>>> COMING UP NEXT ON ARIZONA HORIZON.

THE JOURNALIST ROUND TABLE INCLUDING THE JUDGES RULING ON PROPOSITION 140 TO END PARTISAN PRELIMINARIRIES.

>>> GOOD EVENING, WELCOME TO ARIZONA HORIZON.

I'M TED SIMON.

IT'S TIME FOR THE JOURNALIST ROUND TABLE.

JIM SMALL AND WAYNE OF KKZZ RADIO.

I'LL JOINT WITH YOU ON PROPOSITION 140.

GOT THE BIG RULING YESTERDAY.

>> ONE TO THE ARIZONA SUPREME COURT.

>> LITIGATION WAS DAY CARING PLACE OVER CHALLENGING SIGNATURES OPPONENTS.

THIS IS FOR THE BALLOT.

THEY HAVE ABOUT 30,000, 32,000 MORE THAN THEY NEED.

THEY ARE FINE.

THAT GOT APPEALED TO THE SUPREME COURT.

THEY SAT ON IT AND THAT'S THE DAY WHEN THE TRIAL IS OVER.

YOU DISCLUDED THIS PILE OF VOTES.

YOU NEED TO LOOK AT THOSE AND CONSIDER THEM.

THE TRIAL COURT SAID OKAY, WE WILL.

WE ARE PAST THE DEADLINE SURE WHAT THEY WILL DO.

WE ARE DIRECTING YOU TO TELL OFFICIALS DON'T COURTNEY VETOES FOR PROPOSITION 140.

WE NEVER SAW THIS BEFORE.

THE SUPREME COURT WALKED THAT STATEMENT BACK IN PARTICULAR AFTER THE OPPONENTS.

THIS HAS NO LEGAL BASIS FOR YOU DOING THIS.

YOU CAN'T DISENFRANCHISE EVERY VOTER.

CONSIDER IF IT SHOULD BE COUNTED AT THE TIME BEING.

FAST FORWARD TO YESTERDAY, WHAT WE GOT WAS THE COURT EVALUATED THE SIGNATURES AND SAID, YES, THEY WERE DUPLICATES.

THEY ARE CLOSE TO THE THRESHOLD.

SOME OF THEM WERE DOUBLE COUNTED AND SAID THAT'S UNCONSTITUTIONAL.

I WOULDN'T CONSIDER THOSE.

IT WILL PASS BY THE SKIN OF ITSELF'S TEETH AND SEND IT OFF.

IT'S ON THE BALLOT AND WE'LL LET VOTERS VOTE FOR IT.

>> THE IDEA SLOWING EVERYTHING DOWN AND AT THE LAST MINUTE HOLD EVERYTHING AFTER BALLOTS OF PRINTED.

>> AS JIM MENTIONED TOLD THEM TO CONSIDER THIS RULING WITH THE SIGNATURES.

ALSO RULED THEY DID IN FACT BRING THE CHALLENGE TWO WAYS.

PROVE THEY DIDN'T HAVE ENOUGH.

>> THIS WAS THE JUDGE PRONG NO.

NO.

NO.

THESE ARE ALL OF MY CONCLUSIONS.

>> THEY SET UP A BRIEFING SCHEDULE.

NOW THEY CAN SUBMIT DOCUMENTS BY NEXT WEEK.

>> AGAIN, THE EARLY BALANCE FOR OVER SEAS FOLKS.

>> THIS IS FOR MILITARY.

THOSE BALLOTS HAVE TO GO GET ON SATURDAY.

YOU KNOW, THIS IS THE SIGNATURE TALENT AND THEY FUNCTION AS A HARD AND FAST DEADLINE.

SOME ELECTIONS THERE ARE SPECIFIC TIME LIMITS.

THREE DAY, FIVE DAY, SEVEN DAY.

THAT I DON'T HAVE THAT BUT WAY MOUNTS TO A HARD AND FAST DADDIES LINE.

ONCE THEY ARE PRINTED YOU CAN'T UNRING THAT BELL AND CAN'T TAKE IT BACK.

THEY HAVE DEFERRED TO THAT AS THE HARD AND FAST DEADLINE.

THE DECISIONS NEEDS TO BE FINAL BY THAT DAY.

THEY HAD EMERGENCY HEARINGS WHERE WE MEET AT 5:00 P.M. FOR A LAST MINUTE APPEAL.

THIS YEAR, THEY DIDN'T DO THAT AND THEY REALLY CREATED, IT OPENED PANDORA'S BOX IF THEY LET THEM PERSIST FOR WEEKS AFTER THE BALLOTS WE TURNED INTO.

THAT REALLY SOMETHING THAT DAMAGES THE CITIZENS INITIATIVE PROCESS.

>> NOT ONLY THAT.

IT ALSO DAMAGES CAMPAIGNS.

THEY DON'T KNOW IF IT'S A DEAD MEASURE WALKING UP ENDING THE PRIMARIES IN THE STATE AND REPUBLICANS AND DEMOCRATS FOR VARIOUS REASONS.

THEY SPEND THEIR TIME AND MONEY IN COURT.

>> WHAT IS THE IMPACT FOR THE CAMPAIGN FOR, YOU HAVE TO CONVINCE PEOPLE FOR SOMETHING ON THE BALLOT.

>> MAKE SURE YOU FIGHT THIS OUT AND NOT OUT HITTING THE PAVEMENT.

HITTING TWO THINGS AT ONCE.

ADMINISTER MONEY IN COURT.

THIS WAS A CONTEN AS YOU SAY INITIATIVE.

>> WE STARTED TO SEE THAT CAMPAIGN START TO APPEAR AND SIGNS POPPING UP.

DEFINITELY, THIS IS A RESOURCE SUCK.

IT TAKES THE TIME AND MONEY AWAY.

YOU POINTED THAT OUT.

YOU KNOW, WHEN NO ONE KNOWS IF IT'S ON THE BALLOT.

THEY WOULD HAVE KNOWN THAT TWO AND HALF WEEKS AGO.

>> OH, BOY.

LET'S SETTLE IN.

WE HAVE PREVIOUS OF CITIZENSHIP AND TECH ERROR AND ALL SORTS OF STRANGE FELLOWS.

>> LET ME TAKE A DEEP BREATH.

THE REPORTER STEVE'S OFFICE WAS DOING ESSENTIALLY A VOTER ROLL CHECK TO MISTAKE SURE EVERYONE WAS SUPPOSED TO VOTE.

THEY WERE AN ILLEGAL RESIDENT BUT WEREN'T ELIGIBLE TO VOTE.

THEY FOUND AN ERROR WITH THE STATE'S DRIVER LICENSE DATABASE THAT COMMUNICATED WITH THE VOTER REGISTRATION SYSTEM AND TOLD PEOPLE IF THEY PROVIDED PROOF OF CITIZENSHIP WHEN THEY GOT A LICENSE.

WE HAD A ALLOWED THEM.

>> YOU CAN SEE OH, THEY GOT THEIR LICENSE FOR 1996.

THEY ARE GOOD TO GO.

THE PROBLEM WAS SOME FOLKS ABOUT 98,000 GOT THAT LICENSE BEFORE 1996.

MAYBE MOVE AND PERFECT LICENSE AFTER 2004.

>> ACTUALLY THE ISSUANCE AND TELLING THE SYSTEM THESE PEOPLE PROVIDED PROOF OF CITIZENSHIP WHEN THEY DIDN'T.

>> PROVIDING PROOF OF CITIZENSHIP, AS FAR AS STATE RACES THE COUNTY ATTORNEY.

GOING TO THE SUPREME COURT SAYING I'D LIKE THIS.

NO.

NO.

WE WANT THAT.

>> THESE FOLKS THROUGH NO FAULT OF THEIR OWN THROUGH COMPLETELY ADMINISTRATOR ERROR.

THEY CANNOT VOTE UNDER ARIZONA LAW IN ANYTHING OTHER THAN FEDERAL RACES.

SO, THE SUPREME COURT FILED A SPECIAL ACTION SAYING YOU NEED TO DECREE THESE FOLKS CAN ONLY VOTE WITH A FEDERAL ONLY BALLOT.

WE NEED TO KNOW THAT ASAP BECAUSE WE ARE ABOUT TO SEND OUT BALLOTS.

IF THEY ARE ON THE EARLY VOTING LIST WE NEED TO SEND THEM THE CORRECT BALLOT.

THEY COUNTERED THAT AND SAID, THESE PEOPLE MIGHT BE IMPROPERLY REGISTERED.

IT'S AN ERROR THEY DIDN'T DO ANYTHING WRONG.

CLOSE TO THE ELECTION TO BASICALLY MAKE THIS MASSIVE CHANGE.

WE CAN'T DO THERE WITHINNOLOGY DAYS.

IT'S 89,000 PEOPLE AND MANY ARE OLDER.

MANY HAVE BEEN DRIVING IN ARIZONA SINCE PRE1996.

MANY ARE OLDER VOTERS AND SENIOR CITIZENS.

THEY DID QUICK ANALYSIS.

YOU CAN'T FORCE THESE PEOPLE TO HUNT DOWN PROOF OF CITIZENSHIP AND GET IT TO THE COUNTY IN TIME FOR THEM TO VOTE.

WE NEED TO FIX IT BUT NOT RIGHT NOW.

WE DON'T INDEED TO UP END THE VOTERS.

THE REPEL PARTY AND REPUBLICAN LEGISLATURE LEADERS AND SITED WITH THE DEMOCRATIC SECRETARY OF STATE ESSENTIALLY THE SAME THING.

HE CAME OUT AND SAID HEY, LOOK MOST OF THE VOTERS ARE REPUBLICAN.

HE REALLY WAS LAYING IT OUT.

THIS IS NOT A CITIZENNATION FOR ILLEGAL VOTING AND THIS KENNARD.

30, 40, 50 YEARS.

MANY WERE REPUBLICANS.

WHAT DO YOU WANT TO DO.

>> NO SURPRISE THE LEGISLATURE OF THE REPUBLICAN COUNTY ATTORNEY SAID NO, NO.

GO WITH THE DEMOCRATIC SECRETARY OF STATE ON THIS.

>> IT'S IRONIC THE PUNCHING BAG OF THE ELECTION INTEGRITY CROWD FOR FAILING TO CLEAN THE VOTER ROLES.

THERE WASN'T A LOT OF PROOF OF THAT.

THIS WAS WITH THE VOTER REGISTRATION SYSTEM UNTIL THIS POINT REPUBLICAN LEADERSHIP HAS BEEN CARELY BEHIND.

WITH THAT BEING SAID, THE LEGAL ARGUMENTS ARE PRETTY COMPELLING.

VOTE AHEAD OF THE REPUBLICAN PARTY TO A FEDERAL VOTER LAW THAT SAID YOU CAN'T MAKE CHANGES TO THE VOTER ROLL.

>> AGAIN, AS FAR AS THE BIGGEST GROUP REPUBLICANS AND THE IDEA, AS FAR AS REPUBLICAN LEADERSHIP AND PETERSON HOW ARE THEY EXPLAINING IT'S OKAY.

LET'S GO AHEAD AND VOTE.

>> IT RELIES ON THE SAME ARGUMENT THE VOTER WAS MAKING WE HAVE LAWS ABOUT WHEN TO MAKE THE CHANGES WERE ARGUING, YES, VOTER ROLLS NEED TO BE CLEANED ALL THE WAY AROUND THE IMMATERIAL PACT IS HUGE.

IN THE STATEHOUSE AND SENATE MADE THE BIGGEST PUSH AND YOU KNOW, SOME OF THE MEASURES DRIVING TURNOUT AND THEY ARE GOING TO, YOU KNOW, RAISED LOTS OF MONEY AND THEY ARE TARGETING A HALF DOZEN.

FULLYOVER THE VOTERS IN THE SEATS, ESPECIALLY THE ONES THAT ARE REPUBLICAN VOTERS THEY CAN CLANG THE DYNAMIC.

THERE IS THE PROPOSITION ON THE BALLOT WE SPOKE ABOUT.

WE HAVE A LOT OF CONTENTIOUS THINGS ON THERE.

WE HAVE THE BORDER SECURITY INITIATIVE.

WE HAVE A CLOSED PRIMARY INITIATIVE IN RESPONSE TO THE OPEN PRIMARY.

WE SPOKE ABOUT ALL OF THOSE, YOU KNOW, 98,000 VOTERS OR SO.

THEY COULD MAKE A HUGE DIFFERENCE.

>> VOTE NOW AND SHOW THE DOCUMENTS LATER.

>> YES.

A BIT OF EASING OF RESTRICTIONS.

>> THEY FOUND $360 MILLION OF ESA VOUCHER MONEY STILL SITTING ON COFFEE AND KITCHEN TABLES?

>> YES, THEY PUT OUT A REPORT.

THEY DID AN ANALYSIS OF HOW THE FUNDS HAVE BEEN DISBURSED AND WHAT'S BEEN REPORTED.

$360 MILLION HAS GONE UNSPENT AND REMAINS IN THE COUNCIL OF STUDENTS AND UNDER THE CONTROL OF THEIR PARENTS.

THEY POINTED TO THIS AS AN EXAMPLE OF A PROBLEM.

IT'S NOT NECESSARILY WHAT PEOPLE EXPECT WOULD BE HAPPENING WITH THE VOUCHER MONEY.

THE IDEA IS THE MONEY WILL GO TO STUDENTS AND SPEND IT.

IF THEY DON'T SPEND IT ALL AND HOLDING IT.

THEIR GOAL IS TO RAISE THE QUESTION WHAT'S THE POINT AND WHY IS THIS HAPPENING?

AND WHY DID WE BUILD THE SYSTEM.

>> AS FAR AS WHY THIS IS HAPPENING FOLKS ARE SAVING IT FOR COLLEGE FUNDS.

>> THAT'S AN ALLOWABLE EXPENSE FOR ARIZONA HIGH SCHOOL STUDENTS THAT ARE IN THE VOUCHER PROGRAM GRADUATE THEY CAN ROLL IT OVER AND USE IT TOWARDS COLLEGE TUITION.

ONE OF THE BIGGEST ARGUMENTS MADE BY FOLKS THAT WANT TO REIGN IN THE PROGRAM A BIT.

FAMILIES THAT DIDN'T NEED THE MONEY AND ATTENDING PRIVATE SCHOOL ARE GETTING SUPPLEMENTAL MONEY THEY DIDN'T NEED.

SOME OF THEM ARE HOLDING ONTO THAT TO PAY FOR COLLEGE.

>> IMAGE PAYING FOR COLLEGE MAKES A BETTER SENSE OF GOLF CARTS AND OTHER STUFF.

THAT BEING SAID.

GRAND CANYON INSTITUTION SAID MONEY FROM THE OPIOID CRISIS.

115 TO 360 IS A HEALTHY CHUCK.

>> THAT'S ANOTHER ARGUMENT SINCE THE BILLION DOLLARS BUDGET DEFICIT.

THE ESA PROGRAM BLEW A WHOLE IN THE BUDGET.

THAT'S AN ARGUMENT AND THE MONEY COULD BE BETTER SPENT ELSEWHERE.

THE OBVIOUS USAGE IS THE MONEY YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT THAT LEAD THE ATTORNEY GENERAL AND GOVERNMENT TO FIGHT.

WE HEARD THE MONEY COULD BE BETTER SPENT ON PUBLIC SCHOOLS.

$360 MILLION ON TOP OF THE REST OF THE MONEY 54th OUT OF 51 IN TERMS OF SCHOOL FUNDING AND, YOU KNOW, I THINK THESE THINGS FEED TOGETHER.

YOU KNOW, THE PUBLIC EDUCATION CROWD GOES LOOK, WE ARE SPENDING THE FUNDS ON VOUCHERS.

23 IT'S A BIG EXPENSE DOWN THE LINE.

>> ASK THIS ERR TIME.

THE IDEA OF GUARDRAILS.

AS LONG ALSO IT'S REPUBLICAN LOSE THE CARRYOVER OF FUNDS MAKING AN IMPACT ON THIS UNSPENT PILE.

THAT WON'T HAPPEN, IS IT.

THEY WON'T PUT GUARDRAILS OR ACCOUNTABILITY ON IT.

THEIR EFFORTS ARE ALL ALONG THE WAY AS THE PROGRAM HAS GROWN IN SIZE.

THIS IS TO PUT IN RULES SIMILAR TO PUBLIC SCHOOLS.

TESTING AND YOU KNOW, ADMITTANCE FOR STUDENTS.

ALLOWABLE THINGS.

ANY KIND OF REPORTED.

THIS HAS BEEN DONE WITH THE REPUBLICAN LEAD LEGISLATURE.

THAT'S THE POINT.

TAKE THE MONEY OUT-OF-STATE SCHOOLS AND GIVE IT TO PARENTS AND LET THEM DO WHATEVER THEY WANT.

DOWN AT THE LEGISLATURE, WE GET LAWMAKERS CAMPED OUT ON BOTH SIDES AND STOP REFLECTING WHERE THE GENERAL PUBLIC IS.

I WAS TALKING TO AN ESA VOUCHER MOM.

WHEN I BROUGHT UP THE IDEA OF GUARDRAILS AND SAFETY NETS SHE WAS FOR THEM.

I DON'T THINK IT'S SIMPLE ENOUGH TO SAY EVERYONE THAT LIKES VOUCHERS DOESN'T WANT THE CHANGE AND PEOPLE THAT HATE THEM WANT THEM GONE.

BOTH SIDES ARE CAMPED OUT AND WE DON'T HAVE COMPROMISE ON MORE COMMON SENSE MODIFICATIONS.

>> WE SEE THAT IN PUBLIC POLLING.

THE CENTER FOR THE FUTURE OF ARIZONA.

THEY HAVE A BIG INITIATIVE WHERE THEY DID INTENSE PUBLIC POLLING OF ARIZONANS.

WHERE ARE PLACES THEY AGREE ON AND WHAT ARE THE THINGS, WHAT CROSSES PARTY LINES.

REPUBLICANS, DEMOCRATS, ONE THING THEY HIGH LIGHTED WAS ABOUT VOUCHER RESTRICTIONS.

SHOULD THE SCHOOLS HAVE TO FOLLOW THE SAME RULES AS PUBLIC SCHOOLS FOR EDUCATION AND RECORDS ADMITTANCE.

77% SAID YEAH, ABSOLUTELY, THAT SHOULD HAPPEN.

THAT HIGHLIGHTS THE DISCONNECT BETWEEN THE ELECTED OFFICIALS AND THE GENERAL VOTING PUBLIC.

YOU KNOW, FOR MOST THEY GO TO THE POLLS AND THE CHOICES ARE BETWEEN ONE OR TWO CAMPS.

THERE ISN'T AN OPTION.

>> WE SHOULD MENTION, NOT TODAY, ANOTHER LIST OF THINGS SHOWING HOW MUCH ARIZONANS IN TERMS OF THE SURVEY AGREE ON.

THEY DIDN'T SURVEY THEM.

MARK MEADOWS WON HIS TRIAL, HIS ARIZONA FAKE ELECTOR WHATEVER CONSPIRACY.

HE WANTS IT MOVED TO FEDERAL AND THE COURTS SAID I DON'T THINK SO.

>> HE MADE THE ARGUMENT HE'S COVERED UNDER FEDERAL SUPREMACY CLAUSE.

ANYTHING HE DID WAS UNDER THE COVER OF HIS OFFICIAL POSITION.

THE JUDGE KICKED IT BACK AND SIDED WITH THE ANTONIN SCALIA ATTORNEY GENERAL OFFICE THERE.

NOTHING ALLEGED TO HAVE DONE FALLS UNDER THE COVER OF THAT OFFICE.

CONSPIRING TO UNDERMIND THE RESULTS OF A PRESIDENTIAL E ELECTION.

YOU MIGHT ARGUE YOU DIDN'T DO THOSE THINGS.

>> I THINK HE SAID I WAS DOING MY JOB AND TELLING THE PRESIDENT.

THEY SAID THAT RINGS HALLOW.

>> THIS IS NOT THE FIRST TIME IT WAS REJECTED.

THEY TRIED TO DO THE SAME THING TO CHANGE VENUE.

THEY VIEW THE COURT SYSTEM I THINK YOU HINTED AT IT.

OVERTURNING AN ELECTION IS NOT THE JOB DUTY OR ANYONE IN THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT.

>> ALL RIGHT, CITY COUNCIL THE FIRST AMENDMENT IS OKAY.

THIS IS AFTER THEY GOT NOTARITY FOR ARRESTING A WOMAN AT A CITY COUNCIL MEETING SHE ENDED HER TIME AND GOT ARRESTED OBVIOUS FIRST AMENDMENT PROBLEM.

THEY REVERSED IT QUICKLY.

JOHN KAVANAUGH FILED THE REQUEST TO INVESTIGATE THE CITY ORDNANCE.

THAT WAS CONVINCED VERY QUICKLY THIS WAS A BAD ONE.

>> YOU HAVE SHARED FUNDS IN THERE.

>> THEY HAD THE POWER TO FILE WITH THE ATTORNEY GENERAL.

IF IN VIOLATION THEY GET THEIR SHARED FUNDING.

END OF STORY THERE.

>> SURPRISE IS NOT THE ONLY CITY THAT GOT THIS AND ENFORCED IT.

OTHERS HAVE IT.

JOHN KAVANAUGH, AFTER THEY REPEALED THE ORDNANCE WITHDREW HIS COMPLAINT.

HE ASKED IF THEY WERE CONSTITUTIONAL AND IF THEY COULD BE EN BE FORCED.

A WARNING SHOT TO EVERY OTHER MUNICIPALITY THAT MIGHT HAVE SOMETHING SIMILAR.

>> THE CITY OF SCOTTSDALE HAS A CASE GOING ON FOR FIVE YEARS NOW.

UNDER ACCUSATIONS HE WAS POLITICKING FROM THE PUBLIC COMMENT DESK.

HE TOOK THAT UP TO THE NINTH CIRCUIT.

100,000 IN LEGAL FEES RACKED UP.

IN DIFFERENT INSTANCES THEY SIDED WITH HIM.

>> INTERESTING.

WE HAVE A FEW MINUTES LEFT HERE WAYNE WE WILL STICK WITH YOU ON THIS ONE.

TO THE COTTON WOULD IT CITY COUNCIL RECALL EFFORT.

WHAT'S GOING ON HERE.

WENDY ROGERS POSTED A POSTOF A PHOTO WHERE SHE ENDORSED A WOMAN FROM THE CITY COUNCIL.

IT WAS ON LETTERHEAD WITH THE STATE SEAL.

YOU CANNOT USE ANY STATE INFLUENCES TO IMPACT THE ELECTION.

GOT A RESPONSE FROM HER DEMOCRATIC COUNT BEER PARTS.

>> SHE BASICALLY, AT LAST CHECK SHE TOOK IT DOWN QUICK.

>> SHE DELETED IT AND I DIDN'T KNOW IT WAS A PROBLEM.

>> JUST ANOTHER DAY IN THE LIFE OF WENDY ROGERS.

>> NEVER STOP SURPRISING AND GRABBING HEADLINES.

WE HAVE SEEN THESE THINGS HAPPEN BEFORE.

THIS IS NOT AN ISOLATED INCIDENT.

>> ALL RIGHT JIM AND WAYNE.

THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

THAT'S IT FOR NOW.

I'M TED SIMONS.

THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

HAVE A GREAT