>> BRAUDE: TONIGHT ON "GREATER BOSTON," TWO FORMER STATE CANNABIS CONTROL COMMISSION LEADERS JOIN ME ON THEIR LONG-RUNNING PUSH FOR EQUITY IN THE INDUSTRY, THE SLOW PROGRESS SO FAR, AND CURRENT EFFORTS TO SPEED THINGS UP.

PLUS, LOCAL NOBEL PRIZE WINNER CRAIG MELLO ON HOW THE R.N.A.

TECHNOLOGY HE DISCOVERED, I THINK SIMILAR TO THE ONE BEHIND THE MODERNA AND PFIZER COVID THE MODERNA AND PFIZER COVID VACCINES, COULD TARGET DISEASES LIKE A.L.S.

AND ALZHEIMERS, CURRENTLY WITHOUT CURES.

AND FINALLY, GROUNDTRUTH PROJECT CO-FOUNDER R. CHARLES SENNOTT ON HOW HE'S GETTING MOR JOURNALISTS INTO MORE NEWSROOMS ACROSS THE NATION, AND AROUND THE WORLD.

♪♪ >> BRAUDE: FIRST UP, MARIJUANA EQUITY.

IT WAS A MAIN GOAL THAT THE LEGALIZATION EFFORT HERE IN MASSACHUSETTS WAS BUILT UPON.

THE CANNABIS CONTROL COMMISSION EVEN SET UP A SOCIAL EQUITY PROGRAM SPECIFICALLY TO HELP PEOPLE DIRECTLY AFFECTED BY THE WAR ON DRUGS AND MARIJUANA PROHIBITION, TO GET IN ON THE LEGALIZED INDUSTRY.

BUT AS WE'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT EVERY FEW MONTHS FOR SIX YEARS NOW, WE ARE STILL NOT THERE.

LAST WEEK, STATE LAWMAKERS STARTED NEGOTIATIONS ON A BILL AIMED AT DIVERTING A PORTION OF THE STATE'S MARIJUANA TAX REVENUE TO EQUITY APPLICANTS, AS WELL AS MAKING IT EASIER FOR PEOPLE WITH MARIJUANA CHARGES TO WIPE THEM FROM THEIR RECORD, SOMETHING THAT SEVERAL OTHER STATES HAVE ALREADY DONE, BY THE WAY.

HERE'S WHERE WE STAND NOW: WHEN LAST WE DISCUSSED THE SITUATION ON THIS SHOW IN FEBRUARY, THE LATEST LICENSING NUMBERS SHOWED THAT OF 350 MARIJUANA-RELATED BUSINESSES THAT HAD REACHED THE "COMMENCE OPERATIONS" PHASE, ONLY 13 WERE SOCIAL EQUITY APPLICANTS.

THAT'S 3.7%.

TODAY, WITH THE INCREASED PUSH, AND 420 LICENSES GRANTED, WE'RE UP TO 22, OR 5.2% GOING TO SOCIAL EQUITY APPLICANTS.

AN INCREASE, SURE.

BUT NOT WHAT VOTERS EMBRACED ON THE BALLOT IN 2016.

AND I'M GUESSING MY NEXT GUESTS WOULD AGREE, STEVEN HOFFMAN IS FORMER CHAIR OF THE MASSACHUSETTS CANNABIS CONTROL COMMISSION.

AND SHALEEN TITLE A FORMER COMMISSIONER ON THE C.C.C.

SHE ALSO CO-WROTE THE 2016 RECREATIONAL MARIJUANA BALLOT QUESTION, INCLUDING LEADING THE EQUITY-RELATED SECTIONS, AND IS NOW CHIEF EXECUTIVE OF THE CANNABIS POLICY THINK TANK PARABOLA CENTER.

>> Braude: GREAT TO SEE YOU, SHALEEN AND STEVE.

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR BEING HERE.

I WANT TO START WITH YOU, SO PEOPLE AT HOME ARE CLEAR, THERE WAS EQUITY LANGUAGE IN THE BALLOT QUESTION THAT WAS ADOPTED.

IT IS NOT JUST A NICE IDEA; IT IS THE LAW IN MASSACHUSETTS, CORRECT?

>> THAT'S RIGHT.

MASSACHUSETTS WAS THE FIRST STATE TO REQUIRE LEGISLATORS TO REQUIRE EQUITY.

>> Braude: LANGUAGE IN THE BALLOT?

>> THAT IS RIGHT.

>> Braude: I ASSUME YOU WOULD SAY, STEVE, THERE WAS SOME PROGRESS?

BUT WHAT IS IN THE WAY?

>>> BY FAR THE BIGGEST OBSTACLE WAS THE LACK OF FUNDING FOR ENTREPRENEURS TO START OF BUSINESSES IN THE LEGALIZED CANNABIS INDUSTRY.

AND THE AGE PROCESS GOT IN THE WAY, A HARD, EXPENSIVE PROCESS -- >> Braude: HOST COMMUNITY AGREEMENTS, AGREEMENTS NEGOTIATED BETWEEN THE APPLICANT AND THE CITY OR TOWN?

>> CORRECT.

AND THE LAW REQUIRES THEM TO HAVE -- APPLICANTS TO HAVE A HOST AGREEMENT IN PLACE BEFORE THEY COULD APPLY TO THE COMMISSION.

AND IT WAS TIME-CONSUMING AND SOMEWHAT RANDOM.

>> Braude: ONE THING I NEVER QUITE UNDERSTOOD, AND I HOPE I GET THIS RIGHT, YOU GUYS, THE STATE WISE COMMISSION, WERE REQUIRED TO PROMOTE, BUT CITIES AND TOWNS WERE NOT UNDER THE SAME REQUIREMENT.

IS THAT JUST A DRAFTING PROBLEM OR THE LEGISLATURE IS ASLEEP?

WHAT IS THE DEAL WITH THAT.

[LAUGHTER] >> Braude: I'M SERIOUS, YOU WROTE THE DAMN THING, SO WHAT IS THE DEAL?

>> I WOULD ARGUE THAT THE MUNICIPAL PROCESS WAS MEANT TO INCLUDE EQUITY.

BUT IT TURNED OUT TO BE CORRUPT.

WE HAVE SEEN MULTIPLE PEOPLE GET ARRESTED FOR TRYING TO BRIBE LOCAL OFFICIALS.

IF WHAT IT TAKES IS TO CLEARLY CLARIFY THE MUNICIPALITY OR SUBJECT TO THE SAME REQUIREMENTS, THAT WHAT WE NEED TO DO.

>> Braude: THAT'S ONE OF THE THINGS THE LEGISLATURE WILL THEORETICALLY BE DOING NOW.

A COUPLE OF THINGS: ONE, CRACKDOWN OF ABUSE OF LOCAL FEES BY CITIES AND TOWNS, BASICALLY MEANING THEY CAN'T CHARGE FOR COSTS THAT DON'T EXIST.

I KNOW CITY AND TOWN LEADERS SAY IT IS A PROBLEM.

IT IS NOT A PROBLEM.

IT WOULD HELP MAKE IT EASIER TO CLEAR A RECORD FOR SOMEBODY WHO IS A DEFENDANT, SOMEBODY WHO SUFFERED AS A RESULT OF THE MARIJUANA LAWS IN THE PAST.

I WANT TO TALK TO YOU ABOUT FUNDING.

THERE IS MONEY IN EACH THE HOUSE AND SENATE VERSIONS DIRECTED TO DIVERSITY AND EQUITY INITIATIVES.

MY UNDERSTANDING IS THE TOP AMOUNT IS $25 MILLION, AND THE LOWER AMOUNT, THEY HAVE TO NEGOTIATE THIS, IS HALF.

IS THAT ENOUGH?

THE ANSWER IS NO.

>> THE ANSWER IS NO.

YOU HAVE TO THINK ABOUT THE ECONOMICS OF STARTING A BUSINESS.

ONE OF THE THINGS I'M PROUD WE DID WAS TO CREATE DELIVERY LICENSES -- >> Braude: IT IS NOT LIKE A BRICK AND MORTAR -- >> EXACTLY.

BUT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT RETAIL IN SOME OF THE PRICIER AREAS OF THE STATE, A COUPLE OF MILLION DOLLARS.

AND THE NUMBERS START GOING UP.

IT DEPENDS ON TWO THINGS: ONE IS, HOW WIDELY DO YOU WANT TO HELP PEOPLE.

AND THE SECOND THING, AND I THINK IT IS REALLY IMPORTANT, IS THE WAY THE LEGISLATION IS STRUCTURED IT ALLOWS FOR PRIVATE MONEY.

I THINK IF THE OBJECTIVE IS TO MAKE SURE THERE IS PLENTY OF PRIVATE MONEY COMING IN, I THINK PEOPLE ARE WAITING FOR THERE TO BE A STRUCTURE THEY CAN CONTRIBUTE TO, I THINK THAT FUNDING CAN BE BRIDGED -- >> Braude: YOU'RE SAYING IF PRIVATE INVESTORS KNOW THERE IS PUBLIC MONEY, THAT SEED THING -- >> TWO THINGS.

THE STATE IS PREMATURE BY CREATING THIS FUND WILL ALLOW FOR PRIVATE FUNDING.

AND I THINK THE OTHER THING THAT IS IMPORTANT IS THERE WAS NO STRUCTURE.

I TALKED TO A BUNCH OF THE BIGGER COMPANIES, AND THEY WANTED TO MAKE A CONTRIBUTION.

THERE WAS NO PLACE TO DO IT.

>> Braude: YOU WANTED A BANK CREATED, A STATE BANK CREATED?

>> THAT WAS EARLY WHEN I WAS YOUNG AND NAIVE.

>> Braude: I LIKED THAT.

>> THAT'S A GREAT IDEA.

>> Braude: WHEN YOU WERE CHAIR, EVERY TIME YOU WERE WITH ME, YOU WERE VERY, PUT IT THIS WAY, POLITE TO THE LEGISLATURE -- >> I WILL CONTINUE TOB.

>> Braude: I DON'T THINK YOU HAVE TO BE.

25 MILA MAX, IS THAT INTENDED TO BE THE SEED OR IS THIS JUST A TOKEN THEN TO THROW MONEY TO SHOW WE'RE TRYING TO ADVANCE EQUITY, BUT -- >> NO.

$25 MILLION IS REAL MONEY.

DO I WISH FOR MORE, ABSOLUTELY.

BUT THE WAY THIS THING WAS STRUCTURED FROM THE VERY BEGINNING, WHEN WE FIRST STARTED TALKING ABOUT THIS, THAT IT WOULD BE A PARTNERSHIP BETWEEN PUBLIC AND PRIVATE SOURCES.

AND I'M HOPING THAT CENTURY WAY IT TURNS OUT.

>> Braude: BACK TO THE ISSUE, SHALEEN, THAT EQUITY BE MANDATED BY CITIES AND TOWNS, IT IS EXPLICIT IN THIS LEGISLATION, BUT WE DON'T KNOW IT IS GOING TO COME OUT -- WE ASSUME IT IS GOING TO COME OUT, ASSUMING THEY CAN CUT A DEAL BEFORE THEY TAKE A FIVE-MONTH VACATION, WHICH IS ANOTHER ISSUE -- THEY LEAVE ON JULY 31st, THAT WOULD GO A LONG WAY, LET'S BE CLEAR, TO SOLVE THIS PROBLEM.

THAT WOULD BE A HUGE THING.

>> IT WOULD.

I THINK THE LEGISLATURE DESERVES A LOT OF CREDIT BECAUSE IT TOOK A LOT OF TIME, AND IT WAS A HUGE EFFORT STARTED BY THE EQUITY APPLICANTS THEMSELVES WHO WERE POINTING OUT THESE PROBLEMS.

IN THE END, THE HOUSE AND SENATE HAVE BOTH PASSED GOOD BILLS.

WHEN IT COMES TO MUNICIPALITIES, THERE IS A VERSION THAT REQUIRES THEM TO BE SUBJECT TO THE SAME ENCOURAGED EQUITY.

THERE IS ALSO INCENTIVES TO WORK WITH SOCIAL EQUITY BUSINESSES, FINANCIAL INCENTIVES, AND THERE IS ALSO A WAY YOU WOULD LOSE MONEY AS A MUNICIPALITY IF YOU DON'T.

>> Braude: WHAT ARE THEY NOT DOING THAT YOU THINK THEY SHOULD BE DOING TO ADVANCE THE EQUITY BALL -- >> THEY MEANING THE LEGISLATURE?

>> YES.

>> AUTOMATIC EXPONGEING -- >> Braude: HOW ABOUT YOU?

>> I'M PRETTY HAPPY.

WE'VE BEEN WORKING ON THIS FOR THREE YEARS.

I JUST WANT TO TAKE A LITTLE SIDE STEP.

WE HAVE BEEN WORKING ON THIS FOR FOUR YEARS, SHALEEN AND MYSELF, AND EVERY COMMISSIONER AND THE FORMER COMMISSIONERS HAVE WORKED ON THIS, INCLUDING STAFF, SEAN COLLINS.

THIS IS A COLLECTIVE EFFORT -- >> Braude: I KNOW IT IS NOT DONE -- >> I'M NOT DECLARING -- >> Braude: THEY DISAPPEAR ON JULY 31st.

>> I'M NOT TEMPTING THE LEGISLATURE GODS TO GET MAD AT ME.

FIRST OF ALL, IT HAS BEEN A GROUP EFFORT.

AND FOR THE FOUR YEARS, WE'VE BEEN WORKING ON THREE YEARS: ONE, A SOCIAL EQUITY FUND, AND CLARITY, THAT SHALEEN TALKED ABOUT.

ONE PROBLEM IS THERE HAS BEEN NO OVERSIGHT, I THINK THE LEGISLATURE CLARIFIES THAT.

AND THIRD, A PIECE NOT GETTING A LOT OF COVERAGE, IS ALLOWING FOR CITIES AND TOWNS TO OPT IN TO SOCIAL CONSUMPTIONS.

THEY'RE ADDRESSING THOSE THREE ISSUES.

I'M NOT GOING TO NITPICK.

>> Braude: IS IT STILL A PROBLEM FOR INTRASTATE PURPOSES, THAT MARIJUANA IS CLASSIFIED AS A LEVEL ONE DRUG -- >> THERE IS SOME RESEARCH, BUT IT WOULD BE A BIGGER PROBLEM TO SEE FEDERAL DESCHEDULING WITHOUT ANY PROTECTIONS -- >> Braude: YOU DISAPPEARED.

YOU LEFT FOUR OR FIVE MONTHS EARLY WITH NO EXPLANATION, AND THE COMMISSION DIDN'T EVEN TELL THE PUBLIC FOR A WEEK YOU HAD LEFT.

WHAT IS THE UNTOLD STORY?

>> IT WAS THE TIME TO LEAVE.

I'M NOT GOING TO LOOK RETROSPECTIVELY.

>> Braude: BUT WHY DID YOU LEAVE?

>> IT WAS THE RIGHT TIME TO LEAVE.

>> Braude: WHY DIDN'T THEY TELL US?

>> ASK THEM.

>> Braude: I'M ASKING YOU.

>> IT WAS THE RIGHT TIME TO LEAVE.

>> Braude: IS THERE A STORY YOU'RE NOT TELLING?

>> NO.

IT WAS THE RIGHT TIME TO LEAVE.

I FELT LIKE I ACCOMPLISHED WHAT I CAME TO DO, AND IT WAS TIME TO LEAVE.

A NEW COMMISSION, AND I'M PROUD -- I'M INCREDIBLY PROUD OF WHAT WE ACCOMPLISHED AND NO REGRETS, BUT IT WAS TIME TO LEAVE.

>> Braude: IF THE THINGS YOU AND STEVE TALKED ABOUT ARE IN THE LEGISLATION AND IT MAKES IT ON TO THE GOVERNOR'S DESK AND HE SIGNS IT, WAS THE MANDATE DELIVERED BY THE VOTERS IN NOVEMBER OF 2016 MET?

>> IF IT IS ADEQUATELY FUNDED -- WE DON'T KNOW THAT YET.

BUT IF SO, WE'RE WELL UNDER WAY.

>> Braude: GREAT TO SEE YOU BOTH.

YOU DON'T HAVE TO BE NICE TO THEM ANYMORE.

DO YOU UNDERSTAND THAT?

>> I'M A NICE TIME.

>> Braude: THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR YOUR TIME.

>> Braude: PEOPLE OFTEN HOPE FOR FAME AND SUCCESS TO FALL INTO THEIR LAP, BUT FOR ME, IT WAS THE OTHER WAY AROUND, ABOUT A WEEK AGO AT A RESTAURANT IN HARVARD SQUARE.

THE LAP I ALMOST FELL INTO?

THAT OF DOCTOR CRAIG MELLO, A NOBEL PRIZE WINNER.

BETTER YET, A LOCAL NOBEL PRIZE WINNER WHO, ALONG WITH HIS PARTNER ANDREW FIRE, GOT THE 2006 MEDICINE AWARD FOR THE DISCOVERY OF SOMETHING CALLED INTERFERING R.N.A.

IT'S VERY CLOSELY RELATED TO MESSENGER R.N.A., OR M.R.N.A., I THINK, WHICH WE'VE HEARD SO MUCH ABOUT OVER THE PAST COUPLE YEARS, THANKS TO THE MODERNA AND PFIZER COVID VACCINES.

SO NEVER ONE TO MISS AN OPPORTUNITY, I NO SOONER AROSE FROM A NEAR FACE PLANT ON HIS TABLE THAN I ASKED IF HE'D BE WILLING TO JOIN ME TO TELL US HOW R.N.A.

SCIENCE COULD CHANGE OUR COLLECTIVE LIVES NEXT, AND HE VERY KINDLY AGREED.

DOCTOR CRAIG MELLO IS A PROFESSOR OF MOLECULAR MEDICINE AT UMASS MEDICAL SCHOOL IN WORCESTER, WHERE HE RUNS THE MELLO LAB.

>> Braude: IT IS GREAT TO HAVE YOU HERE.

THANKS SO MUCH.

>> THANKS, JIM.

IT IS GREAT TO BE HERE.

>> Braude: HOW SCARED WHEN YOU WHEN I WAS HURTLING TOWARDS YOUR TABLE -- >> I WOULD HAVE CAUGHT YOU, I PROMISE.

>> Braude: I DON'T THINK YOU COULD, BUT THANK YOU FOR THE PROMISE.

MY UNDERSTANDING IS YOU DISCOVERED THE WAY TO BLOCK THE EFFECTS OF INDIVIDUAL GENES IN CELLS.

DO I HAVE TO RIGHT SO FAR?

>> YES.

>> Braude: TRANSLATE INTO ENGLISH FOR ME.

WHAT DOES THAT MEAN?

>> WHAT WE DISCOVERED IS THAT CELLS, EVERY CELL IN YOUR BODY, HAS A LITTLE SEARCH ENGINE, A PROGRAMMABLE SEARCH ENGINE.

IT IS LIKE A LITTLE GOOGLE INSIDE THE CELL THAT IS PROGRAMMED NATURALLY BY SHORT INQUIRIES MADE OUT OF GENETIC INFORMATION, R.N.A.s AND IT GUIDES TO TARGETS INSIDE THE CELL AND THEN THEY CAN REGULATE THEM OR SILENCE THEM -- IN MOST CASES SILENCE THEM.

AND THIS ENABLES -- WHAT IS SO EXCITING ABOUT IT IS NOT ONLY THAT IT EXISTS, BUT WHEN WE DISCOVERED IT, WE DISCOVERED WE COULD PROGRAM THE SEARCH MECHANISM ARTIFICIALLY.

SO WE COULD ACTUALLY GIVE THE CELL AN R.N.A.

THAT THE CELL WOULD THEN USE AS A QUERY TO FIND INFORMATION, ENABLING RESEARCHERS TO MAKE ARTIFICIAL QUERIES IN THE LAB TO GET THE CELL TO CARRY OUT A GUIDED SEARCH, USING THAT INFORMATION TO FIND AND SILENCE THE TARGET GENE.

>> Braude: TO POTENTIALLY WHAT END?

YOU SILENCE THAT GENE TO WHAT END?

>> Doctor: SO WHEN WE DISCOVERED THIS, AS YOU MAY REMEMBER THE EARLY 2000s, THE HUMAN GENOME WAS FINALLY COMING TOGETHER.

ALL OF A SUDDEN WE HAD ALL OF THIS GENETIC INFORMATION ABOUT NOT ONLY WHY PEOPLE GET SICK BUT WHY SOME PEOPLE ARE HEALTHIER THAN NORMAL.

SO WE HAD ALREADY A GREAT DEAL OF INFORMATION ABOUT HUMAN GENETICS, AND THAT INFORMATION HAS JUST BEEN GROWING ASTRONOMICALLY AS WE CAN SEQUENCE PEOPLE'S GENOMES MORE QUICKLY.

>> Braude: ARE THERE THERAPIES -- IT HAS BEEN 16 YEARS -- ARE THERE THERAPIES THAT HAVE COME OUT OF YOUR WORK?

YES.

>> Braude: FOR WHAT KIND OF THING?

>> Doctor: THERE ARE APPROVED THERAPIES FOR A VARIETY OF DIFFERENT LIVER DISORDERS.

SOME OF THEM ARE VERY, VERY BAD, LIFE-THREATENING LIFE-THREATENING, IN FACT, LETHAL, GENETIC, INBORN TYPES DISEASES WHERE THE CAUSATIVE GENE WAS IDENTIFIED BASED ON THE GENOME PROJECT AND HUMAN GENETICS, AND THESE INDIVIDUALS WHO ARE GETTING SICK -- THESE GENES WERE IDENTIFIED, AND THEN THE OPPORTUNITY TO MAKE THESE DRUGS CAME ALONG RIGHT ABOUT THE SAME TIME.

AND THESE DRUGS CAN THEN TAKE -- BE GIVEN TO A PATIENT -- >> Braude: TO KILL THE BAD GUYS.

>> Doctor: -- AND THEY TURN OFF THE GENE THAT IS DRIVING THE DISEASE.

>> Braude: I READ AN INTERVIEW BY YOU WHERE YOU SAID YOU WERE TARGETING -- YOUR HOPE WAS CERTAIN DISEASES LIKE ALZHEIMER'S, A.L.S., THE NO-CURE-FOR DISEASES MIGHT BE WITHIN THE SCOPE OF THIS TECHNOLOGY.

ARE YOU STILL FEELING THAT WAY?

>> Doctor: YES, INDEED.

WE ARE VERY EXCITED ABOUT GOING AFTER DISORDERS OF THE CENTRAL NERVOUS SYSTEM, AND THE PROBLEM HAS BEEN THAT, YOU KNOW, WE'RE TRYING TO GIVE THE CELL A SEARCH QUIERE TO ENTER INTO THIS NATURAL MECHANISM, BUT WE'RE COMING AT IT FROM THE OUTSIDE.

WE'RE MAKING A MOLECULE AND GET THEM INTO YOUR BODY.

THAT'S WHY THE LIVER WAS AN EASIER TARGET BECAUSE IT FILTERS ALL OF THE BLOOD.

IF YOU GIVE IT ANY DRUG TO A PATIENT AT ALL, A LOT OF IT GOES TO THE LIVER.

BUT GETTING INTO THE BRAIN REQUIRED A LOT MORE WORK.

BUT NEVERTHELESS, WE CAN NOW DELIVER THESE MOLECULES VERY WELL INTO THE BRAIN.

>> Braude: HOW DO YOU FEEL I ALMOST UNDERSTAND THIS.

YOU WON YOUR NOBEL PRIZE, YOU AND YOUR COLLEAGUE -- THIS IS FROM A LONG TIME AGO -- AND SOME OF THE COMMENTSCOMMENTERS WERE SAYING YOU WANTED IT CLOSER TO YOUR WORK THAN MOST SCIENTISTS?

WHAT DOES THAT MEAN?

>> Doctor: IT WAS, IN FACT, A REALLY EXCITING DISCOVERY FROM THE STANDPOINT, AS I JUST TOLD YOU, THAT IT WAS A NATURAL, PROGRAM PROGRAMMABLE MECHANISM IF WE COULD THINK OR MAKE DRUGS, IT WOULD ENABLE US TO MAKE DRUGS THAT MODULATE GENE CONSTRUCTION, TO GO TO THE UNDERLYING CAUSES OF THE DISEASE.

>> Braude: I WAS TOO NERVOUS TO LOOK AT YOU WHEN I WAS SAYING IT IS SIMILAR TO THE mRNA STUFF THAT NONE OF US HERE ABOUT ABOUT BECAUSE OF THE VACCINES -- >> Doctor: YOU'RE CONTINUING TO GET A C-MINUS.

>> Braude: IS THERE ANY CONNECTION?

>> Doctor: THERE IS A CONNECTION.

R.N.A.

IS A CHAIN.

I LIKE TO GIVE PEOPLE A LITTLE PRIMER ON THESE THINGS WHEN I TRY TO EXPLAIN WHAT I WORK ON.

THERE ARE JUST FOUR LETTERS IN THE GENETIC CODE.

AND THEY'RE STRUNG TOGETHER IN THE POLYMERS IN OR D.N.A., AND R.N.A.

IS A VERSION OF THAT POLYMER CODE.

AND THESE SHORT PIECES OF CODE CAN BE USED.

YOU DON'T NEED MUCH.

LIKE TO FIND McBETH, YOU JUST NEED "TO BE OR NOT TO BE."

YOU DON'T NEED THE WHOLE PLAY.

YOU CAN JUST FIND IT.

>> Braude: THANK YOU FOR NOT EMBARRASSING ME.

I HAD DR. FAUCI ON, AND HERE IS WHAT HE HAD TO SAY.

>> WE ARE LIVING, RIGHT NOW, INTO WHAT I THINK IS A GROWING ANTI-SCIENCE ATTITUDE.

WE'VE SEEN THAT GROWING OVER THE PAST FEW YEARS, AND IT IS REACHING A POINT NOW WITH COVID WHERE SOME VERY OBVIOUS SCIENTIFIC TRUTHS, BASED ON CLEAR-CUT, VERY VISIBLE DATA, ARE REJECTED BY PEOPLE.

THE ANTI-SCIENCE ATMOSPHERE THAT MANY OF US HAVE EXPERIENCED IS VERY TROUBLING.

>> Braude: DO YOU SHARE HIS CONCERN?

I ASSUME IT CAN AFFECT FUNDING, HOW MANY KIDS DECIE THEY WANT TO BECOME YOU.

DO YOU WORRY ABOUT IT LIKE DR. FAUCI DOES?

>> Doctor: ABSOLUTELY.

IT IS VERY WORRISOME FOR MANY REASONS.

IF THE ATTITUDE PERSISTS, OTHER COUNTRIES ARE GOING TO EAT OUR LUNCH.

>> Braude: HOW DO WE DISABUSE PEOPLE OF THIS WHEN WE SEEM TO BE SUCH A FACT ADVERSE SOCIETY?

HOW DO WE DO THIS?

>> Doctor: WHEN YOU'RE TRYING TO BRING ALONG EVERYONE, OF COURSE THERE IS THE CHALLENGE.

WE ACTUALLY DO HAVE A REALLY, REALLY HEALTHY SCIENTIFIC ENTERPRISE IN THIS COUNTRY.

I'M NOT SO CONCERNED THAT SCIENCE WON'T KEEP PLOWING AHEAD DESPITE THE HEAD WINDS.

MOST PEOPLE IN GOVERNMENT, IT SEEMS, AT LEAST VALUE THE OUTCOMES THAT SCIENCE BRINGS TO THE TABLE.

>> Braude: LET'S HOPE IT STAYS THAT WAY.

>> Doctor: BUT, YEAH, IT IS A REAL CONCERN TO ME TO SEE HOW PEOPLE ARE SPREADING INFORMATION AND MISINFORMATION -- >> Braude: IS EVERYBODY NICE TO YOU NOW THAT YOU WON A NOBEL PRIZE, WHO WASN'T NICE TO YOU BEFORE -- >> Doctor: IT HAS BEEN WONDERFUL.

I LOVE TO GET ON A LAY SHOW LIKE THIS AND EXPLAIN R.N.A.

TO PEOPLE I FIND THIS STUFF SO INCREDIBLE.

WHAT I LOVE ABOUT SCIENCE IS THE MORE YOU DISCOVER, THE MORE YOU EXPLORE, THE MORE MYSTERIOUS EVERYTHING GETS, RIGHT?

IT IS JUST LIKE THOSE IMAGES -- >> Braude: I KNEW YOU WERE GOING TO SAY THAT.

>> Doctor: -- FROM THE NEW TELESCOPE.

>> Braude: WELL, I HOPE YOU FALL INTO YOUR LAP AGAIN.

THANK YOU.

>> Doctor: THANK YOU, JIM.

>> BRAUDE: CRAIG MELLO, THANKS.

AT A TIME WHEN WE NEED MORE STRONG JOURNALISTS, NEWS ORGANIZATIONS ACROSS THE COUNTRY ARE CONTINUING TO SHED STAFF.

PEW RESEARCH NUMBERS AS OF LAST YEAR FOUND U.S. NEWSROOM EMPLOYMENT WAS DOWN 26% FROM 2008, ACROSS NEWSPAPER, RADIO, BROADCAST TV, CABLE TV AND DIGITAL OUTLETS.

BUT SOME OUTLETS ARE BUCKING THAT TREND, LIKE THE REPORT FOR AMERICA PROGRAM.

LAUNCHED BACK IN 2017, IT PUTS JOURNALISTS IN NEWSROOMS ACROSS THE COUNTRY WITH THE MISSION OF COVERING UNDERSERVED ISSUES AND COMMUNITIES.

IT'S AN INITIATIVE OF THE GROUNDTRUTH PROJECT HERE AT GBH, AND SOON, CO-FOUNDER CHARLES SENNOTT WILL BE DEDICATING A LOT MORE TIME TO THIS AND OTHER GROUNDTRUTH EDITORIAL INITIATIVES, AS HE STEPS DOWN AS PRESIDENT AND C.E.O.

OF THE NEARLY 10-YEAR-OLD ORGANIZATION TO FOCUS ON HIS ROLE AS EDITOR-IN-CHIEF, AND GET BACK TO HIS ROOTS IN ON-THE-GROUND JOURNALISM.

CHARLES SENNOTT JOINS ME NOW.

>> Braude: WITH A BIG SMILE, HE JOINS ME.

NEWSROOMS ARE SHUTTING DOWN, COLOSSAL NUMBERS, AND YOU'RE GOING IN THE OPPOSITE DIRECTION.

I THINK, LIKE, 1500 JOURNALISTS HAVE WORKED THROUGH GROUND TRUTH.

IS THIS A GROUND TRUTH AN ANOMALY?

>> NO, THERE IS.

THIS IS A REALLY BIG IDEA.

REPORT FOR AMERICA IS A SERVICE PROGRAM.

THIS IS TEACH FOR AMERICA FOR JOURNALISM.

REPORT FOR AMERICA IS VERY MUCH A SERVICE PROGRAM.

AND THE IDEA IS THERE IS A TREMENDOUS YEARNING, PARTICULARLY AMONG EMERGING JOURNALISTS, TO SERVE COMMUNITIES.

JOURNALISM IS ULTIMATELY ABOUT SERVING COMMUNITIES.

THERE IS A CRISIS, AND WE'RE SEEING TWO NEWSPAPERS A WEEK DIE IN THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.

WE NOW HAVE 2,000 COMMUNITIES THAT DON'T HAVE LOCAL NEWS ORGANIZATIONS.

THAT CRISIS IN LOCAL NEWS BECOMES A CRISIS IN DEMOCRACY.

WE'RE SEEING A WHOLE NEW GENERATION THAT WANTS TO BE PART OF SERVING THIS COMMUNITIES.

THE CALL TO SERVICE WORKS VERY WELL HERE IN THE STATES.

THAT'S WHY WE HAD SUCH LUCK -- >> Braude: HOW MANY STATES YOU IN?

>> WE'RE IN EVERY STATE.

>> Braude: WHO IS PAYING FOR THIS THING?

>> GOOD QUESTION.

THIS IS THE PART OF MY JOB I'M NOT GOING TO BE ABLE TO GIVE.

WE ARE A NON-PROFIT -- >> Braude: YOU PAY FOR THE WHOLE THING WHEN YOU ASSIGN A REPORTER -- >> WE PAY FOR HALF OF THE REPORTER'S SALARY, AND WE HELP THE NEWS ORGANIZATION RAISE THE OTHER LOCALLY.

LIKE THE KNIGHT FOUNDATION, THE MCARTHUR FOUNDATION -- WE PULL TOGETHER NATIONAL FUNDING FOR HALF THE SALARY, AND WE HELP THE NEWS ORGANIZATIONS GO INTO THE COMMUNITY FOUNDATIONS IN THEIR BACKYARD, TELLING THOSE COMMUNITY FOUNDATIONS YOU HAVE TO CARE ABOUT YOUR LOCAL NEWS ORGANIZATION.

BECAUSE IF YOU DON'T, YOU'RE COMMUNITY IS GOING TO HAVE THREE THINGS HAPPEN: VOTER PARTICIPATION IS GOING TO PLUMMET, POLARIZATION IS GOING TO INCREASE, AND REALLY INTERESTING, BOND RATES WILL DROP BECAUSE BANKS WILL NOT INVEST IN THOSE COMMUNITIES WHO DON'T HAVE ANYONE WATCHING THE STORE.

>> Braude: THAT MAKES TOTAL SENSE.

>> RIGHT?

SO THE DEATH OF THE AMERICAN NEWSPAPERS HAS TAKEN ITS TOLL ON AMERICAN DEMOCRACY AND WE'RE TRYING TO COUNTER THAT TREND.

>> Braude: AND REPORT FOR THE WORLD IS A VARIATION ON THE SAME THEME.

AND YOU'RE IN A BUNCH OF COUNTRIES?

>> THAT'S RIGHT.

WE THOUGHT WHATH IF WHAT IF WE BROUGHT OUR INTERNATIONAL REPORTING, AND WE'VE HAD GREAT SUCCESS IN BRAZIL.

VERY SIMILAR PROBLEM WHERE A LOCAL NEWS CRISIS IS HAPPENING.

AND WE'RE IN NIGERIA, AND THE NEWSPAPERS THAT ARE THERE CAN LITERALLY SAVE LIVES BY DISPELLING RUMORS THAT GET VILLAGES CLASHING.

AND WE'RE IN INDIANA, WHERE THERE IS A BIG CONGLOMERATE IN THE BIG CITIES, BUT THE POORER CITIES DO NOT HAVE LOCAL NEWS, AND WE'RE GOING TO EXPAND.

>> Braude: UKRAINE IS ON YOUR LIST?

>> UKRAINE IS ON OUR LIST.

WE'RE LOOKING AT APPLICATIONS RIGHT NOW.

SO REPORT FOR THE WORLD IS ON A GROWTH WORLD.

REPORT FOR AMERICA IS AS WELL.

TODAY WE ANNOUNCED THE OPENING OF APPLICATIONS FOR MORE NEWSROOMS FOR REPORT FOR AMERICA.

SO YOU CAN LITERALLY -- IF YOU KNOW SOMEONE WITH A NEWSROOM THAT IS SUFFERING OUT THERE, THERE ARE SOME HERE IN THE COMMONWEALTH OF MASSACHUSETTS THAT NEED HELP.

>> Braude: THERE IS A LOT OF DANGEROUS PLACES.

YOU'VE BEEN EVERYWHERE, FROM IRAQ TO AFGHANISTAN, TO TERREAR SQUARE.

AND YOU ALSO HAD A CLOSE RELATIONSHIP WITH JAMES FOLEY, AND EVERYBODY KNOWS HE WAS ABDUCTED IN SYRIA IN 2012 AND MURDERED.

HE IS PRETTY CENTRAL TO YOUR MISSION AND WORK, NO?

>> JIM FOLEY IS IN MY HEART EVERY DAY.

HE IS OUR TRUE NORTH.

HE WAS ABOUT SERVICE.

HE DID TWO TOURS WITH "TEACH FOR AMERICA."

HE TAUGHT LITERACY IN PRISONS.

THEN HE WORKED IN A WOMEN'S SHELTER, AND THEN HE BECAME A JOURNALIST.

AND THOSE OF US WHO WERE LUCKY ENOUGH TO WORK WITH HIM AND KNOW HIM, HE HAD A BEAUTIFUL SPIRIT OF SERVICE.

TO BE THERE TO GIVE PEOPLE A CHANCE TO GIVE THEIR VOICE OUT TO THE WORLD.

HE WAS SO COMMITTED TO IT.

SO JIM IS URGENTLY INVOLVED IN EVERYTHING WE DO BECAUSE HE GAVE US THAT MOTIVATION, AND ALSO JUST TO REMIND EVERYONE, I'M KNOWN MORE FOR THAT WORK IN IRAQ AND AFGHANISTAN, PARTICULARLY HERE IN BOSTON, WHERE I WAS "THE BOSTON GLOBE'S" MIDDLE EAST CORRESPONDENT.

I BEGAN INTERNATIONAL REPORTING AS A POLICE REPORTER IN NEW YORK CITY WITH A REALLY BAT REAL REALLY BAD MULLET HAIRCUT.

AND I RESPONDED TO THE FIRST WORLD TRADE CENTER BOMBING.

SO GLOBAL REPORTING ALWAYS AS A GLOBAL SENSE TO IT.

THAT WAS IN OUR MISSION.

JIM FOLEY HAD THAT IDEA, TOO, THE IDEA THAT GLOBAL AND LOCAL ARE WOVEN TOGETHER.

>> Braude: IN UKRAINE ALMOST EVERY DAY AND IN PALESTINE -- I KNOW YOU DO TRAINING FOR YOUR YOUNG REPORTERS, WHICH HAS TO BE TERRIFYING, HOW TO TIE A TOURNIQUET.

AND EVERYBODY KNOWS ABOUT JAMAL KHASHOGGI BEING MURDERED IN THE MOST VICIOUS WAY.

I WANT TO PLAY FOR YOU WHAT PRESIDENT BIDEN SAID WHEN ASKED IF HE WOULD BRING UP SPECIFICALLY THE KHASHOGGI MURDER WITH THE CROWN PRINCE MEETING IN SAUDI ARABIA.

>> Biden: MY VIEWS ON KHASHOGGI HAVE BEEN MADE ABSOLUTELY POSITIVELY CLEAR.

AND I HAVE NEVER BEEN QUIET ABOUT TALKING ABOUT HUMAN RIGHTS.

THE QUESTION THAT I'M -- THE REASON THAT I'M GOING TO SAUDI ARABIA, THOUGH, IS MUCH BROADER.

IT IS TO PROMOTE U.S.

INTERESTS.

>> Braude: I DON'T WANT TO BE UNFAIR, BUT IT SOUNDS TO ME LIKE THE ANSWER IS NO, I WILL NOT BE BRINGING IT UP.

WHAT IS YOUR QUICK REACTION?

>> A REALLY UNSATISFACTORY ANSWER FROM THE PRESIDENT ON WHAT HE IS GOING TO SAY TO THE CROWN PRINCE ON THE MURDER OF JAMAL KHASHOGGI, WHO EYE KNEW I KNEW AND INTERVIEWED.

HE WAS IN ISRAEL/PALESTINE WHERE HE WAS SHOT BY THE ISRAELI FORCES -- >> Braude: THERE IS NO QUESTION IT WAS INTENTIONAL.

>> SHOT AND KILLED WEARING A PRESS PASS, AND HE GOES TO THAT COUNTRY, TO A COUNTRY WHERE THEY MURDERED JOURNALISTS IN COLD BLOOD.

AND HE DOESN'T SEE THE NEED TO PROTECT JOURNALISM AND FREE PRESS AROUND THE WORLD.

I KNOW IT IS IN HIS HEART.

IT IS KIND OF SAD TO WATCH HIS FOCUS ON NATIONAL SECURITY TO THE POINT WHERE HIS WORDS AROUND HUMAN RIGHTS RUN A LITTLE HALLOW IF YOU CAN'T SEE THE FREE PRESS AS A CRITICAL PART OF IT.

>> Braude: IT IS GREAT WORK YOU'RE DOING.

LOTS OF LUCK, CHARLIE CHARLIE SENNOTT.

THAT'S IT FOR TONIGHT.

THANKS FOR WATCHING.

WE'LL BE BACK TOMORROW.