(energetic music) - Good evening, and welcome to this "Your Vote 2026" debate between the three candidates vying to be the next governor of Maine.

We're coming to you live from the Gracie Theatre at Husson University in Bangor.

I'm Jennifer Rooks, and for the next hour, we will hear from the candidates on major issues facing Maine voters.

The questions were determined by Maine Public and its media partners, the Portland Press Herald and News Center Maine.

Let's meet the candidates.

Republican Bobby Charles has worked as a consultant and lobbyist in Washington and also served as an assistant secretary of state for International Narcotics and Law Enforcement Affairs under the administration of George W. Bush.

Democrat Hannah Pingree is former speaker of the Maine House, who also headed up the Office of Policy Innovation and the Future under Governor Janet Mills.

Rick Bennett is former chair of the state Republican Party who also served as state Senate president and is running as an independent.

Our two journalists are Maine Public State House correspondent Kevin Miller and Billy Kobin, a political reporter for the Portland Press Herald, who will be joining us in just a few minutes.

For this first series of questions, the candidates will have two minutes to respond.

We are asking the audience to withhold their applause until the end of the debate.

The opening order was determined by random drawing before the broadcast.

And the first question from Kevin Miller goes to Bobby Charles.

- Bobby, Deputy Charles, thanks again for visiting us today.

So we're going to jump right into an issue that I know all of you have been hearing about on the campaign trail, because it's of top mind for folks around the state, and that's housing affordability.

So what do you believe is the role that state government should play in bringing down housing costs, and what measures would you support to do that?

- So, thank you.

In my view, Janet Mills and Hannah Pingree have doubled the cost of the median home, robbing young people in particular of something Mainers have always had, the chance for home ownership.

So I will restore that.

I will, let's be specific, roll back unnecessary state regulations, leaving greater discretion to the home buyer and municipality.

I will use the tax code to fundamentally accelerate manufacturing, including prefab, off-site, modular, small homes, mobile homes, panelized housing, kit homes.

Number three, I will encourage municipalities to accelerate and expand housing options and to accelerate permitting.

I will promote tax exemptions for first-time home buyers.

I will gradually reduce non-citizens in public or publicly paid housing, freeing up more units.

I will detoxify the 400 Chinese grow houses and resell them, noting that neither Hannah Pingree nor Janet Mills has ever uttered the words "Chinese grow houses."

I will consider raising the state's itemized deduction cap for higher state-permitted mortgage interest deductions, which is to say, allow the mortgage interest deduction to come up just to accommodate the mortgage payments at the state level.

I am also committed to a $100,000 property tax homestead exemption for all of Maine's population with zero property tax for 100% disabled veterans and a doubling of the combat veteran added homestead exemption.

The point is to expand out.

We have an 80,000-unit deficit.

The point is to expand out the stock by lowering the barriers and encouraging or incentivizing the build-out.

I would also note that Hannah's $100 million plan, if you implemented it at the current median price, which is more than $400,000, is literally only going to build 250 homes.

So we have a $30 billion problem, an 80,000-unit problem.

And my view is, anything short of a robust reduction in regulations and encouragement of housing stock is not going to get us there.

- Thank you.

Do you have a follow-up question?

All right.

Hannah Pingree.

- Do you need me to repeat the question?

- No, it's a great question and a really important question.

Housing is fundamental to Maine's future.

This is an issue where, if young people can't afford to buy a house, if a senior can't afford to downsize, if employers can't find workers, nothing else works.

I have been proud to work on this issue for many years in my local community as a state legislator passing one of the first bonds to invest in affordable housing here in the state of Maine.

And over the last six and a half years, I did have the opportunity to work on housing.

I worked on it with Rick on a variety of issues.

We now have the largest pipeline of affordable housing under production in our state's history.

We have taken action.

We've allowed Mainers to do more of what they want with their own land, build accessory dwelling units, build more density downtown.

But, of course, we absolutely need to do more.

And this is one of the motivating factors that has really driven me to run for governor.

So I've put out a bold housing plan.

You can check it out at hannahforgovernor.com, but I do think we need to continue to invest $100 million a year in housing production, whether that's rural rentals, whether that's affordable home ownership or the infrastructure we need to connect private development.

We also need to crack down on private equity.

We know they're buying up mobile home parks, buying up apartment complexes.

They're displacing Maine families from the affordable housing we have.

We do need to cut red tape.

I think all of us on the stage would agree we need to make it easier to build housing.

I propose a 90-day shot clock on DEP permits.

We need to keep partnering with communities to build the housing we need, but it's also a workforce challenge.

We need to train more workers in the trades to build the housing we need.

We also need to invest in those companies that I know can help us build the housing that both Maine needs and our entire region needs.

And lastly, we are seeing rising homelessness.

We need to prevent evictions.

We need to work on a more regional level to prevent the homelessness crisis.

And I've also called to end veteran homelessness in my first year in office.

If we can't solve this housing challenge, nothing else works.

It is one of my top priorities as governor.

- Rick Bennett, would you like Kevin to repeat the question?

- No, I'm fine with that.

Thank you for the question.

And again, I'm glad you led with this because I'm walking across this state, and everywhere I go, I find people who just are having a hard time buying a home, getting into a house, putting their roots down in the community.

And I also talk with business owners who tell me, when I ask them, "What is holding you back from growing your business?"

they tell me it's the fact that people cannot afford to buy a house near where the jobs are.

So, this is not only affecting people and many people in their family life, in building a future in Maine, it's also affecting our economy gravely.

So what will I do about it?

As governor, I will reduce down payments for first-time home buyers.

When you have a house selling for $400,000, which is below the median right now, that means for 20% down, $80,000.

Many first-time home buyers, most, cannot find $80,000.

So we'll reduce that to $20,000 using a state guarantee.

I'll also provide direct mortgage support so that people can reduce their monthly payment using a capped shared appreciation with the state.

This is being done elsewhere and can work to help get the monthly payment in check.

So that's a way of helping.

Those both are ways of helping people get into homes.

But I also think that underlying all of this is the fact that we have housing scarcity, and we need to expand the supply.

I live in Western Maine.

It was a center of factory-built housing for many, many years.

We used to have five manufacturing plants building homes for Mainers.

So we need to revive the factory-built housing sector.

We need to repair the homes that we have that are dilapidated, where people need to fix them to make them livable.

And I also believe that we need, and as governor, I will require a statewide housing bottleneck audit so we can speed permits along and get houses built faster.

- Thank you.

Billy Kobin from the Portland Press Herald will ask the next question.

- Thanks, all.

We'll start with Hannah.

Obviously, in January, we saw a surge in ICE agents.

They came to the state, Portland area, Lewiston area.

It drew protest, stoked fears in Maine's immigrant community, and then led, eventually, in July, we saw a fatal shooting in which an ICE agent shot a man in Biddeford.

As governor, how would you respond to a future surge of additional ICE agents or ongoing ICE activity?

I'll start with Hannah.

- Sure.

Well, hello, Billy.

Welcome.

- Thank you.

- This is an issue I have heard a whole lot from Maine people about.

They are outraged at what we've seen, especially over the course of the past year.

This is an issue where I would like to see ICE out of Maine, and I think the vast majority of Maine people agree with me.

My opponent, Bobby Charles, has actually stoked fear of immigrants.

He has wanted to open an Alligator Alcatraz to detain people here in our state.

He's even invited ICE to come to our polls and harass Maine people as they go to vote, which is against federal law.

So what will I do as governor?

I believe deeply that our job is to protect Maine people.

We have seen through the last, again, year, as ICE has come to Maine, that they're not here to arrest criminals.

They are harassing innocent people on their way to work, waiting at school buses, people coming home from the hospital.

And I think the hearts and minds of Maine people have been changed.

The immigrants who are here in the state, people who are here legally, they want them to stay.

They want them to go safely to work.

And I will say, it's been actually heartening to see how much Maine people have risen up to support their neighbors, to help people get access to food, to help them get safely to work.

I stood with a group of ministers and rabbis and reverends who are out in front of a employment place, helping people to get safely in.

So governors are going to have to step up.

I would work with other governors across this country and attorney generals to hold ICE accountable for their unlawful actions across this country and here in the state of Maine.

We know that Donald Trump is arresting many of these people and detaining them illegally.

We need to hold them accountable.

I would continue to enforce the law to say that we will not collaborate with ICE or other federal agents who are here illegally.

We will also protect people as they're going to school in courthouses and hospitals.

We need to do everything possible to keep people safe.

I've worked on these issues for many years.

I worked with Rick to start an Office for New Americans to better integrate immigrants into our workforce.

I will continue to do that as governor.

- Billy, do you have a follow-up question for Hannah?

- I'll move on to Rick first, actually.

And Rick, you may go.

Thanks.

- Thank you.

I am deeply disturbed by ICE's presence in Maine, as I think many people have been across this state.

Law enforcement is best done at the community level.

I had the opportunity to ride along with the Auburn Police Department not too long ago and saw community policing at its best.

Maine police officers know their communities.

They know the neighborhoods.

They often see people again and again in the communities, and they know how to defuse situations.

What we see when we have massed, anonymous federal agents from God knows where coming into Maine and harassing people based on the color of their skin, we know we have a problem.

Our immigrants in Maine have been contributing to this state for decades, including the recent arrivals from Somalia.

I was outraged when Donald Trump called Somali Americans "garbage."

That said everything you need to know about the federal administration's view toward our immigrant community.

These are folks who have been living in our communities, building their families, working in our healthcare system, working in businesses, growing new businesses.

And in Western Maine, where I live, they're very much part of what makes our community special, culturally rich.

And so I'm deeply disturbed by ICE's presence, by the fear and harm that they actually create rather than law enforcement.

And I'm increasingly concerned by the politicization of federal law enforcement to accomplish ends that politicians in Washington want to inflict rather than actually building communities here in Maine.

- Thank you.

And Bobby?

- Yeah, so let me give you a unique perspective.

I have worked with law enforcement in one form or another for more than 30 years.

I was a U.S.

Court of Appeals clerk, so that means I was a constitutionalist, and I taught law at Harvard.

I believe very firmly in the idea that lawfulness matters.

So if we start with that premise, I can also be very pro-immigration.

There are nine visas on which those who want to come to the United States can legally get here, and I have helped some of them get here.

I am not in favor of illegal immigration.

And as a result, my perspective on this is as follows: State and local and federal law enforcement should always be talking to each other.

That increases public safety.

The truth be told, as a former intelligence officer for 10 years, everything comes from the bottom up.

So when you cut off the communication between state-level law enforcement and locals with the feds, you lose the ability of the feds to be informed by what's going on in the touch at the end of the fingertips.

It's vital.

I would argue that Biddeford probably wouldn't have happened if the sanctuary state law didn't exist here because the comms, they were sidelined.

The comms between local and state and feds would have been clear.

I have publicly stated my belief, and it's worth noting, since I believe everybody should be fearless if they're law-abiding, I believe body cameras should have been worn, and they weren't.

I believe that masks, and this is just my own view, I think they undermine public trust intuitively.

So while I'm very supportive of law enforcement, I'm also a believer that accountability matters and constitutionality is essential.

On elections, every legal voter should feel comfortable voting.

Every legal vote cast should be counted.

No one should ever, and I'll say it again, I've said it many times, ever fear going to the polls.

On voter maintenance, we have not produced, pursuant to a subpoena from the Justice Department, our voter rolls.

There is a piece of that that is the state's rights, but another piece is governed by 18 U.S.C.

611 and 1015, which is only to say we have to abide federal law and state law.

- Thank you.

Kevin, Billy, do you have a follow-up question?

- If I could, for each of them, briefly.

We'll start with Bobby, what you touched on.

Maine, obviously, has a law now that limits local police from cooperating with federal immigration agents in certain cases.

For each of you, then I want to ask, would you repeal that law?

Would you keep it?

Would you try to change it in some way?

And again, we'll start briefly with Bobby and then we'll go Rick and Hannah.

- So, Billy, your real question is, "Would we or should we repeal the sanctuary state law?"

And I believe we should.

And the reason for that is what I explained a moment ago.

When you have local and state law enforcement that have the touch at the end of fingertips, the trust of the people and the understanding, then if they are coordinating with the federal law enforcement community to protect citizens rather than creating a refuge for those who have violated the law, you get a very simple process that has always existed in this state prior to that.

And that process is a knock at the door, Fourth Amendment rights being respected, and everybody's safe.

- [Billy] Rick.

ICE has not earned the benefit of the doubt in the way that they've acted in Maine and hurting Maine people and Maine communities.

I spoke on the Senate floor on behalf of that bill.

It's not a sanctuary state bill.

The original bill was a little too much, but if you read the amended version of the bill, which I did on the Senate floor, it sets up reasonable guidelines for state and local law enforcements, which we pay for with our state tax money, to work with ICE and other federal agencies and how to go about doing that.

- [Billy] And Hannah.

- support that law.

I would have signed that law had I been governor.

I would work to ensure that we have the strongest law possible to protect people.

And I do want to just comment that Bobby talked a lot about all of the laws and he's a lawyer, but he is somebody who called ICE to come to our polls.

He said he would invite them to come on Election Day.

That is against federal law.

- I'm going to give you a chance to rebut.

- So, my short response is that local, state and federal law enforcement should always be cooperating vertically and horizontally.

That comment was taken largely out of context.

The idea was you need federal reach back if local authorities ask for it.

That's also true of DEA and you and the administration to date cut off the relationship also between DEA undercover and immigration- - [Jennifer] Thank you.

- And that is lawlessness.

- The next question will be asked by Kevin Miller and he will start with Rick Bennett.

- So another top issue that I know the next governor's going to have to deal with: Medicaid spending.

About one-third of Maine residents are on MaineCare, which is state's Medicaid program.

The costs of MaineCare have roughly doubled in the past decade to about $1.5 billion.

Voters voted to expand Medicaid about a decade ago.

So my question for you is, do you think Maine should continue covering folks on MaineCare at that same level?

- Yes, I do believe that MaineCare expansion should be continued.

People have grown to rely on it.

And the challenge is that the state government has made lots of promises, and it's not paying its bills.

So, the first thing I will do as governor is I'll pay our providers fairly and on time.

When we're not paying our providers fairly, those costs get shifted.

They get shifted to the hospitals, they get shifted to the providers, they get shifted to private health insurance.

And we're not paying the bills on time, which many of these providers are already in a very fragile state and by hurting their cash flows by not paying ordinary bills on time, it's devastating.

On healthcare, while we're on it, I'll also invest in a prevention-first primary care approach.

We spend so much money on healthcare in crisis because we're not spending enough money at the front end, which will make people healthier and reduce costs.

Oregon did a coordinated primary care investment.

They studied it.

They found they saved $12 for every $1 they invested in primary care.

Thirdly, I will launch a medical debt relief program.

Medical debt affects 40% of Maine families, and for many of those, it's over $5,000.

Vermont and a lot of other states, 11 other states, have invested small money in reducing medical debt for vast numbers of their population.

Vermont appropriated $1 million.

They expect to maybe save Vermonters $100,000,000 in medical debt.

When people have medical debt, they're much less likely to go get the care they need going forward.

And finally, we must, to solve this healthcare issue, finally get on a path to universal care for every Mainer.

I don't think Maine can go it alone.

It's going to be a regional thing.

We cannot wait for the feds to take action.

Under my administration, I'll work with regional governors to start making that a reality.

- Great.

Thank you very much.

Bobby.

- So MaineCare expansion was an expansion under Mills-Pingree of the coverage to go to non-citizens and to go to those not working between the ages of 18 and 65 who did not have children and were not disabled.

I would say we made a fundamental error.

Whatever the intention at the first end, the effect was we're not paying the bills; everybody's closing down.

So Mills-Pingree fundamentally, systematically mismanaged healthcare in Maine by expanding MaineCare, but underfunding it.

And Rick is right to this end.

That is why bills have been left unpaid and reimbursable rates are too low for hospitals or drug addiction centers or anybody else in this field to survive.

That's why we're losing them.

We have lost one major hospital.

We have five, including the one right here in Bangor, that is in deep trouble.

The governor, Hannah's mentor, just suspended payments for 10 weeks.

What do you do with your cancer surgery?

What do you do with your heart surgery when all of a sudden the hospital isn't being able to pay people?

We've lost 12 birthing units and you can't just mandate they're here because the OB-GYNs have failed.

They've lost.

They're not incentivized to stay.

We've lost 15 nursing homes, 25 assisted living locations, 75 home care nonprofits.

Here's what I will do.

I will pay the bills on time.

Hannah left $750 million in bills unpaid as the head of the legislature.

The exact same thing is happening right now, a big part of the $1.3 billion overhang.

I will bring the reimbursement rates up so that you get paid.

If you have a $20,000 birth, you don't get $4,600, which is what Hannah Pingree and Mills have given.

No, you get, it's set by the state, you get the procedure's cost so that they will stay here.

I will re-incentivize doctors to come to the state.

I went to a couple places with medical schools.

We'll set that up.

We will forgive medical loans, loans for medical school.

We will make this the last residency and we will start an organic healthcare industry at the University of Maine.

Whether you want to be an x-ray tech or a doctor, we will build it from within.

And when we build it, we will be happier.

- I might have a follow-up question at the end, but Hannah, to answer.

- Sure.

- Well, we are one of the richest countries in the world with some of the poorest health outcomes.

I completely agree.

We absolutely need universal care in this country, but until we do, the next governor is going to have a very challenging job ensuring that our rural safety net stays afloat.

Medicaid expansion allowed 100,000 people here in the state of Maine to get access to healthcare.

Many working people who didn't have healthcare before now have access.

That is critical to how our rural hospitals stay open.

I will say, both of my opponents have opposed Medicaid expansion.

Rick was the chairman of the Republican Party.

He actually campaigned against the initiative where Maine people voted overwhelmingly to expand MaineCare.

Bobby has, obviously, stated that we should roll it back.

Again, it is 90% paid for by the federal government.

It is a critical way in which people are getting access to substance abuse treatment, mental health treatment, the basic healthcare they absolutely need.

So the next budget isn't going to be easy.

We're going to have to ensure that we keep our rural hospitals afloat, that we actually have more collaboration across our healthcare system because it is facing intense pressure.

The big, beautiful bill down in Washington actually has promoted huge cuts to both Medicaid and Medicare, and we're going to have to figure out how do we manage these cuts?

How do we manage a federal government that's trying to kick people off their healthcare at a time in which our system is deeply, deeply strained?

So I've proposed a public health insurance option for those families who are losing access to healthcare coverage.

Again, whether they've lost ACA coverage, I'm one of those families now paying over $2,000 a month for a family of four, or they're a family who can't get it through their small business.

So we're going to have a public option where we actually negotiate for lower costs for Maine families.

We also need intense investments in primary care, maternity care, and reproductive healthcare, so every Maine person has somebody who cares about their health.

We have huge heavy lifting to do, but I'm ready to do it as your governor.

- And, Kevin, you mentioned you have a follow-up question?

- Yeah, so, Rick, you said that you supported expansion or you supported the expansion.

- What I objected to, Kevin, was the characterization that I opposed and campaigned against it.

That is, frankly, a flat-out lie that the Maine Democratic Party has been putting out for a while, but this is what parties do.

I raised questions about the wording of the question and I also raised questions about the costs that it might impose.

I did not campaign against it.

I think it should work, and should be set up in a sustainable fashion.

- So, Bobby, I have actually a question for you here.

So you talked about expanding, not getting rid of the expansion, but increasing reimbursement rates to hospitals and taking other steps.

Those are all going to cost money.

- [Bobby] Yeah.

- I know that you're also talking about cutting the state budget by $1 billion perhaps in the first year.

- [Bobby] Yep.

- How are you going to do those things that are going to cost money and at the same time cut the overall state budget?

- So let me address that at the same time that I say I think it's almost comical up here that we're debating and we're hearing Hannah come up with all these solutions to all the problems that she created.

The healthcare system has disintegrated in the Pingree-Mills administration, and that's why we're where we're at.

I will note, too, that if you love the DMV and the waits you have now because of the government delays in paying bills and not paying reimbursements, just wait until the government runs everything.

And then I would say reimbursements, a fact that was incorrect that Hannah stated, are actually done.

Reimbursements are set by the state and it is the state piece of this, not the federal piece, that is the problem.

We need a solvent system.

And by the way, to a short answer to your question, waste, fraud, and abuse are absolutely rife throughout this budget.

That's why we have a $1.3 billion overhang.

- Thank you.

The fourth question is related to what Bobby Charles was just talking about.

Billy, Bobby Charles will go first.

- The next governor, of course, may face a projected budget gap of more than $1 billion.

That's according to the latest forecast, and, of course, those numbers can and have changed in the past, but if you are elected governor, how would you tackle that potential gap?

We'll start with Bobby and move down the line.

- Yeah, I just want to remind people again that there's a certain logic.

I've never run for anything in my life, and in running for this, I noticed that you get slimed all the time, and there's a certain logic at the same time that just goes missing.

Hannah was the right hand of the governor that put us in all these problem sets, and I think it's ironic.

It's like inviting the arsonist back to put out the fire.

It makes no sense whatsoever to put us in a position where all the bad policies are just compounded again.

So, here's the answer, and I'll blend it with the income tax cut because it's very important.

I do want to get at least $1 billion out, and we're going to have to now work harder and faster because this irresponsible administration overspent by another $1.3 billion.

Here's what we're going to do.

We're going to reduce the overall budget by reducing the fraud, and we now know from both federal investigations and state investigations, we have major fraud.

$2.1 billion found 6,500 non-compete sole-source contracts.

Those will all stop.

We're going to cut the waste.

We've got already strong indications of that, hundreds of whistleblowers that come to me.

Duplicative jobs: There are an extra 2,000 unfilled slots that go down into the cascade.

That's where they get their pet projects at the end.

We're just going to cut them.

Eliminating sole-source non-compete insider contracts.

None of this, by the way, has any effect on services.

It only makes us more efficient.

There'll be an immediate hiring freeze.

That will save money.

We're going to downsize through attrition.

No one will lose their job if they're doing a good job.

In fact, they'll be promoted.

Restructuring of DHHS and education, a top-to-bottom review of the department's agencies and programs, all of them, exactly what I did for Colin Powell.

We're going to do zero-based budgeting.

That means no more add-on budgeting.

You start with what I used to do for the National Guard in all 50 states, threat-based analysis.

You say, "What are my needs?"

And then you push the money in behind just what the need is.

You don't overspend and then go look for a place to spend it.

Income tax relief fund, we're going to end the cascade.

We're going to end non-citizen subsidies, which are huge, and we're going to end the energy subsidies.

I will ask the commissioners each to bring back 10% in cost savings at each of the departments.

- [Jennifer] Thank you.

- And I will get rid of the GOPIF office.

- Thank you.

- Hannah, you may go.

- Sure, well, the next governor is going to be facing a significant challenge.

Donald Trump's war in Iran, his tariffs, have put huge headwinds on our economy.

At the same time, he has cut our Medicaid program, our food programs that help us feed kids, all things that my opponent, Bobby Charles, has supported.

So it's not going to be easy.

I was first elected to the legislature in 2002.

I was 26 years old and I spent the first two years on the appropriations committee.

We walked in with a billion-dollar shortfall, not a structural gap, an actual shortfall.

And so I had to spend those two years learning deeply about the state budget.

We figured out, how do we find efficiencies?

How do we make things work at a very, very challenging time?

And I'm proud of the work that we did that actually produced a bipartisan budget.

We did the same thing when I was speaker of the House.

We passed a bipartisan budget.

I worked with Republican leader Josh Tardy during a difficult fiscal time to produce a bipartisan budget and also invest in our infrastructure through bonds.

I think it is about, during these hard times, actually coming together around the challenges we face.

We do need to invest in housing and education.

We need to invest in our healthcare system and we need to invest in property tax relief at the same time we are facing challenges.

But that's what this moment will demand from us.

And again, I have confidence.

As I've traveled the state of Maine, people want the same things for their kids and families.

They want their hospitals to stay open.

They want decent schools for their kids.

So we're going to have to figure out how do we get that done.

Actually, the tax I've heard the most about from Maine people is the property tax, and the state can play a role in delivering property tax relief.

I've called it double the homestead exemption.

I think one of the opportunities we have is to actually open up the Maine Constitution.

This requires bipartisan support to look at, how do we tax second homes owned by non-Maine residents at a higher rate to both deliver tax relief, but also ensure that we can invest in the infrastructure that desperately needs it.

So again, I've worked on many, many budgets.

I've worked across the aisle.

I know how to get it done as governor.

- [Billy] And Rick.

- So we are spending, that's in the state government, well beyond the means of Mainers to pay.

That's the reality.

We need some fiscal prudence.

The state budget has grown 77% in 10 years, about twice the rate of inflation.

Why has this happened?

People ask me all the time.

The dirty truth is that nobody is minding the store.

COVID came; we got billions of dollars from the federal government.

The executive branch wasn't looking at what we were spending.

They were pushing that money out the front door.

And then the legislative branch, because of partisan dysfunction, hasn't had a public hearing on the state budget, the continuing service of the budget, which is 95% of spending in six years.

So, nobody's looking at that.

As governor, on November 4, the day after the election, I'll put together my finance team and we're going to look at every single line item in the budget because it hasn't been done yet.

I already know some areas where we need to review and save some money, but we need to get back to regular order.

We need to get back to consensus budgeting.

As an independent governor, I will get the Republicans and the Democrats both at the table to pass what we did for decades.

And when I was Senate president, we did this.

We passed a consensus budget on current services, got a two-thirds vote, and we took the time for the review.

I will also as governor, because we know that there's misspending going on and some potential corruption.

In fact, the budget that was passed in the last legislature had $100 million reserved to pay the federal government back for potential issues with what we're spending.

So, I will have in my office, working directly for me, the Office of Inspector General, a team of people.

Whenever there is a hint of misspending or corruption, the team will go out, investigate it with full transparency of the people of Maine, and we will get to the root of that and fix it.

- Billy, do you have a follow-up question?

- Yeah, I will briefly.

And I'll start with based off of what Hannah has mentioned, but others have pointed out taxing out-of-state homes may be problematic given the changes needed and whether those are feasible or not.

At what point do you perhaps abandon that idea or do you change it?

I'd like Bobby and Rick to also, again, address that idea of taxing out-of-state homes, whether there's any way to do that given the current constraints.

And we'll start with Hannah and then go Bobby and Rick.

- So I will acknowledge we do need to open up the Constitution.

That is a big thing to do, but we've amended our constitution many, many times before and it would require bipartisan support.

But I'll tell you from Washington County down to Southern Maine, people realize that Maine people are having a hard time keeping their home.

We've seen both Rhode Island and South Carolina enact similar provisions to allow us to tax second homes, especially very valuable second homes, at a higher rate.

And that's what I'm proposing.

- Let Bobby go.

- Yeah, I'll try to be brief on this.

First, that's a complete violation of Article nine and I don't think Mainers, frankly, it's even- Most states would never entertain reopening the Constitution to tax a home valued the same value by those who come in from out of state and own it in state and those in state.

The second thing, I'm just going to say this business about feeding kids, and I find it fascinating.

Hannah talks more about Trump than Trump talks about himself, honest to God.

You had a 38% increase.

You were in charge of the children's well-being in the state of Maine.

That was your children's cabinet.

And we just got ranked- - Thank you.

- 50th in the nation for children's well-being in the period of time.

- Thank you.

We're going to have Rick answer the question about the property tax.

- Thank you.

I don't support the constitutional amendment that Hannah is suggesting because it really doesn't deal with the underlying issue.

We need to get spending in check and we need to deliver meaningful property tax relief soon to Maine people.

The proposal she has pushes the can down the road some more and I don't think it's viable.

In the meantime, I have specific ideas about how we can help people with their property taxes that are reasonable and start with government accountability.

- We're going to take a short break and we'll return for the second half of this Your Vote 2026 gubernatorial debate live from the Gracie Theatre in Bangor.

The two candidates for U.S.

Senate face off in a live televised debate at the Gracie Theatre in Bangor.

Maine Public, in partnership with the Portland Press Herald and News Center Maine, will host this one-hour "Your Vote 2026" debate between Republican Susan Collins and Democrat Troy Jackson before a live audience.

Tune in Thursday, October 15, at 7:00 PM on Maine Public Television, radio, and online.

Details at mainepublic.org/yourvote.

Welcome back to this "Your Vote 2026" debate between the three candidates vying to become the next governor of Maine.

I'm Jennifer Rooks.

We are live at the Gracie Theatre at Husson University in Bangor.

The debate is presented in partnership with Maine Public, the Portland Press Herald and News Center Maine.

We're now going to ask questions specific to each candidates and we are going to start with Kevin Miller who will ask Hannah Pingree a question.

- Hannah, so electricity and housing costs have gone up significantly over the past eight years during Governor Mills' administration.

Hospitals and nursing homes have closed as well.

You were Governor Mills' chief policy advisor for much of that time.

So I guess the question is how would a Pingree administration be different than a Mills administration when you have been working for this Mills administration where we've seen these significant cost increases?

- Sure.

Well, thank you for that question.

And I will say I had the honor of working for Governor Mills for the last six and a half years, but I didn't agree with her on every issue.

We both served together in the Maine legislature and we didn't agree on every issue back then either.

And there are many things that I would do differently as governor.

I have pledged to pass tribal sovereignty in my first 100 days in office, something that Governor Mills has not been supportive of.

And when it comes to issues like housing and energy, I'm actually proud of some of the work that we did to actually build more housing to ensure that young people can stay in the state of Maine.

We put out that report that said we need 84,000 housing units by 2030.

That wasn't just sort of some kind of dream goal.

It's how much housing we need to ensure that our workforce can stay here in the state of Maine.

And we've made progress.

We have significantly increased the pace of housing production, but doing that work motivated me to realize that we need to go much, much faster to meet this critical challenge.

When it comes to electricity prices, we have seen prices go up.

We know that Donald Trump's tariffs, his war in Iran have actually made it much worse.

In Maine, our electricity prices are being driven by two things, storm recovery costs as well as the price of natural gas.

That's why I believe deeply that we need energy independence.

Maine is a state where we import $4 billion a year of fossil fuels.

It's going to be really challenging for Maine people as we try to get through this winter.

We are the most heating-oil-reliant state in the country.

And I know there are huge challenges as people try to pay their electricity bills.

We need to hold our electricity utilities accountable and deliver more clean energy and other sources of energy to lower costs.

I have worked on plans to do that and as governor, I will take this issue very, very seriously during this incredibly challenging time.

In the first month in office, I know we need to deliver heating oil relief.

Maine people are worried about just being able to get through this winter, but this is the kind of issue that I know Maine people, they don't want to give up on their neighbors.

They want us to do something.

- All right, Billy Kobin has a question for Rick Bennett.

- Thanks, Rick, obviously, you previously chaired the Maine Republican Party.

That time overlapped with supporting former Governor Paul LePage and President Trump.

I imagine voters may have asked you this on the trail, but why did you leave the Republican Party last year?

- Yeah, when I came of age, Ronald Reagan was early in his presidency, and I was inspired by the optimism, the hopeful future that he portrayed for our country.

And I was inspired by that, and so I became a Republican.

I've always been very independent.

In fact, the Bangor Daily News, in a study, found me to be the most independent member in my votes in the state Senate over the last few years.

But I have to tell you, I thought of the parties as a vehicle for participation, and what I've come to realize is that they're actually doing great harm to our democracy.

Both parties are more interested in keeping us fighting with each other than actually resolving issues.

I call it the political-industrial complex.

There's so much money that people are making, keeping us fighting with each other.

They don't have an interest in solving problems.

We see that with $400 million being spent in Maine by dark outside money in the U.S.

Senate race.

It's time that we have a different kind of politics, a politics that is focused on getting things done and uniting us around our common values and our common shared goals.

And there are many.

The parties have become destructive of that.

My party in particular has gone down a bad path where it's become a cult of personality rather than a place of meaningful citizen participation.

And so I did take the step of giving up on the party process and becoming an independent so that we can build a better future for Maine people.

- All right, and Kevin Miller has a question for Bobby Charles.

- So, Bobby, during the GOP primary, you aligned yourself with many of President Trump's policies.

As we talked about here earlier, you welcomed the surge of ICE agents here in Maine back in January.

You supported some of his tariffs as well, but since the primary, you seem to have put some distance between yourself and the president on some issues, criticizing him on tariffs, disagreeing with him on others.

So, I guess my question for you is, if voters vote for you to be the next governor, which Bobby Charles should they expect?

How closely would you be aligned with President Trump?

- There is only one Bobby Charles and he is perfectly consistent and I will tell you what I view.

I think tariffs on China were a good idea initially.

I think tariffs on Canada are a terrible idea and I have made an appeal to the president and I've told him to get back to the table and I've told him we need that.

41% of all of our trade is with Canada.

It's a $6 billion footprint.

They are our friend.

On other issues, I differ with them.

I think the environmental rollback of the coal limits, that really bothered me because I've been working for years to get the mercury and the phosphorus out of our lakes in Maine.

I would confront as governor the Central Ohio River Valley governors and make clear that we need to stop the acid rain coming into Maine.

I have my differences.

I differ on a couple of other things with him.

I do want to go back to energy, though, because that was an important issue and I didn't get to address it.

And I'll tell you this, Mills and Pingree have tripled, I mean tripled, the cost of electricity in this state in addition to tripling the property taxes that she now feigns to have a great concern about.

Bottom line up front is the unfunded mandates that have been pushed down on towns have caused our property taxes to go through the roof.

I will be reversing all that with $100,000 exemption, homestead exemption with additional ones for veterans, and that piece of this has to be filled.

On the energy side of the equation, I want to end the subsidies because they're not working.

Just look at your bills.

Subsidizing solar and wind isn't working.

I want to reopen the utility competition, go over the 400 laws that have pushed our energy costs up under Pingree and Mills.

I want to uncap hydro.

I want to save Sappi.

I want to get the natural gas into this state through the Constitution pipeline linked up with Iroquois.

I want to push out on biomass, which gives our loggers markets and actually is completely logical since we're the most forested state.

And I want to give the SMRs a chance.

And on the Emergency 207 plan, I ask Hannah right now and Rick to turn into the camera with me and ask Janet Mills right now to please reconvene the legislature and put money behind our schools for their energy and suspend the gas tax.

- All right.

Well, we have time now, not for another broad topical question.

So we're going to spend the next few minutes with some questions that will have quicker answers.

These don't necessarily need to be "yes," "no," but they're designed to be able to be answered in a sentence or two.

And I think it's your turn to go first, Rick.

And Billy, I think it's your turn to go first.

Go ahead.

- Rick, would you try to change Maine's current abortion laws?

- No.

- [Billy] Hannah.

- Yes, I think we need to enshrine a right to an abortion in our constitution to protect it forever.

- [Billy] Bobby.

- I am with the 75% of Mainers who believe late-term abortion and public funding is wrong, but at the end of the day, in my view, there are a ton of issues that are confronting us.

I've talked with 30,000 Mainers.

This is not the number one issue.

- [Hannah] A lot of women do care.

- Okay, I'll respond again and say I care deeply and am compassionate toward both the mother and the child, but at the end of the day, we are overwhelmed by all the errors that Mills-Pingree have foisted on us and we have got to get back to common sense and affordability.

And if we don't, nothing else matters.

- So, Bobby, as governor, you would not try to change Maine's current laws?

- I have said very clearly, I oppose the late-term abortion.

I've always opposed that.

At 75% of Mainers oppose it and 84% of the United States opposes it.

- So, yes, you would.

- I think I've made my position clear.

- Kevin Miller.

- So before, I was trying to stick to the request for a- - Yes.

- Very brief answer, but I think since the others went on, I want to be clear.

I have always supported reproductive rights and reproductive health for women.

33 years ago, as a member of the Maine House, about the age of Hannah when she was first elected, I co-sponsored the bill to enshrine Roe versus Wade in Maine law.

It was put forward by a Republican governor, Jack McKernan.

It was bipartisan and it's now in the law.

I support that and I received a 92% rating from Planned Parenthood.

It used to be that issues like this, you could have some disagreements within parties.

No longer.

We've become rigid orthodoxy.

- Thank you.

Thank you, Kevin Miller.

And I believe it's time for Bobby Charles to go first.

- So, data centers.

Some people view data centers as job creators.

Others worry that they're going to harm the environment and consume even more energy in our already tight grid.

Would you encourage the development of data centers in Maine?

- So, I will tell you process and then answer.

Process is, I've run organizations with thousands of people who have a lot of interests and I expect to bring into the Blaine House at that circular table group on one side and a group on the other who bring the equities to the table.

And as an honest broker, hear it.

I am agnostic on them.

I'm very concerned in general about both the environment and energy.

Our power grid has not been recapitalized, so it is very fragile.

But at the end of the day, what's good for Mainers is what I will support.

- So does that mean you would encourage it or you're going to allow that council to decide?

- I'm agnostic.

I want to hear, as an honest broker, I have always been an honest broker in every job I've ever had.

And so you're never going to find me committing the kind of fraud that's out there that these insiders are tied to.

I am dedicated to the idea that you listen as a governor.

That's what you do.

That's what I did as an assistant secretary of state.

That's what I did as a federal investigator.

That's what I did running a company.

That's what we do.

- We're going to move on.

- [Billy] Sure.

- Well, I have been listening to Maine people and they are deeply concerned about data centers and AI, big tech, its influence in our lives.

As governor, I would enact a moratorium on data center development until we have the strongest laws in the country to protect our ratepayers, to protect our environment, to ensure that communities have a say.

And I've heard, loud and clear, that is what Maine people want.

- [Jennifer] Rick.

- I voted for the moratorium when it came before us in the state Senate.

I think there's a lot of impacts that we don't know about: noise, water usage, special effects, even locally on electric rates.

And so we need to go in with our eyes open.

However, we need to know that data centers are being used.

Maine's government's own data center operates out of Virginia with far laxer environmental regulations than we have here in Maine.

So data centers are here; AI is here.

How and where we go about doing it is critical.

We need to make sure that communities are first.

This is a community choice first.

And as governor, I will protect that and make sure the guardrails are in place.

- Thank you.

Thank you, Billy, do you have a question for Hannah Pingree?

- Yeah, I'll start.

And again, I think we could keep this one a little quicker given we touched on it earlier, but for each of you, the tribal sovereignty legislation that Governor Mills has vetoed, would you sign it if a similar version comes before you as governor?

We'll start with Hannah.

- Yes, absolutely.

I support tribal sovereignty.

I have made it a priority in my first 100 days in office, and I would work in collaboration with the tribal governments to ensure that we have a much better relationship.

Actually, tomorrow, I'm going to be endorsed by four tribal chiefs.

This is an issue that matters deeply to Maine people.

I've heard about it since the beginning of my campaign and I'm ready to get it done.

- [Billy] I'll go with Bobby.

- Yeah, so I have talked with the tribal chiefs.

I've just been invited today to come up and talk again in detail to one of the tribes.

I am an honest broker.

My attitude on this is, "Come to me as governor, sit down and put it before me."

We've talked details with them.

And as a lawyer, I understand the complexity.

The way it works in Maine is different from the way it works around the rest of the country.

And I remember the original treaty.

So, the short answer is, a governor listens to the people and that is what I will do.

- [Billy] Will you sign that bill if that's- - I will listen first.

I'm not gonna- you're not the people.

Portland Press Herald definitely is not the people.

(audience laughing) - [Billy] And Rick?

- I have co-sponsored the legislation over a period of years to enact tribal sovereignty.

I've fought for it in committee and on the floor of the Senate.

I was named a tribal champion by the Wabanaki Alliance for my hard work in this area.

We have four federally recognized tribes in this state.

There are 570 across the rest of the country that are able to take advantage of federal laws because that the tribes that are in Maine cannot take advantage of.

So, yes, there's a lot of work to do here and I will be a strong supporter.

- All right.

I think that's going to be all the quick questions we have.

We're going to go to our closing statements now.

The order was predetermined before the debate.

And Rick Bennett, you and others will have one minute for your closing statement.

Go ahead.

- I've spent this year walking Maine, county by county, and I'll tell you what I've heard.

People love this state and they can't afford to stay here.

I ran a business here.

I took a Portland startup, a global, and made it profitable.

I led the state Senate when it was tied and we balanced budgets with both parties in the room.

That's the kind of governor I'll be, one who shows up, one who runs things, and one who fixes what's broken: your healthcare bills, your mortgage payments, your energy bill.

I'm not asking you to vote against anyone today.

I'm asking you to vote for a government that will deliver to the people of Maine.

We need to get back to a politics of collaboration and compromise, and the party leaders can't do that.

These party candidates can.

Hannah Pingree has a D on her jersey.

Bobby Charles has an R on his jersey.

My jersey says "Maine."

I'm Rick Bennett, and I'd be honored to have your vote.

- Rick, thank you.

Moving on to Bobby Charles.

Go ahead.

- [Bobby] Sure.

Everyone knows Maine is not affordable.

Janet Mills and Hannah Pingree have made our lives harder and harder.

Your property taxes have tripled.

Your power costs have doubled.

Healthcare is iffy.

Addiction is everywhere.

A topic we didn't discuss tonight, but I care about deeply.

Kids can't read.

Another topic we didn't discuss.

Don't have a trade.

Parents are frustrated.

Teachers are demoralized.

The young cannot pay their rent.

The other day, a lady and her three children came up to me.

They live in a car.

Another lady in Portland stopped me.

She said she voted for me.

I asked her why.

She said, "Because you care.

My son is in and out of prison and addicted to heroin, and I think you might save his life."

And I said, "I will try."

Our state is in such need, which is why I stand before you tonight.

I'm a humble soul, a Jimmy Stewart character type.

We don't have to live like this.

Public corruption and self-dealing.

Who in their right mind, charged with affordable housing by a governor, would give $840,000 to her own nonprofit?

- [Jennifer] Thank you.

- One that employs her husband and her family.

- Bobby Charles your minute for a closing statement is up.

Hannah Pingree, your turn.

- Well, here's what I know after 16 months traveling the state from Mapleton to Machias to Kittery.

Mainers are tough.

Mainers are resilient, but Mainers are fed up.

Families are working harder and still falling behind, and Donald Trump is making it much worse.

I've heard from Maine people that they want two things from their next governor.

First, a governor who will fight every day to lower costs and fix the challenges that we face.

And second, a governor who will stand up to this reckless president.

Donald Trump is counting on governors to give up and back down.

I will never give up.

I will never back down.

I fought the big chemical companies who were poisoning our kids, and I won.

I've built housing for Maine families.

I've helped communities recover from the toughest storms.

I put out bold plans on healthcare and housing, and I'm ready to do it again.

I've delivered my entire life, and I'm ready to do it as your governor.

Again, my name is Hannah Pingree, and I would be deeply, deeply honored by your vote.

- Thank you to all of you.

That concludes our "Your Vote 2026" debate.

Thank you to our candidates, Rick Bennett, Bobby Charles, and Hannah Pingree, and to Gracie Theatre here at Husson University.

And on behalf of Kevin Miller, Billy Kobin, and our media partners, News Center Maine and the Portland Press Herald, I'm Jennifer Rooks.

Thanks for watching.

(energetic music) (energetic music continues)