>> Welcome to the legacy series living a legacy.

I'm your host, Bremante Bryant.

A military assignment is carried out by young black man who, unbeknownst to him, will forever put his name in the history books.

Two generations later lies a grandson who cradles his grandfather's legacy and the duty that comes with an insurmountable weight of responsibility.

This is the story of Tuskegee Airmen Clarence Southall and his grandson, Gregory Southall.

Well, let's, uh, talk a little bit about your father.

Tell me about him.

>> Fantastic, man.

Very knowledgeable.

Fair.

Although there were times as a youngster that I didn't think he was fair.

And, uh, one occasion led to a heated discussion between the two of us about rights, privileges and responsibilities.

And the conversation was because my telephone time as a teenager was being limited, and I couldn't understand.

Well, how come mama can talk on the phone as long as she wants to?

And it went on from there.

But, uh, we spent our summers having these very philosophical discussions about various things.

And as a young woman, a teenage girl, uh, I always wanted to push the envelope, shall we say, and did from time to time.

But, uh, he helped set me on the right path.

He had a favorite.

Well, it became my favorite quote from him.

He said, the mind of a woman in love and the mind of an angry woman often operate at its lowest ebb of efficiency.

Daddy.

That's nice.

Who said that?

Black Plato.

I said, I guess you mean you said it.

He said, yeah, something like that.

But that particular bit of wisdom helped me get through some rough patches at one point.

He always dependable calls.

Dad, I need this.

Or can you help me with that?

He's ready to help.

And I miss him.

>> Your father was a Tuskegee Airman.

When did you realize that?

And the significance of it?

>> I don't recall exactly when I realized it, but I helped him with a lot of what he was doing in terms of mailings and keeping track of the membership for the East Coast chapter, which is here in the greater metropolitan area and began to appreciate more and more of the saga and the story of the Tuskegee Airmen even met a number of them.

But I was knowledgeable enough.

I learned enough from my dad and other members of the East Coast chapter to realize that some of the movies weren't necessarily on point, were not necessarily totally factual.

But I realized that movies take license with some things.

But, uh, the more I read, the more I began to appreciate the rough times that a black man had in the military.

Tuskegee.

The Tuskegee Experiment, as it was referred to, was designed to fail.

Unfortunately, it did not fail.

It was a success.

Uh, the record of the Red Tails was such that there were some white pilots who would only fly with Red Tail escorts.

The Red Tails would escort the bombers over Germany and various other theaters in the European war.

And there was some individuals that said they only wanted the Red Tails to escort them.

The Red Tails did not lose a single bomber on all of their their, uh, sorties during the time that they served.

That being said, their treatment in Tuskegee and other military installations throughout the United States was not, as one would appreciate today, being in the military.

Military was segregated.

The Air Force didn't exist at that point.

It was the Army Air Corps.

And having a training area down in Tuskegee was not necessarily the best place to really want to be an airman.

But they survived.

They succeeded.

They made it through and became wonderful people in our society.

>> Tell us about, uh, your dad's contribution to the community and really his legacy that's been passed down to family members, yourself and others following you.

>> My dad was a native Washingtonian.

And he was active in the Anacostia community along with his parents.

He was active in his church.

The contributions that he made to the community included being active with the Hillsdale Civic Association, being active with the southeast neighborhood.

Um, southeast neighborhood house.

I believe it was.

He helped establish the Southeast Credit Union.

He was active with a Boy Scout troop 1202.

That my brother belonged to.

Along with numerous other young men in the Anacostia community.

He did a lot of things with community organizations, as he had been watching what his parents did with community organizations.

I mentioned Hillsdale Civic Association.

The Anacostia community was a vibrant minority community.

Um, nothing like it is today.

It's coming back.

But it doesn't have the same feel that it might have had years ago.

But he was active.

He was an inspiration to some people.

A thorn in the side to others.

>> How so?

>> Um.

Very opinionated.

And sometimes would just keep nudging folks to do it a certain way.

>> Tell us about Major Clarence Gordon Southall, also known as your grandfather.

>> Yeah, so coming up, I was not able to say pop, so I gave him a name Pop Pop, and that stuck with him.

Just like Spike stuck with me with my girls.

Pop Pop is his name.

So I called him all Pop Pop.

He's the reason I went to Tuskegee University.

Um, he's some of the inspiration that a lot of that, a lot of the inspiration I had, especially on Air Force Base.

I still hear stories about him from some of the old school that's still on base.

Not that many left, but it's still some.

>> When did you first realize the significance or the importance of your grandfather?

>> When they put the street name up, that's when it really kicked in.

When I saw that and I saw the ceremony, I saw all the love and attention and, um, just what he brought to the table, what he's shown and what he went through.

Now, I've heard the stories way before this, of everything.

But when I saw that, that's when I knew it was real.

It was serious.

>> Tell us about, uh, your nephew Gregory.

What was he like as a child?

>> Abraham, Gregory.

Many names.

Um.

I believe I first met him when he was about 2 or 3 years old.

And I don't remember all of the circumstances, because at that point, my brother was between new Jersey, Alabama, a couple of other different postings.

So I was not exposed to Abraham that much as a youngster.

I do recall that there was one weekend or whatever when they were in Washington.

I think he was about two and was before his sister was born.

I know that, but, uh, I didn't do well with young babies.

Young children.

Consequently, fortunately, it was just a weekend and I turned him back over to his parents.

So the next time I met Gregory was probably on a trip to Philadelphia or whatever when they were coming through new Jersey to Thanksgiving at Aunt Barb's house.

That's probably my next good memory of him.

Thanksgiving at Aunt Barb's house became a tradition over many years.

We called it Portable Thanksgiving.

We're coming from Washington and New Jersey.

We'd all meet in Philadelphia Aunt Barb's house and have Thanksgiving.

Different folks would bring different things to the table.

And, uh, we had 3 or 4 years where Gordon and the family would come in from new Jersey, and we all have a chance to do Thanksgiving together.

>> What was life like for Gregory growing up?

>> Oh, they were hard on me.

They always talk to me.

But because, you know, there's a young black man out here, I had to got my butt whooped a lot, and you know.

>> And you're a military brat.

>> Yes, yes.

And I say that in the most sincere way.

What was that experience like for you growing up, moving around, having to make new friends, going to a new high school in your senior year.

>> Um, as I got older, I realized.

But at first, you know, moved around so much it wasn't right.

But as I got older, I realized, and it was it's a good thing I got to experience so many different cultures and so many different things, and I was well grounded.

That's what made me well rounded, well rounded, and that's what rounded me up.

I couldn't deal with anybody.

>> So, Adrienne, how long have you and Gregory known each other?

>> We met in 1988, senior year, um, at Forest Hill High School, because our families had moved to the area at around that same time.

>> So you all kind of have a bond in the sense you're new to a school senior year.

Did that kind of helped sort of cement your friendship in the sense that you all were both new and had to meet people and then met each other?

4>> It definitely did.

Um, because his family was moving from new Jersey, I believe, and I moved from Hempstead.

So we had that, you know, up north kind of thing.

Um, at the time, you know, we bonded at the rap that was out at the time and moving to Maryland.

They have civics class, which we did not have up there.

And so we were two of the four seniors in the civics class.

So we just kind of sat in the back, you know, the seniors.

And incidentally, we all kind of moved from different states to Maryland at that time.

And that's where we started to bond.

And then he and I had an English class together too.

So then that just kept the bond going.

>> Did you know what you wanted to do, be when you grew up?

>> I wanted to be a fireman, a policeman, just like anybody, any kid coming up.

But once I, I wanted to be a veterinarian.

That's why I went to Tuskegee for being a veterinarian.

Once I saw the animals and smelled all that stuff, I don't know.

>> You mentioned that your grandfather played a role in you attending Tuskegee.

Correct?

Uh, was it something that he said to you, or was it that you learned about the Tuskegee Airmen through him?

Talk a little bit about that, because you could have probably chosen many other paths.

Right?

>> Okay.

So I've always heard about Tuskegee Airmen all my life.

So I'm coming up so far as going to Tuskegee.

He actually went down there with me for a campus tour, and we went together.

And of course, he showed me the museum.

He showed me the Tuskegee Airmen, what they did.

The experiment, which is the hospital, was closed at the time.

It was abandoned.

But we went through all of that and it made me pick where I wanted to go.

Plus, that's the only college that took me anyway.

So at the time, >> That's a good education.

And then you move into your work life, right?

>> Yes.

>> So talk a little bit about that.

>> We are a third generation family on Bolling Air Force Base.

My mom was my grandfather, and my mother was there, and now it's me.

But I became I got into an apprentice program, which, uh, they taught me everything from plumbing to welding to pipe fittings, HVAC, they taught me everything.

In a four year program.

So once I went on that program, I started off as an HVAC technician.

Then I went to a boiler plant technician.

And from there on, I just started moving up.

So now I'm a superintendent of a ops flight who matter of fact, that's just one of the team of the year award.

So yes.

So I'm proud of that.

>> Tell me a little bit about how you met Greg.

And what's your friendship been like working with Greg?

>> So we basically met probably in 1992.

Uh, I came here from Korea, and this was my station back here on Boeing, and we worked in the same HVAC shop.

>> And so how have you all stayed friends for 30 years?

I mean, I could see how you could stay co-workers.

You see the person every day.

But you actually became friends.

>> Definitely became friends.

So I was new and he was kind of already established, and he kind of took me under his wing and just showed me, you know what I mean?

Where things were, how they do around there, you know, things like that.

>> The street named for your father.

What does that mean to you?

>> It means that his name is always going to be remembered in a good light.

>> When the street naming when that happened at Bolling Air Force Base, he was so proud.

And he send me a screenshot.

And I was like, oh my God, that is amazing.

You know, because just to be part of a living legacy like that, like Tuskegee Airmen, like, I don't have that kind of legacy in my family.

But to kind of reach out and feel the pride that he felt, um, he was gushing and he told everybody about it.

And I just was, you know, just so happy for him.

Um, because I think that was just really important as a black man finding your way and to have such a strong figure at the head of your family like that, I think I think he, you know, it was a a sense of pride that he couldn't even really express in words >> Your family has been honored in a special way on the base, beyond the street sign for your grandfather.

Talk a little bit about how the family has been honored on the base.

>> On the base, Southall wise, the name is known.

I can come through the gate and the gate guards will know who I am.

Oh, this is Southall, or I don't even know them.

But they would say, oh, so your grandfather was on the base, and I recognized I said, yeah, that's my grandfather.

You know, stuff like, simple things like that.

>> Mother working on the base.

Grandfather's got a street named on the base.

Uh, ever felt any pressure to live up to your grandfather?

And also the standard of knowing that your mother is working where you are, and it's almost like, you know, if your mother's working in the school and you go to the school, would you do something wrong?

Folks will tell your mother, your parent.

Do you ever feel any sort of I use the word pressure.

You use whatever word you feel is appropriate, either pressure or a sense that you had to live up to a certain standard.

It was important for you to do that.

Yes, the Southall name, you have to live up to a certain standard, the same thing I'm teaching my kid two boys right now.

The Southall name goes very far, and this is how it's going to be in your life.

I'm going to tell you, you know, we're going to hold you accountable for what you do.

>> So you kind of almost walked right into my next question about, you know, the legacy of your family and your kids and then how you want to teach them, uh, about those ties to the generation prior in your family.

Tell me how they take to that.

Has that already begun?

Do they hear you?

Uh, what's that been like?

>> My oldest son, Gregory Jr. His birthday was yesterday.

>> Happy birthday.

>> He's coming around.

Yes, he's coming around.

He's starting to get into, you know, as he's being a man, he has to feel his own way.

I'm not pressuring him into doing anything he doesn't want to do, but he's coming into his own way.

I could see Jackson's going to be okay.

Also, he's going to fall into line also.

>> So those are some of the values that you're trying to pass on to them.

Values of what work.

>> Oh, yeah.

Definitely work ethic.

They both have that work ethic.

>> Dedication.

>> Dedicated to your family, dedicated to your friends, dedicated to.

And that goes different ways when I say friends, but dedicate dedication and, um, how can I say it?

Um, loyalty is a master for me.

Loyalty, being loyal.

If you're going to say something, you honor your word.

>> Is there any sort of proud, best friend moment that you could kind of pull between you and Greg.

>> One of the proudest things I would say being his best friend is he's an amazing dad.

He's very dedicated to his boys, very family oriented.

Um, I want him to meet a nice young lady and settle down.

But he's just.

I think he's just a really good guy.

Really good.

Solid man.

Um, you know, I run things by him.

Like I said, he's handy.

You know, we like that.

We like to have somebody around that knows how to do things.

Um, and he's he's he's honest.

He he's not afraid to have vulnerable conversation with you.

Like, I can tell him when I think he messed up.

And he'll listen to that.

And you know, he'll give me his opinion about things as well.

So it's a nice two way street that we have.

>> It sounds like he means a lot to you >> Oh, yeah.

Oh, yeah.

Like even in in my own personal evolution, anybody I've dated, they all know about him.

That's a non-negotiable.

If you have a problem with him, that's not going to work.

He's not going anywhere unless he and I have an issue and we haven't, you know, so he's forever.

>> You work with him, have worked with him almost three decades now, right?

>> Sure.

>> What he brings to the table, not only in terms of his work, but the type of person he is.

>> He's definitely one of my best friends.

Um, his knowledge of.

You know what I mean?

The base being there for such a long time, just in the back of his head, he can be.

Oh, that's building such and such.

It's right over here, you know what I mean?

And just learning together, working in the HVAC field together with us.

I mean, he's just a good dude.

>> You've traveled the world.

>> We've been on a couple of training exercises in our HVAC adventures.

We went out to Arizona together.

Um, we've been a part of each other's birth of our children.

You know what I mean?

His son, my son's, and the passing of our fathers.

You know what I mean?

We really supported each other, and he's just always been there for me.

>> What are some of the qualities, traits maybe, that you can share with us about Greg?

>> Oh, that's my guy.

He has the biggest heart.

He'll do anything for you.

Um, he knows how to do a lot of things.

He can cook really well.

He cooks like he's feeding a football team.

It might just be four of us there.

Um, he fixes so many things.

I'm always calling him to change a light fixture or help me move a piece of furniture or something.

Um, but he's pretty solid.

Very good work ethic.

Um, he loves hanging around older guys.

You know, he has an affinity for people older than him.

For older gentlemen.

The Southalls have a bond that, um.

It's just amazing to watch.

>> Him bringing, uh, me and my family into his family and just cooking and outings and Christmas cards, and, I mean, he just really showed a lot of love not knowing me from, you know, anyone else's.

It's hard to make good friends.

It's hard to make good friends.

He's like a brother.

We're not blood.

But, man, we share everything together.

And it's just, uh, a pleasure to have somebody to talk to.

>> Do you see any similarities, any characteristics that Greg has that your father had?

>> I believe he's helpful to all of his friends.

Um, and from what I've heard at various times, he's willing to help whenever you've asked for his help.

I know he cooks.

He fries up a mean pot of fish and smokes turkey.

So, yeah, he's got some culinary chops there.

>> What do you think your dad would think of Gregory?

>> He would be very proud of the way he's turned out.

>> What do you think's next for Gregory?

>> Anything he sets his mind to.

>> I think he's great.

I think, um, maybe there's some fear he might have stepping into such great legacy from his dad and his grandfather and everything, but I think he can do it.

You know, I just want him to just open up and.

And just go for it, you know, try some things maybe he hasn't tried before.

He's wonderful working at the base and doing the things that he's been doing all this time.

But maybe there's a different location for him, you know, to meet that higher level of professional success.

But I think he can do anything he wants >> You know, he's already in charge of a great group of guys where we work at.

And so it's just timing, I guess.

But he's doing real well.

>> So what does, uh, your nephew mean to you?

>> That I'm an auntie.

I have another man in my life that I can rely on when I need it.

Um.

And legacy goes on.

>> How would you see your legacy, Gregory Southall?

>> My legacy, and it's hard to follow from my grandfather to my mother and my actual father, who passed away last year.

That's a hard, tough to follow, but I'm just setting my own course.

I'm just setting my own course and showing my younger generation, which they do look up to me, my cousins, my nephews and stuff.

They do look up to me.

So I just showed them how the way work get a good a good job, pay your bills on time.

You know, just simple stuff in life.

Just be like I said, loyalty.

Just handle your business.

In other words, that's one of my favorite words to handle your business.

>> This concludes the story of Tuskegee Airmen Clarence Southall and his grandson, Gregory Southall.

The totality of all a man faces when he takes flight to propel his life, his family and his community forward is no small feat.

It shall not be measured by his conquest, but by his responsibility to inspire the lives he touches along the way.

That level of excellence does not only reside in those who take to the skies.

That potential of greatness lies in us all.

When we set our course in that direction.

Thank you for watching.

>> This program was brought to you by WHUT and made possible by contributions from viewers like you.

For more information on this program or any other program, please visit our website at whut.org.

Thank you.