ANNOUNCER: TONIGHT, ON SHOWCASE WITH BARBARA KELLAR, CONDUCTOR OF THE CINCINNATI POPS ORCHESTRA, JOHN MORRIS RUSSELL, AND HISTORIC PRESERVATIONIST THEA TJEPKEMA.

STAY TUNED, SHOWCASE STARTS RIGHT NOW.

[ MUSIC ] KELLAR: HI, I'M BARBARA KELLAR AND I HAVE WITH ME TODAY TWO OF THE MOST INTERESTING, WONDERFUL PEOPLE IN CINCINNATI, THEA TJEPKEMA AND JMR, JOHN MORRIS RUSSELL.

AND THEY ARE HUSBAND AND WIFE IN CASE ANYBODY OUT THERE DIDN'T KNOW.

SO, TODAY WE'RE GOING TO TALK TO THEM A LITTLE BIT ABOUT WHAT THEY DO, BUT MORE MAYBE ABOUT HOW THEY GOT TOGETHER AS THIS FABULOUS POWER MUSIC COUPLE.

SO LADIES FIRST, THEA.

TJEPKEMA: OH.

KELLAR: TELL US A LITTLE BIT ABOUT.

OKAY.

TELL PEOPLE ABOUT YOUR NAME AND WHY IT'S SO DIFFICULT TO PRONOUNCE.

TJEPKEMA: SO, MY NAME IS LIKE SALLY SMITH IN THE NETHERLANDS.

IT'S SO COMMON.

IT'S -- TJEPKEMA FROM NORTHERN HOLLAND, IT'S FROM FRIESLAND, AND MY GRANDPARENTS WERE DUTCH.

AND WE STILL HAVE A TJEPKEMA WINDMILL THERE ON TJEPKEMA STREET.

KELLAR: WOW.

AND THAT WAS ALL -- SO, YOUR FAMILY WAS -- HAS BEEN THERE FOR CENTURIES.

TJEPKEMA: WELL, THEY'RE ALL OVER HERE NOW.

I HAVE A GREAT, GREAT, GREAT, GREAT COUSIN REMOVED STILL THERE RUNNING THE WINDMILL.

KELLAR: OH, SO THAT WAS GOING TO BE MY NEXT QUESTION, DOES IT STILL RUN?

TJEPKEMA: YEAH, AND THEY STILL MAKE BREAD.

IT'S A FLOUR MILL.

KELLAR: OH, MY GOSH.

TJEPKEMA: YEAH.

KELLAR: THEY MAKE -- THEY DO THE -- MILL THE FLOUR, AND THEN THEY ACTUALLY MAKE SOME BREAD.

DO YOU GO BACK AND VISIT ONCE IN A WHILE?

TJEPKEMA: SOON AFTER WE WERE MARRIED, WE WENT OVER FOR A GREAT TRIP TO SEE THE WINDMILL.

I HAD TO SHOW HIM WHY I KEPT MY LAST NAME.

KELLAR: RIGHT?

YES.

RIGHT.

JMR: WELL, IN FACT, ON OUR VERY FIRST TIME THAT WE EVER MET, OF COURSE, IT WAS AT A RECEPTION IN SAVANNAH, GEORGIA, AT AN ART GALLERY THAT THEA WAS RUNNING.

AND SHE HAD HER NAME TAG.

AND, OF COURSE, YOU KNOW, I WAS TRYING TO FIGURE IT OUT, BUT I DID NAIL HER FIRST NAME.

BECAUSE I SAID THEA WITH A HARD T, JUST LIKE THE GREAT OPERA MANAGER THEA DISPEKER.

AND SO I NAILED THAT ONE.

TJEPKEMA: I WAS VERY SHOCKED.

KELLAR: YEAH, SHOCKED THAT HE GOT THAT -- TJEPKEMA: HE GOT MY FIST NAME.

KELLAR: WELL, THAT'S A GREAT -- THAT'S A GREAT FIRST START.

TJEPKEMA: YEAH.

KELLAR: YEAH.

IF THEY CAN PRONOUNCE YOUR NAME, YOU KNOW, YOU KNOW HE'S PAYING ATTENTION.

SO, YOU RAN AN ART GALLERY?

TJEPKEMA: I WAS WORKING IN AN ART GALLERY.

I WAS WORKING FOR THE -- ACTUALLY FOR THE TELFAIR MUSEUM, WHICH IS IN SAVANNAH, AND I ACTUALLY WORKED IN THE OWENS THOMAS HOUSE.

IT'S A HISTORIC HOUSE MUSEUM.

SO, MY DEGREE IN HISTORIC PRESERVATION AND MY MASTER'S IN ARTS ADMINISTRATION, MY WHOLE GOAL WAS TO WORK IN A HISTORIC HOUSE MUSEUM.

KELLAR: AND YOU WERE, YOU WORKED IN SEVERAL.

TELL US WHICH ONES?

THERE WERE SO MANY.

TJEPKEMA: OH, I'VE DONE ALL KINDS OF PRESERVATION, HANDS ON PRESERVATION WORK, LIKE, SCRAPING PAINT.

KELLAR: YEAH.

TJEPKEMA: AND I'VE DONE CURATORIAL WORK AND I DO A LOT OF RESEARCH, WHICH GOES FOR BOTH PRESERVATION AND HANDS ON, YOU KNOW.

KELLAR: YEAH, WELL, YOU'RE NO STRANGER TO OUR AUDIENCE BECAUSE YOU'VE TALKED ABOUT WHAT YOU DO SOMEWHAT, BUT WE WANT TO LEARN MORE.

BUT FIRST, JMR, YOU COULD DO THIS INTERVIEW.

[ LAUGHTER ] I COULD JUST PRESS A BUTTON AND IT'S 27 MINUTES LATER, THAT'S IT.

YEAH.

YOU ARE CERTAINLY A GREGARIOUS ENTREPRENEUR.

ALL THOSE GREAT THINGS.

AND THE POPS IS YOUR BABY.

JMR: THAT'S RIGHT.

AND OF COURSE, WE CAME TO CINCINNATI.

WE'VE KIND OF HAD WHAT WE LIKE TO LOVINGLY REFER TO AS TWO TOURS OF DUTY.

AND WE WERE HERE FROM 1995 TO 2006 AS ASSOCIATE CONDUCTOR OF THE SYMPHONY AND THE POPS.

AND THEN MOVED TO CANADA FOR ABOUT FIVE YEARS WHERE I CONDUCTED THE WINDSOR SYMPHONY ORCHESTRA.

AND AFTER ERICH KUNZEL HAD PASSED AWAY, I GOT THE CALL TO COME BACK HOME.

AND SO WE'VE BEEN HERE SINCE 2011 AND IT'S BEEN FANTASTIC TO COME BACK TO CINCINNATI TWICE IN THESE TWO, AND ESPECIALLY NOW, THIS EXTRAORDINARILY DYNAMIC TIME IN THE HISTORY OF CINCINNATI.

BUT WE BOTH MET IN SAVANNAH AND WE LIVED FOR A COUPLE OF YEARS IN SAVANNAH.

AND IN A LOT OF WAYS IT WAS KIND OF A MICROCOSM OF OUR LIVES HERE IN CINCINNATI.

IT -- THE CITY BUBBLES WITH ARCHITECTURE AND ART.

AT THE TIME, IT HAD A FANTASTIC ORCHESTRA AND WE ENJOYED SO MUCH BEING THERE TOGETHER BECAUSE WE ENJOYED THESE THINGS, THE FINE ARTS, THE TELFAIR ART ACADEMY, ALL OF THE GREAT MUSIC AND ALL THE EXTRAORDINARY ARCHITECTURE OF SAVANNAH.

KELLAR: YEAH.

JMR: AND IN FACT, WHEN WE CAME HERE AND IN 1995, AND, YOU KNOW, WORKING DOWNTOWN, YOU KNOW, WE WOULD WALK AROUND OVER THE RHINE KIND OF LOOKING AT ALL OF THESE BUILDINGS THAT HAD BEEN IGNORED AND WE'RE FALLING APART AND THINKING TO OURSELVES SOMEDAY, YOU KNOW, WE'RE GOING TO WAKE UP AND DISCOVER THAT THIS EXTRAORDINARY ARCHITECTURAL HERITAGE THAT HAS BEEN PRESERVED HERE.

AND NOW LOOK AROUND TO OVER THE RHINE AND THE HERITAGE THAT WE HAVE HERE IN CINCINNATI.

IT'S PRETTY EXTRAORDINARY.

KELLAR: YEAH.

YOU DON'T -- DO YOU LIVE IN OVER-THE-RHINE?

JMR: WE LIVE IN HYDE PARK.

KELLAR: OH, YOU'RE MY NEIGHBORS.

JMR: BUT WE -- AND HYDE PARK HAS GOT SOME FANTASTIC -- TJEPKEMA: WE'RE IN A 1929 TUDOR.

KELLAR: YEAH, OURS IS 1903.

TJEPKEMA: OH, YEAH.

JMR: BUT WE FIND OURSELVES DOWNTOWN ALL THE TIME.

KELLAR: YEAH.

JMR: AND THEA IN PARTICULAR IS VERY MUCH CONNECTED TO THE ARCHITECTURAL HERITAGE OF CINCINNATI AND SERVES ON THE BOARD OF THE CINCINNATI PRESERVATION ASSOCIATION, AS WELL AS THE FRIENDS OF MUSIC HALL.

KELLAR: YEAH, WELL, YOU ARE THE EXPERT.

JMR: SHE IS.

KELLAR: YEAH.

I MEAN, THEA HAS, IF YOU WANT TO LOOK UP THEA DID A WONDERFUL INTERVIEW WITH US.

IT WAS DURING COVID.

SO, SHE WAS IN ONE ROOM AND I WAS IN THE OTHER.

BUT SHE TALKED ABOUT HER SPEECH CALLED WOMEN OF MUSIC HALL, WHERE SHE TALKS ABOUT THE WOMEN WHO WERE IMPORTANT TO THE FOUNDING AND THE PRESERVATION OF MUSIC HALL.

JMR: AND HER GREAT RESEARCH HAS GONE EVEN FURTHER.

I MEAN, THE MOST SIGNIFICANT TALK I THINK SHE'S DONE AND CREATED THIS EXTRAORDINARY TALK CALLED UNDER ONE ROOF ABOUT THE AFRICAN AMERICAN EXPERIENCE IN MUSIC HALL, WHICH IS EXTRAORDINARY.

HER RESEARCH IS JUST AMAZING.

KELLAR: YEAH, I'M FASCINATED WITH RESEARCHERS BECAUSE I LOVE IT.

I LOVE WHAT THEY PULL UP OUT OF BOOKS AND CEMETERIES.

TJEPKEMA: YEAH, YEAH, CEMETERIES.

AND THE UNION NEWSPAPER WAS CINCINNATI'S FIRST BLACK NEWSPAPER AND FINDING NAMES IN THERE AND THEN TRYING TO FIND THOSE NAMES IN MUSIC HALL.

KELLAR: WOW.

TJEPKEMA: AND FINDING OUT THAT A LOT OF VERY PROMINENT COMMUNITY MEMBERS HAVE DONE THINGS IN MUSIC HALL, GIVEN SPEECHES, HELD FUNDRAISING BAZAARS FOR THE AFRICAN AMERICAN ORPHAN ASYLUM.

I MEAN, I FIND A LOT OF THE SIMILAR NAMES IN THE COMMUNITY.

SO MUSIC HALL WAS ALWAYS A COMMUNITY PLACE.

KELLAR: YEAH.

JMR: AND THE MUSICAL HERITAGE, RIGHT?

YOU KNOW.

TJEPKEMA: OH, AND THE MUSIC.

JMR: THE BALLROOM WHERE IT'S PRETTY MUCH THE HISTORY OF AMERICAN JAZZ PLAYED ITSELF OUT IN THE BALLROOM.

I MEAN A WHO'S WHO OF BLACK PERFORMERS WOULD ALWAYS COME TO THE MUSIC HALL BALLROOM CALLED THE GRAYSTONE OR LATER THE TOPPER CLUB.

AND THROUGH THEA'S RESEARCH, IT'S INFORMED SO MANY OF OUR POPS PERFORMANCES AND OUR PERFORMANCES FOR CLASSICAL ROOTS.

I MEAN, SHE'S OUR NUMBER ONE RESEARCHER, LET ME TELL YOU.

RIGHT?

YEAH.

KELLAR: HAS MUSIC HALL, HAVE THEY KEPT GOOD RECORDS THAT YOU CAN LOOK AT?

TJEPKEMA: WELL, A LOT OF THE REALLY, REALLY EARLY PERFORMERS, THERE'S NOT A LOT OF RECORDS.

THERE IS A BIG -- I FOUND AT THE HISTORICAL SOCIETY A GIANT CACHE BOOK WHICH WAS -- STARTS IN LIKE 1879 AND GOES TO LIKE 1895.

AND THAT'S WHERE I FOUND THAT THEY PAID CISSY RITA JONES, THE BLACK PATTI, THEY PAID HER MANAGER, I THINK IT WAS $30.

AND THEN I WAS LIKE, WHO IS THE BLACK PATTI?

KELLAR: SO, THEN YOU HAVE TO FIND OUT.

JMR: WELL, AND OF COURSE, SISSIERETTA JONES IS JUST LIKE THE MOST IMPORTANT BLACK OPERATIC SINGER IN AMERICAN HISTORY.

I MEAN, SHE PERFORMED WITH ANTONIN DVORAK AT CARNEGIE HALL.

SHE HAD THIS GREAT CONCERT AT MADISON SQUARE GARDEN.

AND ONLY A FEW WEEKS AFTER THAT CONCERT IN MADISON SQUARE GARDEN, WHICH IS IN ALL THE HISTORY BOOKS, SHE PERFORMED AT MUSIC HALL.

AND THE THING IS, IS THAT THE CINCINNATI, THE OTHER CINCINNATI NEWSPAPERS USUALLY DIDN'T COVER THESE TYPES OF EVENTS.

AND THIS IS WHY THE BLACK NEWSPAPERS IN TOWN HAVE ALL THE REAL ESSENTIAL INFORMATION THAT WAS IGNORED BY MUCH OF THE MEDIA ESTABLISHMENT OF THE TIME.

TJEPKEMA: AND THIS IS AN EXAMPLE THERE THAT IF I HADN'T LOOKED IN THE CACHE BOOK, THERE WAS NOT AN AD FOR IT IN ANY OF THE NEWSPAPERS.

AND ALL I FOUND WERE REVIEWS TO, LIKE, THE NEXT CITY THAT SHE WENT TO THAT SAID, "GET YOUR TICKETS FAST BECAUSE IT WAS A SELLOUT IN CINCINNATI."

SO, YOU KNOW, YOU FIND ALL THE LITTLE CLUES ANY WAY YOU CAN.

KELLAR: JMR, TELL US A LITTLE BIT ABOUT YOUR BACKGROUND.

JMR: I'M A SON OF THE GREAT MIDWEST.

I WAS BORN IN CLEVELAND AND AS A KID WOULD GO TO CLEVELAND ORCHESTRA CONCERTS ALL THE TIME.

AND IN HIGH SCHOOL I WAS IN A PUBLIC SCHOOL AND WE HAD MUSIC IN EVERY GRADE LEVEL.

I WAS IN BAND, I WAS IN ORCHESTRA, JAZZ ENSEMBLE, MARCHING BAND, BRASS ENSEMBLE.

I DID THE SCHOOL MUSICAL EVERY YEAR IN THE PIT.

AND SO MUSIC WAS ALWAYS VERY, VERY MUCH A PART OF MY LIFE GROWING UP.

BUT I WENT TO COLLEGE IN MASSACHUSETTS.

I DID MY GRADUATE DEGREE IN CALIFORNIA AT UNIVERSITY OF SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA.

I MOVED TO NASHVILLE AND WORKED FOR A COUPLE OF YEARS AT VANDERBILT UNIVERSITY, AND THEN FOUND MY WAY TO SAVANNAH WHERE MY LIFE CHANGED FOREVER.

[CHUCKLES] KELLAR: HOW SOON AFTER YOU MARRIED DID YOU COME BACK TO CINCINNATI?

YOU WANDERED FOR QUITE A WHILE.

JMR: NO, NO, ACTUALLY, WHEN WE MET IN SAVANNAH, WE BOTH MOVED UP TO CINCINNATI.

AND BOTH OF OUR KIDS WERE BORN HERE AND WE MOVED TO CANADA TOGETHER.

AND OF COURSE, IT'S BEEN REALLY THRILLING NOW, IN THE LAST 11 YEARS, 12 YEARS NOW.

KELLAR: HAVE YOU BEEN CONDUCTOR OF THE POPS FOR 11 YEARS?

JMR: THAT'S RIGHT.

I KNOW, TEMPUS FUGIT, EH?

KELLAR: YES, RIGHT.

THAT'S TRUE.

BECAUSE I REMEMBER, YEAH, ABSOLUTELY.

WHEN DID YOU IN YOUR CAREER DID YOU DECIDE YOU WANTED TO BE A CONDUCTOR?

JMR: OH, THAT CAME A KIND OF EARLY ON.

AS A KID, I ATTENDED CLEVELAND ORCHESTRA CONCERTS AND, YOU KNOW, FOR ALL THE FOLKS IN THE -- WHO ARE ORCHESTRA GEEKS, I SAW GEORGE SZELL CONDUCTING MY VERY FIRST CONCERT EVER, THE CLEVELAND ORCHESTRA, DVORAK SYMPHONY NUMBER EIGHT.

AND IN THAT FOURTH MOVEMENT, THERE'S THIS BIG TRUMPET FANFARE THAT STARTS THINGS OFF.

AND AT THAT VERY MOMENT IT WAS LIKE, "I WANT TO DO THIS."

KELLAR: YEAH.

JMR: SO I WAS A TRUMPET PLAYER ALL THROUGH HIGH SCHOOL AND INTO COLLEGE, AND THEN I HAD SOME PHYSICAL PROBLEMS, WHICH MEANT THAT I WAS NOT GOING TO BE ABLE TO CONTINUE WITH TRUMPET.

AND THAT'S WHEN MY STUDIES IN MUSIC HISTORY AND MUSIC THEORY AND MY PRACTICAL KNOWLEDGE FROM PLAYING TRUMPET ALL KIND OF COALESCED.

AND I THOUGHT, "WELL, WHY DON'T I GIVE THIS A SHOT?"

AND SO I STARTED CONDUCTING KIND OF LATE, AS IT WERE, IN MY MID TWENTIES.

AND AT THAT POINT IN TIME, I DECIDED, "WELL, I SHOULD PROBABLY LEARN HOW THE REST OF THE ORCHESTRA FUNCTIONS."

SO AT THE AGE OF 25, I STARTED TAKING SUZUKI VIOLIN LESSONS.

KELLAR: WITH ALL THOSE LITTLE KIDS.

JMR: YEAH, YEAH, WITH ALL THOSE LITTLE KIDS, YOU KNOW, THERE THEY ALL ARE PLAYING MISSISSIPPI HOT DOG AND I'M PLAYING ALONG WITH THEM.

SO IT'S BEEN A GREAT JOURNEY.

AND OF COURSE, THROUGHOUT MOST OF MY CAREER, I'VE KIND OF BEEN THINKING OF MYSELF AS A TRAJECTORY, AS A CLASSICAL CONDUCTOR OF SYMPHONIC WORKS.

AND IT WAS DURING MY TIME AS ASSOCIATE CONDUCTOR, WORKING WITH ERICH AND BEING HERE IN CINCINNATI THAT I STARTED TOYING WITH THE IDEAS OF GOING INTO THE POPS.

AND WHEN I WAS INVITED BACK TO LEAD THE POPS, THAT WAS JUST LIKE, WELL, I'M GOING TO JUMP RIGHT IN.

BUT YOU KNOW WHAT THE POPS IS ALL ABOUT THE PANOPLY OF AMERICAN MUSICAL STYLE.

I MEAN, IT'S GOT IT ALL RIGHT.

KELLAR: RIGHT.

JMR: FROM BLUEGRASS TO JAZZ TO SWING AND R&B AND SOUL AND FUNK AND GOSPEL AND SPIRITUAL.

THIS IS THE MUSIC THAT WE'RE MOST PROUD OF AS AMERICANS.

AND IT'S WHAT WE DO IN PERFORMING WITH THE POPS.

KELLAR: YEAH, WELL, THAT WAS -- I WAS GOING TO ASK YOU, HOW DO YOU FOCUS IN ON WHO YOU WANT AS YOUR GUESTS, AND YOU'RE LOOKING FOR A VARIETY, I'M SURE.

JMR: THAT'S RIGHT.

AND OFTEN TIMES WE'LL GO THROUGH A SEASON AND TO MAKE SURE THAT WE HAVE ALL OF OUR DIFFERENT AMERICAN FOOD GROUPS AS IT WERE, TO MAKE SURE THAT THINGS ARE REPRESENTED.

YOU KNOW, OFTEN TIMES PEOPLE SAY, "WELL, WHY DID THEY CALL IT A POPS ORCHESTRA, RIGHT?"

I MEAN, IT'S THE EXACT SAME ORCHESTRA AS THE CSO, THE EXACT SAME MUSICIANS, EXCEPT THE POPS ORCHESTRA HAS GOT THIS RHYTHM SECTION, RIGHT.

IT'S GOT THE PIANO, DRUMS, BASS, GUITAR.

AND THAT IS WHAT KIND OF PROPELS THE SOUND OF A POPS ORCHESTRA.

BUT IT ALWAYS HAS THIS WORD POPS.

AND, YOU KNOW, PEOPLE THINK OF POPS LIKE POPCORN OR POP SODA.

KELLAR: POPULAR.

JMR: RIGHT?

WELL, IT ACTUALLY COMES FROM THE WORD POPULUS, THE LATIN WORD FOR PEOPLE.

KELLAR: OH, MY GOSH, I DIDN'T KNOW THAT.

JMR: AT THE ESSENCE OF WHAT THE POPS ORCHESTRA IS ABOUT, WHAT THE CINCINNATI POPS IS ABOUT IS IT'S MUSIC OF THE PEOPLE.

IT'S OUR MUSIC.

AND WE SEE MUSICAL HISTORY HERE IN CINCINNATI THAT HAS PLAYED ITSELF OUT, YOU KNOW, FROM THE RIVERBOATS BRINGING DOWN COAL TO STOKE THE INDUSTRIAL REVOLUTION, BRINGING ALSO DOWN MOUNTAIN AND CELTIC MUSIC AND THE MUSIC OF BLACK AMERICA THROUGH SPIRITUALS AND THE BLUES AND JAZZ COMING AND SETTLING HERE IN THE OHIO VALLEY.

THAT THIS IS THE HEART OF AMERICAN MUSIC MAKING.

THIS IS WHERE THAT AMERICAN SOUND COMES FROM.

AND SO WE CELEBRATE THAT WITH EVERY CONCERT.

KELLAR: YOU SUCCEEDED, ERICH.

WAS THERE A POPS CONDUCTOR BEFORE ERICH?

JMR: WELL, ERICH KIND OF INVENTED THE STYLE OF WHAT WE CONSIDER POPS THESE DAYS.

HOWEVER, IF YOU GO WAY, WAY BACK, THIS IS WHERE THEA'S EXCEPTIONAL RESEARCH.

TJEPKEMA: TO THE 1870S IN CINCINNATI.

KELLAR: TO THE 1870S?

TJEPKEMA: YEAH.

KELLAR: DID WE HAVE A POPS?

TJEPKEMA: MICHAEL BRAND, A GERMAN CELLIST.

HE PLAYED WITH THEODORE THOMAS'S ORCHESTRA IN NEW YORK AND CAME HERE ON SEVERAL TOURS OF DUTY WITH THOMAS'S ORCHESTRA AND THEN DECIDED TO START HIS OWN LITTLE POPULAR ORCHESTRA HERE IN CINCINNATI.

KELLAR: HERE IN CINCINNATI?

TJEPKEMA: YEAH.

JMR: WIELERT'S CAFE, AND IT'S STILL THERE ON VINE STREET.

MAD TREE HAS TURNED IT INTO A PLACE CALLED THE ALCOVE.

BUT MICHAEL BRAND AND HIS GRAND ORCHESTRA WOULD GIVE CONCERTS OF POPULAR MUSIC.

YOU KNOW, THEY'D PLAY, YOU KNOW, TCHAIKOVSKY BALLET, YOU KNOW, SCORES OR LITTLE GILBERT AND SULLIVAN OR STRAUSS WALTZES.

AND WHEN THE MAY FESTIVAL, WHEN THEODORE THOMAS WANTED TO CREATE AN ORCHESTRA FOR THE MAY FESTIVAL, HE USED THE PLAYERS FROM MICHAEL BRAND'S ORCHESTRA.

AND WHEN THE ORCHESTRA THEN TRANSFORMED INTO THE CINCINNATI SYMPHONY ORCHESTRA, MOST OF THOSE PLAYERS WERE FROM MICHAEL BRAND'S POPS ORCHESTRA.

SO WE COULD ACTUALLY SAY THAT THE POPS HAS ALWAYS BEEN HERE, AND IT'S PART OF THE ETHOS OF CINCINNATI.

KELLAR: YEAH, I THINK IT WOULD BE.

AND OUR POPS HAS TO BE AT THE TOP OF POPS ORCHESTRAS IN THE COUNTRY.

JMR: OH, ABSOLUTELY.

AND, YOU KNOW, I MEAN, THERE ARE ONLY A HANDFUL OF GREAT POPS ORCHESTRAS: CINCINNATI, BOSTON, NEW YORK POPS, HOLLYWOOD BOWL ORCHESTRA.

AND BUT EVEN AMONGST OUR PEERS, WE'RE FINDING NEW AND EXCITING WAYS TO EXPRESS THIS UNIQUE AMERICAN ART FORM THAT IS JUST SO THRILLING TO DO.

KELLAR: YEAH.

YOU DON'T HAVE EVER HAVE GUEST CONDUCTORS, DO YOU?

YOU DO THEM ALL.

JMR: OH, NO, NO.

KELLAR: OH, YOU DO?

JMR: WE HAVE MANY GUEST CONDUCTORS.

IN FACT, WE HAVE A PRINCIPAL POPS GUEST CONDUCTOR DAMON GUPTON, WHO'S AN EXTRAORDINARY MUSICIAN AND A WONDERFUL CONDUCTOR.

AND IT'S FANTASTIC TO HAVE HIM ON OUR TEAM.

AND THEN WE ALSO HAVE SEVERAL OTHER GUEST CONDUCTORS WHO FILL IN FROM TIME TO TIME, AS WELL AS OUR NEW ASSISTANT CONDUCTORS AS WELL.

SO IT'S A GREAT WAY TO SHARE THE WEALTH AND TO TELL ALL OF THOSE WONDERFUL AMERICAN MUSICAL STORIES IN LOTS OF DIFFERENT WAYS.

KELLAR: WELL, FRANCOIS FERRAR, DID HE WORK WITH YOU OR WAS HE JUST THE CLASSICAL?

HE TOOK PART OF HIS MOTHER'S AND PART OF HIS FATHER'S NAME.

I ASKED HIM -- HE WAS, FOR OUR AUDIENCE, HE WAS THE SON OF JESUS LOPEZ KOBUS.

AND I ASKED HIM WHY HE DIDN'T USE HIS REAL NAME, WHICH WAS CERTAINLY HAVE GOTTEN INTO A LOT OF DOORS.

HE SAID, "BECAUSE I WANTED TO BE MY OWN PERSON."

TJEPKEMA: SOUNDS LIKE OUR CHILDREN.

KELLAR: YES.

IN A GOOD WAY, OR A BAD WAY?

TJEPKEMA: THEY DON'T WANT ANYBODY TO KNOW THEIR DAD.

KELLAR: OH, REALLY?

HOW OLD ARE THEY?

TJEPKEMA: WE HAVE A 23 AND A 21, ALMOST.

KELLAR: ARE THEY BOTH IN SCHOOL?

TJEPKEMA: YEAH, THEY'RE WORKING ON COLLEGE.

KELLAR: DO ANY OF THEM -- WILL THEY FOLLOW IN YOUR FOOTSTEPS?

JMR: WELL, BOTH OF THEM, YOU KNOW, TOOK LESSONS WHEN THEY WERE KIDS.

OUR SON IS LOOKING FOR A DEGREE IN RECORDING ARTS, SO, YOU KNOW, IT'S GOT A LITTLE BIT OF IT.

OUR DAUGHTER, ALTHOUGH SHE TOOK PIANO LESSONS FOR MANY YEARS, SHE WAS ALSO VERY MUCH INTO ROWING.

AND SO THAT'S KIND OF WHERE SHE WENT.

AND WE READ ONE OF MY FAVORITE BOOKS, THE BOYS AND THE BOAT.

AND IT TELLS A LOT ABOUT HOW COMPETITIVE ROWING, THERE'S A MUSIC, THERE'S A RHYTHM TO IT THAT IS VERY MUSICAL.

AND SO IT'S BEEN KIND OF EXCITING TO KIND OF SEE HER TO USE THOSE MUSICAL SKILLS IN A DIFFERENT WAY.

TJEPKEMA: SHE'S SUPER MATHEMATICAL.

SHE'S A MATH BRAIN GIRL.

AND, YOU KNOW, I DON'T KNOW HOW MUCH OF IT IS NATURE OR NURTURE FROM PIANO LESSONS, BUT YOU GET A LOT OF MATH FROM PIANO.

KELLAR: SO YOU WENT TO A LOT OF ROWING EVENTS?

TJEPKEMA: OH, YES.

YEAH.

KELLAR: I ALWAYS WONDERED ABOUT THAT BECAUSE I HAD A -- WELL, I HAD TWO -- A DAUGHTER AND GRANDDAUGHTER WHO WERE DANCERS, SO THEY WERE WITH THE BALLET.

I WENT TO EVERY NUTCRACKER.

IN THE ORIGINAL DAYS, THEY HAD AS MANY AS 16 PERFORMANCES AND THEY DID NOT SPLIT THE CAST.

EVERY CHILD WAS IN EVERY PERFORMANCE, AND I WAS THERE IN THE FRONT ROW FOR, GOD, I DON'T REMEMBER HOW MANY YEARS.

SO I COULD HAVE FILLED IN IF ANYBODY FALTERED THAT.

JMR: BUT WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT EXPERIENCES LIKE THESE, I MEAN, THIS IS WHAT'S SO SPECIAL ABOUT CINCINNATI AND MUSIC HALL.

KELLAR: YEAH.

JMR: YOU KNOW, I MEAN, HOW MANY CITIES CAN SUPPORT, YOU KNOW, A SPECTACULAR ORCHESTRA, GREAT OPERA COMPANY, AN INCREDIBLE BALLET, A CHORUS LIKE THE MAY FESTIVAL AND A MUSICAL COMMUNITY THAT IS SO VIBRANT BUT ALSO SO MUCH GEARED TO ENGAGING THE NEXT GENERATION IN CONCERTS.

KELLAR: ABSOLUTELY.

JMR: AND I REMEMBER AS ASSOCIATE CONDUCTOR PUTTING TOGETHER CONCERTS FOR OUR LOLLIPOP FAMILY CONCERTS AND EDUCATION CONCERTS.

AND WHEN OUR KIDS WERE YOUNGER ESPECIALLY, WE KIND OF KNEW WHAT SORT OF THINGS WOULD FLIP SWITCHES.

SO THEA ESPECIALLY, YOU KNOW, I'D COME BACK FROM WORK AND SHE'D SAY, "OH, JOHN, I'VE GOT A CONCERT FOR YOU."

AND SHE START HELPING ME PLAN -- TJEPKEMA: ANYTHING THOMAS THE TANK ENGINE.

KELLAR: THAT'S RIGHT.

JMR: AND HELPED PUT TOGETHER PROGRAMS THAT KIDS REALLY GOT.

AND I THINK ABOUT THOSE WONDERFUL EXPERIENCES FOR KIDS GROWING UP IN CINCINNATI AND I'VE GOT TO SAY, "CINCINNATI, GET OUT THERE, GET YOUR KIDS INVOLVED WITH ALL THE FANTASTIC ARTS COMMUNITY THAT WE HAVE HERE, BECAUSE IT REALLY IS SPECIAL."

KELLAR: YEAH, THE BALLET ORCHESTRA IS THE CINCINNATI SYMPHONY ORCHESTRA.

JMR: THAT'S RIGHT.

KELLAR: AND BEFORE THAT, THE MUSIC WAS FINE, IT WAS GREAT.

BUT WHEN WE GOT THE SYMPHONY, THE DIFFERENCE, OH, MY GOODNESS.

THE DIFFERENCE WAS -- IT WAS JUST THRILLING.

AND I'll MAKE NOTE TO OUR LISTENERS THAT LIESL NIPPERT MADE THAT POSSIBLE.

JMR: THAT'S RIGHT.

KELLAR: BECAUSE SHE LEFT ENOUGH MONEY FOR THE OTHER OPERA, TOO.

I DIDN'T -- JMR: OH, YES, ABSOLUTELY.

KELLAR: THE OPERA, BALLET TO HAVE THE CINCINNATI SYMPHONY ORCHESTRA.

AS LARRY SAYS, THE CINCINNATI BALLET HAS THE GREATEST PIT ORCHESTRA.

JMR: WELL, AND INDEED, FOR THE MUSICIANS, IT'S REALLY FANTASTIC BECAUSE THERE HAVE BEEN SO MANY PLAYERS.

WE TALK ABOUT THE SORT OF SUCH BACKSTAGE, HOW COOL IT IS FOR THEM TO PLAY SUCH A WIDE VARIETY OF MUSICAL STYLES, YOU KNOW, FROM OPERA DURING THE SUMMER AND POPS, AND OF COURSE, BALLET AND THEN ALL OF THE SYMPHONIC WORKS AS WELL, THE GREAT SYMPHONIC WORKS.

AND SO, YOU KNOW, IT'S ALWAYS FRESH, IT'S ALWAYS NEW.

THERE'S ALWAYS SO MUCH NEW REPERTOIRE BEING PERFORMED.

THIS IS A REAL EXCITING TIME TO BE WITH THE CINCINNATI SYMPHONY AND THE POPS.

KELLAR: YEAH, IT'S IMPORTANT.

A GOAL IS TO KEEP THE SYMPHONY OR THE BALLET OR WHATEVER ORCHESTRA THE WHOLE YEAR, RIGHT?

BECAUSE INSTEAD OF HAVING A THREE MONTH HIATUS IN THE SUMMER OR -- AND THE ORCHESTRA, I GUESS BEFORE WE PLAYED AT RIVERBEND DID NOT PLAY IN THE SUMMER.

JMR: THAT'S RIGHT.

KELLAR: SO AND YOU AND THAT WAS PART OF WHAT LIESL WANTED WAS THOSE ORGANIZATIONS TO BE ABLE TO PERFORM ALL YEAR AND GET PAID ALL YEAR.

JMR: AND IT REALLY MAKES A DIFFERENCE BECAUSE IT MAKES THAT THAT VIBRANT COMMUNITY NOT ONLY TO HAVE FULL TIME MUSICIANS AND DANCERS AND SINGERS AND ARTISTS TO BE LIVING HERE IN TOWN, BUT ALSO TO PROVIDE RESOURCES FOR THE NEXT GENERATION OF MUSICIANS AND DANCERS WHO CAN LEARN FROM THE BEST AND TO BE PART OF THIS COMMUNITY.

AND YOU KNOW, I ALWAYS LIKE WHAT SUZUKI, HE WAS A GREAT VIOLIN PEDAGOGUE.

AND I THINK THIS APPLIES TO ALL THE ARTS, YOU KNOW, HE SAID, "I DON'T TEACH MUSIC TO CREATE GREAT MUSICIANS BECAUSE GREAT MUSICIANS WILL ALWAYS FIND THEIR OWN WAY.

I TEACH MUSIC TO CREATE GOOD CITIZENS."

AND I THINK THIS APPLIES FOR ALL OF THE ARTS AND WHY IT'S SO IMPORTANT AND WHY CINCINNATI HAS EMBRACED THE ARTS IN SUCH A PROFOUND WAY.

IT'S BECAUSE IT CREATES GOOD CITIZENS.

PEOPLE LEARN EMPATHY AND TEAMWORK AND SELF DISCIPLINE.

AND THESE ARE THINGS THAT MAKES OUR COMMUNITY, THAT MAKE OUR COMMUNITY STRONGER.

KELLAR: YEAH, THERE ARE STATISTICS THAT SHOW, WHICH WE WOULD KNOW INNATELY, THAT CHILDREN WHO ARE INVOLVED IN THE ARTS SUCCEED AT A GREATER STRENGTH THAN THOSE WHO ARE NOT.

JMR: ABSOLUTELY.

KELLAR: AND THEA, TELL ME, DO YOU HAVE ANY PROJECTS IN THE WORKS?

TJEPKEMA: WELL, I'M ON THE CINCINNATI PRESERVATION ASSOCIATION BOARD AND STILL CONTINUING RESEARCH ON AFRICAN-AMERICANS IN CINCINNATI.

AND THEY HAVE A WONDERFUL WEBSITE NOW, AN APP CALLED BLACK SITES AND STORIES.

SO I'M NOT ONLY RESEARCHING, BUT I'M FINDING OUT WHERE THESE PEOPLE LIVED OR WHERE THEIR OFFICE WAS OR WHERE THEIR STORE WAS LOCATED.

SO YOU CAN GO ON THE MAP AND IT HAS PINS DROPPED SO YOU CAN SEE WHERE EVERYBODY WAS IN THE CITY.

KELLAR: DO YOU HAVE ANY GOALS THAT YOU WANT TO ACHIEVE, JMR?

JMR: WELL, BABY, TELL US ABOUT THE CRESTING.

TJEPKEMA: WELL, YEAH, THAT'S A LONG RANGE GOAL IS TO RESTORE THE METAL ORNAMENTATION ON THE ROOF.

I KNOW YOU'VE PROBABLY SEEN -- JMR: OF MUSIC HALL.

TJEPKEMA: YEAH.

HAVE YOU SEEN -- HAVE YOU NOTICED THE FINIALS?

THE FINIALS ARE BACK.

THEY'RE ALL -- THEY WERE HAND-CARVED SANDSTONE, AND NOW THEY'RE REPLACED WITH GFRC, GLASS FIBER REINFORCED CONCRETE.

BUT THE REST OF THE ROOF, EVERY RIDGE AND EVERY GABLE HAD METAL ORNAMENTATION, DECORATIVE METAL OR CRESTING ALONG THE ROOF AND PINNACLES.

AND ON THE MAIN GABLE WERE TWO 12 FOOT TALL LYRES.

KELLAR: OH, MY GOSH.

JMR: STUNNING.

KELLAR: STUNNING.

WELL, I LOVE TALKING TO YOU GUYS, BUT YOU'LL HAVE TO COME BACK.

JMR: OH, ABSOLUTELY.

KELLAR: TIME IS TIME, AND WE HAVE TO SAY GOODBYE.

THANK YOU, THEA.

THANK YOU, JMR.

YOU'RE JUST PART OF WHAT MAKES THE QUEEN CITY, QUEEN AND KING.

YOU'RE GREAT.

[ LAUGHTER ] YEAH.

WE'LL SEE YOU BOTH IN MUSIC HALL AND OTHER PLACES.

JMR: RIGHT.

TJEPKEMA: YES.

KELLAR: THANKS.

ANNOUNCER: JOIN US NEXT WEEK FOR ANOTHER EPISODE OF SHOWCASE WITH BARBARA KELLAR RIGHT HERE ON CET.

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