Welcome to This Week in South Carolina.

I'm Gavin Jackson.

Hurricane season is just around the corner and this week we're joined by the Nature Conservancy's Director Dale Threatt Taylor and the Director of the Department of Insurance Ray Farmer about the challenges the state faces from storms.

But first, Derrec Becker with South Carolina's Emergency Management Division gives us an update on this year's hurricane season.

Derrec, thanks for joining us.

<Derrec Becker> Absolutely.

Happy to be here.

<Gavin> So Derrec, start us off by giving an overview about what forecasters are expecting for the 2021 hurricane season right now.

<Derrec> Sure, well the National Hurricane Center they issue their forecasts every single year.

And they are predicting another above average or very active season with 13 to 20 named storms.

Six to ten of those could become actual hurricanes.

Of course last year 2020 was the most active season on record.

It was also the year that South Carolina didn't see any impacts, unlike 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018 and 2019.

<Gavin> Yeah.

<Derrec> It's been a lot.

<Gavin> So, I mean again, we dodged a bullet last year especially considering it was the most active hurricane season on record.

That being said, we had a year off essentially.

Obviously, we've been reacting to the pandemic.

You guys have been responding to that for more than a year now.

But when you switch gears, how prepared is this state for these natural disasters especially hurricanes, flooding.

Obviously you just listed those previous years where we had this experience with this, but when it comes back to reactivating, what's the state's response right now?

The mentality?

<Derrec> Yeah, well the state has a very good response.

We have a lot of experience in responding to and actually unfortunately recovering from hurricanes.

No, we have not seen the direct impact of a major storm since Hurricane Hugo.

So that's always going to be a concern, but we're as prepared as we possibly can be, there's always going to be something or something that comes up in a disaster or in a hurricane that you don't foresee but our plans are flexible enough to be able to respond to those very quickly.

<Gavin> So when we do see a storm approach the coast, it's out there in the Atlantic it's churning up things.

We keep looking at these models.

We keep wondering whether it's actually going to come.

What can people expect to hear and see from the state, from S.C.E.M.D.

when it starts to really become a threat.

What do you guys start doing?

What should people be aware of, especially if they're new to this state, having relocated here?

<Derrec> Yeah absolutely.

One of the main things is, you'll start to see it on the news when there's just a little tiny something in the middle of the Atlantic that could possibly potentially turn into a hurricane, our local meteorologists and even our national meteorologists will start tracking it very, very early on.

Depending on what track the storm takes, we could extend operations here at the state's emergency operations center or we could just continue to monitor like I said, it's completely dependent on the storm.

If it looks like a storm is going to make landfall in South Carolina or in that that cone of probability, if you will, we definitely would activate the state's emergency operations center.

The counties would be involved, all the state agencies.

The governor could potentially declare a state of emergency and then issue an evacuation from the coast.

<Gavin> When we talk about evacuations of the coast we've seen these over the past few storms too, how critical is it to heed those warnings.

You know, people look at that cone of probability and I know that's always kind of controversial about what to look for and where to be, but when does it really kind of come become push comes to shove at that point?

When should people really be heeding the advice of officials?

<Derrec> Absolutely, well, whenever the governor issues an evacuation for a hurricane that's not a decision that's made lightly.

It's the result of us talking with the experts at the National Hurricane Center, speaking with our local forecasters at the National Weather Service offices that serve South Carolina, talking to our local first responders and everybody collectively recommending to the governor that yes this storm is serious enough that we need people to leave the coast.

The last thing we want to do is to ask you to leave your home, but if the storm's dangerous enough and if what we're seeing in the predictions are serious enough, it's a last best option.

It's going to be very important for people to know, if they live on the coast, to know what hurricane zone they live in and be ready to act and have that evacuation plan ready to go.

<Gavin> Yeah because over the past few storms we have seen dozens of lives lost.

We've seen thousands of homes damaged, hundreds of millions of dollars in damage across the state both inland and on the coast.

What becomes a big threat in these situations?

If you're sticking around, what's the big concern for those folks who think they can ride it out either or just wait to the very end at that point?

<Derrec> The biggest concern is always going to be storm surge and flooding.

We say hide from wind, run from water.

So, with the reasons we evacuate would be predicted storm surge, if it's going to be serious enough that people cannot survive it, 10 feet to, Hugo, for example in 1989 had a 21 feet of storm surge.

So that's not survivable for many people, for anybody that I know for that matter.

But when it comes to a high wind storm, maybe you don't evacuate.

Maybe the safest place is your home if you live in a good sturdy house - that's been retrofitted to withstand that kind of wind.

But the main thing is, if you live on the coast line and you hear that evacuation warning go off, now's the time to leave.

<Gavin> And then that inland flooding threat too.

We've talked a lot of places about, like Charleston typically floods.

We see that even on a sunny day can flood down in Charleston, but places like Conway and Socastee have seen their fair share of flooding, river flooding especially when we talk about the Waccamaw.

Are these places and others further inland as well, becoming more fortified as a result of maybe some federal funding that has come to the state or maybe just more of a focus because of repeated flooding?

>> You touch on a very good point that a lot of people say in the upstate or even in the Midlands think that, "Oh, hurricanes are mainly a coastal thing."

But no, the entire state is susceptible to the effects of a hurricane.

Flooding like you just mentioned but also the possibility of high winds and tornadoes.

So it's going to be important for everyone in the state to monitor the forecast.

To take, pay attention and be ready to act if there's a warning issued for their area.

When it comes to the inland flooding that we've seen, the Hurricane Florence in 2018 comes to mind.

Of course, all the rain from Hurricane Florence came down the river system from North Carolina and into areas like Socastee and Marion County, Socastee being in Horry County, of course.

But a lot of people there have decided to stay.

Some have decided to leave and that's the decision you have to make as a homeowner as to whether or not you want to continue to know that you live in this flood prone area.

Some areas have begun the process of applying for mitigation grants, but that takes a lot of time probably several years in fact.

<Gavin> And is that something they consult y'all with these cities and counties when it comes to what to do with this kind of money a mitigation money from the feds?

<Derrec> Right, we certainly help with their applications, but the Hazard Mitigation Program is made available to the states after major disasters and so anybody can apply for certain funding to expand drainage or to retrofit a certain building or even to purchase flood prone properties, repetitive flood prone properties, and so they work with us for that particular program.

The state's disaster recovery office also has funding that they can do to help communities.

Now, a lot of people need help.

Residents might need assistance and so there are some programs available for them, but they would have to contact the state's disaster recovery office for information about that.

<Gavin> So Derrec, just to wrap up right now, what should people be doing right now?

It's the start of hurricane season.

What should they be doing?

What kind of resources are available.

And just kind of give us a rundown now as we approach the 2021 season.

<Derrec> Sure.

Well, brand new this year, we're actually launching a brand new website Hurricane.SC.

And we want it to be the central point where people can go for a quick reference for a lot of information on what they should do to get ready for hurricane season.

People are familiar with the South Carolina hurricane guide.

It's going out.

It'll be available statewide: Walgreens, DMVs, welcome centers along the interstates but they can go to Hurricane.SC and get all this information.

It's highly interactive and they can hopefully learn a thing or two or just refresh their emergency plans.

<Gavin> Very good.

And that's Derrec Becker.

He's the Chief of Public Information and External Affairs as S.C.E.M.D.

Thanks Derrec.

Hopefully, we don't have to talk to you too much during this hurricane season.

<Derrec> I'm with you on that one.

<Gavin> Thanks.

Now to discuss the ramifications of flooding in the state, I'm joined by Dale Threatt Taylor.

She's the Executive Director of the Nature Conservancy of South Carolina.

And Ray Farmer.

He's the Department of Insurance Executive Director, as well.

Y'all, thanks for joining me today to discuss this very important topic as we approach hurricane season.

<Ray and Dale> Thank you Gavin.

Thank you.

<Gavin> So, Ray, I want to start with you.

We've had a busy past few years when it comes to storms and we're projected to have another active season again.

Tell us what role the Department of Insurance plays in dealing with the ramifications of these storms.

These recoveries after all the wind and the rain has gone and people are still picking up their lives, what role does D.O.I.

play?

<Ray> Well, Gavin we really have a role before and after the storm, but after the storm when all of the important people, the heroes, the first responders, have done their jobs, cleared the way for, for example a hurricane, cleared the way for people to go back home, that's when the insurance industry comes in and gets the money flowing, generated, so we can start rebuilding.

So our job is to make sure, number one that we have a solid insurance industry and we certainly do, but then to make sure the industry itself, the adjusters, the appraisers can get into those spots to serve our citizens.

Though, each one of those company representatives are all licensed by the department.

So, we'll make sure that we have emergency licenses ready to go.

So, as soon as possible when people return home, they should be sending an adjuster pretty quick.

And then as we go through the process itself people are going to have questions about their policy, about what the insurance company is or is not doing.

And so we have a great staff here that day in and day out, help our consumers throughout the state.

<Gavin> Yeah, and I was going to say it's been a busy, several active busy years since 2015 especially with the flood here in Columbia and throughout the state.

Have you guys gotten it down to a science when it comes to preparing for these storms and the season and then with recovery efforts as well.

<Ray> Unfortunately, every state agency led by the Emergency Management folks have it down to a science.

It's amazing that when that storm happens and the governor declares a state of emergency, all those state agencies click in and no one has to ask what do I do next.

It is an amazing process that we've had plenty of experience from the I guess the flood in 2015 and we've had some type of event most years subsequent to that.

<Gavin> And Dale when we look at the Nature Conservancy of South Carolina, what role do y'all play when it comes to mitigating storm effects or just getting ready for these active seasons?

>> Well just like everybody else, when storms happen, we care about our neighbors.

The thing is to listen to Director Farmer and be prepared and everything else, but the time to act is like now and after a storm when we've got the luxury of time to plan.

And our goal is to figure out nature based solutions that can actually help us prevent these catastrophic events of flooding in communities.

If we can put in nature based solutions where we are reducing that amount of floods, those are the things we love to do.

So we're constantly planning on how we can get in and analyze, where these events are happening.

What can we do?

What kind of solutions can be put in so that we don't have, years from now our grandchildren aren't going through the exact same thing we're going through now.

<Gavin> Dale how has that changed since 2015, since we've been so active since then and not only just when we talk about coastal conservation issues but maybe inland issues, inland flooding that y'all, that we've been seeing, as well.

We've actually, we look at science and we've been seeing where were the places that was not as impacted with flooding as other places and we've constantly come back to data.

So the Nature Conservatory has been really busy here in the last couple years, really starting with some projects.

A lot, we have in Conway, projects we have in Andrews, also in Mount Pleasant, where we've piloted some projects to really get on the ground trying to show where we can reduce this amount of flooding.

We put in, constructed wetlands.

We put in restored wetlands that can absorb more.

We've looked at storm water run off and we figured out how can we reduce the amount of erosion that's going on.

The amount of impacts going on and so, and looking at the data, that has done, I'm very optimistic.

Those storms told a big story and it really impacted our communities to flooding.

But some of the projects that we've implemented has really provided the data to help us move forward.

We've got piloted programs going on right now, new projects going in Georgetown and other places that really makes me optimistic.

I've only been here for two hurricane seasons.

Coming up on my second hurricane season and I really was blessed that I missed it last year.

But having come from North Carolina I've been through a long of hurricanes and so I know the devastation that can rain down, but it's new to me here in South Carolina but the team has learned a lot.

>> Yeah especially, North Carolina was affected by Hurricane Florence, as we were too.

It's just that with torrential downpour that really affected our rivers and inland flooding.

Director Farmer, I want to ask you about the creation of the Flood Water Commission back in 2019.

That was a big step forward for the state to really kind of get a lot of agencies on the same page, kind of get an idea about what needs to be done to prevent these issues from happening going forward.

Of course, we just saw the legislature create the Disaster Relief and Resilience Fund and also they're funding the Office of Resilience.

I want to ask you about what all this means for this state kind of going forward and trying to attack these issues before they become worse than they already are.

>> Well, as Dale said now is the time to be prepared.

And through Governor McMaster's Flood Water Commission of a couple years ago, you've seen the state become more prepared.

The Flood Water Commission itself working with the Nature Conservancy and about 50 other groups did a lot of common sense efforts to well mitigate flood damage.

One of them was down in the Conway area where they - one Saturday we all met and cleaned out creeks and channels.

There had been no rain for a period of time but yet you saw standing water in creeks and with the help of the Department of Transportation and others these big cranes came in and picked up everything imaginable that were in those creeks and now all of sudden you saw the water starts flowing back where it - toward the rivers like it should.

So those kind of common things, common sense things, planting trees, planting wire grass, those are those are some of the efforts that the Floodwater Commission did during it's time.

>> And then Dale when we talk about coastal flooding.

That's always a constant threat too, people are still building in vulnerable areas.

In fact, one third of the Low Country, One third of Low Country homes are on land that is 10 feet below sea level.

So when you see the kind of development happening, you look at aerial satellite photography from the 1980s to 2020, especially down in the Charleston area, you look at West Ashley development, Mount Pleasant.

How do you remedy this situation or do we just have to accept it and hope that people are trying to put on some best practices to affect runoff and flooding and nuisance flooding, especially as sea level rise is about 10 inches since 1950 in the Charleston area.

It's creeping about one inch every few years.

What do you say to people?

What do you hope to accomplish now?

<Dale> Well, and the first thing it's always clear as I understand that the Nature Conservancy, we're not here to fight nature nor are we to fight our neighbors.

We're always constantly looking for nature based solutions.

So - we're thinking how can we address this.

We're looking for where are areas where we can put in perhaps restoring oyster reefs or so that they can break the water, natural areas that'll repair themselves.

Really mimicking nature in every way we can, what would nature do is what we're constantly saying.

We're not going to ask an entire coastline to pick up and move inland.

We're not going to be unrealistic, but are we going to look and say, "Hey, can we put in "nature based solutions that will actually lessen "the impact on humans?."

As well as being in the room where policies are being made or discussions have been happening that we can make sure that nature based solutions are a part of infrastructure.

Right now in Washington, there's a big, of course infrastructure bill that's going to be coming down to our policy leaders, our legislative leaders and congressional leaders and we want to make sure that they include nature based solutions in those discussions, because to be frankly honest, just saying that there's only a wall can be built or only hard construct solution can be happening, we don't believe that's the case.

We believe that we can have solutions.

So Dale do you think developers are becoming more cognizant about sustainability and resilience issues as far as you can tell?

<Dale> Oh yeah, absolutely!

I was listening actually to a news podcasts or NPR something this morning saying that how important it is for sustainability offices in businesses now, almost everybody has a chief sustainability office.

Here in South Carolina the Nature Conservatory is also a part of sustaining a seat where businesses and commerce and conservation are uniting.

And so we know that developers, we know that businesses, which is very important here in South Carolina - we need jobs - understand how important sustainability is.

We can't - We can't do anything the same ever again.

We really have to make sure that conservation measures that nature based solutions, that sustainable measures are part of every industry and that includes the development community, low impact development, really have a designated preserve areas for wetlands for flood water to go and as Director Farmer said, where we have the transport of water, safely instead of flooding areas.

These are all just a few of the recipe that's needed for us to solve this issue.

<Gavin> Ray, to pick up on that when we talk about development, when we talk about the Low Country being developed over the past few decades, when we look at the Grand Strand with cutting through forests and getting through these natural areas and building of condos and the like, what's the trend when it comes to insuring these properties and homeowners insurance in these small vulnerable areas?

What's that been like?

Are we getting to point, maybe in some of these areas where it's going to become almost cost prohibitive to have insurance?

Are they going to even be able to get insurance in some points in the future?

<Ray> Well, we'll always be able to get insurance through the National Flood Insurance Program, NFIP, that basically has been the only source to purchase flood insurance, but here lately we've had an effort to attract insurance companies back into to this space.

Each one of us has got to take the personal responsibility to make sure that our homes are covered for flood insurers.

There's been a survey that 50% of our citizens don't realize that your normal homeowner's insurance policy does not cover flood.

One of the worst parts about this job in 2015, after the Great Flood, we were out in the community and people would come up for - ask questions for to get in touch with their company and so forth and it was heartbreaking that people did not understand the connection between homeowner's insurance and you've got to get a separate policy for flood.

I mean people had been in their home for 30 years, paid it off a year or two before and would come up and say, "Well, we have that flood insurance, "but we don't have a mortgage anymore, so we dropped it.

"Certainly our homeowners coverage covers flood."

Well, no it doesn't.

So, our job is to educate the public to make sure that they understand and then to make sure we have a market for that.

Just this past year, well last year, Governor McMaster signed the Private Insurance - Private Flood Insurance Act, that's an effort to attract more insurance companies to this space and we're beginning to see that to some degree.

We've got about 60 companies that write, in addition to the NFIP that write - probably it's a small sector of the market, right now, less than 20 million dollars in premium, but we're encouraged because that has increased year over year for the last two years.

So we're seeing some progress.

The private, Flood Insurance Act gives us some flexibility to attract carriers.

It provides good consumer protections.

So we think that the marketplace itself is going to be more competitive in the near future.

So, we're looking forward to that.

<Gavin> We go about three minutes left and Dale I want to ask you about these natural barriers that we look at.

We're talking about the marshes, where, - we have so many marches in this state.

I think we have the most in any state in the country, but unfortunately we're losing about 1.8 feet of them every year to erosion for a variety of reasons including sea level rise, coastal erosion, even boating.

I'm wondering when we look at things like that when we look at the removal of some of these forests or inland areas that would absorb runoff and the like, what needs to be done?

What are you guys trying to do to work and make sure that these areas are preserved and that we can have these natural barriers still in place for such storms like hurricanes?

>> Well, one of the things, we're working as hard and fast as we can with the Nature Conservancy and our other conservation partners.

We have a lot of conservation.

South Carolina is really well known for our land trusts and our conservation partners here in the Nature Conservatory chapter, South Carolina chapter is leading the way.

We have installed a lot of pilot programs where we have installed living shorelines and they have proven to work and we're now expanding that.

That is one of our many natural based, nature- based solutions, the living shorelines as well as forest preservation work.

And we're working hard and as fast as we can to implement as many conservation practices as we can.

It's just one of those things we can do that we know work and you can go on our website and see a lot of our living shoreline wetland restoration, wetland preservation areas that will really help us during these times of floods and coastal erosion and loss of marsh land and remind you if I can sneak it in real quick that these areas that we protect will also provide great areas for recreation, great areas for wildlife.

They're multiplying in the benefit to our quality of life for habitat, for water quality, for everything and so, I guess I keep saying and repeating, We come back working hard and fast as we can.

<Gavin> Gotcha.

Yeah.

There's a lot at stake there too.

And I know, every season just takes one storm.

We've seen it.

We saw it with Hugo, 30 more plus years ago.

We see those threats every season.

So hopefully, we'll make it through another one.

I want to thank our guests Dale Threatt Taylor She's the Executive Director at the Nature Conservancy of South Carolina and Ray Farmer, the Director of the Department of Insurance here in South Carolina.

Thank you both very much.

Stay safe this year.

To stay up to date with the latest news throughout the week, check out the South Carolina Lede.

It's a podcast that I host that drops multiple times each week.

You can find it on SouthCarolinapublicradio.org or wherever you find podcasts.

For South Carolina ETV, I'm Gavin Jackson.

Be well, South Carolina