.

But you say at the end of a month they can when the bill comes, because that's when my check comes in or whatever it might be.

So that's where people are are really starting to gather opposition to this.

What is the clinic's say in terms of the justification for the new policy?

The clinic is saying that they're trying to kind of tighten their finances.

So this is a way that they can kind of more streamline things and that this is a decision that they came at.

And I do believe they had a 1% loss last year in their profits.

So, well, it appears less than 1% expected what they forecast, but they actually were the hospital system in Cleveland that made a profit, right?

Yes.

Thank you for clarifying that there.

But I do want to mention that it's for scheduled office visits.

So your primary care, your specialists, you know, therapy, outpatient procedural things, in-office procedures, but for things like cancer treatments or emergency sees those you can still wait to pay or pay later.

And let's talk about reaction.

So I know some people are angry about it.

The clinic is saying the standard and other hospitals do it.

But what are we hearing from from those who are upset?

Yeah, as you mentioned, folks are coming out and saying, I mean, Nina Turner, who has this organization called We Are Somebody, some health care experts have actually commented about this as well.

They're saying that a lot of Americans, a lot of people in the region are living paycheck to paycheck.

And so, as you mentioned, they might not have the money for it that day and they may have waited for that appointment.

And but they're able to get it later in the month when they get paid, they're able to make that payment.

So they're saying that this is going to potentially delay care.

It could also, they're saying, hurt the hospital system in the sense of university hospitals, MetroHealth, other health care systems do allow you to pay later.

So maybe if they can't get in at the Cleveland Clinic, maybe they'll actually go somewhere else or Metro.

Exactly.

Yeah.

So, yeah, So they're saying this could actually come back to bite the health care system.

And this is going to be started June 1st, so we won't really know for a while.

One of the things we talked about is the effect on people who are living paycheck to paycheck.

But one particular carve out or Medicaid patients, they will not be required.

Exactly.

Yep.

They are not Cleveland wants to regulate short term rentals like Airbnb and Furbo after hearing it from residents tired of loud revolving neighbors.

Cleveland has an estimated 900 to 1500 units in the city available for short term rental.

Phil One aspect of the legislation being proposed is licensing to limit how many short term rentals there can be in one, say, condo building.

Yeah, and there's been there has been some complaints citywide from from neighborhood residents who are frustrated by the whole activity.

Let's face it, I mean, these Airbnb, these they're businesses.

For a lot of folks who, you know, purchase the properties and then use them specifically for rentals on on a short term basis, the Airbnb is the verbose and what not.

So Cleveland's actually kind of late to the game on this.

Other cities, New York, Chicago, San Francisco, they all have, you know, laws in place that make them to regulate these home owners, property owner, rental property owners.

So Cleveland is late to the game on this.

It's it's probably necessary.

These are businesses and Cleveland needs to regulate the businesses that operate within within the city.

Airbnb you sent a note to us after the story had been posted and said basically it didn't say much, but it did say that something like 1% of their properties are places where people have parties, that it's not a thing where where you would see.

I mean, sometimes you'll have the Huntsman family come there.

They're nice and quiet and at the time you have the McIntyre's come in there and, you know, not exactly so and that's just conversation for loud people.

I don't I don't know.

The 1% seems a little maybe exaggerated, but it's not like Cleveland.

Well, I could be speaking out of turn.

But, you know, I think of places like Nashville where you have a lot of Airbnbs for like bachelor and bachelorette parties and you people specifically renovate their homes out there to be like the perfect destination for your bachelor bachelorette party.

And they're having parties.

But I mean, I guess Cleveland for folks around here, it is kind of a popular place to go.

But is it like the destination for your bachelorette party?

I'm not sure.

Not your bachelorette party?

Probably not.

I think I think that's Nashville.

I think it's required.

It's still a business, though, and it's still, you know, living next door or something like that.

That's not what you sign up for.

So I think this is a way of trying to keep things in line and and check.

On the other hand, one of the things that's used for we have people that might come for projects here at Ideastream and they'll get an Airbnb or a Furbo for three weeks because that's how long they're going to be in town.

And so you know that.

So there there are people that are responsible and people that aren't.

So the question is, how do you how do you focus that?

You don't interrupt the commerce of somebody that owns this property.

We make sure that the rules are being followed.

That's what council has to decide, right?

Because council still needs to vet this installation.

Yeah.

So and there's, you know, some proposals there.

You know, they're talking about $150 application fees and annual renewals.

They need to create a density cap of no more than 15% of short term rentals out of all residential units on the block.

So they don't want, you know, a bunch of them in all in one location.

And in fact, to it to me it came like when you mentioned of folks looking to rent short term this affects our hotels too as these are you know normally we'd go to a hotel back in the day.

Now you go to these Airbnbs.

So that does impact our hotels and the taxes that are collected from that.

There would be fines, too.

If you're if you're not.

Yeah.

And they're going to fine you if you're not registered up to five grand.

Yeah.

So I certainly see this happening.

It's just keeping pace with other cities and what's happening across the nation.

There's new technology and businesses.

I found the I found the email from the Airbnb spokesperson.

I was wrong.

Well, it was it was less than 1%, but it was way less according to Airbnb.

So as well, parties remain exceedingly rare, with fewer than 0.1% of reservations on Airbnb in Ohio, resulting in an Allegheny win of a party in 2024, Airbnb remains committed to working with Cleveland lawmakers to help ensure guest hosts and communities are able to quickly and appropriately address community concerns while protecting the right of responsible homeowners to earn supplemental income.

The Ohio Senate advanced a bill this week that would penalize communities that use ranked choice voting also known as instant runoff voting in elections.

It's where you rank all the candidates instead of picking just one.

And voters collectively arrive at a winner.

Karen, the bill would financially penalize any city or county that uses it in an election.

So really it's not a ban, but it it would make it onerous if you had that kind of a voting pattern.

Yeah, like the legislature didn't ban traffic cameras just said, if you're going to use traffic cameras, we're going to take the money that you raised from traffic cameras and deducted from the money that we give you to the local government fund.

So, yeah, it's the idea of presume preserving home rule while still making sure that the legislature gets their point across.

Do you think the legislature is preserving incumbent rule?

Well, I mean, that's a good question.

I think that the concerns about ranked choice voting that have been raised by Republicans and it's mostly Republicans, but some Democrats actually do think it's a bad idea.

They've talked about how that's administrative costs and it delays results.

And it you know, it can drive down turnout.

People don't quite understand exactly how it works.

That's been the the claims against ranked choice voting.

But ranked choice voting goes back a long way in Ohio.

I mean, back in the early part of the last century, Cincinnati, Cleveland, Toledo, Ashtabula and Hamilton, all used ranked choice voting.

And some communities are thinking about re reinstituting it or bringing it to their communities.

And so this would prevent them from doing that.

On the idea that it's just difficult to administer and that the system is fine as it is.

The secretary of state who runs elections in Ohio is also opposed to.

Sure.

And that, again, it's become kind of a Republican talking point.

I think here, though, the supporters of ranked choice voting say that it really does change the way that candidates campaign, because now you can run for second place because second place can actually win.

It reduces wasted votes.

People who go out and vote for the candidate they think's going to win, not the candidate they really want to win.

And it really determines who has the strongest support in a race that has multiple candidates.

And we've seen a lot of races in the last couple of years where there have been a lot of candidates all vying for the same job.

I mean, I'm thinking of U.S. Senate races for the Republicans, for instance, where we had I think it was in 2022 was where there are seven.

I mean, you know, that kind of thing.

The Haslam sports group told Cuyahoga County Executive Chris Ronayne in a letter delivered Thursday that the plan for a new domed stadium in Brook Park for the Browns will go forward with or without the county.

There was a visit this week by Roger Goodell, the commissioner of the NFL, who talked about how this is going to be good for downtown.

I heard a lot of downtown people, Karen, say, has Roger Goodell spent any time in downtown Cleveland because he's saying this is going to be good for downtown, It's going to be good for this area.

But his point being, the stadium, even if it's renovated, would be behind a number of these other palaces where football is played.

But the Haslam sports group said Ronan's resistance to the plan is inexplicable.

Yeah, and they said in the letter that it's kind of part of the reason why Cleveland and the region has not had the economic boom that we've seen in Columbus and in other areas, which is quite a thing to say.

But this letter was went through about ten points of of things that they said were facts that are evident, things they've talked about in terms of the impact of the stadium and the the new domed stadium.

That is, you know, one of the claims that's been made is about downtown that it would not take away from downtown.

But that's actually disputed in a report that was produced by the Legislative Service Commission, I believe that said that, no, it's going to cost potentially.

And it was the Brown's own consultant that said it could cost around $10 million to the downtown stadium.

So Chris Ronayne, of course, fired back saying you're this is this is a bad idea.

He wants the lakefront development to go forward.

He wants the state to help with that.

And he stands by his claim that this $600 million in bonds in the state budget is an unacceptable risk for taxpayers, not only in northeast Ohio, but the entire state.

Right.

And he's still pushing for instead of $600 million in bonds for Brook Park, why don't you give us about half that so that we can renovate the stadium downtown?

Right.

And House Speaker Matt Hoffman, who again, is the speaker of the House, so leader of the Republicans who passed the budget with that $600 million in bonds in it, has said that's not going to happen, that he told the Browns two years ago to come back with a proposal that would make the state money or at least hold the state harmless in terms of money that the state would be putting toward something like this, he said.

That's what the Browns did.

And so that's why this is in the budget.

At least that's what Matt Hoffman has been saying.

I think Republican support for this has still been pretty strong, but not all Republicans.

There are some Republicans who have expressed concerns about whether the state should be investing in this project and whether it's even legal.

I mean, we just had a vote for bonds for infrastructure issue two in the election last week.

But we're not voting on this.

And so there are people who've raised the question of why is that, Phil, interesting timing for Roger Goodell to come to Cleveland.

Word now, Karen, what does the end of June is when the budget has to be approved, June 30th, June 30th.

So now we're okay.

We got a little more than a month.

Let's bring in some of the some of the bigger guns and press.

Exactly.

So what what he I guess football term, we'd call it a blitz or something but prevent these the commissioners, the commissioner also said renovating the existing stadium wouldn't work as I mentioned alluded to this earlier, that it isn't quite up to standards in in NFL parlance.

Yeah, exactly.

You know, they talk about building near the idea that they're talking about a park is this, you know, huge development with housing and in restaurants and bars and, you know, the existing site, you know, was kind of isolated down there on the lakefront.

So they don't have that, you know, immediate campus.

You know, there's Crocker Park type atmosphere down there.

Let's face it, the NFL is not happy with the location.

They're not happy with renovating it.

I think the NFL and the Haslam's clearly want a dome and, you know, saying we're going to do it with or without you is a pretty, you know, strong statement to send.

I thought it was pretty surprising for them to come out so strong like that.

Part of the NFL's business model is they, as Goodell said, we want to not just have football.

We want to be destinations.

We want to have all these other things.

So if you have that in every city, that's part of that.

The NFL is broadening itself beyond football.

And I think that's what the you know, that's obviously what the plan is there.

And Borough Park is to build that.

But again, you know, we talked about when I was on here before is, you know, at what cost, you know, and how prudent is it.

And, you know, we're a cash strapped region and, you know, we're going to build this, you know, huge palace out there, taking jobs away, moving it, and also to the impact on on the Rocket Mortgage Fieldhouse is going to be you know, there's going to be shows that are there that are going to be transferred out to the dome.

No one talks about the impact on on the arena downtown Browns.

The Browns, when they talked to the legislature, said that's not the case, that there's going to be this is additive.

You're going to have shows there.

There will still be shows at Rocket Mortgage.

They'll still be shows at all the concert venues.

That's their claim.

It's another one of the ones that locals, including Chris Ronayne, don't don't necessarily believe.

It's a it's a valid concern, I think.

let me let me add one other thing.

There are some big guns that have been brought into this.

There's a poll out now that is trying to gauge public support for this.

And so we'll finally find out maybe how people really feel about this.

We've heard some of the angry voices, but that represents how Ohioans feel about this since it's their tax dollars that would be involved here, even though the Browns say that the project's going to raise more in taxes than the state will spend to pay back those bonds.

But also donald trump jr.

Yesterday on x was sharing his thoughts about this, saying while my dad is trying to cut taxes for americans, why is a republican governor trying to raise taxes?

He's referring to governor mike dewine's plan to double the tax on sports gambling operators to create a sports facilities fund, which DeWine has said that's what he would prefer rather than this bond package.

So the pressure is really on DeWine at this point, who doesn't, I don't think wants to see this bond package go forward to to really go ahead and allow it to happen.

And now we'll leave you with some advice for the class of 2025.

Each year, I put out a message on social media asking people for one good line of advice for graduates.

And then I put it together in a crowdsourced commencement speech.

This is this year's to the class of 2025.

Surround yourself with good people.

Always be humble.

You have a lot to learn from others.

Learn early the difference between hearing and listening.

Know the value of listening.

Listen more.

Talk less.

Show up when it's easy.

When it's fun.

And when it's a struggle and a strain.

Just show up.

Make sure the people you love know explicitly that you love them.

If you're feeling awful or having a rough time.

Do something kind for someone else.

It might not make you feel better, but it'll never make you feel worse.

And that's a pretty good guarantee to have.

Being kind doesn't cost you a thing.

Kindness is the new currency.

Do good for others.

Lift others as so many have lifted you.

If you find yourself saying thank you more often than sorry, you're on the right path.

Pull your uncle's finger.

It'll make his day.

Get a passport.

Even if you don't have a big trip planned.

But plan and save for a trip before you get too entrenched in the rat race.

Get a cat.

Spend as much time as you can with dogs.

Always sign someone's wedding guestbook with a mysterious alias like Jeepers Pea Money pockets.

It's the gift they'll never return.

If you haven't learned to swim, do it now.

As you age, it's a workout you can do without hurting yourself.

Smile more.

Take care of your gums.

You are what you do.

Be somebody who makes things better, not worse.

Be a builder.

Embrace the reality that you don't know everything.

And you never will.

Never be afraid to admit it and ask for help.

That's how you learn.

All politics is local.

Get involved.

Inform yourselves enough to vote in every opportunity you're afforded.

It's your future.

Take part in it.

Fight for what you believe in and believe in what you're fighting for.

Otherwise, it's nothing but performance art.

Cost versus value isn't just about spending money.

It's also about deciding how to invest your time.

Heart and intention.

Don't turn up your nose at cheap beer or tap water.

There'll be times when you'll be grateful for both.

Always carry a $20 bill.

Find ways to say yes.

No is too easy.

As we get older, we ideally give fewer hoots about things that don't really matter.

The sooner you start, the better.

Always keep an umbrella in your car and kiss with your eyes closed.

I'm Mike McIntyre.

Thank you so much for watching.

And stay safe.