COMING UP ON "BEHIND THE WOMAN."

>> I'M EXCITED TO INTRODUCE Dr. JAMILA MICHENER.

>> SAYING THAT I WOULD BE A TENURED PROFESSOR AT AN IVY LEAGUE INSTITUTION WOULD HAVE BEEN SO FAR FROM MY RADAR.

OUR CLASS THIS SEMESTER IS DEVOTED TO THINKING CAREFULLY ABOUT RACE, RACISM AND HOW THEY MANIFEST IN POLITICS.

>> I JUST REMEMBER THINKING WHY DOES IT SEEM LIKE THERE IS A WAY THAT WE LIVE AND THERE IS ANOTHER WAY THAT OTHER FOLKS LIVE.

I CAN PURSUE THE QUESTIONS THAT ARE THE IMPORTANT QUESTIONS EVEN IF PEOPLE DON'T LIKE THE QUESTIONS.

♪ I GOT A GOOD, GOOD FEELING... ♪ YEAH I'M UP ON A CLOUD, AIN'T COMING BACK DOWN ♪ ♪ I GOT A GOOD, GOOD, GOOD FEELING... ♪ I'M UP ON A CLOUD, AIN'T COMING BACK DOWN ♪ >> GOOD EVENING AND WELCOME TO "BEHIND THE WOMAN."

I'M YOUR HOST Dr. JUHANNA ROGERS.

WE ARE HERE TO CELEBRATE AND LEARN ABOUT THE DIVERSE WOMEN ENHANCING CENTRAL NEW YORK.

AND TONIGHT I'M EXCITED TO INTRODUCE ONE OF THESE WOMEN, Dr. JAMILA MICHENER.

SHE IS AN ASSOCIATE PROFESSOR AT THE CORNELL UNIVERSITY WHERE SHE STUDIES, TEACHES AND INVESTIGATES POVERTY, RACIAL INEQUITY AT THE INTERSECTIONS OF PUBLIC POLICY.

I WANT YOU TO GATHER YOUR FAMILY, SEND A TEXT TO A REALLY GOOD FRIEND AND TELL THEM THEY DON'T WANT TO MISS THIS EPISODE OF "BEHIND THE WOMAN."

BECAUSE Dr. JAMILA MICHENER IS HERE.

THANK YOU FOR COMING UP FROM OUR NEIGHBORING METROPOLIS OF ITHACA.

>> YEAH, THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.

IT WAS A NICE RELAXING DRIVE.

AND I AM SO HAPPY TO BE HERE.

>> I WANT TO TALK TO YOU A LITTLE BIT ABOUT BEING A BLACK WOMAN AND WORKING IN THE ACADEMY.

>> YEAH.

>> AND I THINK FOLKS HAVE HEARD A LITTLE BIT ABOUT MY STORY AND I'M NOT-- I'VE CHOSEN NOT TO WORK WITHIN ACADEMIA FOR A WHILE BUT TO GET OUT INTO THE COMMUNITY.

AND WHAT I REALIZED IS THAT I HAVE BEEN IN A BUBBLE, RIGHT?

AND SOME OF THE WAYS IN WHICH I HAVE HAD TO OPPORTUNITY OPERATE, I'VE HAD TO MORPH BECAUSE THIS IS THE REAL WORLD.

THIS ISN'T THE LIBRARY.

THIS ISN'T CAMPUS.

IT'S A BROADER SPECTRUM.

AND WHAT I REALIZED IS THAT A LOT OF FOLKS DON'T REALLY UNDERSTAND THE DYNAMICS OF WHAT IT TAKES TO BE AN ACADEMIC.

AND SO 1: WHAT MADE YOU GO INTO THE FIELD OF WORK.

AND THEN I'LL ASK MORE POINTED QUESTIONS.

BUT WHAT IS IT LIKE EVERY DAY?

ARE WAS DOES YOUR LIFE LOOK LIKE AS ASSOCIATE PROFESSOR AND WHAT DOES THAT EVEN MEAN?

>> YEAH, I LOVE THAT.

OKAY.

I'LL START AT THE BEGINNING, I GUESS, WHICH IS HOW I GOT INTO THIS BECAUSE IF YOU HAD ASKED ME REALLY AT ANY POINT IN MY YOUNG ADULT LIFE WHERE I SAW MYSELF ENDING UP, SAYING THAT I WOULD BE A TENURED PROFESSOR AT AN IVY LEAGUE INSTITUTION WOULD HAVE BEEN SO FAR FROM MY RADAR.

I MEAN I DIDN'T EVEN KNOW THAT KIND OF A CAREER WAS A POSSIBILITY.

IT WASN'T ANYTHING I SAW ANYWHERE IN MY LIFE.

AND SO I'VE GOTTEN THERE THROUGH, YOU KNOW, JUST SORT OF INCIDENTAL PATH, HONESTLY.

SO GROWING UP, MY PARENTS WERE IMMIGRANTS.

THEY IMMIGRATED TO THIS COUNTRY IN THE 70s, WORKING CLASS PEOPLE THAT WORKED REALLY HARD.

BUT THERE WASN'T ANYONE AROUND WHO WAS A LAWYER OR A DOCTOR OR A PROFESSOR, RIGHT?

>> AND WHERE DID YOU GROW UP?

>> NEW YORK CITY IN BROOKLYN AND IN QUEENS.

AND, YOU KNOW, WORKING CLASS IMMIGRANT COMMUNITIES WHERE MOST PEOPLE WERE DOING VARIOUS KINDS OF LABOR THAT WASN'T-- THAT WEREN'T PART OF LIKE A PROFESSIONAL CLASS, YOU KNOW.

SO I KNEW FROM PRETTY EARLY ON THAT I WANTED TO DO SOMETHING DIFFERENT, MOSTLY BECAUSE I WANTED TO GET OUT OF THE HOOD.

I WAS LIKE I NEED TO NOT BE LIVING IN QUEENS MY WHOLE LIFE.

I NEED TO HAVE SOME OPTIONS.

AND WHEN I WENT TO COLLEGE, I REMEMBER THINKING I WANT TO LEARN ABOUT POVERTY AND INEQUALITY, MOSTLY BECAUSE I HAD ALWAYS GROWN UP AROUND ME WONDERED WHY THINGS WERE THE WAY THEY WERE AND WHY THEY SEEMED TO BE THAT WAY FOR PEOPLE THAT LOOKED LIKE ME AND MY PARENTS AND THE OTHER FOLKS IN OUR COMMUNITY.

BUT WEREN'T THAT WAY FOR OTHER PEOPLE, RIGHT?

I HAD AT ONE POINT MOVED TO NEW JERSEY AND I REMEMBER GOING TO THE NEW JERSEY SUBURB WITH MY FAMILY AND LOOKING AROUND AND THINKING, THIS IS HOW OTHER PEOPLE ARE LIVING?

POOLS IN THE BACKYARD?

>> WHERE WAS SHE LIVING OUT IN ENGINEERSY?

>> GENERAL JERSEY.

-- CENTRAL JERSEY.

IT WAS A MIDDLE CLASS NEW JERSEY SUBURB BUT SO DIFFERENT FROM WHAT I KNEW IN BROOKLYN AND QOOENCE.

>> LIKE GOING FROM SYRACUSE TO MANLIUS.

LIKE IT'S A VERY DIFFERENT-- >> ABSOLUTELY.

AND EVERYBODY WAS WHITE.

WELL, BESIDE MY AUNT AND MY COUSIN.

AND I JUST REMEMBER THINKING, WHY DOES IT SEEM LIKE THERE IS A WAY THAT WE LIVE, PEOPLE LIKE ME THAT LOOK LIKE ME AND THERE IS ANOTHER WAY THAT OTHER FOLKS LIVE.

BUT THOSE ARE THE KINDS OF QUESTIONS I ALWAYS HAD AND WHEN I BOUGHT TO COLLEGE, I SAID I'M GOING TO PURSUE SOME OF THESE ANSWERS AND I LOOK TOOK A LOT OF CLASSES ON TOPICS RELATED TO POVERTY AND INEQUALITY.

AND IN ONE OF THOSE CLASSES, A PROFESSOR OF MINE SAID TOWARD THE END OF COLLEGE, MY JUNIOR YEAR SAID HAVE YOU EVER THOUGHT OF GOING TO GRADUATE SCHOOL?

AND I REMEMBER THINKING, I SAID TO HER, FOR WHAT?

AND SHE SAID TO GET YOUR Ph.D. AND TO BE 100% HONEST, I'M GOING KEEP IT REAL.

I REMEMBER THINKING IN MY HEAD, THAT IS FOR WHITE PEOPLE.

>> LISTEN... >> WHO CAN TWIDDLE THEIR THUMBS READING MORE BOOKS.

I NEED TO GET A JOB.

I CAN'T GO TO SCHOOL FOREVER.

BUT IT PLANTED A SEED IN MY MIND.

SO I DID TAKE TIME OFF AFTER UNDERGRADUATE AND I WORKED.

AND I WOULD BE-- THERE WAS A BOOKSTORE MENTION TO MY OFFICE AND I WOULD BE READING AND PEOPLE WOULD BE LIKE YOU SHOULD GO TO GRADUATE SCHOOL.

EVENTUALLY I HEARD IT ENOUGH AND LEARNED A LITTLE BIT MORE AND DECIDED I'M GOING IN THIS DIRECTION.

I LIKE READING, I LIKE WRITING, I LIKE LEARNING AND I LIKE LEARNING MORE ABOUT THE WORLD IN ORDER TO CHANGE IT.

>> ONE OF OUR FIRST GUESTS DURING SEASON 1,LEY TECIALY TISCHIA HALL CANNON TALKED ABOUT WHEN YOU ARE A BLACK FACED GIRL OR BROWN FACED GIRL, GROWING UP IN URBAN COMMUNITIES, SHE TALKS ABOUT THE IDEA OF BEING SMART, AND WHEN YOU ARE PERCEIVED AS SMART, HOW YOUR EXPERIENCE IS A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT.

>> YEAH.

>> AND SO AS YOU WERE SITTING HERE, I JUST HEARD HER THOUGHTS IN MY MIND ABOUT LIKE WHEN YOU ARE ABLE TO TRANSLATE AND THINK ABOUT THE WORLD THAT YOU ARE IN AND ASK QUESTIONS ABOUT IT.

LIKE IT'S ALREADY PUTTING NEW A PLACE TO BE AHEAD OF THE CURVE.

AND I THINK MANY OF US ARE ASKING OURSELVES THAT QUESTION.

I GREW UP ON THE OTHER SIDE.

HUDSON IN NEWARK SO I KNOW EXACTLY WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT.

AND I OFTEN SAY SYRACUSE REMINDS ME SO MUCH OF HOME BECAUSE YOU CAN GO 10 MINUTES DOWN THE STREET AND BE IN JERSEY IN A TOTALLY DIFFERENT NEIGHBORHOOD THAN YOUR OWN.

AND SO ALL RIGHT, YOU ARE IN THE BOOKSTORE.

YOU ARE READING AND WRITING.

[LAUGHTER] AND YOU PROBABLY DECIDE TO MAKE THAT HAPPEN.

WHAT DOES A PROFESSIONAL CAREER AS AN DISEAK, WHAT DOES THAT-- AS AN ACADEMIC, WHAT DOES THAT LOOK LIKE?

WHAT DOES THAT MEAN?

WHAT DO DO YOU?

>> I WILL SAY WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE VARIES A LOT.

IT DEPENDS ON THE KIND OF INSTITUTION YOU ARE AT BUT FOR ME AT A PLACE LIKE CORNELL, WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE IS A BIG CHUNK OF WHAT I DO HIVE HOIF AND THIS IS CONTRARY TO WHAT MOST PEOPLE THINK, IS RESEARCH.

CORNELL EXPECTS YOU TO HAVE A REALLY PROMINENT RESEARCH PROFILE.

AND SO I GET TO TAKE A LOT OF THOSE QUESTIONS THAT I HAD AS A KID AND INVEST MY TIME IN ANSWERING THEM.

THAT'S LIKE LITERALRY MY-- LITERALLY MY JOB.

I'M COLLECTING DATA AND ANALYZING THE DATA UNDERSTAND TRYING TO UNDERSTAND THE WORLD.

ANOTHER CHUNK IS TEACHING.

BECAUSE AS I AM DEVELOPING KNOWLEDGE ABOUT THE WORLD, I CAN PASS THAT ON TO MY STUDENTS.

BUT I ALSO, AND THIS IS A CHUNK THAT NOT EVERYBODY DOES, NOT EVERY SCHOLAR OR ACADEMIC DOES, BUT A LOT OF MY WORK INVOLVES PUBLIC ENGAGEMENT AND PART OF IT MAY BE MY OWN EXPERIENCES.

FOR ME WHEN I'M ASKING QUESTIONS ABOUT INEQUALITY OR POVERTY, THOSE ARE NOT JUST THEORETICAL.

THEY'RE REAL.

AND SO I WANT TO BE A SCHOLAR AND CONTRIBUTE TO KNOWLEDGE, WHICH IS WHAT CORNELL WANTS.

BUT I ALSO WANT TO-- I WANT TO DO SOMETHING THAT IS GOING TO MATTER IN THE WORLD.

SO I TRY TO TAKE THE WORK THAT I DO AND BRING IT PLACES, WHETHER IT'S POLICY MAKERS OR COMMUNITY ORGANIZATIONS OR WHAT HAVE YOU, TO MAKE SURE IT'S NOT JUST SITTING THERE.

>> THAT'S REALLY IMPORTANT.

AND I ASK THAT QUESTION BECAUSE FOLKS ASK ME ALL THE TIME, YOU KNOW, OR EVEN FOR MYSELF AND I THINK ABOUT DO I WANT TO BECOME A FACULTY MEMBER.

AND PART OF MY ANSWER WAS, I LIKE TO DO STUFF THAT IS ACCESSIBLE TO MY COMMUNITY AND GIVE BACK.

AND SOMETIMES YOU ARE REALLY LUCKY BECAUSE IN SOME SOME REALMS, A LOT OF INSTITUTIONS, IT'S REALLY HARD TO FIND THE SPACES WHERE YOU CAN DO-- YOU CAN ALWAYS FIND THE SPACE TO DO THE RESEARCH AND THE TEACHING BUT TO BRING THAT OTHER PIECE, THAT PUBLIC ENGAGEMENT, COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT COMPONENT ISN'T OFTEN COUNTED OR IT'S NOT CONSIDERED AS MUCH WHEN YOU GO THROUGH THAT THING CALLED TENURE.

>> BUT THAT'S THE PIECE THAT I GET THE MOST EXCITED ABOUT.

I'LL SAY REALLY QUICKLY, CORNELL HAS A GREAT PRISON EDUCATION PROGRAM.

AND WHEN I GOT THERE, ONE OF THE THINGS I WANTED TO DO WAS TEACH IN PRISON SO I HAVE INVESTED IN I TIME IN THAT OVER THE YEARS I HAVE BEEN THERE AND AT VARIOUS POINTS PEOPLE HAVE SAID WHY ARE YOU DOING THAT?

THAT DOESN'T HELP YOU GO IT TENURE.

IT DOESN'T HELP YOU GET RESEARCH PROMINENCE BUT WHAT I ALWAYS SAY IS I GET THE ENERGY AND THE MOTIVATION TO DO THOSE OTHER THINGS WHEN I'M ALSO ABLE TO GIVE TO MY COMMUNITY AND GIVE TO THE ISSUES AND THE CAUSES THAT I KNOW ARE REALLY IMPORTANT.

>> THAT'S WONDERFUL.

WHY DON'T WE LIVE HIF HIF BEFORE WE CONTINUE THIS CONVERSATION WITH Dr. MICHENER, LET'S LOOK INTO ONE OF HER CLASSROOMS TO SEE HOW SHE ENCOURAGES YOUNG STUDENTS TO THINK CRITICALLY ABOUT MANY ISSUES, BUT PARTICULARLY RACE.

>> I DID WANT TO MAKE SURE WE SPENT SOME TIME THINKING CAREFULLY ABOUT RACE AS A CONCEPT BEFORE WE JUMP INTO THINKING ABOUT RACISM AND RACE AND ETHNICITY IN TERMS OF HOW THEY'RE INCORPORATED INTO POLITICS AND LATER IN THE COURSE POLICY, RIGHT?

>> WE ARE AT CORNELL UNIVERSITY AND WE ARE IN THE BROOK SCHOOL OF PUBLIC POLICY, IN A CLASS I'M TEACHING RIGHT NOW, A GRADUATE SEMINAR.

15 GRADUATE STUDENTS OF MINE AND OUR CLASS THIS SEMESTER IS DEVOTED TO THINKING CAREFULLY ABOUT RACE AND RACISM AND HOW THEY MANIFEST IN POLITICS AND HOW WE CAN LEARN ABOUT THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN RACE AND POLITICS.

SO IT'S A VERY FUN TIME.

>> IT MAY NOT SOUND FUN BUT IT'S FUN.

>> EVEN THOUGH THEY WRITE LIKE ACADEMICS, THIS BOOK DOESN'T READ TO ME LIKE THEY'RE WRITING TO ACADEMICS, RIGHT?

MAYBE THEY'RE WRITING TO ACADEMICS AMONG OTHERS.

BUT I THINK THAT THEY'RE WRITING TO LOTS OF FOLKS IN AN ATTEMPT TO TRY TO DISLODGE COMMON UNDERSTANDINGS OF WHAT WE MEAN AND WHAT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT WHEN WE ARE TALKING ABOUT RACE, RIGHT?

OUR CLASS TODAY WAS BASED ON A BOOK CALLED "RACE CRAFT" BY TWO SISTERS, KAREN FIELDS AND BARBARA FIELDS.

ONE IS A SOCIOLOGIST, ONE IS AN HISTORIAN.

AND THE BOOK IS ESSENTIALLY A BOOK THAT CHALLENGES OUR CONVENTIONAL WAYS OF THINKING ABOUT RACE.

IT EMPHASIZES THE FACT THAT RACE DOESN'T HAVE ANY BIOLOGICAL OR SCIENTIFIC BASIS BUT THAT IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE TREAT AS REAL, WE LIVE WITH AS THOUGH IT'S REAL AND THAT HAS IMPLICATIONS FOR SOCIETY.

AND THE BOOK IS REALLY AN ATTEMPT TO DISRUPT THE ASSUMPTIONS THAT WE HAVE ABOUT RACE AND FORCE TO US THINK DIFFERENTLY ABOUT RACE SO THAT ULTIMATELY WE CAN UNDERMINE AND CHANGE RACISM AS A PRACTICE AND A POLICY.

SO WHEN I THINK ABOUT WHAT I WANT MY STUDENTS TO GET FROM ANY CLASS THAT I TEACH BUT IN PARTICULAR THIS CLASS, I WANT THEM TO GET AN OPPORTUNITY TO REALLY THINK, TO THINK BEYOND WHAT THEY WOULD IN EVERYDAY LIFE, TO THINK CAREFULLY, TO THINK CRITICALLY, AND TO BE ABLE TO THINK AT A DEPTH AND LEVEL THAT ALLOWS THEM TO TAKE WHAT THEY LEARN AND NOT HAVE CERTAINTIES AND WALK AWAY THINKING THAT THEY KNOW EVERYTHING IN THE LEARNING PROCESS IS OVER.

BUT LEAST UNDERSTANDING HOW MUCH IS THERE TO KNOW, HOW DIFFICULT THESE IDEAS ARE TO GRAPPLE WITH AND TO GO INTO THE WORLD A MORE CAREFUL AND NUANCED AND EFFECTIVE PERSON IN HOW THEY MOVE ABOUT IN THE WORLD AND THE WORK THIS THE THEY DO IN THE WORLD BECAUSE THEY HAVE REALLY TAKEN THE TIME NECESSARY TO TO UNDERSTAND THE WORLD.

IT'S HARD TO ACT ON THE WORLD IN POSITIVE WAYS IF YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND IT.

RIGHT?

BUT OFTEN WE DON'T REALLY GET THE SPACE TO UNDERSTAND IT.

SO I HOPE THAT THIS CLASS IS A SPACE OF AMPLIFYING UNDERSTANDING AND WAYS THAT MAKE STUDENTS BETTER GOING FORWARD THAN THEY WERE BEFORE THEY WALKED INTO THE ROOM.

GROWING UP, IF YOU TOLD ME I WAS GOING TO BE A PROFESSOR AND I WAS GOING TO GET TO SIT AND TALK AND THINK WITH BRILLIANT STUDENTS ABOUT IMPORTANT THINGS, I JUST WOULD HAVE LAUGHED BECAUSE I NEVER-- THAT IS NOT A FUTURE THAT I SAW AS POSSIBLE FOR MYSELF.

SO TO GET TO BE HERE WITH THEM DOING WHAT I'M DOING, IT REALLY FEELS LIKE AN HONOR AND A BLESSING AND I TRY TO REMEMBER THAT WHEN I'M GRADING AND I'M LIKE, I JUST WANT TO GO TO BED RIGHT NOW.

I TRY TO REMEMBER THAT IT'S TRULY A GIFT.

>> >> IT'S TRULY A GIFT.

>> I ADMIRE WHAT YOU ARE DOING.

>> I ADMIRE WHAT YOU ARE DOING.

MUTUAL ADMIRATION SOCIETY.

>> I SAY THAT SO HUMBLY BECAUSE THE ACADEMY WHOOPED MY BEHIND.

>> OH MY.

ALL OF US.

>> I MEAN I'M MUCH MORE IN THE 9-5 ENJOY THE WORK I'M DOING OUTSIDE OF THAT REALM BECAUSE I FEEL LIKE I'M NOT BEATING DOWN THE DOORS MOST DAYS IN THE SAME WAY THAT I HAD TO DO WITHIN THE ACADEMY AND SO WE'LL GET TO THAT.

BUT THE GIFT THAT YOU HAVE, I HAVE HERE THIS ARTICLE.

IT'S GOING UP ON MY WALL.

LIKE WHEN WE WERE KIDS AND PUT POSTERS ON MY WALL BECAUSE THIS IS AN ARTICLE THAT YOU HAVE THAT YOU WROTE FOR OR WAS CONTRIBUTED TO FOR THE WASHINGTON POST AND ON HER WEBSITE YOU HAVE RLS ARTICLES THAT YOU HAVE BEEN CITED IN OR PROVIDED THAT HAVE ALSO SHOWN UP IN THE NEW YORK TIMES.

AND FOR THOSE THAT DON'T UNDERSTAND THE SIGNIFICANCE OF THAT, MANY TIMES WHEN YOU ARE IN THE ACADEMIC REALM, YOU MAY BE WRITING FOR YEARS AND IT'S GOING INTO THE JOURNAL AND MAYBE A COUPLE OF PEOPLE READ IT.

BUT TO BE FEMALE IN THE ACADEMY AND OF COLOR TALKING ABOUT RACE AND YOUR WORK IS ON LIKE FRONT PAGES OF THE MAJOR NEWS OUTLETS, THAT DOESN'T-- IT'S BECOMING MORE OF A THING BUT THAT'S FANTASTIC.

I'M REALLY FAN GIRLING.

>> I DON'T TAKE IT FOR GRANTED.

I HEAR YOU.

I REALLY DON'T TAKE IT FOR GRANTED.

THAT IS A GIFT.

THAT'S WHAT I DECIDED TO THINK ABOUT.

I WANT TO QUOTE, READ ONE OF THE THINGS THAT YOU TALK ABOUT IN THIS ARTICLE CALLED LATINA AND BLACK WOMEN LOST JOBS IN RECORD NUMBERS.

POLICIES DESIGNED FOR ALL WOMEN DON'T NECESSARILY HELP.

AND THAT THE PANDEMIC HIT BLACK AND LATINA WOMEN HARD HARDEST.

SOME OF THE LINES FROM THIS ARTICLE SAID BLACK ABDULLAH TEEN AWOMEN DISPROPORTIONATE GENERALLY HIVE BLACK AND LATINA WOMEN EVEN WHEN LOCAL MUNICIPALITIES PASS THEM, RIGHT.

MOREOVER, BLACK AND LATINA WOMEN ARE LIKELY TO BE CONCENTRATED IN INDUSTRIES SUCH AS SERVICE AND HOSPITALITY THAT USE THE SUB MINIMUM WAGE SUCH AS WAITRESSING AND INDUSTRIES THAT ARE BASED ON CASH TIPS WERE OVERLY REPRESENTED THERE.

BLACK WOMEN CARRY MORE STUDENT LOAN DEBT AND ARE MORE LIKELY TO BE EVICTED THAN ANY OTHER GROUP.

THEY WILL BE PARTICULARLY HELPED BY THE EXECUTIVE ORDER EXTENDING THE MORATORIUM ONE EVICTIONS FOR CLOSURE AND CONTINUING THE PAUSE ON STUDENT LOAN PAYMENTS.

>> IT'S STUNNING.

I WROTE THAT WITH A COLLEAGUE OF MINE, MARGARET BROWARD AND PART WHAT HAVE WE WANTED TO HIGHLIGHT WAS THAT THERE ARE STRUGGLES THAT ARE UNIQUE TO WOMEN OF COLOR AND I THINK EVEN WELL MEANING FOLKS WHO WANT TO RELIEVE SUFFERING OR DEPRIVATION THAT THEIR FELLOW CITIZEN MAY BE GOING THROUGH, MAY THINK IT'S BETTER TO JUST NOT PAY ATTENTION TO RACE, RIGHT?

WE WILL BE COLOR BLIND AND HELP EVERYBODY, RISING TIDE LIFTS ALL BOATS.

AND WHILE IT'S ABSOLUTELY GOOD TO TRY TO HELP AS MANY PEOPLE AS WE CAN, IT'S IMPORTANT THAT WE ACKNOWLEDGE THAT SOME FOLKS ARE GOING THROUGH A DIFFERENT KIND, A DIFFERENT DEPTH OF STRUGGLE SO THAT WE CAN ADJUST OUR POLICY TO REFLECT THAT SO THAT NO ONE GETS LEFT BEHIND AND THAT WAS THE IDEA THERE, TO SAY THESE WOMEN SOMETIMES GET LEFT BEHIND AND WE DON'T WANT TO DO THAT.

>> IT'S POWERFUL WHAT YOU ARE DOING, PARTICULARLY AT THIS TIME.

WHEN TALKING ABOUT RACE, PART OF OUR NATION SAYING YES, AND MORE FOLKS SAYING YES, WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT IT.

WE NEED TO THINK ABOUT THE POLICIES AND THE DIFFERENT LIVED EXPERIENCES THAT PEOPLE HAD JUST LIKE YOU TALK ABOUT GOING OVER TO CENTRAL JERSEY, RIGHT?

>> YEAH.

>> AND FOR YOU, WHY IS NOW THE TIME?

>> NOW IS THE TIME BECAUSE PEOPLE'S LIVES, THE THINGS THAT ARE GOING ON IN THEIR LIVES, STRUGGLING TO PAY THE RENT, WITH INFLATION, STRUGGLING TO BUY FOOD, JUST STRUGGLING TO EXIST, TO SURVIVE AND TO THRIVE, BECAUSE WE DON'T JUST WANT FOLKS TO BE SURVIVING.

THAT IS REAL.

AND EVEN IF WE ARE UNCOMFORTABLE WITH TALKING ABOUT RACE, EVEN IF IT BECOMES LIGHTNING ROD OR A FLASH POINT, I THINK PART OF MY ABILITY AND MY JOB AS A THINKER, AS A SCHOLAR IS THAT I CAN WADE INTO THOSE WATERS AND SORT OF PUSH US TO ACKNOWLEDGE AND CONFRONT REALITIES THAT ARE REAL IN PEOPLE'S LIVES, TO THINK ABOUT HOW TO ADDRESS AND CHANGE THEM.

DESPITE THE, YOU KNOW, THE BROO WHAT WHAT OR THE RISK THAT MAY EXIST TO DOING SO.

WHO IS GOING TO DO IT?

>> AND WHEN YOU SAY THE RISK, AND I WAS TALKING TO SOME FOLKS EARLIER, WHAT ARE SOME OF THE RISKS?

WHAT ARE WE REALLY TALKING ABOUT WHEN WE SAY RISK?

>> I MEAN ALL SORTS OF RISKS.

WHEN I PUBLISH THINGS LIKE THAT, I GET MAIL, EMAIL, REACHING-- I HEAR FROM PEOPLE ON SOCIAL MEDIA WHO ARE ANGRY, WHO ARE HATEFUL WHO SAY ALL MAPPER OF HORRIBLE THINGS TO ME THERE IS A REAL RISK OF BEING TARGETED AND I WORRY ABOUT THAT SOMETIMES WHEN I'M THINKING ABOUT HOW PUBLIC DO I REALLY WANT TO BE.

AND THEN THERE IS ALSO THE RISK OF BEING MISUNDERSTOOD, RIGHT, OF YOUR INTENTIONS BEING TWISTED.

I'VE HAVE PEOPLE SAY YOU THINK WE SHOULD ONLY GIVE POLICY BENEFITS TO BLACK PEOPLE?

AND I'M LIKE THAT'S WILD: I'M TALKING ABOUT NOT LEAVING FOLKS BEHIND SO A RISK OF THAT AND A RISK OF JUST BEING TARGETED VERBALLY, EVEN PHYSICALLY.

I HAVE HAD PEOPLE COME UP, COME TO MY CLASSROOM WHERE I TEACH AND SHOW UP AND WAIT AT THE BACK OF CLASS UNTIL MY STUDENTS FILED OUT AND COME UP TO ME AND START SAYING WHITE SUPREMACIST STUFF AT CORNELL UNIVERSITY.

NONE OF US ARE INSULATED FROM THE REALITIES OF OUR WORLD.

>> ONE OF THE BIGGEST MOMENTS I THINK IN 2020 AND I SAY THIS IS THAT GEORGE FLOYD, THAT DIDN'T SHOCK ME.

>> NOT AT ALL BECAUSE IT HAPPENS EVERY DAY IT IS A PRIVILEGE TO BE SHOCKED.

TO BE LIKE WE WOULDN'T HAVE EXPECTED THAT.

BUT THE MOMENT THAT REMINDED ME OF MY BACKGROUND THAT I'M TRAINED TO TALK ABOUT RACE, THAT I HAVE BEEN DOING THIS AND REALLY NEED TO CONSIDER SOME MATTERS IS WHEN MENDEZ WAS ARRESTEDMENT THE REPORTER FROM CNN.

>> I FORGET THE NAME, TOO BUT I KNOW WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT.

>> HE WAS AT WORK WHEN THE CNN-- WEARING A CNN BADGE AND ARRESTED IN 9 MIDST OF DOING HIS JOB.

I THINK ABOUT FOR YOU THE SISTER AT UNC, WHO PUT OUT THE 1619 PROJECT THAT TALKS ABOUT THE HISTORY EVER TRANSATLANTIC SLAVE TRADE AND IS ON FACULTY AT UNIVERSITY OF NORTH CAROLINA CHAPEL HILL AND THEY DENIED HER TENURE.

>> AND MUCH OF THIS KIND OF WORK-- I WAS DOING THIS WORK BEFORE I GOT TENURE AND I WOULD-- I JOKE WITH MY STUDENTS NOW I CAN SAY ANYTHING I WANT.

THEY CAN'T FIRE ME.

THAT'S NOT 100% TRUE BUT IT'S CLOSE TO TRUE.

BUT FOR THOSE OF US WHO WANT TO MOVE IN AN AUTHENTIC WAY IN THE WORLD, THE PROTECTION OF TENURE IS GREAT BUT EVEN BEFORE YOU HAVE THOSE KINDS OF PROTECTIONS, YOU WANT TO DO WORK THAT IS MEANINGFUL AND COMPELLING AND TRUE TO YOURSELF, BUT A LOT OF PEOPLE NEVER GET THE PROTECTION OF TENURE SO THAT'S ANOTHER PART OF THE JOB THAT I'M NOW GRATEFUL FOR.

CAN I SPEAK OUT.

I CAN SPEAK UP.

I CAN PURSUE THE QUESTIONS THAT ARE THE IMPORTANT QUESTIONS, EVEN IF PEOPLE DON'T LIKE THE QUESTIONS.

>> YOU CAN DO THAT WORK WHILE MANY OF THE SCHOLARS OR DEPENDING WHERE YOU LAND AND THE TYPE OF INSTITUTION, I'M IN SUPPORT.

THANK YOU FOR DOING THE WORK THAT YOU ARE DOING.

I AM MOTIVATED AND INSPIRED BY YOU I WANT TO THANKS JAMILA FOR JOINING US THIS EVENING ON "BEHIND THE WOMAN."

IT HAS BEEN A PLEASURE TO LESCH FROM YOU.

IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO VIEW THIS SHOI AGAIN, SHARE IT WITH A FRIEND, VISIT US ONLINE AT WCNY.ORG/"BEHIND THE WOMAN," MY NAME IS Dr. JUHANNA ROGERS AND ON BEHALF OF "BEHIND THE WOMAN" TEAM, I WANT TO THANK YOU AND ENCOURAGE YOU TO ENJOY YOUR WEEK.

NEXT WEEK ON "BEHIND THE WOMAN..." >> I'M EXCITED TO INTRODUCE... >> WHAT WE ARE IN AT THE MOMENT IS A SPECIAL DINNER FOR MOTHERS AND DAUGHTERS WHO ARE PARTICIPATING IN OUR PASSPORT DIVISION PROGRAM.

>> WE FOCUS PERSONAL DEVELOPMENT OF YOUNG PEOPLE, PROFESSIONAL DEVELOPMENT OF YOUNG PEOPLE AND STEAM IF WE POUR INTO THEM AND DO OUR JOBS RIGHT, THEY'RE GOING TO TRANSFORM OUR COMMUNITIES.

WE TEACH, WE LOVE THEM, WE FEED THEM