♪.

TED: COMING UP NEXT ON "ARIZONA HORIZON," IT'S THE JOURNALISTS' ROUNDTABLE.

WE'LL LOOK AT THE WEEK'S TOP STORIES, INCLUDING THE GOVERNOR'S VOW NOT TO SIGN ANY LEGISLATION UNTIL BUDGET TALKS RESUME.

THE JOURNALISTS' ROUNDTABLE IS NEXT ON "ARIZONA HORIZON."

.

TED: GOOD EVENING, AND WELCOME TO "ARIZONA HORIZON."

I'M TED SIMONS.

IT'S FRIDAY, AND THAT MEANS IT'S TIME FOR THE JOURNALISTS' ROUNDTABLE, AND JOINING US TONIGHT, HOWIE FISCHER FROM CAPITOL MEDIA SERVICES.

MARY JO PITZL, A CONTRIBUTOR TO CAPITOL MEDIA SERVICES.

JEREMY DUDA FROM AXIOS PHOENIX, AND WE SHOULD NOTE THAT JEREMY'S WIFE WORKS AT ARIZONA PBS.

PANEL, GOOD TO HAVE YOU HERE.

THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

HOWIE, WE'RE GOING TO START WITH WHERE HAVE WE HEARD THIS BEFORE?

THE GOVERNOR SAYS GIVE ME A BUDGET, AN IDEA, I'M NOT SIGNING ANYTHING?

>> I'VE COVERED NINE GOVERNORS, PRETTY MUCH ALL OF THEM SAID THE SAME THING, TIME IS RUNNING OUT.

WE NEED A BUDGET BY JUNE 30.

WE KNOW IT DOESN'T HAPPEN BY MAGIC AS MUCH AS SHE'D LIKE TO BELIEVE IT.

SHE HAS DECIDED, SHE WANTS TO SEE THEIR BUDGET.

HER ARGUMENT IS, LOOK, SECOND WEEK IN JANUARY, YOU GOT MY BUDGET.

I HAVE A $1.8 BILLION SPENDING PLAN -- $17.8 BILLION SPENDING PLAN, AND HERE'S HOW I WANT TO PAY FOR IT.

SOME OF IT IS BLUE SMOKE AND MIRRORS.

WHAT DO YOU HAVE IN MIND?

WE'RE NOT GOING TO TELL YOU EXACTLY, WE DON'T WANT THIS, THIS, THIS, SHE FINALLY WALKED OUT AND SAID I'VE HAD NOVEMBER.

TED: IS THAT ENOUGH TO GET BUDGET TALKS STARTED AGAIN?

>> WELL, NOT IMMEDIATELY.

WHAT WILL GET BUDGET TALKS GOING IS AS THEY GET CLOSER AND CLOSER TO THE DEADLINE, WHICH TECHNICALLY IS JUNE 30, BUT THERE'S A LOT OF REASONS TO TRY TO GET THAT DONE EARLIER LIKE AN ELECTION THAT'S HAPPENING ON JULY 21, BUT RIGHT NOW, THE REPUBLICANS ARE WORKING ON THEIR OWN PLAN.

THEY SAID THEY WILL -- WHEN THEY GET IT DONE, SHE'S PROBABLY NOT GOING TO LIKE IT.

TED: YEAH, PROP 123, THE EDUCATION EXTENSION HERE.

IS THAT PLAYING A MAJOR ROLE IN ALL THIS?

>> PLAY A MAJOR ROLE IN GOVERNOR HOBBS WALKING AWAY FROM THE BUDGET NEGOTIATIONS.

THEIR STAFFS ARE MEETING OFF THE SPEAKER AND GOVERNOR THEMSELVES.

PROP 123 WAS REALLY FRONT AND CENTER IN TERMS OF THE REASONS BECAUSE REPUBLICANS SAY WE DON'T NEED THE GOVERNOR TO DO THIS, AND THE GOVERNOR SAID I WANT TO BE PART OF THAT.

NOW WITH THE MORATORIUM, THE VETO THREAT, SPECIFICALLY ASKED I WANT SOMETHING ON 123.

NO, WE JUST WANT TO SEE THEIR BUDGET PLAN.

MAYBE GIVING THEM A BUDGET PLAN, JOHN KAVANAGH, THE SENATE APPROPRIATIONS CHAIR SAID WE GAVE THEM A BUDGET IN FEBRUARY, AND THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE SAID, YEAH, SURE, WE WANT TO SHOW THE PEOPLE.

IT SHOULD BE PUBLIC.

DOESN'T SEEM THAT BIG AN ASK IN TERMS OF THE MORATORIUMS, SHOW US THE BUDGET AND THEY'LL FIGHT TWO MORE MONTHS ABOUT AN ACTUAL DEAL.

>> THE PROBLEM WITH 123, BACK IN 2016, VOTERS APPROVED THIS MEASURE, AND TAKES ADDITIONAL MONEY OUT OF THE STATE LAND TRUST FOR EDUCATION AND PROVIDED $330 MILLION A YEAR EXTRA FOR K-12 EDUCATION ABOVE THE NORMAL WITHDRAWALS.

EXPIRED LAST YEAR.

OKAY.

FOR THE MOMENT, THE GENERAL FUND HAS PICKED UP THE DIFFERENCE, SCHOOLS HAVEN'T LOST MONEY BUT THE GOVERNOR'S POSITION IS, OKAY, IF WE GO AHEAD AND RENEW 123 FOR A PERIOD OF TIME, WE FREE UP THAT MONEY TO SOME OF THE OTHER PRIORITIES THAT SHE HAS.

SHE HAS A BUNCH OF CHILD CARE THINGS AND HOUSING THINGS AND THINGS LIKE THAT, THEN IT'S A QUESTION WHO GETS THE POLITICAL CREDIT, THE OTHER THING THAT'S HANGING IT UP.

YOU HAVE PEOPLE LIKE JAKE HOFFMAN SAYING IF WE GIVE HER 123, WE MIGHT AS WELL GIVE HER THE GOVERNORSHIP.

TED: I WAS GOING TO SAY HE BASICALLY SAID JUST THAT.

HE WAS VERY CLEAR ABOUT THAT.

>> GIVE SENATOR HOFFMAN CREDIT, HE'S CLEAR WHAT HE THINKS, BUT THEY'VE BEEN LEANING IN THE LAST YEAR ON THE GENERAL FUND, AS HOWIE SAID, FILLING IN THE MONEY THAT 123 PROVIDED, BUT HELLO, THIS IS A BUDGET DEFICIT, A VERY TIGHT NUMBERS ON THE BUDGET.

IT WOULD BE HELPFUL IF THERE WAS A STREAM OF FUNDING RENEWED, BUT YOU GOT TO GO TO THE VOTERS FOR THAT TO GET THAT, WHICH COULDN'T HAPPEN BEFORE NOVEMBER.

SO THE STATE GENERAL FUND IS GOING TO HAVE TO PUT MONEY IN ANYWAY, AND MAYBE THEY CAN JUST CROSS THEIR FINGERS, HOPE THAT THE GOVERNOR'S RACE COMES OUT IN FAVOR OF A REPUBLICAN GOVERNOR, AND THEN YOU CAN JUST FIND A WAY TO PAY THAT OTHER HALF YEAR, AND THEN RENEW IT, IT WILL BE TO THE CREDIT OF THE NEW GOVERNOR AND THE LEGISLATURE.

>> AND ON PROP 123, REGARDLESS OF WHETHER THE GOVERNOR IS PART OF THE TALKS OR NOT, I THINK IT IS ACCEPTED BY THE REPUBLICANS DOWN THERE, WE'RE NOT GOING TO SEE ANYTHING HAPPEN ON THIS THIS YEAR, NOT JUST AMONG THE REPUBLICANS, NOT BETWEEN THE REPUBLICANS AND THE GOVERNOR.

REPUBLICANS CAN'T AGREE AMONGST THEMSELVES WHAT THEY WANT TO DO, THERE'S A BIG FACTION THAT WANTS TO TIE THIS TO PROTECTIONS FOR SCHOOL CHOICE PROGRAMS.

I THINK PARTICULARLY TOP OF MIND WOULD BE ESAs WITH HOBBS THAT DEMOCRATS ARE FREQUENTLY TARGETING AND GOING AFTER.

OTHER REPUBLICANS DON'T WANT TO INCLUDE THAT.

THERE ARE CONCERNS WHAT THAT WOULD MEAN AT THE BALLOT BOX.

THE ORIGINAL PROP 123 BARELY PASSED, DIFFICULT TO COUNT ON FOR THE REVENUE FOR THE BUDGET, BUT THE REPUBLICANS CAN'T AGREE WHAT THEY WANT AMONGST THEMSELVES, AND IF THEY COULD WE WOULD HAVE SEEN IT ALREADY, THEY DON'T NEED THE GOVERNOR'S SIGNATURE EXCEPT WHAT'S ON THE BALLOT.

>> THE GOVERNOR BUILT A BUDGET ON $760 MILLION COMING FROM WASHINGTON.

$12 BILLION TO REIMBURSE STATES FOR BORDER EXPENSES.

THE GOVERNOR SAYS WE'RE DUE 760 MILLION INCLUDING 200 MILLION WE INCLUDED PUTTING UP THE BORDER WALL OF TRUCKS.

NONE OF THAT MONEY HAS BEEN GIVEN OUT YET.

THAT'S PART OF HER BUDGET.

PART OF HER BUDGET IS WE'RE GOING TO DO MEANS TESTING FOR ESAs VOUCHERS AND SAYS WE CAN SAVE 87 MILLION, 88 MILLION ON THAT.

THEN SHE HAS A PLAN TO RAISE TAXES.

A NIGHTLY FEE ON VACATION RENTALS, SO SHE CAN GET MONEY FOR HOME ENERGY EFFICIENCY, AND THEN RAISING MONEY ON THE FIRMS THAT DO ONLINE GAMBLING FOR THE SPORTS GAMING.

AGAIN, THE POINT IS WHAT DO YOU GOT?

TED: MARY JO, REGARDING TIMING, THIS IS AN ELECTION YEAR, IF IT STRETCHES OUT LONGER?

WHO GETS ANTSIER?

GOVERNOR OR FOLKS RUNNING FOR HIGHER OFFICE?

>> I WOULD THINK THE LATTER, THE PRIMARY IS JULY 21.

THE GOVERNOR MIGHT BE WORRIED BUT SHE DOESN'T HAVE A RACE TO RUN UNTIL NOVEMBER.

SO WE GOT A LOT OF LAWMAKERS DOWN THERE THAT ARE EITHER LOOKING TO RETURN OR MOVE ONTO A DIFFERENT SEAT AND IT'S HARD TO CAMPAIGN IF YOU ARE LOCKED UP, COMING IN EVERY DAY FOR MAYBE AN HOUR TO HEAR A BILL OR TWO AND VOTE ON IT, AND THEN GO HOME AND COME BACK THE NEXT DAY AND SORT OF RINSE, WASH AND REPEAT.

>> THERE'S ANOTHER PARTICULARLY IMPORTANT POINT, LEGISLATORS CANNOT TAKE MONEY FROM LOBBYISTS WHILE THE LEGISLATURE IS IN SESSION, AND I'M NOT SAYING LOBBYIST MONEY IS ALL OF, IT BUT IT'S CERTAINLY NICE TO HAVE A LITTLE FUND-RAISER BY THE REALTORS OF THE TRIAL LAWYERS OR WHOMEVER WHO CAN BRING IN MONEY, BUT NOT WHILE IN SESSION.

TED: JEREMY, THERE IS A BIG THING GOING ON IN PHOENIX, TPA, TURNING POINT, TRUMP IS IN TOWN FOR THE EVENT.

ANYONE WHO IS ANYONE IN THE REPUBLICAN PARTY SEEMS TO BE THERE, AND REPUBLICAN PARTY POLITICS, BUT NOT CONGRESSMAN DAVID SCHWEIKERT.

WHAT'S GOING ON HERE?

>> I MEAN, TRUMP ENDORSED ANDY BIGGS IN THE PRIMARY A LONG TIME AGO, A DUAL ENDORSEMENT WITH BIGGS AND KARRIN TAYLOR ROBSON, NO LONGER IN THE RACE.

DUAL ENDORSEMENT DOES NOT TRANSFER OVER.

YOU GOT TO WONDER IF THERE WOULD HAVE BEEN A POINT TO DAVID SCHWEIKERT TO SHOW UP IN WHAT'S GOING TO BE A HOSTILE CROWD.

TURNING POINT HAS THROWN FULL SUPPORT BEHIND BIGGS, ACTIVELY HELPING HIS CAMPAIGN.

YOU CAN LOOK AT THE CAMPAIGN FINANCE REPORTS, A TOP PRIORITY IS GETTING HIM THROUGH THE PRIMARY.

THE MUCH BIGGER PROBLEM FOR DAVID SCHWEIKERT IS IF HE SAW THE CAMPAIGN FINANCE REPORT THIS WEEK, NOT LOOKING GREAT FOR HIM, AND HE DID NOT HAVE VERY MUCH ON HAND.

SEEMS LIKE A MUCH BIGGER PROBLEM.

>> ALSO A WAY FOR SCHWEIKERT TO DIFFERENTIATE HIMSELF FROM BIGGS.

BIGGS SPOKE AT THE EVENT TODAY.

THE PRESIDENT STARTED TO PROMOTE HIS CANDIDACY.

HOW DO YOU SEPARATE ANDY BIGGS FROM DAVID SCHWEIKERT?

HERE'S ONE WAY, AND THE PRESIDENT'S HAVING SOME MOMENTS WHERE HIS POPULARITY IS ON THE WANE.

I DON'T KNOW HOW LONG THAT WILL LAST, BUT THE NUMBERS ARE SHOWING THAT THERE'S A LOT OF UNFAVORABILITY FOR HIM.

SO MAYBE SCHWEIKERT IS TRYING TO MAKE THAT APPEAL TO DISCONTENTED REPUBLICANS.

TED: AND TURNING POINT IS OBVIOUSLY NOT A HUGE FAN OF CONGRESSMAN SCHWEIKERT'S, ESPECIALLY AFTER THE ATTACK ADS AGAINST CONGRESSMAN BIGGS REGARDING THE ASSOCIATION AND THE FRIENDSHIPS WITH ANTI-SEMITIC PEOPLE AND WHITE SUPREMACY PEOPLE.

I MEAN, IT'S A RHETORICAL QUESTION, WE KNOW WHY HE'S NOT THERE, BUT IN A REPUBLICAN PRIMARY, HE'S GOT TO GET OUT OF THE PRIMARY, HOWIE.

GOT TO GET PAST THAT.

>> THAT'S THE POINT JEREMY WAS MAKING.

ANDY BIGGS, THE LAST CAMPAIGN FINANCE REPORT SAID HE HAD 1.7 MILLION IN THE BANK, AFTER EXPENSES THROUGH THE FIRST QUARTER.

CONGRESSMAN SCHWEIKERT HAS $88,000 IN THE BANK.

ACCORDING TO HIS CHIEF CAMPAIGN PERSON, WELL, WE GOT A LATE START, AND B, MONEY IS GOING OUT THE DOOR AS FAST AS WE'RE DOING IT.

YOU GOT TO REMEMBER PEOPLE WHO GIVE MONEY WANT TO KNOW THAT THE MONEY IS GOING TO SOMETHING, AND YOU GET TO THE POINT WHERE YOU'RE SAYING HE'S RUNNING DOUBLE DIGITS BEHIND MR.

BIGGS RIGHT NOW, WITH EARLY VOTING STARTING ACTUALLY IN TEN WEEKS, AND B, IF YOU ONLY GOT 88,000 IN THE BANK, IF YOU PUT IN MORE MONEY, WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO?

HERE'S THE IMPORTANT THING HOW WE HAVE 88,000 IN THE BANK.

HE LOANED HIMSELF 99,000 AND MOVED OVER HALF A MILLION DOLLARS OF CONGRESSIONAL MONEY IN THERE, AND STILL HAS ONLY 88,000 IN THE BANK.

TED: YEAH, JEREMY, BEFORE WE MOVE ON, HE ALSO WENT AFTER TURNING POINT.

THE FRINGE OF THE FRINGE.

THEY WIPED OUT CONSERVATIVES OVER AND OVER, AND THEY SUPPORT UNELECTABLE CANDIDATES.

SO I GUESS IF YOU'RE GOING TO SCORCH THE EARTH, YOU MIGHT AS WELL GIVE IT A GOOD BURN, HUH?

>> SURE, SCHWEIKERT, HIS BIG TALKING POINT IS ELECTABILITY.

HE'S THE CANDIDATE WHO CAN BEAT HOBBS THAT ANDY BIGGS CANNOT.

HE'S SAYING ANDY BIGGS IS THIS YEAR'S VERSION OF KARI LAKE AND THE PERSON THAT CAN WIN THE GENERAL, BUT YOU GOT TO GET THROUGH THE PRIMARY FIRST, AND ANDY BIGGS LOOKS LIKE HE'S BEEN RUNNING AWAY WITH IT FOR A WHILE.

TED: HOWIE, SEE IF THE GOVERNOR'S RACE, WHO IS HUGH LIDDELL, AND WHY IS THIS A BIG WEEK FOR HIM?

>> HUGH LIDDELL IS THE CANDIDATE OF THE NO LABELED/ARIZONA INDEPENDENT PARTY.

AS OF -- WHAT IS IT, 5:17, IT'S THE NO LABELS PARTY, BUT THERE'S APPEAL ON THAT.

THERE IS A SEPARATE ISSUE WHETHER THEY CAN CHANGE THE NAME.

HE'S DECIDED THAT ARIZONANS WANT A DIFFERENT CHOICE, AND THEY MAY.

IF YOU LOOK AROUND, IF YOU ARE ANDY BIGGS OR KATIE HOBBS, AND PEOPLE SAY, YOU KNOW, I DON'T THINK SO.

NOW, HE'S PUT IN A MILLION DOLLARS OF HIS OWN MONEY, SO HE'S GOT A RUNNING START.

WHAT HAPPENED WAS APPARENTLY HE LOOKED AT THE FORM WHERE IT SAYS PUT DOWN WHERE YOU LIVE, AND HE PUT DOWN AN UPS POST OFFICE BOX ON HAYDEN ROAD AND INDIAN BEND, AND GOT A CHALLENGE FROM SOME DEMOCRATS, NOT SURPRISINGLY THEY DON'T WANT HIM ON THE BALLOT, AND THE JUDGE SAID IT'S TRUE, THAT'S WHAT IT SAYS BUT NOBODY WAS FOOLED.

HE WAS IN SUBSTANTIAL COMPLIANCE.

HE LIVES IN SCOTTSDALE, THE ADDRESS WAS IN SCOTTSDALE.

HE WAS THE ONLY HUGH LIDDELL ON THE BALLOT, NO ONE WAS CONFUSED, THEREFORE HE CAN STAY ON THE BALLOT.

TED: I'M SORRY, MARY JO, A POST OFFICE BOX, AWFULLY CRAMPED.

>> YES, AND MR.

LIDDELL CONCEDED HE DOES NOT LIVE IN THE P.O.

BOX.

HE'S RUNNING FOR STATEWIDE OFFICE.

HE'S HERE IN ARIZONA, THAT'S GOOD ENOUGH.

IT WOULD BE DIFFERENT IF IT WERE A LEGISLATIVE SEAT WHERE BOUNDARIES MATTER, ALTHOUGH THERE ARE EXCEPTIONS TO THAT TOO, BUT THAT'S ANOTHER STORY.

TED: THIS QUOTE WAS INTERESTING.

WE DON'T REMOVE NAMES FROM BALLOTS FOR MERE TECHNICAL DEPARTURES FROM STATUTORILY REQUIRED FORMS.

THAT'S AN INTERESTING WAY FOR THE JUDGE TO PUT IT.

>> I THOUGHT SO, TOO.

THERE ARE OTHER ASSOCIATIONS WITH CITIZEN INITIATIVES AND REFERENDUMS AND THINGS LIKE THAT, WHERE YOU WILL PAY A VERY HEAVY PENALTY AND NOT GET ON THE BALLOT FOR THINGS LIKE THAT AND SHOWS THE DIFFERENCE HOW THE LAWMAKERS WHO MAKE THE LAWS VIEW THOSE TYPES OF CAMPAIGNS VERSUS THE CAMPAIGNS WHERE THEY'RE THE ONES WHO ARE GOING TO BE ON THE BALLOT.

>> ISN'T THAT INTERESTING?

FOR ALL THE CASES, AND WE'VE LOOKED AT THEM, A LAY MAKER WHO ALLEGEDLY DOES NOT LIVE IN THE DISTRICT, AND YOU TRY TO -- DON CHUTER WAS AN EXAMPLE OF THAT, AND YEARS AGO SYLVIA LAUGHTER, YOU THINK YOU GOT THE GOODS AND IT GOES TO COURT, AND THE JUDGE SAYS, WELL, IT'S WHERE THE CANDIDATE BELIEVES THEY RESIDE.

EVEN THOUGH THE STATUTE SAYS ONE THING.

TED: YES.

>> SO I OFTEN WONDER WHY WE BOTHER TO REQUIRE PEOPLE LIVE WITHIN THE BOUNDARIES OF THEIR DISTRICT.

OTHERWISE, WHY HAVE A REDISTRICTING COMMISSION, IF IT DOESN'T MATTER WHERE YOU LIVE?

>> THE INTERESTING THING FOR THOSE THAT HAVE BEEN AROUND, WE REMEMBER 1986, CAROLYN WARNER WAS STATE SCHOOLS CHIEF, EVAN MACOMB RUNNING FOR GOVERNOR.

BEAT OUT BURT BARR IN THE PRIMARY.

BEAT OUT DONALD TRUMP.

HE SAID, WAIT, I FEEL A DRAFT, AND HE CAME IN AND HE DIVIDED THE DEMOCRATIC VOTE, WHICH IS HOW WE GOT ED MEEKAM.

THERE IS A LOT OF CONCERN HE COULD BE THE BILL SCHULTZ OF 2026.

TED: WHICH IS WHY THE LIDDELL CAMPAIGN BLAMED THE GOVERNOR FOR VOTER SUPPRESSION FOR THIS PARTICULAR SUIT, THIS PARTICULAR CHALLENGE.

>> I DON'T KNOW IF WE CAN TIE IT TO HER, BUT THE GUY WHO IS SUPPOSEDLY THE TITULAR NAME ON THE THING IS A REGULAR CONTRIBUTOR TO THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY.

THE LAW FIRM REPRESENTED THE GOVERNOR IN THE PAST, PROFESSIONALLY AND PERSONALLY.

OF COURSE, THEY'RE BEHIND IT.

CLEARLY THEY BELIEVE HE'S GOING TO BE A PROBLEM.

TED: RUBEN GALLEGO, SENATOR RUBEN GALLEGO'S LONG FRIENDSHIP WITH ERIC SWALWELL IS GETTING THE ONCE-OVER TWICE HERE, AND HE'S TAKING HITS, SENATOR GALLEGO IS?

>> YES, FLORIDA CONGRESSWOMAN ON SOCIAL MEDIA SAID I KNOW THE WOMAN WHO ALLEGEDLY WAS INVOLVED WITH SWALWELL, AND SOMETHING INVOLVING SOMETHING TO DO WITH SEX.

IT WAS PRETTY VAGUE, SHE DIDN'T NAME NAMES EXCEPT FOR RUBEN GALLEGO AND SWALWELL AND DIDN'T PROVIDE ANY DETAILS THAT CAN BE CHECKED OUT.

WE KEEP HEARING THE STORIES THAT MORE WILL BE COMING OUT.

TED: AND SENATOR GALLEGO SAID THAT HE WAS BLINDSIDED BY SWALWELL AND HEARD THAT SWALWELL WAS FLIRTY.

THEY WERE SUPPOSED TO BE VERY GOOD FRIENDS, JEREMY?

>> VERY CLOSE FRIENDS FOR YEARS IN CONGRESS.

SENATOR GALLEGO WAS THE CHAIR OF SWALWELL'S SHORT-LIVED CAMPAIGN.

WHEN THE RUMORS STARTED SURFACING, I ASKED HIM ABOUT IT, HE DENIED IT.

HE WAS LIED TO, FELT BETRAYED.

CLEARLY NO LONGER FRIENDS WITH FORMER CONGRESSMAN SWALWELL BECAUSE HE'S RESIGNED.

THIS IS OBVIOUSLY -- THE KNIVES ARE COMING OUT, ANYONE WHO WANTS TO TAKE A SHOT AT SENATOR GALLEGO IS TAKING THE OPPORTUNITY.

WE'VE HEARD AS MARY JO MENTIONED, VAGUE ALLEGATIONS.

NOTHING FROM ANY ACTUAL ACCUSERS.

ONE OF THE ALLEGATION WAS FROM GEORGE SANTOS, WHO IS PERHAPS FAR FROM THE MOST CREDIBLE OF SOURCE.

WE'VE HEARD A LOT OF GUILT BY ASSOCIATION SO FAR.

TED: BUT THERE IS THAT ASSOCIATION BETWEEN THE TWO, AND IT HAS TO RUB OFF A LITTLE BIT.

>> OF COURSE IT DOES.

THERE'S A BEAUTIFUL PICTURE OF THE TWO OF THEM WITH THEIR WIVES VACATIONING IN EGYPT ON TOP OF CAMELS IN SHORTS -- I'M NOT GETTING ON A CAMEL IN A PAIR OF SHORTS, BUT THEY'RE TOGETHER.

IT'S A VARIATION ON THE WHOLE EPSTEIN THING.

HOW CLOSE DO YOU HAVE TO BE TO SOMEBODY?

LOOK, WE ALL GET FOOLED.

I'VE HAD CLOSE FRIENDS, I HAD NO IDEA THEY HAD A SECRET LIFE, BUT THERE WERE ALWAYS SUSPICIONS, AND HOW DO YOU -- THEY BASICALLY LIVED TOGETHER IN WASHINGTON FOR A WHILE.

THEY WERE ROOMMATES.

HOW DO YOU NOT KNOW?

HOW DO YOU NOT SUSPECT THAT SOMETHING ISN'T KOSHER.

TED: DOES THAT TAKE A HIT?

GALLEGO OBVIOUSLY WITH SENATOR KELLY, CONSIDERED EARLY PRESIDENTIAL TIMBER BY SOME FOLKS.

IS THAT TAKING A BIT OF A HIT?

>> OH, I THINK SO, IT'S PRESIDENTIAL MENTIONING IS WHERE THEY'RE AT, AT THAT STAGE, AND THAT'S PART OF THE REASON WHY THERE IS SO MUCH ATTENTION TO THIS BECAUSE HIS NAME IS OUT THERE.

TED: YEAH.

>> BUT YEAH.

IT'S NOT GOING TO BE HELPFUL.

TED: SENATOR KELLY'S NAME IS OUT THERE AS WELL.

HE RAISED $13 MILLION IN A FEW MONTHS AFTER THE ILLEGAL ORDERS VIDEO.

>> WHEN YOU TAKE ON THE SECRETARY OF DEFENSE AND STAND UP FOR YOU AS HE CAST, IT FIRST AMENDMENT RIGHT TO TALK ABOUT -- TO TALK ABOUT, GIVE THIS WARNING ON THAT YOU DON'T HAVE TO OBEY ILLEGAL ORDERS, WHICH HAS BEEN FOUND TO BE -- THAT IS EXERCISING YOUR FIRST AMENDMENT RIGHT, YEAH, THAT GOT A LOT OF PEOPLE'S ATTENTION.

HE WON IN COURT.

TED: HE DID INDEED, AND A LOT OF SMALL DONORS, A LOT OF FOLKS CONTRIBUTING THERE.

>> TONS OF THEM.

13 MILLION.

HE HAD SIMILAR THE LAST QUARTER WHERE THE FIRST FEUD JUST STARTED.

YOU LOOK AT HOW MUCH HE'S GOT ON HAND, OVER 22 MILLION, AND SOME OF MY COLLEAGUES AT THE NATIONAL TEAM AT AXIOS PUT TOGETHER A CHART, THE DEMOCRATIC HOPEFULS FOR PRESIDENT, ALL TEN OF THEM AT THIS POINT, AND FUND-RAISING NUMBERS, MARK KELLY HAS THE MOST MONEY ON HAND THAN ANY OF THEM RIGHT NOW.

IS HE GOING TO RUN?

IS HE NOT?

WHO KNOWS?

HE DOESN'T HAVE A RE-ELECTION FOR A WHILE, THAT MONEY WILL BE PUT TO GOOD USE.

TED: GALLEGO DOESN'T HAVE ANYTHING UNTIL 2030, HIS NUMBERS ARE MINUSCULE COMPARED TO THIS.

WE ASKED GALLEGO TAKING A HIT, DOES THIS HELP KELLY'S PRESIDENTIAL MENTIONING OR TIMBER?

>> I THINK IT DOES.

HE NEEDED AN ISSUE.

I'M NOT MEAN TO BE INSULTING.

HE HADN'T HONED IN ON ANYTHING THAT WAS HIS.

I MEAN, HE TALKED, AS HAVE ALL THE DEMOCRATS, ABOUT MINNEAPOLIS AND WHAT WAS GOING ON WITH I.C.E.

THIS GAVE HIM AN ISSUE.

HE SAYS I AM A COMBAT PILOT, I'M AN ASTRONAUT.

YOU TRIED TO TAKE AWAY MY RANK AND MY RETIREMENT BECAUSE I SAID WHAT IS ACTUALLY ON THE WALL OF WEST POINT IN TERMS OF SAYING, YOU DO NOT OBEY ILLEGAL ORDERS.

I MEAN, IT GAVE HIM SOMETHING THAT HE DIDN'T HAVE BEFORE, WHICH WAS AN ISSUE.

TED: YEAH, MARY JO, I KNOW YOU WERE INTERESTED IN THIS AND WROTE ABOUT THIS REGARDING THE 2024 ELECTION AND THE FINDINGS ON ILLEGAL VOTING.

WHAT WERE THE FINDINGS?

>> YES, FOR ALL THE CONCERNS, SOMETHING'S AMISS WITH HOW ELECTIONS ARE RUN, A REVIEW THAT ARIZONA PARTICIPATED IN COMPARING 2024 ELECTION RESULTS WITH THOSE VOTING PATTERNS WITH OTHER STATES OUT OF 3.6 MILLION VOTES CAST IN ARIZONA, THEY FOUND 28 INSTANCES OF POTENTIAL ILLEGAL VOTING.

THE A.G.

'S OFFICE TOOK A LOOK AT IT.

THEY SENT WARNING LETTERS TO 25 PEOPLE SAYING RECORDS SHOW YOU VOTED TWICE IN ARIZONA AND IN ANOTHER STATE.

THE ARIZONA VOTE COUNTED BECAUSE THAT WAS THE FIRST VOTE THEY CAST, THERE IS NOTHING TO PROSECUTE THERE.

THEY'RE LOOKING AT THREE OTHER CASES, INCLUDING ONE OF SOMEBODY WHO LOOKS LIKE THEY VOTED A DEAD PERSON'S BALLOT.

TED: YEAH.

>> WHAT'S IMPORTANT TO MARY JO'S POINT, ALL WE CONSTANTLY HEAR, THIS STARTS WITH OUR FRIEND MR.

HEAP, WE STARTED TALKING ABOUT EARLIER, AT WHAT POINT DO WE SAW WE LOOKED?

IT'S A VARIATION OF THE AUDIT ON THE 2020 ELECTION, AND 2022 AND 2024.

CLEARLY YOU'RE NOT LOOKING AT THE RIGHT THINGS.

IS THIS THE BE ALL AND END ALL FOR ARIZONANS?

IT IS.

YOU HAVE TO PROVE PROOF OF CITIZENSHIP BEFORE YOU CAN GET A BALLOT.

IF WE'RE ALREADY DOING THAT, AND WE'RE NOT VOTING IN MULTIPLE STATES, WHAT'S THE BIG PROBLEM?

TED: IS IT THE BE ALL AND END ALL FOR THOSE WHO STILL BELIEVE THAT THERE IS SOME SORT OF ELECTION HANKY PAFRPGY GOING?

IS THERE ANY EVIDENCE THAT WOULD CONVINCE THOSE FOLKS?

>> I DON'T THINK SO.

THEY ARE COMMITTED, TRUE BELIEVERS.

THEY'RE GOING TO BELIEVE THIS NO MATTER WHAT.

WE'VE HAD CONVERSATIONS WHAT ABOUT THIS?

THE AUDIT, THE SO-CALLED INFAMOUS AUDIT.

THAT WAS DEBUNKED EVERY WHICH POSSIBLE WAY.

PEOPLE SAID THE AUDIT PROVED THERE WAS FRAUD, THEY AFFIRMED BIDEN'S WIN.

HE WON BY MORE THAN WE THOUGHT.

>> THIS CROSS-CHECK WITH OTHER STATES IS DONE TO FIND IF THERE ARE PROBLEMS AND HOPEFULLY BUILD CONFIDENCE IN ELECTIONS.

WHEN YOU GOT MAYBE 28 CASES OUT OF 3.6, THAT'S NOT GOING TO MAKE A DIFFERENCE.

ELECTION AREN'T PERFECT, AS WE LEARNED.

28 VOTES, MAYBE 3 AREN'T GOING TO TIP AN ELECTION.

TED: LAST POINT ON THIS, HOWIE.

JUDGE RULED FOR RECORDER HEAP IN HIS FIGHT AGAINST THE PORED OF SUPERVISORS FOR I.T.

STAFF.

WHO WINS?

>> WE ALL WIN.

CAN'T WE ALL JUST GET ALONG?

THIS IS A QUESTION WHO HAS THE CONSTITUTIONAL AND STATUTORY AUTHORITY TO RUN CERTAIN PARTS OF THE ELECTION.

IT THE IS CLEAR AS KATE BROPHY McGEE SAID THE BOARD DOES CONTROL THE BUDGET, INCLUDING THE BUDGET OF THE RECORDER.

WHAT THE JUDGE SAYS IS THAT DOESN'T ALLOW YOU TO USE YOUR POWER TO TAKE AWAY CERTAIN THINGS OR USE IT AS A CUDGEL TO SAY YOU DO IT OUR WAY OR YOU WILL NOT GET YOUR MONEY.

IT IS A BIG WIN FOR HEAP BECAUSE THE FACT HE INSISTED ALL ALONG BECAUSE, REMEMBER, THEY CHANGED IT UNDER RICHER.

RICHER HAD THE AUTHORITY, THEY WERE SO SCARED OF HEAP, THEY TOOK IT AWAY, AND THE JUDGE SAID YOU CAN'T DO THAT.

TED: SEEMS LIKE HEAP IS HAVING A FEW VICTORIES IN THE CASES.

THE JUDGES, THIS PARTICULAR JUDGE IS SIDING WITH HIM MORE OFTEN THAN NOT?

>> HE'S GOT GOOD LEGAL HELP.

HE HIRED HIS ATTORNEY OVER THE OBJECTIONS OF THE OTHER ATTORNEYS, THEY SAID YOU CAN'T DO THAT.

THEY'RE NOT WRONG, THERE ARE REASONS YOU HAVE AN ELECTED RECORDER.

THE QUESTION IS SHOULD WE HAVE AN ELECTED RECORDER, ELECTED ASSESSOR, ELECTED TREASURER?

WHO KNOWS.

THERE'S A SEPARATION OF POWERS.

TED: LAST TOPIC, JEREMY YOU ARE VERY INTERESTED IN THIS, THE NAVAJO RECORDER'S OFFICE IS VERY IMPORTANT TO YOU, WHY?

>> THEY HAD A VACANCY, THE RECORDER HAD SUBMITTED RESIGNATION, AND THE PERSON WHO ENDED UP GETTING THE APPOINTMENT IS STATE REPRESENTATIVE DAVID MARSHALL WHO REPRESENTS NAVAJO COUNTRY.

THE PROVISION OF THE ARIZONA CONSTITUTION SAYS A STATE LAWMAKER CANNOT HOLD ANY OTHER STATE, COUNTY OR MUNICIPAL POSITION, NOT JUST WILD AIR IN THE LEGISLATURE, DURING THE TERMS TO WHICH THEY'VE BEEN ELECTED.

THIS COMES UP REGULAR AND LAWMAKERS SAY CAN I DO THIS?

CAN I DO THIS?

YOU CAN'T.

YET, REPRESENTATIVE MARSHALL SUBMITTED LETTER OF RESIGNATION TO THE HOUSE TODAY.

SOUNDS LIKE HE INTENDS TO MOVE FORWARD.

I'VE SPOKEN WITH A REPUBLICAN LAWYER, IF HE TRIES TO TAKE THE JOB, I'M GOING TO FILE SUIT.

I'VE HEARD PEOPLE SAY THERE'S A QUESTION TO BE TAKEN.

I DON'T SEE WHAT THE QUESTION IS.

TED: ISN'T HE RUNNING FOR CORPORATION COMMISSION?

>> WELL, I DON'T KNOW.

HE SUBMITTED PETITIONS.

HIS NAME IS GOING TO BE ON THE BALLOT.

WE HAVEN'T HEARD ANYTHING FROM MR.

MARSHALL OR RECORDER MARSHALL, I DON'T KNOW IF HE'S BEEN SWORN IN YET.

>> NOT YET.

>> HE CAN'T DO BOTH OF THE JOBS, YOU GOT TO PICK ONE.

>> HE'S ALL OVER.

>> A SLIGHT LEGAL THEORY, DURING THE TERM YOU WERE ELECTED MEANS IF YOU QUIT, YOU ARE NO LONGER IN THE TERM TO WHICH YOU ARE ELECTED.

TED: ALL RIGHT, WE HAVE TO QUIT IT RIGHT NOW.

PANEL, GOOD CONVERSATION, GOOD TO HAVE YOU ALL HERE.

THAT'S IT FOR NOW.

I'M TED SIMONS.

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING US.

YOU HAVE A GREAT WEEKEND.