WELCOME TO "KENTUCKY TONIGHT."

I'M RENEE SHAW.

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING US.

OUR TOPIC : IT'S TIMELY, JOBS AND THE ECONOMY.

JUST LAST WEEK THE CDC ANNOUNC THE FULLY VACCINATED COULD STOP WEARING MASKS, INDOORS AND OUTDOORS, IN MOST CIRCUMSTANCES GOVERNOR ANDY BESHEAR IS FOLLOWING THE CDC GUIDANCE ON MASKS AND IS LIFTING COVID-RELATED CAPACITY RESTRICTIONS FOR BUSINESSES JUN SO AS LIFE RETURNS TO NORMAL, WHAT DOES NORMAL LOOK LIKE FOR THE WORKPLACE?

WITH MORE AND MORE HELP-WANTED NINES STOREFRONT WINDOWS AND THE NATION ARE WE FACING A HIRING SLOWDOWN AND WORKER SHORTAGE?

FOR ANSWERS TO THESE AND MANY MORE QUESTIONS, WE'RE JOINED IN OUR LEXINGTON STUDIO BY: BILL LONDRIGAN, PRESIDENT OF THE KENTUCKY STATE AFL-CIO.

BETH DAVISSON, VICE PRESIDENT OF WORKFORCE DEVELOPMENT FOR THE KENTUCKY CHAMBER OF COMMERCE.

JASON BAILEY, EXECUTIVE DIRECTO FOR THE KENTUCKY CENTER FOR ECONOMIC POLICY.

AND SHANNON PRATT STIGLITZ, SENIOR VICE PRESIDENT OF GOVERNMENT AFFAIRS FOR THE KENTUCKY RETAIL FEDERAT WE WANT YOU TO JOIN THE CONVERS SEND US A QUESTION OR COMMENT O TWITTER @KYTONIGHTKET.

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WELCOME TO ALL OF OUR GUESTS.

BOY, THIS IS ONE OF THOSE TIMELY CONVERSATIONS, AS WE ALL HAVE ON THIS SHOW.

WE NEVER HAVE AN ILL-TIMED ONE, BUT IN PARTICULAR WITH ALL THE NEWS ABOUT THE REOPENING OF THE ECONOMIY AND DEALING WITH MASKS AND NO MASKS.

THE PHRASE WAS THIS TIME LAST YEAR NO SHOES, NO SHIRT, NO SERVICE.

NO MASK, NO SERVICE.

RIGHT?

NOW THAT'S OPTIONAL ON THE MASK PART.

WANT YOU TO GO TO YOU FIRST, SHANNON, AND ASK YOU ABOUT FOR RETAILERS IN PARTICULAR, IS THIS CDC GUIDANCE CAUSING MORE CONFUSION OR IS IT PROVIDING SOME LEVEL INTENT ABOUT HOW TO MOVE FORWARD?

>> Shannon: EYE IT'S VERY IMPORTANT THAT THE BUSINESSES ARE TO DO WHAT THEY FEEL MOST COMFORTABLE WITH AND WE HAVE SEEN MAJOR RETAILERS COME OUT AND SAY THAT THEY ARE GOING TO ALLOW CUSTOMERS TO GO INTO STORES WITHOUT MASKS.

WE HAVE SEEN SMALL RETAILERS DO THE SAME.

IT WAS SORT OF I THINK A SURPRISE AND A SHOCK TO NOT BE PREPARED FOR AS A RETAILER, ESPECIALLY GIVEN THE FACT THAT RETAILS HAVE INVESTED SO MUCH IN COVID-19 MITIGATION EFFORTS, AND, YOU KNOW, PUTTING STORE EMPLOYEES AT THE FRONT OF THE STORE TO MAKE SURE THE CUSTOMERS ARE WEARING MASKS, AND THEY'VE ALSO HAD TO CONSUME THOSE FINES WHEN THEY AREN'T.

SO PROBABLY BETTER PREPARATION WOULD HAVE BEEN MUCH APPRECIATED BY RETAILERS.

>> Renee: A LITTLE MORE HEADS YOU HAVE?

>> Shannon: YES.

AND NOW WE'RE GOING TO GO ON THE HONOR SYSTEM, AND, YOU KNOW, THAT'S THE BEST WAY WE CAN DO IT.

>> Renee: SO WE WANT TO GET INTO HIPPA A LITTLE BIT, AND WHAT LEGALLY BUSINESSES ARE REQUIRED TO DO, SO CAN THEY REQUIRE MASKS, SHOULD THEY REQUIRE MASKS, AND IF A PATRON DOESN'T COMPLY WITH THE RULES, DO THEY HAVE ANY RECOURSE?

>> Shannon: I AM NOT AN ATTORNEY, SO ASKING LEGAL ADVICE IS A LITTLE BIT TOUGH, BUT I THINK THAT A BUSINESS HAS THE ABILITY TO ASK THAT OF THEIR PATRONS, THAT THEY CAN ASK, "ARE YOU VACCINATED?"

THEY CAN ASSUME IF YOU'RE NOT WEARING A MASK THAT YOU ARE VACCINATED.

AND SO WHILE THAT AREA SEEMS TO BE FAIRLY CLEAR, I DO THINK THAT BUSINESSES ARE UNCOMFORTABLE ASKING THEIR CUSTOMERS SUCH AN INVASIVE PERSONAL QUESTION, AND I THINK MANY EMPLOYERS FEEL THE SAME WAY.

>> Renee: SO BILL LONDRIGAN, WHAT DO YOU KNOW ABOUT THIS?

THIS IS A TIGHT ROPE HERE FOR BUSINESSES, I WOULD ASSUME.

THEY WANT TO MAKE SURE PATRONS AND THEIR EMPLOYEES ARE SAFE, JUST LIKE THEY DUNNED COVID TIMES.

WHAT'S THE NEW RULES HERE FOR THAT?

>> Bill: THERE'S TWO DIFFERENT ASPECTS.

ONE AS YOU MENTIONED IS THE PATRONS AND THE ABILITY THE OWNER OR THE BUSINESS OWNER TO REQUEST OR REQUIRE THEM TO HAVE MASKS OR NOT.

I WENT INTO A RESTAURANT JUST RECENTLY FOR THE FIRST TIME FOR A DINNER, AND THE SIGN OUTSIDE SAID, IF YOU'RE VACCINATED, YOU DO NOT HAVE TO WEAR A MASK, WHICH REALLY GIVES IT BACK TO THE HONOR SYSTEM.

>> Renee: THE HONOR SYSTEM.

>> Bill: THIS COULD BE FOLKS GOING IN THAT ARE NOT VACCINATED PERHAPS, SO THAT'S A LITTLE BIT OF A TIGHT ROPE, AND I THINK THE OWNER OF BUSINESS, I THINK THEY HAVE A LOT OF LEEWAY IN WHAT THEY CAN ASK PATRONS.

THEN YOU HAVE ON THE OTHER SIDE WHEN THEY CAN THEIR EMPLOYEES, AND THEY HAVE A WHOLE LOT OF LEEWAY WHAT THEY CAN ASK THEIR EMPLOYEES TO DO, AND WE KNOW THERE WILL PROBABLY BE LITIGATION IF THEY REQUIRE PEOPLE TO BE VACCINATED OR TO HAVE A JOB, SO IT'S DEFINITELY GOING TO BE A TOUGH ISSUE FOR FOLKS TO DEAL WITH, BOTH AS THEY DEAL WITH THEIR PATRONS AND AS THEY DEAL WITH THEIR EMPLOYEES.

>> Renee: AND WE LEARNED OVER THE WEEKEND THAT ADULT AIRLINES HAS SAID FOR FUTURE HIRES THEY HAVE TO BE VACCINATED NOT EXISTING EMPLOYEES.

>> Bill: THAT IS CERTAINLY ANOTHER ASPECT OF THIS.

WHO IS GOING TO BE REQUIRED TO BE VACCINATED.

HOW ARE THEY GOING TO ENFORCE VACCINATION.

AND WHETHER OR NOT THEY CAN ACTUALLY PENALIZE PEOPLE FOR NOT BEING VACCINATED.

I THINK THAT IS DEFINITELY GOING TO BE SOME OF THE QUESTIONS THAT WE'RE GOING TO ASK AND LOOK FORWARD AND MAYBE HAVE SOME LITIGATION OVER SOME OF THESE ISSUES.

>> Renee: JASON BAILEY ALREADY PREDICTING THIS IS GOING TO END UP IN COURT, BUT OF A PRIVATE BUSINESS, SHOULDN'T THEY ABLE TO SET THE RULES OVER WHO CAN WALK IN THEIR BUSINESS IF THEY'RE NOT VACCINATED?

ONCE AGAIN, THE HONOR SYSTEM, SHOULD THEY HAVE TO SHOW PROOF IF THEIR VACCINATED?

>> Jason: I THINK THERE IS A LOT OF LEEWAY PUT FOLKS ARE RISK AVERSE ABOUT ISSUES LIKE THIS.

THERE ARE PRIVACY CONDITIONS THAT PEOPLE HAVE, FOR EXAMPLE, UNDER HIPPA REQUIRING THAT THEY SHOW A VACCINATION CARD OR HAVE LEGITIMATE REASONS FOR NOT GETTING A VACCINATION COULD POTENTIALLY CREATE LIABILITIES OR RISKS FOR EMPLOYER THAT I THINK SOME ARE PROBABLY GOING TO BE HESITANT TO DO OR HAT LEAST SEE HOW THAT PLAYS OUT OVER TIME.

>> Renee: SO HIPPA STANDS FOR THE HEALTH INSURANCE PORTABILITY AND ACCOUNTABILITY ACT.

THIS WAS IN PLACE IN 1996, REQUIRED THAT SOME PATIENTS' HEALTH INFORMATION BE PROTECTED, PUT DOES HIPPA PROTECT PERSONAL INFORMATION IN EVERY SITUATION, BETH DAVIESSON?

THERE HAVE BEEN EXPERTS WEIGHING IN TODAY ON WHETHER OR NOT HIPPA REALLY APPLIES TO ALL BUSINESSES.

DO ALL BUSINESSES OPERATED UNDER HIPPA RULES?

>> Beth: YES, WE'RE CLEARLY STILL IN THE WILD WILD WEST.

WE WERE THOUGHT WE WERE IN THE MIDDLE OF THE PANDEMIC, AND NOW COMING OUT OF IT LOOK AT THE WORKFORCE AND ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT IMPLICATIONS ARE HUGE AND WE'RE TRYING TO FIGURE ON IT.

SO WHEN YOU LOOK AT HIPPA, I THINK A LOT OF LEGAL GUIDANCE WOULD TELL THAT YOU IF YOU'RE NOT A HEALTH CARE PROVIDER, A DOCTOR OR CLINICIAN, THAT YOU HAVE SOME MORE A BRITTLE TO OPERATE OUTSIDE OF HIPPA BECAUSE YOU'RE NOT WITHIN THAT SPHERE OF HEALTH CARE.

>> Renee: YES.

SO THEN THAT WAY BUSINESSES COULD DECIDE TO ASK FOR VACCINATION CARDS AND THEY COULD MANDATE FACE COVERINGS EVEN IF YOU ARE VACCINATED, RIGHT?

I MEAN, IF IT'S ALL ABOUT NOT HAVING TO SHOW THE CARD, YOU'RE JUST GOING TO HAVE TO ASSUME THE DEFAULT IS THAT EVERYBODY COULD BE A POTENTIAL COVID POSITIVE PERSON.

RIGHT, BILL LONDRIGAN?

>> Bill: YEP.

ONE OF THE THINGS WE NEED TO CONSIDER, THOUGH, AS WE GO FORWARD AND MORE AND MORE PEOPLE GET VACCINATED, YOU KNOW, THIS ISSUE MAY EVENTUALLY WORK ITSELF OUT AND LESS AND LESS FOCUS BE PUT ON HAVING TO PROVE THAT YOU WERE VACCINATED.

HOPEFULLY MORE AND MORE PEOPLE GET VACCINATED.

THE HIGHER LEVEL WE HAVE, THE LESS RISK WE HAVE BOTH IN THE WORKPLACE AND THE RETAIL SITUATIONS.

>> Renee: SURE.

SO YOU REPRESENT WORKERS.

WHAT DO YOU HEAR, PARTICULARLY FROM FRONTLINE WORKERS WHO ARE DOING THESE HIGH INTERACTIVE JOBS WHERE THEY ARE REALLY INTERACTING WITH THE PUBLIC?

THEY DON'T KNOW WHO HAS BEEN VACCINATED OR NOT AND IF THEY'RE NOT WEARING A MASK THEY CAN ASSUME BUT THEY DON'T KNOW.

WHAT ARE WORKERS' PROTECTIONS?

WHERE DOES THAT STAND IN ALL OF THIS?

>> Bill: WORKERS HAVE ALWAYS BEEN CONCERNED DURING THIS ENTIRE PANDEMIC AS TO WHETHER OR NOT THEY'RE BEING PUT AT RISK, AND A LOT OF THEM HAVE BEEN PUT AT RISK UNNECESSARILY IN WORK PLACES ARE WHERE EMPLOYERS WEREN'T FOLLOWING THE CDC GUIDELINES OR WEREN'T REQUIRING DISTANCING OR WEREN'T ABLE TO REQUIRE DISTANCING,WHERE THEY WEREN'T REQUIRING MASKS.

STILL AT ANNOINT WORKERS, THOSE THAT DEAL WITH THE PUBLIC, WHETHER THEY BE IN A RESTAURANT OR OTHERWISE, THEY ARE STILL CONCERNED ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT THEY'RE BEING POKED TO THE VIRUS AND WHETHER OR NOT THEY'RE GOING TO BE POTENTIAL TO GET THE VIRUS.

THERE STILL IS A LOT OF CONCERN OUT THERE, AND WE STILLER WORKING WITH EMPLOYERS TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY ARE PROVIDING A SAFE WORK ENVIRONMENT.

AND AS THINGS HAVE PROGRESSED, AS TIME HAS GONE ON, EMPLOYEES HAVE RESPONDED MUCH -- NAH MUCH BETTER FASHION THAN WE DID INITIALLY WHEN THE PANDEMIC HIT AND THERE WAS SO MUCH UNCERTAINTY AS TO WHAT IS GOING TO TRANSPIRE AS FAR AS EXPOSURES GO WITH THE WORKPLACE.

NOW WHEN PERSONAL PROTECTIVE EQUIPMENT IS MUCH MORE WIDELY USED, WHEN THERE ARE CERTAIN PROTOCOLS ON TEMPERATURE ECONOMICS AND EVERYTHING ELSE, THE SITUATION HAS DEFINITELY IMPROVED BUT WORKERS STILL FEELING AT RISK, AND THAT'S THAT ARE HOTS FRONTLINES ESPECIALLY.

>> Renee: I WANT TO GO TO YOU SHANNON AND ASK YOU DO YOU THINK BUSINESSES WILL CONTINUE THEIR MITIGATION MEASURES?

WILL THEY CONTINUE ALL THE SANITATION AND ALL THE SOCIAL DISTANCE THAT HAVEN'T AREN'T JUST FACE COVERINGS WHICH WE SEEM TO BE SO POLARIZED OVER?

>> Shannon: YES.

ONE OF THE THINGS I AM WORKING WITH THE RETAILERS IS ALL THAT THEY HAVE DONE, NOT JUST TO PROTECT WORKERS, NOT JUST TO PROTECT THEIR COMMUNITIES, BUT THE INVESTMENTS THEY HAVE MADE IN PARTICULARLY HERE IN THE COMMONWEALTH TO PUT UP TESTING SITES, TO PUT UP VACCINATION SITES.

THOSE INVESTMENTS WERE PROOF TO ME THAT THEIR BELIEF IN THE COMMONWEALTH AND THAT WE COULD OVERCOME THIS.

AND SO BEYOND THAT I THINK -- DO I THINK, YES, I THINK THE PLEXIGLAS PIECES WILL BE HERE TO STAY.

I THINK THAT GIVES EMPLOYEES A LEVEL OF COMFORT.

>> Renee: EVEN AGAINST OTHER COMMUNICABLE DISEASES, FLU, ET CETERA.

>> Shannon: YES.

I THINK THAT WE WILL SEE SOME MITIGATION EFFORTS, BUT THE ENFORCEMENT OF MASKS, PARTICULARLY IN KENTUCKY, WAS SOLELY PLACED ON THE BUSINESS.

AND IT PUT OUR EMPLOYEES AT RISK.

AND THAT WAS OUR GREATEST COMPLAINT WHEN WE TALKED TO THE LEADERS OF THE COMMONWEALTH ABOUT THE WAY THE MASK MANDATE WAS STRUCTURED.

>> Renee: AND WHEN YOU SAY IT PUT EMPLOYEES AT RISK, BECAUSE OF THE CONFRONTATION THAT THEY WOULD HAVE WITH PATRONS?

>> Shannon: CORRECT, CORRECT.

AND, FOR EXAMPLE, THE FIRST WEEKEND IT WAS IMPLEMENTED, A WALMART EMPLOYEE IN KENTUCKY WAS STRANGLED.

I MEAN, AND THE CUSTOMER WAS CHARGED WITH A FELONY, BUT AT THE SAME TIME WE HAVE TO UNDERSTAND THAT THE WAY WE IMPLEMENT THESE POLICIES, WE HAVE TO LOOK AT THE DECIDED CLUED SCOPE OF ALL OF THEIR IMPLICATIONS.

WE CAN'T JUST LOOK AT IT IN ONE WAY.

I THINK RETAILERS WILL CONTINUE TO DO IT, YES.

I THINK THEY WILL DO IT FOR LIABILITY CONCERNS, FOR THEIR CUSTOMERS' COMFORT, AND FOR THEIR EMPLOYEES' COMFORT.

>> Renee: AND BETH CASESSON WE THINK ABOUT THE LIABILITY PROTECTIONS THAT THE KENTUCKY LEGISLATURE PUT IN PLAS PASS, DOES THAT WORK THE WAY IT WAS DRAFTED UNDER THESE NEW RELATES?

>> Beth: YES, SO THOSE LEGAL LIABILITIES SET THOSE PROTECTIONS FOR EMPLOYEES ARE IN RESPONSE TO COVID, AND ALL THE NEW EXECUTIVE ORDERS THAT WE WOULD SEE COME OUT, SO WHAT'S REALLY IMPORTANT, AS WE'RE EVENING TALKING, WE EVEN GET CONFUSED OURSELVES OF WHAT ARE THE RULES, WHAT DO WE IMPLEMENT NOW AND WHAT COMES NEXT?

AND SO AS YOU THINK ABOUT LEGAL LIABILITY PROTECTION, IT HAS TO BE CLEAR, CRYSTAL CLEAR, ALL OF THE STANDARDS, THE REQUIREMENTS THAT GET PUT INTO PLACE MOVING FORWARD AS THINGS CONTINUE TO CHANGE, AND I-ONE POINT WE WILL BE AT THE SENSE OF NORMALCY THAT WE SAW PRE-PANDEMIC, BUT UNTIL THEN ALL THE MANDATES, ALL REQUIREMENTS HAVE GOT TO BE SEWER CRYSTAL CLEAR FOR EMPLOYERS TO KEEP THEIR EMPLOYEES SAFE AND THEIR CUSTOMERS.

>> Jason: I THINK WE HAVE HAD -- THERE'S BEEN ALSO A DEGREE TO WHICH THERE HAVEN'T BEEN GOOD STANDARDS AND REQUIREMENTS TO PROTECT WORKERS.

WE WERE NEVER HAD AN OSHA, OCCUPATIONAL HEALTH AND SAFETY STANDARD PASS AT ALL IN 2020 THROUGHOUT ALL OF THIS CRISIS.

THE LEGISLATION PASSED TO PROHIBIT THE ABILITY TO TAKE LEGAL ACTION AROUND POTENTIAL IMPACTS OF COVID, FOR EXAMPLE, AND THERE WERE CERTAIN INDUSTRIES THAT DID A REALLY GOOD JOB PRESENTING THEIR EMPLOYEES.

THERE WERE OTHERS THAT AREN'T.

THERE WERE 50,000 MEATPACKING EMPLOYEES IN THE UNITED STATES, INCLUDING IN KENTUCKY, THAT GOT COVID.

AND ABOUT 250 DIED.

SO, YOU KNOW, THAT'S AMONG THE BURDENS I THINK THAT WORKERS HAVE HAD TO TAKE ON.

THE RISKS THAT THEY HAVE HAD TO TAKE ON DURING THIS CRISIS, AND YOU'RE CONTINUING TO SEE THAT EVEN NOW.

HOPEFULLY WE'LL GET THROUGH THIS AND THINGS WILL GET BETTER.

BUT AT THIS POINT ABOUT 36% OF THE KENTUCKY POPULATION IS FULLY VACCINATED.

SO WE HAVE A WAYS TO GO.

>> Tom: GET TO HERD IMMUNITY.

>> Jason: BEFORE WE DEFEAT THIS VIRUS.

>> Renee: BILL, PARTICULAR WHEN IT COMES TO THOSE INDUSTRIES LIKE THE MEATPACKING INDUSTRY THAT HAD SUCH HIGH ACCIDENTS OF COVID SPREAD EARLY ON IN THE DISEASE.

>> Bill: I WANTED TO ADDRESS A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THAT LIABILITY PROTECTION FOR EMPLOYEES THAT PASTED THE LEGISLATURE.

THAT IS SOMETHING THAT WILL PRETTY MUCH PROHIBIT INDIVIDUAL WORKERS FROM FILING A CIVIL SUIT AGAINST AN EMPLOYER FOR BEING EXPOSED TO COVID.

BUT THERE ARE PROVISIONS IN THE BILL THAT SAY THAT THE EMPLOYER, IF HE OR SHE ACTED NEGLIGENTLY, THEN THERE STILL IS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR THEM TO FILE A SUIT AGAINST THE EMPLOYER.

AND THERE ARE OTHER AVENUES TO TAKE FOR WORKERS THAT HAVE BEEN EXPOSED TO COVID ON THE JOB, WHICH IS THEY CAN FILE WORKERS' COMPENSATION CLAIMS AS WELL, AND THAT AVENUE MAY BE ONE OF THE BEST APPROACHES THAT THEY COULD TAKE UNDER THESE CONDITIONS, ESPECIALLY IN LIGHT OF THE EXECUTIVE ORDER THAT GOVERNOR BESHEAR ISSUED THAT THERE WOULD BE A PRESUMPTION THAT A PERSON GOT COVID AT THE WORKPLACE IF THEY WERE EXPOSED.

SO THERE ARE SOME PROTECTIONS OUT THERE, BUT AS JASON MENTIONED, THE LACK OF A CLEAR OSHA STANDARD FOR INFECTIOUS DISEASE CONTROL AND THIS TYPE OF PANDEMIC IS REALLY A BIG PART OF THE PROBLEM.

AND THERE REALLY WAS A PANDEMIC TYPE REGULATION THAT WAS PROMULGATED IN THE PREVIOUS ENERGIES BEFORE DONALD TRUMP CAME IN, AND THEN WHEN HE CAME IN, THEY NECESSITY DELEGATED THAT WHOLE PROCESS, WHERE THEY -- THEY NEGATED THAT WHOLE PROCESS WHERE THEY WOULD HAVE REQUIRED EMPLOYEES TO HAVE PROTECTIONS IN PLACE FOR PERSONAL PROTECTIVE EQUIPMENT AND OTHER PROVISIONS THAT HAVE ALREADY BEEN MANDATED FOR THE WORKPLACE.

SO WITHOUT THAT BEING IN PLACE, WORKERS WERE OBVIOUSLY AT THE MERCY OF THE VIRUS AT THE WORKPLACE, AND AS JASON MENTIONED, WE HAVE HAD HUNDREDS AND THOUSANDS OF THEM DIE FROM COVID BECAUSE THEY WERE EXPOSED AT THE WORKPLACE.

>> Renee: BETH-DAYSSON, I WANT TO COME TO YOU.

BUSINESSES HAVE RECEIVED BILLIONS AND BILLIONS OF DOLLARS FROM FEDERAL STIMULUS ACTIONS TO HELP THEM WITH THE PPE PURCHASES, ET CETERA, PAYCHECK PROTECTION PROGRAM AND MANY QUESTIONS, SHOULD IT NOT BE THEIR OBLIGATION TO THE DEFAULT BE REQUIRING FACE COVERINGS, AND IF NOT VACCINATION CARDS, AND TO DO ALL OF THOSE THINGS REGARDLESS OF WERE WE WANT TO CLAIM WE'RE OUT OF THIS PANDEMIC OR NOT BECAUSE WE STILL HAVE CASES?

>> Beth: YEAH, I MEAN, I THINK BUSINESSES HAVE REALLY FOUGHT FOR KENTUCKIANS THROUGHOUT THIS ENTIRE PANDEMIC.

YOU HAVE TO GO BACK TO MARCH 2020 WHEN OUR ECONOMY WAS ALIVE AND WELL, AND THEN OUT OF NOWHERE THE LIGHTS TURNED OFF, AND EMPLOYERS TURNED OFF THE LIGHTS ON A THRIVING ECONOMY, SHUT DOWN, FIGURED OUT HOW TO RETOOL THEIR WORKPLACES SO THAT THEY COULD KEEP THEIR WORKERS SAFE.

THEY HAVE IMPLEMENTED STRATEGIES FROM A TO Z, HAVE TURNED AROUND THE WAY THAT THEY MANUFACTURE AND DO BUSINESS ALL TO KEEP WORKERS SAFE, AND WHAT WE WOULD SEE THROUGHOUT COVID FOR THE FOLLOWING YEAR AND WHAT EMPLOYERS HAVE DONE, AND I THINK WE'VE EVEN HEARD THE GOVERNOR SAY IT MANY TIMES, WE WEREN'T SEEING THE COVID SPREAD AT THE WORKPLACE LIKE WE WERE IN OTHER AREAS.

IT WAS REALLY VERY WELL MITIGATED BY BUSINESSES ACROSS KENTUCKY.

AND I THINK EVEN NOW, MOVING FORWARD, BUSINESSES ARE STILL CONTINUING TO FIGHT FOR THEIR WORKERS.

AS YOU'RE LOOKING AT HOW THE ECONOMY IS GETTING TURNED BACK ON AND WORKERS ARE BEING WELCOMED INTO THE WORKPLACE, THEY ARE DOING IT SAFELY AND ANY WAY THAT WORKERS CAN FEEL SAFE COMING BACK TO, AND WE'RE SEEING THEM COME BACK AND WE'RE SEEING CASES GO DOWN, WE'RE SEEING VACCINES GO UP, AND WHAT WE'VE REALLY SEEN IS THAT EMPLOYMENT IS AN CREDIBLE WAY TO GET VACCINATED BECAUSE EMPLOYERS HAVE FOUGHT FOR THEIR EMPLOYEES TO GET THOSE VACCINATIONS.

THEY'RE MARKETING THE OPPORTUNITIES.

THEY'RE STRONGLY ENCOURAGING.

THEY'RE GIVING PAID TIME OFF SO THAT THEIR EMPLOYEES CAN GO GET VACCINATED AND KEEPING THEIR TEAM SAFE.

>> Renee: WHAT ABOUT TESTING OF EMPLOYEES THAT BUSINESSES COULD RIGHT NOW OR SHOULD THEY MAKE THAT AVAILABLE TO JUST MAKE SURE EVERYONE IS SAFE?

DO YOU THEY IS THERE A PLACE FOR ON-SITE COVID TESTING AT BUSINESSES OSH REFERRAL TO BE HEAD OF THE TESTED?

>> Beth: ABSOLUTELY.

YOU SEE THE ENCOURAGEMENT TO GO GET TESTED.

YOU SEE SOME EMPLOYERS REALLY VOTING FOR ON-SITE TESTING.

YOU SEE THOSE DAILY COVID CHECKS THAT BEFORE YOU CAN EVEN WALK INTO YOUR OWN WORKPLACE, YOU HAVE TO FILL OUT "DO YOU HAVE A FEVER?

DO YOU HAVE SYMPTOMS?

HAVE YOU BEEN AROUND ANYONE?"

THAT EMPLOYERS PUT INTO PLACE A YEAR AGO AND ARE STILL HAVING HAVE IN PLACE TODAY.

AND TO SEE ALL THESE AMAZING PARAMETERS WHERE, YOU KNOW, AS EMPLOYEES, EMPLOYERS, WE WOULDN'T EVEN KNOW WHAT PPE MEANT A YEAR AGO BUT NOW WE ARE WITH A ONCE IN 100-YEAR PANDEMIC WHERE WE HAVE BUILT UP THE SUPPLIES WITHIN OUR WORKPLACE, THE DEFENSE MECHANISMS NEEDED TO KEEP OUR WORKERS SAFE, AND KENTUCKY EMPLOYERS HAVE DONE A REALLY GREAT JOB.

>> Renee: JASON.

>> Jason: I THINK THERE ARE SOME EMPLOYERS WHO HAVE DONE A GOOD JOB, THERE ARE SOME WHO HAVE NOT, AND THERE'S CERTAINLY BEEN CASES OF WORKPLACE CONTRACTING OF THE SPEAKERS NOW WE HAVE A SITUATION WHERE PEOPLE NEED TO GO GET SHOTS, THEY NEED TO HAVE TIME OFF WORK TO BE ABLE TO DO THAT IN SOME CASES, WHEN YOU GET THAT SECOND SHOT YOU DON'T FEEL SO GOOD EVEN FOR A DAY OR TWO.

I KNOW I DIDN'T.

AND SO IN KENTUCKY MORE THAN A THIRD OF EMPLOYEES DON'T HAVE PAID SICK DAYS AT THEIR JOBS.

SO THEIR ABILITY TO TAKE OFF WORK AND GET THOSE VACCINES MAY BE LIMITED IN SOME CASES.

SO I THINK THERE'S MORE THAT CAN BE DONE.

I THINK WE SAW A MAJOR LOBBYING IN THIS SESSION FOR BALE THAT PROHIBITS THE STATE FROM DOING ANY OCCUPATIONAL SAFETY REGULATION BEYOND WHAT THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT DOES.

SO IF KENTUCKY SAW KENTUCKY-SPECIFIC HAZARD AND IS RISK THAT IS WORKERS WERE FACING, THEY WERE NOT ALLOWED -- THEY ARE NOW NOT ALLOWED THE ISSUE REGULATIONS AROUND THAT.

THOSE ARE SITUATIONS WHERE WORKERS ARE BEING PUT AT RISK UNNECESSARILY BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE THE LAWS AND REQUIREMENTS IN PLACE TO ENSURE THAT THEIR WORKERS ARE TREATED AS WELL AS POSSIBLE IN ALL SITUATIONS.

>> Renee: BETH, DO YOU WANT TO ANSWER THE OSHA CONCERNS THAT JASON BROUGHT UP?

>> Beth: WHY WELL THE CALL TO GO VEHICLES VACCINATED, JASON IS RIGHT, AFTER THAT SECOND SHOT YOU DO NOT FEEL GOOD, AND WE HAVE SEEN SO MANY OF OUR MEMBERS GIVE VOLUNTARY PAID TIME OFF TO THOSE EMPLOYEES, NOT TO DEDUCT FROM THEIR VACATION TIME, BUT LET THEM GO GET THE VACCINE BUT THEN SOME RECUPERATE YOU CAN TIME IF IT'S NEEDED.

THE OSHA STANDARD WOULDN'T IT SAY I'M THE EXPERT ON THAT, SO I WOULD LIVE AT SOME OF MY OTHER COLLEAGUES AT THE CHAMBER TO REALLY ADVOCATE OR TO THINK AND CONSIDER THAT.

I THINK IT HAS BEEN CONFUSING.

TODAY ALONE SO OSHA CAUGHT UP WITH CDC WHERE UP -- CDC LAST WEEK CAME OUT AND SAID, YOU KNOW, IF YOU'RE VACCINATED, DON'T WEAR A MASK.

IF YOU'RE NOT VACCINATED, YOU NEED TO WEAR A MASK.

BUT THE OSHA GUIDELINES UNTIL THIS MORNING STILL SAID, DON'T DIFFERENTIATE BETWEEN YOUR EMPLOYEES.

IF ONE HAS A MASK ON, THEY ALL NEED TO HAVE A MASK ON, WHICH WE KNOW FROM THE CDC HADN'T YET CAUGHT UP YET.

SO I THINK EVERYONE IS STILL TRYING CATCH UP TO GET THE SAFEST GUIDELINES IN PLACE.

AGAIN, I'LL GO BACK TO THE WILD WILD WEST.

ONE YEAR AGO THIS PANDEMIC HIT US AND I THINK EVERYONE HAS DONE THE -- FOUGHT THE HARDEST FIGHT THAT THEY COULD POSSIBLY FIGHT IN THIS PANDEMIC.

>> Renee: BILL?

>> Bill: I WOULD SAY THAT EMPLOYERS IN MANY CASES HAVE STEPPED UP.

IN SOME INDUSTRIES WAS EASIER, I THINK, TO DO THINGS LIKE SOCIAL DISTANCING AND SUCH.

BUT IN A LOT OF CASES, OF COURSE, WE HAVE HAD THAT, YOU KNOW, THOSE INDUSTRIES, THOSE MEATPACKING PLANTS WHERE WORKERS EVER SHOULDER TO SHOULDER AND PERSONAL PROTECTIVE EQUIPMENT MAY NOT HAVE BEEN SUPPLIED AT THE LEVEL TO WHICH IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN.

YOU KNOW, WE'RE ALL HOPE THANKFUL EMPLOYERS AND WORKERS AND EVERYBODY ARE WORKING TOGETHER TO TRY AND MAKE SURE THAT EVERYBODY'S PROTECTING THEMSELVES AND EACH OTHER.

THIS IS REALLY ABOUT ALL OF US.

IT'S NOT ABOUT JUST ONE WORKER GETTING SICK AND GIVING THE TO SOMEBODY ELSE.

IT'S A WIDESPREAD ISSUE THAT WE ALL NEED TO CONTINUE WORKING VERY HARD TO TRY AND MITIGATION ANY OF THE TRANSMISSION AT WORK, AT RESTAURANTS OR ANY PLACE ELSE.

AND I THINK PEOPLE NEED TO USE COMMON SENSE, AND A LOT OF FOLKS NEED TO CONTINUE WEARING THEIR MASK AND MAKING SURE THAT THEY'RE ENCOURAGING FOLKS TO GET VACCINATED.

IT'S DEFINITELY STILL WITH US.

AND I THINK THAT'S ONE OF THE THINGS WE SHOULD BE FOCUSING ON NOW EVEN THOUGH WE SEE THIS BIG TURN IN TERMS OF THE REQUIREMENTS FOR MASK WEARING, THERE ARE STILL PEOPLE GETTING CORDOVA DAY AND GETTING COVID EVERY DAY.

>> Renee: IF OTHER INDUSTRIES WERE TO FOLLOW TO RETAILERS' EXAMPLE, WE WOULD BE OKAY.

>> Shannon: AS BILL AS POINTED OUT, EVERY WORK ENVIRONMENT IS SITUATIONALLY DIFFERENT.

YES, I THINK THAT RETAILERS HAVE MORE THAN STEPPED UP TO GO ABOVE AND BEYOND.

AND I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT TO REMEMBER THAT THE FIRST CASE IN KENTUCKY WAS AN EMPLOYER -- AN EMPLOYEE OF A RETAILER, NOT -- IT WAS NOT A CONNECTION WITH THAT, BUT THE FACT THAT WE DID NOT KNOW WHAT WE SHOULD TELL THAT BUSINESS TO DO, THE FACT THAT THE STATE DIDN'T KNOW WHAT TO TELL THAT BUSINESS, WE HAD SO MUCH TO LEARN.

AND I THINK THAT WE HAVE DONE THAT WELL.

AND I THINK THAT YOU WILL SEE, AS THIS NEW GUIDANCE COMES INTO PLACE, RETAILERS AND RESTAURANTS WILL CONTINUE TO DO -- TO MAKE -- TO IMPROVE AND GET BETTER AND BETTER, AND THEY KNOW THEY HAVE CHALLENGES AHEAD, BUT IT'S ALL ABOUT THEIR CUSTOMERS AND THEY'RE GOING TO MEET THEIR CUSTOMERS WHERE THEIR CUSTOMERS WANT TO BE.

>> Renee: YOU ARE WATCHING "KENTUCKY TONIGHT" AND WE'RE TALKING ABOUT JOBS AND THE ECONOMY, CDC GUIDELINES AND ALL OF THAT, FACE COVERINGS AND VACCINATIONS AND ALL.

I DO WANT TO MOVE NOW TO TALK ABOUT THE ECONOMIC IMPACT OF ALL OF THIS AND THE FACT THAT WE ARE SEEING MORE HELP WANTED SIGNS DOTTED IN STOREFRONT WINDOWS AND DRIVE-THROUGH RESTAURANTS SAYING, YOU KNOW, $13 AN HOUR OR $15 AN HOUR IF YOU WANT TO BE A COOK OR AT THE FRONTLINE.

SO I WANT TO GO TO YOU, BETH DAVIESS DAVISSON BECAUSE TODAY THE KENTUCKY CHAMBER RELEASED THIS QUARTERLY REPORT ABOUT THE PANDEMIC, IT SAYS EMPLOYERS HAVE EXPANDED, JOINING IN THE UNIVERSITY OF KENTUCKY GATTON COLLEGE, EMPLOYERS EXPANDING PAYROLLS BY 19,200 JOBS FROM DECEMBER TO MARCH.

KENTUCKY RECOVERED 67% OF THE JOBS LOST IN THE FIRST MONTHS OF THE PANDEMIC, BUT KENTUCKY IS STILL LAGGING BEHIND WHEN IT COMES TO JOB PARTICIPATION, WORKFORCE PARTICIPATION.

TELL US WHY.

>> Beth: SO THE KENTUCKY CHAMBER'S ECONOMICKY REPORT WAS RELEASED TODAY, AND WE ARE SEEING TWO/THITHER OF THOSE JOBS HAVE GONE BACK ONLINE BUT WHEN WE LOOK AT WORKFORCE PARTICIPATION WE ARE LACKING, AND WE HAVE GONE LAGGING AND WE'RE NOT SEEING ANY IMPROVEMENTS IN SIGHT.

LABOR FORCE PARTICIPATION MEANS ABLE-BODIED CITIZENS THAT COULD BE WORKING BUT THEY ARE NOT.

THEY'RE NOT PARTICIPATING IN THE WORKFORCE AND THEY'RE NOT LOOKING FOR A JOB.

IN KENTUCKY WE RANKED 48th IN THE NATION.

IT'S IMPORTANT TO NOTE KENTUCKY HAS NEVER DONE INVESTIGATION.

EXEMPTIONLY WELL.

>> Renee: NUMBER 41 JUST A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO.

>> Beth: YES, PRE-PANDEMIC WE WERE 40th, 41, AND THEN IN JULY OF LAST YEAR WE SLID TO 50th IN THE HEIGHT OF PANDEMIC.

SINCE THE THEN HERE WE ARE CREEPING ONTO A YEAR LATER, WE'RE STILL AT 48.

AND AT THE HEIGHT THAT OF PANDEMIC 250,000 KENTUCKIANS LEF THE WORKFORCE AND STOPPED ALSO YOU LOOKING FOR WORK.

MEANWHILE OUR BUSINESSES WERE STILL REALLY IN NEED.

AND IF YOU TALK TO ANY KENTUCKY CHAMBER MEMBERS TODAY, THEY WILL TELL THAT YOU FINDING WORKFORCE RIGHT NOW AND RECRUITING TALENT IS AS HARD AS IT'S EVER BEEN.

NOT HARDER.

AND THE -- IF NOT HARDER.

THE REASON THAT'S SO CRITICAL IN KENTUCKY IS WE REALLY NEED TO LOOK AT WHO WE KEEP LEAVING BEHIND WHEN IT COMES TO LABOR FORCE PARTICIPATION, THOSE THAT BE AREN'T PARTICIPATING.

McEXPENSE COMPANY CAME OUT WITH A STUDY AND THEY NAMED KENTUCKY THE TOP STATE IN THE NATION FOR MOST UI CLAIMS AND MOST VULNERABLE JOBS, VULNERABLE JOBS DUE TO TECHNICAL ADVANCEMENTS IN THE WORKPLACE, AUTOMATION THEY WON'T BE COMING BACK.

AND WHO THAT IMPACTED THE MOST IN KENTUCKY WERE WOMEN, BLACK AND BROWN, OUR BLACK AND BROWN, AND INDIVIDUALS WHO DIDN'T OBTAIN HIGHER LEVELS OF EDUCATION ATTAINMENT.

SO IF IN OUR STATE IF YOU HELD A BACHELOR'S DEGREE, WERE YOU TWICE AS LIKELY TO HAVE KEPT YOUR JOB IN KENTUCKY.

ANOTHER NOTE THAT KEEPS ME UP AT NIGHT SERB JUST CAME OUT.

>>> -- >> Renee: THE SOUTHERN REGIONAL EDUCATION BOARD.

>> Beth: THAT'S RIGHT.

Y IS IS EDUCATIONAL BOARD SAID IN THE SOUTH IN THE NEXT FIVE YEARS ONE-FIFTH ALL OF OUR JOBS THAT JUST NEED A HIGH SCHOOL DEGREE WILL BE GOING AWAY.

SO AUTOMATION IS UPON US AS WE'RE COMING OUT OF THIS PANDEMIC AND OUR CITIZENS AREN'T PARTICIPATING LIKE THEY NEED TO, AND WHAT HAPPENS WHEN OUR CITIZENS AREN'T IN THE WORKPLACE, THEY'RE NOT EARNING AND LEARNING IN THE WAYS THAT WE NEED NEM.

THEY'RE NOT ON THOSE CLEAR PATHWAYS WHERE THEY CAN DEPRIVE TOWARDS MORE INCOME, WHERE THEY CAN OBTAIN HIGHER LEVELS OF POST SECONDARY EDUCATION ATTAINMENT WHICH IS WHERE THE ECONOMY ASK GOING AND WHEN IS WHERE WE NEED OUR CITIZENS.

SO NOT ONLY EMPLOYERS PLEAD BLEEDING OUT FOR THEM TODAY, WE WILL NEED THEM TOMORROW BUT WE WILL NEED THEM IN WAYS THAT IS GOING TO REQUIRE MORE SKILLS AND HIGHER DEGREE LEVELS AND EDUCATION LEVELS.

>> Renee: SINCE I MENTIONED YOUR REPORT I'VE GOT TO MENTION THE KENTUCKY POLICY, KENTUCKY FOR ECONOMIC POLICY REPORT.

THIS WAS FROM JUST LAST WEEK MAY 7th.

JASON, YOU WROTE THIS OF COURSE.

I DON'T HAVE TO TELL YOU.

YOU'RE THE AUTHOR.

AND THE HEAD LIN LOEW SUNNY THIS ONE WEIRD TRICK MAY HELP KENTUCKY EMPLOYERS FIND WORKERS, AND YOU SAY IT'S REALLY SIMPLE.

WHAT'S NOT HAPPENING THAT BUSINESSES COULD GET THE WORKERS THAT BETH SAYS THEY NEED?

>> Jason: YEAH, WE DON'T HAVE A LABOR SHORTAGE.

WE HAVE A PAY SHORTAGE.

THERE ARE CERTAIN SECTORS THAT ARE HAVING A HARD TIME FINDING PEOPLE LUT BUT THERE ARE SECTORS THAT INSIST ON CONTINUING THE LOW PAY THAT THEY OFFERED BEFORE THE PANDEMIC, AND ACTUALLY HAVE BEEN OFFERING FOR DECADES NOW.

SO IF ANY EMPLOYERS SAY I CAN'T FIND THE WORKERS I NEED, YOU NEED TO ADD THE STATEMENT, AT THE WAGES I WANT TO PAY.

KENTUCKY'S A LOW WAGE STATE.

WE HAVE BEEN IN A SITUATION WHERE -- AND ESPECIALLY THE RESTAURANT INDUSTRY WHICH IS WHERE YOU HEAR MOST OF THESE COMPLAINTS 100 IN SIX RESTAURANT WORKERS LIVE IN POVERTY.

THE RATES OF ACCESS TO HEALTH INSURANCE AND PENSION ON THE JOB ARE VERY LOW.

THERE HAS BEEN A MOVE TO JUST-IN TIME SCHEDULING WHERE AS A WORKER YOU DO NOT KNOW UNTIL YOU -- YOU DO NOT KNOW WHAT YOUR SCHEDULE WILL BE IN ADVANCE.

YOU MAY BE CALLED IN AT THE LAST MINUTE.

YOU MAY BE SENT HOME IF YOU GO IN FOR WORK.

THAT KIND OF LACK OF FLEXIBILITY MAKES IT VERY DIFFICULT FOR WORKERS.

IT MAKES THE WORK FRANKLY NOT APPEALING WHEN THERE ARE OTHER OPTIONS OUT THERE.

SO, YOU KNOW, WHAT WE'RE SEEING IS SORT OF A -- THE STIMULUS CHECKS AND THE OTHER VACCINATION MEASURES AND OTHER THINGS ARE MEANING THAT PEOPLE ARE SPENDING MONEY, THE ECONOMY IS RECOVERING.

THAT'S A GOOD THING.

BUT THE EMPLOYERS, YOU KNOW, SPECIFICALLY IN THE RESTAURANT INDUSTRY, YOU KNOW, WANT TO CONTINUE A SITUATION WHERE THE PAY IS VERY LOW.

AND I THINK THAT THAT'S JUST -- LIKE WHEN THERE'S A SHORTAGE OF ANY -- IN ANY SECTOR, WHEN YOU NEED MORE WHEAT AND THERE'S NOT ENOUGH THERE, THE PRICE GOES UP.

THE PRICES STARTED TO GO UP.

>> Renee: YEAH, BECAUSE WE'RE SEEING SIGNS FOR STARTING PAY $13, $15 AN HOUR.

>> Jason: BUT THE PRICE WENT DOWN LAST YEAR AND WHAT WE'RE SEEING IS WAGES GOING TO THE GROWTH TRENDS OF WHERE THEY WERE BEFORE.

>> Renee: BUT MINIMUM WAGE IS STILL $7.25.

>> Jason: THAT'S RIGHT.

EVE A MINIMUM WAGE THAT'S VERY LOW.

AND THERE ARE STILL ISSUES AROUND PEOPLE THAT PEOPLE HAVE BARRIERS.

THERE ARE PEOPLE THAT HAVE CONDITIONS THAT ARE -- THAT MAKE THEM MORE LIKELY TO CONTRACT COVID THAT ARE MAKING THEM MORE HESITANT TO ENTER THE WORKFORCE.

WE HAVE SEEN A DECIMATION CHILD CARE IN THIS STATE OVER THE LAST TIP YEARS WHERE THE NUMBER OF CHILD CARE CENTERS HAS BEEN CUT IN HALF AND NOW IT'S WORSENED DURING THE PANDEMIC.

SO WE DON'T NECESSARILY PROVIDE THE SUPPORTS THAT ARE OUT THERE.

REGARDLESS, WORKERS, BUSINESSES THAT PROVIDE GOOD WAGES, PROVIDE GOOD WORKING CONDITIONS, THEY DON'T HAVE TROUBLE ATTRACTING WORKERS THEY NEED.

>> Renee: BUT 40% OF THE EMPLOYMENT PAYS LESS THAN $15 AN HOUR.

>> Jason: 40% OF JOBS.

NEARLY 40% OF JOBS IN KENTUCKY PAY LESS THAN $15.

IF YOU LOOK AT STATES THAT HAVE HIGHER WORKFORCE PARTICIPATION THEY HAVE MUCH HIGHER WAGES, MUCH HIGHER MEDIAN WAGES, AND THEY'RE JUST ON A DIFFERENT TRACK IN TERMS OF UNDERSTANDING THAT IF YOU WANT QUALIFIED EMPLOYEES, YOU CAN'T TREAT THEM AS EXPENDABLE.

YOU CAN'T CREATE THIS SORT OF HIGH TURNOVER HUMAN RESOURCES STRATEGY THAT JUST SORT OF CHURNS THROUGH WORKERS.

YEAH, THOSE KIND OF EMPLOYERS ARE GOING TO HAVE A HARD TIME.

>> Renee: BILL LONDRIGAN, WHEN YOU THINK PARTICULARLY ABOUT RESTAURANT WORKERS, AND THERE'S A UNION FOR THEM, OF COURSE, AS WELL, TALK ABOUT THE FACT THAT $2.13 -- IT'S THE MINIMUM WAGE FOR A SERVER BECAUSE PEOPLE RELY ON TIPS AND HOPEFULLY THEY MAKE AT LEAST ABOVE MINIMUM WAGE AN HOUR, BUT DO YOU THINK THAT NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED?

>> Bill: ABSOLUTELY.

JUST LIKE THE MINIMUM WAGE FOR ALL OTHER WORKERS NEEDS TO BE ADDRESS TO THE LEVEL OF AT LEAST $15 AN HOUR WHICH IS ONE OF THE CLARION CALLS RIGHT NOW FOR $15 AN HOUR FOR WORKERS TO AT LEAST HAVE SOME LIVEABLE WAGE.

WHEN YOU LOOK AT $2.13 AN HOUR AND IT'S BEEN THERE SINCE NAIN, IT'S JUST PITIFUL AND EXPECT PEOPLE TO MAKE A LIVING ON THAT IN ADDITION TO THEIR TIPS.

AND NOW UNDER THE CONDITIONS WE'RE IN NOW, PEOPLE THAT ARE SERVERS IN RESTAURANTS AND THE PATRONS NOT NECESSARILY COMING BACK AT THE LEVEL THEY HAD BEEN OR THEY'RE CERTAINLY NOT, SO THE TIP LEVEL HAS DECREASED, AND CONSEQUENTLY THEIR TAKE HOME PAY SO THEY'RE IN A TOUGH SITUATION TO ENTICE THEM TO COME BACK TO WORK.

AS JASON SAID, THE BOTTOM LINE IS HOW DO WORKERS GET INCENTIVIZED TO COME BACK TO WORK?

THEY COME BACK TO WOK FOR WAGES, FOR HEALTH CARE, OR RETIREMENT.

>> Renee: YOU YOU.

>>> >> Renee: NOW THEY'RE BEING INCENTIVIZED ABUSE BECAUSE GOVERNOR SAID YOU HAVE TO GO BACK TO WORK.

THERE ARE SEARCH REQUIREMENTS.

>> Bill: RIGHT.

WE LOOK AT THIS BIG PICTURE SITUATION AS FAR AS WAGES GO, AND WEMORE THE LAST SEVERAL DECADES THE DECLINE IN UNIONIZATION HAS LED TO A LOT OF THE DECLINE IN WAGES, AND THE INCREASE IN INAQUATIC IS AT THE HIGHEST LEVEL IT'S EVERY BEEN IN HISTORIES.

>>> >> Renee: BUT HAS NOT UNDER THE EMPLOYMENT INSURANCE SITUATION WHICH DOESN'T RUN OUT UNTIL THIS FALL EXACERBATED THE PROBLEM OF PEOPLE NOT LOOKING FOR WORK IF THEY CAN MAKE AS MUCH MONEY OR MORE THAN GETTING ASSISTANCE WITHOUT A JOB, WHY WOULD THEY GET A JOB?

>> Bill: I THINK JASON ADDRESSED THE SITUATION WE HAVE.

MAJORITY OF WOMEN THAT ARE TAKING CARE OF THEIR CHILDREN DURING THE PANDEMIC WHEN THEY'RE NOT IN SCHOOL AND THEY HAVE NO FLEXIBILITY FOR THEM TO ACTUALLY GO BACK INTO WORK.

THAT'S WHY WE HAVE THE PANDEMIC UNEMPLOYMENT INSURANCE, IS TO FILL THIS GAP DURING THE TIME PERIOD WITHIN WHICH WORKERS ARE GOING TO HAVE A DIFFICULT TIME GETTING BACK THE WORK OR GOING INTO A WORK ENVIRONMENT THAT IS CONTINUING TO BE SAFE.

SO RIGHT NOW, AS I MENTIONED EARLIER, THIS PANDEMIC HAS NOT SUBSIDED TO THE POINT WHERE PEOPLE FEEL TOTAL SAFE ABOUT GOING BACK INTO WORKPLACES OR INTO RESTAURANTS, SO IT'S HAVING AN IMPACT ON THE RESTAURANT WORKERS, AND IT ALSO HAS AN IMPACT ON PEOPLE'S DESIRE AND NEED TO GO BACK TO WORK AT THIS PARTICULAR TIME.

AND I DO THINK THAT THE BENEFITS ARE ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY, CONTINUING ON FORWARD, UNTIL THINGS ACTUALLY DO STRAIGHTEN OUT AND WORKERS CAN GET BACK TO WORK AT A WAGE RATE THAT IS ATTRACTIVE TO THEM AND A LIVEABLE WAGE THAT THEY CAN RAISE THEIR FAMILY ON.

>> Renee: CAN YOU SPEAK TO THE RAILS?

>> Shannon: I THINK.

I THINK FIRST OF ALL IT'S IMPORTANT TO NOTE IF YOU WANT AN EXAMPLE OF A STRAW TOUR PAYING 15 ANSWERED HOUR.

CHIPOTLE HAS ANNOUNCES THEY'RE PAYING $15 AN HOUR AND THEY PLAN TO I.

TO HIRE 20,000 EMPLOYEES ACROSS THIS COUNTRY.

A CONVENIENCE STORE CHANGE HAS ANNOUNCED THAT THEY WILL PAY SUMMER, THEY'RE GOING TO PAY WAY ABOVE THE MINIMUM WAGE, I THINK $13.50 FOR A CLERK, $16.50 IF YOU'RE DOING MORE MANAGEMENT PIECE, BUT THEY'RE ALSO GOING TO PAY A SUMMER BONUS.

EMPLOYERS ARE LOOKING AT WAYS TO ENTICE THE WORKER BACK.

BUT A RECENT NATIONAL RETAIL FEDERATION STUDY FOUND THAT ONE IN TEN EMPLOYEES HAVE SAID THAT THERE IS NO AMOUNT OF PROTECTIONS AN EMPLOYER COULD PROVIDE THEM TO ENTICE THEM TO COME BACK THE WORK IN A WORKPLACE.

>> Renee: ONE IN TEN.

>> Shannon: ONE IN TEN.

ONE IN TEN CONSUMERS WHO ARE EMPLOYED HAVE SAID THAT THEY KNOT BE ENTICED BACK TO WORK IN A PLACE WHERE THEY WEREN'T GUARANTEED.

AND THEN IF YOU BREAK IT DOWN FROM THERE, MORE WOULD COME BACK IF THEY KNEW THAT THEY WERE -- THEIR COLLEAGUES WERE VACCINATED, THAT THE PUBLIC THEY WERE FACING WAS VACCINATED.

BUT I THINK, TOO, THERE'S A PRACTICALITY TO THIS PROBLEM IN THE SENSE THAT IF YOU'RE A SINGLE MOTHER WHO IS AT HOME RIGHT NOW, IT'S SUMMERTIME COMING, AND LET'S SAY YOU'RE A SINGLE MOTHER WHO IS A BARTENDER.

WELL, WE CAN'T EVEN HAVE BAR SEATING OPEN IN KENTUCKY YET.

SO IT IS NOT PRACTICAL AT THIS POINT IN TIME.

I THINK I CAN UNDERSTAND AND APPRECIATE THAT.

AND I THINK THAT EMPLOYERS ARE RECOGNIZING THEY HAVE TO GET BACK TO THAT NORMALCY.

SO I MEAN, WE'RE IN THIS SORT OF SITUATION OF, WELL, WE CAN'T GET THE WORKERS TO GET THE FULL WAGES BACK THAT THEY WANTED BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE THE CAPACITY LIMITS OR ALL THESE DIFFERENT THINGS, BUT WE NEED TO WORKERS IN ORDER TO GET BACK TO THE 75% AND THEN THE 100%.

BUT BEYOND THAT, I THINK THAT WE ARE SEEING RETAILERS EVEN DURING THE PANDEMIC AND THROUGH NOW CONTINUING TO LOOK AT WAYS TO IMPROVE EMPLOYEES, WHETHER IT'S THROUGH WAGES, I THINK THAT WE'VE HEARD A LOT ABOUT GOVERNMENTS MANDATING WAGES, AND IT LOOKS TO ME LIKE THE MARKET IS DRIVING THAT WAGE UP ALL ON ITS OWN.

>> Renee: WHAT ABOUT THOSE OTHER BENEFITS, PARTICULARLY FOR THE WOMAN WHO IS A SINGLE MOM AND SHE'S A BARTENDER, WHAT ABOUT CHILD CARE?

IT DOESN'T ALWAYS HAVE TO BE ON-SITE.

IT COULD BE PERHAPS A COLLABORATIVE EFFORT WITH OTHER BUSINESSES TO COME TOGETHER AND PROVIDE CHILD CARE.

>> Shannon: CHILD CARE IS A HUGE PROBLEM.

IT'S ALSO -- AND THAT'S A HUGE PIECE OF THE AMERICAN RESCUE PLAN ACT, IS HOW DO WE RECONSTRUCT CHILD CARE, BECAUSE IT AS AN INDUSTRY ITSELF WAS DAMAGED.

AND SO WE ALL HAVE A RESPONSIBILITY TO COME TOGETHER AND TAKE ALL THESE PIECES AND PUT IT TOGETHER BECAUSE, YES, WITHOUT CHILD CARE, WE HAVE A GREAT CONCERN.

IF YOU'RE IN JEFFERSON COUNTY RIGHT NOW, YOU HAVE TWO DAYS OF YOUR CHILD BEING IN A CLASSROOM, AND SO YOU HAVE NTI EVERY DAY, BUT THAT IS A DIFFICULT THING TO MANAGE.

AND SO WE HAVE GOT TO ADDRESS THOSE PIECES.

WE'VE GOT CHILD CARE IS A HUGE PROBLEM FROM THE SENSE OF WE'VE GOT AN INDUSTRY TO BUILD BACK BECAUSE THEY WERE CLOSED DOWN TOO.

>> Renee: THAT'S RIGHT.

YOU CAN WATCH AN INTERVIEW DID I THIS PAST WEEKEND WITH SARAH TAYLOR VANOVER WHO WORKS FOR THE STATE WHO HAS WRITTEN THIS BOOK CALLED "AMERICAS CHILD CARE CRISIS" AND SHE TALKS ABOUT HOW IT'S ON THE BRINK OF COLLAPSE.

BETH DAVISSON, THIS IS RESEARCH YOU HAVE DONE FOR THE KENTUCKY CHAMBER.

THERE ARE 2 MILLION WOMEN BECAUSE HAVE BEEN DISPLACED BECAUSE OF THE PANDEMIC, MANY CAREGIVERS PARENTS WHO HAD TO MAKE A CHOICE BETWEEN PROVIDING CHILD CARE OR WORKER, AND THE CHOICE AT THE TIME WAS TAKING CARE OF THEIR CHILD.

>> Beth: THAT'S RIGHT.

THE LACK OF CHILD CARE DURING COVID AND NOW IS THE NUMBER ONE ISSUE THAT WOMEN HAVE EXITED THE WORKFORCE.

WE DIALED BACK ON TWO DECADES OF PROGRESS OF WOMEN'S ADVANCEMENT IN THE WORKPLACE DURING THIS COVID SEASON.

AND TIME AND TIME AGAIN IT IS ALL ABOUT CHILD CARE.

MOST OF KENTUCKIANS LIVED IN WHAT WE CALL CHILD CARE DESERTS BEFORE THE PANDEMIC.

WE KNOW THAT DURING THE PANDEMIC MANY CHILD CARE CENTERS HAVE CLOSED AND HAVE BEEN HURT THEMSELVES.

SO THERE HAS TO BE, I THINK, LIKE SHANNON SAID, THERE HAS GOT TO BE A STATE, A FEDERAL, AN EMPLOYER WHERE EVERYONE IS COMING TOGETHER TO SOLVE THIS PROBLEM.

I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT TO NOTE, TOO, THAT WHEN YOU LOOK AT WHO IS PAYING WHAT WAGES, IT'S NOT JUST RETAIL AND RESTAURANT.

KENTUCKY'S KEY SECTORS HURTING AND NEED PEOPLE, AND THESE ARE JOBS FROM PAY VERY GOOD WAGES.

LIKE AT OUR KEY SECTORS IN HEALTH CARE, IN RECONSTRUCTION AND MANUFACTURING.

CRITICAL JOBS THAT PAY VERY GOOD WAGES THAT CANNOT FIND ANYONE TO SHOW UP FOR THESE POSITIONS RIGHT NOW.

AND THAT CAN'T GO WITHOUT SAYING.

IT IS SO IMPORTANT THAT WE REALLY UNDERSTAND HOW CRITICALLY HARD THESE EMPLOYERS THEY REALLY HAVE IT.

WHEN YOU LOOK AT WE WOULDN'T BLAME A SINGLE MOTHER THAT NEEDS THAT EXTRA UI INCENTIVE TO STAY HOME RIGHT NOW.

I MEAN WE UNDERSTAND THAT.

WE HAVE TO ALSO REALLY HAVE THAT SAME SORT OF LENS FOR KENTUCKY'S SMALL BUSINESS EMPLOYERS.

SMALL BUSINESSES MAKE UP THE MAJORITY OF KENTUCKY BUSINESSES.

THESE OWNERS HAVE PUT THEIR LIFE SAVINGS TO OPEN THESE BUSINESSES, AND THEM GOING FROM PAYING $7.25 AN HOUR TO $15 OVERNIGHT OR EVEN NOW COMPETING WITH THE UI INCENTIVES THAT HAVE GOT THE AVERAGE PATE $17.25 AN HOUR, WHERE DO THOSE KENTUCKY BUSINESSES GO?

AND THEN WHAT HAPPENS TO THOSE JOBS IN KE?

>> Renee: JASON, I DO WANT TO ASK YOU ARE DOISTS BUSINESSES HAVE TO FIND WAYS TO BE CREATIVE WITHOUT THE EMPLOYEES THEY'RE WORK FOR AND UNTIL BE NO JOBS FOR EMPLOYEES WHEN THEY ARE ON THE HUNT FOR THEM?

DO YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT I'M SAYING?

THEY'RE GOING TO ADAPT TO NOT HAVING THE WORKFORCE THAT THEY HAD BEFORE, AND WORKERS WILL BE IN THE LURCH IF WORKERS DON'T GO AHEAD AND BITE THE BULLET RIGHT NOW.

>> Jason: IF AN EMPLOYER NEEDS A WORKER TO DO A PARTICULAR TASK, THEY'RE GOING TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO GET THAT AND PAY WHAT THEY NEED TO DO THAT GET THAT WORK DONE IF IT'S PROFITABLE FOR THEM TO DO SO.

THAT'S HOW MARKETS WORK.

WE HAVE AN ECONOMY RECOVERING AND IT FELL INTO A DEEP HOLE AND IT'S COMING OUT OF THAT HOLE AND IT'S GOING TO BE TIME TO PUT ALL THE PIECES TOGETHER BUT THERE'S NO REASON TO THINK THAT ALL OF A SUDDEN BECAUSE OF A PANDEMIC PEOPLE HAVE BECOME PERMANENTLY LAZY OR THEY'RE NOT WILLING TO WORK.

PEOPLE WERE WORKING BEFORE THE PANDEMIC.

THEY'LL BE WORKING AGAIN AFTER THE PANDEMIC.

MANY HAVE THEM HAVE SOME CHALLENGES WE'VE ALREADY TALKED ABOUT LIKE IN TERMS OF CHILD CARE, IN TERMS OF, YOU KNOW, THE FEAR -- THE RISKS OF GETTING COVID, ET CETERA.

BUT TO TAKE AWAY A BENEFIT THAT HAS BEEN SO ESSENTIAL, IT'S $34 MILLION A WEEK INTO THE KENTUCKY ECONOMY.

EMPLOYERS NEED TO THINK ABOUT THE EXPANDED UNEMPLOYMENT BENEFITS, ABOUT HOW MUCH THAT IS HELPING THEIR BUSINESS, THAT MONEY FLOWING THROUGH AND PEOPLE SPENDING AT A THEIR BUSINESS, THAT $34 MILLION.

WE NEED TO CUT THAT OFF THE WAY SOME STATES ARE DOING NOW IS TO HAMPER THE RECOVERY AND MAKE IT MUCH HARDER.

PEOPLE ARE GOING BACK THE WORK.

THERE ARE 42,000 KENTUCKIANS THAT HAVE GOTTEN RESTAURANT JOBS SINCE THE BOTTOM OF THIS CRISIS.

42,000.

SO PEOPLE ARE COMING BACK.

IT'S JUST THAT THAT PARTICULAR INDUSTRY WAS -- IS BASICALLY STARTING OVER, AND SO THEY'RE HAVING TO BUILD BACK.

AND MANY OF THOSE WORKERS WHO WERE IN RESTAURANTS BEFORE ARE, YOU KNOW, LOOKING AT WHAT THEIR OPTIONS ARE IN THE WORKFORCE, AND THEY KNOW THAT IN THE RESTAURANT INDUSTRY IN PARTICULAR, AND THERE ARE REASONS THAT THE FIGHT FOR $15 MOVEMENT NATIONALLY STARTED IN THE RESTAURANT INDUSTRY BECAUSE PEOPLE WERE UPSET AND FRANKLY GETTING TIRED BEFORE IF PANDEMIC OF THE LOW WAGES AND THE POOR WORKING CONDITIONS, AND EVEN THOSE EMPLOYERS THAT OFFER BETTER WAGES, YOU KNOW, LOOK AT THEIR WORKING CONDITIONS ISSUES THAT ARE A BARRIER FOR THEM THAT THEY NEED TO LOOK PAT LOOK AT THE HEALTH CARE STRIP.

LOOK AT HOW REGISTERED NURSES GET BURNT OUT OF THEIR JOBS.

THERE ARE 3500 HEALTH CARE WORKERS WHO HAVE DIED IN THIS CRISIS NATIONWIDE BECAUSE THEY'VE GOTTEN COVID.

SO, YOU KNOW, ALL EMPLOYERS NEED TO LOOK AT -- AT THE ENTIRETY OF THE CONDITIONS THAT THEY OFFER EMPLOYEES.

AND AS A STATE WE NEED TO BE LOOKING AT RAISING THE BOTTOM BECAUSE WHAT HAPPENS IS AN EMPLOYER, IF AN EMPLOYER -- IF ONE OF THEIR COMPETITORS IS ABLE TO OFFER EVEN LOWER WAGES BECAUSE THE MINIMUM WAGE HESITANCY BEEN UPDATED FOR A KICKED, THEN THAT MAKES IT HARDER FOR THEM TO RAISE WAGES SO WE NEED TO RAISE THE WAGES FOR ALL OF THESE.

THAT'S THE ROLE OF GOVERNMENT& BECAUSE THAT'S MISSING -- >> Renee: BUT TO THE POINT, IT SEEMS THAT THE MARKET IS ALREADY CAUSING THAT TYPE OF WAGE INSUFFLATION ON THE OWN.

>> Jason: IT'S STARTING TO BUT THEY'RE SAYING THEY DON'T HAVE ENOUGH WORKERS, SO THEY'RE CLEARLY NOT, THEIR NOT PROVIDING ENOUGH, AND THEY START AT SUCH A LOW LEVEL IN A LOT OF THESE BUSINESSES.

IF YOU LOOK AT THE WAGES THAT ARE BEING PAID IN THE RESTAURANT INDUSTRY, ABOUT 43% ARE CONSIDERED LOW INCOME.

I MEAN, THESE ARE NOT -- AND THEY'RE SPORADIC WHEN YOU LOOK ADD TIPPED WORKERS.

YOU DO NOT KNOW WHAT YOU'RE GOING TO GET.

THERE ARE VERY HIGH LEVELS WAGE HEFT THEFT IN THE RESTAURANT INDUSTRY.

NOT ALL RESTAURANTS FOR SURE BUT THERE ARE SOME THAT DO THAT.

THERE ARE VERY HIGH LEVELS SEXUAL HARASSMENT FROM BOTH CUSTOMERS AND THE WORKPLACE ITSELF.

SO THESE ARE THINGS THAT PEOPLE HAVE HAD TO DEAL WITH IN THIS INDUSTRY.

AND SO TO THINK IN THE MIDDLE WHILE WE'RE TRYING TO GET OUT OF A PANDEMIC THAT PEOPLE SHOULD BE FLOCKING FOR THESE JOBS THAT DON'T PAY VERY WELL, I THINK THEY NEED TO RETHINK THAT.

>> Renee: BILL LONDRIGAN, IF YOU WERE TO ARTIFICIALLY INFLATE, A THIS SIDE MAY CHARACTERIZE RAISING THE MINIMUM WAGE FROM $7.25 TO $15 AN HOUR, BUSINESSES ONCE AGAIN WILL ADAPT.

THAT'LL REQUIRE MORE PART-TIME WORK, THEY'LL CUT DOWN ON OTHER WAYS.

SO THE WORKERS DOESN'T HALLS ALWAYS BENEFIT FROM THESE TYPES OF ARTIFICIAL INFLATIONS OF THE OF THE MINIMUM WAGE.

>> Bill: I WOULDN'T NECESSARILY CHARACTERIZE IT AS AN ARTIFICIAL WAGE THAT'S CREATED.

IT'S ONE THAT SETS THE FLOOR THAT ALL EMPLOYEES HAVE TO ABIDE BY, SO IT GIVES US THAT FLOOR THAT IS NECESSARY FOR PEOPLE TO HAVE A DECENT WAGE.

AND WHILE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT RESTAURANTS, OF COURSE, ASIDE FROM TALKING ABOUT SOME OF THE SMALL MOM AND POP TYPE RESTAURANTS, USUALLY WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THESE HUGE INDUSTRIAL COLOSSUSES LIKE MCDONALD'S, CHIPOTLE, YOU NAME IT, APPLEBEE'S WHICH HAVE BEEN PULLING IN HUGE AMOUNTS OF MONEY, LARGE, LARGE PROFITS DURING THIS PANDEMIC, CEO SALARIES OUT THE ROOF, TENS OF UNLESS OF DOLLARS PER YEAR FOR CEOS, AND NOW WE'RE KIND OF, YOU KNOW, MOANING OVER THE FACT THAT THEY MAY HAVE TO RAISE THEIR WAGES IN ORDER TO ATTRACT WORKERS BACK TO THEIR WORKPLACES.

THAT TO ME DOESN'T MAKE ANY SENSE.

THEY'RE MAKING ENOUGH MONEY IN MANY, MANY CASES FOR THEM TO PAY THE HIGHER WAGE TO ATTRACT THE PEOPLE BACK IN SO THAT THEY CAN HAVE A SUCCESSFUL BUSINESS, BUT THEY'RE NOT NECESSARILY DOING IT AT ANY EVEN WAY OR ANY PARTICULAR EFFECTIVE WAY.

HEALTH CARE BENEFITS ARE LACKING THROUGHOUT THE INDUSTRY.

RETIREMENT PLANS ARE PRETTY MUCH NON-EXIST.

SO WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE -- NON-EXISTENT.

SO WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE A ATTRACTIONS FOR THOSE TYPES OF JOBS, IT'S NOT PARTICULARLY ATTRACTIVE IN MANY WAYS.

THEN ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE LEDGER WE HAVE THESE CORPORATE GIANTS THAT ARE MAKING BILLIONS OF DOLLARS WORTH OF PROFITS EVEN DURING THIS PANDEMIC.

SO THEY HAVE GOT TO STEP UP.

WHETHER IT'S WHAT YOU WOULD CALL THE MINIMUM WAGE ARTIFICIAL WAGE OR THE MARKET DERIVED WAGE, CERTAINLY THEY'RE NOT HITTING THE MARK HERE.

AND SOME OF THEM SAYING WE'RE GOING TO RAISE OUR WAGES A COUPLE DOLLARS AN HOUR, IT DOESN'T SEEM TO BE ENOUGH TO GET THAT ATTRACTION FOR PEOPLE TO MAKE THAT CHOICE TO GO BACK TO WORK, TO STOP COLLECTING UNEMPLOYMENT BENEFITS BECAUSE THEY KNOW THEY CAN MAKE MORE MONEY BY WORKING.

SO WHEN THOSE WAGES AND THOSE CONDITIONS IMPROVE, YOU'RE CERTAINLY GOING TO SEE WORKERS GOING BACK TO WORK.

>> Renee: EARLIER, JASON BAILEY MENTIONED ABOUT SPACES THAT ARE ENDING PARTICIPATION IN THE FEDERALLY FUNDING PANDEMIC UNEMPLOYMENT INSURANCE PROGRAM, THE HOOSIER STATE, INDIANA, WITH UNFUNDED U.

IS ONE OF THEM EFFECTIVE JUNE 19th, THE GOVERNOR ANNOUNCED THAT TODAY.

AND WE KNOW THERE WERE TWO HOUSE MEMBERS, REPUBLICAN CHAIRMEN IN THE KENTUCKY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES WHO WERE CALLING ON GOVERNOR BESHEAR TO DO THE SAME, TO TERMINATE THE FEDERAL UNEMPLOYMENT INSURANCE SUBSIDY.

SO WHAT IMPACT DO YOU THINK THESE CLARION CALLS FOR -- IN ORDER TO GET PEOPLE BACK TO WORK AND ADDRESS THIS LABOR SHORTAGE CUT OFF THAT UNEMPLOYMENT INSURANCE?

>> Jason: IT WOULD JUST MAKE OUR RECOVERY DEFICIENT WOULD HAMPER OUR RECOVERY IN A SERIOUS WAUGH.

$34MILLION A WEEK OF THOSE EXPAND UNEMPLOYMENT BENEFITS ARE GOING INTO THE CREIGH ECONOMY.

SELF-EMPLOYED WORKERS ARE GETTING THOSE.

THEY'RE NOT LAID OFF.

THEIR BUSINESS EVAPORATED THEY WORKED ON HOUSING OR DID SOMETHING ON THE SIDE, AND THAT EVAPORATED AND THEY'RE GETTING THOSE BENEFITS, BUT THEY'RE GOING TO GO AWAY.

SO IN AN ECONOMY THAT'S GETTING BACK ON THE FEET JUST NOW, STARTING TO GET BACK ON THE FEET, TO ELIMINATE THAT SPEND NOW IN THE ECONOMY IS A BIG HURT.

IT'S GOING TO HURT THOSE FAMILIES AS WELL.

THESE ARE FOLKS WHO -- THE IDEA THAT THEY DON'T WANT TO WORK IS BELIED BY THE FACT THAT'S THEY DID WORK AND WERE LAID OFF YOU.

CAN'T GET UNEMPLOYMENT BENEFITS BY NOT WORKING.

IF YOU LOOK AT THE DATA, RIGHT NOW THERE'S 39 WEEKS OF UNEMPLOYMENT BENEFITS AVAILABLE.

THE AVERAGE IN KENTUCKY, THE AVERAGE PERSON RECEIVING THE BENEFITS RECEIVES THEM FOR 13 WEEKS.

AND WE HAVEN'T HAD A REQUIRED JOB SEARCH UNTIL LAST WEEK.

SO PEOPLE WERE NOT STAYING ON THEM THE ENTIRE TIME THEY WERE STAYING TO THEM AS LONG AS THEY NEEDED TO.

IN MANY CASES THEY WERE ON TEMPORARY LAYOFF AND THEY WERE ABLE TO GET THEIR JOB BACK AND THEY WENT BACK.

SO PEOPLE ARE USING THIS BENEFIT IN THE RIGHT WAY.

IT'S PLUGGING A MAJOR HOLE IN THE ECONOMY AND FAMILY BUDGETS.

IT'S HELPING STIMULATE IT AND GET IT BACK ON THE FEET.

WE'RE NOT GOING TO HAVE PEOPLE FULLY VACCINATED TO LEVELS THAT ARE ACCEPTABLE FOR SEVERAL MORE MONTHS, AND THAT'S WHY THE BENEFIT WAS DESIGNED TO CONTINUE THROUGH SEPTEMBER 16th -- TO SEPTEMBER 6th.

IT WOULD JUST BE SHOOTING OURSELVES IN THE FOOT IN A MAJOR WAY AND HURTING FAMILIES TO CUT A THAT A.

>> WILL: >> Renee: A WANT TO WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT TO END THE PARTICIPATION IN FEDERAL UNEMPLOYMENT INSURANCE?

Y.

>> >> Shannon: I THINK WE HAVE TO LOOK AT THE FACT THAT WE CAN'T JUST LOOK AT THE UI BENEFIT.

WE HAVE DO LOOK AT ALL THE STIMULUS PAYMENTS, AND IF YOU AVERAGE THAT OUT, I THINK IT'S $32 AND CHANGE PLUS AN HOUR THAT AMERICANS ARE RECEIVING IF THEY'RE GETTING UNEMPLOYMENT AS WELL, THAT IS A TOUGH WAGE FOR ANY EMPLOYER TO COMPETE WITH, PARTICULARLY WHEN YOU LOOK AT RETAIL AND RESTAURANT AND GOING INTO MAYBE A STARTING JOB, SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

WHAT IS INTERESTING TO ME, TOO, IS I THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, JUST TO RESPOND TO MR. BAILEY AND MR. LUNDERGAN, THEY TALKED ABOUT THE RESTAURANT INDUSTRY AND THE FACT THAT PEOPLE DON'T WANT TO WORK IN THESE INDUSTRIES, BUT WHAT'S INTERESTING TO ME IS THE CHICAGO FEDERAL RESERVE IN ONE OF ITS LETTERS STATED THAT WHAT WAS SURPRISING TO THEM IS THAT IF THEY LOOKED AT THE LEISURE AND HOSPITALITY ECONOMY AND THOSE WORKERS IN THERE, WHEN MANUFACTURING JOBS CAME OPEN, THEY DIDN'T WANT TO SWITCH.

THERE IS VALUE IN RETAIL.

THERE IS VALUE IN WORKING IN A RESTAURANT AND IN THE H COMMUNITY.

IT IS ENTREPRENEURIAL.

IT CAN BE A CAREER.

THE CEO WALMART STARTED AS A CLERK.

KROGER'S CEO IS A KENTUCKIAN, BORN KENTUCKIAN AND STARTED IN THE GROCERY INDUSTRY IN A VERY EARLY STAGE.

SO I THINK WE ALSO TO HAVE STOP TALKING ABOUT THESE EMPLOYEES AS LIKE SOMETHING THAT THEY CAN'T HAVE A CAREER IN THESE SECTORS BECAUSE I THINK THAT THAT IS PART OF THE PROBLEM.

I GET VERY CONCERNED WHEN I HEAR, WELL, WE NEED GOOD-PAYING JOBS, LIKE NOT THOSE RETAIL, RESTAURANT JOBS.

E. BUT THEY CAN LEAD TO VERY GOOD CAREERS.

YOU CAN BE A FRANCHISEE OF A TEXAS ROADHOUSE AND HAVE A VERY SUCCESSFUL CAREER AND FAMILY LIFE.

AND THE RETAIL FEDERATION IS BUILDING A RETAIL CERTIFICATE PROGRAM TO ENCOURAGE MORE EMPLOYEES TO GO INTO THE RETAIL SECTOR.

AND I THINK THAT WHAT I WAS TRYING TO AVOID, MR. BAILEY, IS I WAS TRYING TO VIDE THE IMPRESSION THAT THE UI BENEFIT, WHAT WE WERE ARGUING THAT WE NEEDED TO CONSIDER HOW TO GET THESE WORKERS BACK IN THERE IS THAT JUST BECAUSE WE HAVE -- WE RAISE THAT AS A CORN SAY THAT THAT IS A FACTOR IN WHY THEY'RE NOT RETURNING TO EMPLOYMENT DOES NOT MEAN THAT WE THINK THAT THOSE WORKERS ARE LAZY.

AGAIN, WAS ARGUING IS IT WAS A PRACTICAL PROBLEM, AND THAT IS OKAY, BUT WE ALL HAVE TO WORK TOGETHER TO DO IT.

AND WE ALSO HAVE TO RECOGNIZED WHAT EMPLOYERS ARE DOING TO MEET EMPLOYEES WHERE THEY WANT TO BE.

>> Renee: BETH DAVISSON, DO YOU HAVE ANYTHING YOU CARE TO CHIME?

IN?

>> Beth: THEY BRING UP AMAZING POINTS.

I AGREE WITH SHANNON.

WAITRESSED MY WAY THROUGH COLLEGE AT LCC AND THEN ACROSS THE STREET OVER AT UK AND I DID I THAT ALL BY BEING A WAITRESS, AND IT CAN BE A CAREER AND AN AMAZING STEPPING STONE.

I THINK WHAT WE WANT TO TALK ABOUT IN KENTUCKY IS WAGE GROWTH.

WE NEED EMPLOYEES OR CITIZENS BACK INTO THE WORKFORCE SO THAT THEY CAN GROW, SO THAT THEY CAN GROW THEIR CAREERS, AND WHEN THEY'RE AT HOME, THAT'S NOT HAPPENING.

NOW, ALSO I DON'T DENY THAT, YOU KNOW, THIS SUPPLEMENT AND THIS BENEFIT HAS HELPED KENTUCKIANS GREATLY OVER THE PAST YEAR, AND WHAT IN THE WORLD WOULD WE HAVE DONE WITHOUT IT?

AND WE HAVE SEEN I THINK AS OF TODAY 20 STATES CALL FOR THE END OF THOSE EARLY UI BENEFITS.

I DON'T KNOW THAT THAT'S A KENTUCKY SOLUTION.

WE NEED A KENTUCKY SOLUTION THAT'S GOING TO BE GOOD FOR OUR CITIZENS AND GOOD FOR BUSINESSES.

WE ARE WORKING WITH THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE RIGHT NOW TO FIGURE OUT WHAT THAT WILL BE IN PARTNERSHIP WITH OUR KENTUCKY CHAMBER MEMBERS BECAUSE SOMETHING HAS TO BE DONE.

WE ARE NUDGING CLOSER AND CLOSER TO AUGUST.

THAT BENEFIT WAS ALWAYS MEANT TO PHASE OUT.

I WENT FROM $600, $300, AND AUGUST IN TERMS OF TODAY'S TIME IT'S TOMORROW, IT WILL BE HERE BEFORE WE KNOW IT, AND SO GETTING A WORK SEARCH REQUIREMENT ON AS SOMETHING WE ADVOCATED FOR HEAVILY, BUT IS THAT ENOUGH?

AND I DON'T THINK IT IS.

WE'VE GOT TO GET KENTUCKIANS BACK INTO THE WORKFORCE.

IT'S THEIR HEALTH BENEFIT THAT WILL BE IMPACTED, BUT THEN ALSO OUR ECONOMY.

WE NEED THEM BACK.

KENTUCKY NEEDS THEM BACK AND WE'VE GOT DO IT NOW.

>> Renee: JASON BAILEY, YOU'VE TALKED ABOUT AND WRITTEN ABOUT WAGE STAGNATION.

SO WHEN MS. DAVISSON TALKS ABOUT WAGE GROWTH, AS KENTUCKY BEEN KEEPING UP WITH WAGE GROWTH IN A WAY THAT YOU THINK IS PRODUCTIVE FOR THE WORKERS?

>> Jason: NO, WE HAVEN'T.

WE HAVE HAD WAGE STAGNATION FOR SEVERAL DECADE NOW.

IF YOU LOOK ACROSS WORKERS ACROSS THE MIDDLE AND THE BOTTOM, THEIR WAGES HAVEN'T GROWN.

THEY HAVEN'T KEPT UP WITH GROWTH IN ECONOMY.

WHAT YOU HAVE SEEN IS WAGE GROWTH AT THE VERY TOP.

YOU'VE SEEN EXECUTIVE SALARIES RISE.

YOU'VE SEEN CAPITAL INCOMES OF THE OWNERS OF THE SHAREHOLDERS HAVE SEEN THEIR INCOMES SORE SOAR.

THE CEO OF KROGER MAKES -- GOT A $6 MILLION LAST YEAR.

HE MAKES $22 MILLION A YEAR.

THE AVERAGE KROGER EMPLOYEE MAKES $22,000 A YEAR.

SO THAT IS THE KIND OF ECONOMY THAT WE'VE CREATED WHERE THE AVERAGE FAMILY AND THE AVERAGE CHEYE WORKER IS SEEING THEIR WAGES NOT GO UP, AND WHILE THE INCOMES AT THE SOP SOAR.

THERE ARE REASONS FOR THAT.

IT'S NOT NATURAL PROGRESSION.

THEY ARE SPECIFIC POLICY CHOICES WE HAVE MADE TO HAMPER UNIONS AND DRASTICALLY DECREASE UNIONIZATION TO LET THE MINIMUM WAGE NOT KEEP UP WITH THE GROWTH IN THE ECONOMY.

TO BASICALLY IN LOTS OF WAYS SHIFT THE BALANCE OF POWER AWAY FROM WORKERS AND TO BUSINESSES.

AND THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE SEEING AS SOCH FRUSTRATION.

HERE AS THIS ECONOMY COMES OUT WITH WORKERS FOR IN SOME CASES, YOU KNOW, THINKING ABOUT, RETHINKING THE CONDITIONS THEY WORKED UNDER BEFORE.

AND I THINK THAT'S -- WHEN WE HAVE A LOT OF DEMAND IN THE ECONOMY BECAUSE PEOPLE HAVE MONEY TO SPEND, THAT ALLOWS -- THAT PRESSURES EMPLOYERS TO FIND WORKERS, BUT IF THEY'RE GOING TO HIRE THEM BACK AT THE SAME LOW WAGES THEY HAD BEFORE, THEY MAY HAVE TROUBLE.

>> Renee: SPEAK TO THE FLATION OF UNIONS.

>> Bill: THERE'S A BILL PENDING BEFORE THE SENATE CALLED THE PRO ACT PROTECTING THE RIGHT TO ORGANIZE THAT WOULD ABSOLUTELY CHANGE THE PLAYING FIELD FOR WORKERS IN THIS COUNTRY, GIVE THEM A FAIR SHOT TO EXERCISE THEIR RIGHTS TO BARGAIN COLLECTIVELY AND ORGANIZE TOGETHER.

WE HAVE SEEN OVER YEARS WITH ANY LOSS OF UNION DENSITY, WAGES HAVE DON'T GOWN AND STAGNATED AS JASON HAS REFERRED TO, AND WORKERS HAVE NOT BENEFITED FROM THE OVERALL ECONOMY IN THAT REGARD.

SO WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT NOW IS TO TRY TO CHANGE THE LAW TO GIVE WORKERS A BETTER CHANCE AT ORGANIZING THEIR WORKS PLACES SO THAT THEY CAN BARGAIN COLLECTIVELY, RAISE THEIR WAGES, IMPROVE THEIR BENEFITS, IMPROVE THEIR LIVING STANDARDS AND MAKE FOR A BETTER UNITED STATES OF AMERICA WHERE WORKERS HAVE MORE DISPOSABLE INCOME.

>> Renee: THANK YOU ALL.

THIS HAS BEEN A VERY GOOD DISCUSSION.

AND WE'LL KEEP THE CONVERSATION GOING ABOUT THE FUTURE OF WORK IN MANY WAYS, WHETHER IT'S MORE REMOTE WORK.

I THINK A LOT OF WORKERS WHO ARE WHITE COLLAR WORKS WHO HAVE THAT LUXURY WOULD LIKE TO HAVE THAT BENEFIT AND WE'LL SEE IF THAT STILL OS SO GOES ON NEXT MONDAY NIGHT A SPECIAL PROGRAM, EXAMINING VIOLENT CRIME IN LOUISVILLE: A KET FORUM.

WITH RECORD LEVEL HOMICIDE RATES IN THE DERBY CITY, HOW ARE CITY LEADERS AND ANTI-VIOLENCE ADVOCATES TRYING TO STEM THE VI MAYOR GREG FISCHER AND THE DEPUTY POLICE CHIEF ARE AMONG THE GUESTS IN OUR KET FORUM NEXT LONG NIGHT THAT THE 8:00 EASTERN/7:00 CENTRAL.

DON'T FORGET TUNING IN FRIDAY NIGHT AT 8 8:00 AND SO DILL BRYANT AND A PANEL OF JOURNALISTS BREAK DOWN NOOSE OF THE WEEK RIGHT HERE ON KET.

I'M RENEE SHAW.

TAKE REALLY GOOD CARE.