>>> Announcer: THE FOLLOWING PROGRAM IS PART OF THE "HERE "HERE & NOW" LET'S COVERAGE.

THE HEAVILY CONSTITUTE NATEED AND ANTICIPATED ELECTION DAY IN WISCONSIN CAME AND WENT, AND FOR THE MOST PART, WITHOUT INCIDENT, REASSURING VOTERS AND OFFICIALS OF WISCONSIN'S ELECTION PROCESS.

I'M FREDERICA FREYBERG, AND TONIGHT, ON "HERE & NOW," ZAC SCHULTZ BREAKS DOWN TUESDAY'S RESULTS, AND WE HEAR ANALYSIS FROM TWO POLITICAL SCIENTISTS FROM TWO SIDES OF THE STATE, AND WHAT TUESDAY'S TURNOUT TELLINGS US ABOUT WISCONSIN'S ELECTORATE.

IT'S "HERE & NOW" FOR NOVEMBER 11th.

>> Announcer: FUNDING FOR "HERE & NOW" IS PROVIDED FOR THE FOCUS FUND FOR JOURNALISM AND FRIENDS OF PBS WISCONSIN.

♪ >> Frederica: TUESDAY'S MIDTERM ELECTION MAINTAINED WISCONSIN'S BRAND OF A DIVIDED STATEWIDE ELECTORATE.

REPUBLICAN U.S.

SENATOR, RON JOHNSON, WON RE-ELECTION WITH A NARROW VICTORY OVER HIS OPPONENT.

IN THE RACE FOR GOVERNOR, DEMOCRATIC INCUMBENT, TONY EVERS, WON 51% TO 47% OVER THE REPUBLICAN, TIM MICHAELS.

FOR ATTORNEY GOVERNOR, CALL DEFEATS ERIC TONY, AND IN THE ELECTION FOR SECRETARY OF STATE, DEMOCRATIC INCUMBENT HOLDS A .3% MARGIN OVER HIS REPUBLICAN CHALLENGER, AMY.

SENIOR POLITICAL REPORTER, ZAC SCHULTZ HAS BROUGHT US COVERAGE THROUGHOUT THE ELECTION SEASON AND WAS ON HAND AS THE RESULTS CAME IN.

[CHANTING] >> THANK YOU!

[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE] HELLO, WISCONSIN!

[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE] >> Reporter: IT WAS A LONG WAIT, BUT WHEN GOVERNOR TONY EVERS TOOK TO THE STAGE JUST BEFORE 1:00 A.M. WEDNESDAY MORNING, HE DECLARED VICTORY WITH ONE OF HIS FAVORITE SAYINGS.

>> HOLY MACKEREL, FOLKS, HOW ABOUT THAT?

>> Reporter: HE RELIES ON HIS STYLE.

>> THAT'S WHO I AM AND ALWAYS BEEN.

SOME CALL IT BORING, BUT WISCONSIN, AS IT TURNS OUT, BORING WINS.

[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE] >> Reporter: GIVING CREDIT TO SUPERCHARGED TURNOUT AMONG YOUNG VOTERS, ESPECIALLY COLLEGE STUDENTS, AND DEMOCRATS WHO WERE MOTIVATED BY THE ISSUE OF ABORTION RIGHTS.

>> SHOWED UP FOR EACH OTHER, YOU SHOWED UP FOR THE REPRODUCTIVE RIGHTS AND FREEDOM FOR YOU.

[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE] THE FREEDOM FOR YOU AND YOUR NEIGHBORS TO MAKE THEIR OWN HEALTHCARE DECISIONS WITHOUT HAVING TO ASK ME OR ANY OTHER ELECTED OFFICIAL.

[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE] >> Reporter: ACROSS THE STATE IN MILWAUKEE, EVERS' FORMER LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR, BARNES, WAS NOT ABLE TO CELEBRATE IN THE U.S. SENATE RACE.

HE CONSISTENTLY UNDERPERFORMED EVERS' MARGINS BY ABOUT 2%, AND HIS SUPPORTERS WERE SENT OFF WITH BARNES TRAILING INCUMBENT REPUBLICAN RON JOHNSON.

>> OUR ELECTIONS HAVE RAZOR THIN MARGINS, AND THIS U.S. SENATE RACE IS NO DIFFERENT.

THIS RACE IS FAR TOO CLOSE TO CALL TONIGHT.

>> Reporter: AND JOHNSON SENT SUPPORTERS HOME WITH MORE OPTIMISM.

>> WE LOOKED VERY CLOSELY AT THE NUMBERS.

WE FEEL VERY CONFIDENT THAT THERE'S NO WAY THAT THEY CAN REALLY MAKE UP THAT GAP, BUT, YOU KNOW, I'M NOT -- I'M NOT GOING TO, YOU KNOW, DECLARE VICTORY UNTIL ALL THE NUMBERS ARE IN, BUT I JUST WANTED TO GIVE YOU GUYS THE SENSE THAT THIS RACE IS OVER, YOU KNOW.

[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE] >> Reporter: BY NOON ON WEDNESDAY, BARNES WAS READY TO CONCEDE.

>> NOW, UNFORTUNATELY, WE DIDN'T GET TO THE FINISH LINE THIS TIME, BUT THE MOVE MEANT SO MUCH TO ALL OF US WHERE JUST BECAUSE WE DIDN'T CROSS THE FINISH LINE, IT DOES NOT MEAN IT'S OVER.

>> Reporter: BETWEEN THE GUBERNATORIAL AND SENATE RACE, CANDIDATES IN GROUPS SPENT MORE THAN $3 00 MILLION, AND VOTERS WERE FLOODED WITH NONSTOP NEGATIVE ADS.

JOHNSON WAS ONLY TALKING ABOUT HIS RACE, BUT HIS COMMENTS ON ELECTION NIGHT SEEMED TO SUM UP THE CURRENT POLITICAL ENVIRONMENT.

>> IT'S A LITTLE DEPRESSING, ISN'T IT?

THAT LIES ARE THAT EFFECTIVE, AND IF YOU EVER WONDER, QUITE HONESTLY, WHY MORE GOOD PEOPLE DON'T RUN FOR OFFICE, I WOULD JUST RECOMMEND PEOPLE LOOK AT THE WISCONSIN U.S. SENATE RACE IN YEAR 2022.

>> Reporter: MEANWHILE, BACK IN MADISON, THE SELF-DESCRIBED BORING TONY EVERS WAS READY TO DANCE THE NIGHT AWAY TO CELEBRATE FOUR MORE YEARS IN OFFICE.

>> WE'RE GOING TO POLKA TONIGHT AND GET BACK TO WORK TOMORROW.

THANK YOU, WISCONSIN, WE LOVE YOU!

[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE] >> Reporter: REPORTING FROM MADISON, I'M ZAC SCHULTZ, FOR "HERE & NOW."

>> Frederica: SO GOVERNOR EVERS DANCED THE ELECTION NIGHT AWAY AND HIT THE CODE FOR A VICTORY TOUR OF K-12 SCHOOLS ACROSS THE STATE.

STUDENTS VISITED THIS WEEK WERE MOSTLY TOO YOUNG TO VOTE, BUT OUR NEXT GUEST SAYS THE YOUTH VOTE THIS PAST TUESDAY WAS A KEY TO EVERS' WIN.

AMBER WICHOWSKY IS PROFESSOR OF POLITICAL SCIENCE AT MARQUETTE UNIVERSITY AND DIRECTOR OF THE MARQUETTE DEMOCRACY LAB.

THANKS VERY MUCH FOR BEING HERE.

>> THANKS FOR HAVING ME.

>> Frederica: SO YOU GOT A LOT OF OTHER TAKEAWAYS FROM TUESDAY'S ELECTION, BUT THE YOUTH VOTE STANDS OUT FOR YOU.

WHY?

>> YEAH.

ABSOLUTELY.

THERE'S A QUESTION HEADING INTO TUESDAY ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT THE HIGH TURNOUT AND DEEP CIVIC ENGAGEMENT SEEN AMONG GEN-Z VOTERS WOULD CONTINUE THIS ELECTION.

THERE'S POLLING DATA SUGGESTING THAT YOUNGER VOTERS WERE NOT AS ENTHUSIASTIC THIS TIME AROUND, BUT TUESDAY, WE SAW THAT IN MANY PLACES LIKE WISCONSIN, YOUNG VOTERS TURNED OUT AT RELATIVELY HIGH RATES.

I SAY "RELATIVELY" BECAUSE YOUNGER VOTERS VOTE AT LOWER RATES THAN OLDER VOTES, BUT IT'S ESTIMATED APPROXIMATELY 27% OF 18-YEAR-OLDS TO 29-YEAR-OLDS VOTED ON TUESDAY IN STATES LIKE WISCONSIN, PENNSYLVANIA, MICHIGAN, AND THESE ARE STATES WHERE THERE WERE ISSUES THAT VERY MUCH ARE BEING DEBATED, ON THE BALLOT IN SOME CASES, AND THESE ARE ISSUES THAT ANIMATING YOUNG VOTERS, AND WE ARE SEEING THEM CONTINUE TO TURN OUT.

>> Frederica: SPEAKING OF THE ISSUES, WHAT WERE THE ISSUES THAT BROUGHT YOUNGER PEOPLE TO THE POLLS COMPARED TO OLDER VOTERS?

>> YEAH.

ONE ISSUE THAT STANDS OUT IS ABORTION.

IF YOU'RE LOOKING AT PUBLIC OPINION DATA HEADING INTO TUESDAY, ABORTION WAS MORE LIKELY TO BE IDENTIFIED AS A TOP ISSUE FOR YOUNGER VOTERS, AND YOUNGER VOTERS ARE ALSO MORE LIKELY TO CITE CLIMATE CHANGE AS AN ISSUE OF PRESSING CONCERN FOR THEM.

THEY ARE SLIGHTLY LESS LIKELY TO SAY THINGS LIKE INFLATION, AND,S THAT TEND TO BOTH ADVANTAGE REPUBLICANS AND TO ANIMATE OLDER VOTER, AND SO THAT THE ISSUE WITH GEN-Z IS NOT JUST THEIR RATES OF PARTICIPATION, WHICH THEY ARE CIVICALLY ENGAGED GENERATION, BUT THIS IS A GENERATION BREAKING FOR DEMOCRATS, SO THEY ARE VOTING 3-1 FOR DEMOCRATIC CANDIDATES, AND THAT TOGETHER, DELIVERS VOTES FOR EVERS HERE IN WISCONSIN.

>> Frederica: SO IF THE YOUTH VOTE WAS A KEY TO EVERS' WIN, WHY NOT LIFT BARNES TO THE SAME EXTENT?

>> YEAH.

FIRST, I WANT TO QUALIFY YOUTH VOTE.

THERE'S SOME REALLY IMPORTANT DISTINCTIONS WITHIN THE YOUTH VOTE.

ONE IS THAT YOUNG VOTERS OF COLOR ARE MORE LIKELY TO VOTE DEMOCRATIC COMPARED TO THEIR WHITE GEN-Z VOTERS, SO THERE'S A RACIAL AND ETHNIC DIFFERENCE.

WE HAVE A GENDER GAP AND A COLLEGE DIVIDE AS WELL.

SO, IT IS NOT THAT JUST ALL YOUNG VOTERS TURN OUT, BUT IT IS THOSE IN COLLEGE OR COLLEGE EDUCATED.

NOW, IF WE LOOK AT THE MAP HERE IN WISCONSIN TO UNDERSTAND WHERE WERE THE PLACES, AND WHERE ARE THE VOTERS WHO WERE SWITCHING THEIR TICKET, SPLITTING THEIR TICKETS, EXCUSE ME, BETWEEN EVERS AND JOHNSON?

THESE TENDED TO BE PLACES WHERE REPUBLICANS DID BETTER.

IT'S NOT A PERFECT CORRELATION, BUT IN PLACES OF THE STATE WHERE REPUBLICANS DID BETTER, YOU WERE MORE LIKELY TO SEE VOTERS SPLIT THEIR TICKETS.

PLACES THAT HAVE BEEN THE DEMOCRATIC STRONGHOLDS, MILWAUKEE, DANE COUNTY, YOU SAW LESS TICKETS, BUT YOU SAW SOME, BUT ADD THE VOTES TOGETHER, THAT MEN BARNES HELPED CLOSE THE GAP, BUT NOT ENOUGH TO WIN ON TUESDAY.

SO, 2022 IS GOING TO COME DOWN TO AN ELECTION WHERE WE DON'T HAVE A CLEAR NARRATIVE COMING FROM THE ELECTION.

THERE WERE SO MANY FACTORS AT PLAY ACROSS BOTH THE STATE AS WELL AS THE COUNTRY.

>> Frederica: WELL, AS DIRECTOR OF YOUR DEMOCRACY LAB, YOU ENGAGE WITH MARQUETTE STUDENTS ON THE KIND OF RUDIMENTS OF VOTING, LIKE, WHAT YOU NEED TO DO, WHERE TO GO, ISSUES.

DID THAT HAVE AN IMPACT IN THE LAST ELECTION, HAVE YOU FOUND?

>> ABSOLUTELY.

SO, WE'RE STILL DIGGING INTO THE DATA, BUT IF YOU LOOK AT WARD LEVEL DATA HERE IN THE MILWAUKEE COUNTY, TURNOUT IN MILWAUKEE COUNTY WAS DOWN A LITTLE BIT COMPARED TO 2018.

PLACES WHERE WE SAW TURNOUTS, IN SOME CASES, THE PERCENTAGE OF REGISTERED VOTERS INCREASED WERE ACTUALLY NEAR COLLEGE CAMPUSES INCLUDING HERE IN THE WARDS AROUND MARQUETTE, SO SOME OF THE THINGS THAT WE DO ARE JUST EDUCATING STUDENTS ABOUT WHAT THEY NEED TO VOTE, WHAT IS THEIR PROOF OF RESIDENCY, WHAT PHOTO ID DO THEY NEED, AND WHERE'S THEIR POLLING LOCATION?

IN MILWAUKEE, IN A CYCLE, OUR POLLING LOCATIONS SHIFTED SOMEWHAT BECAUSE OF REDISTRICTING SO WE MADE SURE STUDENTS KNEW WHERE THEIR POLLING LOCATIONS WERE.

IF STUDENTS MOVED IN THE LAST TIME THEY VOTED, STUDENTS NEEDED TO KNOW THEY NEEDED TO RE-REGISTER.

YOUNG VOTERS OFTEN HAD SOME ADDITIONAL HURDLES TO OVERCOME IN TERMS OF VOTING, AND SO WE WANTED TO MAKE SURE STUDENTS WERE INFORMED AND EMPOWERED TO EXERCISE VOTING RIGHTS TUESDAY.

>> Frederica: WITH LESS THAN A MINUTE LEFT, YOU'VE ALSO SAID THAT TUESDAY'S RESULTS SHOW THIS IS NOT A STATE WHERE DONALD TRUMP CAN COME IN AND RECREATE 2016.

WHY NOT?

>> WELL, ABSOLUTELY.

LOOK AT THE SUBURBAN COUNTIES OUT OF MILWAUKEE.

THESE USED TO BE THE REPUBLICAN STRONGHOLDS, AND EVERS, WE SAW IT IN 2018, 2020, AND THE QUESTION WAS CHOMPING OUT ON THE BALLOT, AND TRUMP NOT IN THE RACE, WITH THOSE VOTERS CONTINUE TO VOTE DEMOCRATS, AT LEAST AT SOMEWHAT HIGHER MARGINS THAN HISTORICALLY, AND FOR THOSE REASONS INCLUDING AREAS AROUND GREEN BAY, THE NUMBER OF VOTES COMING OUT OF DANE COUNTY, OUT OF MILWAUKEE, THOSE SHIFTING MARGINS, IT'S JUST NOT A STATE THAT TRUMP WILL LIKELY BE ABLE TO WIN.

>> Frederica: ART, AMBER WICHOWSKY, THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

>> THANKS FOR HAVING ME.

>> Frederica: AS TO THE EVERS/JOHNSON VOTERS IN WISCONSIN, A KEY PART OF THE JOHNSON PLAYBOOK WERE ATTACK ADDS AGAINST BARNES CALLING HIM "DIFFERENT" AND "DANGEROUS," ARE THEY TIPPING TO THE INCUMBENT SENATOR?

WHO PEOPLE WHO WORK TO GET OUT THE VOTE FOR BARNES REGARD THE MESSAGES, ESPECIALLY IN MILWAUKEE VILIFIED FOR CRIME.

WE TALK WITH ANGELA LANG, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF BLACK LEADERS ORGANIZING FOR COMMUNITIES, AND THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR BEING HERE.

>> THANKS FOR HAVING ME.

>> Frederica: HOW DO YOU REGARD THOSE ATTACK ADS AGAINST BARNES?

>> THEY WERE TERRIBLE.

THEY WERE VILE.

THEY WERE REALLY HARD TO WATCH.

I THINK FOR -- I KNOW ME PERSONALLY AND OTHER FOLKS, IF WE CAN TALK TO OUR OWN LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR THIS WAY, HOW DO THE REST FEEL ABOUT THE BLACK COMMUNITY AND OTHERS HE SHOULD HAVE BEEN COURTING INSTEAD OF VILIFYING, IT WAS HORRIBLE AND TERRIFYING AND HARD TO WATCH, BUT AT THE SAME TIME, ENCOURAGING TO SEE BARNES REMAIN GRACEFUL IN HANDLING THAT AND NOT STOOP TO THEIR LEVEL.

>> Frederica: WHAT'S THE RESPONSE TO THE LEVEL THAT BARNES DID NOT DO ENOUGH TO DEFEND AGAINST THEM?

>> I THINK IT'S COMPLICATED.

I THINK ON ONE HAND, ANYTHING HE PROBABLY WOULD HAVE DONE WOULD HAVE BEEN SEEN AS WEAPONIZED AND FURTHER SEEN AS THE ANGRY BLACK MAN AND THAT'S WHY YOU SAW HIM MAKING PEANUT BUTTER AND JELLY SANDWICHES.

HIS HUMANITY WAS STRIPPED BECAUSE OF THE ADS, AND BEING A BLACK PERSON, ESPECIALLY RUNNING A STATEWIDE -- FOR STATEWIDE OFFICE, YOU HAVE TO BE CAREFUL TO NOT FURTHER FAN THOSE FLAMES, AND PEOPLE ASK, WOULD I HAVE PERSONALLY DONE SOMETHING DIFFERENT?

ABSOLUTELY!

THAT'S WHY I'M NOT THE CANDIDATE.

I THINK IT WOULD HAVE BEEN INCREDIBLY DIFFICULT FOR, I THINK, MOST OF US TO HANDLE IT IN THE WAY HE DID WITH SUCH GRACE.

>> Frederica: DO YOU THINK THOSE WHO VOTED FOR EVERS AND NOT FOR BARNES WERE FRIGHTENED AS DESIGNED BY THAT MESSAGING?

>> I'M VERY CURIOUS TO HAVE CONVERSATIONS WITH THOSE VOTERS TO SEE IF PEOPLE FOCUS GROUPED THEM OR WHAT HAVE YOU, AND ULTIMATELY, I CAN'T THINK OF ANY OTHER REASON FOR THE VOTERS TO EXIST OTHER THAN RACISM AND FEAR MONGERING, AND I THINK THAT'S REALLY SAD AND REALLY TRAGIC THAT SOME PEOPLE CAN'T GET PAST THEIR OWN RACISM, BUT WE HAVE ALL OF THE CHALLENGES ON THE LINE AND UNDERSTANDING HOW RON JOHNSON IS VERY HARMFUL TO THE COMMUNITIES AND FOR WHATEVER REASON, THAT SEEMED TO TAKE A BACKSEAT IN TERMS OF RACISM FOR THE FOLKS.

>> Frederica: HOW DOES THAT SPEAK TO THE RACIAL POLARIZATION IN WISCONSIN?

>> I THINK IT SHOWS WE HAVE A LOT OF WORK TO CONTINUE TO DO.

I KNOW IN THE LAST COUPLE YEARS SINCE THE MURDERS OF TAYLOR AND FLOYD, THERE'S MORE CONVERSATIONS HAPPENING, AND CONVERSATIONS NEED TO CONTINUE.

I THINK WE'RE IN THE MIDST OF A RACIAL RECKONING THAT WE HAVE TO CONTINUE TO DIG INTO, AND I THINK IT'S GOING TO BE AWHILE BEFORE THIS COMMUNITY AND STATE AND COUNTRY AS A WHOLE COMES TOGETHER AND ACTUALLY SAYS WE DEMAND BETTER AND ALL COMMUNITIES DESERVE TO THRIVE AND HAVE DIGNITY AND NOT HAVE THIS RACIST RHETORIC, BUT I THINK IT STARTS BY CONTINUING TO HAVE CONVERSATIONS.

>> Frederica: YOU SAID "FOLLOWING THE BARNES DEFEAT THAT, QUOTE, PROGRESSIVES THAT DECIDED THE ELECTABILITY WHISPER CAMPAIGN IN THE PRIMARY, YOU ALL ARE PARTLY TO BLAME, "WHAT'S THAT ABOUT?

>> YEAH.

I THINK WE SAW, YOU KNOW, I WON'T MENTION THE CAMPAIGNS, BUT WE SAW CAMPAIGNS IN THE PRIMARY KIND OF AMPLIFY THE DOG WHISTLE POLITICS, CALLING HIM EXTREME GIVEN HIS ENDORSEMENTS OR TALKING ABOUT THE TAX RECORD.

THINGS THAT REPUBLICANS WOULD TALK ABOUT, BUT THESE WERE HIS OPPONENTS AND CHALLENGERS IN THE PRIMARY, AND I THINK BY HAVING DOG WHISTLES, AND KIND OF GOING UNCHECKED IN SOME CASES, REALLY PROVIDED AN OPENING FOR THE REPUBLICANS TO HAVE THEIR VILE MESSAGES AS WELL IN THE GENERAL ELECTION.

>> Frederica: THERE WAS A DECREASE IN VOTER TURNOUT IN MILWAUKEE COUNTY WHICH SAW SOMETHING LIKE 47,000 A FEWER VOTES THAN IN 2018 IN THE U.S. SENATE RACE.

NOT FOR LACK OF EFFORT.

WE KNOW.

WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT THAT?

>> YEAH.

YOU KNOW, WE ARE STILL GOING TO BE DIGGING INTO THE NUMBERS AND FIGURING OUT WHAT HAPPENED, BUT WE ALSO KNOW, TOO, THAT WE'RE GETTING REPORTS THAT HUNDREDS OF PEOPLE JUST EVEN IN SOME POLLING PLACES WERE TURNED AWAY DUE TO HAVING THE WRONG POLLING LOCATION BECAUSE OF REDISTRICTING, AND THEIR POLLING PLACE MOVED.

DID THE PEOPLE TURNED AWAY ABLE TO GET TO THE CORRECT POLLING PLACE TO VOTE?

WE HEARD REPORTS OF THAT, AND, YOU KNOW, WE ALSO HEARD SOME REPORTS OF PEOPLE HAVING CHILDCARE ISSUES BECAUSE MDS WAS CLOSED, NOT SAYING THAT'S ALL OF THE REASONS, BUT I THINK WE HAVE TO LOOK AT SOME OF THOSE THINGS THAT ARE NOT NORMALLY TALKED ABOUT TO REALLY KIND OF PUT THE PIECES TOGETHER OF A PUZZLE OF WHAT ACTUALLY HAPPENED, BUT IT GOES TO SHOW THERE'S MORE WORK TO DO FOR THE SPRING ELECTIONS NEXT YEAR.

>> Frederica: BRIEFLY, LOOKING AHEAD TO THE NEXT STATEWIDE RACE, RACE FOR SUPREME COURT.

WHY IS THAT ELECTION IN YOUR SIGHTS?

>> I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT FOR SEVERAL REASONS.

OUR TEAM FEELS VERY STRONGLY THAT, ONE, WE COULD FLIP THE IDEOLOGY OF THE COURT AWAY FROM THE CONSERVATIVE MAJORITY.

THE COURT IMPACTS THINGS LIKE BALLOT DROP BOXES AND VOTING ON ELECTION DAY AND THINGS LIKE THAT, AND IT IS ALSO AN OPPORTUNITY, WE HAVE MADE AN ENDORSEMENT TO ELECT OUR FIRST BLACK JUSTICE IN THE STATE OF WISCONSIN, AND EVERETT MITCHELL.

WE ARE EXCITED TO BE A PART OF HISTORY AND UNDERSTAND, TOO, WHAT'S AT STAKE FOR THE REST OF THE STATE IF WE ARE ABLE TO FLIP THAT SEAT.

>> Frederica: ANGELA LANG, THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

>> THANKS FOR HAVING ME.

>> Frederica: IN WISCONSIN'S 3rd CONGRESSIONAL DISTRICT, A TRUMP-ENDORSED REPUBLICAN, DERRICK VAN ORDEN, IS HEADED TO WASHINGTON.

WEEKS BEFORE THE ELECTION, NATIONAL DEMOCRATIC PARTY FUNDERS POLLED SUPPORT FROM THE CANDIDATE, PFAFF.

DID THEY WIN BY REDIRECTING MONEY?

WE TURNED TO THE POLITICAL SCIENCE PROFESSOR AT UW-LA CROSSE.

THANK YOU FOR BEING HERE.

>> THANK YOU.

>> AS TO THE QUESTIONS, DID THE DEMOCRATS' HOUSE MAJORITY PACK MISCALCULATE HERE?

>> YES.

THE RACE WAS MUCH CLOSER THAN EXPECTED, AND IN MOST CLOSE CONGRESSIONAL RACES, THE POLITICAL PARTIES AND THE POLITICAL ACTION COMMITTEES GET HEAVILY INVOLVED TO ASSIST THE CANDIDATES.

WHAT WAS SO STRIKING ABOUT THIS RACE WAS THE LACK OF PARTY SUPPORT AND LACK OF SUPPORT FROM THOSE KEY POLITICAL ACTION COMMITTEES IN HELPING BRAD PFAFF, THE DEMOCRAT.

I THINK DEMOCRATS BOTH WITHIN THE PARTY AND KEY POLITICAL ACTION COMMITTEES CLEARLY MISCALCULATED.

THEY CLEARLY DID NOT EXPECT THE RACE TO BE AS CLOSE AS IT WAS BECAUSE AS A POLITICAL SCIENTIST, MY EXPECTATION IS THAT WHEN A RACE IS CLOSE, YOU'RE GOING TO GET THE PARTY HEAVILY INVOLVED, THE PACs HEAVILY INVOLVED, AND THAT DID NOT HAPPEN.

CLEARLY, THERE WAS A DISCONNECT IN THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY ABOUT THE STATE OF THE RACE.

>> Frederica: DO YOU FEEL AS THOUGH THEIR CALCULATIONS WERE BASED ON WHAT HAPPENED IN THE LAST ELECTION FOR THIS SEAT?

>> HAVE POSSIBLE.

AFTER ALL, RON KIND, LONG-TIME INCUMBENT FROM THE DISTRICT, HAD THE CLOSEST ELECTION OF HIS CAREER WHEN HE RAN AGAINST DERRICK VAN ORDEN IN 2020.

IT WAS JUST A THREE-POINT MARGIN OF VICTORY FOR KIND.

PLUS, WE HAD SEEN SOME INDICATIONS IN PRESIDENTIAL ELECTIONS THAT THIS AREA IN WESTERN WISCONSIN WAS DRIFTING AWAY FROM THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY.

DEMOCRATS MIGHT HAVE GOTTEN A BIG HUNG UP ON THOSE RESULTS, THE CLOSER THAN EXPECTED RESULT IN 2020, THE PRESIDENTIAL RESULTS, AND MAYBE WRITTEN OFF THIS DISTRICT A LITTLE MORE THAN THEY SHOULD HAVE.

IN RETROSPECT, IT WAS A MISTAKE ON THEIR PART, AND THEY MAY HAVE TO HAVE A COURSE CORRECTION IN 2024 TO REGROUP IN THE AREA.

>> Frederica: SO, HOW DO TRUMP REPUBLICANS, LIKE DERRICK VAN ORDEN, POTENTIALLY HAVE TO MODERATE POLITICALLY?

>> IT'S A FASCINATING ISSUE, FREDERICA.

VOTERS TEND TO VOTE THE CANDIDATE A BIT MORE THAN THE PARTY, SO MR. VAN ORDEN'S POLITICAL STRATEGY AS A MEMBER OF CONGRESS WILL BE FASCINATING TO WATCH.

>> Frederica: ALL RIGHT, ANTHONY CHERGOSKY, THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

>> THANK YOU.

>> Frederica: TO SEE EXTENDED INTERVIEW WITH PROFESSOR ANTHONY CHERGOSKY, VISIT OUR WEBSITE AT PBSWISCONSIN.ORG/NEWS.

SO THE RED TSUNAMI DID NOT MATERIALIZE.

TONY EVERS WON AND SO DID RON JOHNSON.

HOW TO PARTISANS FEEL ABOUT THE RESULTS?

WE TURN TO THE POLITICAL PANELIST, BILL McCOSHEN, A CONSULTANT, AND DEMOCRAT, SCOT ROSS.

THANK YOU FOR BEING HERE.

>> THANKS FOR HAVING US.

>> THANK YOU.

>> Frederica: WHAT'S YOUR REACTION,, AND SKOT, TO THE ELECTION?

>> EVERS' MANDATE NOW MEANS WE MOVE FORWARD.

DEMOCRACY WAS ON THE THE BALLOT, ABORTION, AND FREEDOM ON THE BALLOT, AND THE PEOPLE RESPONDED AND SAID THEY WANTED THE DEMOCRATIC WAY.

THEY WANTED EVERS IN THERE TO MAKE SURE FREEDOMS ARE PROTECTED.

WE'LL HAVE FREE AND FAIR ELECTIONS FROM NOW ON.

LET'S SEE IF THE REPUBLICANS CAN JOIN US IN THE MANDATE AND MOVE THE STATE FORWARD.

>> Frederica: BILL, WHAT WAS YOUR ANSWER?

>> LIKE A YOUTH SOCCER TOURNAMENT, EVERYONE GOT A TROPHY, REPUBLICANS WON THE SENATE RACE, TREASURER'S RACE, 3rd CONGRESSIONAL DISTRICT, AND GOT SEATS IN THE ASSEMBLY AND SENATE.

THERE ARE BIG WINS ON THE REPUBLICAN SIDE ON TUESDAY NIGHT AS WELL.

GRANTED, THERE WERE SOME SIGNIFICANT DEMOCRATIC WINS.

LOSING THE GOVERNORSHIP AND AG'S RACE, AND THIS POLITICAL CLIMATE IS A MASSIVE MISSED OPPORTUNITY FOR REPUBLICANS.

THERE'S NO DOUBT ABOUT THAT.

>> Frederica: YOU SPOKE, BILL, TO LESSONS LEARNED AFTER THE DEFEAT OF YOUR CANDIDATE, TIM MICHAELS, LIKE WHAT?

>> WELL, I THINK, NUMBER ONE, IS MONEY, RIGHT?

YOU NEED MONEY, ORGANIZATION, AND MESSAGE TO WIN STATEWIDE, AND, YOU KNOW, TIM WAS MASSIVELY OUTSPENT, AND AT THE END OF THE DAY, MONEY MATTERS.

YOU CAN'T GET OUTSPENT $12 MILLION TO $20 MILLION AND HOPE TO COMPETE IN THE STATE OF WISCONSIN.

I THINK THAT WAS ONE THING.

ON THE GROUND, I GIVE DEMOCRATS THE CREDIT.

THEY ACTUALLY HAD A VERY STRATEGIC GROUND, MICROTARGETTING EFFORT ON CAMPUS ACROSS THE STATE, WHICH, FRANKLY, MADE THE 3rd CONGRESSIONAL DISTRICT CLOSER THAN MOST THOUGHT IT WOULD BE AND TARGET THE YOUNG PEOPLE ON ABORTION.

GEN-Z IS THE ONLY DEMOGRAPHIC THAT VOTE FOR DEMOCRATS IN OVERWHELMING NUMBERS TUESDAY NIGHT.

EVERYONE ELSE VOTED REPUBLICAN.

DEMOCRATS UNDERSTAND WHERE THEY WERE AND HOW TO IDENTIFY THEM AND GET THEM OUT.

>> Frederica: YOU SPOKE TO THE IDEAS OF DANE COUNTY AS THE POWER HOUSE, WHICH, PERHAPS, THAT CAME PAIN, THE TIM MICHAELS' CAMPAIGN, DID NOT PAY ATTENTION TO.

>> I'M A BROKEN RECORD ON THIS AND SAID IT FOR 20 YEARS.

WHEN MARK NEWMAN LOSS IN 1998 BY 90,000 VOTES, BELLS SHOULD HAVE BEEN GOING OFF FOR EVERY REPUBLICAN.

THEY WERE NOT.

EVERS BEAT MICHAELS BY 173,000 VOTES TUESDAY NIGHT, ABOUT INSURMOUNTABLE.

RON JOHNSON WAS ABLE TO OVERCOME IT IN LARGE MEASURE DEFINING BARNES ON THE TERMS HE WANTED HIM DEFINED.

WE'LL COME BACK TO THAT, BUT DANE COUNTY NEEDS TO BE A HIGHER PRIORITY FOR REPUBLICANS IF THEY EVER WANT TO WIN THE GOVERNORSHIP AGAIN.

>> Frederica: SCOT, YOUR TAKE AWAY FOR THE CLOSE LOSS?

>> REASON DANE COUNTY VOTES DEMOCRAT DEMOCRATIC IS THEY REFLECT THE VALUES, AND REPUBLICANS ARE GOING TO HAVE TO CHANGE STRIPES TO MAKE END ROADS IN DANE COUNTY.

STARTING THERE.

VERY DISAPPOINTING.

YOU KNOW, BARNES KEPT HANGING WITH WISCONSIN, AND IT IS UNFORTUNATE WHAT HAPPENED, WHICH, YOU KNOW, TALKING ABOUT THE MONEY, BARNES OUTSPENT BY $29 MILLION.

I DON'T THINK WE CAN, YOU KNOW, UNDERSTATE THE SIGNIFICANCE OF DIANE AND THE LINES.

THEY GOT $500 MILLION FROM RON JOHNSON IN A PERSONAL TAX BREAK EXTORTED PUBLICLY FOR THEM AND WENT ON TO BASICALLY FINANCE HALF OF THE EFFORT, YOU KNOW, AGAINST BARNES FOR RON JOHNSON.

I THINK THAT'S JUST SHOCKING.

>> Frederica: IN MILWAUKEE COUNTY, TURNOUT WAS DOWN FROM 2018.

WHAT'S THAT ABOUT?

>> I MEAN, I THINK, YOU KNOW, YOU HAVE TO MAKE SURE YOU GET VOTERS OUT TO THE POLLS.

MILWAUKEE DOES A GOOD JOB OF IT.

YOU KNOW, SOMETIMES YOU ARE SHORT, THOUGH, AND I THINK, YOU KNOW, DEPENDING ON THE BREEZE, YOU KNOW, THIS WAS THE CLOSEST SENATE RACE I CAN REMEMBER OR -- >> FIRST TIME IN HISTORY BOTH STATEWIDE RACES WITHIN 3%.

FIRST TIME IN HISTORY.

>> AND WE HAVE TO GO BACK TO 1998 FOR A U.S. SENATE RACE THAT CLOSE, AND SO, YOU KNOW, I THINK IF THE BREEZE BLOWS DIFFERENT ON ELECTION DAY, BARNES IS U.S.

SENATOR ELECT.

>> THREE OF US ARE OLD ENOUGH TO REPUBLICAN WHEN WISCONSIN SPLIT THE TICKET A LOT.

IN THE 1990s A LOT, 1998, GOVERNOR WON WITH 60%, AND FINEGOLD BEAT NEWMAN.

>> ONLY BY 37,000 VOTES.

>> THAT WAS THE LAST TIME, 24 YEARS AGO SPLITTING THE TICKET AT THE TOP.

>> Frederica: YOU TALKED ABOUT REPUBLICANS, BILL, FINDING A DIFFERENT CANDIDATE TO APPEAL TO SUBURBAN VOTERS.

IS IT THE ALLURE OF DONALD TRUMP OVER?

>> I THINK IT'S OVER.

I THINK THE PARTY'S READY TO LOOK FORWARD, NOT BACKWARDS, AND, YOU KNOW, HOPEFUL PRESIDENT TRUMP DOES NOT ANNOUNCE FOR THE WHITE HOUSE NEXT WEEK BECAUSE I THINK THAT DISRUPTS WHAT'S GOING ON IN THE STATE OF GEORGIA, AND I THINK GEORGIA SHOULD BE REPUBLICAN'S SOLE FOCUS FOR NEXT 30 DAYS, AND ANYTHING IN THE WAY OF THAT SHOULD BE SHUNNED BY VOTERS, AND I THINK YOU SEE HIS RECENT ATTACK ON RON DeSANTIS THIS WEEK THAT REPUBLICANS ARE PUSHING BACK IN A BIG WAY.

I -- DONALD TRUMP MAY, IN FACT, GET IN THE RACE, BUT IT'S NOT A GIVEN HE'S THE NOMINEE.

>> Frederica: SCOT, HOW DO DEMOCRATS RECLAIM SUPPORT OF RURAL VOTERS?

>> THEY HAD IT IN LA CROSSE AND O'CLAIRE, CARRYING A LOT OF THE COUNTIES, YOU KNOW, THAT HE CARRIED LAST TIME.

I DON'T THINK DEMOCRATS HAVE A RURAL REPUBLICAN, BUT REPUBLICANS HAVE A SUBURBAN PROBLEM, THE DARK RED WOW COUNTIES ARE MOVING TOWARDS DEMOCRATS, AND, YOU KNOW, THAT'S WHERE WE ARE AT.

>> Frederica: I JUST WANT TO SPIN NOW TO THE NEXT BIG RACE IN WISCONSIN, STATE SUPREME COURT RACE.

WHAT'S THE STAKES, BILL?

>> HUGE.

4-3 CONSERVATIVE MAJORITY, BRIAN SWINGS BACK AND FORTH BETWEEN THE TWO BLOCKS OF THREE, AND SO IT'S NOT DECIDEDLY CONSERVATIVE.

THIS IS A CONSERVATIVE SEAT THAT'S UP, AND I THINK THE STAKES ARE VERY, VERY HIGH, AND THERE'S AT LEAST ONE CONSERVATIVE CANDIDATE IN ALREADY, FORMER SUPREME COURT JUSTICE DAN KELLY, FAIRLY CONFIDENT THERE'S GOING TO BE ANOTHER POSSIBLY JUDGE DORREL BEFORE THE END OF NOVEMBER.

>> Frederica: SCOT?

>> COUPLE THINGS, ONE, BRIAN'S DONE WITH HIS SWING DANCE PARTY, LIKE, IT'S OVER, HE'S WITH THE REPUBLICANS FROM HERE ON NOW.

SECOND THING IS, PROGRESSIVES HAVE AN INCREDIBLE OPPORTUNITY, EVER SINCE MIKE GABLEMAN WON IN 2008, THE SUPREME COURT'S BEEN CONTROLLED BY REPUBLICANS.

YOU KNOW, DEMOCRATS HAVE A FANTASTIC OPPORTUNITY.

I THINK THEY'LL SEIZE IT.

I DON'T THINK ANY OTHER ROM REPUBLICANS GET IN.

>> Frederica: WE LEAVE IT THERE, BILL McCOSHEN, SCOT ROSS, THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

>> THANK YOU.

>> Frederica: FOR MORE ON THIS AND OTHER ISSUES, GO TO PBSWISCONSIN.ORG AND CLICK ON THE NEWS TAB.

THAT'S OUR PROGRAM FOR TONIGHT.

I'M FREDERICA FREYBERG.

HAVE A GOOD WEEKEND.

♪ >> Announcer: FUNDING FOR "HERE & NOW" IS PROVIDED BY THE FOCUS FUND FOR JOURNALISM AND FRIENDS OF PBS WISCONSIN.