JOHN YANG: Late last month, the head of a Nigerian bank, his wife, son, and three others were killed when the helicopter taking them to Las Vegas, crashed in California's Mojave Desert.

Also late last month, the Army National Guard temporarily halted all its helicopter operations after fatal crashes in Utah and Mississippi, and that followed the Army's temporary grounding late last year of its Osprey aircraft which can function as a helicopter.

These incidents and recent high profile accidents like the one that killed basketball star Kobe Bryant and his daughter in 2020 and 2019 tour helicopter crash in Hawaii that killed seven raise questions in people's minds about the safety of helicopters.

John Goglia is a former member of the National Transportation Safety Board and former chair of the National Coalition for Aviation Education.

John, we may be seeing a lot more helicopters as air taxis are being developed as soon as next year.

Quite simply, our helicopter safe?

JOHN GOGLIA, Former Member, National Transportation Safety Board: Helicopters in the vehicle itself is very safe.

What we're seeing today is a lot of issues with we have pilot issues, and maybe not monitoring their operations well enough.

You know, you mentioned two accidents in Nigeria and fella who died.

And Kobe Bryant.

Both of those were helicopter pilots that disregarded weather cues in order to accomplish the mission.

And that self-imposed pressure that they have on themselves to get the mission done.

Oftentimes, it's the driver behind the event that leads to a crash.

JOHN YANG: In those military ground as we talked about what they call stand downs.

Those were to -- make sure that the crews the pilots understood the operating guidelines, or were they worried about the craft themselves?

JOHN GOGLIA: Most of the time, the craft is pretty reliable.

And there's been a few instances where there was a mechanical problem.

But the real issue is the pilots.

Usually that single pilot operations, especially in the military, let's get it done.

Got a mission to do, I'm going to get it done.

Well, when you're not in a war zone, you have a lot more flexibility.

But sometimes it's difficult for people to separate those two events.

JOHN YANG: Pilot error is more difficult or helicopters trickier, more difficult to fly than fixed wing aircraft?

JOHN GOGLIA: Helicopters require a lot of concentration.

In an airplane, oftentimes, with the automation that's in there that you don't have to focus as much helicopters, you have to maintain your focus from beginning to end.

And so sometimes people will lose their focus and when the consequences are severe.

JOHN YANG: And is there a narrower margin of error with a helicopter than a fixed wing aircraft?

JOHN GOGLIA: Yes, but if you're talking about the pilot, is its concentration that is has to be maintained, you know, and the helicopter industry themselves has taken a page out of the commercial aviation playbook with their safety themes, and really driving down analyzing virtually every mishap that happens, and looking at the cause, and identifying that the pilots are flying today.

So, getting caught up in bad weather.

That's a major contributor to helicopter accidents, fatigue on the part of the pilots, which leads to that lack of concentration, that's a major factor in accidents.

JOHN YANG: Can that problem be addressed with regulations or guidelines about training about recertification?

JOHN GOGLIA: Helicopter industry has a very robust set of regulations, you know, if the pilots not going to follow the guidelines for whether, you know, sooner or later that's going to lead to a bad outcome.

That's not a regulation issue.

That's -- that individual pilot issue.

So I don't know that at this point in time we need additional regulations.

But we need to have a very robust training program which the industry themselves is pushing for, and audit to make sure that the pilots don't lose sight of the fact that they need to maintain their skills and their attention to accomplishing the job not just getting the mission done.

JOHN YANG: Is the pipeline for helicopter pilots with those skills that concentration, that ability to safely fly a helicopter?

Is that big enough?

Or is that is there a supply problem?

JOHN GOGLIA: Is there is a bit of a supply problem, because most of them come out of the military and the military is having problems building their own pilots so that they're not letting them out so much so to speak, that providing additional bonuses to keep them in the military because training takes a lot of resources, a lot of money to train a pilot.

There are commercial trainers, but they're only a fraction compared to what the military supplies.

JOHN YANG: Most people's experience with helicopters these days really is probably sightseeing tours like over Hawaii, the Grand Canyon, a tourist out there about to get on a helicopter.

We're thinking about taking one of these tours, what would you say to them?

JOHN GOGLIA: Well, I've taken them myself.

So I don't think they're particularly dangerous.

But there are certain pilots that like to give the people that are on that helicopter, the thrill of the adventure and I have been on some of those helicopters to an unannounced that I've had throwing rides.

And again, it's up to the individual because he's alone.

He doesn't have the company's representative over his shoulder.

He doesn't have the FAA looking at him until it's something bad happens.

So yes, you need to be concerned, and sometimes, you need to have a conversation if you're chattering a helicopter, that what you expect from that pilot.

So if, you know, if you have it beforehand, say if the weather gets bad, I don't mind if we don't go, you know, so make sure they understand that this is a mission critical.

I don't have to accomplish this, this task getting me from point A to B, that it's okay that we don't go.

JOHN YANG: John Golia, former member of the NTSB.

Thank you very much.

JOHN GOGLIA: Thank you for having me.