A property tax relief rally.

A new Indiana Democratic Party chair.

Plus, Democrats help the GOP with the federal budget and more.

From the television studios at WFYI.

It's Indiana Week in Review for the week ending March 21st, 2025.

Indiana Week In Review is produced by WFYI in association with Indiana Public Broadcasting stations.

Additional support is provided by the Indy Chamber, working to unite business and community to maintain a strong economy and quality of life.

This week, governor Mike Braun spoke to a crowd of a couple hundred people at the statehouse who are rallying for property tax relief or in many cases, the elimination of property taxes altogether.

The event was led by conservative local radio hosts from WIBC who repeatedly called on the crowd to vote out lawmakers who didn't back significant relief.

Wheres my money, wheres my money Braun told the cheering crowd down the hallway from the House and Senate chambers that people need to get their minds right about real property tax relief.

They say they're not hearing it.

Well, they're going to be hearing it after today.

If they haven't before.

The rally featured the lieutenant governor, state lawmakers and local officials like Marshall County Commissioner Jesse Bohannon, who had a message for his fellow local leaders.

We cannot fight this.

It is inevitable.

Let's get behind it and help it get done right.

Legislative debate over property tax relief will continue the rest of session.

How significant a message did the property tax rally send?

It's the first question for our Indiana Week in Review panel.

Democrat Ann DeLaney Republican Chris Mitchem, Jon Schwantes host of Indiana Lawmakers.

And Niki Kelly, editor in chief of the Indiana Capital Chronicle.

I'm Indiana Public Broadcasting Statehouse bureau chief Brandon Smith.

Chris, can this influence the debate in the last month and a half of session?

I certainly think it can influence it.

And I think that Governor Braun showing up is really what took this event from more of like a grassroots effort to a more significant showing a force per se, because I think if he didn't show up, you would have had the same group of, you know, more vocal folks that have been vocal since the beginning of this whole discussion and just kind of having an event at the statehouse.

And I don't think it would have had the same impact, but, you know, we were just talking about it, but I think the pictures of Brian holding up the signs, I thought it looked like he was having a good time.

And I think it showed that, you know, the whole point of a rally, right, is not for a lawmaker to hear somebody speak and say, you know, that's a good point and might change my vote.

It's the whole it's the whole idea of image and momentum.

And I think Governor Braun showing up looking like he had the momentum that he was with the people.

It also helps that he's been he's been able to harp on the same message, the same plan the entire time.

I think it really showed that he has the momentum going forward, which is what I think was the ultimate goal there.

And, I it wasn't the biggest rally I've ever seen, but it was certainly one of the loudest.

And it made my job a little difficult in the statehouse that day.

But, so I definitely think that the lawmakers, you know, heard the volume, they heard the music.

I'm just not sure they'll be dancing toward the end.

They they definitely heard it.

it was loud.

and they did it on the third floor, which is down the hallway from both the House and Senate chambers.

As they were going into session that day.

So they definitely heard the rally going on.

What kind of impact can that have?

Doesn't have any impact.

You don't think it doesn't have any?

You know, I laugh at this.

Republicans finally decided they have a property tax problem.

Mitch Daniels, solved this forever by raising the sales tax to the highest in the country.

They have been in total control for the last 15 years.

Total control.

After that property tax deal, the property taxes have doubled and now they're realizing it.

How about that?

They're the reason the property taxes are high.

That's why.

Because they have underfunded schools and all and roads and everything else.

And cut the corporate taxes in the meanwhile.

So they are the problem.

And the other part of this problem is that Beckwith just stuck it to Braun.

By doing that rally.

Braun cannot get his package passed.

He can't get it passed.

It's fiscally irresponsible.

It's not going to happen.

Okay.

Period.

And rather than having him sit down with the leadership and come up with a plan that is feasible and can be passed and allow him declare victory, he goes out and reinforces this non plan that isn't going to happen.

So the governor can then veto the bill and then call a special session, and then they'll pass it again and he'll look weak.

This is this brings up a point I haven't thought about which is the idea of is there any downside to this for my friend?

I agree, I think he was very enthusiastic and I think it represents he feels like he has momentum.

But I also agree with Ann and that they're not going to pass the Braun proposal.

Right.

And and that's okay.

No, no bill that's introduced just skates through without any changes.

Right.

But he does seem to have now the leaders on board for an actual cut.

Yeah.

For paying less next year than we're paying this year.

And so I think as long as he gets that, he can still legitimately claim victory, because that was not going to happen without him.

And without this push.

I do think there could have been a downside to the rally when they first set it up and they were just like 50 chairs.

I thought, yikes, guys.

Like, if that's it, that is lawmakers that could actually be like, oh, we don't have to pressure.

But they they packed them in there pretty good.

And so, in the end it was it was a good, good show.

And I think there are some lawmakers who might be teetering on the whole protection of local government versus helping their homeowners that I think probably saw that it might make a difference.

It's only been the last couple of weeks where, Rod Bray and Todd Houston have started kind of echoing the same line, which is one of the goals.

There's like three goals essentially they have now.

And and the first goal is to make the 26 bill less than the 25 bill for the majority of homeowners is can Mike Braun take if that's the ultimate package that and you know, whatever else they do long term, can Mike Braun take that to this crowd of people and declare victory?

The governor always has the ability to declare victory, because you can always pick out pieces and and elements of a plan and say, see, I propelled I was the one who pushed this recalcitrant General Assembly to do what I wanted to do.

So you can always you know, it wasn't Mike pence, referred to guardrails.

He'd always say, I put up the guardrails and then the General Assembly can work within that.

So, and he was already I mean, he had doubled down on this before.

There was any doubt a few weeks ago with the social media, a targeted social media ads that had certainly caught the attention of of leadership.

So he has moved the ball.

I know you love sports cliches.

New football during NCAA, we move the ball.

and if they are talking about in fact cuts it will be interesting.

But in react if that happens the next discussion is where does that burden fall?

Which property tax payer?

Which taxpayers will bear the burden because, I mean, pick this issue or any number of other issues.

Roads, funding, bridges, it's going to get shifted more to locals, school funding, these other types of things, libraries, police.

So the question in the end becomes, who's going to pay the taxpayer?

Does that person feel relief if, in fact, the check that he or she is writing is equivalent to what he or she wrote before?

You're talking about the 26 bill, they're going to get a 25 bill in November.

There's not nothing.

Nothing's going to happen.

Exactly.

To mine.

And it's going up 5%, which is actually lower than I thought it would increase.

Okay.

But but people looking at that saying they're going to say he said, I was going to have my property taxes cut and they're not.

Yeah.

Well that's that's always, that's always the trap of.

Well one thing the that the a lot of these people attend the rally need to understand which is Indiana is not eliminating property taxes.

So if that's the goal you know no we're not.

No we're not we're not at that.

Point other states are looking at doing so.

In fact, this week we saw an eruption of headlines and enthusiasm in Florida, where governor DeSantis and others, I think 13 bills already have been issued, released or introduced down there to do away with it.

so that's going to become the popular.

And there second, in the second, the second Indiana gets oceanfront beaches and Disney World.

Right.

We can probably look at Michigan.

Exactly, exactly.

All right.

Former state Senator Karen Tallian is the new chair of the Indiana Democratic Party, the party's state central committee elected Tallian this week to serve the next four years as party leader.

Tallian won a narrow victory and says she will reach out to those who didn't support her to ensure the party is united moving forward.

She says a major path to returning Indiana Democrats to relevancy rests with winning back labor union voters.

Labor has been gone for a while, but I have had labor leaders tell me we've been gone.

But if you're in, we're back.

Tallian says what Democrats need to offer voters now is rationality.

When I look at what's going on, both in the state House and at the national level, a lot of what the Republicans are offering does not make sense.

Tallian replaces Mike Shmuel, who opted not to run for a second term as state party chair.

Ann DeLaney, was this the best move for Indiana Democrats?

Oh, I think so.

They had good candidates, there's no question about it.

But I think she's her combination of experience and, her network across the state and her network with labor.

And she has the ability to to speak on the issues.

She has the ability to raise money and, she knows how to manage.

I think she's an excellent choice.

And I know all of the exchanges will be happy to help her in her rebuilding effort this year.

Karen Tallian, worth noting the second woman ever to lead the Indiana Democratic Party.

The first is sitting to my left.

Chris.

Karen Tallian made the idea of bringing labor voters back to the Democratic Party, a huge part of her campaign for chair.

Do you think it is a realistic goal?

I mean, I think it's a good goal to have.

I mean, we've we've talked a lot about on the show about how, you know, the kind of more excited, further left progressive who make a lot of noise about those issues that potentially don't necessarily win.

A lot of the moderate voters, they've become increasingly in volume, both at the state and the federal level.

So you would think that, you know, a party chair would a new party chair would come out, potentially try to appease that side.

But she says she comes out and says, we need to start, you know, rebuilding the party, both internally, externally and talking about labor union voters.

That's not something that you would expect, which is, I think, something that's probably welcomed for a lot of Indiana state Democrats.

just needing to have a total pivot of your strategy of what your outreach looks like, of your fundraising goals, different things like that.

I really don't understand how four people tried to go for this job.

I would not wish this on.

My worst enemy.

Right.

I don't I don't understand why that was there.

But, you know, Karen Tallian, you know, I, I interacted with her a little bit during my early days, in the state House.

And, you know, she was the one trying to push for marijuana legalization for.

It was cool.

She wasn't really getting trapped up in a lot of those hot button liberal topics, which I think is good for where the Indiana Democrats need to go.

there'll be a lot of room there, because I think by the time Donald Trump and Elon Musk are finished, they're going to irritate so many people that, you know, something about the guns and some of the left wing issues are going to be less important.

I mean, certainly for veterans already.

Well, on that front, she'll also have to continue trying to fight back against that far further left progressive side that isn't probably going to go anywhere.

Is that the is that the path for Democrats to try and find voters somewhere in the middle to win back voters they've lost?

Well, I think that's probably strategically the key, because if you look at the state and others where Democrats, what has changed?

It is the exodus of blue collar labor, working class voters who had migrated increasingly to the Republican Party and perhaps because of Donald Trump or certainly nudged in that direction.

So it's not as if the more progressive and I these are labels who don't really play because they're a progressive factions of the labor faction of the party, and vice versa.

So but the, the, the folks that that you were talking about, Chris.

they they're not where are they going to go?

It's not that they're, they're not going to go switch now and go with the Republican Party.

and they're smart enough to realize that a, probably a third party, you know, solution is not if you were really opposed to what's happening nationally and in this state in terms of Republican control, Supermajorities in the legislature, that's that protest vote is not going to do much good.

So you have them anyway.

You know, this is.

But you yes, I agree that they're not going to go vote for somebody else, but are they just not going to go and vote?

You know, is the question you don't want.

Well, in 2016.

But if you had if you had that faction before and you didn't win.

Yeah.

What's wrong with the mathematics then.

Yeah that's true.

It is winning back.

So it seems to be the right strategy but cannot work.

Yeah.

Oh gosh.

You're the second person today to ask me, you know how they they get back right.

And I you know I just don't know I think who I think they do have to try to come in a little out from the fringes.

And frankly, both parties need to do that and focus on more kitchen table issues.

I hate to, you know, use the phrase, but that's where people are at.

They're they're concerned about inflation and prices and jobs and things like that.

They're not necessarily as concerned about identity politics and things like that.

So that, you know, her whole strategy was to offer rationality, which is something that is missing from the opposition party.

She's doing a good job of looking in the mirror.

And before you can go and do you know, rah rah rah Republicans are bad in Indiana, you need to first start to look at how can we rebuild within?

How can we start putting the foundation down to be successful?

I think she's doing a good job of like first trying to focus on that aspect.

Time now, for viewer feedback each week we post an unscientific online poll question, and this week's question is, will labor union voters shift back to the Democratic Party A yes or B no?

Last week, we asked you whether Indiana's property tax system needs a major overhaul.

Certainly that rally at the statehouse said they do.

67% of you said yes, 33% said no.

If you'd like to take part in the poll.

Got a fire smile.

We're and look for the poll.

Well, the federal government will be funded through September, after President Donald Trump this week signed a continuing resolution to avert a shutdown.

And he was able to do so after a small group of Senate Democrats, led by Minority Leader Chuck Schumer, chose to advance the CR, prompting outcry from many in their party.

The measure cuts $13 billion in non-defense spending while providing a small boost to the defense budget.

The many Democrats who voted against it also pointed out that it does nothing to rein in President Trump and Elon Musk's efforts to cut spending already approved by Congress.

Senator Chuck Schumer, speaking on the floor about his decision to advance the bill, said allowing the government to shut down was a far worse option.

But increasingly, Democrats are calling on Schumer to step aside from leadership with Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez saying many Dems are outraged and feel like Schumer's actions are a slap in the face.

Like.

Jon Schwantes, Chuck Schumer has said that once President Trump is out of power, the GOP will return to.

In his words, the old Republican Party.

Is Chuck Schumer delusional?

Well, he may want to talk with JD Vance or Donald Trump, junior.

Jim Banks or Jim Banks and any number of other people who sort of became of their formative years in as politicians were watching the rise of Donald Trump.

Clearly that tapped into something that has been around.

I mean, the the political scientists will talk about, you know, the, this goes back to the 50s and the Nixon administration and the, you know, giving up the South or, you know, gaining the South.

It there's a lot of, pieces and parts moving in this chess game.

But, I think it's more complex than any one individual.

Although I will say no one seems to have the ability to compel action.

either or stop action.

The way that that Donald Trump.

Really not action.

Well, yeah.

And that's I think why Chuck Schumer, he would say, you know, was fearful of adding to the chaos and inviting, you know, martial law or.

Yeah, well, let me let me ask you this then, though.

And, I mean, you advance this continuing resolution to keep the government from shutting down.

But if the legislative branch has decided that Donald Trump can stop funding anything he wants, I.

Don't think the legislature's decided that.

And I don't think the courts have decided that, you know, for example, the Department of Education is a is a cabinet.

It was established by the by Congress.

He can't simply unilaterally say that and that it doesn't exist anymore.

All of these things are going to be litigated in courts.

And he can scream all he wants about impeaching judges that don't agree with him.

I think finally, Chief Justice Roberts has to develop a backbone and say enough because we're headed to martial law unless the courts intervene to stop him from doing the illegal actions that he and Elon Musk are trying to do.

I mean, the idea that you can just grab people up off the streets ahead of a potential gang membership, whether you have any criminal action or not, whether you have a green card or not.

I mean, they're doing things that are.

Or any evidence.

Or any evidence of anything and then export them like that.

He he just he he doesn't believe in the rule of law.

He thinks he's Putin in the U.S. and the courts have got to step in and stop him.

I want to ask a lot of the focus following the continuing resolution has been on Democrats because of the outcry from progressives.

and not even that progressive.

Democrats.

the outcry in a lot for a lot of the party about Schumer's leadership.

But I want to ask about the Republican Party a little bit in that they've got control of everything.

But now a very, very slim majority in the House.

But they got the bill through the House.

They have a, a slightly larger majority in the Senate.

They obviously have the white House.

And this is all they could get.

Just another continuing resolution.

Are you surprised they can't get a budget done?

not necessarily just because I think the the amount of chaos, whether you like it or not, there's there's a lot going on at the federal level.

So I think that adds a lot of uncertainty to trying to pass something as certain as a budget that I think that's why you try to tend to go to the resolution.

but to your point, I do think a lot of credit has to go to, you know, Speaker Johnson for having such a slim majority.

You could argue that's difficult.

But also, you're in a position where if you're one of the 1 or 2 Republicans that vote against the rest of the Republicans, all of a sudden you're in the crosshairs of being the person that's against the Donald Trump, you know, mandate given by the American people going against his agenda.

So I think a lot of credit has to go to him for keeping that in line.

And then, you know, for all my buddy Schumer, he he was in a lose lose situation there, wasn't he.

He was.

Yeah.

He you know he's a smart politician.

And he didn't want to let Trump both blame the Democrats for not having a continuing resolution.

And give somebody who doesn't believe in the rule of law a blank check to go out and do whatever he wants to.

At the same time that we've we've seen government shutdowns.

I mean, going back, you know, gosh, almost 30 years now to the Clinton days and time after time after time, the results of all those shutdowns show that the that whichever party is in the white House is the party that gets blamed regardless of what the minority party tries to stop or, or even the the majority in the in the legislature tries to stop.

It's the party in the white House who gets blamed.

So to Chuck Schumer, I agree a lose lose situation choose the losing or side.

I mean, I think his big mistake was coming out and saying he wasn't going to vote and then immediately popping.

You know, I am surprised there's not a little more focus on the Republicans who went around with this.

For a year.

We listened to campaigning all about the, you know, federal deficit and the debt ceiling and out of control spending.

And they their first action, you know, budgetary wise, was a continuing resolution that raises the debt ceiling.

And no one seemed to care at all here.

Historical examples, I think, are sound.

But one thing missing from them is social media, the ubiquitous social media, which I think the pendulum of history is now fundamentally altered by ubiquitous social media, probably for the worse.

All right.

Language dropped into an unrelated bill in a House committee this week, banned state and local government units from hosting or funding obscene performances.

The provisions author couldn't provide examples of what he's trying to ban.

State law says a performance is obscene if the average person, applying contemporary community standards finds that the dominant theme appeals to the prurient interest in sex.

If the performance depicts or describes in a patently offensive way, sexual conduct, and if it lacks serious literary, artistic, political or scientific value.

Republican Representative Chris Cheater, the languages author, was asked repeatedly by both lawmakers and Indiana Public Broadcasting for examples and whether he had anything specific in mind.

He says no.

I've heard about it in other places and seen some things in other states, and I just want to make sure that we make it really clear that here, you know, those are not going to.

Be public events.

Like, what sort of things are we talking about?

Just performances that.

That are sexual in nature.

Or that that appeal to those types of interests that are not appropriate for minors?

Asked specifically whether his language aims to target drag storytimes at public libraries where performers in drag read to children, Jeter says he doesn't know that it's a case by case basis, and that it's up to communities to decide.

Nick Kelly, why be cagey about this?

Yeah, I don't know.

I mean, you brought an amendment in in this bill.

I think he probably should have been ready to answer more directly some examples.

Or maybe he's being cagey because, I mean, the fact is, is we saw some things there.

I mean, most drag performances, the storytime ones, anyway, those aren't saps.

They showed.

They're dressed in drag, but they're reading a book.

I mean, that the Indiana law and the drag they're dressed in is not particularly sexual anyway, right?

And the Indiana law on what would count as an obscene performance is pretty high.

I mean, the entire performance has to be basically about sex.

And so I'm not sure it actually stops much.

and, you know, but I do wish some concrete examples had been given before we put things.

Yeah.

Jon, does this feel like.

Well, sure.

Okay.

No government should host or fund an obscene performance as defined by Indiana law, which copies basically its language from a U.S. Supreme Court decision on what is or is not obscene.

Okay.

Is that really happening anywhere in Indiana?

Not that I'm aware of.

No one invited me.

If it is, You know, they are, by the way, it would be a crime.

It wouldn't.

That's right.

That's the thing.

So it's already, if you get a jury, a prosecutor to prosecute obscenity and a jury to convict somebody, it's already there.

Yeah, yeah.

You had an example.

Well, yeah.

I mean, the Supreme Court at one point said when trying to define obscene, said, I know what when I see it.

Yeah.

And I saw it, I saw it with state money, the Oaken Bucket game.

If you were a Purdue fan and you lost 66 to nothing, you would think that.

That's a perfect segue, because finally it is the best time of the year.

March madness is upon us.

There are four Indiana teams in the men's and women's tournaments for seed Purdue on the men's side, who won yesterday, three seed Notre Dame, eight seed Indiana, which is playing like right as we take this.

And 12 seed Ball State on the women's side.

Ann DeLaney which Indiana school will go the furthest.

I have to go with Notre Dame.

I'd like to be able to go to IU, but I think I have to go with Notre Dame.

It's going the furthest.

Probably Notre Dame, but I'm rooting for Ball State.

They are so fun to watch.

Their guard play is unreal.

Keep an eye on them.

You'll be entertained.

Yeah, a nice upset for Team Notre Dame.

Probably nobody believes in Purdue on the men's side.

I wonder do you always.

Feel like they're running into the Titans?

McNeese I think okay, I think I think Notre Dame.

But in deference to your request and I'll say and and things kind of maybe Purdue.

Yeah.

I mean a few weeks ago I was ready to pick Notre Dame to win the whole thing.

And the way they played these last few weeks, I don't think I definitely don't have them winning the whole thing anymore.

But I would like to think they will go the furthest.

Jon, I'm sure you didn't mention that.

Are you snubbed from the men's?

From the men's?

Well, as long as you brought it up, that's, And that's Indiana Week In Review for this week.

Our panel is Democrat Ann DeLaney, Republican Chris Mitchem, Jon Schwantes of Indiana, lawmakers and Niki Kelly of the Indiana Capital Chronicle.

You can find Indiana Week In Reviews, podcast and episodes at wfyi.org/iwir or on the PBS app.

I'm Brandon Smith of Indiana Public Broadcasting.

Join us next time because a lot can happen in an Indiana week.

The views expressed are solely those of the panelists.

Indiana Week in Review is produced by WFYI in association with Indiana Public Broadcasting stations.

Additional support is provided by the Indy Chamber, working to unite business and community to maintain a strong economy and quality of life.