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[MOTIVATIONAL MUSIC] - Hi everyone, Steve Adubato for the entire half hour.

This program is part of our series honoring our Veterans.

It is our effort, which will never really be enough, our effort to recognize, honor, pay tribute to those brave men and women in the military.

And we kick off this program with a distinguished panel, including state Assemblywoman Melinda Kane, representing the sixth legislative district down in South Jersey, a gold star mother of Lance Corporal Jeremy Kane, who lost his life in 2010 in Afghanistan, stopping a suicide bomber.

- Correct.

- Dr.

Michael Mimms, who is a former Marine Corps officer and lead veteran mental health navigator and mental health first aid instructor for the New Jersey Hospital Association.

And finally, back again after several years, I'm glad to have him back Jack Fanous, who's co-founder and executive director of the GI Go Fund and co-founder of JobPaths.

Thank you all for joining us.

- Thank you.

- So, as we put up your website, I want folks to better understand who you are and what you do.

And Jack, describe the GI Go Fund, please.

- Sure, so the GI Go Fund is a nonprofit organization, I founded with my brother and a group of our friends in 2006 after a buddy of ours was killed in Iraq, his name was Lieutenant Seth Devour.

And the organization has grown over the years, as you can imagine, when we started, we were 25 years old, I'm 45 years old now.

This is our 20th year.

And the organization's grown and developed over the years as the veterans community has grown.

Their needs have grown and changed over the years.

But primarily our focus has always been on helping veterans find employment, start a business, and all the wraparound things that come along with that.

So, claiming your benefits, making sure you're registered with the VA, taking care of whatever else, may come your way, but putting a veteran back on their feet and helping them transition back home.

And that hopefully is right when you get outta the military but not always.

Sometimes we're helping people go through that transition several years later, especially out of our offices in Newark, we see a larger demographic of people who sometimes are struggling to transition right when they get out.

So, it's a whole host of things that we take care of.

- Assemblywoman let me ask you this, your son Jeremy, tell us about him.

- He was an amazing young man who after watching what had happened on September 11th as a 14-year-old, he privately determined, decided that he would become a Marine when he was old enough.

And in his teenage years, he made plans and changed himself to become a Marine.

And on September 11th of his freshman year of college, he joined Marine Corps Reserves and he was deployed as a, rather than going to his senior year at Rutgers, he was deployed to Afghanistan.

But he was just an amazing man who was brave, funny, determined, smart, and knew the risks that were involved in going off to war, and especially the impact that would have on our family.

My husband, his dad had just died of stomach cancer.

So, he knew our family was grieving terribly and he knew that we were all very frightened for his safety and assured us that he would return home safely but this was a commitment that he had made to his fellow Marines and to his nation, and he was going to carry out that commitment that he had made.

- And being a gold star mother, for those who may not know what that means, please tell them.

- So, gold star mother, I did not know what that term meant until I became one.

I had never met anyone who had lost anyone killed in combat.

And a gold star family member, simply someone whose loved one had, family member who had died in service in, while active duty in military, in combat.

- Thank you.

And thank you for sharing, a little bit about Jeremy.

Dr.

Mimms, lemme ask you this.

When it comes to the piece of the mental health piece, and again, with you and your colleagues at the New Jersey Hospital Association, explain to folks what the most pressing mental health needs are for our veterans who return home.

- Well, and thank you for having me again, Steve.

I think one of the, or four of the most pressing needs for returning vets is kind of closing that treatment gap that we have for our veterans and it's really, it's four prongs to that one is the cost.

There's so many organizations out in here that can allow you to get the treatment you need for a nominal fate.

Second, trying to kind of do away with the stigma associated with being mentally ill or not being well.

There's some kind of discrimination there from time to time, how people were treated that are not, well.

Second, the logistics.

It's difficult sometimes getting our vets back and forth to the treatment they need.

And last awareness.

I may be struggling Steve, and not even aware that I'm struggling.

I don't laugh like I used to.

I don't learn like I used to.

I don't love like I used to, and I don't have that same excitement for life, but I may not even be aware of that.

- Your experience in the Marines, helps you how in your work?

- Specifically as a lead navigator, when I'm called to go into hospitals when there's some kind of a, there's a soldier or whatever, struggling with some kind of crisis, sometimes when the behavior doctor at the hospital's not able to break through with that individual or the nurse or the social worker.

The fact that I'm able to go in and have some kind of comradery, the fact that I did serve it makes it a lot easier for me to sit down with this vet and say, here.

I'm in the fighting hole with you, let me help.

- Mm-hmm.

Jack, let me ask you this.

You told our producers, and I've thought about this a lot, that saying thank you for your service, which we do.

We say it, you said it could become impersonal, and rather than saying simply thank you for your service, either welcome home or is there anything you need, talk about that.

Why is thank you for your service not nearly enough, Jack?

- And it's not an indictment on anybody.

Of course, sometimes- - No.

- You know, it's a matter of people- - It's respect.

- Yeah.

They recognize what people are doing.

But I think maybe it's time to evolve that, you know, when I first started 20 years ago, that was the barometer, thank you for your service.

You know, at a job fair, at an event, at a standout for homeless veterans.

That was pretty much the barometer of what it was.

And now for 20 years doing it, I don't find it to be empty in the sense that the meaning behind it is empty.

But there's no outcome there.

There's no call to action, right?

There's just, thank you for your service.

You're welcome to, it was an honor to serve pretty much how that conversation usually goes.

And I just find so much more value in saying, is there anything you need?

Is there anything I can help you with?

You know, because of your service, right?

So, I just like to give actionable items, right?

I think that's really what the most important thing is, is thank you for your service, I think is implied.

I don't believe there are many Americans who wouldn't thank you for your service.

Let's take it another step, right?

And I feel comfortable saying that now 20 years in, maybe not seven or eight years in or 10 years in, I didn't feel like it was my place.

But I've seen thousands and thousands of veterans now and thousands of these interactions and I can just see how much more we could do, 'cause people do care.

- And real quick, before I come back to Melinda, let me ask you Jack, some of the key barriers, obstacles to returning veterans becoming gainfully employed are?

- I think a lot of it has to do with just, some of it's just the system is antiquated.

The way the process with which veterans are going through the employment process, I know that sounds mechanical.

You know, there's been a lot of work done over the years about translating your military experience into civilian experience.

- Yeah.

- There's been a critical amount of work done on that.

But a matter about engaging with employers where they are.

A lot of times we talk about meeting veterans where they are, that's true.

But if you're applying for a job at, say, Prudential, who's a great partner of ours and sponsor or Ernst & Young, who's a partner of ours.

You know you have to go through their online system.

And a lot of times veterans are not advised or guided towards that, and are expecting it to happen a little bit differently for them.

And over the 20 years I've seen that, right?

They expect to go to a job fair and get hired as opposed to being told to apply for a job online.

And I think it's just that one little twist of understanding of how the process works and making sure you go through it.

'Cause they're incredibly qualified.

The employers have gone through training.

The employers are well equipped now to hire.

They know what qualifications they're looking for, and what leadership they're looking for.

It's a matter of just connecting that dot.

- I want to jump in here.

- I'm sorry Jack, jump in here.

- I also think that sadly their stereotypes remain, that those that have served don't have skillset sets, don't have education.

- Correct - That you joined the military because you didn't have other options that maybe you weren't, you know, college wasn't appropriate for you, and that you were leaving the military and, you just don't lack the skills or, you know, that would be appropriate for outside employment.

I've seen that in higher education.

And until you have really, hired veterans or seen how you should embrace and be honored to be working with veterans and to be employing veterans and to have veterans as students to change that mindset.

But I think it remains with some people.

- Assemblywoman, to what degree do you believe the state government?

You and your colleagues in the legislature, but also the state government itself, leaders in state government, understand, appreciate, and are prepared to, go beyond thank you for your service and really do what is necessary to help our returning veterans to quote unquote, as the graphic says on the screen, honor, truly honor our veterans please?

- I mean, I see that commitment there within the state.

Prior to becoming an Assemblywoman, I was a county commissioner in Camden County for six years.

And that commitment remains in all levels of state government.

And I serve on the military and Veterans Affairs Committee and, I just know that the state is open to hearing from veterans and to making changes as the veteran community shifts, as veterans are aging, as housing needs change, employment needs change, mental health needs, all of those things that we are open to that.

- Right?

- And to listening to what is needed for legislation to working with our community.

- Got it.

Dr.

Mimms, let me ask you this.

Not only are you a mental health first aid instructor, but you're a navigator, a mental health navigator.

Explain what does mean to be a first aid instructor.

Explain what that means.

- It's a good question.

A first aid instructor is someone who has people that want to know more about learning about the signs and symptoms of people that are struggling with mental illness.

I teach a seven and a half hour nationally recognized class through the National Council, that takes these individuals for free.

Anywhere in the state that you wanna hold a class, I will come instruct those individuals, service members, family members, civilians, and anything about how to recognize those signs.

I teach that eight and a half hour course.

It's a really, really, really good curriculum.

And the results that we've had from the feedback we've gotten from my evaluations have been outstanding.

- But Dr.

along those lines, accessing it, we'll put up the website for the hospital association again.

But I'm curious about this.

Of all the veterans who I wanna say are fortunate enough to return home because in light of what you just shared about Jeremy, Assemblywoman, fortunate enough, in spite of all the challenges they face, fortunate enough to return home, let me ask you this, do you have any sense of what percentage of those veterans who return home and need mental health support are actually accessing it and getting it?

- I don't have those numbers, Steve, but as we know- - But anecdotally, what do you sense, doctor?

- I would say probably, and then there's no rhyme or reason to this, just based on the number of individuals that come, I would say maybe 10% of it, maybe 15%, which is kind of low.

But when you couple that against the number of veterans that die by suicide each day in this country, which is 22 and you multiple, - Oh, oh, one second just to go back doctor, 22 Veterans.

- Yes.

- Every day.

- Die by suicide in this country.

And that's about 8,000 vets a year.

If you're able to impact just the slightest of that number through talking with them, and through Mental Health First Aid and just reaching out to them to help closing that stigma, cost, logistics, and awareness gap, you can really, really do a good bit of good there, Steve.

- Jack, jump in from what Dr.

Mimms just said.

To what degree do you sense, 'cause I'm sure there are a whole range of complex reasons why a veteran would choose that path of no longer wanting to live.

To what extent do you believe, Jack, from your experience not being able to find gainful employment is part of that equation?

- Yeah, in my 20 years, honestly, I think it's one of the contributing factors and if not one of the leading factors many times that would lead to depression and mental illness.

Many times, I mean, if you are struggling with, you know, things that happened while you were serving, but you're also struggling with an eviction notice or you're being foreclosed on or you're unemployed or you're dealing with substance abuse, you know, all of the other things that come along with it.

That's what tips it all over.

And really I think it's about reaching people at scale, really, that's really where JobPath came in, was that we felt the enormity of the problem was.

- Go back and explain JobPath.

We'll put up the website for that as well.

- Sure, so JobPath is what we've created, now we're going on 10 years now.

It's a online solution to many of the work that GI Go Fund does in person for nonprofits.

Over the years now, we've found partner nonprofit organizations that need the same type of work in software communities.

We built one for the state during COVID.

We've built software for the Bob Woodruff Foundation and other major nonprofits.

But the idea behind it is- - Bob Woodruff from ABC, who- - Yep, his major non-profit.

Devastating head injury while covering the war, but explain what exactly what the service is, Jack.

- Sure.

So, a veteran can go out.

Like, so if you walk into our office, at GI Go Fund, any many nonprofits, you're gonna ask a counselor to help you write a resume, help you search for a job, help you identify what the best options for job training, things like that.

All of that now happens at scale online, where a veteran can write a resume, connect with employers.

We have over 6,000 employers, over 9 million jobs posted in the system.

These are all employers that are now committed to do it because they're doing it digitally, right?

They're able to connect to veterans where they are.

And if you think about it, when you and I first met maybe like 10 or 11 years ago, at the Russ Berrie Awards for Making a Difference, our office would see maybe 30, 40 veterans a week, right?

That was kind of our capacity.

- What about now?

- To do that?

I mean, now with the site, we're helping 36, 40,000 veterans every single month across the country- - Wow.

- Who are coming on, building websites, looking for building resumes, looking for jobs, connecting with employers.

So, there's been a lot of work done on the employer side as well that have recognized, 'cause they take training when they sign up that have recognized those skills.

It's a matter of scaling up the services, right?

The reason why I was at that Russ Berrie Making a Difference award was 'cause we didn't do it the way everybody else did.

We just refused to.

(laughing) We had to do it differently.

And the outcomes are there.

- Assemblywoman, let me follow up with you on something.

So, Dr.

Mimms is talking about, and every day works at with his colleagues to support and help veterans who are struggling with mental health issues.

And he talked about the anecdotally say it's 10, say it's even 20% that who need it, get it.

The obvious outcome is that the vast majority who need it don't get it.

- Correct.

- But I've been thinking about family members.

When you're talking about Jeremy, the needs of family members who either have a returning vet who's struggling mightily or lost a loved one in the service of our country.

What about those emotional and mental health needs?

- They're enormous.

You know, addressing what Dr.

Mimms has said, the number of suicide losses within this country daily of veterans.

That does not take into consideration the family members who have died by suicide.

Very often you see siblings, if there's a suicide death within the family, the rate of siblings who have then died by suicide is enormous.

The rate of spouses, of children is very, very high.

The whole family becomes at very high risk, for families.

We are all at risk.

I remember when Jeremy was killed, I was told that I was entitled to, I believe it was 11 or 12 counseling sessions and, you know, free counseling sessions, which is really nothing.

I'm 15 years out after Jeremy's death.

And the impact that it has had on me and my two other sons is enormous.

Just talking about it, it still brings me to tears.

So, to think that the impact of this traumatic tragic loss of a 22-year-old, that life continues on, and it has.

I mean, my life, on the outside is amazing.

I've accomplished a great deal, I have a very happy, joyous life.

But the pain remains.

And to say that we don't need support and counseling, whether it be, if you are surviving a parent, whether it be a combat loss or whether it be your loved one has served, I'm in contact with many parents whose sons came home, and they struggle every day with what their children went through.

I'm in contact with spouses who still struggle with marriages that are very troubled, difficult because of the mental health issues of their spouses, children that have grown up with issues in their home because of that, we need to address that.

And we need to make sure that, you know, there are more losses from mental health issues, from suicide than on the battlefield.

And that is really hard to comprehend.

I believe that from post 911 in the War on Terror three times as many people have died from suicide than in the war on terror.

And people don't wanna talk about that, but that those are the statistics.

- Powerful, Powerful.

- Dr.

Mimms, please, please, I'm sorry.

Just jump in, Dr.

Mimms, because we're talking about mental health needs of family members.

- Yes, absolutely.

And he makes a very good point.

We're just talking about those vets that died by suicide and don't even often realize that the family members suffer as well.

But the flip side of that coin is, and you talked about how many maybe are getting the help or how many we help.

It does my heart good when I get a call from a veteran and says LT talking to me that I counseled and said, Mimms, I didn't want to eat bottle weapon today.

It's been the first time in two weeks or three weeks or whatever.

That's a powerful statement.

'Cause that individual could have been one of those 22 for that particular day.

And we've kind of helped avoid that, just through a New Jersey hospitalization association, mental health training, and the like.

- We have two minutes left.

Go back to how I asked the question of Jack about thank you for your service not being enough, particularly now, as concisely as possible.

One action that a civilian, the rest of us who never served.

One action we could take, one thing we could do to make a difference to truly honor our veterans, Jack, go.

- The easiest thing comes to my mind always is you could post a job to hire a veteran.

That's the easiest thing if you have a job opening, look at veterans.

Help a veteran turn their life around, turn their family's lives around.

And keep in mind those numbers that we were just talking about at 22 suicides a day, you know, that's more than the entire war in Afghanistan and Iraq combined in one year.

So, those numbers are tragic and there's ways to help turn it around with just posting a job or signing up to be a mentor on JobPath or on the Bob Woodruff site or any of the sites that we have.

- Melinda, one action, please.

- Just to check in with people.

I mean, the simple act of, of texting someone who either a family member or a veteran, just to text a veteran, how are you doing today?

I'm thinking about you.

Paying attention to what's going on in current events, what's going on at the VA.

All of those things impact people.

And just a phone call or a text.

Just checking in on you, how are you doing?

Thinking of you.

- Dr.

Mimms, one action we could take, one thing we could do.

- One action that we could take for me personally, is to promote a lot more of the messaging we see on the TVs all the time.

I saw a commercial last night where this lady, this mother was talking about her daughter being in the military and how proud she was of her.

But the proudest thing our daughter did was when she came home, she said, mom, let's go get help from me.

If we could do more of that type of programming.

When we look at, when people came out, politicians are campaigning in November, we can't even stand to turn the TV on because every ad is about thank you for, you know, I approve of this message.

We need to approve the mental health messages in the same kind of vein that we do with some of these political messages.

- To Dr.

Mimms, to Assemblywoman Melinda Kane, to you, Jack, thank you for making a difference.

Thank you for being part of our Honoring our Veterans initiative.

It will not, put it this way, it's one thing to ask, what can the average civilian do?

But it's also, what can we in the media do?

And one of the things I know we need to do is in stop doing these one-offs.

Like that's we did a segment on that.

We did a program on that.

Is sustaining, ongoing commitment to make a difference.

And thank you, all of you.

- Thank you for everything.

- Thank you so much.

- We're always there.

Thank you.

- I'm Steve Adubato, way more importantly, those are three people who make a difference every day honoring our veterans.

Try to make a difference.

That's all.

See you next time.

- [Narrator] Think Tank with Steve Adubato is a production of the Caucus Educational Corporation.

Funding has been provided by Horizon Blue Cross Blue Shield of New Jersey.

PSE&G.

The Russell Berrie Foundation.

New Jersey’s Board of Public Utilities.

RWJBarnabas Health.

Let’s be healthy together.

The New Jersey Economic Development Authority.

The Port Authority of New York and New Jersey.

Kean University.

And by IBEW Local 102.

Promotional support provided by NJBIA.

And by ROI-NJ.

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