I'm your host, Stephen Henderson.

Today we are continuing our series on the black church in Detroit, which is produced in partnership with the Ecumenical Theological Seminary, and the Charles H. Wright Museum of African American History.

60 years ago this month, 250,000 people gathered at the Lincoln Memorial in Washington for the March on Washington for jobs and freedom.

Reverend Dr. Martin Luther King Jr., And the Southern Christian Leadership Conference, helped organize this massive march along with other civil rights leaders.

I spoke with black church leader and civil rights activist, Reverend Charles Williams II, of Historic King Solomon Missionary Baptist Church, about the impact of that 1963 March, and the state of civil rights today.

Reverend Charles Williams II, welcome back to "American Black Journal."

- Thank you for having me.

It's always good to be here.

- Yeah, it's always good to see you.

So I do wanna start with the reason we're having this conversation right now, which is that we are coming up pretty quickly on the actual 60th anniversary of the March on Washington, where of course Dr. King delivers his "I Have a Dream" speech, but also lots of other things happened.

It really is a turning point in the Civil rights movement, and its ability to demand that some significant changes take place in the next few years.

We see the passage of the Civil Rights Act, the Voting Rights Act, the Fair Housing Act.

All of the legislation really gets its power and the wind behind its sails, I think at this march.

We are talking before the actual anniversary, and you are planning to go to Washington to be part of that.

But I want to get you just to talk a little about how you're feeling about this anniversary and what's on your mind, what you're thinking about as we really look back to 60 years since this pivotal moment.

- You know, we, first of all, we're marching in the same spirit of those who have come before us.

I think it's very important for us to understand that we're standing on shoulders of individuals who marched to Washington DC, as Dr. King would put it, "looking for this check that's marked with insufficient funds."

But before even that, we considered those like A. Philip Randolph, who was a chief contractor, constructor of the March on Washington that we all are very familiar with, but also had threatened March on Washingtons prior.

The King era or the civil rights era of the march that we herald.

And every time we did it, and every time we've done it, we've been able to see incremental steps of progress for black Americans when A. Philip Randolph first announced the march to Washington.

We were able to desegregate the military forces, and then of course, Bayard Rustin and others thought that it might be important for us to do it again in the civil rights movement, '64 or '65, what we saw, was an opportunity for voting rights to get expanded across the country.

And then from there, of course, as you mentioned, fair Housing and then a Civil Rights Act.

60 years later, here we now see that we still have some issues that are very, very important to Black Americans across this country.

As you well know, in this era of the most, in the most divisive area that I have seen in my lifetime, not to suggest that it hadn't been more divisive, or it's not equally divisive to some of the prior years.

We've got challenges around voting, whether it's in Florida, or whether it's in Georgia, or even in Michigan.

We have challenges around the issues of police brutality as we've seen three years ago, when we witnessed a man with a knee on his neck, named George Floyd.

And I think that it becomes important for us to utilize these tools that have worked for us in the past, because obviously they have made some strides.

So as we move forward, we're marching not just to, for instance, educate a president.

I mean, it's obvious that civil rights organization leaders now have cachet with a president, as well as the vice president, as well as much of the administration across the president's cabinet, and even in the halls of Congress.

However, it's important for us to continue to highlight these issues in this country.

This is the reason why "National Action Network," we consider this not a commemoration.

It's not a dog and pony show.

I mean, there are those who say, "Well, let's, we going back to have a big parade."

No, no, we're not having a parade.

We are having a march, and we have some issues that are very important to us.

I.e.

the George Floyd Police Accountability Act, which still has not passed in this country.

I.e.

the John Lewis Voting Rights Act, which steel has not gotten through the Senate House and on a president's desk.

In the Civil Rights Movement, King's and the strategists who worked with King, I.e.

Bayard Rustin and others, their thought was, is that we have to educate the world- - Mm-hmm.

- About what's happening in this country in regards to black America.

And in doing that, and showing the world, we raise the moral consciousness of this country to have to respond to what's happening in Ukraine, and what's happening across the world.

We have the responsibility to respond to what's happening right here in this country.

So, when a President Biden, and when delegates and diplomats go to world conferences, the question may come up.

We saw that there was a big march that was happening in your country around issues that black Americans are facing.

How are you dealing with that while you are checking me with your American moral authority?

And so I think it's important, as we march in Washington, and as we deliver these messages and hear these speeches, that are broadcast all over the world, to understand that they tried out the way for presidents and for congressional leaders to act.

Because you can't point your finger at any other country when you got three fingers pointing back at you.

- Yeah.

Yeah.

So one of the things I think is really an interesting thing to think about right now is what would work.

As you point out, we have a lot of things that we need done in Washington, we have a lot of things we need done locally.

It used to be, as you point out, that look, if you got enough people out to march, and demand change, that it would happen.

It seems we live in a very different era now.

Talk about how at the National Action Network where you're on the front lines while this... How different does the work look, and what is the call, I guess, to people to get behind and to join, to make sure that we keep the momentum going in terms of change?

- Yeah.

I think it's just important for us to continue to sacrifice our bodies and uplift our voices.

And a time where on January 6th, folks decided to go inside of the capitol and try to so-called take over the country.

I think it makes very good sense for us to continue to use our bodies and our voices.

You know, I think the biggest misconception is that we're doing this under the guise of safety.

It's not safe.

It really isn't safe.

And it, and it really is a challenge to the structure.

It's safe to send a tweet.

Yeah.

It's safe to make a Facebook post.

Yeah.

But when you spend your time and your resources, there is no greater picture of displeasure.

And there's no way to unupset the landscape of this country, than people all over this country, black Americans, white Americans from all over this country gathering together to say that "These issues are here.

I'm going to hold them up and show them to you, and they matter, and you've got to move."

I mean, I think one of the misconceptions is, is that if something goes viral in a tweet or in a Facebook post, that that excuses us from having to put boots on the ground.

Boots on the ground are always, will always be important.

Look, I've been a part of protests with 10 people and 10,000 people, and a hundred thousand people.

And it did not matter how many folks were there.

When people sacrifice their time, their energy, their resources, and they gather together, and they organize, and they stand together collectively, that tradition, that strategy, that tactic will never be denied.

- 2023 is also the 60th anniversary of the Detroit Walk to Freedom,