>> GUNFIRE IN DOWNTOWN MILWAUKEE REINFORCES CALLS FOR REFORM.

NEW COVID CASES MOUNT ONCE AGAIN.

AND THE BABY FORMULA SHORTAGE REACHES A CRISIS POINT.

I'M FREDERICA FREYBERG.

TONIGHT ON "HERE AND NOW," RESEARCH ON OPINIONS OF DOCTORS ON THE DANGER OF BANNING ABORTION.

HOW PARENTS FIND BABY FORMULA EVEN WHEN THE SHELVES ARE BARE.

WE HEAR FROM BARRON COUNTY'S HEALTH OFFICER, WHERE COVID TRANSMISSION IS NOW IN THE HIGH CATEGORY, AND SENATOR LA TONYA JOHNSON RESPONDS TO GUN VIOLENCE IN MILWAUKEE.

IT'S "HERE AND NOW" FOR MAY 20.

>> FUNDING FOR "HERE AND NOW" IS PROVIDED BY THE FOCUS FUND FOR JOURNALISM >> MILWAUKEE KEEPS BREAKING RECORDS FOR VIOLENT CRIMES, WITH 86 HOMICIDES THIS YEAR SO FAR.

23 MORE THAN THE RECORD SET LAST YEAR.

MOST OF THESE HOMICIDES CAUSED BY GUNFIRE.

THEN A WEEK AGO, THREE SHOOTINGS DOWNTOWN NEAR THE DEER DISTRICT INCLUDING A MASS SHOOTING THAT INJURED 21 PEOPLE.

THE MAYOR THERE HAS NOW IMPOSED A CURFEW FOR PEOPLE UNDER 17 THROUGHOUT THE CITY AND IS WORKING TOWARD ADDITIONAL MEASURES.

WE SAT DOWN WITH DEMOCRATIC STATE SENATOR LATONYA JOHNSON, WHOSE DISTRICT INCLUDES THE ENTERTAINMENT DISTRICT FOR HER RESPONSE.

SO WE TALKED WITH YOU IN 2015 ABOUT GUN VIOLENCE WHEN IT WAS AT RECORD LEVELS THEN.

TODAY, IN 2022, IT'S MUCH WORSE.

WOULD YOU DESCRIBE GUN VIOLENCE IN YOUR CITY AS OUT OF CONTROL?

>> GUN VIOLENCE IN MY CITY IS OUT OF CONTROL.

BECAUSE IT'S TO THE POINT WHERE KIDS ARE GETTING CAUGHT IN THE CROSS FIRES JUST BEING IN THEIR FRONT YARDS.

>> S SO AS WE KNOW, A WEEK AGO THERE WERE THREE SEPARATE SHOOTINGS IN THE DEER DISTRICT, THE ENTERTAINMENT DISTRICT, INCLUDING A MASS SHOOTING.

WHAT WAS YOUR IMMEDIATE REACTION TO THAT?

>> I WAS SADDENED, I WAS ANGRY, FRUSTRATED, BECAUSE IT DIDN'T HAVE TO GET TO THIS POINT.

WE KNOW IN THE CITY OF MILWAUKEE AND, YOU KNOW, THERE ARE JUST TOO MANY GUNS.

AND WE NEED TO CLOSE THE GUN LOOPHOLES TO TRY AND GET SOME OF THESE GUNS OFF THE STREET.

THE REASON WHY I WAS FRUSTRATED IS BECAUSE EVERY YEAR, THIS BECOMES A TOPIC, ESPECIALLY FOR ELECTED OFFICIALS WHO REPRESENT MILWAUKEE.

AND WE CAN NEVER GET HELP, NEVER GET HELP.

BUT YOU KNOW, ONCE IT HITS THE DEER DISTRICT, THEN IT BECOMES AN ISSUE OF CONCERN DURING CAMPAIGN TIME.

AND THIS IS AN ISSUE OF CONCERN EVERY SINGLE DAY FOR THE PEOPLE WHO LIVE HERE.

>> ONE SPECIFIC THING THAT THE MAYOR HAS ANNOUNCED THAT HE IS DOING IS ENFORCING A CITY-WIDE CURFEW ON YOUNG PEOPLE UNDER THE AGE OF 17, AND IMPOSING 100 OR $200 FINES.

DO YOU THINK THAT WILL WORK?

>> I THINK THAT IT'S A START.

I THINK THAT THE MAYOR IS USING WHAT HE HAS AT HIS DISPOSAL.

HE CAN'T SIT THERE AND LET THE CITY CONTINUE TO DECLINE, OR LET INNOCENT CHILDREN BE KILLED ON THE STREET.

SO IF HE'S TRYING TO DO SOMETHING, AND HE'S USING WHAT'S AVAILABLE, AND THE UNFORTUNATE THING IS THAT THE POLICE ARE DOING THEIR JOB.

THEY'RE ARRESTING THESE PEOPLE, THEY'RE RECOVERING THESE GUNS.

THE MAYOR IS DOING HIS PART.

OUR CRIMINAL JUSTICE SYSTEM IS DOING THEIR PART WITH WHAT FEW RESOURCES THAT THEY HAVE.

THE ONLY PEOPLE WHO AREN'T DOING THEIR JOB IS THE STATE LEGISLATURE.

AND WE CAN'T CONTINUE TO ALLOW MILWAUKEE TO SHOULDER THIS BURDEN BY ITSELF.

AND THE ONE THING THAT I REALLY HATE IS WHEN MY COLLEAGUES TALK ABOUT THE VIOLENCE, AND THEN THEY TALK ABOUT POVERTY.

THAT REALLY IRKS ME, BECAUSE THAT SAYS THAT POOR PEOPLE ARE VIOLENT, AND THAT'S NOT THE CASE.

I GREW UP IN LA GRANGE, TENNESSEE, A THREE-ROOM SHACK, NO INDOOR PLUMBING, AND I'VE NEVER BEEN TO JAIL.

YOU KNOW, SO NOT ALL POOR PEOPLE ARE VIOLENT.

AND THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT PEOPLE KNOW.

AND I TRY TO EDUCATE THAT IN THE CAPITOL.

IN MOST CASES, A LOT OF THESE PEOPLE ARE VICTIMS JUST LIKE WE ARE.

THEY'RE TRAPPED IN THE ONLY NEIGHBORHOOD THAT THEY CAN AFFORD TO LIVE IN.

BUT, YOU KNOW, VIOLENCE DOES CAUSE TRAUMA.

AND WHEN PEOPLE ARE LIVING IN NEIGHBORHOODS THAT ARE FILLED WITH TRAUMA, THAT TRAUMA IS GOING TO HAVE A NEGATIVE IMPACT.

AND A LOT OF THAT IS WHAT WE'RE SEEING WITH THE GUN VIOLENCE.

IT'S TRAUMA.

TRAUMA ON TOP OF TRAUMA.

AND WE HAVE TO DO A BETTER JOB OF CREATING BETTER ENVIRONMENTS FOR OUR CHILDREN.

YOU KNOW, OUR KIDS CAN'T GO OUTSIDE AND PLAY.

WE ALWAYS TALK ABOUT FOOD DESERTS IN OUR COMMUNITIES, AND THAT'S A HUGE ISSUE, ESPECIALLY IN TERMS OF OBESITY, BUT WHAT'S AN EVEN GREATER RISK IS PARENTS NOT FEELING SAFE ENOUGH TO LET THEIR KIDS GO OUTSIDE, TO EXERCISE, TO PLAY.

THAT'S A HUGE ISSUE.

AND THAT'S AFFECTING SO MANY OF OUR KIDS IN THE CITY.

>> WHAT IS YOUR MESSAGE TO YOUR CONSTITUENTS AROUND ALL OF THIS?

>> THAT WE ARE TRYING.

I'M TRYING.

THAT AS A BLACK ELECTED, AND I'M TRYING TO PREVENT MYSELF FROM CRYING, HAVING WISCONSIN CARRY THE TITLE OF BEING THE WORST PLACE IN AMERICA FOR A BLACK CHILD, THAT HITS HOME, BECAUSE I'M BLACK.

AND I'M A MOTHER.

HAVING TO ATTEND SO MANY FUNERALS FOR KIDS, THAT'S TRAUMA.

HAVING TO GO TO THE CAPITOL YEAR AFTER YEAR AND BEG FOR HELP, THAT'S TRAUMA.

AND NOT BEING ABLE TO DO ANYTHING ABOUT IT, THAT'S TRAUMA.

BECAUSE AS THE WEATHER GETS WARMER AND PEOPLE ARE EXCITED ABOUT GOING OUTSIDE, OUR KIDS ARE IN THE GREATEST DANGER BECAUSE THEY'RE OUT ON THE STREETS.

AND WE HAVE TO DO BETTER.

I HAVE TO GET MY COLLEAGUES TO CARE.

AND SO MANY TIMES, I'VE BEEN TOLD, WELL, THIS ISN'T HAPPENING IN MY DISTRICT SO IT'S NOT MY ISSUE.

AND I UNDERSTAND, I PROMISE YOU THAT I UNDERSTAND THAT, YOU KNOW, THEY ARE LAW-ABIDING CITIZENS AND THEY DESERVE THE RIGHT TO HAVE THEIR GUNS.

THERE ARE PEOPLE THAT HUNT, THEY DESERVE TO HAVE THEIR GUNS.

BUT WHAT ABOUT WHEN THOSE GUNS ARE BEING USED ON YOUR CHILDREN?

IF THIS WAS THEM, WHAT WOULD THEY DO TO TRY AND SAVE A LIFE?

I DON'T THINK LAW-ABIDING LIFE.

ESPECIALLY SAVING THE LIFE OF INNOCENT CHILDREN.

THERE'S NO REASON THAT A 2 MONTH OLD IN THE CITY SHOULD KNOW WHAT A GUNSHOT FEELS LIKE.

BUT THEY DO.

AND THAT'S TOO MUCH.

IT'S UNACCEPTABLE AND WE HAVE TO DO BETTER.

>> YOU CAN SEE THE EXTENDED INTERVIEW AT PBSWISCONSIN.ORG BY CLICKING ON THE NEWS TAB.

IN OTHER NEWS, AS A BABY FORMULA SHORTAGE WORSENS, PRESIDENT JOE BIDEN PUT IN PLACE THE DEFENSE PRODUCTION ACT.

THAT'S AN EMERGENCY ACTION MEANT FOR TIMES OF WAR, IN ORDER TO EXPEDITE SUPPLY CHAINS AND GET FORMULA BACK ON TO SHELVES.

THE CRISIS FELT ACROSS THE COUNTRY HAS PARENTS SCRAMBLING, GOING STORE TO STORE TO FIND FOOD FOR THEIR BABIES.

WE'RE JOINED BY DR. JASMINE ZAPATA, CHIEF MEDICAL OFFICER AND STATE EPIDEMIOLOGIST AT THE WISCONSIN DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH SERVICES.

AND DOCTOR, THANKS VERY MUCH FOR BEING HERE.

>> THANK YOU.

>> SO HOW CRITICAL IS THIS SHORTAGE IN WISCONSIN?

>> THAT'S A GREAT QUESTION.

THIS IS A VERY CRITICAL SITUATION BECAUSE THERE ARE MANY PARENTS, THERE ARE MANY FAMILIES WHO INDEED, WHEN THEY GO TO THE STORES, CAN'T FIND THE FORMULA THAT THEY NEED FOR THEIR BABIES.

SO THIS IS VERY REAL AND IT'S A VERY CRITICAL SHORTAGE RIGHT NOW.

>> AND INDEED, IT EXISTS IN WISCONSIN AS WELL?

>> YES, MM-HMM.

>> SO WHAT HAVE THE FEDS TOLD YOU ABOUT HOW LONG IT WILL TAKE TO RELIEVE THE SHORTAGE WITH THEIR ACTIONS AND WITH THE MICHIGAN MANUFACTURING PLANT NOW BACK IN OPERATION AFTER BEING CLOSED?

>> GREAT QUESTION.

WE ARE HOPING AND WE'VE HEARD THAT THEY ARE WORKING AS FAST AS POSSIBLE AND HOPEFULLY THERE WILL BE SOME RELIEF VERY SOON BUT WE HAVEN'T GOTTEN AN EXACT DAY OR AN EXACT TIME PERIOD WHERE THE SHELVES WILL BE FULLY STOCKED AND ALL OF THIS GOES AWAY.

WE JUST KNOW SOON.

THERE HAVE BEEN SOME KEY THINGS THAT HAVE TAKEN PLACE EVEN OVER THE PAST WEEK THAT GIVE US HOPE.

>> SO THE DHS WEBSITE DOES HAVE A LIST OF FORMULA ALTERNATIVES THAT PARENTS CAN TURN TO IF THEY CAN'T FIND THEIR REGULAR BRAND.

HOW DOES A PARENT ASSESS WHAT ALTERNATIVES MIGHT WORK FOR THEIR BABY?

>> THAT IS A GREAT QUESTION.

SO IF YOU'RE A PARENT AND YOU HAVE -- OR A FAMILY MEMBER AND YOU HAVE A BABY WHO IS USED TO TAKING A TYPE OF INFANT FORMULA, IN GENERAL, YOUR BABY CAN TAKE ANY OTHER TYPE OF INFANT FORMULA BRAND.

THERE ARE SOME FAMILIES THAT JUST HAVE A CERTAIN BRAND THAT THEIR BABY IS USED TO, SO THE KEY POINT IS THAT YOU CAN TAKE ANY OTHER TYPE OF INFANT FORMULA BRAND.

THERE ARE JUST A FEW KEY THINGS THAT ARE VERY IMPORTANT TO WATCH OUT FOR, AND TO AVOID THAT CAN BE HARMFUL FOR THE BABY.

SO IT'S OKAY TO SHIFT TO DIFFERENT BRANDS, BUT THINGS TO WATCH OUT FOR AND NOT TO DO IS TO FEED YOUR BABY COW'S MILK OR EVEN PLANT BASED MILKS, ESPECIALLY FOR BABIES WHO ARE UNDER 1 YEAR OF AGE, THAT CAN BE VERY HARMFUL TO DO, SO AVOID THAT.

AVOID WATERING DOWN FORMULAS TO MAKE THEM STRETCH.

THAT CAN BE VERY DANGEROUS FOR BABIES.

AND THEN AVOID HOMEMADE RECIPES.

BUT OTHER THAN THAT, IF YOU ARE LOOKING FOR JUST DIFFERENT BRANDS OF FORMULAS, THAT IS OKAY.

>> WHAT IF EVEN THE ALTERNATIVES ARE OUT OF STOCK AND THE SHELVES ARE SIMPLY BARE, WHAT THEN?

>> THOSE ARE SOME GREAT QUESTIONS.

IF THE SHELVES ARE BARE, THERE'S A LOT OF DIFFERENT THINGS THAT YOU CAN DO.

YOU CAN GO ONLINE TO RETAILERS THAT YOU TRUST, REPUTABLE ONLINE SOURCES.

THERE HAVE BEEN FAMILIES WHO HAVE FOUND SUCCESS WITH THAT.

ALSO GOING TO LOCAL CHARITIES AND LOCAL FOOD BANKS, THEY HAVE BEEN HELPFUL.

ALSO CONTACTING YOUR LOCAL WIK C OFFICE, THEY HAVE BEEN HELPFUL DIRECTING PEOPLE TO RESOURCES.

ADDITIONALLY, IF YOU'RE IN A SITUATION WHERE YOU HAVEN'T BEEN ABLE TO FEED YOUR BABY AND IT'S A DIRE SITUATION, CALL YOUR HEALTHCARE PROVIDER, BECAUSE YOUR HEALTHCARE PROVIDER CAN HELP GUIDE YOU THROUGH SOME THINGS THAT YOU CAN DO, SOME OPTIONS IN EMERGENCY SITUATIONS.

SO TALK TO YOUR BABY'S HEALTHCARE PROVIDER IF YOU ARE COMPLETELY OUT AND THEY MIGHT BE ABLE TO HELP AS WELL.

>> SO WE HEARD FROM A COMMUNITY CLINIC IN GREEN BAY THAT MOMS ARE TAKING TO SOCIAL MEDIA TO ALERT EACH OTHER WHERE TO FIND FORMULA.

SOMETIMES VISITING MULTIPLE STORES AND STILL COMING UP SHORT.

WHAT, AGAIN, IS YOUR ADVICE FOR PARENTS WHO FIND THEMSELVES IN THIS REALLY VERY SCARY KIND OF CIRCUMSTANCE?

>> YES.

IT DEFINITELY CAN BE A SCARY CIRCUMSTANCE IF YOU'RE LOOKING ALL OVER AND YOU CAN'T FIND FORMULA OR FOOD FOR YOUR BABY.

I WOULD SAY THAT THE MOST IMPORTANT THING TO DO IS TO CALL YOUR BABY'S HEALTHCARE PROVIDER TO ALERT THEM OF THE SITUATION.

BEFORE YOU TAKE FORMULA AND WATER IT DOWN OR MAKE YOUR OWN, YOU SHOULD CALL YOUR BABY'S HEALTHCARE PROVIDER BECAUSE THEY CAN TALK YOU THROUGH SOME OPTIONS THAT YOU CAN DO FOR YOUR BABY AND THEY MIGHT BE ABLE TO HELP YOU AS WELL.

ANOTHER OPTION IS CONTACTING SOME MILK BANKS, SOME CERTIFIED MILK BANKS, BECAUSE RIGHT NOW THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO ARE LACTATING AND PRODUCING MILK FOR THEIR OWN BABIES THAT THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO ARE WILLING TO DONATE THAT AS WELL, SO THAT'S SOMETHING AS AN ALTERNATIVE YOU CAN LOOK TO, AND OF COURSE LOOK AT THE DHS WEBSITE TO LOOK FOR SOME RESOURCES.

>> THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR TALKING WITH US, DR. JASMINE ZAPATA.

THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU SO MUCH.

>> IN PANDEMIC NEWS, THIS WEEK THE U.S.

MARKED 1 MILLION DEATHS CAUSED BY COVID-19 SINCE THE START OF THE OUTBREAK.

NOW COVID-19 CASES ARE ON THE RISE AGAIN.

18 WISCONSIN COUNTIES ARE NEWLY DESIGNATED WITH HIGH LEVELS OF COVID COMMUNITY TRANSMISSION, ACCORDING TO A NEW ASSESSMENT TOOL FROM THE CENTERS FOR DISEASE CONTROL.

BARRON COUNTY IN NORTHERN WISCONSIN IS ONE OF THESE.

WE CHECK IN WITH BARRON COUNTY PUBLIC HEALTH OFFICER LAURA SAUVE.

THANKS VERY MUCH FOR BEING HERE.

>> THANKS FOR HAVING ME.

>> SO THE STATE REPORTS THAT COVID CASES HAVE GONE UP AT LEAST 50% IN THE LAST TWO WEEKS.

WHAT KIND OF INCREASES ARE YOU SEEING IN YOUR COUNTY?

>> WE'RE ACTUALLY SEEING IN THE LAST FOUR WEEKS A FAIRLY STEADY RATE OF CASES.

WE'VE BEEN IN THE HIGH RISK RANGE ON AND OFF FOR FOUR WEEKS AS WELL.

>> SO WHAT'S HAPPENING IN BARRON COUNTY TO YOUR UNDERSTANDING?

>> SO WE'RE NOT SEEING ONE LARGE OUTBREAK THAT'S SPURRING THIS.

WE'RE REALLY SEEING, WHEN WE TALK TO PEOPLE, THAT IT STILL IS SPREAD MOSTLY WITHIN A FAMILY UNIT OR WITHIN SOCIAL SETTINGS, PEOPLE GOING TO AN EVENT AND NOW WE'RE SEEING A COUPLE OF PEOPLE COMING DOWN WITH THIS AND THEN SPREADING TO OTHER PEOPLE WITHIN THEIR SOCIAL CIRCLE.

>> SO HOW CONCERNING IS THIS TO YOU AS THE PUBLIC HEALTH OFFICER THERE?

>> YOU KNOW, I THINK WE'RE ALWAYS CONCERNED ABOUT ANYTHING THAT'S GOING TO MAKE PEOPLE ILL.

ESPECIALLY THE REASON THAT WE'RE IN HIGH RISK IS BECAUSE WE ARE SEEING MORE HOSPITALIZATIONS, AND THE CDC'S NEW DESIGNATION TAKES INTO ACCOUNT THE NUMBER OF CASES AS WELL AS HOW MANY PEOPLE ARE BEING HOSPITALIZED AND HOW MANY AVAILABLE HOSPITAL BEDS WE HAVE.

SO WE'RE ALWAYS CONCERNED JUST LIKE FROM THE BEGINNING OF THE PANDEMIC, WHERE WE WANTED TO SLOW THE CURVE AND PROTECT OUR HOSPITAL SYSTEMS, WE'RE REALLY LOOKING TO PROTECT OUR MEDICAL SYSTEM SO THAT, IF I GET IN A CAR ACCIDENT OR HAVE A HEART ATTACK, I CAN STILL GET THE QUALITY CARE WE'RE USED TO.

>> HAVE YOU SEEN ANY DISCERNIBLE CHANGE IN PREVENTIVE BEHAVIOR, LIKE INDOOR MASK WEARING AS RECOMMENDED BY STATE HEALTH OFFICIALS AMONG THE PUBLIC THERE IN RESPONSE TO THIS?

>> I WOULD SAY WE DON'T SEE A LOT OF MASK WEARING IN OUR RURAL COMMUNITIES AS A WHOLE.

THAT IS THE ONE THING THAT HELPS PROTECT US AND OUR NEIGHBORS THAT WE WOULD ENCOURAGE PEOPLE TO CONTINUE TO DO, ESPECIALLY WHEN WE'RE IN THIS RED HIGH RISK TIME.

>> DO YOU SUSPECT THAT THE NUMBERS IN YOUR COUNTY AND ELSEWHERE ARE ACTUALLY HIGHER BECAUSE MANY PEOPLE TEST POSITIVE WITH THESE HOME TESTS?

>> OH, YES.

WE BELIEVE THAT OUR NUMBERS ARE A VAST UNDERCOUNT OF THE NUMBER OF POSITIVE TESTS AND POSITIVE CASES THAT ARE ACTUALLY CIRCULATING WITHIN OUR COMMUNITY AT THIS TIME.

>> DID PUBLIC HEALTH OFFICIALS LIKE YOURSELF THINK THAT WE WOULD BE IN THIS PLACE AGAIN AT THIS TIME?

IT KIND OF SEEMED LIKE WE HAD A HANDLE ON THIS.

>> RATE.

I THINK THE AMOUNT OF HOPE WE HAD IN EARLY 2021, WHEN THE NEW VACCINES WERE COMING OUT AND WE WERE SO HOPEFUL THAT WE WERE GOING TO SEE THE ENDS OF THIS THROUGH VACCINATION EFFORTS, I THINK IT'S BEEN SOUL CRUSHING, TO BE HONEST, THAT THAT DIDN'T COME ABOUT.

WERE HOWEVER, THE PEOPLE WHO ARE GETTING VACCINATED AND SOME OF THOSE PEOPLE WHO HAVE HAD PREVIOUS INFECTIONS ARE NOT GETTING, USUALLY, AS SERIOUS OF INFECTIONS THIS TIME AROUND.

SO WE STILL ENCOURAGE PEOPLE TO GET VACCINATED.

>> BECAUSE I NOTE THAT BARRON COUNTY HAS A FULLY VACCINATED AND BOOSTED RATE OF 29%.

THAT SEEMS LOW TO ME.

WHAT'S YOUR COMMENT ON THAT?

>> WE ARE SEEING ABOUT HALF OF OUR POPULATION WHO HAVE HAD THE INITIAL DOSE OF THE VACCINES, AND WE ARE ACTIVELY AT PUBLIC HEALTH AND OUR HEALTHCARE PARTNERS ARE ACTIVELY OFFERING THE BOOSTERS AND ENCOURAGING PEOPLE TO DO THAT.

HERE AT PUBLIC HEALTH, WE'RE GOING INTO OUR LONG-TERM CARE FACILITIES TO MAKE SURE ALL OF OUR MOST VULNERABLE RESIDENTS ARE FULLY VACCINATED AND HAVE HAD THEIR FIRST AND SECOND BOOSTERS.

YOU KNOW, WE JUST CONTINUE TO ENCOURAGE PEOPLE AND MAKE THE VACCINE AS AVAILABLE AS POSSIBLE FOR PEOPLE.

>> YOU SPOKE TO HOSPITALIZATIONS AND HOW THAT HAS LED TO THE HIGH KIND OF CATEGORY IN YOUR COUNTY.

IS THERE A DANGER AT THIS TIME THAT THOSE HOSPITALS ARE KIND OF REACHING ANY KIND OF CAPACITY?

>> I HAVE NOT SEEN THAT.

HOWEVER, I HAVE SEEN IT AS NORTHWESTERN WISCONSIN, OUR HEALTHCARE EMERGENCY RESPONSE COALITION PUTS OUT A REPORT ON A WEEKLY BASIS, AND THERE ARE SOME CONCERNS THAT SOME OF OUR HIGHER LEVEL CARE FACILITIES, WHERE WE MIGHT TRANSFER SOMEONE WHO MIGHT BE MORE SEVERELY ILL, ARE SEEING LIMITED SPACE AGAIN, SO THAT ABILITY TO TRANSFER T THE MORE SERIOUSLY ILL PEOPLE MIGHT BE MORE LIMITED.

I WOULD HATE TO GIVE YOU THE WRONG INFORMATION ABOUT OUR SPECIFIC HEALTHCARE ENTITIES.

BUT THAT'S WHAT I KNOW ON A REGIONAL BASIS RIGHT NOW.

>> ALL RIGHT.

WELL, WE APPRECIATE YOUR WORK AND YOUR TIME TALKING WITH US ON THIS, LAURA SAUVE.

THANKS.

>> THANK YOU.

>> ALSO THIS WEEK, THE LEAKED SUPREME COURT DRAFT OPINION TO OVERTURN ROE V. WADE CONTINUES TO PLAY OUT AS A POLITICAL BATTLE.

THIS WEEK, REPUBLICAN SCOTT FITZGERALD FROM THE FIFTH CONGRESSIONAL DISTRICT GAVE REMARKS DURING A HOUSE JE JUDICY COMMITTEE MEETING ON ABORTION CARE ACCESS.

>> I BELIEVE EVERY HUMAN LIFE IS PRECIOUS AND SHOULD BE PROTECTED AT EVERY STAGE.

IF THE LEAKED SUPREME COURT OPINION ENDS UP BEING THE FINAL PRODUCT AND OVERTURNS ROE VERSUS WADE, IT WOULD BE A FANTASTIC VICTORY FOR LIFE AND FOR THE BABIES.

THE PRO-LIFE MOVEMENT HAS BEEN DECADES WORKING ON THIS MOVEMENT.

>> FOR HIS PART, DEMOCRATIC GOVERNOR TONY EVERS SPOKE AT A RALLY IN SUPPORT OF ABORTION OPTIONS AT THE STATE CAPITOL.

>> THE DECISION BY THE SUPREME COURT TO OVERTURN ROE AND DECADES OF WELL ESTABLISHED PRECEDENT WILL HAVE A DISASTROUS CONSEQUENCE FOR FOLKS IN EVERY CORNER OF OUR COUNTRY AND OUR STATE, AND THAT INCLUDES SO MANY WISCONSIN WOMEN AND THEIR FAMILIES, AND WE ALSO KNOW THAT THIS IMPACTS -- THE IMPACTS OF THIS DECISION WILL ESPECIALLY BE BORNE BY LOW INCOME FOLKS AND WISCONSINITES OF COLOR ALSO.

>> ONE REETCHER WANTS TO KNOW HOW WISCONSIN DOCTORS FELT ABOUT ABORTION.

TWO SURVEYS OF PHYSICIANS CONDUCTED BY THE UW COLLABORATIVE FOR REPRODUCTIVE EQUITY SHOW THAT THE OVERWHELMING NUMBER OF WISCONSIN DOCTORS FAVOR ABORTION AS PART OF THE WOMEN'S HEALTHCARE.

WE TURN TO THE COLLABORATIVE'S DIRECTOR, JENNY HIGGINS, PROFESSOR OF OBSTETRICS AND GYNECOLOGY AND GENDER AND WOMEN STUDIES.

THANKS VERY MUCH FOR BEING HERE.

>> THANKS FOR HAVING ME AND PAYING ATTENTION TO THIS ISSUE.

I APPRECIATE IT.

>> SO WHY DID YOU CONDUCT THIS SURVEY OF UW SCHOOL OF MEDICINE PUBLIC HEALTH PHYSICIANS?

>> WE SOMETIMES HAVE THIS SENSE BECAUSE OF THE WAY ABORTION IS COVERED IN THE MEDIA THAT THERE IS A 50/50 BREAK DOWN OF PEOPLE WHO FEEL SUPPORTIVE OF OR ARE AGAINST ABORTION, AND SEEMING IMPORTANCE TO DOCUMENT THE PRECISE NUMBER OF PHYSICIANS IN PARTICULAR WHO FELT SUPPORTIVE OF ABORTION OR CONCERNED ABOUT ABORTION RESTRICTIONS IN PART BECAUSE AS PHYSICIANS, THEY'RE THE BEST PEOPLE TO BE IN A POSITION TO MAKE THE EVIDENCE-BASED DECISIONS ABOUT REPRODUCTIVE HEALTHCARE.

>> SO WHAT DID THE SURVEY FIND THEN?

>> WE FOUND OVERWHELMINGLY THAT PHYSICIANS NOT ONLY ARE SUPPORTIVE OF ABORTION, BUT THAT THEY THINK THAT WOMEN'S HEALTH IN WISCONSIN WILL GET WORSE IF ROE V. WADE IS OVERTURNED.

SO 91% OF OVER 900 PHYSICIANS WE SURVEYED SAID THAT WOMEN'S HEALTH IN OUR STATE WOULD GET WORSE IF ABORTION WERE TO BECOME ILLEGAL.

OVER 90% OF PHYSICIANS ALSO EXPRESSED AT LEAST SOME LEVEL OF CONCERN ABOUT LEGISLATIVE INTERFERENCE AND THE DOCTOR-PATIENT RELATIONSHIP.

>> FIRST, HOW WOULD IT GET WORSE FOR WOMEN?

>> WELL, WE DIDN'T ASK THAT IN THAT PARTICULAR STUDY.

IN ANOTHER STUDY, WE INTERVIEWED ABOUT 23 HEALTHCARE PROVIDERS WHO ARE MORE SPECIFICALLY INVOLVED IN REPRODUCTIVE HEALTHCARE AND ABORTION CARE, SO NOT A GENERAL POPULATION OF PHYSICIANS BUT THIS WAS NOW A MORE SPECIALIZED POPULATION OF PHYSICIANS, AND WE ASKED THEM SOME OF THEIR FEELINGS ABOUT WHAT MIGHT HAPPEN AS A RESULT IF ROE IS OVERTURNED.

THEY DESCRIBED A NUMBER OF CONCERNS THEY HAD ABOUT THAT, ONE BEING BOTH SHORT AND LONG TERM NEGATIVE IMPACTS ON HEALTH AND WELL-BEING, SO AS AN EXAMPLE, CARRYING A PREGNANCY TO TERM AND GIVING BIRTH IS INHERENTLY MUCH MORE RISKY THAN GETTING A FIRST TRIMESTER ABORTION, SO JUST BY BEING FORCED TO HAVE PREGNANCIES AND GIVE BIRTH THAT PEOPLE WEREN'T EXPECTING TO, THEIR RATE OF MATERNAL MORBIDITY AND MORTALITY CAN GO UP.

ALSO THE EMOTIONAL AND SOCIAL CONSEQUENCES OF NOT BEING ABLE TO OBTAIN ABORTIONS, PHYSICIANS IN OUR SURVEY REPORTED THAT PEOPLE WOULDN'T DO AS WELL IF THEY WEREN'T ABLE TO -- THEY AND THEIR CHILDREN WOULDN'T DO AS WELL IF THEY WEREN'T ABLE TO RECEIVE THE ABORTIONS THEY WANTED TO HAVE.

>> SO WHAT WOULD LEGISLATIVE INTERFERENCE LOOK LIKE?

>> IT'S A GOOD QUESTION, AND THAT QUESTION WAS WRITTEN IN A VERY BROAD WAY.

WE WERE INTERESTED IN -- WE WANTED TO SEE A LITTLE BIT AS DID PHYSICIANS FEEL SOMEHOW DIFFERENTLY ABOUT ABORTION RELATED INTERFERENCE VERSUS OTHER TYPES OF LEGISLATIVE INTERFERENCE, BUT I THINK WHAT I TOOK AWAY FROM THAT FINDING WAS THAT IN GENERAL, AT LEAST THE PHYSICIANS WE SURVEYED, THERE WAS A SENSE OF IF -- THAT WE AS PHYSICIANS OR I AS A PHYSICIAN AM IN THE BEST PLACE TO MAKE DECISIONS ABOUT HEALTHCARE OR HOW HEALTHCARE SERVICES SHOULD OCCUR AS OPPOSED TO PEOPLE WHO DON'T HAVE THAT BACKGROUND.

BUT MOSTLY I THINK IT'S JUST AN INDICATION THAT PHYSICIANS IN OUR STATE WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY ARE THE ONES WHO ARE ENSURING THAT HEALTHCARE PROGRAMS OCCUR IN A CERTAIN WAY.

>> DOES THERE EXIST A STIGMA AROUND THE PROCEDURE, EVEN FOR PHYSICIANS WHO SUPPORT IT MEDICALLY?

>> YEAH, THERE'S TREMENDOUS STIGMA AROUND THE PROCEDURE, AND WE FOUND THIS IN OUR SURVEY AS WELL, SO ONE WAY IT'S MANIFESTED IS THAT WHILE, ON AVERAGE, PEOPLE IN OUR SURVEY WERE INCREDIBLY SUPPORTIVE OF ABORTION, THEY PERCEIVED THEIR PEERS TO BE LESS SUPPORTIVE ON AVERAGE, RIGHT?

IN PART BECAUSE ABORTION IS STIGMATIZED.

SO EVERYONE FEELS AS IF EVERYONE ELSE IS A LITTLE LESS SUPPORTIVE THAN THEY ARE, WHEN IN FACT THE NORM IS TO BE QUITE SUPPORTIVE.

THEY ALSO -- A SIGNIFICANT NUMBER OF PHYSICIANS IN OUR SURVEY SAID THAT THEY WORRIED ABOUT ALIENATING THEIR PEERS OR THEIR PATIENTS IF THEY WERE TO TAKE A PUBLIC STANCE ABOUT ABORTION.

AGAIN, SUGGESTING THAT THERE'S SOME SOCIAL STIGMA SURROUNDING THIS TOPIC.

>> VERY, VERY COMPLICATED STUFF.

JENNY HIGGINS, THANKS VERY MUCH.

THANKS FOR JOINING US.

>> TAKE CARE.

>> THE BOARD OF REGENTS THIS WEEK NAMED THE NEW CHANCELLOR OF UW-MADISON.

JENNIFER MNOOKIN WILL TAKE THE HELM OF THE FLAGSHIP CAMPUS IN AUGUST.

SHE'S CURRENTLY DEAN OF THE UCLA LAW SCHOOL.

NO SOONER HAD SHE BEEN NAMED THAN LEGISLATIVE REPUBLICANS TORCHED HER HIRE.

STEVE NASS, VICE CHAIR OF THE SENATE UNIVERSITIES COMMITTEE CALLED IT QUOTE RIDICULOUS.

SAYING JENNIFER MNOOOKIN HAS A VERY CLEAR HISTORY OF ADVOCATING FOR THE FORCED INDOCTRINATION OF COLLEGE STUDENTS WITH CRITICAL RACE THEORY.

>> WHEN I GET TO MADISON, I'D LOLOVE TO TALK IN GREAT DETAIL ABOUT CRITICAL RACE THEORY.

THERE'S A LOT OF DIFFERENT PERSPECTIVES ON IT, AND IT'S BECOME SOMETHING THAT WHEN PEOPLE ENGAGE WITH, I'M NOT EVEN SURE THEY'RE TALKING AT ALL ABOUT THE SAME THING.

>> BY WAY OF DISCLOSURE, PBS WISCONSIN IS PART OF UW-MADISON.

FOR MORE ON THIS AND OTHER ISSUES FACING WISCONSIN, VISIT OUR WEBSITE AT PBSWISCONSIN.ORG AND THEN CLICK ON THE NEWS TAB.

THAT'S OUR PROGRAM FOR TONIGHT.

I'M FREDERICA FREYBERG.

HAVE A GOOD WEEKEND.

>> FUNDING FOR "HERE AND NOW" IS PROVIDED BY THE FOCUS FUND FOR JOURNALISM AND FRIENDS OF PBS WISCONSIN.