A vigil last night with over 20 community organizations, including Students for Justice in Palestine at Stockton University.

Drew Princeton TCNJ and Rutgers, held in New Brunswick on Wednesday, honored the more than 15,000 Palestinians killed since October 7th by Israeli airstrikes The organizers also demanded a cease fire and the Israel-Hamas war specifically targeting Congressman Frank Pallone, who has not yet called for one and two last month attended the pro-war march for Israel and Washington, D.C.. From London, I'm joined by Omar Shakir, the Israel and Palestine director at Human Rights Watch who investigates human rights abuses in Israel, the West Bank and Gaza.

Omar, today marks two months to the day of the deadly Hamas attack on Israel.

And your group, Human Rights Watch, has repeatedly condemned the Israelis retaliation on the Palestinian people.

That have resulted in over 15,000 Palestinian deaths.

Do you see this as genocide?

Is Israel committing apartheid or what It's clear that the Israeli government is committing war crimes in the context of the current hostilities.

Whenever you punish an entire civilian population, In the case of Gaza, more than 2.2 million people, half of whom are children, for the heinous acts of fighters.

That is textbook collective punishment, which is a war crime, deliberately obstructing the entry of humanitarian aid.

Lifesaving aid is a war crime, starvation as a method or a weapon of war is a war crime.

Human Rights Watch has documented that Israeli authorities are committing the crimes against humanity of apartheid and persecution.

This is not unique to the recent two months.

We have our report on this edition.

2021.

We're talking about years long, systematic oppression of Palestinians, including those in Gaza, including the 16 year closure policy of Gaza, the generalized ban on travel.

We're talking about a policy methodically to maintain the domination by Jewish Israelis over Palestinians when it comes to access to land resources, when it comes to the overarching policy around freedom of movement, around legal status.

This was happening on October 6th.

You know, in the years before.

And they continue.

So we're seeing serious abuses.

We've also documented war crimes by Palestinian armed groups, including the heinous October 7th acts.

And we know that your ability to get your message out has been difficult.

Your talk at the Columbia University Law School was canceled numerous times.

The school claimed that there were security approvals that were not raised before.

Do you believe free speech is being undermined on college campuses, especially around this issue?

I certainly think when you see the climate in Europe, in the United States, around discussions of Israel-Palestine, it's very concerning.

Human Rights Watch has documented how anti-boycott laws have been used to muzzle legitimate campaigns, activism, discussions around business and human rights in the occupied Palestinian territory.

In my case, I eventually was able to get the talk at Columbia.

I've done so at Harvard, Stanford, University of Chicago, probably 50, 60 campuses over the last year.

I've spent more time in the United States, but I'm relatively privileged.

And I think when you look at students young faculty, we're seeing really alarming reports, student groups that are entirely banned from doing events, the doxing of students, trucks that are going around campus showing students the personal information you have job offers that have been withdrawn over free expression.

You also have students that face legitimate concerns us anti-Arab, anti-Palestinian as well.

We think about those concerns.

Omar, this comes amid a larger environment of what some are calling censorship and people losing their jobs or speaking out in support of Palestinian rights or being called anti-Semitic.

You know, so what are your thoughts on that?

Why is that?

Look, I mean, Palestine legal U.S. human rights organization has talked about the Palestine exception to free expression.

There has been a years-long tendency for students faculty, others to speak out on Palestinian rights, to be sanctioned for doing so.

Sometimes it's event cancelations, but sometimes it is suspensions.

It is people losing jobs.

And it is a product, I think, of a climate in the United States where sometimes speech for Palestinian rights, people are punishing it because they disagree on the substance.

Omar, thank you so much for joining me.

My pleasure.