- We are honored to be joined by another Rutgers scholar, Dr. Saladin Ambar, professor of political science and senior scholar at the Eagleton Institute of Politics at Rutgers University, my alma mater, at Eagleton.

And first of all, Doctor, thank you so much for joining us.

- Oh, please, Steve, call me Din, and good to be here this post-election moment.

- So again, post-election, the end of 2022 moving into 2023, this will be seen then.

Question, I'm looking, I know, my research is a lot of papers, and it includes the "Post."

Yes, the "Post," not "The Washington Post."

"Eyes on the Spies," help us get this.

So now the Republicans control the lower house.

The Democrats, even though people are moving around there, it looks like they control the Senate and Joe Biden's the president.

Republicans taking over the House, they say their primary focus is Hunter Biden.

We have inflation.

We have global warming issues.

We have internal threats, external threats.

There are a whole range of issues.

Hunter Biden, top of the list, sir, please talk to us.

- Well, the Republican Party, frankly, is a non-functioning party if it's a party at all, certainly on a national level.

Look, there are Republicans in states like Georgia.

Brian Kemp has an agenda there.

- The governor there.

- People like Mitch McConnell who care about, you know, policy and getting judges through.

But by and large, it is a non-party.

It is an ideology of distortion, you know, vagaries of human personality.

It's kind of a form of a cult in some ways.

It can't be taken seriously as a party as such.

There's no real platform to speak of.

They were pretty proud of that last time.

So yeah, they kind of are perfect for the "New York Post," the paper I grew up with in Queens, page six.

It's a page-six party, if we could call it that.

- And Din, I appreciate what you're saying, but there are significant number of people who call themselves Republicans.

However, and the reason I'm focusing on this, and then we'll talk about the Democrats in a second, and there are lots of splits in that party, in the Democratic party as well.

But when Marjorie Taylor Greene is saying, and to the young Republicans, I'm not sure what state she was in, "You know, if Steve Bannon," Trump's former advisor, "and I were leading the January 6th insurrection, we would've" quote, "won, and we would've been armed."

And then said, "I was joking."

But Marjorie Taylor Greene matters.

She matters to Kevin McCarthy.

She matters in the Republican Party.

Where does she, what do you think winning means to her and to that wing of the party?

- I think winning means attention.

It means, you know, media hits.

It means being able to make money on the circuit, speaker circuit.

It means glorifying yourself to the expense of real policy and issues.

Again, it's about the individual candidate and the personality and the persona.

You know, tapping into that right-wing media funding and you know, chicken circuit, however you wanna describe it, and it's tragic for democracy.

Let's, you know, not parse words here.

It's absolutely tragic for democracy in America.

- Why, Din, why?

Help people understand that, who just say, "I'm a Republican.

Why are you mixing me in with all those other folks who have things they say that are so dangerous having to do with January 6th?

What does that have to do with democracy?"

- Well, you know, Liz Cheney, last I checked, is still a Republican.

Mitt Romney's still a Republican.

There are a handful of Republicans nationally around the country who care about democracy, who care about January 6th as not representative of multiracial democracy.

This is still a republic, at least ostensibly, and there are some Republicans, few though they may be, who care about that, and including, I think, Mitch McConnell.

You know, so to be a Republican is not a, you know, an attack.

To be a Republican who has, is not to launch an attack on one's person, but to be a Republican and remain silent on January 6th, let alone to approve of it, you know, to traffic in innuendo that somehow it was a good thing or could've even been done better is horrific and automatically should disqualify someone from holding office or running for office as a member of a party to be taken seriously.

- Talking about the role of Congress, we look forward to having an interview with the congressman who represents, I believe, the 7th district, Tom Kean, who beat Tom Malinowski in a very highly competitive race, at the time, the candidate for Congress, Tom Kean, did not do any media interviews with us or a whole range of other folks.

We look forward to having him.

Why?

Because we wanna know, you know, we've interviewed people, actually, I'm gonna come to this, because I'll ask Congressman Kean about this, but I asked State Senator Edward Durr from South Jersey, who actually won in a race against the Senate President, Steve Sweeney, I asked him about January 6th and what we need to learn from it, and he said, "Let's move on."

I asked him about denying the 2020 election.

He said, "Steve, let's move on."

How do we move on, Din, without acknowledging what those things, what those events mean and what denying elections mean?

"So let's just move on," Din.

That's what the Senator said.

You say?

- I think that in all, let me be very serious here for a moment.

You know, I think there's something to be said about moving on from, you know, anti-democratic, you know, violent events in our history.

You know, we're a state that remembers 9/11.

We're a country that, you know, certainly supports the statement "never again" with respect to the Holocaust.

We're a country that ought to remember and does remember slavery.

We don't, we're adults here.

We can't just move on from bad things because they maybe affect us personally in a negative way or how people perceive us.

That is the absolute, you know, worst remedy for any kind of problem.

You know, I'm not a psychologist, but I think, you know, Psych 101 tells you that, you know, running from your problems is not the way to address them.

- But they don't, but excuse me, Din, many Republicans do not see that as a problem, They are the party of either Donald Trump or those who believe in that, quote, MAGA wing, that philosophy, and dare I say, there's a, we're interviewing some folks who've written and understand the QAnon stuff.

But is that the party, or is it a narrow wing of the party?

And I promise I'll move to the Democrats.

I've got two minutes left.

- You know, I think you're right.

I think it is the party, but I think there are folks in the party like Tom Kean Jr. who realize it's a problem, who, you know, if you cornered him in a room somewhere would tell you this is absolutely nuts, it's bonkers, but they- - And his father, former Governor Kean, would say the same thing.

- 100%, absolutely, a man of, you know, dignity, whatever you may think about the- - And Chris Christie, our former governor, would say the same thing, and Christine Todd Whitman, a former Republican governor, would say the same thing, so what's left?

- Well, at some point, someone of prominence is going to have to take a stand for the benefit of the country and for the benefit of their own party.

If they truly care about their party, someone of prominence is gonna have to take a stand, and certainly Tom Kean Jr., with his name recognition in a state like New Jersey, would go a long way to doing that if he were to take on that battle.

- Din, real quick on this minute left, President Biden, I believe, will be 82 if he runs again in 2024.

I'm not gonna be accused of an ageist, being an ageist, but is 82 too old to run for president, which means 86 on the back end?

- You know, as someone who wakes up with aches and pains every day, you know, (laughs) I think we all know that, you know, when you start to get up in age, you're not at your optimum.

And you know, ideally he would turn it over to someone else.

But the truth of the matter is, if Donald Trump is the nominee for the Republican Party, a big if, obviously he's got a lot of legal issues and other problems going on, but if he were to be, then Biden may be one of a handful of people who can beat him, to which I say, you know, if he's 103, let's roll him out there because democracy is on the line.

And I think sadly, that's where we are at this stage in our politics.

- I appreciate what you're saying, but also it seems to me that the party has the responsibility to put up the strongest possible candidate to make the biggest difference for all the people, and people who can decide for themselves.

Professor, I wanna thank you so much for joining us.

To John Farmer and the family at the Eagleton Institute at Rutgers, we thank you so much.

Thank you, Professor.

- Thank you for having me, Steve, pleasure.

- You got it.

Steve Adubato, that's the professor.

We'll see you next time.

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