[INSPRATIONAL MUSIC STING] - We are honored to be joined once again by Dr. Benjamin Dworkin, Director of the Rowan Institute for Public Policy and Citizenship.

Good to see you, Ben.

- Good to see you, Steve.

Thanks so much for having me.

- Hey, Ben, one of the things you and I talked about offline the other day was the importance of promoting public service in young people., having young people get into government, public, not just government, just public service.

Question, with all the garbage going on, all the dysfunction going on, how hard is it to do that?

To get young people to say, (claps) "I want to be in public service because that looks like I can make a difference."

- It's not as tough as I think it used to be, and here's why.

You know, there was a certain point when I was growing up in the '80s that people just thought it was all corrupt and they just wanted to stay out of it.

No one wanted to be involved.

They just wanted to go and make money.

At a certain point, a little bit of a generation later, people said, "Well, I want to do something," right?

We began to see a new movement, a resurgence in youth activism, but it wasn't through politics.

And what we've seen in the last decade is a move where people who want to be active, who want to change the world, who believe in something and want to make a difference, understand that politics is an avenue for them to do it.

Politics, government, issue advocacy.

You know, it used to be the "think global, act local," right?

Just work in your local soup kitchen, things like that, and now people understand, whether they're inspired by a member of Congress or somebody running for president, that through politics, through the system, you can actually make a difference.

So, we're seeing an increase in many ways in people who are participating.

It's not as hard as it used to be.

Granted, I'm still dealing with college students, and it's always going to be tough.

Any number of different things on their plate these days, but I think people understand that no matter what you do, politics will intrude on your life, and so you should know something about it.

- I'm curious about this, Ben.

So many questions about the outcome of elections.

If I don't like the outcome of the election... Obviously, we saw what happened in 2020.

We know what January 6th was and why it matters.

To what degree do you believe there has been a significant diminishing of public confidence in the outcome of elections?

- I think it has been significant, but this- - And what does that do with citizenship?

Is there a connection between that and citizenship?

- Yes.

Of course there is.

Look, the point about citizenship is that it can't be rented.

You have to take ownership for what's going on.

You know, my father used to tell me, "You know, Ben, in the history of the world, no one ever washed a rented car."

And the idea- - Good one.

- Was you have to take ownership for your democracy.

I think that is where citizens have an absolute role to play, even if these things you watch on TV seem distant to us.

The role that folks like we play here at Rowan University and with RIPPAC is really to try and reduce that connection, to reduce the intimidation, the fear factor of getting involved.

- By the way, RIPPAC is the acronym for the Rowan Institute for Public Policy and Citizenship.

Ben, let me try this.

So, we're taping on the 21st of March.

We don't know what's going to happen.

Former President Trump, criminal issues, legal issues.

Let it play out.

Politically, though, say the president runs again.

What do you say if the former president runs again, the current president runs again.

Investigations going on back and forth.

Republicans in Congress investigate Hunter Biden, Joe Biden, every family member.

Back and forth investigating each other.

What does that do for our representative democracy when it's very difficult to separate the electoral process, the political process, from the prosecutorial criminal accusation?

That's not even a category.

I don't know what it is, but they're all meshed together in the world of social media.

How's that for a complicated question, my friend?

(both laugh) - Let me try and give you a straightforward answer.

It makes it much tougher.

I mean, that's the bottom line.

But here's why I believe America comes through, because- - You're going to tell me there's a silver lining, Ben Dworkin, aren't you?

- There is, there is, I won't say it's a silver lining, but I think there's an opportunity to find that silver lining, and this is what I mean by that.

This election you were hypothetically describing is for president.

People run for president in a different way than they run for state legislature or for even governor or Congress.

Running for president is a grander exercise.

It's about a vision for the future, whether it's make America great again, or bring stability, or whatever theme, hope and change, whatever theme comes through, morning in America, all of these things that we understand- - By the way, Ben makes reference to the former President Reagan and former President Obama, but go ahead, and their slogans.

- I'm sorry for- - That's okay.

Ben, we're insiders.

- Dating myself.

- We're political junkies.

Go ahead.

- But the point is that running for president is more of a visionary exercise, and so even as the mudslinging goes back and forth, there is an element of where are we going as a country?

And the country may be divided, but we are arguing about where we want to go.

This direction or that direction?

I think that gives us hope, because in the end, everybody gets a chance, in theory, to vote.

I mean, what we had in 2020, more people voted for Donald Trump than any other candidate running for president in the history- - And he lost by five million votes.

- Of the republic, except for one, Joe Biden.

So, you know, I think that was a tremendous testimony to the brilliance of democracy.

- And a lot of young people, Ben.

A lot of young people voted.

A lot of young people voted.

- Absolutely.

Absolutely.

Young people, young people voted in record numbers.

We've seen that again.

Certain analysts and folks do studies about young-person voting.

We see a surge in it in 2022 as well, so we'll see how things play out in '24.

- And we'll keep the conversation going with Dr. Ben Dworkin, Director of the Rowan Institute for Public Policy and Citizenship.

My good friend Ben, thank you so much.

We'll talk soon.

- Thank you, Steve.

- I'm Steve Adubato.

That's Dr. Dworkin.

We'll see you next time.

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