>> WITH ALL DUE RESPECT TO SIMON AND GARFUNKEL, FORGET ABOUT THAT TROUBLED WATER UNDER THE BRIDGE.

HERE IN INDIANA, THE WATER'S JUST FINE - ASIDE, THAT IS, FROM SOME ANTIQUATED TREATMENT PLANTS AND MILES AND MILES OF AGING PIPES, INCLUDING SOME MADE OF LEAD.

HERE, AS IN MANY PARTS OF THE COUNTRY, THE MORE TROUBLING PROBLEM - OR AT LEAST MORE VISIBLE PROBLEM - IS THE CONDITION OF THE BRIDGES OVER THE WATER, NOT TO MENTION AND THE ROADS THAT RUN BETWEEN THEM.

HI, I'M JON SCHWANTES, AND ON THIS EDITION OF INDIANA LAWMAKERS, WE'LL FOCUS ON INFRASTRUCTURE, IN ALL ITS MANIFESTATIONS, AS THE STATE SCRAMBLES TO MAINTAIN ITS LONG-HELD STANDING AS THE CROSSROADS OF AMERICA.

THE ISSUE IS FRONT AND CENTER THANKS TO THE TWO-YEAR STATE BUDGET CRAFTED BY THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY AND THE $2 TRILLION INFRASTRUCTURE PLAN PROMOTED BY THE WHITE HOUSE.

DON'T GO AWAY.

INDIANA LAWMAKERS, FROM THE STATEHOUSE TO YOUR HOUSE.

♪♪ JOINING ME TO TALK ABOUT JOINING ME TO TALK ABOUT INDIANA'S ONGOING EFFORT TO MAINTAIN, AND BUILD UPON, ITS LONGSTANDING REPUTATION AS THE CROSSROADS OF AMERICA ARE REPUBLICAN SENATOR ERIC KOCH OF BEDFORD, CHAIR OF THE SENATE UTILITIES COMMITTEE, HOUSE DEMOCRATIC LEADER PHIL GIAQUINTA OF FORT WAYNE, JAMIE PALMER, SENIOR POLICY ANALYST AT THE INDIANA UNIVERSITY PUBLIC POLICY INSTITUTE, AND GARY LANGSTON, PRESIDENT OF THE INDIANA MOTOR TRUCK ASSOCIATION.

THANK YOU ALL FOR BEING HERE.

I KNOW YOU ALL BRING A DIFFERENT PIECE OF THE INFRASTRUCTURE PUZZLE TO THIS.

SO THIS IS GOING TO BE THE MOST WIDE-RANGING TOPIC DISCUSSION WE'VE HAD ALL YEAR, BECAUSE INFRASTRUCTURE IS KIND OF NOW -- YOU CAN FRAME IT AS ANYTHING.

I WONDER IF WE COULD START WITH THAT AS A JUMPING OFF POINT.

I WOULD LOVE TO GO AROUND, HERE WE ARE IN THE 21st CENTURY, I USED TO KNOW WHAT CROSSROADS OF AMERICA MEANT.

YOU COULD LOOK AT THE MAP AND SEE THE SPOKES COMING OUT, INTERSTATE SPOKES.

AND I THINK I USED TO KNOW WHAT INFRASTRUCTURE MEANS.

WHAT DO THESE THINGS MEAN NOW, SENATOR?

>> JON, IF WOULD YOU HAVE ASKED ME THAT IN 2002 WHEN I FIRST CAME TO THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY, I WOULD HAVE PROBABLY GIVEN YOU A DIFFERENT ANSWER.

IF YOU WANT TO MEASURE WHAT IS INFRASTRUCTURE BY THE WORK OF THE SENATE UTILITIES COMMITTE THIS SESSION, INFRASTRUCTURE HAS WASTE WATER.

INFRASTRUCTURE HAS BEEN BROADBAND, INFRASTRUCTURE HAS BEEN BUILDING NEW FACILITIES OF ALL KINDS TO GENERATE ELECTRICITY.

AND THIS MORNING WE'RE GOING TO BE TAKING UP 5G, INFRASTRUCTURE IS NOW HOW FAST AND HOW QUICKLY DATA IS GOING.

AND SO WE'VE MOVED INTO A NEW TIME.

I WOULD ALMOST SAY THIS HAS BEEN THE SESSION OF INFRASTRUCTURE WITHOUT PEOPLE REALLY REALIZING IT.

IT'S REALLY KIND OF FLOWN BELOW THE RADAR SCREEN.

BUT BECAUSE OF WHAT INFRASTRUCTURE HAS BECOME.

THERE IS A LOT GOING ON, AND A LOT GOING TO CONTINUE TO GO ON IN THE COMING YEARS.

>> REPRESENTATIVE, DO YOU BUY THAT EXPLANATION.

YOUR DAY JOB, YOU WORK FOR FORT WAYNE CITY UTILITIES.

SO THAT'S A TRADITIONAL SORT OF TAKE ON, I GUESS, THE NOTION OF INFRASTRUCTURE.

BUT IF I LOOK AT FOR INSTANCE, THE WHITE HOUSE PROPOSAL FOR UPWARDS OF $2 TRILLION IN INFRASTRUCTURE SUPPORT AND INVESTMENT, YOU COULD SAY INFRASTRUCTURE OF, AND FILL IN THE BLANK IN JUST ABOUT ANYTHING.

RESEARCH, BASIC EDUCATION, CLIMATE STUDIES.

WHAT DOES IT MEAN TO YOU?

>> BELOW THE RADAR.

SEWERS.

WATER MAINS.

ARE DEFINITELY BELOW THE RADAR BECAUSE THEY'RE BELOW THE GROUND.

WE TEND TO IGNORE THEM.

WHEN MAYORS AND CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS ARE RUNNING FOR RE-ELECTION, THEY POINT TO THEIR PROJECTS, AWFUL DIFFICULT TO CONVINCE VOTERS HOW IMPORTANT UNDERGROUND STUFF IS.

AND IF SOMEONE SAID WHEN YOU GO TO TURN ON YOUR FAUCET, AND THE WATER DOESN'T TURN ON OR IT'S RUSTY, YOU FLUSH YOUR TOILET AND SOMETHING IS HAPPENING THERE, YOU HAVE SEWAGE BACKUP.

THAT IS WHEN WE REALLY, UNFORTUNATELY, AS CITIZENS, I THINK, REALIZE HOW IMPORTANT THAT TYPE OF INFRASTRUCTURE IS.

WE'VE SEEN INTERRUPTION OF BUSINESSES WITH THIS PANDEMIC.

WELL, TRY, WHEN YOU SEE A RESTAURANT HAVE TO CLOSE BECAUSE OF A WATER MAIN BREAK, OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

AND THE AGING INFRASTRUCTURE IN THE STATE, NOT JUST IN FORT WAYNE, BUT IN COMMUNITIES ACROSS THE STATE REALLY NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED, I'M REALLY EXCITED ABOUT THE POTENTIAL OF FEDERAL DOLLARS COMING TO THE STATE.

>> YOU MENTIONED THE FUNNY LOOKING WATER -- OR THE TELL TALE SIGNS SOMETHING IS UP.

THAT'S WHEN A CUSTOMER AT THE END OF THE PROCESS MIGHT TAKE NOTE, SOMETIMES I'M GUESSING WITH -- WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT WATER, FOR INSTANCE, YOU DON'T EVEN GET THOSE INDICATIONS, BECAUSE THE LEAK THAT -- WHERE HUNDREDS IF NOT THOUSANDS OF GALLONS ARE POURING ON A DAILY BASIS INTO THE DIRT, YOU DON'T KNOW ABOUT IT, NECESSARILY, OR IF, FLINT MICHIGAN, THEY DIDN'T KNOW FOR YEARS, A LOT OF TIME YOU DON'T KNOW.

AND THIS IS, JAMIE PALMER, SORT OF A SPECIALTY OF YOURS, A RESEARCH FOCUS HAS BEEN WATER INFRASTRUCTURE AND SO FORTH.

SO, WHEN I ASKED YOU THE QUESTION, I HAVEN'T FORGOTTEN, I WANT TO GO AROUND AND -- DO YOU VIEW IT THROUGH THE PRISM OF WHAT WE CAN'T READILY SEE, WHICH IS WASTE WATER TREATMENT PLANS, OUR WATER MAINS AND SO FORTH.

OR DO YOU SEE IT MORE BROADLY AS THEY DO?

>> I SEE IT -- I THINK EVERYTHING THEY SAID WAS TRUE.

I THINK IN TERMS OF WATER, WE ARE STARTING TO FOCUS MORE ON -- >> SINCE THEY CONTROL THE FUNDING AT THE POLICY INSTITUTE, I THINK THAT IS A VERY GOOD WAY TOE START YOUR RESPONSE.

>> WE'RE FOCUSING MORE ON STORM WATER.

I THINK WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO FOCUS ON FLOOD MANAGEMENT.

ENERGY DISTRIBUTION IS AN IMPORTANT INFRASTRUCTURE THAT WE HAVE TO PAY ATTENTION TO, WHEN WE GET NEW FORMS OF ENERGY WE HAVE TO MAKE SURE IT IS WELL-CONNECTED TO OUR COMMUNITIES.

>> SOMETIMES IT IS DOUBLE-DUTY.

I KNOW, SENATOR, YOU'VE BEEN TRYING FOR A COUPLE YEARS TO HAVE A STUDY GROUP THAT WOULD LOOK AT USING INVESTOR-OWNED UTILITIES CAPACITY, YOU KNOW, DISTRIBUTION CAPACITY TO -- FOR HIGH TECH METERING, NORMALLY USED FOR BROADBAND, YOU KIND OF DOING DOUBLE DUTY.

GARY LANGSTON, DO YOU CARE ABOUT WHAT IS GOING ON UNDERGROUND, OR DO YOU JUST WANT TO KNOW -- >> I DO.

>> YET SAFELY FROM POINTED A TO POINT B.

>> WE HAVE TO STOP AND USE SOME OF THE FACILITIES OCCASIONALLY.

>> I'VE HEARD ABOUT THOSE PLASTIC -- DIFFERENT TOPIC.

>> SENATOR COOK SAID I THINK OUR PERSPECTIVE IS BEING CHANGED ABOUT WHAT INFRASTRUCTURE MEANS.

HE SAYS SINCE 2002, I THINK WHERE IT'S BEING SUGGESTED THAT OUR PERSPECTIVE SHOULD CHANGE AS RECENTLY AS A FEW WEEKS AGO WHEN THE 2.3 TRILLION PROPOSAL CAME OUT.

IT'S DIFFICULT FOR US TO LOOK JUST AT INDIANA BECAUSE WE'RE MOVING FREIGHT ACROSS THE NATION.

SO WE CARE ABOUT THE INFRASTRUCTURE NOT ONLY IN INDIANA WHO I BELIEVE IS DOING A GREAT JOB IN -- I MEAN IT'S HARD TO GO ANY PLACE WITHOUT SEEING AN ORANGE CONE.

THAT'S GOOD, WE'RE HAPPY ABOUT THAT.

I THINK THAT IS -- WE'LL HAVE MAYBE 1300 PROJECTS IN PLAY THIS YEAR AND SPEND $2 BILLION TO CONTINUE TO BUILD OUR INFRASTRUCTURE HERE.

WE CARE ABOUT THE ROADS, AND WE CARE ABOUT OUR ABILITY TO PARK ONCE WE HAVE TO STOP.

SO, YES, IT'S VERY IMPORTANT TO US, AND INDIANA'S A VERY IMPORTANT FREIGHT STATE.

AND AN IMPORTANT INFRASTRUCTURE STATE, AS YOU SAID, IF YOU LOOK AT THE MAP, INDIANA IS RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE OF A VERY IMPORTANT FREIGHT CORRIDOR FOR THE REGION.

SO IT'S PRIMARY FOR US.

>> FROM YOUR PERSPECTIVE, IS OUR STATE STILL DESERVING OF THE TITLE CROSSROADS?

AMERICA, OR WE'RE JUST HANGING ON?

>> NO QUESTION ABOUT THAT.

WE HAVE MORE INTERSTATES THAT CONVERGE HERE THAN ANY OTHER PLACE IN THE COUNTRY.

AND WE HAVE MORE THAN A MILLION TRUCKS THAT GO THROUGH INDIANA EVERY DAY.

JUST ON 80, 94 ALONE THERE IS LIKE 180 OR 90,000 TRUCKS THAT GO THERE EVERY DAY.

WE'RE A MANUFACTURING STATE, MANUFACTURING...NOW, AND WE CERTAINLY DESERVE THAT.

AND WE SHOULD HANG ON TO THAT.

>> THE WHITE HOUSE PROPOSAL, I THINK YOU'VE ALL SUGGESTED IT AIN'T WHAT OUR FATHERS OR GRANDFATHERS OR GRANDMOTHERS THOUGHT ABOUT INFRASTRUCTURE.

IT'S EVOLVED.

DOES THIS MEAN NOW BECAUSE OF WHAT WE'RE SEEING COMING OUT OF THE WHITE HOUSE THAT LAURMENT IN STATES, INCLUDING THIS ONE, AND TAXPAYERS ARE GOING TO START SEEING THINGS IN A MORE HOLISTIC MANNER, AND IF SO DOES THAT MAKE IT EASIER TO GET THEM TO SWALLOW SOME OF THESE REVENUE ENHANCEMENTS THAT MAY COME UP, A TAX TO THOSE THAT ARE KEEPING SCORE.

OR IS IT EASIER TO SELL WHEN IT'S A ROAD ISSUE, IT'S A WATER ISSUE, IT'S A BROADBAND ISSUE?

BECAUSE NOW IT SEEMS LIKE THE FIRST TIME AS AN AMERICAN SOCIETY, WE'RE GOING TO HAVE A DISCUSSION BY VIRTUE OF THE WHITE HOUSE PROPOSAL, LUMPED TOGETHER, DOES THAT MAKE IT EASIER FOR YOU?

>> THEY ARE CONVERGING, WE ARE BEING SOMEWHAT PROACTIVE, NOT KNOWING WHAT AND WHEN.

WE ARE BUILDING FRAME WORKS FOR RECEIPT OF THAT MONEY, THERE IS LANGUAGE IN SENATE BILL 348 TO DEAL WITH THE WASTE WATER FUNDS COMING DOWN AND FRAME WORKS FOR DEALING WITH THE NEXT-LEVEL BROADBAND FUNDS WHICH ARE ALREADY THERE, PLUS SOME POTENTIAL FEDERAL FUNDING, WHICH LOOKS LIKE IT WILL BE QUITE SIGNIFICANT.

SO AS WE'RE A PART-TIME LEGISLATURE, WE'RE LOOKING FORWARD, AND WE'RE DISCUSSING THOSE PRIORITIES, AND BUILDING THOSE FRAMEWORKS FOR ACCOUNTABILITY.

AND -- >> YOU DON'T NECESSARILY WANT TO SEE THE GOVERNOR -- I KNOW THERE WERE SOME MEMBERS, EVEN OF YOUR CAUCUS, AND YOU'RE THE SAME PARTY AFFILIATION AS THE GOVERNOR, BUT WEREN'T NECESSARILY HAPPY THAT THE FIRST RECOVERY PACKAGE, WHICH WAS SIGNIFICANT FUNDING, WAS DIVVIED UP LARGELY BY THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE BECAUSE YOU WEREN'T IN SESSION.

>> WE WEREN'T, AND WE WORKED WITH THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE ON THE NEW FRAMEWORK, AND I THINK WE'RE ALL NOW IN AGREEMENT ON THOSE PRIORITIES.

>> DOES OUR SYSTEM, WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT ADDRESSING THESE HUGE GENERATIONAL TYPES OF THINGS, ARE WE SET UP TO DEAL WITH THIS?

SEEMS INCREASINGLY, WE'RE IN A WHAT HAVE YOU DONE FOR ME LATELY KIND OF MINDSET, ELECTED OFFICIALS ARE CONSTANTLY HAVING TO SHOW THEIR CONSTITUENTS THIS IS WHAT I DID FOR YOU THIS SESSION.

A PROGRAM, 10, 20 YEARS, AND I THINK WE HAVE THE BEST SELF-SUSTAINING FORMULA WHAT CAME OUT OF THE SESSION MAYBE 2017 THAT STAYS DEDICATED TO THOSE FUNDS.

DOES THAT -- ARE WE CAPABLE AS A POLITICAL SYSTEM NOW OF CHEWING OFF, BITING OFF THESE HUGE PROJECTS, OR ARE WE JUST DOOMED TO THINK OF EVERYTHING IN TWO-YEAR INCREMENTS?

>> I THINK CITIZENS LIKE TO SEE AT THE END OF THE DAY RESULTS, IF I CAN TAKE YOU BACK ABOUT 20 YEARS BACK IN LATE 90s THE FED SAID, HEY, FORT WAYNE, YOU GOT TO CLEAN UP THE RIVERS.

NOW, THEY TELL YOU THAT WITHOUT DOLLARS ATTACHED.

BUT IF THE CITY DECIDED THAT WE'RE GOING TO GET A TASK FORCE OF CITIZEN NEIGHBORHOOD LEADERS TOGETHER AND WORK WITH THEM AND CONVINCE THE REST OF THE CITIZENS IN FORT WAYNE HOW IMPORTANT IT IS TO MAINTAIN, CLEAN UP THE RIVERS, AND SO WE DID A -- IT TOOK ABOUT TEN YEARS, CAME UP WITH OUR CONSENT DEGREE AND PLAN, THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT APPROVED, AND THE NUMBER OF OVERFLOWS GOING INTO THE RIVERS HAS GREATLY DECR DECREASED.

WE SET OUT A PLAN TO SEPARATE THE SEWERS, NOW WE HAVE A TUNNEL OPENING I THINK IN A COUPLE MORE YEARS, INDIANAPOLIS HAS ONE AS WELL.

BUT FOLKS NOW, IF YOU GO TO OUR NEW PARK CALLED PROMENADE PARK IN FORT WAYNE, TWO YEARS IN AUGUST, PEOPLE ARE CANOEING ON THE RIVER.

THEY'RE REALLY ENJOYING, THAT WAS ONE OF THE SELLING POINTS OF HAVING TO PAY AN INCREASED IN YOUR SEWER BILL WAS, HEY, JUST THINK OF WHAT THE RESULT WILL BE.

WE'RE GOING TO BE ABLE TO HAVE THESE GREAT RIVERS WHERE PEOPLE CAN COME PLAY ON THE RIVERS, ATTRACT MORE BUSINESSES TO DOWNTOWN FORT WAYNE.

>> DO THEY HAVE A CHOICE, SO MANY THINGS, CONSENT DECREE, THIS IS UNACCEPTABLE, YOU BETTER COME UP WITH A WAY TO FIX IT.

THAT COMPELS ACTION.

THE STORY HAS A HAPPY ENDING.

>> IT WILL BE NICE TO HAVE THE FEDERAL DOLLARS COME IN, YOU MENTIONED 348, THE TASK FORCE BILL GOING TO BE SET UP WITH LEGISLATORS ON THERE AS WELL AS OTHER MEMBERS FROM THE STATE WILL BE ON THERE TO HELP DETERMINE THE BEST WAY TO GET THESE FUNDS OUT TO THE COMMUNITY.

>> JON, IF I COULD ADD, ONE THING THAT WE HAVE SUCCESSFULLY USED THE LAST FEW YEARS ARE THESE STATE-WIDE TASK FORCES, LONG-TERM ADVISED BY EXPERTS, A MIX OF MEMBERS BETWEEN LEGISLATORS, ADMINISTRATION, AND OUTSIDE EXPERTS, WE USED IT WITH ROAD FUNDING, WATER AND STORM WATER, WE JUST CAME OFF OF A TWO-YEAR ENERGY POLICY TASK FORCE, WHICH IS GOING TO BE REAUTHORIZED FOR ANOTHER TWO-YEAR LOOK AT DISTRIBUTED GENERATION.

>> EVEN USED IT FOR SUNDAY LIQUOR SALES.

>> I GUESS WE DID.

I FORGOT ABOUT THAT.

>> WHERE MY MIND IS.

>> THIS SUMMER THERE WILL BE TWO KICKOFF, ONE IS THE REAUTHORIZED ENERGY TASK FORCE, REDISTRIBUTED GENERATION AND THE WASTE WATER TASK FORCE.

THIS GIVES US A CHANCE TO NOT BE HOSTAGE TO THE TIMETABLE SESSION, EVERYTHING IS 110 MILES PER HOUR, TAKE A LONGER VIEW, ADVISED BY EXPERTS.

THAT'S BEEN A REALLY GOOD MODEL, THAT WILL CONTINUE AS WE MAKE SOME OF THESE OTHER INFRASTRUCTURE DECISIONS.

>> JAMIE PALMER, AS PEOPLE SIT THERE THINKING, THE MONEY IS COMING, AND IN ALL LIKELIHOOD IT WILL TO SOME EXTENT.

IS PROBABLY A TEMPTATION TO SAY THIS WILL FIX A LOT OF PROBLEMS.

AS I LOOK AS I DID IN PREPARING FOR THE SHOW, THE AMERICAN SOCIETY OF CIVIL ENGINEERS EVERY YEAR COMES OUT WITH A NATIONAL STUDY, WITH STATE BY STATE BREAKDOWNS.

THE GAP NOW, THE PROJECT GAP FOR ALL KINDS OF INFRASTRUCTURE, LEVIES, DAMS, BRIDGES, ROADS, RAIL LINES, AND WATER, CERTAINLY, IS 2.59 TRILLION, I BELIEVE, IN INDIANA.

NOW, I THINK THAT IS THE CASE.

IF YOU REALLY WANTED TO SOLVE THE PROBLEM, JOE BIDEN WOULD HAVE TO SAY USE EVERYTHING JUST IN THE STATE OF INDIANA.

ARE EXPECTATIONS SET TOO HIGH THAT THIS IS A PANACEA TO SOLVE ALL OUR INFRASTRUCTURE PROBLEMS IF THIS MONEY DOES FLOW?

>> CERTAINLY NOT GOING TO SOLVE ALL OUR INFRASTRUCTURE PROBLEMS.

BUT IT IS A GOOD START.

AND THE SUSTAINED ATTENTION, THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY HAS GIVEN A NUMBER OF THESE AREAS, IS REALLY CRITICAL, FOR INSTANCE.

THEY HAVE CREATED A STATE WATER ASSISTANCE FUND THAT THIS YEAR HAD $17 MILLION WITH THE REVERSION, AND THEN HOPEFULLY IN THE NEW BUDGET WILL HAVE 20 FOR EACH YEAR.

WE JUST NEED TO KEEP AT IT.

I MEAN, WE CAN'T FIX IT ALL AT ONCE ANYWAY.

BUT WE NEED TO GET STARTED ON THE MOST CRITICAL ISSUES, AND THEN JUST KEEP WORKING AT IT.

WE ARE GOING TO NEED MORE MONEY.

BUT WE'RE ALSO NEVER GOING TO HAVE AS MUCH MONEY AS WE WANT.

SO ALSO ONE OF THE REALLY PRUDENT THINGS THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY HAS DONE IS TO PUT A FOCUS ON ASSET MANAGEMENT SO THAT COMMUNITIES KNOW WHAT THEY HAVE, THEY KNOW WHAT CONDITION IT'S IN, AND THEN THEY CAN USE THAT OVER TIME TO MANAGE IT EFFICIENTLY.

BECAUSE IF THEY DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY HAVE, ALL THEY'RE DOING IS LIKE GOING FROM ONE CRISIS TO ANOTHER.

>> AND I SHOULD POINT OUT, AS I WAS ASKING THAT QUESTION, I THINK I CAUGHT MYSELF PAINTING A BLEAKER PICTURE THAN I NEEDED TO.

IT'S NOT 2.5 TRILLION THAT INDIANA'S GAP, 2.5 BILLION.

MAYBE THIS IS THE PANACEA.

I TAKE IT BACK.

SILVER BULLET FOR ALL.

GARY LANGSTON, WE TALK ABOUT MAKING PEOPLE AWARE, THEY'RE AWARE OF ROADS, THAT THE ROADS ARE BAD, TALK ABOUT THE AMERICAN SOCIETY OF CIVIL ENGINEERS, THEY SAY WE GET A C MINUS ON ALL OF OUR INFRASTRUCTURE, THE GOOD NEWS THAT'S UP FROM A D PLUS.

ANOTHER STUDY THAT CAME OUT THE SAME MONTH, OR WITHIN SIX WEEKS OR SO, NATIONAL STUDY THAT SAYS WE HAVE THE SECOND BEST ROAD SYSTEM, OUR DRIVERS ARE SO FORTUNATE, SECOND ONLY TO TEXAS.

WHAT DO YOU USE AS THE ARBITER IN TERMS OF JUDGING WHERE WE ARE VIS-A-VIS OTHER STATES, AND WHAT'S THE EFFECTIVE TOOL THAT HOOSIERS, TAXPAYERS SHOULD SAY, YEAH, THAT'S THE BIBLE WHERE WE STAND IN TERMS OF THE NATION?

>> I'M NOT SURE WHAT ALL HOOSIERS SHOULD USE AS THE MEASURING STICK.

BUT WE USE DRIVERS.

I MEAN, THE BILLIONS OF MILES...INDICATOR OF WHO IS DOING THE RIGHT THING, WHO ISN'T, WHO NEEDS MORE MONEY, AND WHO NEEDS TO FOCUS THAT WAY.

SO, YOU'RE RIGHT, YOU CAN FIND DIFFERENT STUDIES THAT SAY DIFFERENT THINGS, AND I'M NOT SURE WHERE WE RANK WITH ALL OF THAT.

I KNOW THAT -- I KNOW THAT WE STILL HAVE WORK TO DO TO IMPROVE OUR INTERSTATES.

AND WE ARE DOING THAT.

WE NEED MORE CAPACITY TO RELIEVE CONGESTION.

CONGESTION STILL -- YOU WOULDN'T THINK THAT INDIANA WAS A STATE THAT HAS A LOT OF CONGESTION.

BUT, IN THE MOST RECENT 100 TOP CONGESTED AREAS IN THE NATION, INDIANA'S FOR THOSE PLACES.

SO, WE NEED TO ADD ADDITIONAL LANES.

WE NEED TO ADD ADDITIONAL PARKING, AND I THINK WHAT'S GOING ON IS A STEP IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION.

I'M JUST THRILLED THAT THERE IS SO MUCH TALK ABOUT INFRASTRUCTURE, PARTICULARLY AT THE FEDERAL LEVEL.

WE'VE BEEN TRYING TO GET THAT DONE FOR A WHILE.

WE'VE GOT TO SHORE UP THIS HIGHWAY TRUST FUND.

YOU KNOW, THIS INFUSION OF CASH HERE WILL HOPEFULLY KEEP PEOPLE'S INTEREST, BUT IT'S CERTAINLY NOT GOING TO FIX THE PROBLEM.

WE HAVE TO FIND A RELIABLE SUSTAINABLE SOURCE TO DO THAT.

BECAUSE WE HAVE A LOT OF THINGS THAT AREN'T DEVELOPED THAT ARE GOING TO NEED TO BE LIKE THE ELECTRIC GRID FOR ELECTRIC VEHICLES.

IN INDIANA, IF I GET THIS WRONG, I BELIEVE IT'S REPRESENTATIVE KARICKHOFF HAS A BILL STUDYING WHERE WE ARE IN INDIANA WITH REGARD TO BEING PREPARED FOR THAT.

THERE'S A LOT OF WORK TO DO WITH THE INFRASTRUCTURE OF THAT PART OF THE INDUSTRY.

>> I THINK THERE ARE A FEW BILLS DEALING WITH THAT.

THEY MIGHT BE ABLE TO POINT TO A FEW.

CERTAINLY A HOT TOPIC, AND WILL PROBABLY BE FOR SOME TIME.

>> RIGHT.

>> IT'S -- YOU KNOW, AS I LOOK AT ALL THIS, I -- ARE YOU SMILING OR CURSING THE WHITE HOUSE, THE TIMING ON THIS?

AGAIN, IT IS NOT A DONE DEAL, RECONCILIATION MAY WELL BE A DONE DEAL.

BUT YOU ALREADY HAVE A BUDGET THAT YOU HAVE TO FINISH UP HERE, YOU AND YOUR COLLEAGUES IN THE NEXT FEW WEEKS.

THE GOVERNOR WANTED $100 MILLION FOR BROADBAND EXPANSION, AND THERE IS ALREADY BUDGET ITEMS.

HOW DO YOU PUT A BUDGET TOGETHER THINKING THAT MAY BE ALL OUT THE WINDOW ANYWAY?

IS THIS JUST A COMPLICATER YOU DON'T NEED?

>> WE'RE BEING PROACTIVE, THINKING HOW TO PRIORITIZE IT, BUILDING A FRAMEWORK, SEWING A POCKET FOR AN UNKNOWN.

BUT WE HAVE A GLIMPSE OF WHAT WE THINK IT MAY LOOK LIKE.

BEING A PART TIME GENERAL ASSEMBLY WE HAVE TO DO THAT.

WE'RE GOING TO LEAVE HERE IN A COUPLE WEEKS.

WE'LL BE GONE FORMALLY UNTIL NEXT YEAR.

WE'LL HAVE THESE INTERIM STUDY COMMITTEES AND TASK FORCE AND COMMISSIONS GOING ON IN THE MEANTIME THAT I THINK ARE GOING TO BE VERY INVOLVED IN MAKING THOSE DECISIONS.

>> EVERYBODY LOOKS AT THIS, I GUESS, FORGET BEAUTY BEING IN THE EYE OF THE BEHOLDER, NOW INFRASTRUCTURE IS IN THE EYE OF THE BEHOLDER, A LOT OF PEOPLE DEPENDING WHERE THEIR DISTRICTS ARE, CARE MORE ABOUT WATER, ENERGY, CARE MORE ABOUT, IF I HAD TO -- AND GRANTEDED YOUR DAY JOB IS WITH THE CITY UTILITY.

IF YOU HAD TO SAY HERE'S A POT OF MONEY, YOU NEED TO DIVVY IT UP, WHAT ARE PRIORITY ONE, TWO, THREE?

>> WELL, GREAT QUESTION.

AND YOU KNOW, IT'S INTERESTING, BECAUSE MAYORS WOULD RATHER THE MONEY COME TO THEM, IN WHICH A LOT OF HUD DOLLARS COME TO MAYORS, THEY DON'T HAVE TO MESS AROUND WITH CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS THAT HAVE THEIR OWN WISH LIST, IF YOU ASK ANYONE THEY'RE ALWAYS GOING TO TELL YOU THEY GOT ABOUT 25 THINGS THAT THEY'D LIKE TO DO.

YEAH, AS YOU SAID, I'M A WATER PERSON.

AND SO BUT YOU'RE ALWAYS GOING TO HAVE ROADS THAT ARE ALWAYS GOING TO BE PROBABLY FRANKLY NUMBER ONE IN MOST PEOPLE'S EYES HOW DO WE CONTINUE TO MAINTAIN OUR STREETS AND CURBS AND SIDEWALKS, AND THOSE TYPE OF THINGS ON A LOCAL LEVEL.

BUT CERTAINLY WHEN I THINK INFRASTRUCTURE AND WHEN WE'VE SEEN JUST IN THIS PAST WEEK, THE PROBLEM THEY'RE HAVING DOWN IN FLORIDA WITH THEIR SEWAGE POND, THINGS LIKE THAT, AND THE CITY OF FORT WAYNE HAS DONE A REALLY GOOD JOB.

>> NOW RELEASED INTO THE GULF OF MEXICO.

>> EXACTLY.

I WOULD, THOUGH, LIKE TO JUST SORT OF ADD THAT I THINK AS WE'RE THINKING ABOUT THESE THINGS, SENATOR, THAT MAYBE IT WOULD LOOK ALSO IS LIKE REGIONIZATION, HOW CAN THE CITY OF FORT WAYNE EXPAND AND HELP OUT OTHER AREAS WITHIN THE REGION SO THAT SOME OF THESE SMALLER UTILITIES DON'T HAVE TO NECESSARILY RELY ON THEMSELVES AND FORT WAYNE, BECAUSE WE DO OVER THE LAST TEN TO 20 YEARS WE'VE EXPANDED OUR CAPACITY TO BE ABLE TO TAKE MORE SEWAGE FROM SURROUNDING COMMUNITIES, AND THAT MIGHT BE ONE WAY TO KIND OF HELP FRANKLY EVEN LOWER THE COST, HELP US GET BETTER BIDS AND THINGS LIKE THAT IF WE'RE ABLE TO HELP OUT MORE FOLKS IN THE REGION.

>> HOW TO GET THERE FROM BEDFORD -- >> AS WE THINK ABOUT DOLLARS COMING TO COMMUNITIES, MAYBE WE CAN INCENTIVIZE THOSE LIKE THE CITY OF FORT WAYNE, TRYING TO BE MORE OF A REGIONAL AREA VERSUS MAYBE GIVING OUT TO EVERY LITTLE COMMUNITY THAT MAY NOT BE SET UP TO TAKE THE MONEY.

>> TALKING ABOUT REGIONAL ADVANCES TIES INTO ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT, A LOT OF PEOPLE, CHAMBER AND OTHERS, AGAIN, TALKING ABOUT LOTS OF STUDIES, THE BIGGEST ECONOMIC BANG FOR YOUR BUCK IN TERMS OF A BILLION SPENT HERE, MEANS A BILLION IN INVESTMENT DOWN THE ROAD.

YOU STUDIED THESE ISSUES, IS THERE ONE PART OF THE INFRASTRUCTURE EQUATION THAT REALLY DOES AT THIS TIME IN OUR HISTORY YIELD A BIGGER POT?

IS IT BROADBAND?

THE NOTION -- AND I DON'T WANT YOU TO TURN YOUR BACK ON YOUR BELOVED WATER ISSUES?

>> I'M NOT SURE I'M WILLING TO PICK UONE.

ELECTED OFFICIALS AR ALWAYS FOCUSED MORE ON ROADS.

IN TERMS OF WATER, THERE IS MORE CONCERN RIGHT NOW ABOUT STORM WATER, LIKE I SAID BEFORE.

IT'S ALL CRITICAL.

IF WE WANT ALL OF THE STATE TO THRIVE, THEN IT ALL HAS TO HAVE CERTAIN AT LEAST MINIMUM INFRASTRUCTURE.

>> I'M AFRAID WE'RE ALMOST OUT OF TIME.

GARY LANGSTON, THE FINAL WORD, HONEYMOON, THIS BLISSFUL MOMENT, IS IT GOING TO LAST?

>> IT USED TO BE EASY WHEN YOU MAKE THE PRIORITIES VERTICAL.

THEY'RE MORE HORIZONTAL, IF I DID SAY THAT ROADS AND BRIDGES WERE THE MOST IMPORTANT, IT WOULD ONLY BE BECAUSE WE CAN MOVE EVERYTHING TO EVERYBODY ELSE TO GET IT FIXED.

>> BECAUSE WHAT IS ON THE BACK OF YOUR TRUCK ISN'T GOING TO GO ON THE RAIL CAR AND INTO THE BELLY OF THE PLANE AND ONTO THE SHIP.

INTERMODAL.

ANOTHER TOPIC FOR ANOTHER DAY.

THANK YOU FOR BEING HERE, YOU OBVIOUSLY HAVE A GREAT AMOUNT OF EXPERTISE AND PASSION.

AGAIN, MY GUESTS HAVE BEEN: REPUBLICAN SENATOR ERIC KOCH OF BEDFORD, HOUSE DEMOCRATIC LEADER PHIL GIAQUINTA OF FORT WAYNE, JAMIE PALMER OF THE INDIANA UNIVERSITY PUBLIC POLICY INSTITUTE, AND GARY LANGSTON OF THE INDIANA MOTOR TRUCK ASSOCIATION.

WILL INDIANA FOLLOW GEORGIA AND OTHER STATES IN CHANGING ITS VOTING LAWS?

ONE MAN'S FRAUD PROTECTION IS ANOTHER MAN'S VOTER SUPPRESSION, ON THE NEXT INDIANA LAWMAKERS.

TIME NOW FOR OUR WEEKLY CONVERSATION WITH INDIANA LAWMAKERS ANALYST ED FEIGENBAUM, PUBLISHER OF THE NEWSLETTER INDIANA LEGISLATIVE INSIGHT, PART OF HANNAH NEWS SERVICE.

ED, HAS THE PRESIDENT SEEN TO IT THAT WE'RE NOW GOING TO TALK ABOUT INFRASTRUCTURE AS SORT OF A ONE BIG THING AS OPPOSED TO THE WAY WE USED TO TALK ABOUT THINGS, HEY, AIRPORTS, ROADS, PORTS, HARBORS, IS THIS THE NEW NORMAL?

>> LOOKS LIKE THE AMERICAN JOBS PLAN IS TAKING THE SAME VIEW OF INFRASTRUCTURE AS THE PANEL AND THE GOVERNOR AND THE LEGISLATURE, AND THAT IS A BROAD VIEW.

ONE THING THAT REALLY DIDN'T COME ACROSS IN THAT, OR IN THE TALK FROM THE PANEL TODAY IS THE FACT THAT REALLY JOB ONE FOR INFRASTRUCTURE IS MAINTAINING WHAT WE HAVE.

AND THE MORE ROAD MILES THAT YOU PAVE, THE MORE TRANSMISSION LINES FOR UTILITIES THAT YOU PUT UP IN THE AIR OR UNDERGROUND, THE MORE MILES OF PIPELINE THAT YOU'VE GOT, THE MORE YOU'VE GOT TO MAINTAIN THEM, THEY NEED TO BE PLOWED, FIXED, MAINTAINED.

THAT'S SOMETHING WE'VE NEGLECTED FOR DECADE, AND IN SOME CASES CENTURIES.

>> IF YOU'RE A LAWMAKER, TABBING YOUR SUCCESSES TO YOUR VOTERS, PROBABLY SEXIER TO SAY LOOK AT THIS ROAD THAN WE PATCHED THOSE HOLES.

>> ABSOLUTELY.

AND THEN YOU ALSO, IF YOU'RE A LEGISLATOR SAY WE ARE FORCED BY FEDERAL MANDATES TO DO CERTAIN THINGS, ONE IS TO FIX SEWER PLANTS.

AND THERE IS ONE MAJOR CITY IN THE STATE OF INDIANA THAT JUST THIS WEEK ANNOUNCED A BIG PLAN, ALMOST $200 MILLION TO UPGRADE SEWER FACILITIES, AND SOME SEWERS LINES THAT HAVEN'T BEEN FIXED SINCE THE 1800s WHEN THEY WERE BUILT.

THERE ARE A LOT OF DIFFERENT THINGS THAT NEED TO BE DONE TO MAINTAIN THINGS.

>> JUST A FEW SECONDS.

NOW THAT WE THINK THERE IS A POT OF GOLD, LITERALLY, ALMOST, AT THE END OF THE RAINBOW, DOES THIS CHANGE THE PACING AND RHYTHM OF THE BUDGET TALKS OVER THE NEXT COUPLE WEEKS?

>> I DON'T THINK THE LEGISLATURE WILL BE LOOKING AT FEDERAL DOLLARS AT THIS POINT, THEY'RE TOO SPECULATIVE.

I THINK YOU'LL SEE THE SENATE BUDGET THAT WAS JUST REVEALED DURING THE COURSE OF THE WEEK COME OUT IN THE COMING WEEK HERE WITH SOME MONEY -- A LOT OF MONEY FOR INFRASTRUCTURE, INCLUDING $250 MILLION FOR BROADBAND, ALTHOUGH SOME PEOPLE SAY WE MIGHT NEED AS MUCH AS 3 BILLION FOR THAT, ALSO SEE BABY STEPS TAKEN TOWARD INTERMODAL LOGISTICS, INCLUDING SOME MONEY FOR HUFFINGTON HARBOR UP IN GARY.

>> ED, WE'LL HAVE TO LEAVE IT THERE, THANKS AS ALWAYS FOR YOUR INSIGHT, SEE YOU NEXT WEEK.

>> UNTIL NEXT WEEK, TAKE CARE.

AND REMEMBER, YOU CAN GET OUR SHOW ON DEMAND FROM XFINITY.

THAT CONCLUDES ANOTHER EDITION OF INDIANA LAWMAKERS, I'M JON SCHWANTES, ON BEHALF OF WFYI PUBLIC MEDIA AND INDIANA'S PUBLIC BROADCASTING STATIONS, THANK YOU FOR JOINING US, INVITE YOU TO VISIT US AT...UNTIL NEXT