Welcome to Colorado Inside Out, PBS12's weekly Roundtable represents an analysis of Colorado's public policy issue, I'm Debbie Brown president Colorado business Roundtable will amplify the voice of business as a force for good, I'm honored to fill in as your guest with.

Topic one, insert house cream caucus is demanding changes to house rules, membership power away from congressional leaders.

According to the caucus members involved, their reforms proposed would return the people's house back tothe American people.

We will start the conversation today under an editor of Westword, Patty what are your thoughts about the decentralized power play.

>> First of all, I'm so excited to talk about Lauren Boebert in the first part of the show rather than during the disgraced section because she is the communications director for the freedom caucus, she has put up a Facebook explanation formative video and I will encourage Evan to watch about what the plan is.

And there are actually, I will deny this next week, there are a few things that make sense, one is, that bills should be submitted earlier, they are suggesting bills be summative fibers earlier so people have a chance to read them and discuss them before they vote on them, we would like to see much more trance plenty and those presented.

There's the suggestion that amendments be made on the four which make sense but otherwise, this is bad week for them trying to get attention single tap in the Senate and the deal that was just made, these guys are not getting a lot of attention on it, the freedom caucus and if they get smaller depending on indictment after the January 6 investigation is over, we always look at how the government can run better.

In a couple ideas are good, but I don't see it going far.

>> Thank you.

David Kopel research director, some ideas seem like good ideas .

>> Very much, and they are certainly right that regardless of which party has been in charge of the house in recent years it's been a very oligarchic thing, in the most extreme thing that the house instead of passing a budget through the normal appropriations process does this very last minute thing called a continuing resolution where it is built over a thousand pages long and worked out only by people at the top of their party leadership and then jammed on the house with no opportunity for people to read the bill before they vote on it.

And in Colorado where Constitution was written later we saw abuses in other states and in Congress, one rule is it takes under normal conditions three days to pass a bill, you have introduced, a second reading on a different day and after reading on a different day and in between because to a committee.

But the U.S. House does not have procedures, and they need something, the five day rule to give people time to read it before they vote, is a great idea but one thing is bad that they have is that they propose rules by the majority of the majority.

In other words Republicans say like the speaker of the house, speakers can bring forward any bill that is supported by less than half of the Republican caucus.

And I don't agree with that, the house is there to make decisions as a whole.

So if you have a bill supported for 40% Republicans and 60% of Democrats, and that passes, that's the process working.

>> Great, such a honor to get to know you, Dani Newsom, for cobalt advocate, jump in, what about the piece about community spending, as is earmarked by another name?

>> I have to step back and say the current chair of the house freedom caucus Scott Perry, who was unsuccessful in his attempt to beg the former president for a pardon his role in the instruction, anything coming out of the so-called house freedom caucus, I look at, quite skeptically, and I agree, absolutely agree with David regarding they want the rule that you can only vote on something that if Republicans regain the majority in the house, that the majority of Republicans support which is bogus but they also want to be able to target they want to target spending cuts at specific agencies and people, Anthony felt she is retiring, so they may not be able to target Anthony patchy but trust me they will go after others, they've always wanted to go after big bird, and they will go in a line item way and go after their favorite boogie man, this is the house freedom caucus after all.

Scott Perry insurrectionist gets a no vote from me.

>> Running our panel today is her own Dominic Dezutti, Dominic, the person who put Colorado inside out on the map, >> I don't think it's going well, and thank you that's very kind, I don't think I put Colorado Inside Out on the map, the legends here at this table and speaking of legends it's good to see history being made, because were only a few minutes into the program in a very heard say Dani say I agree, this is historic, and I think we need to look at the enemy of any congressional representative.

If Republicans get the majority, say by one in the house, they go to 218 seats in the minimum they would need for majority right now the Washington Examiner estimates the house freedom caucus to be around three dozen members.

One of the ideas are good or ludicrous, why are 36 members shaking their fist in the air sinks is how we will run things, I think Kevin McCarthy if he's trying to warm a seat as speaker of the house, I don't know how serious he is to take this, I applaud coming out and saying this is what we want and negotiate with us now.

But I do not know if the credibility as Dani talked about or the demands they are making especially if they're good ideas or ludicrous, need much energy from representative McCarthy.

>> Preparation perhaps for a redware, we will wait and see.

Topic number two, in Adams County judge ruled a grand jury had probable cause when indicting paramedics and police for manslaughter.

Who were involved in Elijah McLean's death, the indictments have been challenged by some paramedics and officers.

Starting now, give us some context on this case.

>> In the view of the Americans, grand jury with one of the essential protections of liberty because it means the prosecutor can bring you into court charged with a felony and make you defend yourself as a body of citizens have looked at the facts first and said there's enough here to make a reasonable case, and the standard is probable cause which is more probable than not.

That's a much lower standard than a criminal conviction by a petit jury of 12, because there they have to find guilt beyond a reasonable doubt, you are allowed to challenge and one of the ways the grand jury has become weaker as a protection of people over the centuries, court say that a prosecutor can share some evidence with the grand jury so instead of the grand jury hearing all the pro and con evidence they get selectively shown the most inculpatory evidence, and hear the defendants challenge the probable cause determination as their right to ask a judge to take a look at it and the judge said yes, no problem.

There is probable cause.

And rejected the defendant's idea to say before you decide that, take more time so get the grand jury instructions which we think are defective and the original grand jury material, the judge said no, we have enough already, and besides that, there are victims rights laws is a case you should report explicitly in the judge didn't want any further delays.

Next Dani, what are your thoughts?

>> You know, let's hear it for the Adams County judge but let's hear it from Atty.

Gen. Phil Weiser who took over the investigation of the case for goodness sakes, and shame shame shame on the former district attorney from the 17th judicial district who took a pass and said there was not probable cause to disbelieve what the first responders had said, of course there was.

You can see the video, Elijah Mclain a very demure, 100 pound young man walking home interest on the basis of a call that said he was acting sketchy.

This young man is dead.

Thrown to the ground.

This is just, this is just murder is what it was.

So let's hear it for film Pfizer in the Adams County judge but it's about time that the EMTs in the cities involved are brought before for justice.

>> A tragedy and wake-up call, Dominic, how does this impact not only the Aurora PD but other police departments, not just in Colorado, but across the country, with the electrical for police departments.

>> All municipalities to pay attention to this because I think one of most important things here for credibility to be rebuilt in the Aurora community there has to be evidence the processes being followed, and a take away from this is a real positive the process of grand jury is moving forward.

And, the people have a day in court and we can trust the process as part of the foundation of this country since the beginning.

Other municipalities need to take notice because it's not that this can't happen in Lakewood or Thornton or Denver or anywhere else, and Aurora, will continue to be a model for a lot of different issues, how is it being handled there, when mistakes are made what do we learn, the only way to move forward or something tragic like this is that the process being followed, lessons are learned, if both are ignored.

>> Wrap us up, how does this?

>> It's a mess and will not and quickly.

When you think about it, it was back a year before the George Floyd County, Elijah Mclain was killed, and people played on the snow attention, the DA as Dani said, is it okay, nothing wrong, there's nothing wrong, it was swept under the rug.

There were some people who follow the case and we wrote about it, until the George Floyd protest this was really something no one paid attention to.

And that of course there was racial profiling, racial policing came to the forefront across the country with the George Floyd case and that's why all this and we started to hear about Elijah Mclain and wound up appointing Weiser to do the investigation and the Aurora Police Department under the microscope the group doing the study of them came out with a report that said they did some things right, and still have a long way to go.

So good for them to be scrutinized.

Good for the changes that have been put in place, if you're in a top position, because of the previous chief being gone 11 interim chief in there.

Aurora is working on, let's hope all municipalities are working on it.

>> Thank you.

>> Our next up, color increased out-of-state people seeking abortion services, mostly from Texas, while the remainders made abortion legal, Daniel start with you, what are your thoughts on the recent news of an increase perhaps in people coming to Colorado?

>> I work for cobalt, and we live it.

Thanks to an ill-gotten Supreme Court majority, states are prohibited from stopping a crazy teenager, or citizen from obtaining an assault rifle but the state can step in and force a pregnant person to carry that pregnancy and force that pregnant person to give birth.

It is so twisted.

And contrary to Supreme Court justice assertion that there is no traditional history of abortion in this country which is a lie, of course there is.

And abortion was legal in most places until the latter part of the 1800s, but having said that Como the McGivney statistic.

In the shines a light on it.

Thanks to the reproductive health equity act abortion and contraceptives are fundamental rights in Colorado.

So you have people coming to Colorado.

And last year, cobalt and part of the abortion procedure, and also funding the associated costs like travel, lodging, food and childcare.

Last year, I will call the travel, $6000 for the whole year, but this year between June 24 and the Supreme Court issuing the decision overturning Roe V Wade, and July 21, just short of one month, we spent almost $60,000 funding travel and lodging and that tells you most of the people coming into Colorado coming from Texas but their surrounding states because if you look at the map, the ever-changing map where abortion is legal, you will see Colorado and New Mexico are kind of there.

So yes, it's an incredible incredible increase, and these are people who need the medical care that they cannot get in their own states and their coming to Colorado because Colorado is a safe haven where medicine matters more than religious or political etiology.

>> Dominic, what's your perspective on the issue?

>> I think first and foremost it will only get more complicated in Colorado, this is something we will watch, and as of next week on the state campus, they will vote as a state on August 2 on how that state should handle abortion rights, it is legal but should that change?

Colorado is an island for services it will only increase.

These conversations and resources, everything they talked about will only magnify my question here is how this will impact this election year, because generally while a very contentious and sensitive issue, abortion is settled in Colorado so, something might be on the ballot and was not a top issue in all debates and things like that.

That changes this year.

Does that tilt, or impact other races.

Right now razor thin, you have both Kirk Meyer and Caravelle, two women running for that seat, a brand-new seat that is up to 40% Latino, that could go any direction something like this wouldn't take that much to tilt it one way or the other.

It will be interesting to watch.

And it will only grow in impact in Colorado.

>> You think about polling, inflation, geopolitical, now this is a top issue for voters.

What you say Patty about that?

>> It will be interesting, she really knows what she's talking about with women's rights and health issues.

This will get hot, part of the issue is demand and the wait time that gets into the very controversial part of when and abortion is acceptable because people do divide on that, they might believe in choice, but up until a certain time, others will say almost up to birth if there truly problems for the mother or baby, Colorado is one of the few states that does offer late-term abortion, the people in other states, only from Texas, or Oklahoma, if they have to wait there we moved into the latter category that makes it all the tougher for everybody.

For the woman, the people who are pro-choice, antichoice, so it will only get trickier as this grows.

And the impact is more color.

>> Any last words on the topic?

>> It be ideal of congressional candidates on all sides said whatever our personal opinion, the US Constitution gives Congress no power over that.

One way or the other.

And abortion laws that are been proposed in Congress have said oh, this is because Congress has the power to end regulate interstate commerce, a medical procedure within a single state is interstate commerce.

There's one other thing that is even clearer constitutionally which is all citizens in the United States including pregnant women have the right to interstate travel, that is a privilege of citizens of the unit states in either the federal government or state can interfere with.

>> Let's move on to topic four.

With the recent drop in unemployment rates, Colorado's $1 billion unemployment loan is on track to be repaid however is not paid in full employers can expect higher tax rates in 2024 which is not something employers want to hear.

Dominic, this may be an easier issue that once we carried on about today.

Stuck about inflation and paying back loans.

>> Who would've thought unemployment would be less emotional with all the charge topics we talked about today.

Again, I'm a geek for simple math.

Calculus is way over my head.

Simple stuff I enjoy.

Digging into this one was from, because I encourage folks to read the whole article if you know what I mean because okay, we are 1 billion back to the government, okay great, and we pay back 100 million, fantastic.

They must be doing well, this is great.

Except wait a second, there is some FinePrint 600 million of the 800 million we pay back was actually another payment received from the federal government, is like borrowing thousand dollars from your parents and then getting $600 for Christmas and paying back with that.

Yes, technically your little bit ahead, he still feels like federal funding money, and always different conversations about inflation and businesses and unemployment, I do not know what the paces right now for funny money, let's know what will happen, they say we paid off a bill, in some ways can be defined as fiscal responsibility.

Will be a great campaign stump speech.

And the votes will move on.

>> It's good point, federal funny money.

For the money coming to Colorado, I think employers feel comfortable, that's one problem that has been potentially sultry Patty your feedback.

>> Lots of funny money since the start of the pandemic, it is not done yet.

We will see a lot of juggling as people get used to funny money and set up programs, city of Denver, set up programs and that funding will be gone, to have the programs continue?

This will be big issues in the coming years.

Right now unemployment is down in Colorado.

It's hard to believe when you go to all the places still looking to hire people, you would think everyone who wants a job as other and working, but at least unemployment is down and that means people are getting some pay in so they can pay the increasingly high costs of groceries, gas, and everything else.

>> Upsala, Summit say that inflation could be a byproduct of potentially the funny money, what do you say?

>> Is Dominic Sakuma read the full article.

In the Colorado sunday It was outstanding.

She said send states like Texas and Georgia and Ohio did a fiscally prudent thing took all the latest infusion of federal funny money and used it to pay off this loan they had to take out for the unemployment fund.

Colorado did not do that is Patty Sigma they started other programs, which now they will run out of money for, the caller doesn't pay this off by November 10 then taxes will go up on employers.

Sorry.

And if there is another tax increase the tenant to employers besides paying federal loans, if you build up the unemployment reserve fund which has not been done.

And we are in recession now and it is terrible to be raising taxes on employers in a situation like that because that either reduces the employees pay or reduces the number of jobs.

>> Dani, last word on the topic?

>> I refuse to say federal funding, I will call it American rescue money, that's what it was for and if you recall things are pretty damn bad.

When the federal government distributed that money so good on Colorado, he paid 600 million back, what's wrong with that and taken the money her parents give you and pay them back something you of them, it's wrong with that?

>> They would say nothing.

[LAUGHTER] >> For goodness sake, it's like regifting a wedding gift, for goodness sake.

I don't have any problem with it, there is a concern though, the concern of our unemployment is at record lows but if unemployment starts to rise, then there is a concern.

Because that fund has not been restored.

>> We have a little bit of time left and go quickly through disgrace of the week and then positive spirit Patty can you kick us off.

>> I don't have to deal with Lauren Boebert, the McGough with the Colorado Centennial Institute launching a petition drive against respect for marriage act, they do not want same-sex marriage okayed by states across the country.

They don't want states to have to respect other people same-sex marriages.

>> Sorry, by the way, I had Covid-19 in early July, it had all the vaccinations, my symptoms were not bad, but I have a continuum cold.

But I am safe now.

[LAUGHTER] Marion Goodman, July 1 was sitting across from her, and I found out from a test that code, apparently her immune system is ironclad and nothing happened to her.

The University of Michigan which plumbs to the Big Ten football conference is now annexing USC and UCLA leading to the imminent demise or segregation of the Pacific football conference which usually plays.

>> In addition to David, Wyoming and the governor for passing and signing yet another antiabortion bill, you have lawmakers and governors who think they really have the right to insert themselves in a medical examining room.

In a bedroom.

These are from people that call themselves freedom loving.

It's a damn disgrace.

>> In Monty Python's classic holy Grail, they might refuse to go away despite losing both arms, both legs, and declaring a flesh wound, Tina peters who has somehow and some way raise $255,000 to pay for the re-cancel, we know officially she wants by double-digit margins, if it was all put out and dollar bills and set aflame in a chimney on a back porch it would've made a more productive and is doing right now.

>> Well done.

Well done.

And to end on optimism, I will go around and say something nice.

>> All the small business owners who get people employed and kept things going especially Sean Kenyon who owns the Occidental and Williams, he just won the national US mentor, >> Today August 1 is caller day and that's the president in 1877 in the park mission stating that caller had become the 37th state in the union and the 101st year in the independence of the United States but.>> Dani.

>> Thanks to the Colorado mortality community and Department of Health, healthcare policy and financing, new moms facing losing their Medicaid coverage, they can keep that coverage for up to one year and that hopefully will go a long way to reducing maternal mortality rates which is a national crisis including in Colorado so that is good news.

>> To quick shout outs, one to other kind people reached out to me over the past several weeks.

Am overwhelmed with your kind comments thank you.

In a quick shadow to my former colleagues are moving on to new adventures, my dear friend Heather and the producer of this program both of them moving onto brand-new adventures and am excited for them.

Knowing they have made such an impact here, sorry to see them go but I'm excited to see what is next for them.

>> Well said.

I am looking forward to all your new adventures and what's expected to come as well.

My say something nice is of course being excited about football season, first week of training camp.

That's all the time we have today, watch this and other episodes at PBS 12.work or the YouTube channel, this is Debbie Brown, good night and have a great weekend.