REPORT FROM SANTA FE IS MADE POSSIBLE, IN PART, BY GRANTS FROM THE NEW MEXICO MUNICIPAL LEAGUE, A BETTER NEW MEXICO THROUGH BETTER CITIES AND FROM >>LORENE: HELLO, I AM LORENE MILLS AND WELCOME BACK TO PART TWO OF AN INTERVIEW WITH OUR DEAR FORMER GOVERNOR, BILL RICHARDSON.

WELCOME BACK.

>>BILL: THANK YOU, NICE TO BE BACK AGAIN.

>>LORENE: WELL WE HAVE BEEN HAVING A WONDERFUL CONVERSATION ABOUT INTERNATIONAL RELATIONS AND DIPLOMACY AND EVERYTHING BUT AS FORMER GOVERNOR, I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW HOW YOU ARE FEELING ABOUT SOME OF THE THINGS THAT ARE GOING ON IN NEW MEXICO NOW.

ONE THING, CAN YOU IMAGINE, WE STARTED THIS SESSION WITH ABOUT $3.5 BILLION DOLLARS IN NEW MONEY, WHAT WOULD YOU HAVE DONE WHEN YOU WERE GOVERNOR?

>>BILL: WELL, I STARTED OUT HAVING, I WON'T SAY EXTRA MONEY, BUT GOVERNOR JOHNSON USED TO VETO A LOT OF THINGS.

BUT THEN WE HAD THE RECESSION IN MY SECOND TERM.

I AM VERY HAPPY THAT THE STATE HAS THESE NEW FUNDS, $3.5 BILLION, I THINK WE CAN TAKE CARE OF A LOT OF OUR, NOT COMPLETELY, OUR SOCIAL NEEDS, OUR HEALTHCARE NEEDS AND I THINK THE GOVERNOR IS DOING A GOOD JOB.

I LOVED HER STATE OF THE STATE WHERE SHE TALKED ABOUT A NEW HEALTHCARE AUTHORITY, FUNDING FOR COLLEGE.

>>LORENE: CHILDCARE, UNIVERSAL CHILDCARE.

>>BILL: CHILDCARE.

>>LORENE: HEALTHCARE.

>>BILL: HEALTHCARE.

I WOULD ONLY SAY THIS, MY HOPE, YOU KNOW I FOCUSED A LOT ON JOBS AND ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AND OPPORTUNITY, YOU KNOW, NEW STUFF LIKE THE SPACEPORT AND THE RAIL RUNNER, MOVIE INDUSTRY, I JUST WANT TO SEE THE STATE, AND THE GOVERNOR HAS DONE THAT, DO SOMETHING FOR SMALL BUSINESSES.

SOME OF THIS PYRAMIDING, I WOULD LIKE TO SEE SOME TAX CUTS, I KNOW THAT THEY ARE CONTROVERSIAL WITH SOME MEMBERS OF MY PARTY BUT I THINK, REENIE, HUMAN BEINGS, NEW MEXICANS, THEY WANT TO MAKE A LITTLE MORE MONEY.

THEY WANT MORE MONEY FOR THEIR FAMILIES, THEY WANT MORE ECONOMIC GROWTH, THEY WANT JOB OPPORTUNITIES, MORE ENTREPRENEURSHIPS.

THAT'S ALL I WOULD SAY.

>>LORENE: WELL, PEOPLE NEED TO JUST REMEMBER HOW MUCH YOUR POLITICAL ACCOMPLISHMENTS MADE A DIFFERENCE FOR OUR STATE.

YOU WERE THE FIRST TO GET MEDICAL MARIJUANA PASSED.

>>BILL: YES, YEAH, I DID.

>>LORENE: BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, THEY SAID IT WAS VERY UNPOPULAR, YOU SAID BUT IT IS THE RIGHT THING TO DO.

>>BILL: THE RIGHT THING FOR MEDICAL REASONS.

>>LORENE: YEAH.

>>BILL: WITH PROPER SUPERVISION, PROPER RESEARCH AND WE DID IT AND WE WERE ONE OF THE FIRST STATES THAT DID THAT AND IT HELPED A LOT OF PEOPLE.

>>LORENE: ABSOLUTELY AND THEN IT BECAME, YOU KNOW, EXPANDED INTO RECREATIONAL AND ALL OF THAT AND PROVIDED A HUGE AMOUNT OF TAX MONEY FOR THE STATE.

SO, IT SEEMED TO BE WIN, WIN ALL AROUND.

YOU ALSO, THIS WAS VERY CREATIVE OF YOU, ENDED THE DEATH PENALTY.

I KNOW THAT EVEN THE POPE, MANY, MANY PEOPLE WORLDWIDE REALLY CONGRATULATED YOU ON THAT, AND AGAIN, IT WAS THE RIGHT THING TO DO.

>>BILL: IT WAS THE RIGHT THING TO DO AND A LOT OF CREDIT GOES TO REPRESENTATIVE GAIL CHASEY, I SAW HER RECENTLY.

>>LORENE: YEAH.

>>BILL: IT WAS THE LEGISLATURE THAT PUSHED ME TO DO THIS, BECAUSE, INITIALLY, REENIE, I THOUGHT THAT GETTING RID OF THE DEATH PENALTY WAS NOT THE RIGHT THING TO DO.

IT WAS A DETERRENT, BUT I WAS CONVINCED TALKING TO A LOT OF VICTIMS, A LOT OF FAMILIES, DOCTORS, LAW ENFORCEMENT, THAT CONTINUING THE DEATH PENALTY JUST WASN'T THE RIGHT THING TO DO.

SO IT WAS CONTROVERSIAL BUT IT'S THE RIGHT PATH IN MY JUDGEMENT AND I WISH MORE STATES WOULD BE TAKING THIS STEP.

>>LORENE: ANOTHER THING IS THAT YOU CAN GET RID OF THE DEATH PENALTY OR IF YOU DON'T, BUT THE LONG YEARS OF FIGHTING IT IN COURT FOR EACH INDIVIDUAL CRIMINAL THAT WAS GOING TO BE EXECUTED THE MILLIONS THAT WERE SPENT LEGALLY IN THAT.

AND SO YOU GOT WONDERFUL KUDOS FOR THAT WORLDWIDE.

>>BILL: WELL AND THE POPE, YOU ARE RIGHT.

>>LORENE: THE POPE HIMSELF.

>>BILL: AND I WORKED WITH THE CATHOLIC CHURCH HERE IN NEW MEXICO, ARCHBISHOP SHEEHAN, WHO IS STILL AROUND.

>>LORENE: YEAH, YEAH.

>>BILL: I SAW HIM NOT TOO LONG AGO, IT WAS A PARTNERSHIP, BUT I GOT TO GIVE A LOT OF CREDIT TO THE LEGISLATURE BECAUSE THEY PUSHED ME IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION.

>>LORENE: YEAH.

>>BILL: AND I SIGNED THE BILL AND THEN I BECAME AN ADVOCATE.

I HAVE BEEN ON THIS INTERNATIONAL COMMISSION AGAINST THE DEATH PENALTY WORLDWIDE TO GET MORE COUNTRIES TO EITHER DO A MORATORIUM ON THE DEATH PENALTY OR END IT ALL TOGETHER.

>>LORENE: YOU GAVE US THE RAIL RUNNER.

I JUST WISH IT WERE A BULLET TRAIN BUT YOU KNOW WE ALL LOVE TO SEE IT, LOVE TO RIDE IT.

>>BILL: YOU KNOW THE ONE MISTAKE I MADE ON THE RAIL RUNNER, THAT IT'S THE RIGHT THING TO DO FOR CLEAN ENERGY REASONS, TRANSPORTATION, I WISH I HAD TAKEN IT ALL THE WAY TO THE AIRPORT.

>>LORENE: ABSOLUTELY, WE WISH THAT.

>>BILL: AND I THINK THAT WE COULD HAVE.

BUT I WON'T GET INTO WHY WE DIDN'T DO IT, BUT I WISH I HAD, YOU KNOW ON SECOND THOUGHT.

>>LORENE: YES, BECAUSE EVERYONE IS LATE FOR THE AIRPORT AND IF YOU HAVE A WAY TO TRANSFER FROM DOWNTOWN, YOU KNOW, YOU MIGHT AS WELL DRIVE.

SPACEPORT, TOO.

>>BILL: I THINK IT IS GOING TO BE GREAT FOR NEW MEXICO, WELL I THINK IT ALREADY HAS.

IT HAS GOTTEN A LITTLE SLOW STARTING, BUT IT IS GOING TO BE JOBS, TECHNOLOGY, A LOT OF SCHOOL KIDS, TRAINING ASTRONAUTS, ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT FOR THOSE LITTLE COUNTIES, T OR C, LAS CRUCES, ALAMOGORDO, THEY ALL CHIPPED IN INITIALLY.

I THINK IT IS GOING TO BE GOOD FOR ALBUQUERQUE, FOR LAS CRUCES, BUT AT THE SAME TIME IT'S TECHNOLOGY, IT'S SPACE, I MEAN IT IS ONE OF OUR UNANSWERED QUESTIONS.

WHAT CAN WE DO WITH SPACE WHEN IT COMES TO CLIMATE ENERGY, WHEN IT COMES TO EXPLORATION, WHEN IT COMES TO FEEDING PEOPLE, FOOD SECURITY.

SO IT IS A GREAT INVESTMENT FOR THE FUTURE.

SOME HAVE SAID, WELL, YOU KNOW, WE WISH IT WOULD BENEFIT US FASTER.

WELL IT IS BENEFITTING BUT IT IS GOING TO TAKE A LITTLE TIME.

>>LORENE: YEAH, YEAH.

ALSO, YOU WORKED REALLY HARD GETTING THE FILM COMMISSION UP AND GOING.

BUT OF ALL THOSE ACCOMPLISHMENTS, WHAT ARE YOU PROUDEST OF?

>>BILL: WELL, I WOULD SAY I AM PROUDEST OF THE FACT THAT WE ALWAYS HAD A BALANCED BUDGET.

BUT IN TERMS OF OUR SOCIAL NEEDS, YOU KNOW, I HAD THE FIRST GAY RIGHTS LEGISLATION AND I HAD A CABINET THAT WAS VERY DIVERSE - WOMEN, HALF OF MY CABINET WAS WOMEN, AFRICAN AMERICANS, WE HAD SPANISH, SO BEING GOVERNOR WAS THE BEST JOB I EVER HAD.

EVEN THOUGH I HAD SOME VERY GOOD JOBS AT THE UN, THE CONGRESS, I LOVED IT, THAT'S WHERE I MET YOUR HUSBAND AND YOU, WHEN I WAS A CONGRESSMAN.

>>LORENE: YEAH.

>>BILL: BUT BEING GOVERNOR, YOU RUN THE SHOW.

I LIKE THE POWER BUT TO DO THE RIGHT THING AND I LIKED THE BIPARTISANSHIP.

SO TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION, WHAT DID I LIKE THE MOST, THAT WE WERE ABLE TO DO THINGS TOGETHER - REPUBLICANS AND DEMOCRATS - AND I HAD MY FIGHTS WITH DEMOCRATS, TOO.

BUT THERE WERE REPUBLICANS THAT I COULD WORK WITH LIKE STUART INGLE, SENATOR INGLE, LIKE DAN FOLEY, REPRESENTATIVE DAN FOLEY, LIKE GOVERNOR CARRUTHERS.

I APPOINTED HIM, HE HELPED ME ON A LOT OF COMMISSIONS ON EDUCATION.

AND I SAY, WHERE IS THAT DIALOGUE NOW, UNFORTUNATELY, I THINK THE REPUBLICAN PARTY IS MOVED INTO THIS MAGA NEGATIVE MOVEMENT THAT SEEMS TO CONTROL THE PARTY.

>>LORENE: BUT ALSO THEY ARE ACCEPTING LYING AS A MODUS OPERANDI AND LIKE THIS GUY, JOE SANTOS.

>>BILL: ELECTION DENIAL, YEAH.

>>LORENE: YEAH, ELECTION DENIALISM.

IN 2011, YOU SAID, AFTER THE TUCSON SHOOTING, THAT GOT GABBY GIFFORDS AND KILLED SIX PEOPLE AND INJURED, YOU SET UP THE NATIONAL INSTITUTE FOR CIVIL DISCOURSE.

>>BILL: YES.

>>LORENE: AND MY GOD DO WE NEED THAT NOW.

THE VIOLENT, POLITICAL RHETORIC AND IT IS FALLING ON UNGLUED PEOPLE WHO THINK IT IS A CALL TO ACTION.

>>BILL: RIGHT.

>>LORENE: AND WE JUST HAD THIS IN ALBUQUERQUE WITH THAT GUY SOLOMON PENA GOING AND SHOOTING AT LAWMAKERS' HOUSES.

I AM WONDERING HOW WE CAN TAMP IT DOWN, HOW WE CAN RETURN THE CIVIL DISCOURSE THAT YOU EVOKED IN 2011, HOW CAN, IN 2023, HOW CAN WE TAMP DOWN AND REPRESS VIOLENT, POLITICAL RHETORIC?

>>BILL: WELL, I WILL SAY ON THE NATIONAL SCALE, I THINK IT IS GOING TO TAKE ELECTIONS WHERE MAGA CANDIDATES ARE DEFEATED AND ELECTION DENIALISM BECOMES LESS RELEVANT, WHICH IT IS NOT RELEVANT AT ALL AND BASICALLY DONALD TRUMP LOSES JUICE AND POWER.

AND MORE MODERATE ELEMENTS, I DON'T SEE THEM YET IN THE REPUBLICAN PARTY COMING, BUT HERE IN NEW MEXICO I GIVE THE GOVERNOR A LOT OF CREDIT.

I THINK WITH HER LEGISLATIVE INITIATIVES, THE HEALTHCARE AUTHORITY - BY THE WAY I HAD PROPOSED THAT, THAT WAS A GOOD IDEA.

THE COLLEGE INITIATIVE, HER INITIATIVES ON HEALTHCARE ACROSS THE BOARD, EDUCATION, PRESCHOOL, DIANE DENISH, MY LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR, DESERVES A LOT OF CREDIT FOR THAT.

PRESCHOOL STUFF I REMEMBER SHE WAS HOUNDING ME ON THAT, WE GOT TO DO MORE, SHE WAS SO RIGHT.

>>LORENE: BUT DIDN'T SHE SET UP THE FIRST CHILDREN'S CABINET?

>>BILL: SHE DID, YES, SHE DID.

>>LORENE: ANYBODY WHO HAD ANYTHING TO DO WITH CHILDREN, THEY HAD A SEPARATE CABINET.

>>BILL: YEAH AND SHE STARTED IT, SHE SHOULD GET THAT CREDIT, THEY SHOULD GIVE HER A MEDAL I MEAN WE IMPLEMENTED IT, BUT SHE WAS PART OF THE TEAM.

SO I THINK GOVERNOR LUJAN-GRISHAM, SHE'S OFF TO A GOOD START.

THE LEGISLATURE IS OFF TO A GOOD START.

YOU KNOW THERE IS A LITTLE RANCOR BUT I THINK THERE IS A CIVILITY WITHIN THE LEGISLATURE, REPUBLICANS AND DEMOCRATS, THAT EXISTS, THAT DOES NOT EXIST IN THE US CONGRESS.

SO I WOULD ENCOURAGE THAT EFFORT.

>>LORENE: YEAH.

SO YOU HAVE FUNDING TRAIN OF GLORY THAT ARE BIG NUMBERS, FOR EXAMPLE, IN THE 2006 ELECTION, YOUR SECOND TERM, YOU HAD THE HIGHEST PERCENT OF VOTES IN ANY NEW MEXICO GUBERNATORIAL ELECTION.

AND ANOTHER ONE OF YOUR GUINNESS WORLD RECORDS, IT'S THE HANDSHAKES IN EIGHT HOURS BY A POLITICIAN.

>>BILL: WELL, I KID GOVERNOR LUJAN-GRISHAM, I SAID, YOU WON HANDILY, BUT I GOT 69% ONCE.

AND ON THE GUINNESS ISSUE, WHAT I TRIED TO GET OUT THERE WAS ALTHOUGH WE HAD TO FLY THE GUINNESS PEOPLE IN FROM LONDON.

>>LORENE: OH MY GOODNESS.

>>BILL: SO THAT THEY WOULD CERTIFY THE ELECTION.

AND THEY HAD A LITTLE CLICKER.

>>LORENE: ARE YOU KIDDING, EVERY HANDSHAKE?

>>BILL: YEAH, YEAH, AND I REMEMBER MY HAND BEING A LITTLE HURT.

>>LORENE: OH MY GOSH.

>>BILL: BUT WE DID THOSE, I THINK IT WAS 11,000 SOMETHING.

BUT TO SEND A MESSAGE THAT GRASSROOTS POLITICS IS IMPORTANT, SHAKING HANDS IS IMPORTANT, GOING TO PEOPLE'S HOMES AND TALKING IS IMPORTANT, TELEPHONING.

NOW IT IS ALL TWITTER, SOCIAL MEDIA, NOT ALL OF IT, FACEBOOK, ADS, NEGATIVE PUNDITS ON TV POUNDING EACH OTHER.

SO IT WAS SORT OF A MESSAGE THAT IS LESS RELEVANT NOW, REENIE, I THINK THAT GRASSROOTS POLITICS WHERE YOU NEED TO TALK TO PEOPLE ESPECIALLY I AM REALLY WORRIED ABOUT THE RURAL-URBAN DIVIDE.

>>LORENE: YEAH.

>>BILL: YOU KNOW THE LITTLE TOWNS, THE CLAYTONS, THE TUCUMCARIS, YOU KNOW, WHERE YOU DO YOUR BROADCASTS.

A LOT OF IT IS ALBUQUERQUE, SANTA FE, LAS CRUCES AND WE KIND OF FORGET ABOUT THE LITTLE TOWNS.

>>LORENE: YEAH.

>>BILL: THE LITTLE KIDS THAT ARE 4H AND THE GIRLS AND BOYS, THEY WANT OPPORTUNITY, TOO, NOT HANDOUTS.

THEY WANT TO PARTICIPATE, THEY WANT JOBS, THEY WANT SCHOLARSHIPS, AND THAT URBAN-RURAL DIVIDE IS STILL A PROBLEM HERE IN NEW MEXICO THAT WE GOT TO DO BETTER AT DIALOGUING.

>>LORENE: EXCELLENT, EXCELLENT.

WE ARE SPEAKING TODAY WITH FORMER GOVERNOR, BILL RICHARDSON.

I WANT TO TALK TO YOU ABOUT YOUR RELATIONSHIPS TO THE NATIVE AMERICANS BECAUSE ONE OF THE OTHER BIG THINGS YOU DID I THINK IN YOUR CAPACITY AS ENERGY SECRETARY UNDER CLINTON, DIDN'T YOU FACILITATE THE LARGEST TRANSFER OF LAND BACK TO A TRIBE?

TELL US ABOUT THAT.

>>BILL: WELL, THIS WAS THE UTE TRIBE ON THE WEST AND MANY STATES IN THE WEST AND WE DID A DEAL, NOT A DEAL, NOT A COMPROMISE, IT WAS MAJOR, I THOUGHT, RETURN THE LAND TO THE UTE TRIBE IN EXCHANGE FOR SOME ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTIONS FOR THE MOAB IN UTAH AND ALSO LOS ANGELES IS PART OF THAT DEAL.

THE WATER FLOW, THE WATER DELIVERY FROM THE UTES WENT TO LOS ANGELES AND IT DIDN'T RESOLVE THE PROBLEM, BUT I HAVE ALWAYS FELT THE NATIVE AMERICANS ARE SO IMPORTANT.

YOU KNOW I WAS FIRST ELECTED TO CONGRESS BECAUSE I WON THE NATIVE AMERICAN VOTE, I WON VERY NARROWLY AGAINST A GREAT CANDIDATE, ROBERTO MONDRAGON, AND I WORKED THOSE NAVAJO PRECINCTS, THE NATIVE AMERICAN, I WOULD GO OUT THERE, SO I HAVE ALWAYS FELT A DEBT BESIDES THE FACT THAT WE AS A NATION AND AS A STATE, MISTREATED THE NATIVE AMERICANS AND WE HAVE TO FIND WAYS TO MAKE UP FOR THAT.

AND I FULLY FOR THAT AND THIS IS WHY I HAVE ALWAYS TRIED TO CHAMPION, IN MY FOUNDATION WORKS ON GETTING THE NAVAJOS COVID ASSISTANCE, TENNIS SHOES FOR KIDS WITH NIKE, WE HAVE A PARTNERSHIP.

WE GO OUT TO THE CHAPTER HOUSES TO THE SCHOOLS AND GIVE THEM TENNIS SHOES, THEY LOVE THAT.

>>LORENE: YEAH, YEAH.

BUT I AM GLAD THAT YOU MENTIONED THAT BECAUSE EVEN THOUGH YOU ARE NOT IN OFFICE NOW AND ALL THAT, YOU STILL HAVE WORKED VERY, VERY DRAMATICALLY WITH THE NATIVE AMERICANS ESPECIALLY DURING THE COVID TIME BECAUSE THEY WERE SO HARD HIT IN THE BEGINNING, IT WAS SO BRUTAL.

>>BILL: IT WAS BRUTAL AS YOU KNOW THEY DON'T HAVE THE FULL ACCESS TO WATER, THERE ARE LONG DISTANCES.

VERY RURAL, POVERTY, BUT ACCESS TO HEALTHCARE IS PROBABLY THEIR BIGGEST PROBLEM BECAUSE OF A LACK OF WATER, THEY DON'T HAVE DRINKING WATER THAT IS CLEAN.

>>LORENE: YOU CAN'T WASH YOUR HANDS TO KEEP FROM GETTING COVID.

>>BILL: YOU HAVE GOT TO GO GET THE WATER AND SO WE HAVE GOT SO MUCH TO DO ESPECIALLY WITH THE NAVAJO NATION AND WHEN IT COMES TO ENERGY, I WANT THEM REPRESENTED WHEN IT COMES TO THESE DECISIONS ON WHETHER WE MERGE AVANGRID AND PUBLIC SERVICE OF NEW MEXICO, THE NEW PRC, I APPOINTED A NAVAJO TO THE PUBLIC RECLAMATION POSITION YEARS AGO.

>>LORENE: YEARS AGO.

>>BILL: AND I THINK THAT IS VERY IMPORTANT.

>>LORENE: WELL, THE NUKE THING IS REALLY, REALLY INTERESTING BECAUSE JUST THIS YEAR, THE NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION HAS DECREED THAT ALL OF THE SPENT FUEL RODS FROM ALL THE NUCLEAR PLANTS IN THE COUNTRY ARE GOING TO BE ON BUSES AND TRUCKS AND TRAINS TAKEN TO NEW MEXICO AND WE DON'T EVEN HAVE A POWER PLANT HERE OF OUR OWN.

AND SO SENATOR STEINBORN WHO HAS WORKED WITH YOU IN THE PAST IS TRYING TO STOP THIS BECAUSE WE CAN'T AS A STATE SAY, WE ARE NOT ACCEPTING CERTAIN KIND OF MATERIALS THAT DO NOT ORIGINATE HERE.

AND SO HE WAS ABLE TO DO A BILL LAST SESSION FOR ALL THE URANIUM TAILINGS THAT ARE LEFT ALL OVER NAVAJO LAND.

HE GOT MONEY TO GO IN AND CLEAN THEM UP AND NOW THIS SESSION HE IS TRYING TO SAY, YOU CAN'T BRING THAT STUFF HERE.

AND SO WE HOPE THAT WILL DO IT, BUT YOUR EXPERIENCES AS ENERGY SECRETARY I AM SURE YOU ARE TRYING TO LOOK DOWN THE ROAD, YOU KNOW, THE WORST THAT COULD HAPPEN WITH NUKES AND IT IS KNOCKING ON OUR DOOR.

>>BILL: WELL I AM VERY CONCERNED ABOUT THIS TREND BECAUSE WE HAVE AS NEW MEXICANS DONE ENOUGH.

WE HAVE THE NATIONAL LABS.

>>LORENE: YEAH, WE HAVE ALREADY GAVE.

>>BILL: YEAH AND THEN YOU KNOW I WAS THE SECRETARY OF ENERGY THAT OPENED WIPP.

IT WAS CLOSED AND I SAID, "NOT UNTIL THEY FULFILL FULL EPA STANDARDS."

AND I REMEMBER SOME OF THE OTHER DELEGATION MEMBERS WERE MAD AT ME, I SAID, "NO, FULLY EPA STANDARDS."

AND WE ESTABLISHED WIPP, WHICH ON THE WHOLE HAS BEEN THE RIGHT DECISION, BUT IT IS LOW LEVEL RADIOACTIVE WASTE.

>>LORENE: IT IS ALSO SUPPOSED TO BE A PILOT PLANT.

>>BILL: THAT'S RIGHT.

>>LORENE: WASTE ISOLATION PILOT PLANT, THERE ARE NO OTHER ONES.

>>BILL: BUT WE DON'T HAVE TO HAVE LIKE THE HIGH-LEVEL STUFF.

I LOVE THE PEOPLE IN HOBBS AND CARLSBAD, BUT I THINK SOME OF THE OTHER STATES NEED TO SHARE IN THIS AND SO I AM CONCERNED.

I THINK STEINBORN IS RIGHT, LET'S IMPROVE WIPP, LOW LEVEL WASTE.

ALL RIGHT THAT IS WELL DONE, IT IS PROVIDING A LOT OF JOBS, BUT WE HAVE LOS ALAMOS, SANDIA, WE HAVE FOUR MILITARY BASES WHICH IS GOOD, IT IS JOBS BUT LET OTHER STATES TAKE SOME OF THIS.

LIKE IN SANTA FE EVERY TIME I GO THROUGH ROUTE 599.

>>LORENE: YEAH.

>>BILL: YOU KNOW, I GOT THOSE FUNDS AT THE TIME IT WAS $25 MILLION BECAUSE THE PEOPLE OF SANTA FE DIDN'T WANT THE WASTE TO COME THROUGH THE CITY.

>>LORENE: RIGHT.

>>BILL: AND EVERY TIME I DRIVE THERE TO THE AIRPORT, I REMEMBER THOSE FIGHTS, BUT WE GOT THAT DONE.

TODAY WOULD BE $300,000 MILLION DOLLARS FOR THAT ROAD 599.

>>LORENE: RIGHT, RIGHT.

AND YOU ALSO DIDN'T LET THEM PUT GAS STATIONS ON EVERY EXIT.

>>BILL: YEAH.

>>LORENE: SO IT IS ACTUALLY A BEAUTIFUL DRIVE.

>>BILL: RIGHT.

SO I AM ONE OF THOSE THAT THINKS THAT HYDROGEN AND NUCLEAR FUSION HAVE A FUTURE IN OUR ENERGY SECURITY.

BUT WASTE, WE HAVE DONE ENOUGH IN NEW MEXICO, LET IT GO SOMEWHERE ELSE.

WE DO HAVE TO DO IT, YOU CAN'T MAKE THAT WASTE DISAPPEAR BUT LET OTHER STATES SHARE IN THAT.

AND SO I AM CONCERNED ABOUT THIS DECISION, I THINK THE GOVERNOR HAS TAKEN THE RIGHT POSITION AND THE CONGRESSIONAL DELEGATION, NOW THE LEGISLATURE.

WHO KNOWS IF IT CAN BE STOPPED, I MEAN WHEN THE NATIONAL GOVERNMENT PUSHES, IT'S TOUGH.

>>LORENE: YEAH AND THEY ARE AN INDEPENDENT COMMISSION THEY ARE NOT ANSWERABLE.

>>BILL: RIGHT.

NO.

>>LORENE: THEY DECREE IT AND WE GET ALL THIS... >>BILL: THAT'S RIGHT, SO IT IS GOING TO BE, I THINK SETTLED WITH A LOT OF LAWSUITS.

IT IS GOING TO BE LIKE THE OPENING OF WIIP, IT IS GOING TO TAKE QUITE A BIT OF TIME FOR ANYTHING TO HAPPEN.

BUT I THINK SENATOR STEINBORN HAS ALWAYS BEEN VERY STRONG ENVIRONMENTALIST AND THE GOVERNOR AND THE TEAM HERE IS DOING THE RIGHT THING IN PUTTING A LOT OF SCRUTINY INTO THIS DECISION.

>>LORENE: YEAH, I WANT TO RETURN YOU KNOW THEY SAY, DANCE WITH THE ONE WHAT BRUNG YOU, YOUR FEATS OF DIPLOMACY NOW AND I JUST WANT TO MENTION THIS BOOK BECAUSE WE DIDN'T THE LAST SHOW, HOW TO SWEET TALK A SHARK , BUT THERE AE SO MANY TRICKS TO NEGOTIATION AND DIPLOMACY.

ALSO, THIS IS A WONDERFUL BOOK, YOUR AUTOBIOGRAPHY BETWEEN WORLDS , BUT YOU HAVE BEEN IN THE NEWS A LOT FOR ALL THESE PEOPLE YOU HAVE RESCUED FROM BEING UNLAWFULLY DETAINED, CAN YOU TELL US A LITTLE BIT MORE, WE TALKED ABOUT BRITTNEY GRINER BEFORE BUT WHAT ARE SOME OTHER ONES THAT YOU HAVE GOTTEN OUT THAT YOU FEEL FREE THAT YOU CAN TALK ABOUT, THE BACKGROUND.

>>BILL: WELL, I THINK THERE ARE OTHERS THAT YOU TRY TO KEEP LOW KEY, SECRET.

THE MOST INTENSE THAT I HAVE HAD RECENTLY HAVE BEEN THESE RUSSIAN CASES, THERE ARE THREE.

ESPECIALLY BECAUSE OF THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN THE US AND RUSSIA IS SO BAD.

AND I THINK THAT WE ARE DOING THE RIGHT THING IN SUPPORTING UKRAINE, BUT I THINK EVENTUALLY THERE HAS GOT TO BE A WAY THAT RUSSIA, UKRAINE, THE EUROPEAN UNION, THE UNITED STATES, WE FIND AN END TO THIS BECAUSE WE ANNOUNCED THREE BILLION DOLLARS IN MILITARY AID TO UKRAINE.

I AM FOR IT, BUT I THINK EVENTUALLY THERE HAS TO BE A PATH WHERE THE UN, WHERE GROUPS LIKE MINE THAT ARE NOT GOVERNMENT, PLAY A ROLE IN REFUGEE ASSISTANCE, IN FOOD ASSISTANCE, IN TRANSFER OF HUMAN BEINGS, YOU KNOW, WHAT IS IT 100,000 RUSSIANS HAVE BEEN KILLED?

>>LORENE: YEAH.

>>BILL: ONE HUNDRED EIGHTY THOUSAND UKRAINIANS?

>>LORENE: YEAH.

>>BILL: SO THERE HAS TO BE A ROLE FOR HUMANITARIAN PATHWAY NOT JUST GEOPOLITICAL MILITARY AND I THINK THE UN, I AM A BIG UN ADVOCATE, NEEDS TO STEP UP AND BE MORE ACTIVE.

>>LORENE: WELL ALSO WHEN YOU CALL THEM MILITARY EXERCISE, NOT A WAR, YOU KNOW, IT IS A WAR.

>>BILL: YEAH.

NO.

>>LORENE: YEAH.

>>BILL: NO I JUST THINK THAT IT IS VERY IMPORTANT THAT AND I SEE SO MANY OF OUR VETERANS COMING BACK, A LARGE PERCENTAGE ARE HOMELESS, PTSD, WE HAVE GOT TO DO BETTER IN TAKING CARE OF OUR PEOPLE NOT JUST THE DEPENDENTS BUT THOSE THAT HAVE BEEN LEFT BEHIND.

THIS IS WHY I FEEL SO STRONG ABOUT HELPING NATIVE AMERICA NAVAJO NATION.

YOU CAN'T JUST SAY, WELL, YOU KNOW, LIKE THERE WAS SOME COMMISSION WHERE THE NATIVE AMERICANS DIDN'T APPLY, SO THEREFORE, THEY SHOULDN'T BE ELIGIBLE TO BE NAMED ON THE PRC IN FACT.

I THINK GOVERNOR LUJAN-GRISHAM DID THE RIGHT THING IN SETTING UP A TRIBAL ADVISORY GROUP, BUT IT WAS THIS COMMISSION THAT THEY NOMINATED NINE PEOPLE, NONE FROM NORTHWESTERN NEW MEXICO, NO NATIVE AMERICANS, NO NAVAJOS, I THINK THEY NOMINATED ONE NATIVE AMERICAN.

THE NAVAJOS, THEY HAVE THE COAL PLANTS, THEY HAVE RENEWABLE ENERGY, THEY HAVE OIL AND GAS, SO THE GOVERNOR DID THE RIGHT THING WITH THIS TRIBAL ADVISORY GROUP AND HOPEFULLY WILL HAVE A VOICE.

>>LORENE: YEAH.

WELL WHAT ARE YOU WORKING ON NOW?

>>BILL: WELL, WE HAVE THE FOUNDATION SET UP HERE IN SANTA FE.

WE HAVE THREE EMPLOYEES, ANNA WHO YOU CAN'T SEE IS ONE OF THEM.

WE ARE WORKING ON REFUGEE ISSUES, BESIDES THE PRISONER, THE HOSTAGE ISSUES, WE ARE VERY INTENSELY INVOLVED IN THE PAUL WHELAN CASE AND OTHER CASES OF AMERICAN HOSTAGES, THERE ARE ABOUT 70.

WE ARE INVOLVED.

>>LORENE: HOW MANY?

>>BILL: SEVENTY.

>>LORENE: SEVENTY?

>>BILL: WORLDWIDE.

>>LORENE: UNLAWFULLY DETAINED AMERICANS.

>>BILL: NOT ALL CLASSIFIED AS UNLAWFULLY DETAINED BUT MANY VERY QUESTIONABLY DETAINED.

>>LORENE: YEAH.

>>BILL: VENEZUELA, IRAN, RUSSIA, LOT IN THE MIDDLE EAST.

BUT WE ALSO HAVE AN EFFORT TO PROTECT WILDLIFE IN AFRICA.

>>LORENE: YES.

>>BILL: ESPECIALLY ELEPHANTS, YOU KNOW MANY OF THE SPECIES THERE.

WE HAVE AN EFFORT TO PROTECT THE ROHINGYA REFUGEES IN BANGLADESH.

WE HAVE A PROGRAM HOPEFULLY WE'RE GOING TO START ANOTHER PROGRAM WITH CUBA ENTREPRENEURSHIP.

TRAINING WOMEN, WE HAD A VERY ACTIVE PROGRAM THAT WE WANT TO RENEW ON TRAINING WOMEN IN LEADERSHIP POSITIONS IN THIRD-WORLD COUNTRIES.

>>LORENE: OH WONDERFUL AND A STEP RIGHT BEFORE THAT IS EDUCATING GIRLS.

>>BILL: THAT'S RIGHT, THAT'S RIGHT.

I MEAN THE TALIBAN SITUATION IS INTOLERABLE WHERE THEY CAN'T GO TO SCHOOL OR UNIVERSITIES, THEY CAN'T GET JOBS.

YOU KNOW.

>>LORENE: YEAH.

>>BILL: WHAT'S THE INTERNATIONAL COMMUNITY DOING BESIDES COMPLAINING, WE HAVE GOT TO DO MORE.

I DON'T HAVE THE ANSWERS THERE, BUT I WOULD LIKE TO GET INVOLVED IN THAT ONE.

>>LORENE: WELL HOW CAN PEOPLE FIND OUT MORE ABOUT WHAT THE RICHARDSON FOUNDATION IS DOING.

>>BILL: WE ARE HERE IN SANTA FE.

>>LORENE: DO YOU HAVE A WEBSITE?

>>BILL: 216 WASHINGTON AVENUE.

YEAH, WE WILL GIVE YOU THE WEBSITE TO PUT IT UP THERE.

>>LORENE: GOOD.

>>BILL: YOU KNOW WHAT HAPPENS, REENIE, IS WHEN I GET INVOLVED IN THESE HOSTAGE SITUATIONS, I GET A LOT OF NEW MEXICANS THAT COME IN HAVE DIFFERENT KIND OF HUMAN RIGHTS PROBLEMS.

IN OTHER WORDS, NEW MEXICANS, THEY HAVE A SON THAT NEEDS A JOB OR A SON THAT IS IN PRISON, JUST TODAY I HAD A FAMILY COME IN TO SEE ME ABOUT HELPING WITH THEIR SON.

I SAID, "YOU KNOW, I AM NO LONGER GOVERNOR, I HAVE ONE STAFF MEMBER."

BUT THEY SAY, "WELL, YOU HELP PEOPLE, SO HELP US, WE CAN'T GO ANYWHERE."

THIS IS WHAT PEOPLE SAY.

>>LORENE: WELL I AM GRATEFUL FOR HOW MUCH YOU HELP THE ANIMALS, THE ENVIRONMENT, PEOPLE.

>>BILL: WELL, THANK YOU.

>>LORENE: YOU KNOW I AM VERY PROUD OF YOU AND HONORED THAT YOU CAME TO TALK TO US TODAY ABOUT EVERYTHING YOU ARE DOING.

>>BILL: OF COURSE, OF COURSE, WELL THANK YOU SO MUCH.

AND I LOVE WHAT YOU DO WITH YOUR SHOW AND CONGRATULATIONS ON YOUR AWARD AS A SANTA FE TREASURE AND YOUR LEGACY WITH YOUR LATE HUSBAND, ERNIE MILLS.

>>LORENE: YEAH.

>>BILL: THANK YOU.

>>LORENE: NO, THANK YOU.

OUR GUEST TODAY, WHAT A WONDERFUL VISIT, THANK YOU, IS FORMER GOVERNOR, BILL RICHARDSON.

I HOPE THAT WE CAN DO THIS AGAIN, SOON.

>>BILL: OF COURSE, THANK YOU.

>>LORENE: AND I AM LORENE MILLS, I WOULD LIKE TO THANK YOU OUR AUDIENCE FOR BEING WITH US TODAY ON REPORT FROM SANTA FE .

REPORT FROM SANTA FE IS MADE POSSIBLE, IN PART, BY GRANTS FROM THE NEW MEXICO MUNICIPAL LEAGUE, A BETTER NEW MEXICO THROUGH BETTER CITIES AND FROM