>> FUNDING FOR NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS PROVIDED BY THE  MCCUNE CHARITABLE FOUNDATION AND VIEWERS LIKE YOU.

>> Gene: THIS WEEK ON NEW MEXICO FOCUS, HOW HOUSING  PROBLEMS IN NEW MEXICO HAVE BEEN COMPOUNDED BY THE  PANDEMIC.

>> Serge: ALBUQUERQUE, LIKE  ALMOST EVERY OTHER PLACE IN THE COUNTRY, YOU CANNOT AFFORD  A TWO-BEDROOM PLACE IF YOU'RE WORKING 40 HOURS AT MINIMUM  WAGE.

>> Gene: REACTION TO DEB  HAALAND'S CONFIRMATION HEARING AT THE U.S. SENATE.

NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS STARTS NOW.

THANKS FOR JOINING US THIS WEEK.

I AM YOUR HOST GENE GRANT.

WE ARE HAVE REACTION TO  MS. HAALAND'S HEARING AND WHAT APPEARS TO BE LIKELY  CONFIRMATION FROM BOTH THE LINE AND A PANEL OF NATIVE  WOMEN WHO SAYS SHE IS LEADING THE WAY FOR THE NEXT  GENERATION.

THE LINE IS ALSO TALKING ABOUT  THE STATE BUDGET, JUST PASSED THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES  THIS WEEK.

WE START WITH THE TOUGH CHOICE  FACED BY SCHOOL BOARDS ACROSS THE STATE WHEN IT COMES TO  SENDING KIDS AND EDUCATORS BACK TO SCHOOL.

ALBUQUERQUE PUBLIC SCHOOL BOARD OF EDUCATION SAID LAST  WEEK IT IS TOO SOON TO BRING STUDENTS AND STAFF BACK TO  BUILDINGS EVEN IN A HYBRID MODEL.

FACING A TICKING CLOCK AND A SHORT SUPPLY OF VACCINE, THE  BOARD DECIDED ONLY CERTAIN GROUPS OF STUDENTS SHOULD  RETURN.

OTHER SCHOOL DISTRICTS HAVE  CRAFTED A BACK-TO-SCHOOL BUILDING PLAN THEY THINK MIGHT  WORK BUT NO SIZE FITS ALL, CERTAINLY, AND NO GUARANTEE  COVID-19 WON'T BE SPREAD.

HERE TO HASH IT OUT, OUR LINE  OPINION PANEL JOINED BY MERRITT ALLEN OF VOX OPTIMUM  PUBLIC REACTIONS.

KRISTELLE SIARZA, ANOTHER ONE  OF OUR PR PROS, FROM SIARZA SOCIAL DIGITAL.

AND FORMER STATE SENATOR WHO HEADS NEW MEXICO BRANCH OF THE  WORKING FAMILIES PARTY.

ERIC GRIEGO.

WE TALKED A LOT ABOUT THIS SINCE THE CALENDAR TURNED.

MOST EDUCATORS AGREE KIDS LEARN BETTER IN A CLASSROOM  SETTING BUT THAT IS A MUCH DIFFERENT STORY WHEN SAFETY  COMES INTO THE PICTURE AND, MERRITT, THERE IS SCIENCE OUT  THERE THAT SAYS THIS IS DOABLE.

ALSO A TON OF LOGISTICS FOR RAMPING UP IN-PERSON LEARNING.

DOES IT MAKE SENSE TO CALL THAT PART OF YEAR JUST A WASH  AND TRY TO DO IT BETTER WHEN STUDENTS RETURN THIS SUMMER?

IS THAT A BETTER WAY TO DO  THIS?

>> Merritt: I THINK NO ONE WAS  SURPRISED THAT APS HAS MADE THIS DECISION.

IT IS SIMPLY TOO LARGE AND TOO LARGE AN EFFORT TO PULL OFF  BEFORE THE END OF THE SCHOOL YEAR AND THE EXPENSE TO TURN  IT ON AND FOR THE SHORT AMOUNT OF TIME, AND I THINK IT POINTS  TO THE FACT THAT EITHER APS HAS GOT TO BECOME MORE NIMBLE  IN ITS MANAGEMENT AND BRING IN SOME REAL AGILE PRACTICES OR  IT NEEDS TO SERIOUSLY LOOK AT BEING SEGMENTED.

IT IS TOO BIG TO SUCCEED AND TOO BIG TO FAIL.

>> Gene: JUST TO MAKE SURE WE ARE CLEAR ON WHAT YOU'RE  SAYING, YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT APS AS A UNIT IS TOO BIG NOT  THE TASK ITSELF BUT MAY BE BREAKING UP APS, IS THAT WHAT  YOU'RE SAYING?

>> Merritt: IT IS UNABLE TO  RESPOND QUICKLY IN TERMS OF ITS PHYSICAL PLANT AND A LOT  OF THINGS WITH CURRENT MANAGEMENT STYLE.

EITHER IT HAS GOT TO KIND OF RAMP -- CHANGE ITS PERSPECTIVE  ON HOW IT IS MANAGED OR IT SERIOUSLY NEEDS TO BE BROKEN  UP.

>> Gene: GOT YOU.

ERIC, THE IDEA OF VACCINATIONS, WE ARE SEEING  THIS HAPPENING ACROSS THE COUNTRY, SOME STATES,   TEACHERS ARE VACCINATED SOME STATES  AREN'T.

WE ARE IN THE AREN'T CATEGORY  OVER HERE.

WAS THIS A BIGGER ISSUE THAN  MAYBE THE GOVERNOR MIGHT HAVE ANTICIPATED, THE IDEA OF  HAVING OF TEACHERS VACCINATED BEFORE THEY WENT BACK TO  SCHOOL.

>> Eric: I AM NO APOLOGIST FOR  APS BUT I THINK THIS IS A PART OF GOVERNMENT -- THIS IS AN  AREA WHERE OTHER LEVELS OF GOVERNMENT HAVE FALLEN DOWN ON  THE JOB.

I THINK IF WE WOULD HAVE HAD A  SERIOUS PLAN FOR IMPLEMENTING VACCINATIONS AND COULD HAVE  PRIORITIZED EDUCATORS ACROSS THE COUNTRY, CERTAINLY NEW  MEXICO, BECAUSE, WE ARE A SMALL STATE AND I THINK WE ARE  ACTUALLY IN THE TOP STATES IN TERMS OF GETTING VACCINATIONS  OUT, BUT SO I DON'T THINK IT IS UNREASONABLE FOR EDUCATORS  TO SAY, LOOK, I HAVE AN ELDER AT HOME.

I AM WORRIED ABOUT MY OWN HEALTH AND THAT THEY SHOULD BE  PRIORITIZED.

THE OTHER PART, I THINK  MERRITT ALLUDED TO THIS, YOU KNOW, APS IS A BIG SCHOOL  SYSTEM AND TO REALLY BE PREPARED, I MEAN, WE KIND OF  KNOW WHAT NEEDS TO BE DONE, FIRST AND FOREMOST GET AS MANY  PEOPLE VACCINATED.

PRIORITIZE EDUCATORS AND  STAFF, RIGHT, BUT THERE IS A LOT OF SCHOOLS THAT ARE  SMALLER AND SMALLER DISTRICTS THAT FIGURED THIS OUT AROUND  THE COUNTRY, BUT YOU GOT TO HAVE MASK MANDATE, YOU HAVE TO  HAVE THE VENTILATION IN PLACE, YOU HAVE TO HAVE CONTACT  TRACING.

WE KNOW ALL THE PIECES THAT  MAKE IT AS SAFE AS POSSIBLE.

IT IS NOT 100% GUARANTEE AS WE  ALL KNOW, BUT THE MERE SIZE OF APS AND THE FACT THAT I DON'T  THINK THAT OTHER LEVELS OF GOVERNMENT HAVE BEEN AS  PREPARED TO HELP A BIG SCHOOL SYSTEM LIKE APS GET READY.

I THINK THAT IS PART OF THE PROBLEM.

I HAVE A 12 YEAR OLD AT HOME AND HE IS DOING FINE,  VIRTUALLY, ALL VIRTUAL WHERE HE GOES TO SCHOOL.

BUT, YOU KNOW, HE LIKE MANY KIDS JUST REALLY, REALLY ARE  JUST SICK OF THIS.

THEY GOT TO HAVE SOMETHING IN  CONTACT.

WE HAVE TO FIGURE THIS OUT.

IT CAN'T JUST BE IN THE GOVERNOR.

IT CAN'T JUST BE ON APS.

WE HAVE TO FIGURE THIS OUT  SOONER RATHER THAN LATER BECAUSE I DO THINK THE SOCIAL  EMOTIONAL PIECE OF THIS IS GOING TO TAKE A DEEPER TOLL  THAN FOLKS REALIZE, NOT JUST GRADES BUT A LOSING A YEAR OF  SOCIAL INTERACTION.

>> Gene: I AM AFRAID OF THE  STUDIES THAT WILL COME OUT THREE TO FIVE YEARS FROM NOW  THAT WILL SHOW US ALL JUST EXACTLY WHAT YOU'RE SAYING.

IT IS TROUBLESOME.

KRISTELLE, INTERESTINGLY,  MERRITT BROUGHT UP APS AND ITS ABILITY TO MANAGE THIS DUE TO  ITS SIZE.

BUT, DISTRICTS OUT THERE LIKE  TAOS AND FARMINGTON, THEY HAVE DIFFERENT PLANS TO GO BACK TO  IN-PERSON.

IS THIS A SIZE QUESTION OR  JUST ABOUT COMPETENCE AND GETTING READY AND DOING ALL  THE THINGS THAT NEED TO BE DONE?

WHAT IS YOUR SENSE OF IT?

>> Kristelle: MY SENSE ON IT  IS ACTUALLY BASED FROM DOING THE ACTUAL RESEARCH, YOU KNOW.

I SPENT SOME TIME SPEAKING TO EDUCATORS KNOWING THIS WAS  GOING TO BE A TOPIC ON THE PANEL TODAY.

AND I SPENT SOME TIME ALSO LOOKING AT THE INDEPENDENT  SCHOOL PERSPECTIVE AS AN INDEPENDENT SCHOOL PARENT.

IT IS SIZE.

IT IS ALSO TACTICAL  IMPLEMENTATION.

IT IS ALSO DEMOGRAPHICS.

WHY DO I SAY IT IN THAT FASHION?

THE SIZE OF THE DISTRICT THAT MANY PEOPLE DON'T REALIZE IS  THAT APS IS ONE OF THE TOP 10 LARGEST SCHOOL DISTRICTS IN  THE COUNTRY.

IMPLEMENTATION IS ALSO  SOMETHING TO CONSIDER THAT EVERY SCHOOL HAS ABOUT, YOU  KNOW, A COUPLE THOUSAND KIDS THAT HAVE CUSTOM PLANS TO  THEIR LESSONS IN TERMS OF WHAT CLASSES THEY ATTEND, WHAT  PROGRAMMING THEY SHOULD BE IN, WHAT SPECIALTY GROUPS THEY  SHOULD BE PLACED IN, WHETHER IT BE SPECIAL EDUCATION,  ATHLETICS OR SOMETHING ALONG THOSE LINES.

AND THEN THE THIRD PART IS, YOU KNOW, THE LOGISTICS OF IT  ALL.

THE PERSPECTIVE OF TIME IS  SOMETHING TO TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION.

TEACHERS ONLY HAVE ABOUT FIVE WEEKS LEFT TO TEACH AFTER,  THEORETICALLY SPEAKING, AFTER SPRING BREAK WHICH IS WHEN  APPROXIMATELY IN SCHOOL WOULD BE.

FROM THE TEACHERS, OR AT LEAST FROM SOME OF THE INDIVIDUALS  THAT ARE IN THE UNION, THEY FEEL THAT FIVE WEEKS,  OVERHAULING THEIR CURRICULUM FOR JUST FIVE WEEKS OF  INSTRUCTIONAL LEARNING IS NOT WORTH THE EFFORT ACCORDING TO  WHAT TEACHERS ARE SAYING AND THE VACCINATION CAUSES MAJOR  PROBLEMS BECAUSE A TEACHER'S JOB IS TO HELP A STUDENT, THAT  IS THEIR MISSION, AND THAT IS THEIR MO, WHY THEY WAKE UP  EVERY MORNING, BUT AT THE END OF THE DAY, THEY ARE THERE TO  PROTECT THEIR OWN FAMILIES AND FAMILIES ARE FIRST.

THE LAST POINT I WANTED TO MAKE ABOUT WHY THIS IS SUCH A  CHALLENGING ISSUE IS THAT APS IS SO LARGE THAT THE  DEMOGRAPHICS OF STUDENTS, THE DEMOGRAPHICS AND STUDIES OF  DIFFERENT FAMILIES AND DIFFERENT TEACHERS, DIFFER, SO  THAT NOBODY CAN AGREE.

IN A RECENT BOARD MEETING THEY  REFERENCED -- IN AN APS BOARD MEETING THEY REFERENCED THEY  DID A SURVEY AMONG TEACHERS AND PARENTS, 75% OF TEACHERS  DON'T FEEL LIKE THEY SHOULD BE GOING BACK INTO THE CLASSROOM  CONSIDERING THE TIMING AND ALSO THE VACCINATION ISSUE.

ON THE FLIP SIDE, WHEN THEY INTERVIEWED THE PARENTS,  DEPENDING WHAT PART OF TOWN THAT YOU WENT TO, 75% OF  PARENTS FELT THEY SHOULD GO BACK AND ANOTHER PART OF TOWN,  75% OF PARENTS SAID THEY SHOULDN'T GO BACK, AND NOBODY  COULD AGREE AND EVEN THOUGH THEY HAVE A ZONE METHOD OF  MANAGEMENT IN APS, THE WAY THAT THE DISTRICT IS  STRUCTURED THIS IS NOW EYE OPENING EVEN MORE SO NOW IN  TERMS OF HOW TO DEAL WITH THIS  CERTAIN ISSUE.

>> Gene: EXCELLENT POINTS.

LET ME READ YOU A QUOTE FROM THE GOVERNORS.

I KNOW YOU KNOW THIS GOVERNOR'S SAID, IN PART,  DISTRICTS AND LOCAL LEADERSHIP CAN AND SHOULD DEBATE WHEN AND  WHERE, BUT SHOULD BE NO DEBATE ABOUT THE FUNDAMENTAL FACTS OF  WHETHER IT CAN BE DONE SAFELY IN THE FIRST PLACE.

DO YOU AGREE WITH THAT?

>> Merritt: I DO.

I THINK WE SEE THIS NATIONALLY.

THIS IS COMING FROM NOT JUST THE ADMINISTRATION BUT ALSO  THE CDC.

WE ALSO, I THINK, TO ERIC'S  POINT, OUR CHILDREN ARE REALLY MISSING OUT ON JUST KEEP  ACTIVE AND DEVELOPMENT OF BEING WITH OTHER KIDS AND OUT  OF THE HOURS.

THIS IS NOT GOOD FOR OUR KIDS  NOT JUST FROM THE LEARNING POINT BUT FROM THE SOCIAL  PIECE OF IT.

YOU KNOW, THE VACCINE IS NOT A  CURE ALL BECAUSE THERE IS NOT A VACCINE APPROVED FOR  CHILDREN UNDER 14 SO THAT IS NOT A PANACEA.

THERE ARE KIDS GETTING IN PERSON LEARNING, I KNOW,  BECAUSE I HAVE A RELATIVE WHO WORKS WITH SPECIAL NEEDS  CHILDREN AND SHE HAS BEEN IN A CLASSROOM SINCE OCTOBER.

SO, SHE HAS BEEN VACCINATED.

I THINK ULTIMATELY, NO, APS  IS -- AND I THINK ON A PREVIOUS SHOW I SAID THERE IS  NO WAY WE ARE GOING TO GO BACK TO SCHOOL IN THE CLASSROOM OR  HYBRID FOR THE 2021 SCHOOL YEAR.

THE THING THAT HAS TO HAPPEN IS WE HAVE TO GIVE EVERY CHILD  FROM K 12 WHO HAS BEEN ENROLLED IN PUBLIC SCHOOLS  DURING THE PANDEMIC, YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE TO ADD AN EXTRA  YEAR.

>> Gene: THAT IS GOING TO BE A  DISCUSSION.

20 SECONDS, IF YOU CAN.

THIS IDEA OF SPORTS IS THERE A CASE FOR DOING IN-PERSON  ACTIVITIES BUT NOT IN-PERSON LEARNING?

IS THAT COMPATIBLE?

>> Eric: MY SON HAS TAKEN SOME  LESSONS OUTSIDE, YOU KNOW.

KIDS ARE GOING CRAZY IN THEIR  ROOM AND NEED INTERACTION.

WE CAN DO THIS SAFELY.

IF WE CAN DO IT SAFELY AND PEOPLE ARE RESPONSIBLE AND  FOLLOW THE BEST SCIENCE WE ARE GETTING, I THINK WE CAN.

THEY MAY BE A START.

IF THEY ARE OUTSIDE.

IF THEY FOLLOW THE PROTOCOLS.

I DON'T THINK IT IS AN  OUTRAGEOUS REQUEST TO SAY CAN WE DO SOMETHING TO GET THESE  KIDS SOME KIND OF, YOU KNOW, ACTIVITY AND INTERACTION.

MAYBE THE CLASSROOM WE ARE NOT READY FOR THAT, BUT WE SHOULD  AT LEAST TRY TO DO OTHER SPORTS AND OTHER ACTIVITIES.

>> Gene: I WAS WATCHING SOME OF THE COVERAGE IN HOUSTON ONE  OF THE AFFILIATES OUT THERE LAST WEEK DURING THE BIG  FREEZE, AND THEY HAVE CUT TO THE SPORTS AND SHOWING A HIGH  SCHOOL SPORTS GIRLS BASKETBALL GAME.

ALL THE COMPETITORS WERE MASKED ON COURT.

IT WAS REALLY INTERESTING WATCHING THEM BUZZING UP AND  DOWN THE COURT HOISTING UP, YOU KNOW, SHOTS WITH MASKS ON.

IT CAN BE DONE IF WE WANT TO DO IT.

GO AHEAD KRISTELLE.

>> Kristelle: EAST MOUNTAIN  HIGH HAS STARTED SPORTS THIS WEEK.

THEY ARE A CHARTER SCHOOL IN APS.

THEY FOUND A WAY.

>> Gene:   WE ARE OUT OF TIME FOR THIS ONE.

WE'LL GET REACTION TO DEB HAALAND'S CONFIRMATION  HEARINGS NEXT.

>> Hughes:   DO LOTS AND LOTS OF RESEARCH.

THERE ARE ONLINE PORTALS THAT WORK PRETTY WELL.

I GOT A LOT MORE SUCCESS IN PHONE CALLS ACTUALLY.

I KNOW  A LOT OF YOUNG PEOPLE ARE SCARED TO PICK UP THE PHONE  AND CALL.

I DON'T KNOW WHAT IT IS.

I KNOW I GET DREAD WHEN I SEE THE PHONE RING BUT CALLING WAS  HELPFUL.

AND,   LOOK AT PLACES THAT DON'T NECESSARILY SAY THEY HAVE  AVAILABILITY.

>> Gene:   THE EYES OF NATIVE AMERICA WERE GLUED TO SCREENS  THIS WEEK AS NEW MEXICO CONGRESSWOMAN DEB HAALAND SAT  FOR CONFIRMATION HEARINGS AS JOE BIDEN'S PICK FOR SECRETARY  OF THE INTERIOR.

MS. HAALAND WHO IS LAGUNA AND  JEMEZ PUEBLO WOULD BE THE FIRST EVER NATIVE AMERICAN  CABINET SECRETARY.

IN FRONT OF A DIVIDED ENERGY  AND NATURAL RESOURCE COMMITTEE SHE TOUTED A RECORD OF  BIPARTISAN BILLS.

SHE HAS ALSO BEEN A STRONG  ADVOCATE FOR INDIGENOUS AND ENVIRONMENTAL ISSUES,  SOMETHING THAT DIDN'T SIT WELL WITH SENATORS WHO ARE CLOSELY  ALIGNED WITH THE OIL AND GAS INDUSTRY.

NOW, IF CONFIRMED, MS. HAALAND WILL HEAD THE AGENCY  RESPONSIBLE FOR LAND AND RESOURCE MANAGEMENT AND INDIAN  AFFAIRS.

THIS WEEK, NMIF CORRESPONDENT  ANTONIO GONZALES GOT REACTION AND INSIGHT FROM A GROUP OF  NATIVE WOMEN ABOUT A HISTORIC MOMENT FOR INDIAN COUNTRY.

>> Antonia: KIERA TOYA, HOLLY COOK MACARRO, SHAYAI LUCERO,  WELCOME TO NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS.

THIS HISTORIC NOMINATION HAS CREATED BUZZ AND EXCITEMENT  ACROSS INDIAN COUNTRY.

DEB HAALAND IS BEING LOOKED AT  AS SOMEONE WHO IS CONNECTING TO NATIVE VALUES AND ALSO A  LOT OF PEOPLE ARE CALLING HER MANY AUNTIE DEB.

SHE IS MORE THAN JUST A POLITICIAN TO INDIAN COUNTRY.

SHAYAI, YOUR FROM THE SAME TRIBAL COMMUNITY AS DEB  HAALAND.

WHY IS HER NOMINATION BEING SO  CELEBRATED BY NATIVE PEOPLE?

>> Lucero: I AM HAPPY TO SAY  THAT DEB AND I ARE FROM THE SAME TRIBE.

I AM ALSO PUEBLO OF ACOMA AND WE ARE ACTUALLY FROM THE SAME  VILLAGE HERE IN LAGUNA AND SO OUR VILLAGE IS THE MOST  TRADITIONAL OF ALL THE DIFFERENT VILLAGES HERE IN  LAGUNA.

SO, DEB KNOWS LIKE THE PUEBLO POLITICS OF NOT  BEING ABLE TO BE IN POSITIONS SUCH AS THE GOVERNOR, SO I  FEEL THAT HER -- BY HER MOVING INTO THIS ASPECT TO BE A  POLITICAL LAWMAKER FOR EVERYBODY IS HER WAY OF  BRINGING THAT PUEBLO WOMEN'S VOICE TO OUR TRIBES AND TO OUR  COUNTRY.

SO, IT DOES GIVE ME CHILLS  BECAUSE WHETHER YOU'RE A SUPPORTER OF HER OR NOT, SHE  IS GOING TO BE THE PROTECTOR OF OUR MOTHER SO WE HAVE TO  MAKE SURE THAT WE HONOR HER AND SUPPORT HER IN THAT  ASPECT.

>> Antonia: AND HOLLY YOU HAVE  A LOT OF EXPERIENCE ON THE NATIONAL LEVEL WITH DC  POLITICS AND LEGISLATION, LOBBYING AND ADVOCATING ON  TRIBAL ISSUES.

HAALAND TOLD THE SENATE  COMMITTEE THIS WEEK THAT SHE IS SOMEONE THAT IS ABLE TO  CONNECT AND LISTEN TO TRIBAL COMMUNITIES AND WORK ON  BIPARTISAN ISSUES.

WHY IS REPRESENTATION  IMPORTANT?

>> Macarro: YOU KNOW, THANK  YOU FOR THAT QUESTION.

IT IS SOMETHING THAT I THINK  HAS BEEN -- THE ANSWER TO THAT QUESTION HAS BEEN EXEMPLIFIED  BY SOME OF THE TWEETS AND STATEMENTS WE HAVE SEEN COME  OUT FROM SENATOR DAINES, FROM SENATOR BARRASSO AND THEIR  TWEETS AND STATEMENTS AND VOICING THEIR CONCERNS OVER  THAT CONGRESSWOMAN HAALAND IS RADICAL FOR HER VIEWS THAT ARE  COMPLETELY IN LINE WITH PRESIDENT BIDEN'S CLIMATE  CHANGE AGENDA AND VIEWS ON DRILLING ON PUBLIC LAND,  FRACKING, ET CETERA, THEY COME FROM STATES WITH SIGNIFICANT  TRIBAL POPULATIONS.

AND ALASKA, 11% OF THE  POPULATION, 10% IN MONTANA.

THEY ALSO HAVE MILLIONS OF  ACRES OF TRIBAL TRUST LAND WITHIN THE BOUNDARIES OF THEIR  STATES AND THEIR STATEMENTS AND VIEWS DID NOT REFLECT A  TRIBAL PERSPECTIVE AT ALL.

IN FACT, CONGRESSMAN  ROSENDALE, IN RESPONSE TO THE TRIBAL CONCERNS THAT WERE  AIRED FOR MONTANA TRIBAL LEADERS FROM STATE SENATOR  JONATHAN WINDY BOY TO TRIBAL CHAIRMAN ANDY WERK AT FORT  PECK, I THINK, AND HE CALLED THOSE VIEWS PATHETIC AND  DOUBLED DOWN ON THE STATEMENTS THAT THEY HAVE MADE.

SO, THAT TO ME ONLY UNDERSCORED WHY WE NEED A  VOICE AND A PRESENCE LIKE DEB HAALAND TO LEAD THE DEPARTMENT  OF INTERIOR.

AND BRING OUR VOICE TO THE  TABLE, TO THE ACTUAL TABLE AT THE CABINET AND THROUGHOUT THE  DEPARTMENT OF INTERIOR.

>> Antonia: TO ADD TO THAT AS  LOOKING AT THE NATIVE WAY OF THINKING, NATIVE  REPRESENTATION, NATIVE VIEWS ON THE WORLD, JUST EXPAND ON  THAT A LITTLE BIT, HOLLY.

>> Macarro: DEB'S APPROACH --  NATIVE WOMEN AS WE ALL KNOW -- LOOK AT OUR PANEL -- HAVE BEEN  LEADING THE WAY FOR A LONG TIME AND BOTH IN OUR  COMMUNITIES AND WITHOUT.

CERTAINLY, I THINK, HAVE LED  THE WAY IN GETTING SUPPORT, OUR COMMUNITY SUPPORT AND  REALLY STANDING BEHIND DEB AS SHE HAS GONE THROUGH THE RUNUP  TO NOMINATION AND BEYOND.

BUT HER APPROACH AND HER  RECOGNITION AS THE HIGHEST RANKING FRESHMAN IN  INTRODUCING AND PASSING LEGISLATION IN THE 116TH  CONGRESS, THE LAST CONGRESS, SHE PASSED MORE BILLS THAN  ANYONE ELSE IN HER CLASS WITH BIPARTISAN SUPPORT, WITH  CONGRESSMAN DON YOUNG, A REPUBLICAN FROM ALASKA, WHO  WALKED ACROSS THE CAPITOL AND INTRODUCED HER AND REPEATEDLY  EMPHASIZED HER BIPARTISAN EFFORTS TO PASS LEGISLATION,  HER WILLINGNESS TO WORK TOGETHER, HER WILLINGNESS TO  LISTEN AND TO CONSIDER THE VIEWS FROM A 360 PERSPECTIVE.

I THINK THAT REFLECTS HOW WE WORK IN TRIBAL COMMUNITIES.

WE DON'T CONSIDER SINGULAR VIEWS.

WE CONSIDER COMMUNITY IMPACTS.

WE CONSIDER EVERYONE THAT IS  AFFECTED.

I THINK THAT CONGRESSWOMAN  HAALAND WILL BRING THAT TO THE INTERIOR AND SHE HAS A  DEMONSTRATED TRACK RECORD OF DOING THAT AS A MEMBER OF THE  HOUSE.

>> Antonia: YOU ARE ALSO FROM  THE COMMUNITY HAALAND IS CONNECTED TO.

SHE HAS JEMEZ PUEBLO HERITAGE.

YOU'RE A YOUTH LEADER YOURSELF  AND WORK ON NATIVE YOUTH ISSUES NATIONALLY.

WHAT ARE YOU HEARING ABOUT HAALAND FROM PEOPLE FROM  NATIVE YOUTH IN YOUR COMMUNITY AND BEYOND?

>> Toya: ESPECIALLY IN MY COMMUNITY, I THINK WE ARE  REALLY EXCITED TO SEE HAALAND AND ESPECIALLY IN THIS  POSITION.

I HAVE FRIENDS ALL OVER INDIAN  COUNTRY AND WE ARE ALL LIKE REALLY EXCITED, REALLY HAPPY  TO SEE HER.

WE ARE ALL JUST LIKE HAPPY AND  JUST PRAYING THAT SHE JUST GETS THROUGH IT.

>> Antonia: AND SHAYAI, YOU'RE A BUSINESS WOMAN, A MOTHER,  SCIENCE AND ENGINEERING ARE REALLY IMPORTANT TO YOU.

YOU HAVE ALSO SEEN THE IMPACTS OF COVID-19 IN YOUR COMMUNITY.

HAALAND DURING HER CONFIRMATION HEARING SAID SHE  WOULD MOVE FORWARD PRESIDENT BIDEN'S AGENDA ON PANDEMIC  RECOVERY.

WHAT DO YOU HOPE SHE COULD DO  FOR INDIAN COUNTRY IN HER CAPACITY IF CONFIRMED AS  SECRETARY.

>> Lucero: I THINK HER BIGGEST  IMPACT IS GETTING NATIVE AMERICANS A VOICE.

YOU KNOW, EVEN THOUGH THE DEPARTMENT OF INDIAN AFFAIRS  IS MAYBE 10% OF THE INTERIOR'S ENTIRE JOB, WE HAVE NEVER BEEN  ABLE TO BRING OUR ISSUES TO THE FOREFRONT.

SO, YOU KNOW, LIKE SENATOR MURKOWSKI BROUGHT UP THE FACT  THAT ALASKAN TRIBES ARE MUCH DIFFERENT THAN THE LOWER 48  TRIBES AND HOW THE CARES ACT FUNDING WAS DISTRIBUTED WAS A  REAL HUGE IMPACT ON ALASKAN NATIVES.

AND JUST A LOT OF PEOPLE THAT,  YOU KNOW, I WAS LISTENING ON CLUB HOUSE AND WATCHING  TWITTER FEEDS ALL MORNING AND A LOT OF THE BUZZ WAS THAT  PEOPLE DIDN'T REALIZE THE NATURE OF THE -- OR THE  DIFFERENCES BETWEEN THE TWO.

AND SO SOMETHING LIKE THAT IN  EDUCATING OTHERS ABOUT OUR NATIVE AMERICAN VIEWS IS GOING  TO BE VERY VITAL IN HAVING HER AS OUR VOICE, BUT ALSO GOING  BACK TO SOME OF THE SCIENCE, BECAUSE SHE KEPT REITERATING  SCIENCE.

WE HAVE TO FOLLOW SCIENCE.

SCIENCE IS IMPORTANT AND IT IS IMPORTANT BECAUSE A LOT OF OUR  ENERGY IS DEPENDENT ON NONRENEWABLE SOURCES SO I WAS  EVEN EXCITED TO HEAR THE SENATOR FROM MAINE TALK ABOUT  OFFSHORE WIND ENERGY.

I WAS LIKE, WHOA, I COMPLETELY  FORGOT ABOUT THAT.

AND TO BRING THINGS LIKE THAT  TO OUR COUNTRY, TO THINK ABOUT SCIENCE AND ENERGY AND THINGS  IN THAT MANNER, I THINK WOULD HELP US NOT ONLY MAINTAIN  THOSE JOBS BUT ALSO WOULD HELP, YOU KNOW, DEB KIND OF  THINK IN A BROADER PICTURE.

AND JUST THAT IS GOING TO BE  VERY, VERY HELPFUL TO INDIAN COUNTRY AS WELL AS THE REST OF  AMERICA.

>> Antonia: HOLLY, THERE IS  MUCH SUPPORT FROM TRIBAL LEADERS, DIRECTORS OF NATIONAL  NATIVE ORGANIZATIONS, ELECTED OFFICIALS, COMMUNITY MEMBERS,  THERE IS ADVOCACY GOING ON RIGHT NOW.

CAN YOU TELL US WHAT IS DEB FOR INTERIOR WEEK OF ACTION,  WHAT IS THAT ABOUT?

>> Macarro: DEB FOR INTERIOR  WEEK OF ACTION HAS BEEN PUT TOGETHER BY LEADERSHIP AT  ILLUMINATIVE AND THE NATIVE VOTERS ALLIANCE, NATIVE  ORGANIZERS ALLIANCE AND ADVANCED NATIVE POLITICAL  LEADERSHIP.

THEY HAVE JOINED FORCES AND  REALLY THEY HAVE TREMENDOUS SKILLS IN TERMS OF PROVIDING  SOCIAL MEDIA CONTENT, PROVIDING THE LINK TO THE  LETTER THAT HAS GENERATED NEARLY 15,000 LETTERS GOING  INTO MEMBERS OF THE SENATE COMMITTEE ON ENERGY AND  NATURAL RESOURCES.

AND THAT WILL BE REDIRECTED.

THE COMMITTEE VOTE FOR CONGRESSWOMAN HAALAND IS NEXT  WEDNESDAY, MARCH 2, SO THERE IS ALWAYS A WEEK INTERVENING.

AND SO AS SOON AS SHE IS -- NOTABLY JUST BEFORE WE WENT ON  THE AIR, ANTONIA, SENATOR MENTIONED -- PUT OUT A  STATEMENT THAT HE IS VOTING FOR CONGRESSWOMAN HAALAND  WHICH GUARANTEES HER PASSAGE OUT OF COMMITTEE.

HE HAD SAID HE WAS UNCOMMITTED TWO DAYS AGO SO THAT REALLY  INDICATES THIS WAS A SUCCESSFUL WEEK FOR HER.

SO, PLEASE KEEP AN EYE OUT.

ELIMINATIVE, IF YOU GO ON  THEIR SOCIAL MEDIA FEED OR NATIVE ORGANIZERS ALLIANCE OR  ADVANCED NATIVE POLITICAL, THEIR SOCIAL MEDIA CONTENT,  TWEET STORM, TALKING POINTS, PIECES THAT WE CAN DO TO  AMPLIFY THE PUBLIC SUPPORT AND IT ALSO, I THINK, REALLY  EPITOMIZES THE SYNERGY THAT TOOK PLACE THAT I HAVE NEVER  SEEN BEFORE IN 23 YEARS OF DOING POLITICS ON THE FEDERAL  LEVEL, OF THE TALENT THAT WE HAVE IN PLACE ON THE GRASS  ROOTS SIDE, ON THE POLITICAL SIDE, DEB HERSELF, HAVING ALL  COMING TOGETHER, KIND OF HITTING HER STRIDE JUST AT THE  RIGHT TIME TO PLAY THAT CRITICAL ROLE OF SUPPORT.

AND THEN THERE IS THE ORGANIC NON-TRIBAL COMMUNITY, THE  CLIMATE CHANGE ORGANIZATIONS, CONSERVATION GROUPS THAT HAVE  COME TOGETHER AND ARE ALSO, ALL OF THAT, ALL OF THOSE  CALLS AND LETTERS GOING INTO THE SENATE COMMITTEE ON ENERGY  AND NATURAL RESOURCES IS REALLY CRITICAL.

AND, AS I SAID, WE NEED -- THE POWER SHARING AGREEMENT GIVING  THE 50/50 SPLIT IN THE SENATE, WE ONLY NEED -- IT'S A 50/50  VOTE MEANS THAT A NOMINEE WILL ADVANCE, A PRESIDENTIAL  NOMINEE WILL ADVANCE.

SENATOR DAINES AND SENATOR  BARRASSO INDICATED THAT THEY WILL PUT A HOLD ON HER  NOMINATION, WHICH MEANS SENATOR SCHUMER WILL THEN HAVE  TO FILE -- THAT PROCESS PROCEDURE WILL ADD ANOTHER  THREE TO FIVE DAYS DEPENDING WHICH DAY THEY FILE IT ON.

I DON'T EXPECT TO SEE A VOTE, A FLOOR VOTE FOR CONGRESSWOMAN  HAALAND UNTIL MID MARCH.

WE DO HAVE WORK TO DO IN THE  INTERVENING WEEKS TO ENSURE THAT SHE DOES GET ACROSS THE  FINISH LINE.

>> Antonia: KIERA, AS YOU  TOUCHED ON A LITTLE BIT, JUST THE MEANING OF HAVING DEB  HAALAND A PUEBLO WOMAN AND NATIVE WOMAN ALREADY WHO IS A  CONGRESSWOMAN AND MAKING STRIDES ON THAT LEVEL, BUT  SOMEBODY NOMINATED TO LEAD THE INTERIOR DEPARTMENT, WHAT DOES  THAT MEAN FOR YOUNG NATIVE WOMEN AND GIRLS AND WHAT DOES  IT MEAN PERSONALLY FOR YOU?

>> Toya: I LOOK UP TO HER SO  MUCH.

SHE IS ONE OF MY FAVORITE  PEOPLE AND LIKE WHAT SHE HAS DONE WITHIN LIKE THE LAND AND  ALL OF LIKE THE LAWS THAT SHE PASSED AND POLICIES SHE HAS  DONE.

I KNOW SHE IS A BIG  INSPIRATION TO A LOT OF YOUNG GIRLS AND A LOT OF NATIVE  WOMEN AND ESPECIALLY THOSE WHO WANT TO FOLLOW IN HER  FOOTSTEPS, JUST PLACING DOWN THE FOUNDATION FOR US SO WE  AND THOSE LIKE YOUNG WOMEN AND GIRLS CAN JUST FINISH WHAT SHE  WAS STARTED.

>>   Antonia: THANK YOU ALL SO MUCH FOR SHARING YOUR THOUGHTS  TODAY AND I AM SURE THE EXCITEMENT IS GOING TO  CONTINUE IN INDIAN COUNTRY AS PEOPLE WATCH THE CONFIRMATION  PROCESS FOR DEB HAALAND FOR INTERIOR SECRETARY PLAY OUT.

THANK YOU SO MUCH.

>> Gene: RAVE REVIEWS FROM OUR  PANEL OF NATIVE AMERICANS WHO POINTED OUT JOE MANCHIN'S VOTE  GOES A LONG WAY TOWARDS WINNING A NOMINATION.

HOW DID THE LINE THINK THE CONGRESSWOMAN DID AND WHAT DID  WE LEARN ABOUT HER PLANS AT DEPARTMENT OF INTERIOR.

ERIC, THIS PICK WAS A BIG NOD TO PROGRESSIVES AND  CONSERVATIVE SENATORS WENT AFTER MS. HAALAND FOR SOME OF  HER VIEWS.

SHE PARRIED AN AWFUL LOT,  DOING IT WELL, SAYING SHE WAS ADVANCING MR. BIDEN'S AGENDA,  NOT HER OWN.

WAS THAT A GOOD ENOUGH  DISTINCTION?

DID YOU FEEL A GOOD SEPARATION  THERE?

>> Eric: YEAH.

LOOK, SHE HAS BEEN A LEADER ON RENEWABLES AND GREEN ECONOMY  STUFF AND PART OF THE REASON WHY SO MANY PEOPLE AND SO MANY  CONSERVATION GROUPS SUPPORTED HER, NOT TO MENTION NATIVE  GROUPS AND MANY OTHERS, IS BECAUSE SHE HAS BEEN BOLD ON  THIS DIRE NEED TO TRANSITION TO A NONFOSSIL FUEL BASED  ECONOMY, RIGHT?

WHEN YOU GET UP FOR A POSITION  LIKE THIS, YOU KNOW, OPPONENTS USE IT AS AN OPPORTUNITY TO  COME AFTER YOU.

SO, I THINK SHE DID THE BEST  SHE COULD WITHOUT COMPROMISING HER CORE VALUES AND SAYING WE  ARE GOING TO DO EVERYTHING.

I KNOW I SAID WE NEED TO MAKE  THIS TRANSITION A PRIORITY AND MAKE SURE THAT ALL THE  COMMUNITIES TO BE AFFECTED ARE PRIORITIZED AND SHE DIDN'T  FLIP FLOP OR SELL OUT.

SHE SAID, LOOK, SHE WAS CLEAR  THERE WAS ONE QUESTION FROM I THINK THE RANKING MEMBER WHERE  SHE SAID, YOU KNOW, YOU SAID THESE OUTRAGEOUS THINGS ABOUT  PRACTICE AND ABOUT THE NEW DEAL AND SO ON AND DO YOUR  VALUES MATTER OR DO BIDEN'S VALUES MATTER?

SHE SAID LIKE, LOOK, I WORK FOR THE PRESIDENT.

MY VALUES -- MY OWN AGENDA IS SECONDARY, RIGHT?

I THINK THAT SENT A SIGNAL TO BOTH PEOPLE WHO ARE WORRIED  SHE WOULD BE PUSHED TO BE MUCH MORE SORT OF IN LINE WITH THE  MANSIONS OF THE WORLD AND IT SAID, LOOK, I AM GOING TO TAKE  MY ORDERS FROM THE PRESIDENT, OBVIOUSLY.

AND HE IS NOT ANYWHERE NEAR WHERE SHE IS IN TERMS OF BEING  PROGRESSIVE ON CLIMATE CHANGE BUT THE FACT THAT SHE IS THERE  AND SHE HAS A RECORD OF BEING A LEADER IN THIS CLIMATE  CHANGE THAT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT I THINK SHE DID THE BEST  SHE COULD.

SHE DID PARRY.

I FELT LIKE THERE WAS A LOT OF CHEAP SHOTS COMING AT HER.

THE BOTTOM LINE IS SHE HAS GOT MANCHIN.

I DON'T KNOW WHERE CHRISTINE KRYSTEN SINEMA FROM ARIZONA  IS.

SHE HAS BEEN SORT OF ON THE  FENCE.

AND IF SHE DOES GET KRYSTEN  SINEMA, SHE NEEDS TO GET ONE OF THE REPUBLICANS.

I THINK THAT IS POSSIBLE.

SHE HAS A FEW REPUBLICANS  AREN'T SPEAKING OUT WHO WILL PROBABLY END UP VOTING FOR  HER.

OVERALL I WAS VERY, VERY HAPPY  TO HEAR THAT MANCHIN WASN'T GOING TO HOLD IT UP BECAUSE  THAT WOULD HAVE CAUSED A REAL DISASTER FOR HER AND THE  PRESIDENT.

>> Gene: THE FACT THAT HE  DIDN'T LET IT HANG OUT THERE FOR 42, 72 HOURS.

HE JUST CAME STRAIGHT OUT.

THAT IS A BIG DIFFERENCE.

MERRITT, A LOT FROM MS. HAALAND ABOUT SOME OF HER  VIEWS ON KEYSTONE PIPELINE, FRACKING, ALL THAT KIND OF  THING.

AS ERIC MENTIONED, SHE DIDN'T  WALK AWAY FROM ANY OF THIS BUT DID NOT EITHER DIG HER HEELS  IN TERRIBLY DEEP EITHER.

I AM ASKING THIS IN THIS  CONTEXT.

LET'S ASSUME SUCCESS AND SHE  GETS THE NOMINATION.

ALL THESE THINGS ARE NOT GOING  AWAY.

IT SEEMS TO ME IT IS A PRISM  HOW SHE'LL BE VIEWED BY A LOT OF FOLKS IN WESTERN STATES,  WHO HAVE A LITTLE BIT OF ANXIETY ABOUT HER.

WHAT IS YOUR FEELING ON THAT?

>> Merritt: I THINK THAT WAS  SMART TO NOT BE UNEQUIVOCAL ON THE ISSUE BECAUSE THERE IS SO  MUCH DRAMA RIGHT NOW AND THERE IS SO MUCH MORE TO THE  DEPARTMENT OF THE INTERIOR BESIDES KEYSTONE AND FRACKING  LICENSES, FRANKLY.

FRACKING LEASES.

AND IN THE WEST WE ALSO, YOU KNOW, WE KIND OF NEED WILDFIRE  MANAGEMENT.

THAT IS REALLY A BIG DEAL.

THERE IS A LOT MORE THAT THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR HAS  TO MANAGE.

AND I THINK SHE ALSO NEEDS A CLEARER PICTURE OF WHAT THE  PRESIDENT WANTS, SO, TO THE POINT THAT IT IS THE  PRESIDENT'S POLICY AND NOT HER OWN AGENDA, SHE WAS SMART TO  NOT GO FULL BORE ON THOSE QUESTIONS AND WE ALSO, YOU  KNOW, REALLY HAVE TO SEE WHERE THE ECONOMY GOES, WHERE THE  STATES WHO ARE RELYING -- I THINK IT IS ALASKA, WYOMING  AND NEW MEXICO WHO ARE THE MOST DEPENDENT ON FRACKING,  AND HOW THE ECONOMIC RECOVERY ACT THROUGH THE PANDEMIC GOES,  BECAUSE I JUST DON'T THINK THE COUNTRY IS GOING TO TORPEDO  THREE STATES WHO MAY ALREADY KIND OF BE IN TROUBLE OVER  THIS.

WE ARE OKAY FOR FOUR YEARS.

WE COULD ACTUALLY GET THROUGH THIS ADMINISTRATION WITH NO  NEW LICENSES.

KEYSTONE I DON'T THINK ANYBODY  CARES -- NO ONE IN THEIR RIGHT MIND SHOULD CARE ABOUT  CANADIAN OIL.

>> Gene: THAT WAS FOR CHINA.

IT WASN'T EVEN FOR OUR USE FOR GOD SAKE.

RIGHT.

>> Merritt: DON'T SEE THAT AS  A REAL BIG DEAL, BUT THE REAL TOUCHSTONE EMOTIONAL ISSUES  THAT ACTIVISTS ARE SPOT UP ON AND BRINGING TO THE FOREFRONT  TO POLARIZE PEOPLE FOR WHATEVER PURPOSE.

SO, I DO THINK SHE HANDLED THAT WELL BECAUSE ULTIMATELY  IT IS THE WHITE HOUSE WHO IS MAKING THE DECISION ON THOSE  POLICIES THAT ARE VERY TOUCHY RIGHT NOW.

>> Gene: KRISTELLE, WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT IT, AGAIN,  ASSUMING SUCCESS AND SHE GETS THE NOMINATION AND SHE IS OUR  SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR, YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT, I THINK  SHE MENTIONED 90% OF THE EMPLOYEES DON'T WORK IN  WASHINGTON D.C. OF THOSE 70,000.

THIS IS A REALLY FASCINATING DEPARTMENT BUT I HAVE GOT TO  SAY THESE WESTERN SENATORS HAVE SHOWED THEIR HAND,  RANKING MEMBER BARRASSO FROM WYOMING, THAT ERIC MENTIONED.

MR. LEE FROM UTAH, MS. MURKOWSKI, THESE ARE VERY  DIFFERENT SENATORS WHEN IT COMES TO ENERGY STUFF.

AND I HAVE GOT TO THINK SHE IS THE POINT PERSON FOR ANYTHING  THAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN HERE MOVING AWAY FROM FOSSIL FUELS  ALMOST LIKE SHE IS SET UP FOR IT VERSUS JOE BIDEN, IN A WAY.

SHE IS GOING TO BE THE FACE OF THIS TRANSITION.

IT IS GOING TO BE DIFFICULT.

>> Kristelle: IT WILL BE  DIFFICULT BUT ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I THINK THAT THE  MEDIA THROUGHOUT THIS ENTIRE PROCESS FORGETS IS THAT SHE  REPRESENTS THE PEOPLE FROM THE LAND THAT WE STOLE, SO I THINK  THAT IS KIND OF AN IMPORTANT  PERSPECTIVE TO TAKE AS A CONSIDERATION THAT SHE IS  REPRESENTING THE INDIGENOUS PEOPLES AND, OF COURSE, THEY  HAVE EVERY RIGHT TO SAY SOMETHING ABOUT THE LAND  ESPECIALLY THE YEARS OF TURMOIL THAT WE PUT THEM  THROUGH.

NATIVE PEOPLE HAVE BEEN PUT  THROUGH.

IN TERMS OF THE WESTERN STATES  AND THE LOCAL STATES LIKE I WAS WATCHING THE WAY SHE WAS  ANSWERING A LOT OF THE DEBATE IN THE CONVERSATIONS AND IT IS  TRUE COMMUNICATION STRATEGY WHERE YOU SAY THE WORDS, THIS  IS NOT MY AGENDA, THIS IS THE PRESIDENT'S AGENDA.

I FULLY UNDERSTAND THAT BUT ONE OF THE THINGS THAT PEOPLE  FORGET IN A CONVERSATION ABOUT, YOU KNOW, SECRETARIES  OF THE INTERIOR, ET CETERA, IS THAT THE REASON WHY SHE IS  QUESTIONED SO MUCH IS FASCINATING BECAUSE I THINK  THAT PEOPLE JUST DON'T KNOW HER ENOUGH ON WHAT HER  CAPABILITIES ARE IN TERMS OF MANAGEMENT.

AND ONE OF THE THINGS I ALSO THINK THAT PEOPLE DON'T  REALIZE, ESPECIALLY SINCE WE KNOW THIS IS A NEW MEXICAN,  SHE ACTUALLY WORKS SO MUCH BETTER BEHIND THE SCENES THAN  IN PUBLIC SPEECHES OR WHATEVER IT MIGHT BE.

I LIKE TO COMPARE HER TO SENATOR HEINRICH.

HE IS NOT AS VOCAL AS SENATOR UDALL.

SENATOR UDALL ON THE OTHER HAND IS GUN SLINGING AND AS I  AM WATCHING A LOT OF THE RHETORIC A LOT OF WESTERN  SENATORS ARE SAYING ABOUT ENERGY, ONE OF THE PHRASES  THAT I FOUND FASCINATING THAT I DO BELIEVE SHE FOLLOWS IS,  IT IS INNOVATION, NOT ELIMINATION.

THAT IS A KEY THAT I THINK SHE IS LEADING WITHIN HER, WITHIN  HER NEW DEPARTMENT.

>> Gene: THAT IS THE NEEDLE  SHE HAS TO THREAD RIGHT THERE.

INNOVATION VERSUS JOB LOSS IS  A BIG ISSUE FOR THIS ADMINISTRATION AS THIS THING  GOES ON.

WE HAVE TO HOLD IT THERE AND  KEEP AN EYE ON THE COMMITTEE FOR A VOTE.

WE WANT TO TALK ABOUT HOUSING.

ALBUQUERQUE HAS SEEN ONE OF  THE LARGEST SURGES OF RENTAL PRICES IN THE NATION,  SOMETHING DUE TO TEXT EXAMPLE OF LOW SUPPLY AND HIGH DEMAND  FOR HOUSING.

IT PLAYS OUT FROM CARLSBAD TO  TAOS AND MANY PLACES IN BETWEEN.

NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS CORRESPONDENT, MEGAN KAMERICK,  SAT DOWN WITH UNM LAW  PROFESSOR SERGE MARTINEZ TO TALK ABOUT HOW THESE HIGHER  PRICES MAY AFFECT YOUNGER AND LOWER INCOME PEOPLE AND TENANT  THOMAS HUGHES ABOUT HIS RECENT EXPERIENCE FINDING A PLACE TO  LIVE.

>> Megan: THOMAS AND SERGE  THANK YOU FOR JOINING US TODAY.

THOMAS, YOU HAVE BEEN SEARCHING FOR A PROPERTY TO  RENT FOR AROUND HALF A YEAR.

YOU FINALLY FOUND A PLACE THIS  MONTH.

CAN YOU TELL US ABOUT THE  TRIALS AND TRIBULATIONS THAT MADE THIS SEARCH SO DIFFICULT  AND SO LONG.

>> ABSOLUTELY.

FINDING A SPACE -- FIRST AND FOREMOST WE NEED TO  ACKNOWLEDGE THE PANDEMIC.

IT IS ALWAYS CRAZY TRYING TO  FIND SOMETHING WHEN LOTS AND LEASING AGENTS DON'T WANT TO  SHOW IN PERSON BECAUSE OF THE CONDITION.

I AM VERY SYMPATHETIC WITH THAT.

SAFETY IS INCREDIBLY IMPORTANT, BUT, TRYING TO MOVE  INTO A SPACE SIGHT UNSEEN IS A TERRIFYING ESPECIALLY WITH THE  EXPECTATION, A LOT OF SPACES WE WERE EVEN CONSIDERING, YOU  NEED TO HAVE A LEASING AGREEMENT IN PLACE BEFORE WE  LET YOU SEE IT.

AND THEN IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT,  THEN WE CAN TALK ABOUT CANCELING THE LEASING  AGREEMENT.

THAT DIDN'T SIT RIGHT WITH ME.

THAT WASN'T SOMETHING I WANTED TO DO.

I THOUGHT THAT WOULD BE A ONE OFF BUT I TOURED 16 DIFFERENT  PLACES AND I THREW OUT ABOUT 30 JUST BECAUSE THEIR  EXPECTATION I HAD TO HAVE SOMETHING IN PLACE WITH THEM,  APPROVAL OR LEASING AGREEMENT, BEFORE THEY WOULD LET ME SEE  IT.

>> Megan: A BINDING LEASING  AGREEMENT?

>> Hughes: YES, BINDING  LEASING AGREEMENT.

THEY WERE LIKE, WE WOULD LET  YOU CANCEL THE LEASE IF YOU DIDN'T LIKE IT, BUT THEY SENT  OVER AN ENTIRE COPY OF THE LEASE EXPECTING BINDING  AGREEMENT TO BE SIGNED BEFORE THEY WOULD LET ME SEE IT.

>> Megan: BEFORE YOU SAW IT, WOW.

>> Hughes: THAT SAT WRONG WITH ME.

IT WASN'T LIKE INDEPENDENT LEASING AGENTS.

THESE WERE LARGE RENTAL COMPANIES DOING THIS.

IT WAS KIND OF TERRIFYING.

>> Megan: WHAT ABOUT  APPLICATION FEES?

>> Hughes: WE SAW A LOT OF  THAT.

APPLICATION FEES, THEY WEREN'T  UNREASONABLE.

THEY HOVERED BETWEEN 45 AND  75-DOLLARS.

MOST OF THEM HOVERING AT ABOUT  50.

THAT IS WHAT THEY CLAIMED IT  COST TO RUN A BACKGROUND CHECK AND DO ALL THAT KIND OF STUFF.

THAT SEEMED PRETTY STANDARD.

THEN AND NOW IT WAS A  50-DOLLAR APPLICATION FEE.

>> Megan: DID YOU HAVE TO PAY  A LOT OF THOSE?

>> Hughes: I ENDED UP PAYING  12 OR 13 APPLICATION FEES.

ALL OF THEM ACCEPTED ME BUT  THAT WAS JUST THE PROCESS TO GET IN THE DOOR TO SEE THE  SPACE.

>> Megan: WOW.

OKAY.

THAT CAN ADD UP.

WHERE DID YOU STAY UNTIL YOU FOUND A SPOT?

>> Hughes: I AM FORTUNATE SO MY PARTNER AND I BOTH HAVE  FAMILY IN TOWN.

I STAYED WITH EXTENDED FAMILY  AND THEN VERY BRIEFLY MY GRANDFATHER WHILE HE NEEDED  HELP.

AND MY PARTNER WAS STAYING  WITH HIS PARENTS.

BUT IF WE DIDN'T HAVE THAT IT  WOULD HAVE BEEN ABSOLUTELY TERRIFYING TRYING TO FIND A  SPOT WITH NOWHERE TO STAY.

WE STARTED LOOKING IN EARNEST  MAYBE AUGUST OR SEPTEMBER OF LAST YEAR AND WE HAVE BEEN  TOYING WITH THE IDEA SINCE MARCH OR APRIL OF LAST YEAR,  SO WE WERE DOING ONLINE STUFF BUT FEET TO PAVEMENT STARTED  IN AUGUST AND TOOK UNTIL THIS MONTH TO BE SOMEWHERE.

>> Megan: NEW YORK TIMES RECENTLY REPORTED THAT  ALBUQUERQUE IS SEEING ONE OF THE HIGHEST SURGES IN RENTAL  PRICE INCREASES DURING THE PANDEMIC IN THE NATION.

THAT IS AROUND 8%.

WHY DO YOU THINK WE ARE SEEING  THIS INCREASE RIGHT NOW?

>> Serge: THERE IS LESS  HOUSING AND MORE DEMAND.

THE MATH IS PRETTY  STRAIGHTFORWARD.

WE HAVE IN ALBUQUERQUE SEEN  HOUSING AVAILABILITY GO DOWN, HOUSING AFFORDABILITY GO DOWN  AS WELL AND THE NUMBER OF FOLKS WHO ARE TRYING TO GET  INTO THE PLACES THAT DO BECOME AVAILABLE ARE GROWING.

THERE IS CERTAINLY THE MARKET IS A LOT MORE -- IT IS A LOT  LESS FLUID RIGHT NOW.

PEOPLE AREN'T MOVING AND  ESPECIALLY WHEN IT COMES TO BUYING HOMES.

HOMES ON THE MARKET GET SNATCHED UP VERY QUICKLY RIGHT  NOW.

AND, SOME OF THAT IS PANDEMIC  RELATED BUT SOME OF IT IS ALSO, YOU KNOW, SYSTEMIC STUFF  ABOUT SUPPLY OF HOUSING, AND THE DEMAND FOR IT.

WHAT THOMAS HAS TALKED ABOUT IS PERHAPS, LIKE I SAID, IT  MAY BE SITUATIONAL TO SOME EXTENT IN TERMS OF WHAT WE ARE  SEEING NATIONWIDE ABOUT HOUSING ELASTICITY AND  AVAILABILITY IN THE MARKET RIGHT NOW, BUT THE DIFFICULTY  OF FINDING A PLACE TO LIVE IS ESPECIALLY FOR FOLKS TRYING TO  FIND SOMETHING AFFORDABLE IN ALBUQUERQUE, HAS BEEN GOING ON  FOR QUITE SOME TIME.

THERE IS JUST NOT ENOUGH  HOUSING TO MEET THE NEEDS OR THE RESOURCES FOR THE FOLKS  WHO NEED IT.

>> Megan: IS THERE A  DISCONNECT BETWEEN HOUSING COSTS AND SALARIES?

THAT IS ALSO A DYNAMIC?

>> Serge: ABSOLUTELY.

HOUSING AFFORDABILITY COMES TWO WAYS, RIGHT?

COST OF THE HOUSING AND THE RESOURCES AND THE INCOME OF  THE PEOPLE WHO ARE PAYING IT.

ALBUQUERQUE, LIKE ALMOST EVERY  OTHER PLACE IN THE COUNTRY, YOU CANNOT AFFORD A  TWO-BEDROOM PLACE IF YOU'RE WORKING 40 HOURS AT MINIMUM  WAGE.

THAT IS NOT ATYPICAL.

THAT IS NOT UNUSUAL.

THERE IS NO STATE OR COUNTY  AROUND THE COUNTRY.

THERE ARE PROBABLY THREE  MUNICIPALITIES WHERE YOU CAN.

IN THE STATE OF NEW MEXICO,  ALBUQUERQUE IS NOT UNIQUE.

WE HAVE HOUSING PRICES HAVE  OUTSTRIPPED THE MINIMUM WAGE UNTIL FOLKS WHO ARE DOWN AT  THAT END OF THE MARKET ARE JUST -- THEY ARE PRICED OUT.

THEY CAN'T AFFORD A TWO-BEDROOM APARTMENT UNLESS  YOU WORK MULTIPLE JOBS OR MULTIPLE PEOPLE WORKING OR  DOUBLE UP.

>> Megan: WE HAVE SEEN THIS IN  MANY CITIES WITH AN INFLUX, WE ALL WANT MORE JOBS HERE, WELL  PAYING JOBS, THINGS LIKE NETFLIX, AMAZON IS BUILDING A  WAREHOUSE.

DO WE HAVE ANY INDICATION  THERE IS AN INFLUX OF THAT THAT IS DRIVING SOME OF THESE  DYNAMICS?

>> Serge:   ANY INFLUX LIKE THAT AND FOR BUILDERS AS WELL AS  DEVELOPERS, ECONOMICS POINT TOWARDS HIGHER END OF THE  MARKETS.

IT DIDN'T MAKE ECONOMIC TO  BUILD AFFORDABLE HOUSING WITHOUT SIGNIFICANT SUBSIDIES  OR OTHER WAYS TO MAKE CIRCLES WHO AFFORD IT.

STARTER HOMES WE HAVE SEEN FEWER AND FEWER OF THE STARTER  HOME MARKETS BEING HERE IN ALBUQUERQUE BECAUSE YOU MAKE  MORE MONEY IN BUILDING BIGGER HOUSES.

WHAT THAT DOES, THERE IS MORE HOUSING AVAILABLE FOR THE  PEOPLE WHO HAVE THE MEANS TO DO IT BUT FOR EVERYONE ELSE,  THE SUPPLY IS DECREASING AND DEMAND IS INCREASING AND YOU  SEE WHAT HAPPENS.

THE MATH IS NOT HARD.

>> Megan: WE ARE IN THE MIDDLE OF A PANDEMIC, FINANCIALLY  DEVASTATING.

HOW DOES THIS INCREASE OR  COMPLICATE -- I AM SORRY -- HOW DOES THIS INCREASE THE  COMPLICATION OF LIVING SITUATIONS FOR EVERYONE  INVOLVED?

>> Serge: WHEN YOU HAVE  REDUCED INCOMES, THAT MAKES IT HARD FOR FOLKS TO PAY RENT OR  TO MEET IF THEY WANT TO MOVE INTO A NEW PLACE TO SHOW THEY  MEET ANY INCOME GUIDELINES.

YOU HAVE JUST THE REDUCED  AMOUNT OF MONEY GOING INTO THE SYSTEM, DIS-INCENTIVIZING  LANDLORDS FROM PUTTING PLACES ON THE MARKET IF THEY ARE NOT  ABLE TO GET FOLKS PAYING THE RENTS.

IT IS AN ECOSYSTEM AND WITHOUT THE INFLUX OF MONEY THAT COMES  IN, EVERYBODY SUFFERS.

IF YOU DON'T PRIORITIZE  HOUSING AS SOMETHING THAT WE WANT TO MAKE SURE WE MAKE  ACCESSIBLE TO EVERYBODY.

>> Megan: HAVE YOU HEARD  STORIES LIKE THOMAS'.

YOU'RE HOPING THIS IS  EXTREMELY UNIQUE BUT IT SOUNDS LIKE SOME OF THE THINGS HE IS  ENCOUNTERING ARE SYSTEMIC.

>> Serge: IN MY EXPERIENCE, AT  THE LOWER END OF THE RENTAL MARKET, FOLKS WHO ARE  DESPERATE TO FIND AFFORDABLE HOUSING, AND IT IS A REAL  CHALLENGE TO FIND AFFORDABLE HOUSING BECAUSE THE INVENTORY  IS NOT THERE AND PEOPLE -- MORE NEW PEOPLE ARE BEING  PUSHED INTO A WORSE ECONOMIC SITUATION.

THERE IS MORE COMPETITION FOR AFFORDABILITY.

AND THERE IS NEVER A ONE-TO-ONE MATCH.

THERE ARE A LOT OF PEOPLE WHO ARE IN AFFORDABLE HOUSING THAT  COULD AFFORD MORE BUT FOR WHATEVER REASON THEY ARE NOT,  SO, THERE IS SOMETIMES A MISMATCH BETWEEN SUPPLY AND  DEMAND THAT COMES THAT WAY, BUT THE CITY IS WORKING TO  INCREASE AFFORDABLE HOUSING AND WHATNOT IN TERMS OF  HUNDREDS OF UNITS, WHEREAS THE NUMBERS OF FAMILIES WHO ARE  LOOKING FOR AFFORDABLE HOUSING THE LAST NUMBER I SAW WAS  ABOUT 18,000.

AND THAT WAS A   COUPLE OF YEARS AGO.

SO, THE STORY TO TELL IS ONE THAT, YEAH, THERE IS LOTS OF  FOLKS WHO CANNOT FIND A PLACE TO MEET THEIR NEEDS SO THEY  END UP LIVING IN PLACES THAT ARE LOWER QUALITY, THAT ARE --  THEY ARE DOUBLED UP, CROWDED OR ACCEPTING WHATEVER THEY CAN  GET FROM A LANDLORD WHO KNOWS THEY HAVE THE POWER TO DO  THAT.

>> Megan: SOUNDS LIKE THEY ARE  TAKING ADVANTAGE OF THAT.

THIS UPWARD TREND DOESN'T JUST  PERTAIN TO RENTAL PRICES.

AS YOU MENTIONED, THE  ALBUQUERQUE HOUSING MARKET HAS SEEN SIMILAR JUMPS.

WE HAVE VERY LOW MORTGAGE INTEREST RATES RIGHT NOW.

WHAT DOES THIS MEAN FOR THE FUTURE OF THE MARKET OR FOR  YOUNGER OR LOWER INCOME PEOPLE?

ASSUMING THOMAS WOULD LIKE TO BE A HOMEOWNER SOME DAY.

>> Hughes: WE LOOKED AT HOMEOWNERSHIP.

MY PARTNER AND I HAVE PRETTY SUBSTANTIAL SAVINGS THAT WE  HAVE ACCRUED.

WE WERE LOOKING AT THE  SITUATION OF BEING HOMEOWNERS AS OPPOSED TO RENTERS BECAUSE  WE BOTH INTEND TO BE HERE FOR A LONG TIME.

IT WASN'T FEASIBLE.

THERE WERE NO STARTER HOMES  THAT FIT OUR NEEDS.

I MEAN, GRANTED WE HAD SOME  KIND OF FUNNY DEMANDS.

WE WANTED TO BE IN A DECENT  AREA OF TOWN, BUT APPROACHING 165 TO 200-DOLLARS A SQUARE  FOOT IN THIS CITY IS RIDICULOUS.

WE WANTED TO BE HOMEOWNERS.

IT WASN'T FEASIBLE AT THIS  TIME.

>> Megan: WHAT DOES THAT MEAN  FOR ALBUQUERQUE, SERGE?

>> Serge: I DON'T THINK IT IS  GOOD, RIGHT?

IF YOU CAN ONLY BUY A HOME IF  YOU'RE AT THE HIGH END OF THE MARKET AND NO AFFORDABLE  HOUSING FOR RENTALS AND OTHERS IN THAT END OF THE MARKET,  WHAT WE'LL SEE IS PROBABLY A LESS EXTREME VERSION OF WHAT  YOU SEE IN OTHER PLACES WHERE PEOPLE JUST GET PUSHED OUT,  WHERE THERE IS NO ABILITY FOR YOUNGER PEOPLE, ESPECIALLY, TO  BE ABLE TO BECOME HOMEOWNERS OR FOR FOLKS WHO HAVE  HISTORICALLY, USUALLY PEOPLE OF COLOR, AREN'T ABLE TO HAVE  THAT WEALTH THEY HAVE ALREADY GOT, CAN'T BUY A HOME WHICH IS  A SOURCE OF WEALTH FOR AMERICAN FAMILIES.

YOU'LL SEE THE MARKET CONTINUE TO SPREAD, THE HAVE'S AND HAVE  NOT'S.

DOWN AT THE LOWER END, THAT IS  ALSO A PROBLEM BECAUSE OF THE AVAILABILITY.

PRIORITIZING THIS IS REALLY IMPORTANT, RIGHT?

HOUSING IS A HUMAN RIGHT AND THERE IS A STRAIGHT LINE  BETWEEN MODIFICATION OF IT AND A DECREASE IN HOUSING  STABILITY.

BY TREATING IT AS SOMETHING WE  ARE GOING TO PUT RESOURCES INTO, TO MAKE SURE EVERYONE  HAS ACCESSIBILITY, THAT IS HOW WE ADDRESS THIS PROBLEM NOT BY  HOPING THE MARKET WILL SOLVE THIS.

IT WILL NOT.

IT CANNOT.

>> Megan: THOMAS, AS WE WRAP UP WE HAVE BEEN HEARING WHAT A  HEADACHE THIS PROCESS WAS FOR YOU TO GO THROUGH, ANY ADVICE  FOR SOMEONE TRYING TO NAVIGATE THE MARKET IN ALBUQUERQUE?

>> Hughes: I DON'T NECESSARILY KNOW THAT MY ADVICE IS ANY  GOOD, BUT DO LOTS AND LOTS OF RESEARCH.

THERE ARE ONLINE PORTALS THAT WORK PRETTY WELL.

I GOT A LOT MORE SUCCESS IN PHONE CALLS ACTUALLY.

I KNOW A LOT OF YOUNG PEOPLE ARE SCARED TO PICK UP THE  PHONE AND CALL.

I DON'T KNOW WHAT IT IS.

I KNOW I GET DREAD WHEN I SEE THE PHONE RING BUT CALLING WAS  HELPFUL.

AND, LOOK AT PLACES THAT DON'T  NECESSARILY SAY THEY HAVE AVAILABILITY.

LIKE WHERE I AM RIGHT NOW, A UNIT JUST BECAME AVAILABLE AND  WE SWOOPED RIGHT IN.

IT WAS VERY MUCH A TIMING  THING.

HAD WE NOT ACTED QUICKLY WE  WOULDN'T BE HERE.

SO, BE WILLING TO CIRCLE BACK  IF YOU LIKE SOMETHING, KEEP CONTACTING AND SEE IF THEY  HAVE AVAILABILITY, SEE IF THEY HAVE TIMELINES.

THAT IS BEST I CAN SAY AND HOPE THAT YOU FIND SOMEBODY  HONEST.

I MEAN, THAT IS VERY IMPORTANT  IN THIS PROCESS.

THAT YOU FIND SOMEBODY HONEST.

>> Megan: THANK YOU BOTH FOR TALKING WITH US.

THESE ARE REALLY IMPORTANT ISSUES TO KEEP A SUSTAINABLE  VIABLE COMMUNITY.

THANKS A LOT.

>> Serge: THANKS, MEGAN.

>> Hughes: THANK YOU FOR THE  OPPORTUNITY, MEGAN.

>> Gene: WE HAVE A BUDGET AND  IT IS MOVING AT THE LEGISLATURE.

ON WEDNESDAY THE HOUSE OVERWHELMINGLY PASSED A  FUNDING MEASURE FOR NEXT YEAR.

IT'S ABOUT A 5% INCREASE IN  SPENDING, 4.6 DIRECTLY, WITH A LOT OF MONEY IN IT FOR  PANDEMIC RELIEF IN ONE-TIME COSTS.

AND, ERIC, AS FORMER SENATOR HERE, LET ME ASK YOU THIS, WE  SAW THIS ONE-TIME SPENDING FOR THE LAST ADJUSTED BUDGET AND  LAWMAKERS, UNLESS I AM MISSING SOMETHING, SEEMS TO HAVE  WHETTED THEMSELVES THAT THIS IS A WAY TO WEATHER THE  PANDEMIC.

DO YOU LIKE THIS APPROACH?

IS THIS GOING TO STICK OR IS THIS JUST THE APPROPRIATE WAY  TO HANDLE THE MOMENT?

>> Eric: YOU KNOW, I AM A  BIG -- A LOT OF FOLKS UP THERE, WE HAVE TO HAVE AT  TIMES LIKE THIS, AN ECONOMY STRUGGLING, WE HAVE TO HAVE A  PUBLIC SECTOR FOR GETTING MEANINGFUL EMPLOYMENT IN  GETTING PEOPLE BACK TO WORK AND INVESTING IN CORE SERVICES  FOR PEOPLE, RIGHT?

I THINK IT IS THE   RIGHT THING TO DO.

I KNOW FISCAL CONSERVATIVES ARE SAYING WE NEED TO TIGHTEN  OUR BELT.

I THINK THAT IS THE WRONG  THING TO DO.

I THINK AT THE FEDERAL LEVEL  THERE HAS BEEN A BIG INVESTMENT AND THAT IS PART OF  THIS PACKAGE.

FEDERAL MONEY IS A BIG PART OF  THIS PACKAGE.

>> Gene: TWO TO THREE BILLION  WE ARE ANTICIPATING COMING IN.

>> Eric: THAT IS THE RIGHT  THING TO DO.

WE HAVE TO FIGURE THIS OUT FOR  THE LONG-TERM TO FIND OUT IT HOW FISCALLY SOUND WE NEED TO  BE, BUT I THINK IN THE SHORT TERM WE ABSOLUTELY NEED THE  STATE AND FED'S TO REALLY PUMP SOME MONEY INTO THE ECONOMY  GET PEOPLE BACK TO WORK, BUILD THINGS, MAKE SURE WE HAVE CORE  SERVICES COVERED.

I THINK THAT IS THE RIGHT  APPROACH AND I HOPE THAT MAKES IT THROUGH THE SENATE SIDE AND  FINANCE SIDE.

I THINK IT IS.

I THINK THERE IS AGREEMENT  THAT WE CAN'T START CUTTING BACK NOW IN THE MIDDLE OF A  PRETTY MAJOR ECONOMIC DOWNTOWN, CAUSED BY THE  PANDEMIC.

I THINK IT IS THE RIGHT WAY TO  GO.

>> Gene: PATTY LUNDSTROM HAD  THE SAME THOUGHT.

WELL, THIS IS NOT THE TIME TO  BE CUTTING GOVERNMENT STUFF.

MERRITT, INTERESTINGLY A KEY  PART OF THIS WAS THE REPUBLICAN IDEA FROM THE  WINTER SPECIAL SESSION, YOU MIGHT RECALL, GIVE A BREAK TO  LOW WAGE FRONT LINE WORKERS.

THAT IS PART OF THE BILL  CERTAINLY.

WHAT CAN HOUSE REPUBLICANS DO  WITH THIS AND WIN?

IS THERE SOMETHING IN IT FOR  REPUBLICANS AS WELL.

>> Merritt: I THINK THERE  ABSOLUTELY IS.

I MEAN, CERTAINLY AS KIND OF A  FISCAL HAWK MYSELF, I SEE THIS BUDGET AND I FEEL SINGING.

I THINK, THAT WAS MY MILLENNIAL IMITATION THERE.

I WAS KIND OF SURPRISED IT DIDN'T GET MORE SUPPORT AMONG  REPUBLICANS BECAUSE I FELT LIKE THE ONE-TIME SPENDING,  THE PANDEMIC STIMULUS WAS QUITE MODERATE.

I FELT LIKE THE STATE RECOGNIZES, OKAY, WE HAVE A  BIG INFLUX OF FEDERAL CASH COMING IN AND WE RECOGNIZE  THAT, SO WE DON'T HAVE TO DO AS MUCH WITH OUR OWN FUNDS.

I THOUGHT THE PAY RAISES WERE MODERATE, CONSERVATIVE.

I FELT THIS WAS A PRETTY, AGAIN, RESTRAINED BUDGET DOING  WHAT NEEDS TO BE DONE WITH THE SITUATION WE HAVE, WHICH IS  UNPRECEDENTED.

SO, I WAS QUITE SURPRISED AND  I WAS SO SURPRISED AT HOW THE LEADERSHIP OF THE HOUSE CAUCUS  WAS MIXED WITH MINORITY LEADER FOR THE BUDGET AND WHIP AND  CAUCUS CHAIR MONTOYA AND DOW VOTING AGAINST IT.

I FOUND THAT VERY SURPRISING.

BUT, YOU KNOW, I THINK THERE  ARE SOME REASONS.

THERE IS FRUSTRATION WITH  OTHER BILLS THAT ARE HELD UP.

THAT MAY HAVE SOMETHING TO DO  WITH IT.

BUT, NO, I FELT LIKE IT WAS A  BIG WIN.

I FELT LIKE REPUBLICANS GOT A  LOT.

FISCALLY, I FOUND IT TO BE  QUITE A RESPONSIBLE BUDGET AND I FEEL LIKE WE SHOULD TAKE  THIS AS A WIN AND SAY WE WORKED ACROSS THE AISLE.

WE HAVE A BUDGET THAT MEETS OUR NEEDS BUT MAINTAINS THE  CASH RESERVE WE NEED FOR THE NEXT CRISIS AND WE DON'T KNOW  WHEN THE PANDEMIC WILL END.

>> Gene: ARE YOU COMFORTABLE  WITH THE PLAN THAT WOULD USE A BILLION OF THE STATE'S  2.7 BILLION CASH RESERVE FOR ONE-TIME SPENDING?

THAT IS A PRETTY BIG CHUNK.

YOU OKAY WITH THAT?

>> Merritt: NO BUT GIVEN THE NUMBERS THAT THE REPUBLICANS  HAVE GIVEN THE MINDSET OF BOTH SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE,  PRESIDENT PRO TEM OF THE SENATE AND THE GOVERNOR, I  THINK IT IS THE BEST WE COULD ASK FOR.

SO, I DON'T LOVE IT BUT I DON'T EXPECT TO LOVE THE  BUDGET.

I AM SATISFIED WITH THE  BUDGET.

>> Gene: THAT MAKES SENSE.

>> Eric: JUST REMEMBER ABOUT 700 MILLION IS GOING TO SMALL  BUSINESSES, BY THE WAY.

THERE IS A HUGE CHUNK GOING  DIRECTLY TO HELP SMALL BUSINESS.

JUST TO BE CLEAR.

>> Gene: A LOT OF MONEY GOING  A LOT OF DIFFERENT DIRECTIONS.

YOU'RE EXACTLY RIGHT.

WE ARE TALKING ABOUT 7.4 BILLION.

REBECCA DOW WAS JUST MENTIONED.

SHE HAD AN INTERESTING POINT THAT HER CRITICISM, SORT OF AN  UN-TARGETED APPROACH, TO BOOSTING SPENDING FOR SCHOOLS,  SAYING MORE MONEY SHOULD BE DIRECTED FOR THE DISTRICTS  THAT ARE DOING IN-PERSON LEARNING.

DOES SHE HAVE A POINT?

>> Kristelle:   YOU THINK ABOUT TARGETS.

AM I AIMING AT THE RED TARGET OR THE BLUE TARGET?

I DON'T THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, IN-PERSON SCHOOLS VERSUS  IN-HOME SCHOOLS, RIGHT?

I THINK THE BLANKET STATEMENT  OF EDUCATION JUST NEEDS FUNDING PERIOD IS WHERE IT IS  MOST IMPORTANT.

I DON'T KNOW IF SHE MIGHT HAVE  LIKE A PERSONAL TICK AGAINST SOME OF THE UNIONS MIGHT BE  OUT THERE.

I DON'T KNOW WHAT HER  INTENTIONS MIGHT BE, BUT I THINK THAT IT ALSO GOES BACK  TO FUNDING EDUCATION FROM A K THROUGH 12 PERSPECTIVE JUST  GOES BACK TO THE PRIORITIES OF THE GOVERNOR.

IT IS WHAT SHE PROMISED AND WHAT SHE RAN ON.

IMPROVING SCHOOLS.

EVEN THROUGH THE PANDEMIC,  THAT DEDICATION IS DEFINITELY THERE.

YOU KNOW, IF I WAS TO KIND OF COMMENT HOLISTICALLY ON THE  BUDGET AND HOW DOES THIS LOOK, IN FULL DISCLOSURE I AM A  BOARD MEMBER OF THE NEW MEXICO FOUNDATION FOR OPEN  GOVERNMENT, SOME PEOPLE CALL THEM THE IPRA PEOPLE.

AND, I FOUND THAT I AM GLAD THERE IS SOME SENSE OF  TRANSPARENCY HOW THIS BUDGET HAS GONE SO FAR.

I AM VERY CURIOUS ABOUT HOW CAPITAL OUTLAY WILL BE LAID  OUT.

IF THERE IS SOME TYPE OF  NEGOTIATION WHY THIS BUDGET HAS BEEN SO EASY COMPARED TO  PAST 10 YEARS OF COMPILING THE BUDGET, ESPECIALLY IN THE  PANDEMIC, SOMETHING TELLS ME THAT CAPITAL OUTLAY IS GOING  TO BE UGLY.

I AM HOPING THERE IS A BIG  SENSE OF TRANSPARENCY WITH NEW MEXICO FOUNDATION FOR OPEN  GOVERNMENT ALONG WITH COMMON CAUSE AND OTHERS, THEY ARE  ADVOCATING FOR FULL TRANSPARENCY FROM THE  BEGINNING FOR BOTH THE BUDGET AND CAPITAL OUTLAY PROCESS.

>> Gene: A GREAT PLACE TO FINISH.

THANKS TO OUR PANELISTS.

WE ARE OUT OF TIME.

I AM BACK IN A MOMENT.

TURQUOISE, THAT WAS A  SURPRISE.

WERE YOU LIKE ME ON WEDNESDAY  WHEN YOU FIRST SAW THE NOTICE FROM THE GOVERNOR ON THAT VERY  DAY WE WERE FLINGING DOORS OPEN BECAUSE WE WERE NOW  TURQUOISE.

WHATEVER THE COLOR, IT WAS A  BIT OF GOOD NEWS ON THE HEELS OF THE SNOW, ICE AND COLD  TEMPS IN THE AREA RECENTLY.

GETTING NORTH OF 60 DEGREES  CERTAINLY HELPED THAT AS WELL.

WELL.

WHATEVER THE DETAILS MAY BE, IT DOES FEEL LIKE A CORNER HAS  BEEN TURNED OR AT LEAST WE ARE COMING UP ON ONE.

TIMING COULDN'T BE BETTER.

THERE IS REPORTING THE NATION  COULD SEE A PRETTY ROBUST ECONOMIC RECOVERY ONCE WE  TRULY GET ON TOP OF THIS VIRUS.

OUR LOCAL BUSINESSES ARE READY.

THEY HAVE SLOGGED THROUGH A TOUGH SEASON AND STIMULUS  MONEY IS ITCHING TO BE SPENT, A LOT OF IT.

ALL RIGHT.

THANKS AGAIN FOR JOINING US  AND STAYING INFORMED AND ENGAGED.

WE'LL LEAVE YOU THIS WEEK WITH IMAGES OF THE WONDERFUL ANIMAS  RIVER IN FOUR CORNERS AREA.

STAY SAFE, SEE YOU AGAIN NEXT  WEEK, IN FOCUS.

>>   FUNDING FOR NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS PROVIDED BY THE  MCCUNE CHARITABLE FOUNDATION AND VIEWERS LIKE YOU.