>>> MAJOR FUNDING FOR REPORTERS ROUND TABLE WITH DAVID CRUZ IS PROVIDED BY NEW JERSEY REALTORS, THE VOICE FOR REAL ESTATE IN NEW JERSEY.

MORE INFORMATION IS ONLINE AT NJREALTOR.COM.

RJW BARNABUS HEALTH.

AND BY NJ SERVICE GROUP SERVING NEW JERSEY BUSINESSES FOR MORE THAN 100 YEARS.

PROMOTIONAL SUPPORT IS PROVIDED BY NEW JERSEY BUSINESS MAGAZINE, THE MAGAZINE OF THE NEW JERSEY BUSINESS AND INDUSTRY ASSOCIATION, REPORTING TO EXECUTIVE AND LEGISLATIVE LEADERS IN ALL 21 COUNTIES OF THE GARDEN STATE SINCE 1954.

>>> HI, EVERYBODY.

IT'S REPORTERS ROUNDTABLE.

I'M DAVID CRUZ.

HAPPY TO BE BACK WITH YOU.

THE LAST TIME I SAW OUR GUEST, I WAS HOLDING A MICROPHONE FOR HER DURING A RADIO INTERVIEW AT BIRDLAND IN MANHATTAN.

IT WAS ONE OF THE FEW TIMES THAT I'VE EVER WORKED AS A RADIO FIELD PRODUCER.

AND IN RETROSPECT, IT WAS THE ONLY TIME I'VE EVER BEEN INVOLVED IN AN INTERVIEW WHERE THE ENTIRE PRODUCTION TEAM AND THE SUBJECT WERE ALL LATINO.

THERE IS A DEARTH OF US IN THIS BUSINESS AND MARIA HINOJOSA IS PRESIDENT AND FOUNDER -- EXECUTIVE PRODUCER OF LATINO USA AND AUTHOR OF "ONCE I WAS YOU, A MEMOIR OF LOVE AND HATE IN A TORN AMERICA."

IT IS A PLEASURE TO WELCOME MARIA TO REPORTERS ROUNDTABLE.

>> HEY, DAVID, IT'S GOOD TO BE WITH YOU.

WHAT'S UP, WHAT'S UP, WHAT'S UP, NEW JERSEY?

SAME, A LOT OF LOVE FOR NEW JERSEY.

>> SO YOUR BOOK BEGINS WITH THE STORY OF YOUR ENCOUNTER WITH A LITTLE GIRL IN AN AIRPORT IN McALLEN, TEXAS.

SHE WAS PART OF A GROUP OF KIDS JUST ARRIVING IN THE STATES.

THAT WAS 2019.

BUT YOU HAVE BEEN COVERING IMMIGRATION FOR YOUR ENTIRE PROFESSIONAL CAREER AND HAD SEEN THAT MOVIE BEFORE MANY TIMES, NO?

>> SO HERE'S THE THING, DAVID.

I WROTE "ONCE I WAS YOU" AND IT WAS HARD BECAUSE I WASN'T EVEN PLANNING ON WRITING THE BOOK.

I FEEL LIKE A LOT OF THINGS HAPPENED DURING THE LAST PRESIDENTIAL ADMINISTRATION THAT WERE VERY DIFFICULT, BUT THERE WERE ALSO SOME THINGS THAT HAPPENED AS A RESULT OF IT THAT WERE GIFTS.

"ONCE I WAS YOU" IS THAT.

I DON'T KNOW IF I WOULD HAVE WRITTEN THIS BOOK HAD IT NOT BEEN FOR THE CIRCUMSTANCES THAT WE WERE LIVING THROUGH IN THE LAST ADMINISTRATION.

SO I FINISHED THE BOOK, HAND IT IN TO MY EDITOR, WHO, BY THE WAY, IS THAT A LATINA, PROUD MEXICANA IRISH FROM CHICAGO.

AND SHE SAYS, OKAY, NOW GO BACK AND WRITE THE INTRODUCTION.

I WAS LIKE WRITE THE INTRODUCTION?

I ALREADY WROTE THE BOOK, AREN'T WE DONE?

AND SANDRA CISNEROS, THE GREAT AMERICAN WRITER, TOLD ME TO WRITE NOT JUST ABOUT WHAT YOU REMEMBER BUT WRITE ABOUT WHAT YOU WISH YOU COULD FORGET.

AND THAT SCENE IN THE AIRPORT IN McALLEN IS A SCENE THAT I WISH I COULD FORGET.

IT'S A LITTLE GIRL WHO FOR ALL INTENTS AND PURPOSES BEING TRAFFICKED BY PEOPLE BEING PAID BY THE U.S. GOVERNMENT.

I USE THESE TERMS BECAUSE THEY ARE SHOCKING, BUT IT IS IN FACT WHAT'S HAPPENING.

THESE CHILDREN DID NOT HAVE THEIR PASSPORTS OR ANY IDENTIFICATION.

THEY DID NOT KNOW WHERE THEY WERE GOING.

THEY DID NOT KNOW WHO WAS TAKING THEM.

THEY HAD BEEN TOLD THAT THEY COULD NOT SPEAK TO ANYBODY.

THOSE ARE THE DEFINITION OF PEOPLE WHO ARE BEING TRAFFICKED.

AND SO I HAVE THIS ENCOUNTER AND I START THE BOOK BECAUSE IT'S REALLY ABOUT FINDING OUR COMMON HUMANITY.

THAT'S THE TITLE OF THE BOOK, "ONCE I WAS YOU."

IN MANY WAYS IT'S TRYING TO SAY IN SOME WAYS ONCE I WAS THIS LITTLE GIRL.

I DON'T WANT TO REVEAL TOO MUCH, BUT SOMETHING IS REVEALED IN THIS BOOK THAT TURNS OUT I COULD HAVE BEEN ONE OF THOSE CHILDREN WHO HAD BEEN TAKEN FROM THEIR PARENT WHEN I ARRIVED WITH PRIVILEGE, WITH A GREEN CARD.

AND SO PART OF THE MESSAGE IS WE ARE IN THIS.

YOU KNOW, AMERICANS ARE TIED TOGETHER.

ONCE I WAS YOU, ONCE YOU WERE ME, CAN WE BEGIN TO SEE OURSELVES IN EACH OTHER?

THAT IS ALSO A DEEPY LY CENTRAL PART OF OUR IMMIGRATION STORY IN THIS COUNTRY.

>> HERE WE ARE AGAIN, NEW ADMINISTRATION.

PERHAPS KINDER, GENTLER RHETORIC, BUT STILL HUNDREDS OF KIDS AGAIN ALONE AT THE BORDER IN WHAT YOU CALL CONCENTRATION CAMPS.

ANY DIFFERENCE IN THE BORDER SITUATION NOW?

>> WELL, LOOK, THE BIDEN ADMINISTRATION, JOE BIDEN, HE KNEW WHAT WAS GOING TO HAPPEN.

WHY?

BECAUSE CHILDREN COMING, REFUGEE CHILDREN, DESPERATE PEOPLE HAVE BEEN, SPECIFICALLY REFUGEE CHILDREN, HAVE BEEN ON THE UPTICK SINCE THE LATE 1990s.

SO IT'S NOT LIKE THEY CAN ALL OF A SUDDEN BE JUST LIKE OH, MY GOSH, WHAT HAPPENED HERE?

THEY SHOULD HAVE BEEN BETTER PREPARED.

BUT I TALK ABOUT CHANGING THE NARRATIVE, DAVID.

I TALK ABOUT WHY IS IT THAT THE ADMINISTRATION CONTINUES TO SAY THINGS LIKE DON'T COME TO THIS COUNTRY.

THIS IS NOT NECESSARILY A GOOD TIME TO COME.

THAT IS SO INAPPROPRIATE AND INSENSITIVE TO SAY TO SOMEBODY WHO IS A REFUGEE.

DO YOU UNDERSTAND THAT WOULD BE LIKE SAYING TO SOMEBODY WHO WAS ESCAPING NAZI GERMANY, YOU KNOW WHAT, DON'T COME RIGHT NOW.

IT'S NOT A GOOD TIME FOR OUR BORDERS.

NO, NO, NO, NO, NO.

THESE ARE REFUGEES AND WE NEED TO SEE THEM AS SUCH.

ALSO, I'VE REALLY PUSHED, DAVID, I MEAN I KNOW PEOPLE THINK THAT I'M SOUNDING EXTREME, AND WE'RE LOOKING AT THESE PICTURES.

JOE BIDEN SHOULD BE THERE WELCOMING THEM.

HE SHOULD BE THERE SAYING I SEE YOU.

I SEE THAT YOU ARE NOT A THREAT TO THIS COUNTRY.

I SEE THAT YOU ONLY WANT TO BRING THE BEST OF YOURSELF.

AND YOU KNOW WHAT, ALL OF THESE PEOPLE WILL GLADLY REGISTER, GET INTO LINE, WHATEVER.

THERE IS NO LINE PER SE.

YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT PEOPLE WHO ARE DESPERATE.

SO THE FRAMING OF THE CONVERSATION NEEDS TO BE CHANGED.

AND WE, ALL OF US, THE PEOPLE OF NEW JERSEY, THOSE OF US IN NEW YORK, WE HAVE TO SEE THEM AS OUR BROTHERS AND SISTERS.

HELLO.

ISN'T THE STATUE OF LIBERTY JUST KIND OF DOWN THE STREET FROM US?

WE HAVE TO EMBODY THAT IN THIS MOMENT HISTORICALLY, AND THAT'S KIND OF WHAT I WISH THIS ADMINISTRATION WOULD UNDERSTAND.

IT'S LIKE IT'S THEIR MOMENT TO CHANGE THE NARRATIVE ENTIRELY.

AND BY THE WAY, JUST TO END, NOT EVERYBODY WANTS TO COME TO THIS COUNTRY, OKAY?

YOU'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT 3 MILLION, 5 MILLION PEOPLE, HALF A MILLION.

YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT A FEW THOUSAND PEOPLE.

SO UNDERSTAND THAT NOT EVERYBODY WANTS TO BE HERE.

BUT THOSE WHO ARE MAKING THIS TREK, THOSE ARE THE SURVIVORS.

I WANT TO MEET THEM.

I WANT THEM HERE.

I WANT THEM TO HELP BUILD UP OUR COUNTRY.

>> I WANT TO TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT YOUR CAREER IN THE FEW MINUTES WE HAVE LEFT.

YOU WORKED ALL OVER THE COUNTRY.

I WONDER WHAT IT WAS LIKE IN THE NEWSROOM AS A LATINA TRYING TO TELL STORIES ABOUT MARGINALIZED PEOPLE.

I MEAN I LIVED MY JOURNALISTIC CAREER IN SO-CALLED PROGRESSIVE NEW JERSEY IN SUPPOSEDLY PROGRESSIVE PUBLIC MEDIA, AND I HAVE FELT A THOUSAND SMALL CUTS OF RACISM, BUT ALSO OF INDIFFERENCE.

I ONCE HAD A PRODUCER TELL ME THAT PEOPLE WITH ACCENTS ARE HARD TO UNDERSTAND SO WE SHOULDN'T INTERVIEW THEM.

I MEAN NEWSROOMS ARE GETTING A LITTLE MORE DIVERSE, BUT THAT DOESN'T JUST HAPPEN, RIGHT?

IT TAKES A HUNDRED UNCOMFORTABLE CONVERSATIONS WITH PEOPLE WHO DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY IT'S IMPORTANT TO HAVE A DIVERSE NEWSROOM.

>> LOOK, YOU KNOW, THE PROBLEM IS, IS THAT THERE'S -- AND I'M SO SORRY THAT YOU'VE HAD TO GO THROUGH THAT.

YOU KNOW, YOU AND I, DAVID, WE DON'T HAVE TO BE -- WE LOVE WHAT WE DO.

WE'RE JOURNALISTS, WE LOVE THIS, BUT WE SHOULDN'T HAVE TO BE WARRIORS IN ORDER TO BE LATINO AND LATINA JOURNALISTS IN THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.

YES, I TRACE MY ROOTS BACK AS AN AMERICAN JOURNALIST TO MY FOUNDING FATHER, FREDERICK DOUGLAS, WHO WAS THE EDITOR AND PUBLISHER OF THE NORTH STAR BUT WHO WAS BORN INTO SLAVERY.

HE IS MY FOUNDING FATHER AS AN AMERICAN JOURNALIST AND THAT'S WHAT ALLOWS ME TO CENTER MYSELF.

I DIDN'T HAVE THAT ANALYSIS AS A YOUNG WOMAN WHEN I WAS THE FIRST LATINA AT NPR AND THE FIRST LATINA CORRESPONDENT AT NPR, THE FIRST LATINA CORRESPONDENT AT CNN AND PBS.

AND NOW I CREATED MY OWN COMPANY, AND I'M THE FIRST LATINA TO RUN A NATIONAL NONPROFIT INDEPENDENT NEWSROOM BASED OUT OF HARLEM HERE IN NEW YORK.

SO HERE'S THE THING.

THE REASON WHY I WANT MORE PEOPLE TO BECOME JOURNALISTS AT LARGE, TO BECOME JOURNALISTS OF CONSCIENCE, AND THOSE OF YOU WHO ARE LATINO OR LATINA JOURNALISTS OF COLOR, DO THIS WORK.

WE NEED YOU.

THIS IS YOUR CIVIC DUTY.

IF YOU HAVE A PASSION FOR JOURNALISM THE WAY DAVID AND I DO, YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE TO WITHSTAND THOSE HUNDRED CUTS OR THOUSAND CUTS NO MATTER WHERE YOU ARE.

WE NEED YOU AS JOURNALISTS BRINGING YOUR WHOLE SELF INTO THE NEWSROOM BECAUSE YOU KNOW WHAT, OUR COUNTRY IS GOING TO BE THE BETTER FOR IT.

WHEN WE DON'T HAVE REPRESENTATIVE MEDIA, OR BOOK PUBLISHERS, PUBLIC RADIO, INDEPENDENT, ALL OF US SUFFER.

IT'S NOT EXCELLENT JOURNALISM WHEN IT IS NOT TRULY REPRESENTATIVE.

>> ALL RIGHT, MARIA HINOJOSA, THE BOOK IS "ONCE I WAS YOU, A MEMOIR OF LOVE AND HATE IN A TORN AMERICA."

OF COURSE LATINA USA CONTINUES ON WNYC EVERY WEEK.

GREAT TO SEE YOU AGAIN.

THANKS FOR TAKING A FEW MINUTES WITH US.

>> THANK YOU, ALL.

>>> ALL RIGHT, LET'S BRING OUR PANEL IN HERE.

STACY IS THE STATEHOUSE REPORTER FOR "THE RECORD," USA TODAY NETWORK.

SAM SUTTON IS HEALTH REPORTER FOR POLITICO AND JNJ SHAWN SULLIVAN.

WE HEARD FROM MARIA HINOJOSA WHO'S BEEN COVERING MEDIA FOR DECADES.

THIS WEEK ADVOCATES RAISED THE VOLUME AGAIN.

SEVERAL UNDOCUMENTED WORKERS STARTING A HUNGER STRIKE OUTSIDE THE STATEHOUSE WHILE THE BUDGET HEARINGS GOT UNDER WAY.

THEY WANT THE STATE TO PROVIDE SOME KIND OF FINANCIAL ASSISTANCE.

MANY OF THE FOLKS HAVE BEEN OUT OF WORK FOR A YEAR.

THEY DON'T QUALIFY FOR UNEMPLOYMENT, LET ALONE ANY KIND OF STIMULUS CHECKS BECAUSE OF THEIR STATUS.

STACY, THE GOVERNOR SAYS HE WANTS TO TRY TO HELP, BUT SOME LAWMAKERS SAY CITIZENS NEED HELP FIRST.

WHAT ARE THE ADVOCATES SAYING?

>> WELL, THE ADVOCATES ARE POINTING OUT THAT THESE FAMILIES ARE WORKING FAMILIES HERE IN NEW JERSEY.

THEY SUPPORT THE NEW JERSEY ECONOMY, AND THEY HAVE BEEN LARGELY LEFT OUT OF THE BENEFITS OF THE RECENT STIMULUS PACKAGES.

YOU KNOW, WHILE OTHERS GOT THREE CHECKS TO HELP THEM KEEP THEIR FAMILIES AND THEIR BUDGETS AFLOAT DURING THE CORONAVIRUS PANDEMIC, A LOT OF UNDOCUMENTED FAMILIES DID NOT GET THOSE BENEFITS.

THEY ALSO POINT TO THERE WAS A RECENT AGREEMENT IN NEW YORK, THAT NEW YORK WOULD PUT $2 BILLION IN ITS BUDGET TO HELP SUPPORT THESE UNDOCUMENTED WORKING FAMILIES THAT HAVE NOT SEEN THE BENEFITS OF THE FEDERAL STIMULUS.

>> ANY SENSE THAT LAWMAKERS ARE INCLINED TO DO THAT HERE IN JERSEY?

>> WELL, I THINK, YOU KNOW, WE SAW THE LATINO CAUCUS PUSH FOR THIS THIS WEEK, ESPECIALLY, BUT WE'RE SORT OF IN THE MIDDLE OF THIS BUDGET DECISION-MAKING THAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN OVER THE NEXT -- THE NEXT COUPLE OF MONTHS.

SO IT REALLY WILL BE UP TO THE LEGISLATURE TO SEE WHAT THEY PUT IN THEIR FINAL BUDGET BILL.

>> ALL RIGHT.

LET'S GET INTO THESE BUDGETS HEARINGS.

I I THINK THE HEADLINE OF THE WEEK WAS LAWMAKERS PUSHING BACK AGAINST THIS $4 MILLION THE GOVERNOR BORROWED IN ANTICIPATION OF BUDGET DEFICITS THAT I GUESS NEVER CAME.

THE STATE IS EVIDENTLY FLUSH WITH CASH AND THEY DON'T NEED THE MONEY.

WHAT'S THIS ALL ABOUT, SAM?

>> YEAH.

I THINK THAT OLS EARLIER THIS WEEK CAME IN AND SAID REVENUE PROJECTIONS ARE GOING TO BE $550 MILLION GREATER THAN WHAT TREASURY HAD SAID A FEW MONTHS BEFORE.

I THINK THAT ON ONE HAND, YES, THAT IS A SIGN OF THE STATE'S BALANCE SHEET IS MUCH HEALTHIER THAN FOLKS MAY HAVE THOUGHT SIX TO EIGHT MONTHS AGO, BUT I DID FIND IT INTERESTING THAT BOTH THE GOVERNOR AND THE TREASURER REPEATEDLY POINTED OUT THAT THERE WAS TREMENDOUS UNCERTAINTY AT THE TIME THIS MONEY WAS BORROWED IN NOVEMBER.

I ALSO FOUND IT INTERESTING THAT EVEN THOUGH OLS WAS SAYING THAT OUR BALANCE SHEET LOOKS A LOT BETTER THAN EVERYONE THOUGHT, YOU KNOW, BARRING CHANGES, NEW JERSEY COULD BE STARING AT A FISCAL CLIFF SOMEWHERE TWO OR THREE YEARS DOWN THE LINE.

LOOK, THIS IS ABOVE MY PAY GRADE BUT REVENUES ARE GREATER THAN WHAT WE EXPECTED BUT THE ECONOMY HAS A LOT OF CASH AND LOW INTEREST RATES FLOATING AROUND AND I THINK THAT'S ALLOWED PEOPLE TO PAPER OVER SOME OF THE VERY OBVIOUS CRACKS THAT ARE IN OUR ECONOMIC SYSTEM RIGHT NOW.

COMMERCIAL REAL ESTATE ISN'T LOOKING GREAT.

THERE'S A LOT WRITTEN ABOUT EVICTIONS AND THE WAVE OF EVICTIONS THAT WILL BE COMING SOON.

WE JUST SPENT TIME TALKING ABOUT THE LACK OF AID PROVIDED TO UNDOCUMENTED POPULATIONS.

AUTO LOANS ARE LOOKING REALLY BAD.

THERE'S A LOT MORE MONEY THAN EVERYONE THOUGHT, BUT THERE'S ALSO A LOT MORE UNCERTAINTY THAN FOLKS THOUGHT AT THIS POINT LAST YEAR.

>> YEAH, REALITY CHECK ON THE WAY.

$4 BILLION IS CHUMP CHANGE, THOUGH, WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT THE $2 TRILLION PLUS THE PRESIDENT WANTS TO SPEND FOR INFRASTRUCTURE, BUT HE'S GETTING PUSHBACK FROM HIS OWN PARTY.

SOME DEMOCRATS SAY THEY WANT THE S.A.L.T.

DEDUCTION RESTORED.

50-50 SENATE.

SUDDENLY EVERY DEMOCRAT HAS THE POWER TO DERAIL A BILL.

WH WHAT'S THE S.A.L.T.

DEDUCTION THING ABOUT.

HOW ABOUT IT, STACY?

>> YEAH, SO THE PRESIDENT WANTS TO SPEND $2 TRILLION TO FIX INFRASTRUCTURE ACROSS THE COUNTRY, THINGS LIKE LEAD PIPES WHICH ARE CERTAINLY A PROBLEM HERE IN NEW JERSEY, BRIDGES, TUNNELS.

BUT WE'VE SEEN THIS S.A.L.T.

DEDUCTION, WHICH IN CASE FOLKS DON'T KNOW WHAT IT IS, IN 2017 THERE WAS A CAP PUT IN PLACE THAT SAID YOU COULD ONLY DEDUCT $10,000 FROM YOUR TAXES.

YOUR FEDERAL TAXES, FOR STATE AND LOCAL TAXES.

IT REALLY MATTERS IN STATES LIKE NEW JERSEY BECAUSE WE HAVE SUCH HIGH PROPERTY TAXES.

BUT THERE ARE SOME LAWMAKERS, CONGRESSMAN JOSH GOTTHEIMER ARE SAYING THEY WON'T SUPPORT THE PRESIDENT'S INFRASTRUCTURE PLAN UNLESS IT INCLUDES A S.A.L.T.

CAP REPEAL.

THEY'RE OF COURSE BOTH DEMOCRATS AND WE'LL SEE OVER THE NEXT COUPLE OF MONTHS AS CONGRESS STARTS VESTING THIS INFRASTRUCTURE PLAN WHAT ACTUALLY COMES TO BE.

>> IT REMINDS ME OF THE EARLY DAYS OF THE OBAMA ADMINISTRATION WHEN THEY WERE TALKING ABOUT HEALTH CARE REFORM AND THEN SUDDENLY ALL THESE DEMOCRATS STARTED TO FEEL THEIR OATS AND ALMOST DERAILED THAT WHOLE THING.

LET'S SEE IF THAT HAPPENS WITH THIS INFRASTRUCTURE BILL.

ALL RIGHT, OTHER NEWS OF THE WEEK, SEAN, THE ATTORNEY GENERAL'S OFFICE LAUNCHED AN ONLINE PORTAL ON THE USE OF FORCE BY POLICE IN THE STATE.

KUDOS TO YOU AND YOUR COLLEAGUES.

YOUR REPORTING WAS THE IMPETUS FOR ALL OF THIS.

THAT'S GOT TO FEEL PRETTY GOOD.

TELL US ABOUT THE PORTAL AND WHAT IMPACT IT MIGHT HAVE AND WHETHER OR NOT YOU'VE CHECKED IT OUT THIS WEEK.

>> YES.

SO THE PORTAL AIMS TO BE KIND OF A COMPENDIUM OF USE OF FORCE FROM OFFICERS IN THE STATE.

THAT COULD BE A COMPLIANCE HOLD TO AN OFFICER FATALLY SHOOTING A SUSPECT OF THE AND SO THERE'S QUITE A CONTINUUM THERE.

AND, YOU KNOW, WE A COUPLE YEARS AGO UNDERTOOK THE MASSIVE TASK OF TURNING WHAT USED TO BE PAPER RECORDS INTO A DATABASE AND FOUND SOME PRETTY TROUBLING RACIAL DISPARITIES AND ALSO SOME SERIOUS OUTLIERS IN TERMS OF WHICH POLICE OFFICERS ARE USING FORCE.

AND SO LOOKING AT THE A.G.'S DATA, A LOT OF THOSE PROBLEMS SEEM TO PERSIST.

THIS IS A SMALL WINDOW.

WE LOOKED AT FIVE YEARS OF DATA.

RIGHT NOW THE PORTAL IS UP AND RUNNING WITH JUST FIVE MONTHS OF DATA, AND SO THAT'S A LITTLE BIT OF A NARROWER SNAPSHOT, BUT YOU'RE STILL SEEING WIDESPREAD RACIAL DISPARITIES.

YOU KNOW, ANOTHER TROUBLING THING IS JUST, YOU KNOW, WE HAD SUSPECTED THAT A LOT OF POLICE CALLS HAD TO DO -- THAT ENDED UP WITH USE OF FORCE HAD TO DO WITH WHAT WE CALL EMOTIONALLY DISTURBED PERSONS, PEOPLE EXPERIENCING MENTAL HEALTH CRISES, BUT ACTUALLY WE WEREN'T ABLE TO QUANTIFY THAT BECAUSE THE FORMS NEVER USED TO RECORD THAT INFORMATION.

NOW THEY DO, AND IT IS STAGGERING THE NUMBER OF MENTAL HEALTH CASES THAT END UP WITH POLICE INTERVENTION THAT LEAD TO, YOU KNOW, USE OF FORCE TO RESTRAIN SOMEBODY UNDERGOING A MENTAL HEALTH CRISIS.

>> AND IT BUTTRESSES THE CASE THAT A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE BEEN MAKING THAT MAYBE THIS IS NOT THE WORK THAT COPS SHOULD BE DOING.

YOU KNOW, WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT PEOPLE WHO SAY DEFUND THE POLICE, THIS IS KIND OF WHAT THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT, RIGHT?

>> YEAH.

I MEAN THERE IS A QUESTION, PARTICULARLY TO WHAT EXTENT SHOULD POLICE OFFICERS BE SOCIAL WORKERS, BE THE FIRST RESPONDERS FOR THINGS THAT ARE NONCRIMINAL IN NATURE.

YOU KNOW, HAVING A MENTAL HEALTH EPISODE ISN'T A CRIME.

SOMETIMES PEOPLE DO COMMIT CRIMES WHEN THEY ARE UNDERGOING A MENTAL HEALTH EPISODE, BUT POLICE OFFICERS HAVE TO -- ARE INCREASINGLY BEING RELIED UPON TO FILL IN THE GAPS FOR CRUMBLING SOCIAL SAFETY NET.

AND THERE ARE A LOT OF FOLKS THAT SAY THAT THE POLICE MAY NEED TO RESPOND TO SOMEONE WHO'S BEING VIOLENT WHO'S HAVING A MEDICAL EPISODE, BUT HAVING CRISIS INTERVENTION TRAINED SOCIAL WORKERS MIGHT BE A BETTER WAY TO ADDRESS THIS STUFF.

>> YEAH.

SUFFICE TO SAY THAT WE NEED MORE DATA, RIGHT?

FIVE MONTHS OF DATA DOES NOT AN APPROPRIATE OR FULL PICTURE MAKE.

>> YEAH.

LOOK, I'VE BEEN FAIRLY IMPRESSED WITH THE NEW REPORTING MODEL THAT THE ATTORNEY GENERAL'S OFFICE HAS ROLLED OUT, BUT LIKE ANYTHING IN GOVERNMENT, IT'S GOING TO RELY ON COMPLIANCE.

YOU HAVE MORE THAN 500 MUNICIPALITIES IN NEW JERSEY, ALMOST AS MANY POLICE DEPARTMENTS, AND YOU HAVE TO TRAIN EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM ON ACCURATELY CAPTURING THIS DATA.

WE FOUND OUT THIS WEEK THAT WE'RE STILL RELYING ON POLICE TO REPORT THE DEMOGRAPHIC DATA OF ARR ARRESTEES SO YOU'RE ASKING THEM TO DETERMINE THEIR RACE AND GENDER.

SO THERE WILL STILL BE HICCUPS IN THE REPORTING AND COMPLIANCE ISSUES.

I KNOW OF AT LEAST ONE POLICE SHOOTING THAT ISN'T REPRESENTED IN THE DATA THAT OUGHT TO BE.

SO THOSE ARE CASES THAT ARE RELYING UPON US TO KEEP DIGGING INTO THE DATA AND MAKING SURE THAT EVERYTHING IS BEING CAPTURED.

>> ALL RIGHT.

THE GOVERNOR AND THE FIRST LADY WERE SCHEDULED TO GET THEIR COVID SHOTS THIS WEEK, BUT THE GOVERNOR ALSO WARNED THAT THERE'S GOING TO BE ANOTHER SHORTAGE OF JOHNSON & JOHNSON JABS.

SAM, IF YOU WANT TO GET PEOPLE VACCINATED, IT HELPS TO HAVE VACCINE AROUND, NO?

>> YEAH, IT CERTAINLY DOES.

IT'S LOOKING LIKE NEW JERSEY IS GOING TO HAVE, BASED ON THE NUMBERS THAT THE HEALTH COMMISSIONER PUT OUT EARLIER THIS WEEK, AROUND 200,000 FEWER VACCINES OVER THE NEXT COUPLE OF WEEKS THAN THEY EXPECTED.

I KNOW THE ADMINISTRATION HAS KIND OF FRAMED THIS AS IF YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE A SHORTAGE, IT'S GOOD TO HAVE A SHORTAGE OF THE ONE-SHOT DOSE BECAUSE YOU'RE ONLY SCREWING WITH ONE APPOINTMENT AS OPPOSED TO TWO.

BUT I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT TO REMEMBER THAT THESE J&J DOSES WERE BEING AND ARE STILL BEING TOUTED AS A REALLY IMPORTANT TOOL FOR GETTING INTO COMMUNITIES WHERE VACCINE PICKUP JUST HASN'T BEEN WHERE IT NEEDS TO BE, SPEAKING SPECIFICALLY ABOUT BLACK AND LATINO COMMUNITIES AS WELL AS SOME OF THE MORE RURAL PARTS OF THE STATE.

SO ABSENT THAT FOR A COUPLE OF WEEKS, THAT'S GOING TO BE A LOT HARDER.

AND DOVETAILING WITH THAT, WE HAVE A LOT OF VARIANTS THAT ARE MAKING THINGS A LOT HARDER FROM A PUBLIC HEALTH STANDPOINT RIGHT NOW.

SO IF YOU HAVE 200,000 FEWER FOLKS VACCINATED OVER THE NEXT TWO WEEKS, THAT'S 200,000 MORE FOLKS, I COULD SAY, WHO ARE STILL EXPOSED TO A POTENTIALLY FATAL VIRUS.

>> THERE WAS A PIECE ABOUT CHRIS CHRISTIE'S NONPROFIT RAISING A LOT OF MONEY.

NOBODY KNOWS WHERE IT'S ACTUALLY GONE?

>> NO ONE KNOWS WHERE IT'S GONE AND NO ONE KNOWS WHO GAVE IT.

IT'S A LITTLE BIT EARLY IN THE GAME FOR THAT.

THE WAY THAT THIS WORKS IS CHRISTIE'S NONPROFIT IS -- IT HAS TO FILE WHAT'S CALLED A FORM 990 WITH THE IRS, BUT BEFORE IT DOES THAT, IT PROVIDES SOME DATA TO THE IRS ABOUT ITS ASSETS, ITS REVENUES.

THE KIND OF AGGREGATED DATA THAT I SAW SHOWED THAT IT HAD RAISED A LITTLE MORE THAN $500,000 IN ITS FIRST YEAR OF OPERATION IN 2019 AND HAD 270,000, $280,000 WORTH OF ASSETS.

WE DON'T KNOW IF THAT CAME FROM CHRISTIE HIMSELF, HE'S A RATHER WEALTHY MAN.

HE DON'T KNOW IF THAT CAME FROM SETON HALL, WHICH IS THE INSTITUTION THAT'S PARTNERING WITH CHRISTIE ON THIS THING OR WE DON'T KNOW IF IT CAME FROM FOLKS WHO ARE INTERESTED PARTIES ACROSS THE STATE.

SO AS WITH EVERYTHING CHRISTIE POST SECOND TERM, THERE'S A LOT OF QUESTIONS AND IT'S AN INTERESTING PLACE TO ALWAYS BE TAKING A LOOK.

>> WE ALSO SAW THE STATE CORRECTIONS COMMISSIONER GET A GRILLING BEFORE AN ASSEMBLY COMMITTEE THIS WEEK, SPECIFICALLY ABOUT THE EDNA MANN PRISON.

STACY, HOW DID HE DO?

>> WELL, BASED ON WHAT LAWMAKERS SAID AFTER THE HEARING AND JUST FOR CONTEXT, THIS TOOK LIKE EIGHT HOURS.

HE TESTIFIED FOR ABOUT THREE AND A HALF HOURS AND ANSWERED QUESTIONS.

LAWMAKERS, I THINK, WERE ENCOURAGED TO HEAR ABOUT SOME OF THE REFORMS THAT ARE IN PLACE, BUT ALSO STILL RECOGNIZE THAT THERE IS JUST A CULTURE OF SEXUAL ABUSE AT THIS PRISON THAT HAS ENDURED FOR TEN YEARS, AND THAT'S SORT OF THE QUESTION IS HOW DO YOU FIX SOMETHING THAT HAS BEEN SUCH A PROBLEM AND JUST A PART OF THIS PRISON WHERE 370 WOMEN LIVE.

HOW DO YOU FIX IT WHEN IT'S BEEN A PROBLEM FOR SO LONG.

>> IS THERE ANY SENSE THAT HIS COMING TO THE ASSEMBLY COMMITTEE AND ANSWERING ALL OF THESE QUESTIONS, IS THERE ANY SENSE THAT THAT HELPS HIS CASE AND MAYBE GETS HIM, I DON'T KNOW, PAROLE FROM THE GOVERNOR?

>> WELL, I THINK THE GOVERNOR HAS STOOD BY HIM, DESPITE EVERY SENATE DEMOCRAT CALLING ON HIM TO STEP ASIDE AFTER THESE MOST RECENT ALLEGATIONS OF ASSAULT AND ABUSE IN JANUARY.

HE HAS NOT APPEARED PREVIOUSLY BEFORE LAWMAKERS ON THIS SPECIFIC ISSUE, AND SO I DO THINK ASSEMBLY MEMBERS MADE IT A POINT YESTERDAY TO THANK HIM FOR SHOWING UP.

>> ALL RIGHT, THAT'S ROUNDTABLE FOR TODAY.

THANKS TO OUR GUEST MARIA HINOJOSA AND TO OUR PANEL.

YOU CAN FOLLOW ME ON TWITTER @DAVIDCRUZNJ AND SUBSCRIBE TO THE YOUTUBE CHANNEL.

I'M DAVID CRUZ.

FOR THE ENTIRE CREW OVER HERE, THANKS FOR WATCHING.

WE'LL SEE YOU NEXT WEEK.

>>> MAJOR FUNDING FOR REPORTERS ROUNDTABLE WITH DAVID CRUZ IS PROVIDED BY NEW JERSEY REALTORS, THE VOICE FOR REAL ESTATE IN NEW JERSEY.

MORE INFORMATION IS ONLINE AT NJREALTOR.COM.

RWJ BARNABUS HEALTH.

LET'S BE HEALTHY TOGETHER.

AND BY NJM INSURANCE GROUP SERVING THE INSURANCE NEEDS OF NEW JERSEY RESIDENTS AND BUSINESSES FOR MORE THAN 100 YEARS.

PROMOTIONAL SUPPORT IS PROVIDED BY NEW JERSEY BUSINESS MAGAZINE.

THE MAGAZINE OF THE NEW JERSEY BUSINESS AND INDUSTRY ASSOCIATION, REPORTING TO EXECUTIVE AND LEGISLATIVE LEADERS IN ALL 21 COUNTIES OF THE GARDEN STATE SINCE 1954.