♪ ♪ ♪ >> John Hope Bryant, founder, Operation Hope.

Next on "The Chavis Chronicles."

>> Major funding for "The Chavis Chronicles" is provided by the following... At Wells Fargo, we are committed to diversity and understand our responsibility in supporting and empowering diverse communities.

Diversity and inclusion is integral to the way we work.

Supporting the financial health of our diverse customers and employees is one of the many ways we remain invested in inclusion for all, today, tomorrow, and in the future.

American Petroleum Institute -- through the core elements of API's Energy Excellence Program, our members are committed to accelerating safety, environmental and sustainability progress throughout the natural-gas and oil industry in the U.S. and around the world.

You can learn more at api.org/apiEnergyExcellence.

Reynolds American, dedicated to building a better tomorrow for our employees and communities.

Reynolds stands against racism and discrimination in all forms and is committed to building a more diverse and inclusive workplace.

At AARP, we are committed to empowering people to choose how they live as they age.

♪ ♪ >> John Hope Bryant, founder of Operation Hope and many other things.

Welcome to "The Chavis Chronicles."

>> Thank you for all that you've done for not only the Black America, but for America.

You really are a change-maker.

And I want to appreciate -- I want everybody to know how much I appreciate you.

>> Well, thank you.

You come straight outta Compton, California.

Tell us about your upbringing.

How did you first get into financial services?

>> Well, my mother and dad divorced over money.

We owned -- in south central L.A., we owned an eight-unit apartment building that we bought for $18,000.

The payment was $237.

>> So they were property owners.

>> Yeah.

Yeah.

We owned our own home also, but we owned an 8-unit apartment building across the street from our house.

You can make the mortgage with one -- with two rental payments, and we lived in the third unit, so we had five other units that were profit.

Anyway, we lost that building is the point.

We had our own home.

We lost that.

We owned a cement contracting business.

We owned a gas station at Normandie and Vernon.

Everybody who knows South Central L.A.. We lost that because my dad could make it but couldn't keep it.

He knew how to make money, but didn't know how to build wealth.

He confused cash flow and profit with wealth building and ownership.

He wouldn't ask my mother, who was a financial genius, for help.

He didn't realize they had to be better together.

And my mother's credit score today is 857.

>> 857?

>> 857.

She's not Black, she's green.

I didn't even realize it could go beyond 800.

By the way, I asked my mother if they got divorced over money.

I asked my mother recently was she gonna get married again, and she said, "Yeah, baby.

He's going to be a BMW -- a Black Man Working.

My mother is full of self-esteem and self-confidence and usually tells me she loves me every day of my life.

So I never really had a self-esteem problem growing up because of her.

Anyway, my mom left my dad.

They lost everything.

I went to go live with a girlfriend.

She told me it was her relatives so I wouldn't be nervous.

Her boyfriend, the girlfriend's boyfriend, saved my life.

I fell backwards, was swallowing my tongue.

He hit me between my shoulder blades, cleared my throat passage.

So I idolized this guy, Dr. Chavis, waited for him to come home.

I'm seven years old.

And he was selling marijuana part time after work to make some extra money to take care of us.

I didn't realize that.

And he was murdered by the guys who -- for whom that was their territory.

They followed him home and drove him over -- rode -- rode over him in a truck, riding a bicycle, until he was dead right in front of me.

And I can still, to this day, see that visual as I say this to you.

>> How old were you when that happened?

>> I was seven.

And if I wasn't on camera, I might tear up.

But I don't wanna make this about me.

But that was -- That was -- That was about money.

It was a pivotal moment.

And then when I was nine years old, my mother bought her first -- [clears throat] my mother bought our first home.

As a result of that, we moved to Compton, 15502 South Frailey.

I said I wasn't going to get emotional.

And my best friend was George.

He was 18 years old.

Didn't have a mom and dad like I had.

[ Coughing ] Was smarter than me.

Which -- the point here is that smarts is not enough.

He got better grades, but he hung around the wrong environment, Dr. Chavis.

He hung around the drug dealer named Tweak next to me, also about money, and he was murdered at 18.

So I'm -- So by the time I'm nine years old, I've seen one death, the death of our net worth in our family, and two murders.

So I had enough, man.

And I'll tell you next, you know, what happened next and why -- what my antidote was.

But that was my -- >> The reason why I asked that question, John, because most of us don't get an opportunity.

I'm getting choked up now.

Most of us don't get an opportunity to tell our stories.

From the crucible that you were born in, that you were raised in, to where you are today.

>> Yeah.

>> Those stories, man, are so important for our young people to hear.

>> Yeah.

It makes life make sense.

>> Oh, no question.

>> And for people to understand that rainbows only follow storms -- that you cannot have a rainbow without a storm first.

So they know they can do it too.

It's deeper than even what I articulated because my grandmother, who lived in a shotgun shack, my great grandmother was a slave, but my grandfather was a slave.

My grandfather -- not great great great grandfather.

Born in 1871.

R.B.

Smith, Mississippi.

>> Mississippi.

That's right.

>> And in 1871, Mississippi -- 1871, you were born into effective slavery, because it ended in 1865.

He was able to get a little farm as a sharecropper.

We hear about this in the history books.

As a sharecropper.

That farm was worth $700 at its height in 1921.

So he owned one farm worth $700.

My mother ended up owning seven homes.

I end up owning 700 homes through the Promise Homes company.

This is the march toward freedom.

This is the new march of civil rights that I call silver rights, for the movement coming from the streets to the suites.

And the new color, as it has always been, I believe, is green.

But we don't -- We were never taught that lesson.

And when the rules are published and the playing field is level, as you know and as you fought your whole life, we succeed.

>> You know, John, I -- in my younger years, I actually had an opportunity to work with the Reverend Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. at the Southern Christian Leadership Conference.

And of course, before Dr. King was assassinated in 1968, he was heading toward this struggle for economic justice, for economic equity.

But, you know, his life was cut short.

>> Because of it, I think.

>> Oh, no question about it.

So tell us about Operation Hope.

What led to you founding this tremendous organization now that has helped so many people across America?

>> Because of him and because of Andrew Young, who was with him, who was on that balcony when Dr. King was assassinated in '68.

>> Yes, in Memphis.

>> In Memphis, April of '68.

And because of Frederick Douglass, who, by the way, also owned $6 million worth of real estate in 1865.

[ Laughs ] Think about that.

And that real estate is in Baltimore, Maryland.

It has a marker on it, you know.

And so he rented it out to working-class Blacks.

So he was also financially free.

All money is is freedom.

But though Abraham Lincoln and Frederick Douglass had the Freedman's Bank, Lincoln was assassinated April 1865.

Dr. King had the Poor People's Campaign.

He was assassinated April 1968.

I want to extend and continue and hopefully finish successfully some of the work they began.

But all of this comes back again, as you know, to personal stories.

So that story of my best friend being murdered, his name was George.

Unless I mention his name, no one will ever call his name again.

I go to a classroom to teach -- that teaches financial literacy.

A banker came into the classroom, blue suit.

>> This is in California?

>> In Compton.

Blue suit, white shirt, red tie.

He's 6'2".

He's Caucasian.

Male.

Teaching financial literacy.

Because of the C.R.A.

law, banking.

C.R.A.

law.

that just passed in '77.

And I never saw a White man in my neighborhood unless he was a detective wearing a suit, and it was a bad suit.

The second session of this financial literacy lesson, I raised my hand.

"Excuse me, sir.

What do you do for a living, and how did you get rich legally?"

I was dead serious.

[ Chuckles ] Nobody in my neighborhood had a business card, was on a salary, could come to my office and to my school in the middle of the day.

My mother had an hourly job with two breaks and lunch.

>> Now, most schools don't teach financial literacy.

>> That's exactly the point I'm making.

So he says, "Young man, I'm a banker, and I finance entrepreneurs."

I said, "Sir, I don't know what an entrepreneur is.

No one's ever mentioned that word to me in my entire life."

French word -- build something out of nothing.

"But whatever it is, it is legal, and you're financing it?

I'm going to be one."

That is who I am today.

I left that school, I opened up the dictionary to the word entrepreneur.

French word -- build something out of nothing.

That's it.

Borrow $40 from my mother.

Open the neighborhood candy house in my den.

>> How old were you?

>> Nine years old.

And at this point, I'm sorry, I'm ten.

And put the liquor store out of the candy business.

It's a longer story than that, but the shorter version of the story is I took $40 and made it $300 a week investment -- a return, paid my mother back, put the liquor store out of the candy business -- Mac's Liquor Store down the street.

>> I guess that banker that first taught you at nine and ten years old, he's not alive now.

>> You know, one of my sadnesses, I didn't get his business card.

I don't know his name.

Yes, I would love to say thank you to that guy.

>> He put you on a trajectory.

>> Sure did.

>> So let's continue.

I want to know what led to Operation Hope and all of the various things that you're doing and what is the intersection between what you're doing and the banking industry today.

>> Well, you can't grow without constructive friction.

It's impossible.

But I think there's been more progress through evolution than revolution.

We've got to figure out how to make the system work for us.

People say -- some of my friends say, "Oh, I hate rich people."

No, you don't.

That isn't -- That is literally a lie.

You hate rich people till you become rich, okay?

What you hate is a gamed system.

What you hate is a system that's playing games with you, that you -- no matter how hard you work, you cannot succeed.

So let's solve that problem.

Let's level the playing field.

Publish the rules and give you a shot to succeed.

It's the James Brown version of affirmative action.

Open the door, I'll get it myself.

My job is to open that door broad, deep, and wide, and to institutionalize access, to make free enterprise and capitalism work for our people.

Some people say, "Oh, well, what we need is a socialist model."

Well, where do you think the money for socialism comes from?

I mean, what are you -- in Norway and all these countries, that's oil.

[ Laughs ] I mean, you've got to make it.

Shimon Peres told me -- I was in Jordan one day.

He said, "People are going to criticize your work.

You tell them, even if you want to distribute money like a socialist, you got to first collect it like a capitalist.

We have made capitalism a bad thing.

Money is not bad, it's the love of money that's bad.

It's the abuse.

>> I think there's a lot of miseducation, or should I say no education about the financial markets, about capitalism, about creating a pathway toward wealth.

As particularly young people today look for pathways -- and not only young people, but I would say people of all ages want to be financially well.

>> Yeah.

>> Financial wellness.

>> It's the new sexy.

>> Well, that's what we want to talk about.

I want people to understand that.

>> We've got to make smart sexy again, Dr. Chavis.

We've been making dumb sexy for way too long.

We've dumbed down and celebrated it.

That's why, again, I love what you're doing.

You're amplifying and raising the temperature, raising the frequency of these conversations so that people can actually hear it.

It is possible to go from nothing to something.

Most legitimate wealth in this country came from so-called poor people who worked their rear ends off.

People like Reginald Lewis, the founder of Jet, the founders of Ebony magazine, the founders of Essence, the founder of BET.

These are entertainment companies, but you can look at all the range of other things that we have done as people.

You know, C.J.

Walker -- Madam C.J.

Walker.

All these heroes and sheroes who came up from nothing.

Dr. Dorothy Height, who created -- who owned a building on Pennsylvania Avenue, National Council of Negro Women.

All these stories that nobody really either understands or appreciates.

>> I know people are scrambling to go look it up, but I want you to tell everybody what is the mission of Operation Hope?

>> To eradicate poverty as we know it in our lifetime.

Make free enterprise work for the poor.

Become America's financial coach.

To become -- To change the banking system.

To get the banks out of the "no" business and back into the "yes" business.

By moving credit scores 54 points in six months, which is what we do, and 120 points in 24 months, which is what we do, because nothing changes your life more than God or love than moving your credit score 120 points.

>> You have proven examples that you can do that.

>> Oh, we have 4 million clients and we've directed $4 billion.

Now we have a $50 million annual budget, and $4 billion, we've invested in these neighborhoods.

We have 200 operating locations.

We're the largest in the country, with 46 states with 350 full-time staff people that are making free enterprise work every day and finishing, I think, the work of the Freedman's Bank.

>> Talk to us about some of the responsiveness of African-Americans, Latino communities, other communities of color, and also White communities -- how people are responding to all of the opportunities that Operation Hope offers.

>> 30 years ago, people ignored me.

20 years ago, they laughed at me.

Well, now we have 3 million followers on social media, 100 million video views.

I'm honored to be able to talk to you.

I've already told you about the results of Operation Hope, and we've helped to create federal policy four times.

And I think the best is yet to come.

So it's no longer an argument.

But, you know, first people ignore you, then they criticize you, then they try to copy you, then you win.

You just have to keep going.

You know, I think Dr. King once said the arc of of justice, as long as it bends towards freedom -- or arc of freedom, as long as it bends towards justice -- >> Bends towards justice.

>> Towards justice.

I think you just -- if you're -- if you're about the right thing, if you're authentic, you just stay about the business and you keep producing results and then let the results speak for you.

You don't need to say a word.

So when I'm going to go to the airport, as I did coming to see you, I have TSA agents screaming out their credit score to me.

I walk in, "680."

"700."

I've had people literally giving their phones to me.

I'm like, "Whoa, whoa, what's that?"

They're just showing me their credit score.

>> That's great.

>> It warms my heart.

They're saying to me, "I have access now.

I have access now."

Do you know that half of us African Americans have a credit score below 620?

Take away -- Forget about police brutality for a minute.

Forget about racism and all the other legitimate issues.

That means that half of us, Dr. Chavis, are locked out of the free enterprise system.

You can go to church every Sunday, be the nicest person on the planet, pay your taxes, be kind, be joyful, and you can't get a decent mortgage at less than 680.

>> Because of your credit score.

>> Because of your credit score.

You can't get a small business loan.

I don't care how good your idea is, below 700 because it's risky credit.

So you think that it's racism that somebody is telling you no.

It might be.

It also might be -- or it just might be that your credit score stinks.

We can solve that.

>> If you had to choose a lasting message to the group that has in -- or feel that there is no hope out of poverty, how can John Hope Bryant give them hope?

>> I was homeless for six months of my life when I was 18 years old.

I didn't tell you that part of this story.

I believed too much of my own press, that's how I got there.

And I thought I was doing business.

It was really busyness.

And God has a funny way of sending messages.

Whatever goes around comes around.

But I worked myself out of that mess, too.

And that's when I founded a company.

That was my first company success.

And then that led to me founding later on Operation Hope.

And all that led me here to you.

I wouldn't be here without my problems.

I wouldn't be here without my challenges.

Success doesn't define you, it's how you manage your failures, because life is 10% what life does to you and 90% how you choose to respond to it.

Not react, respond.

What's your response going to be?

If you're born Black in America, you're born blessed because you can do so -- you're doing so much with so little for so long, you could almost do anything with nothing.

The ancestors are praising you, because look at what they came through and look at where you are now.

So if you're watching this program, you can do it.

That's my message to you -- that anybody can do it.

You can do it.

But you've got to focus like a laser beam because you are resilient, you are strong, You have a hustle built into your brain and into the muscle fiber, and you've got all the ancestry strength waiting to be called forward.

But you can't be angry because anger is not a business plan.

You've got to be non-emotional.

You've got to be focused, and you've got to master this new system we call capitalism.

>> How does Operation Hope deal with some of these inequities that appear to be systematic?

>> In some respects, the best thing I can do on civil rights issues is to stay out of the way and let the NAACP, La Raza, a range of other organizations that are squarely focused on these issues, let them do their job.

Become a lifetime member.

Give them some support in the matter, boys.

Stay out of the way of civil rights.

The groundwater effect issues.

While I'll also augment silver rights.

Let me stay focused on access to capital.

Once playing field is somewhat level, or even if it's not, let me help you get around it over, and through it, even if it's imperfect.

So even if we have the biases and the inequalities, done is better than perfect.

I'd rather you own a home then rent for somebody.

Why do you want to rent a home you don't own in a place that people don't know you and a place that doesn't want you with money you don't have, that's going to go to somebody who owns it, not you, in a place that doesn't want you, on some value you're not creating for yourself.

I'd rather you take even modest ownership -- in fact, I would argue superior ownership in what we call the hood, our neighborhoods.

I'd rather you buy the worst house on the best block in our neighborhoods, where values are not properly appreciated.

Buy it, rehab it, rent it, and hold it.

In an uneven environment.

Why?

Because an inner city in France is called Paris.

An inner city in the U.K. is called London.

We have centrally-located, invaluable real estate right in our own neighborhoods, and we are giving it away.

So you can't just debate.

You can't just protest.

You can't just fight the long fight of the groundwater effect.

That may take 20 years.

What are you going to do in the next two years?

We can't just sit around and complain.

There are some short term things we can do.

That's what I'm focusing on.

I'm trying to give you access to capital.

I'm trying to get your savings up $1,000, which I can do in a year.

Your debt down $3,000.

That's what I'm doing.

And your credit score up so that the bank, irrespective of racism and discrimination, whatever bank it is, can say yes to you or must say yes to you, while at the same time supporting structural reforms.

As you know, I'm trying to get financial literacy legislation done.

That's a whole nother effect, which I'll actually need to take some lessons from civil rights wins in order to even get that done.

I think that this ultimately comes together, but I think focus and knowing what you're good at and not trying to be everything to everybody is also an art form.

>> There are a lot of young people today that want to be entrepreneurs.

What would you say to young people that want to become an entrepreneur today?

>> You can do me times ten.

We need job creators.

We need Bill Gates as much as we need President Obama -- a Black Bill Gates, somebody who, not through entertainment and sports -- no knock on that, but you can't create scaled jobs through entertainment and sports.

We need just normal professions at scale.

At my company, 55% of my vendors are Black and women -- plumbing, electrical, landscaping, roofing, lighting.

I'm doing -- I think I just -- $4 million in checks in the last couple years.

Those are scalable, sustainable wealth-creation contracts that you can reboot every year.

We need a bunch of people like me doing that at scale.

Hopefully banking and institutions will give you access to capital today.

So all these things are part of a mosaic to me that I know are important to you.

And I think it's -- it's like a relay race, or a continuing historical narrative of folks who came before us.

>> Yes.

What gives you your greatest hope?

>> Conversations like this.

Because the book, The Tipping Point, Malcolm Gladwell, the author, who is -- comes from African descendants, by the way of the Caribbean, the University of Illinois reporting there show that at 5% of role models and every community stabilizes.

So somebody might say, I'm this dreamer.

I'm out of my mind.

I think I can eradicate poverty in my lifetime.

Dr. Dorothy Height said, "John, you're a dreamer with a shovel in your hand."

Well, the shovel in my hand has 5% tied to it.

The book, The Tipping Point, said that at 5% of role models, every community stabilizes.

Dr. Chavis, not 80%.

Not 50% of role models.

Somebody could say that's unachievable.

Just 5%.

And hope is so powerful, you need a simple minority of it and it changes the world.

I think hope is the first cousin to love, and love is the child of God.

So it's all about light and it's all about him and what's for him, who can be against?

Dr. King only had 20% of the Black community support, as you well know.

He only had 20% of the White community's support, and half that was Jewish, as you well know.

Most people were either against him or sitting on their hands.

And look at what he did.

5%.

So what gives me so much hope are conversations like this, where we come from different places but end up in the same spot.

>> Yes.

>> And I think we're better together.

And if you can get 5% of leaders, 5% of banks, 5% of corporations, 5% of civic leaders, just -- or more to mobilize.

5% of legislators around a new vision for America.

>> So all hope is not lost.

>> All hope is in our hands.

>> John Hope Bryant, thank you for joining "The Chavis Chronicles."

>> For more information about "The Chavis Chronicles" and our guests, please visit our website at TheChavisChronicles.com.

Also, follow us on Facebook, Twitter, LinkedIn, YouTube, Instagram, and TikTok.

Major funding for "The Chavis Chronicles" is provided by the following... At Wells Fargo, we are committed to diversity and understand our responsibility in supporting and empowering diverse communities.

Diversity and inclusion is integral to the way we work.

Supporting the financial health of our diverse customers and employees is one of the many ways we remain invested in inclusion for all, today, tomorrow, and in the future.

American Petroleum Institute -- through the core elements of API's Energy Excellence Program, our members are committed to accelerating safety, environmental and sustainability progress throughout the natural-gas and oil industry in the U.S. and around the world.

You can learn more at api.org/apiEnergyExcellence.

Reynolds American, dedicated to building a better tomorrow for our employees and communities.

Reynolds stands against racism and discrimination in all forms and is committed to building a more diverse and inclusive workplace.

At AARP, we are committed to empowering people to choose how they live as they age.

♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪