Coming up on IGI, we look back on 100 years of the Menninger Clinic and its impact on mental health care in our community and across the nation.

Coming up next on IGI.

This program on KTWU is brought to you by friends of KTWU.

We appreciate your financial support.

Thank you.

Hello and welcome to IGI.

I'm your host, Tiffany Obezele.

This year marks the 100th anniversary of the renowned Menninger Clinic.

Over the next hour, we look back at the history of Menningers, the services they provided the impact that Menningers on the Topeka and the field of psychiatry, and the continuing legacy of the clinic.

Joining us now to discuss the history of Menningers are Walt Menninger, former CEO of the clinic and the current chairman of the board of Clinic Kansas, and Alison Beebe, a psychiatric nurse formerly with the clinic.

Walt and Alison, welcome to I've Got Issues.

I'm excited to have you here and learn more about the history.

Walt, I want to start with you.

What were the social and medical conditions that led to the founding of the Menninger Clinic?

It really was partly, the idea It was fully the idea of my grandfather, who was a family practitioner in Topeka in the 1890s, but was frustrated because at that time doctors didn't there were a lot of them, not a lot of medications.

And doctors kept to themselves techniques.

And he wanted to be able to share and have doctors work together.

And the idea didn't really come to fruition until later.

In 1908, he went to a continuing education meeting in Rochester, Minnesota, at the Mayo Clinic.

And was impressed of the doctors that cooperated and worked together there.

And although it sounds apocryphal, when he got home, he told his three sons at Sunday noon lunch, boys, I know what we're going to do.

You're going to become doctors, and we'll practice together.

He batted two out of three, and his eldest son, Carl, who came back in 1919, came back interested in being practicing psychiatry and neurology.

And grandfather said, that's fine as long as we practice together.

So Carl practiced that specialty.

Grandfather was a general practitioner.

And then and subsequently it became a problem with Carl's patients who couldn't be hospitalized in the General hospital.

So they had to have their own sanatorium.

And in 1925, they established the Menninger Sanatorium Corporation.

And sold stock to citizens in Topeka to raise the money to buy the farm.

That became the first Menninger Clinic.

Wow.

Sanatorium.

That's such a vague word.

What is sanatorium mean?

It's simply a term given for where people could come and stay and be cared for, and theoretically, in a sanitary, sanitary context, it was used for tuberculosis, but otherwise health care institution, usually in a, isolated spot or in a property that was like a farm or expanded territory, which is what the Menninger Sanatorium was.

Okay, so I hear you saying that you started out in a farmhouse, which is pretty cool.

How did the, You said Carl was one of the people and Will, was one of the people that really helped shape that early vision.

And so how did they help shape that vision of the clinic once it got to the farmhouse?

Well, it it was obviously a collaborative venture.

There were not medications in, in that to the same degree then.

So that the programs for caring for people who were emotionally troubled involve activities and, and interaction in a, in a therapeutic context.

And as it evolved, the program utilized activities outside.

And everybody who was involved in the management and operation was part of the treatment process.

So you had the doctor, but you had nurses and you had the groundskeepers and you had activity therapists and so forth.

As it evolved over time, because the treatment program involved the whole life of a full day of activity and so forth.

It wasn't just and there were not specific medications, so there was more interaction with the different people, personnel who were at the institution.

And I hear you saying that over time it evolved.

You know, why was, the approach I hear you saying collaboration.

I hear you saying evolving and having all of these people working together, for mental health at this time.

Why was that revolution to the field of psychiatry at the time?

Well, I don't know how revolutionary it was.

I know that what was a major contribution was my father's putting together a treatment protocol that involved everybody.

So that a patient would come in and there would be a diagnostic period, which they'd try to assess what were the emotional needs and the emotional challenges.

And then everybody who dealt with the patient doctors, nurses, groundskeepers, Food personnel and so forth all had an awareness that this patient had these kinds of problems, and you approach them in a particular way to try to address whether their problem was helping them get out to do things, helping them deal with their anger, which they had torn inward in depression or other emotion aspects that played out in daily life.

Okay, well, Allison, I want to turn to you for a moment.

I know you worked.

And then, of course, for a long time, even when it moved to Houston, you went.

I didn't.

Tell us about your role, and getting to help these patients and work at Menningers.

So I came to Menningers in 1988 when I was, I think, 22.

So I was just a pup.

And it was a great place to learn because the focus was on education.

And, teaching nurses all the staff.

I remember we had, three day long, sessions for nurses, for education.

That was amazing.

Or they would send us to Phoenix or different places to get the education.

So that was really important to train staff no matter who they were, which not every hospital does that.

You know, usually hospitals, it comes down from the top.

And then but it it was everyone has a voice.

And so we had that shared government governance which a lot of hospitals don't have, where my voice carried the same weight as well.

Maybe not his, but, maybe more, maybe more, maybe more.

But everyone had their opinion and people's thoughts were taken into consideration in the treatment of the person.

Because you're treating the person as a, as a whole, or you're not treating them as their diagnosis, you want to treat their, you know, medical health, their psychological health, their social health.

So all those different aspects.

So it was just an amazing learning experience coming from, I worked at the state hospital in Boston first, and I moved from Boston here to go from a state hospital to, you know, the world renowned Menninger Clinic, was amazing.

It was.

Yeah, it was really an amazing, amazing place.

So I hear you talking about this whole person approach.

It's very holistic.

And you're saying that everybody's doing activities outside.

Everybody's getting a voice.

How did this set, Menningers apart from what was being offered at the time for folks in mental health, the whole approach.

Menninger did a lot of collaborative work.

And also there was a basic understanding in terms of psychoanalytic theory that they applied as to what contributed to the problems of functioning.

And so there was collaborative work together.

There was a effort to learn to hear everybody's input, to get to the the even the folks serving the food, will see things happen and feed that back into the assessment and the interaction and the therapeutic contributions that would lead to change.

I do think one of the differences might be the patient was also part of the team versus us saying, you need to do x, y, z.

The patient obviously has feedback.

It's their lives, right?

They have information that we don't have.

They're the only ones who know how they're feeling, how they're doing.

And so the patient was an integral part of their own team, which only makes sense, like you say that now.

And it's like, well, of course, but then I think that was, revolutionary.

Wow.

Okay, so, Allison, I know you said you were there since you were 22.

Just about right.

Just, what stories have you heard or experienced about the early days of the clinic?

Getting to work there.

Oh, girl, there's so many stories.

I just, you know, I was trying to think of this earlier because there's so many.

What's your favorite?

My favorite.

Oh, gosh.

It was just fun because it you knew people were going to show up and do a good job.

You didn't have to worry like, oh, so-and-so is always late.

And people showed up and they knew that the the bar was elevated and they knew they had to reach that bar.

But it wasn't it wasn't a pressurized feeling where it was like, oh, you have to you want it to.

You wanted to excel because that was the expectation.

And it was like, this is cool.

It's like being on an Olympic team, right?

You wanted to excel.

I think some of the fun things were, you know, one of my favorite things was I could walk to the credit union, get money out of my account, go to the travel agent and book a trip because there was a travel agent on campus.

So of course, I'm going over there.

You know, just those things, you know, if you got sick, there was a doctor that could see staff.

You could go in for a doctor's appointment.

You could get your medicine filled at the pharmacy if you wanted.

You.

The food was great.

So we all ate there.

It was.

It was a family.

It was a family.

Oh, yeah.

And all that talk about food.

When anybody who is in a hospital for a long time or whatever, food becomes a very important part of one's life.

And it's important that, that the food be good and, and varied and so forth.

Menninger was, running our cafeteria, and all through the seasons was always one of the best places to eat in Topeka, really was.

Oh, what about, like, your interaction with the community?

It sounds like you had community within.

How was your interaction with the community?

In Topeka, as you were, building the practice and interacting with.

Well, I grew up in Topeka, and so, was a known quantity in one way or another.

But even as I was practicing community, I very active, remained active in my church.

And it was in the choir at church that I was active in the Rotary Club.

I remained active in community activities, and staff were encouraged to do to, have those connections and be part of that community.

And one of the other fascinating things that's often quoted about is how the community was part of the process here, because patients didn't always stay just at the hospital, and they reached a point where they could go out and actually work in the community.

And so there was an interaction of the community, with the activities of Menninger and an awareness.

And I think over time, pride in the community because the institution achieved its stature.

I, I'm not sure how, you know, exactly what it was, but in 1935, there was an article in fortune magazine about private psychiatric hospitals and had several hospitals on the East Coast and the Menninger Hospital.

They only say only space.

But from there, to the west.

And so it got our reputation early, of high regard.

And it sustained.

And then it became even more significant when, after World War Two, there was a demand for training of psychiatrists, and it became an influential thought center for the training of more psychiatrists than any other training program in the world for about a decade.

That is pretty cool.

Walt, and Allison, thank you so much, for being here on idea to share the historical relevance of the Menningers clinic.

Coming up next, we discussed the services that Menninger Clinic offered while here in Topeka.

Stay with us.

Joining us now to discuss the various services that Menninger Clinic provided over the years are Alice Everhart- Wright former child health specialist and family therapist at the Menninger Clinic.

Kay Kelly, formerly the director of social work at Menningers and a founding partner of Heritage Mental Health Clinic in Topeka.

And doctor Marci Baumann Bork, child, adolescent and adult psychiatrist and founding partner for Heritage Mental Health Clinic here in Topeka.

Ladies, welcome to IGI.

I want to start with you.

Kay.

And I want to talk about what kinds of services and therapies, were offered at the clinic during your time there.

And where you were at the clinic?

I came to Menninger in, 1987 under the Postmasters Fellowship program at the Partial Hospital Services, and I also was in the outpatient department as well.

And I think when I was asked to talk about the services at the clinic, I was started remembering all of the things that Menninger had to offer and the breadth and the range of services.

You know, as a friend, I was going to forget something.

You know, it's it's so many services that they provided.

So regardless of what the service was, I would say this, that a patient could come in and feel, like they were going to be really understood and the time was going to be taken for them, whether they came in to an inpatient unit, which we had the Hope unit, we had an eating disorder unit, we had an addictions unit, we had a professional and crisis unit.

These are all inpatient that I'm talking about right now.

Crisis unit.

We also had the partial hospital, which was in between an inpatient and a person going to an outpatient, therapy, for example, and partial hospital.

There was halfway houses in the community.

We also had community residents program, and there were families in Topeka who housed the patients too, when they were in the partial hospital program.

So that was kind of an in between.

Service that was offered.

And then so there was a wide variety of services, and I'm just talking about adult services at this point.

I think some people will be talking about the child services a little bit later, but so you can imagine that, that there was everything there.

There was, art therapy for people.

There was woodworking therapy.

There was, music therapy.

There was, I mean, biofeedback, hypnosis, group psychotherapy, group educational therapy.

And there was just, everything that you could imagine, really, that a person might need to recover.

So it was quite it.

The services were, like I said, unique, I think, in that way.

And, it was a wonderful place to be and to see what services could be offered to people and actually to the staff.

Also to us so far as the training which was mentioned earlier.

So yeah, I will actually.

What about you?

Where were you and what therapies and services were offered?

Where you were?

I came in 1983 as a resident, so I did my residency training here.

And from there I was, on the Professionals in Crisis Unit, which was a brand new program at the time.

And that was very exciting.

I later became the residency director.

And so it was a exciting place to be because there were new residents coming in, new ideas, new staff coming in all the time.

And it was always more, that could be offered to the patients because we had new blood coming and going all the time.

And then later in my career, I was the director of the outpatient center in the community, 32, 27, 37th and Burlingame.

And it was another unique service.

It was really focused on, treating people in the community that was off the campus.

I echo what Katie was saying.

It was really wonderful that when you saw a patient, you knew that there was somebody at Menninger that could help you.

Whether it was diagnosis or fine placement or, whatever their next step in treatment needed to be.

And, I think I even heard you say there is horticulture.

There was a greenhouse.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's pretty cool.

It's something for everybody to do.

Yeah, yeah.

So I think both of you guys have talked to us about adult services, so I want to turn and talk with us, about some children's services.

And, Alice, why don't you tell us where you were and what kinds of things you got to, deal with?

With therapies and services?

Well, I prodded Topeka to become aware of problems starting early and children.

I grew up here with a my mother's a large daycare center, and every year there were children with serious emotional problems and no treatment.

They would say we'll take them when they're six years old.

I went away to college on both coasts.

First, California and Massachusetts.

Neither of my programs in child development dealt with kids with serious emotional problems.

So I found a couple of clinics in Boston that I observed.

I went I did an independent study at Tufts on teacher techniques with emotionally disturbed preschoolers, and I was intending to stay on the East Coast.

But my mother, who had been my partner, from the time I was seven years old in developing services for children, wanted to entice me back to Topeka.

So she told me about a research project that was being done at Topeka State Hospital.

On how her mother's mental illness affected her preschool children.

The consultant on that program was somebody I had wanted to study with who had been at Menninger, Lois Murphy.

I'd read her book about watching children grow up, and I wanted to study with her.

She was at Sarah Lawrence.

So she advised me not to come there because she was on sabbatical that year.

So I went to Tufts, and then I found out she was going to be the consultant for this research project at Topeka State Hospital.

So I came back and they didn't know what to call me.

I had a master's degree in child study, but they called me a psychologist and put me on the psychology faculty, and I had to learn about mental health.

By the time I left Topeka State nine years later, we were serving 50 children in our families.

We'd been given a building, we'd been given the van.

The community was involved in giving us equipment.

Walt Menninger gave a crib for our baby nursery when we started taking babies, and I made a speech in Chicago about, prevention on a shoestring for staff and 40 volunteers that came every day.

And so it was a very, very exciting period.

We were a family, went to things on Saturday mornings.

There were always presentations I learned on the job how to do all this stuff and then made up lots of strategies.

Wow.

So now Alice, the children's unit also had inpatient and I wasn't.

Yeah, we were okay, I was separate, you were separate, I wasn't separate, I was with the day treatment center the day treatment.

Okay.

And then I became part of the children's department.

And then when I left Topeka State Hospital after I lost a key position, I worked in private practice, and people trained me.

And then I took a job in research at Menninger on adolescent pregnancy.

And we studied, over 100, babies with teenage mothers at Johns Hopkins, set up Joe and Lucy, where by that time many girls started their therapeutic preschool.

Six months after I started mine.

Okay, okay, now that sounds pretty innovative.

And it sounds very collaborative, which we were on, very collaborative.

I did a lot in the history of it.

Yeah.

What role did, spiritual quality art, occupational therapy play in patient care.

And I'll start with you.

Well, that was all part of it.

There were we had, you know, pastors that were part of our team to as well as, art therapist, as well as the horticultural and the woodworking was a great service.

I remember a lot of the the patients that had a lot of anger issues.

They got on board working very intensively on that wood, and it was really helped with anger issues.

Yeah.

You know, if anybody remembers them.

But that was kind of do you remember that.

No.

Okay.

So but that's Yeah.

I mean, you know, I think whatever, you know, a patient needed it was kind of there.

And the diagnostic part was, was there.

We took the time to really understand someone.

I think we've said that, before, but it was taking that time to really understand, and all the services were there.

So you were kind of contained in a lot of ways, to help, to help people.

Art therapy was a big thing.

Art therapy was a big.

Yeah, very big.

Just to speak to the spirituality part of it.

I think a lot of people separate psychiatry from spirituality, and the part that I really appreciated at Menninger was the fact that they addressed everybody believes something.

And if you don't bring your spirituality into their treatment, you leave out a big piece of how they view the world, how they relate to other people, what they think about their lives going forward.

And so it was a very important piece of their overall treatment was awesome.

Alice Kay and Marcy, thank you for sharing your experiences while you were a part of the team.

Coming up next on our segment, we'll talk about the community impact of Menninger Clinic, and we'll be right back.

And we are back, joining us now to discuss the impact the clinic had on both Topeka and the field of psychiatry.

are Joan Wagner and former mayor of Topeka, Larry Wohlgasht former Menningers development director and also former Topeka mayor.

And a familiar face fact to join us for the discussion.

Doctor Walt Menninger, thank you all for being here today.

I want to talk about the, Menningers Clinic and how it shaped Topeka's identity.

Doctor Menninger, I'll start with you.

Well, I have to go back to when I was a child prior to prior to World War two, there was an exodus of psychoanalysts and psychiatrists from Europe, Jews who were escaping Hitler's Nazi Germany and who were highly respected in the field of psychiatry, psychology.

And a number of them were attracted to Topeka to help and increase the degree of specialty awareness in Topeka, and the institution already had established a national reputation because of the writings of Doctor Carl and the educational work of doctor Will and and the work that the clinic had done.

And they changed the nature of the intellectual community in Topeka.

A second major development affecting Topeka was when, after the war, the VA knew it had a need for great more, great many more psychiatrists in the country because of the casualties from the psychiatric casualties from World War Two.

And they came to Topeka and convinced Doctor Carl to that to establish to expand the training capacity at Menninger to include a VA hospital.

And overnight in 1946, Topeka and the Menninger Institution became the largest training program for psychiatrists in the country, with 100 doctors in training before they may be trained.

Largest training center, maybe to 8 or 10.

Yeah, and that Menninger School of Psychiatry then expanded to not only train psychiatrists, but clinical psychologists, social workers, clergy and all related mental health disciplines.

And it in cooperated not only the VA but the Topeka State Hospital.

So it became a major enterprise and also attracted to Topeka educated population of of doctors that with various interests for in the community but in learning and expanding and that had an impact on this community.

If I could just add to that fact among the the Jewish, doctors or therapists who came here, developed a very large Jewish community in Topeka.

And for a city this size, had a well-developed synagogue, a very strong part.

And, of course, they were very, influential in the arts, in the culture, in the history, development of Topeka.

They became sort of one of the backbones that made Topeka unique and also added so much to the cosmopolitan aspect of Topeka.

That's pretty cool.

Well, Joan, I knew you wanted to talk to us about, like, the community impact in general.

And so we've learned about this, like, population that came here, added to the fabric in the culture.

And so tell us some more about the impact in general as the mayor.

Well, not only as the mayor, but when, a resident of Topeka, they're in their in your neighborhoods.

In in my neighborhood, I had a psychiatrist living across the street when you go to Washburn to go to their chamber music society, it's usually somebody who was from Menninger that helped organize it or where they were attending or could have even been playing there in the symphony.

They are, throughout the community and what that did for Topeka was, energized and, and, innovated a whole lot.

And it made it a much nicer place to live because you had, these folks around when Topeka, learned that was going to think about leaving.

It created a lot of anxiety because people could tell how important it had been.

Not only the more than 1000 employees that they had or the facilities that they operated, but they were part of us.

And, so we worked together.

Doctor, doctor Walt, you remember coming into the office to give me that news, and I think, the whole community, felt like what they did was so important.

We just might have to turn them loose.

And so we worked with, the groups to see what we can do to find a way to make managers continue to succeed, even if it's not here.

But what they've left in this community is a wonderful fabric of cooperation and, strength.

So cool.

Well, and, I mean, going one step beyond when, just Topeka, but nationally and in my role was, development director, I would call on corporations and all, various donors or potential donors throughout the country.

And it was always amazing to learn you you have your thoughts prepared.

I'm going to tell about the background manager and what it's doing.

And generally they already knew.

Yeah.

And that was that.

The first part almost the door was opened because, of course the Menninger family had done so much of that in the 40s and 50s.

Doctor Walts father was and, and his mother were just unique in going all over the country and becoming friends with the people that run the corporations, society people, money, people that have the means that could make major contributions to Menninger.

And because of that, Menninger had one of the largest endowments of any, hospital foundation like this in the country and made it possible for Menninger to continue and be very strong as, the medical issues were changing.

Oh, okay.

So.

Right, one of the things that Venegas was doing was really impacting mental health.

And so how do you think, what role do you think that played in reducing that stigma?

I hear the food and I hear working there and training, and you're bringing people locally and nationally, and it's changing the fabric of our community.

And so what role do you think it played in also helping to reduce the stigma around mental health here and nationally?

I think that locally, because people increasingly became aware that many patients who came here for treatment reached, a level of improvement that they didn't have to stay in the hospital, they actually live in the community.

And a number would get jobs in the community.

And so people learn that if you're mentally ill, you're not necessarily out of your head and, could be more taller and more aware of mental health issues.

That's one aspect.

But I think the the general awareness and appreciation for what people can be, is also improved by the contact of all of the work of the staff and the doctors in training and others who were not some strange person living you there, but as the mayor said, was living across the street and so that there was more acceptance and more awareness of the issues related to mental health, I think they provided, leadership in this community in a lot of different ways.

You would find, somebody, speaking at the city council meeting talking about a zoning issue or something, but because they were, from Menninger, they seemed to have a greater presence somehow.

I think they gave to this community something that's pretty hard to define.

But it was a sense of something really important was happening here.

And we were very proud as a community of having Menningers here.

And I want to make sure everybody still feels that pride.

Well, you know, that was reminds me of Menninger of course, because it was so well known and I think it was 97, it was voted the number one, by U.S. News and World Report, the number one Menninger Psychiatric Hospital in the country.

And that gives pride.

But then, they all people in Topeka always knew there were celebrities out here.

You know, somebody from the East coast, the West coast, whoever they are, they're they're they're out here.

And so they they'd always like to know, but yet they also knew about confidentiality.

Of course, you don't talk about that.

But we also brought many scholars.

Margaret Mead was a visiting professor.

Aldous Huxley was here.

And so we had, an extraordinary educational program and we hosted meetings of military, the army, psychiatrists and others.

So we had a constant program of continuing education, which brought people into to peek at it, to add to their professional skills and that's what Topeka took pride in.

Yeah.

Knowing that those people were because of Menninger.

Those people are coming to Topeka.

Well, and and even though they had to move to Houston to continue the the services, the legacy that the staff who remained or those who went for a while and came back, it has continued to enhance the community.

So I, I would say part of the move was required because with the changing funding of health care, we could not get enough money just from treating patients to court to cover the costs of our research and education.

And that was a major reason for the new, for the move to be able to have an affiliation with a university medical school that would pick up more of the education costs and help us with research costs that we could not generate from income from patients.

John, Larry, and Walt I know we could talk all day about the impact that Menningers had on our community and beyond.

I thank you all for joining us.

Coming up next, we have the opportunity to sit with current CEO and president of the Menninger Clinic in Houston, TX We'll hear what he has to say about the 100th anniversary of the Menninger Clinic and the impact it has on mental health and an innovative practice.

Greetings, everyone!

I am so excited to be here with Armando Colombo, president and CEO of the Menninger Clinic.

Oh, so glad to be here.

Thank you for having me.

Well, we are excited to have you here.

We have been in discussion about the 100th anniversary.

We wanted to be able to incorporate you in this discussion.

So talk to us a little bit about the Menninger Clinic in Houston.

I know it's located on the Baylor campus.

Is that correct?

Actually, we're we're located just outside of the medical center in, Houston.

We have our own 50 acre campus.

It's the second site.

When we first moved to Houston, we rented, a facility.

I wasn't here.

I've been here about six years, but they came and rented a, psychiatric hospital that was available just to really prove the concept and see if it was going to be a viable option here in Houston.

And, of course, it has.

And then we moved to our own 50 acre campus.

Just outside of the medical center on Main Street in Houston.

In 2012, 2013.

So we've been here about 12, 13 years on this campus.

So, as we know, the legacy of the Menninger Clinic has come from Topeka, and it's following along in in that path, down in Texas.

And I'm curious to hear, or if you know how the clinic has there have been changes as it has transitioned from Topeka to your location.

So I would say the mental health field has changed, and I think Menninger has changed with it.

But I think we're focused on employing the latest tools and treatments.

I said, I think what is important is what hasn't changed.

We still strive to treat the whole person and provide the best possible care to patients in the manner they want to receive it.

So we meet patients where they are.

We remain strongly committed to furthering mental health education, by continuing to train professionals.

We're also committed to making mental health and treatment, an accepted part of the human condition.

We feel getting treatment for mental health should be just like getting treatment for anything else.

Enabling all of us to discuss these topics, openly and really reducing the stigma.

I would say, we train psychiatrists.

Psychologists.

We've started, since I've been here and advanced and grown our social work training program.

We've added a licensed professional counselor training program.

We have a peer review, a peer specialist training program.

And we have an affiliation with several nursing schools.

So we're training nurses all the time.

And we have a nurse residency program where we bring nurses in as part of our team, and provide them a six month, 3 to 6 month training program, which hopefully transitions them to become nurses here at the Menninger Clinic.

But if they don't, it prepares them for a great career outside of here, and we feel like they've gotten the best training possible by being here at Menninger, that is great.

So a definite resource.

And how about the future?

What is what's future pipeline looking like?

Yeah, I think it's exciting.

As we look to the future, we're continuing to expand access.

We're excited that we're now I, like I said, a network with major, most major insurance plans, which alleviates a lot of the cost burden.

We've just announced a partnership with, national nonprofit Homebase that's based out of Boston that will significantly expand mental health services to Texas veterans and their families at no cost.

So we're going to take care of, Texas veterans and their families here at the clinic for no cost, which is great.

About a year and a half, two years ago, we partnered with, the NFL trust, to provide mental health services to former NFL players, here in Houston.

So we're one of two sites in the country that takes care of, former NFL players, which is something that was, the clinic in Kansas was very involved in professional athletes.

And we're actively engaging and taking matter into community, by partnering with community groups, schools and churches to bring mental health resources that they're needed.

And we're really doing some exciting, research.

As far as, substance use disorder, TMS, a lot a lot of interesting and exciting research opportunities going on in the clinic.

That is tremendous.

So my legacy continues in Houston.

And Armando Colombo, we thank you so much for your expertise and for sharing the passion of the clinic in maintaining that here.

And in your area in Houston.

We thank you so much for joining us.

Joining us on IGI today.

Thank you for having me.

And I appreciate being part of, the ability to honor the Menningers and celebrate this amazing 100 year legacy and, I'm honored and humbled to continue to lead the organization into the future.

Fabulous.

Thank you so much.

Thank you.

Welcome back.

To wrap up our discussion, we're joined once again by Kay Kelly, Allison Beebe and Doctor Marci Baumann-Bork.

Bau ladies, thank you again for being here today to talk about the clinic.

We learned that, Menningers ended up going to Houston.

And I know Allison, you went to Houston when it went there.

And so what was that like for you?

Well, if you think of when you move, when a person moves, that's a lot.

So let's think we moved the entire hospital.

It was, enjoyable, stressful.

It was a lot because there were, there were quite a few Topeka staff members that came to help out, which was amazing.

Otherwise, I don't think we could have done it.

People that stayed, people that stayed for six months or a year.

But we had to hire all new staff.

So we were moving, leaving jobs that we had had for, you know, 15 years, getting new jobs, hiring people, training them.

And I think the biggest thing was sharing the Menninger ethos like, this is kind of how we do it, because it was different than the what people had experienced in Texas.

I think a lot of folks were let's give someone medication, and then we kind of lock the door and we go like this.

No, we didn't do that at all.

It was like, no, the nurses, you don't hide behind the nurses station.

You're out here, we're going outside.

We're doing stuff.

We're we're communicating.

We're active.

This is this is a, you know, active participation situation.

You're not just sitting here behind the desk.

So there was a lot of education, and it was just a lot unpacking boxes, all the things that you do when you move.

Right?

Yeah.

So yeah, it was it was wild.

So as we're looking forward to the future, how do you feel like, you know, having been there when I was here and then in Houston looking for it, what kind of legacy does that carry forward through your experience?

You know, I think I think we got it.

I think we got it and they have it.

You know, I was there for five years.

And I think we found the people that had the heart.

And that's really what it was like.

Okay.

Marcy and I both, have had families here and and a lot of connection here in Topeka.

And, while Menninger was thinking about going, it was hard decision not to go.

But I was thinking of starting a small clinic.

And I found out through Doctor Roy Menninger that Marci also was thinking about starting a small clinic here in Topeka to carry on the legacy, to carry on the heritage.

And we called it the Heritage Mental Health Clinic as what Marci and I did.

And so we're the co-founders of the Heritage Clinic here.

And, you know, I think, and we had 12, 14 I did a originally we had psychiatrist, psychologists and social workers as part of the, so we had a little team also our own little team.

But I think, what I would just say is that the, the staff that left, whether they went to Menninger or they went out in private practice or they came to heritage wherever they went, they carried the legacy and the heritage of mental health that they learned from the medical clinic, which I think is that's the heart also that Allison's talking about.

But that's that's the what they will carry with them wherever they go.

So I would say that's part of the future, too.

And I would just say something about the education and training was phenomenal at Menninger, and they were always innovative.

Not only with the psychodynamic psychoanalytic, but also new treatments that were, coming out and training staff in those areas, too.

So, I think that's a, a future, kind of promise of Menninger.

Yeah.

So Doctor Mercy.

Yeah.

I just think back to when Kay and I worked to get the clinic open.

We had like 500 patients within the first couple of weeks because Menninger was leaving, and there were enough people that were still finishing up their treatment.

And, staying in the community.

We were kind of overwhelmed.

And so for quite a while we were, Having a hard time keeping up with getting used to working with insurance, doing all of the business part of it, with it, we'd always been kind of indulged with with being at Menninger, I think, you know, over the time we figured out how to operate, administratively.

But the main thing that we hung on to was we want our patients to feel understood.

We want to be able to follow them from start to finish.

And the longer we have been here without Menninger, the more we realize, oh my gosh, I wish I had.

I, I wish I had somebody to test this patient.

I wish I had some of those services.

And so I guess I just want to say I really appreciated what I learned at Menninger.

And I'm hoping that all of the patients that we took care of, since they've moved to Houston, are part of that legacy, too.

So I hear all of you guys saying, heart is a big part of what you took away.

You'll forever appreciate the training and experience, and I hear some of your hopes of that.

You hope went back to Houston.

What are some of your hopes that you hope people remember most about the clinic?

I would say I hope that they remember how much each and every person was valued in a unique way.

That's something I feel like the medical profession is kind of losing right now, and it means a lot when somebody walks in the door.

I mean, there's a there's a quote that says people don't care so much about how much, you know, they care more about how much you care.

And I think that was, the crux of what made Menninger special.

And I hope that's what stays with them when they're in Houston.

Okay, how about you?

What do you hope, people remember most about the clinic?

Well, there was a an atmosphere of collegiality, cooperation, communication, unification.

Everybody was important, including the patient.

And I think, Alison, you mentioned earlier that the patient was part of the team.

They came to the team meeting, you know, and so everybody was valued.

Every input was valued.

And, and there was an openness of dialog, communication.

So, Allison, what do you hope people remember about Menninger Clinic?

Oh, gosh, it really was a family.

It was and like all families, there are days that people got along and there were days that people did not.

But the great thing about Menninger and that communication piece is if you weren't getting along with someone, we sat down and you had to talk about it and you discussed it and you resolved it.

Because you can't treat someone else's issue if you're not good with yourself.

So that's a big piece of you have to be right with yourself first before you can, you know, give advice or, you know, tell someone, well, you should probably do this when you're not even doing it yourself.

So, but I think it's a legacy of love, family.

Acceptance.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Ongoing learning.

Yeah I'm going learning.

Okay.

So.

Right the medical profession changes.

All the professions are changing as time evolves professions change.

Right.

And so I heard you say something about how healthcare's, changing.

What lessons from history do you hope guide the future of mental health care?

What is so difficult right now is that it is so hard to communicate with other practitioners.

You know, Menninger was so, stilted in were were all, a part of the treatment team.

Your perspective has to be included.

And the way it is right now, I think we end up being in kind of a vacuum.

And it's really hard to communicate with other mental health practitioners.

So I'm hoping that at some point, that piece of communicating with each other comes back.

What'ssomething you hope for Menninger, you hope helps guide the future of mental health care?

So you're talking about coordination, really?

And Menninger had, care coordinators, actually, that, helped to coordinate the team, coordinate the treatment.

And so that is that was a big part that's lost.

So everything is very separate right now.

It seems like.

And, so that would be something I agree with Marcy on that.

That is something.

But also just, you know, openness to, I think to each other's understanding of, of a client and a patient, coming in and taking the time which now people come in for, you know, 15 minutes, you know, 20 minutes to a psychiatric appointment, really.

And, you know, if you're lucky, you can have an hour therapy appointment.

Most of the time you can really, but, but that's monitored quite a bit.

And the luxury we had at Menninger of really taking the time to understand the patient was, as a gift, really, to the patient.

And, that's something I wish.

Yeah, would still be, I can't tell.

Yeah, I can't tell you how many times I have told, you know, patients that I see now, if I was back at Menninger, this is what I would do.

I have to kind of teach them what we had before and what I would love for them to have that we just don't have available to them.

Yeah.

So I'm hoping that Menninger Houston can carry some of that forward, which is, What about you, Alison?

I think meeting people where they are, treating them with dignity and respect.

And it was, I think Doctor Karl Menninger who said it's not one out of five people that have mental health issues.

It's five out of five.

We all have mental health issues.

So to think that there's something special about this person, that person, whatever, we all have struggles that we need to deal with.

And I think there's that mutual humanity.

How do you think Topeka, still feels?

The Menninger Clinic's legacy here today?

I saw there was a celebration, at the beginning of May.

And so how it's 100 years, celebration.

How is that legacy still felt here today?

I think a lot of the people that came here to be treated at Menninger, their descendants are here, their children are here.

They know where benefit their family got from.

When Menninger was still in Topeka.

So I think it's the direct descendants that have benefited and, and are still celebrating the fact that their family member was able to get help there.

And there are many clinicians still practicing in Topeka also that were trained at Menninger.

So that's another aspect of it.

And in Kansas City and Lawrence and the community.

So there are many staff, and I think staff went to the VA.

There's a lot of people to be and, and, so there's a lot of, heritage that way to legacy of the, clinicians that are still in this area like that.

Is the Heritage Foundation.

It's still it's still going.

It's going now that the Heritage Clinic.

Yes, yes, yes, yes, it's very small now.

We've lost a lot of our people have moved on or retired.

We're always trying to recruit people to come back or it's it's a difficult to get, in your head, such a powerful draw.

There are so many things that would pull people in.

And as a little clinic, we just can't offer that.

So, but we're still going and you're carrying on what's legacy, right?

All right, all right.

Well, thank you so much, Allison K and, Marcy, thank you for being here today.

And I want to thank all of our guests for joining us to discuss the history, the services, the impact and the future of the Menninger Clinic.

It's been a wonderful discussion to honor the legacy of many others.

Now celebrating its 100th birthday.

That's all the time we have for this episode of IGI.

If you have any comments or suggestions for future topics, send us an email at issues@ktwu.org.

If you would like to view this program again or any previous episodes of IGI, visit us online at watch.ktwu.org for IGI I'm Tiffany Obazelle and thank you for watching.

This program on KTWU is brought to you by Friends of KTWU.

W. We appreciate your financial support.

Thank you.