>> FROM OUR STATE HOUSE STUDIO IN MONTGOMERY, I'M TODD STACY.

WELCOME TO "CAPITOL JOURNAL."

THERE'S SOME BREAKING NEWS ON THE ISSUE OF REDISTRICTING.

AS WE REPORTED LAST WEEK, THE U.S. SUPREME COURT HAS RULED THAT THE LATEST CONGRESSIONAL DISTRICTS PASSED BY THE ALABAMA LEGISLATURE VIOLATED SECTION 2 OF THE VOTING RIGHTS ACT.

THAT MEANS THEY'LL HAVE TO BE REDRAWN, AND TODAY WE LEARNED HOW SOON.

JULY 21ST WAS THE DEADLINE REQUESTED BY ATTORNEY GENERAL STEVE MARSHALL.

HE SAID, AFTER CONSULTING WITH MEMBERS OF THE LEGISLATURE, THAT DATE ALLOWED ENOUGH TIME FOR NEW MAPS TO BE DRAWN, REVIEWED AND PASSED.

WITH NO OBJECTION FROM THE PLAINTIFFS, THAT'S THE DATE SET BY A THREE JUDGE PANEL FROM THE 11TH CIRCUIT.

TO MEET THAT DEADLINE, A SPECIAL SESSION WOULD NEED TO BE CALLED NO LATER THAN JULY 17.

WHILE WE DON'T KNOW WHAT THE NEW CONGRESSIONAL MAP WILL LOOK LIKE, WE DO KNOW AT LEAST A FEW OF THE DISTRICTS, AND MAYBE ALL, COULD BE VERY DIFFERENT.

THE COURT WANTS LAWMAKERS TO CREATE TWO DISTRICTS THAT ARE, IF NOT MAJORITY BLACK, CLOSE TO IT.

CURRENTLY, ONLY THE 7TH DISTRICT IS MAJORITY BLACK AT 57%.

THAT NUMBER IS LIKELY TO COME DOWN AS VOTERS ARE DRAWN INTO ANOTHER DISTRICT.

WE'LL TALK MORE ABOUT THIS CASE AND ITS RAMIFICATIONS WITH OUR GUESTS LATER IN THE SHOW.

TAKE A LOOK AT WHAT'S COMING UP.

I'LL BE JOINED BY TISH GOTTELL FAULKS OF THE ALABAMA ACLU AND BERNARD SIMELTON OF THE ALABAMA NAACP TO DISCUSS THEIR PERSPECTIVES AS THE SUCCESSFUL PLAINTIFFS IN THE CASE.

THEN JOHN WAHL, CHAIRMAN OF THE ALABAMA REPUBLICAN PARTY JOINS ME TO TALK ABOUT CONSERVATIVES' DISAPPOINTMENT WITH THE RULING BUT THEIR DETERMINATION TO COMPETE IN THE NEW DISTRICTS.

AND FINALLY JIMMY ENTREKIN OF THE LEGISLATIVE SERVICES AGENCY TO TALK ABOUT THE NUTS AND BOLTS OF REDISTRICTING.

WHAT WE CAN EXPECT FROM A SPECIAL SESSION IN JULY.

THAT'S COMING UP.

ALSO TOPPING THE NEWS IS THE ISSUE OF MEDICAL MARIJUANA.

THE ALABAMA MEDICAL CANNABIS COMMISSION THIS WEEK SELECTED 21 COMPANIES FOR LICENSES FOR VARIOUS WORK IN THE INDUSTRY.

CULTIVATION, TRANSPORT, TESTING AND DISTRIBUTION - PLUS, SOME LICENSES FOR THE WHOLE PROCESS FROM SEED TO SALE.

BUT THEN TODAY, THE COMMISSION MET AGAIN AND HALTED INDEFINITELY THOSE LICENSES FROM GOING FORWARD.

COMMISSIONERS SAID STAFF HAD RAISED CONCERNS ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT THE APPLICATIONS HAD BEEN PROPERLY GRADED.

THE COMMISSION PARTNERED WITH THE UNIVERSITY OF SOUTH ALABAMA TO REVIEW THE APPLICATIONS.

IN ITS MEETING TODAY, COMMISSIONERS SPOKE ABOUT POTENTIAL INCONSISTENCIES IN THE SCORING DATA DURING APPLICATION REVIEW.

THEY SAID THEY WOULD CONDUCT AN INDEPENDENT REVIEW OF THAT PROCESS.

WELL, THE LEGISLATIVE SESSION MAY BE OVER, BUT ITS EFFECTS ARE STILL TAKING SHAPE.

ONE NEW LAW HAS A LOT OF FOLKS EXCITED BECAUSE IT WILL ALLOW WORKING PEOPLE TO KEEP MORE OF THE WAGES THEY EARN.

"CAPITOL JOURNAL'S" RANDY SCOTT REPORTS.

>> THERE'S STILL PLENTY TO TALK ABOUT AFTER THE 2023 REGULAR SESSION.

ONE ITEM IS THE EFFORT BY STATE LEADERS TO IMPROVE ALABAMA'S ECONOMY, BY EITHER ATTRACTING NEW BUSINESSES OR NEW EMPLOYEES.

HOUSE BILL 217 IS GEARED TOWARD THE LATTER BY TAKING TAXES OFF OF OVERTIME PAY FOR EMPLOYEES.

>> IT PUTS US IN A VERY GOOD POSITION TO BE ABLE TO DO SOME REALLY GOOD THINGS FOR THE STATE OF WORKING PEOPLE AND THE STATE OF ALABAMA AND MAKE SURE OUR ECONOMY CONTINUES TO GROW IN ALL CORNERS OF THE STATE AND REMAIN COMPETITOR WITH OUR NEIGHBORS.

>> IT'S AN IDEA THAT HAS STATEWIDE SUPPORT SAYS THE NATIONAL DIRECTOR OF FEDERATION DIRECTOR.

>> WHEN REPRESENTATIVE DANIELS APPROACHED ME ABOUT THIS I SAID DID YOU FIND THIS IN ANOTHER STATE?

HE SAID NO.

ALABAMA WOULD BE THE FIRST STATE IN THE NATION TO ALLOW OVERTIME TO BE EXEMPT FROM STATE INCOME TAX.

>> LAWMAKERS CAME UP WITH A GOAL FOR THE REGULAR SESSION TO IMPROVE ALABAMA'S ECONOMY BY IMPROVING THE BUSINESS CLIMATE.

THEY DEVELOPED IDEAS, INCLUDING THE GAME PLAN PACKAGE OF BILLS AND OTHER MEASURES SUCH AS BILL 217 THAT WILL CUT TAXES ON OVERTIME PAY IN THE STATE MAKING IT UNIQUE THROUGHOUT THE COUNTRY AND ALABAMA IS TAKING THE LEAD ON.

>> IT IS GEARED TOWARD HOURLY WORKERS AND WITH 2.2% UNEMPLOYMENT RATE, WE ARE STRUGGLING FOR EMPLOYEES IN ALL TYPES OF BUSINESSES.

>> GOVERNOR KAY IVEY SIGNED THE BILL AFTER IT WENT TO HER DESK.

IT GOES IN TO EFFECT FOR 18 MONTHS AND THEN AN EVALUATION TO CHECK ON THE PROGRESS.

>> REPRESENTATIVE DANIELS SAID HE LOOKS AT THIS AS A REAL OPPORTUNITY FOR PEOPLE TO WORK MORE.

THEY WILL BE EXEMPT FROM STATE INCOME TAX ON ANY HOUR OVER 40 HOURS A WEEK, IF THEY ARE AN HOURLY WORKER.

AND HE SAID, WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT IT, IT'S LIKE GETTING A 5% RAISE EVERY HOUR.

>> FOR "CAPITOL JOURNAL," I'M RANDY SCOTT.

>> TODAY WAS THE LAST DAY GOVERNOR KAY IVEY COULD ACT ON BILLS THAT PASSED, EITHER SIGNING THEM INTO LAW, VETOING THEM OR LETTING THEM DIE WITHOUT HER SIGNATURE.

SOME SIGNIFICANT BILLS WERE SIGNED THIS WEEK.

SENATE BILL 206 FROM STATE SENATOR CLYDE CHAMBLISS IS AIMED AT CRACKING DOWN ON RETAIL THEFT, AND SPECIFICALLY, ORGANIZED RETAIL THEFT.

SENATE BILL 103 FROM STATE SENATOR ARTHUR ORR REQUIRES THE ETHICS COMMISSION TO HAND OVER ANY EVIDENCE THAT MIGHT EXONERATE SOMEONE UNDER INVESTIGATION.

SENATE BILL 278 FROM STATE SENATOR JABO WAGGONER CREATES THE HIGHER EDUCATION DISTRESS FUND TO HELP COLLEGES IN FINANCIAL DIFFICULTY.

THIS WAS BORN OUT OF THE HARDSHIPS BIRMINGHAM SOUTHERN COLLEGE IS FACING.

AND HOUSE BILL 479, THE GROCERY SALES TAX CUT FROM STATE REPRESENTATIVE DANNY GARRETT AND STATE SENATOR ANDREW JONES.

IT GRADUALLY CUTS THE STATE'S 4% SALES TAX IN HALF FOR GROCERY ITEMS BEGINNING THIS SEPTEMBER.

BUT FOR THE SECOND CUT TO KICK IN NEXT YEAR, THERE MUST BE 3.5% GROWTH IN THE EDUCATION TRUST FUND.

>> WE STARTED OUT THIS YEAR TALKING A LOT ABOUT BROADBAND INTERNET AND HOW THE STATE CAN GET THAT HIGH SPEED SERVICE TO PLACES THAT LACK IT.

ONE SUCH EFFORT IS UNDERWAY HERE IN MONTGOMERY, WHERE CITY AND COUNTY OFFICIALS ARE WORKING TO DEVELOP A COMPREHENSIVE STRATEGY.

BUT THEY NEED HELP FROM LOCAL RESIDENTS.

"CAPITOL JOURNAL'S" KAREN GOLDSMITH REPORTS.

>> ALABAMA'S DEPARTMENT OF ECONOMIC AND COMMITTEE AFFAIRS HELD SESSIONS IN ALL 67 COUNTIES DISCUSSING THE STATE'S BROADBAND CONNECTIVITY PLANS.

OFFICIALS IN MONTGOMERY WANT TO TAKE IT A STEP FURTHER SO THEY KNOW WHERE TO PLACE THIS FIBER TO BEST SERVE ITS RESIDENTS, AND TO BEST SERVE THOSE TRAVELING THROUGH MONTGOMERY, ESPECIALLY THROUGH MONTGOMERY COUNTY WHERE THERE'S LITTLE TO NO INTERNET CONNECTION.

MONTGOMERY COUNTY COMMISSIONER CARMEN MOORE-ZEIGLER.

>> CAN YOU IMAGINE YOU ARE GOING DOWN AND TRAVELING FOR BUSINESS OR PLEASURE AND YOU HAVE AN ACCIDENT AND YOU ARE STRANDED WITH YOUR FAMILY ON A ROAD THAT THEY HAVE NO CONNECTIVITY?

THAT WOULD BE FRIGHTENING TO ME, AS A MOM AND IT'S FRIGHTENING TO ME BECAUSE OF MYSELF AND NOT ONLY THAT I HAVE A COLLEGE STUDENT THAT'S ON THAT ROAD.

>> MONTGOMERY THRIVE, WHICH IS A MONTGOMERY COUNTY COMMISSION AND CITY OF MONTGOMERY COUNTY INITIATIVE IS ASKING RESIDENTS TO COMPLETE THIS ONE-PAGE BROADBAND SURVEY.

>> PEOPLE IN THE COMMUNITY WANT INTERNET, ESPECIALLY IN THE RURAL AND UNDERSERVED COMMUNITY A LONG TIME AND IT'S TIME WE DO IT.

STEP ONE IS TO MAKE SURE WE GET FEEDBACK FROM THEM AND UNDERSTAND WHERE THEY WANT US TO GO WITH THIS.

>> JACK MADDOW WILL CONDUCT THE SURVEY.

THEY HAVE COMPLETED MORE THAN 300 OF THEM.

>> WE KNOW PRETTY MUCH THE BROADBAND CONDITIONS AROUND THE COUNTRY.

WE HAVE ALSO BUILT AND MANAGED NETWORKS.

SO, WE HAVE A PRETTY GOOD IDEA ON THE COSTS AND DIFFICULTIES OF DOING THAT TOO.

>> HE SAID IT WILL HELP TO KNOW HOW MUCH TO REQUEST FROM STATE AND FEDERAL FUNDING SOURCES.

EVEN AN I DON'T KNOW ANSWER IS STILL A VALID RESPONSE BECAUSE BROADBAND IS NOW CONSIDERED THE NEW UTILITY, A NECESSITY.

>> PEOPLE IN THE 1920S THOUGHT EVERYONE HAVING ELECTRICITY WAS A FAIRY TALE.

THAT WOULD NEVER HAPPEN.

AND BECAUSE THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT IN THE ROOSEVELT ADMINISTRATION GOT INVOLVED IN FUNDING EXPANSION OF ELECTRICITY TO RURAL AREAS, NOW EVERY BUILDING PRETTY MUCH IN THE UNITED STATES HAS ELECTRICITY.

WE THINK THAT WILL HAPPEN WITH FIBER ALSO IN THE FUTURE.

>> THE SURVEY CAN BE FOUND IN ENGLISH AT TINYURL.COM/MONTGOMERY AL BROADBAND AND IN SPANISH FOR "CAPITOL JOURNAL," I'M KAREN GOLDSMITH.

>> TURNING TO WASHINGTON, U.S.

SENATOR TOMMY TUBERVILLE IS PUSHING A LEGISLATIVE PACKAGE AIMED AT LOWERING THE COST OF HIGHER EDUCATION.

ONE BILL, THE GOAL ACT, LOOKS SPECIFICALLY AT GRADUATE PROGRAMS AND WOULD CAP FEDERAL LOANS FOR GRADUATE DEGREES AS A WAY TO FIGHT RISING TUITION.

HE SAID STUDENT DEBT IS A REAL PROBLEM AND REQUIRES MORE THAN JUST BAILOUTS.

>> TODAY WE'RE HERE TO SAY ENOUGH IS ENOUGH.

I'M HERE WITH MY COLLEAGUES FOR THE GOAL ACT.

HOW APPROPRIATE IS THAT, I DIDN'T SCORE MANY TOUCHDOWNS.

>> NOT ABOUT LSU.

>> THAT'S RIGHT.

BUT IT IS ABOUT HELPING YOUNG PEOPLE ACHIEVE GOALS LIKE BUYING A HOUSE.

IT WOULD HAVE A LIMIT ON FEDERAL GRADUATE SCHOOL LOANS, A LIMIT.

THIS WOULD PREVENT SOME OF THE WORST EXAMPLES OF STUDENTS BEING EXPLOITED FOR PROFIT.

IT WOULD FORCE SCHOOLS TO BRING DOWN COSTS AND COMPETE FOR STUDENTS.

WHAT AN IDEA.

IT WOULD ALSO PROTECT STUDENTS GETTING BURIED IN DEBT THEY CAN NEVER, EVER PAY.

THIS LEGISLATION IS ONE STEP TOWARD RESTORING SANITY IN OUR EDUCATION SYSTEM.

IT'S OUT OF CONTROL.

>> THIS WEEK TUBERVILLE, SENATOR KATIE BRITT AND THE WHOLE DELEGATION GOT A VISIT FROM SOME FAMILIAR FACES.

AS PART OF THE SOUTHEASTERN CONFERENCE'S TRIP TO WASHINGTON, THE COACHES, PRESIDENTS AND ATHLETIC DIRECTORS FROM AUBURN AND ALABAMA MET WITH MEMBERS OF THE DELEGATION THERE ON CAPITOL HILL.

SO, YES THAT MEANS NICK SABAN, WHO HELD COURT WITH THE MEMBERS, HUGH FREEZE, BRUCE PEARL AND OF COURSE THE PRESIDENTS AND OTHER ADMINISTRATORS.

ONE OF THE COACHES' TOP PRIORITIES IS TO GET CONGRESS TO ADDRESS THE NAME IMAGE AND LIKENESS ISSUE THAT HAS CHANGED THE FACE OF COLLEGE SPORTS.

I WONDER IF 15 YEARS AGO NICK SABAN COULD HAVE IMAGINED HE'D BE GOING TO MEET SENATOR TUBERVILLE IN DC.

WE'LL BE RIGHT BACK WITH TONIGHT'S GUESTS.

>> YOU CAN WATCH PAST EPISODES OF "CAPITOL JOURNAL" ONLINE AT VIDEO@APTV.ORG.

"CAPITOL JOURNAL" EPISODES ARE ALSO AVAILABLE ON APTV'S FREE MOBILE APP.

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♪ KEEP UP WITH WHAT'S HAPPENING WITH "CAPITOL JOURNAL."

>> MONTGOMERY NATIVE PERCY L. JULIAN WAS A CHEMIST, THE THIRD AFRICAN-AMERICAN TO RECEIVE A PH.D.

IN CHEMISTRY, HE SPECIALIZED IN THE CHEMISTRY OF NATURAL PRODUCTS AND THEIR SYNTHESIS IN THE LABORATORY.

THIS TECHNOLOGY IS IMPORTANT IN MEDICINES, FOOD PRODUCTS, PAINT AND FIREFIGHTING FOAMS AMONG OTHER THINGS.

JULIAN RECEIVED MANY AWARDS INCLUDING ELECTION TO THE NATIONAL ACADEMY OF SCIENCES AND THE NATIONAL INVENTORS HALL OF FAME.

>> JOINING ME NEXT ARE TISH GOTTELL FAULKS OF THE ACLU OF ALABAMA AND BERNARD SIMELTON OF THE NAACP OF ALABAMA.

THANK YOU FOR COMING ON THE SHOW.

>> THANK YOU FOR HAVING US.

>> WE'RE TALKING ABOUT REDISTRICTING AFTER THIS MONUMENTAL COURT RULING LAST WEEK.

I MEAN, MONUMENTAL MAY NOT CAPTURE THE MOMENT.

I CALLED IT, IN SOME POLITICAL WRITING, AN ATOM BOMB.

WE ARE JUST GETTING THE REACTION.

I WILL START WITH YOU.

WHEN YOU SAW THE RULING COME DOWN AND YOU SAW THE OPINIONS, WERE YOU SURPRISED?

WHAT WERE YOUR THOUGHTS?

>> FIRST OF ALL, I WAS ELATED THE DECISION CAME DOWN IN OUR FAVOR.

BEFORE THEN, YOU KNOW, THERE WAS SOME CONCERN BACK AND FORTH WHETHER WE WOULD GET A FAVORABLE RULING FROM THE SUPREME COURT BUT I ALWAYS BELIEVE BECAUSE I WAS THERE WHEN ARGUMENTS WERE MADE, I BELIEVE THE JUSTICE RULED BASED ON THE EVIDENCE PRESENTED AND THE LAW AND THE CONSTITUTION THEN WE WERE, YOU KNOW, IN TO WIN, BUT LATELY THERE HAVE BEEN SOME RULINGS THAT, YOU KNOW, LED ME TO BELIEVE THEY MAY BE MOVING AWAY FROM THAT, BUT WHEN I HEARD THE RULING I WAS FLABBERGASTED.

I WAS ELATED.

I WAS OVERJOYED AND PLEASED WITH THE RULING OF THE SUPREME COURT.

>> TISH, WALK US THROUGH THE LEGAL ARGUMENTS.

WHAT WERE THE DECISIVE LEGAL ARGUMENTS THAT MADE THE 5-4 RULING WITH CHIEF JUSTICE ROBERT AND JUSTICE KAVANAUGH JOINING THE LIBERALS ON THE COURT.

IT DOESN'T HAPPEN THAT OFTEN.

>> IT DOES NOT.

ONE THING WE KNEW IS CLEARLY ESTABLISHED FEDERAL LAW SUPPORTED THE PRELIMINARY INJUNCTIONS THAT WE WON AT THE THREE-PANEL DISTRICT COURT LEVEL.

WHAT THE STATE WANTED TO PUT FORWARD WAS A REVOLUTIONARY NEW APPROACH TO APPLYING SECTION 2'S TASK.

THEY WANTED TO BEHAVE AS THOUGH THERE'S NEVER BEEN A CONCERN ABOUT RACIAL DISCRIMINATION FOR VOTING IN ALABAMA AND WHAT THEY PUT FORWARD FOR PROPOSAL OF A NEW TEST FOR SECTION 2 COMPLIANCE WOULD HAVE GUTTED THE BENEFITS, THE ENTIRE UNDERLYING PURPOSE FOR THE VOTING RIGHTS ACT, WHICH WAS TO REMEDIATE A HISTORY OF RACIAL DISCRIMINATION IN VOTING.

>> ARE YOU SAYING THEY WERE ASKING FOR TOO MUCH, FROM EVEN THIS CONSERVATIVE COURT?

>> THEY ABSOLUTELY WERE.

I THINK BASED ON THE FACTS, THE CLEARLY ESTABLISHED FEDERAL LAW AND THE VERY CAREFUL CONSIDERATION OF THE THREE-JUDGE PANEL, ANYONE ON THE COURT AND INTERESTED IN STARE DECISIS WOULD HAVE COME OUT AS THIS COURT DID.

>> YOU HEAR THE TERM PACKING VERSUS CRACKING.

THIS HAS TO DO WITH THE SEVENTH DISTRICT.

THOSE THAT DRAWN THE DISTRICT HAVE PACKED TOO MANY BLACK VOTERS IN TO ONE DISTRICT DELUDING THEIR INFLUENCE, THEIR VOTING INFLUENCE IN OTHER DISTRICTS.

SO, PRESUMABLY THAT'S GOING TO BE REMEDIED WITH DIFFERENT DISTRICTS THAT HAVE BETTER EQUITY.

MY QUESTION COMES INTO WHEN YOU GO TOO FAR THE OTHER WAY, DON'T YOU GET IN TO CRACKING TERRITORY WHERE YOU ARE SPLITTING UP BLACK VOTERS, SPREADING THEM TOO THIN SO THEY DON'T HAVE ENOUGH VOTING INFLUENCE?

DO YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT I'M SAYING?

IS THERE A CONCERN THERE?

>> CERTAINLY THERE IS BUT WHAT WE WANT ARE DISTRICTS THAT HAVE A MAJORITY BLACK POPULATION.

BASED ON THE POPULATION IN THE STATE OF ALABAMA, WITH 28% OF THE AFRICAN-AMERICAN POPULATION BEING BLACK, THERE SHOULD BE TWO MAJORITY BLACK DISTRICTS IN THE STATE WITHOUT IT BEING GERRYMANDERED.

WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE MAPS THAT WILL BE PRESENTED TO THE COURT, THEY WILL AGREE THAT YES, THESE ARE GREAT MAPS THAT WILL PROVIDE THE MAJORITY DISTRICTS THAT WE ARE SEEKING.

YOU KNOW, CERTAINLY IT WILL TAKE SOME OF THE BLACK VOTING AGE POPULATION OUT OF REPRESENTATIVE SEWELL'S DISTRICT, BUT GIVE OPPORTUNITY FOR BLACKS IN ALABAMA TO HAVE MORE COHESIVE VOTING POWER, ESSENTIALLY BY SENDING TWO CONGRESSIONAL BLACK CONGRESSIONAL LEADERS TO CONGRESS.

>> UH-HUH.

I WANT TO ASK YOU, TISH, ABOUT ONE THING AND CHIEF JUSTICE ROBERT'S RULING.

HE TALKED ABOUT RACE CONSCIOUS, VERSUS RACE MOTIVATED.

HE IS TALKING ABOUT WHEN YOU ARE APPROACHING REDISTRICTING, WHICH THE LEGISLATURE HAD BEEN ARGUING, LOOK, WE WERE TRYING TO BE RACE NEUTRAL AND YOU ARE SAYING RACE, NO, RACE DOES PLAY IN TO ACCOUNT HERE.

ROBERTS SAID YOU CAN BE RACE CONSCIOUS WHEN COMING UP WITH THESE MAPS, DRAWING THE LINES WITHOUT HAVING TO BE RACE MOTIVATED.

WHAT DO YOU THINK HE MEANT BY THAT AND IT IS ALMOST LIKE A NEW THEME INTRODUCED INTO THIS CONVERSATION?

>> I INTERPRET CHIEF JUSTICE ROBERT'S WORDS AS RECOGNIZING THERE ARE A LOT OF THINGS THAT GO INTO WHERE PEOPLE CHOOSE TO LIVE ACROSS THE COUNTRY AND SPECIFICALLY HERE IN ALABAMA.

THERE ARE PARTS OF ALABAMA THAT HAVE A VERY LOW BLACK POPULATION, AND THERE ARE PARTS OF ALABAMA THAT ARE VERY DENSELY POPULATED BY THE AFRICAN-AMERICAN COMMUNITY.

WHAT CHIEF JUSTICE ROBERTS RECOGNIZED WAS THAT THERE IS HISTORICAL RELEVANCE TO THAT PHENOMENON.

WHILE HE RECOGNIZES THERE'S AN ISSUE, A CONCERN WITH FOCUSING IN ON RACE, MAKING IT THE DECISIVE FACTOR IN HOW THINGS ARE DONE, HE ALSO RECOGNIZES THAT WE NEED TO BE AFFIRMING ABOUT THE PROBLEM OF RACISM HISTORICALLY WITHIN THE STATE OF ALABAMA AND WITHIN AMERICAN SOCIETY IN HOW WE MOVE FORWARD.

IGNORING THAT HISTORY IS DANGEROUS, AND CHIEF JUSTICE ROBERTS RECOGNIZES THAT WE NEED TO BE CONSCIENTIOUS ABOUT IT AND, IN FACT, BEFORE THESE MAPS WERE ADOPTED PART OF WHAT REPRESENTATIVE ENGLAND ASKED OF THE REAPPORTIONMENT COMMITTEE WAS WHETHER THEY HAD DONE ANY INVESTIGATION INTO RACIAL POLARIZATION, WHETHER THEY HAD DONE ANYTHING EVALUATING HOW TIGHTLY THEY WERE PACKING BLACK VOTERS INTO ANY PARTICULAR DISTRICT, OR ARTIFICIALLY DIVIDING BLACK VOTERS IN PARTICULAR DISTRICTS.

WHAT WE KNOW FROM THAT INITIAL COMMITTEE HEARING WAS THAT THE STATE DID NOT DO THAT PROCEDURAL EVALUATION BECAUSE THEY WANTED TO IGNORE RACE COMPLETELY.

>> IT WAS IN THEIR RULES, THEIR GUIDELINES.

THAT'S WHY THEY WERE SAYING -- THE LAWMAKERS, YOU KNOW, THEY DID A MILLION DRAWINGS OF MAPS WITHOUT REGARD FOR RACE AND COULDN'T COME UP WITH TWO THAT WERE -- BUT ONCE YOU DID APPLY RACE IT WAS EASY.

MAYBE THAT GETS -- YOU GOT ON A GOOD POINT THERE BECAUSE GOING FORWARD, OBVIOUSLY IN A STATE LIKE ALABAMA YOU BROUGHT UP THE WHOLE VOTING PROPENSITY KIND OF THING.

THAT SEEMED TO BE REALLY DECISIVE IN THIS RULING.

WHEREAS, BLACK VOTERS, 90% VOTE FOR A BLACK CANDIDATE.

15% OF WHITE VOTERS VOTE FOR A BLACK CANDIDATE.

KEPT HEARING THE STATISTICS COME BACK UP.

I WOULD IMAGINE THOSE ARE SIMILAR STATISTICS TO OTHER SOUTHERN STATES, OTHER FORMER PRE-CLEARANCE STATES.

LET'S CALL IT THAT.

I'M CURIOUS IF THIS IS GOING TO CREATE A NEW STANDARD.

TEN YEARS AGO IT WAS SHELBY VERSUS HOLDER THAT REALLY TOOK AWAY THE PRE-CLEARANCE AND ALL OF THAT WORK.

STATES HAD TO GO TO THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT TO ASK FOR PRECLEARANCE.

DOES THIS CREATE ANOTHER PERFORM OF THAT AT LEAST AS IT PERTAINS TO REDISTRICTING?

BECAUSE OF THAT RACIAL BREAKDOWN IN VOTING, IT SEEMS TO ME ANYTIME ANOTHER STATE DRAWS ITS MAPS IT IS PROBABLY IN THE SAME BOAT.

IS IT ALMOST A BACK DOOR TO REESTABLISH PARTS OF SHELBY HOLDER?

>> I THINK ANYTIME -- ESPECIALLY STATES IN THE SOUTH BECAUSE OF PAST HISTORY AND BECAUSE OF CURRENT VOTING PATTERNS, AS YOU CLEARLY POINTED OUT, WHITES VOTE FOR WHITE CANDIDATES AND BLACKS TEND TO VOTE FOR BLACK CANDIDATES.

NOW, WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE VOTING PATTERN, YOU MUST TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION RACE WHEN YOU ARE DRAWING UP DISTRICTS BECAUSE IN ORDER FOR ME TO BE REPRESENTED IN CONGRESS, I NEED TO BE ABLE TO ELECT A PERSON OF MY CHOICE.

IF I'M IN -- ESPECIALLY IF I'M IN A MAJORITY BLACK AREA, I NEED TO BE ABLE TO ELECT THE PERSON OF MY CHOICE.

IF YOU TAKE AWAY THOSE -- WHAT I CALL IMPORTANT VARIABLES, THE RACE, THEN BECAUSE OF THE WAY PEOPLE VOTE IN ALABAMA AND IN THE SOUTHERN STATES I WOULD NOT BE ABLE TO ELECT THE PERSON OF MY CHOICE.

AGAIN, WHAT THEY DID IS PACK ALL OF THE PEOPLE IN DISTRICT 7.

NOW, THAT'S ASSURED HER OF A FIRM ABILITY TO WIN.

>> THAT WAS KIND OF THE POINT, RIGHT?

THEY DREW THAT DISTRICT A LONG TIME AGO.

>> IT'S THE POINT BUT YOU ARE OVERPACKING.

>> YEAH, YEAH.

>> BUT THOSE PEOPLE WHO ARE NOT IN DISTRICT 7 WHO DESERVE TO BE REPRESENTED, THEN AND COULD BE REPRESENTED BY A PERSON OF THEIR CHOICE, BECAUSE THEY PACKED THEM ALL IN THERE THEY DIDN'T HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO VOTE FOR A PERSON OF THEIR CHOICE BECAUSE EVERYBODY WAS PACKED INTO DISTRICT 7 AND THE OTHER WAS TOO SPREAD OUT WHERE THEY COULD NOT FORM A COHESIVE ELECTION MAJORITY TO ELECT THE PERSON OF THEIR CHOICE.

SO I THINK YOU ARE GOING TO SEE ON THESE NEW MAPS WHERE THOSE PEOPLE ARE TAKEN OUT OF DISTRICT 7 AND PUT INTO ANOTHER DISTRICT WHICH, YOU KNOW, I WON'T SAY WHAT THAT DISTRICT MAY BE BUT ANOTHER DISTRICT WHERE BLACKS ARE ABLE TO FORM A MAJORITY AND TO ELECT A PERSON OF THEIR CHOICE.

>> IS THIS -- YOU ARE GETTING AT A GOOD POINT.

LIKE, IS THIS MAYBE AN EVOLUTION OF HOW JURISPRUDENCE, AS IT COMES TO THE VOTING RIGHTS ACT, IN THAT, ALL RIGHT, LATE '80S, EARLY '90S WE ARE GOING TO CREATE THIS DISTRICT TO ENSURE FOR THE FIRST TIME IN A LONG TIME SENSORY CONSTRUCTION.

>> SENSORY CONSTRUCTION.

>> AT LEAST ONE BLACK REPRESENTATIVE.

THAT WAS 30 YEARS AGO.

IT IS EVOLUTION OF JURISPRUDENCE AS IT PERTAINS TO THE VOTING RIGHTS ACT.

NO, THAT'S NOT ENOUGH.

YOU HAVE TO DO WHAT THE LAW SAYS.

>> I THINK WHAT THE COURT IS EVOLVING TO IS A GOAL FOR THE UNITED STATES AND FOR THE DEEP SOUTH BY REMOVING SECTION 5 IN THE SHELBY OPINION.

WE DIDN'T ELIMINATE THE STATE'S OBLIGATIONS.

WE JUST TOOK AWAY THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT'S OVERSIGHT AT THE FRONT END.

WHAT WE HAVE NOW WITH SECTION 2 IS THE STATE IS BEING GIVEN AN OPPORTUNITY TO MOVE FORWARD INDEPENDENTLY, WITHOUT FEDERAL GOVERNMENT OVERSIGHT OR INTERFERENCE, BUT WHAT WE KNOW IN THIS INSTANCE WAS THAT THEY DID NOT PUT FORTH A MAP THAT SATISFIED THE EVALUATION PROCESS OF HOW THEY SHOULD REACH THEIR CONCLUSIONS, AND KEEP IN MIND HERE, WHAT WE MAY END UP WITH MAY NOT BE A MAJORITY BLACK DISTRICT.

>> A SECOND ONE.

>> A SECOND MAJORITY BLACK DISTRICT, BUT WHAT THE COURT RECOGNIZES THE PEOPLE OF ALABAMA MAY DECIDE TO DO IS WITHIN IN THIS NEW DISTRICT AND ITS CONSTRUCTION, WE MAY SEE A COALITION OF BLACK VOTERS AND OTHER VOTERS OR OF VOTERS WHO AGREE ON SOME OTHER PLATFORM THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH RACE THAT WILL ALLOW THEM TO ELECT CANDIDATES OF THEIR CHOICE TO PUT FORWARD THEIR POLICY PREFERENCES.

ULTIMATELY HERE, WHAT WE HAVE ASKED FOR IS AN OPPORTUNITY AT A FAIR PROCESS.

THE SUPREME COURT CONFIRMED THAT ALABAMA DID NOT PROVIDE THAT.

>> I WAS GOING TO SAY -- NOT TO DISAGREE WITH TISH BUT I THINK THE COURT IS SAYING THAT BLACK VOTERS -- YOUR VOTES STILL MATTER BECAUSE OF THE RULING.

WHEREAS BEFORE, YOU PACK ALL OF THE BLACKS IN TO ONE DISTRICT AND YES, YOU ARE ASSURED OF ELECTING ONE PERSON, BUT IF YOU HAVE OVERALL ENOUGH POPULATION TO ELECT TWO, OR MAYBE THREE, WELL, WHY SHOULDN'T WE REDISTRICT IN THAT ORDER?

RATHER THAN PACKING EVERYBODY -- OR PACKING THEM WHERE THEY CANNOT FORM A COHESIVE VOTING.

>> IT'S GOING TO BE INTERESTING TO SEE.

LOOKS LIKE WE ARE LOOKING AT A JULY SPECIAL SESSION.

THAT'S RIGHT AROUND THE CORNER TO REDRAW THE MAPS.

I AGREE WITH COALITIONS AND HOW THIS MIGHT LOOK.

IT MAY TAKE A LONG TIME BECAUSE IN ANY CASE THERE ARE PROBABLY GOING TO BE -- WHETHER OR NOT THE MAJORITY -- IT WILL BE MORE MODERATE, RIGHT.

>> YES.

>> WHAT NOW?

>> MORE MODERATE IN A GENERAL ELECTION SENSE.

THE KIND OF REPUBLICAN THAT COULD BE COMPETITIVE IN THAT IS NOT THE KIND OF REPUBLICAN THAT GETS NOMINATED -- NAME THING FOR THE DEMOCRATS.

I'M FASCINATED BY THE POTENTIAL POLITICAL RAMIFICATIONS HERE, BUT I THINK IT MIGHT BE SEVERAL TERMS BEFORE WE REALLY CAN FLESH THAT ALL OUT.

>> HOPEFULLY IT WILL NOT TAKE 30 MORE YEARS, BUT OUR EXPECTATION IS TO PULL POLICY IN ALABAMA BACK TOWARDS THE CENTER.

TO GET OUR POLITICIANS, OUR LEGISLATORS TALKING TO ONE ANOTHER, NEGOTIATING AND COMPROMISING BECAUSE WHAT WE HAVE RIGHT NOW IN ALABAMA DOES NOT DO THAT.

>> WELL, WE'RE OUT OF TIME BUT THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR COMING ON AND EXPLAINING SOME OF THESE COMPLICATED ISSUES.

I SUPPOSE CONGRATULATIONS ARE IN ORDER FOR THE PLAINTIFFS FOR YOUR VICTORY.

BUT THANKS AGAIN FOR COMING ON THE SHOW.

>> TALK ABOUT SHELBY BUT I DON'T KNOW IF YOU CAN GET IT ON.

>> I'M SORRY.

YOU HAD SOME EVENTS PLANNED.

>> EVERYONE KNOWS THIS IS THE TENTH ANNIVERSARY OF SHELBY VERSUS HOLDER DECISION AND WE WILL HAVE A SUMMIT 23-25 JUNE, AND SO WE WILL BE IN SHELBY COUNTY GOING BACK TO WHAT WE CALL THE SCENE OF THE CRIME.

AND THEN WE WILL HAVE STRATEGY SESSIONS THAT WE WILL COME UP WITH HOW WE ARE GOING TO MOTIVATE PEOPLE TO GET OUT TO VOTE IN 23 AND MORE IMPORTANT IN 2024 ABUSE THESE A CRITICAL ELECTION FOR AMERICA AND WE WANT EVERY VOTER TO KNOW THEIR VOTE IS IMPORTANT AND TO MAKE SURE THEY ARE PREPARING TO GET OUT TO THE POLLS.

WE ARE GOING TO EDUCATE PEOPLE AND GET THEM TO THE POLLS IN 2024.

>> SOUNDS GOOD.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME AND LOOK FORWARD TO SEEING YOU NEXT TIME.

>> ABSOLUTELY.

THANK YOU.

>> WE'LL BE RIGHT BACK.

>> YOU CAN WATCH PAST EPISODES OF "CAPITOL JOURNAL" ONLINE ANYTIME AT ALABAMA PUBLIC TELEVISION'S WEBSITE APTV.ORG.

CLICK ON THE "ONLINE VIDEO TAB" ON THE MAIN PAGE.

YOU CAN ALSO CONNECT WITH "CAPITOL JOURNAL" AND LINK TO PAST EPISODES ON "CAPITOL JOURNAL'S" FACEBOOK PAGE.

>> ALABAMA BORN AND EDUCATED HAZEL BRANNON SMITH OWNED AND EDITED FOUR WEEKLY NEWSPAPERS DURING THE '50S AND '60S.

SHE SPOKE OUT AGAINST RACIAL VIOLENCE AND INTIMIDATION AND FOR FREEDOM OF THE LAW AND SPEECH.

SHE RECEIVED THE PULITZER PRIZE, THE FIRST WOMAN TO RECEIVE THE PRIZE FOR EDITORIAL WRITING.

THE COMMITTEE ACKNOWLEDGED HER STEADFAST OBLIGATION TO DUTY IN THE FACE OF OPPOSITION AND OPPRESSION.

>> YOU ARE WATCHING ALABAMA PUBLIC TELEVISION.

>> JOINING ME NEXT IS JOHN WAHL, CHAIRMAN OF THE ALABAMA REPUBLICAN PARTY.

MR. CHAIRMAN, THANK YOU FOR COMING ON "CAPITOL JOURNAL."

>> GREAT TO BE ON THE SHOW AND GET TO TALK TO THE PEOPLE OF ALABAMA.

>> WE'RE TALKING A LOT ABOUT REDISTRICTING THIS WEEK AND OF COURSE WE DON'T KNOW WHAT THOSE MAPS WILL LOOK LIKE.

WE JUST KNOW THAT BECAUSE OF THE SUPREME COURT'S RULING, THE SUPREME COURT LAST WEEK RULING THAT ALABAMA'S MOST RECENTLY PASSED CONGRESSIONAL DISTRICTS PASSED IN 2021 ARE IN VIOLATION OF THE VOTING RIGHTS ACT.

THAT'S WHAT THE MAJORITY OF THE COURT SAID.

THEY WILL GO BACK TO THE DRAWING BOARD.

WE'LL WAIT AND SEE WHAT THE MAPS END UP LOOKING LIKE, BUT STARTING FROM THERE, WHEN THAT RULING CAME DOWN, I KNOW A LOT OF REPUBLICANS WERE DISAPPOINTED IN THE RULING ITSELF.

IS THAT FAIR -- IS THAT A GOOD CHARACTERIZATION?

WERE YOU DISAPPOINTED TO SEE THE RULING?

>> OBVIOUSLY THE ALABAMA REPUBLICAN PARTY WAS DISAPPOINTED AT THE SUPREME COURT'S RULING AND FOR US IT GOES TO THE CONSTITUTION ARGUMENT.

THE CONSTITUTION MAKES IT PLAIN THAT REDISTRICTING -- OR THE DRAWING OF DISTRICT LINES AND REDISTRICTING IS A DUTY OF THE STATE LEGISLATURE.

AND, AS REPRESENTATIVES OF THE PEOPLE, WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE THESE LINES, YOU KNOW, RESPECT THE LEGISLATURE AND THEIR PROCESS AND SEE THE LINES ALLOWED TO BE DRAWN ON THE STATE LEVEL RATHER THAN A FEDERAL COURT COME IN AND OVERRULE THAT.

BUT AS FAR AS MOVING FORWARD ON IT, I TRUST THE STATE LEGISLATURE.

I THINK THEY ARE GOING TO CREATE SEVEN DISTRICTS THAT REPRESENT THE PEOPLE AND THE VALUES OF ALABAMA.

AND KEEPING COMMUNITIES TOGETHER AND ALLOWING THE PEOPLE TO HAVE THEIR VOICE IN WASHINGTON.

>> WE DON'T KNOW WHAT THOSE WILL LOOK LIKE YET AND THOSE CONVERSATIONS ARE ONGOING BUT WE KNOW AT THE VERY LEAST YOU WILL HAVE TWO DISTRICTS THAT WILL BE A LOT MORE MODERATE, IF YOU WILL, FOR LACK OF A BETTER WAY TO SAY THAT, MEANING TWO DISTRICTS WILL BE A LOT CLOSER IN LINE IN TERMS OF RACIAL MAJORITIES, RIGHT?

WE DON'T KNOW IF IT WILL BE MAJORITY BLACK DISTRICTS OR CLOSE TO IT OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT BUT NO MATTER WHAT THERE WILL BE A LOT CLOSER IN RACE.

THAT MEANS IN A GENERAL ELECTION PROBABLY A LOT MORE MODERATE.

YOU HAVE TALKED ABOUT THE REPUBLICAN PARTY WANTING TO COMPETE IN ALL SEVEN DISTRICTS, THAT BEING THE CASE.

HOW DOES THAT CHANGE YOUR CALCULUS?

DOES IT TAKE A DIFFERENT KIND OF REPUBLICAN CANDIDATE TO APPEAL TO THOSE WHO MAY BE REPUBLICANS HAVEN'T HAD TO APPEAL TO REALLY IN THE LAST COUPLE OF DECADES?

>> YOU KNOW, I THINK THIS COULD BE SEEN AS VERY POSITIVE FOR THE REPUBLICAN PARTY BECAUSE WHEN WE LOOK AT ENGAGING THE PUBLIC, WE WANT TO REPRESENT ALL OF THE PEOPLE OF ALABAMA.

WHEN WE THINK OF WHAT'S IMPORTANT FOR PEOPLE, IT'S BEING SAFE, IT'S BEING PRODUCTIVE.

IT'S HAVING A BRIGHT FUTURE FOR THEIR CHILDREN AND I THINK THE REPUBLICAN VALUES ARE BEST FOR THE PEOPLE.

WE LOVE TO ARGUE THAT IN ELECTION CYCLES.

WE DID POLLING AND ASKED WHAT ISSUE REALLIES MOST IMPORTANT TO YOU.

IN THAT LIST, ONE THING WE ASKED IS PROTECTING CHILDREN.

AMONGST REPUBLICANS IT WAS NUMBER ONE AND INDEPENDENTS NUMBER ONE AND EVEN AMONGST DEMOCRATS IT WAS THE THIRD MOST IMPORTANT ISSUE.

THERE ARE DEFINITELY ISSUES OUT THERE AND THERE ARE VALUES OUT THERE THAT THE PEOPLE OF ALABAMA, REPUBLICAN OR DEMOCRAT ARE GOING TO AGREE WITH THE REPUBLICAN PARTY.

WE'RE GOING TO TALK ABOUT THOSE.

WE WILL DEFEND OUR VALUES AND TALK ABOUT PROTECTING PEOPLE'S RIGHTS AND FREEDOMS AND WE PLAN TO BE COMPETITIVE AND DO OUR BEST TO WIN ALL SEVEN CONGRESSIONAL DISTRICTS.

>> LET'S MOVE TO THE LEGISLATIVE SESSION THAT RECENTLY CONCLUDED.

OBVIOUSLY, THERE WERE REPUBLICAN MAJORITIES IN THE HOUSE AND SENATE.

YOU MAY NOT ALWAYS AGREE WITH THE OUTCOMES.

I WAS CURIOUS AS TO WHAT YOU THOUGHT ABOUT GENERALLY HOW THIS LEGISLATIVE SESSION WENT.

I KNOW YOU SPENT A LOT OF TIME IN MONTGOMERY JUST INTERACTING WITH THE LAWMAKERS THEMSELVES.

>> WELL, THAT'S IMPORTANT TO ME AS CHAIRMAN.

THE REPUBLICAN PARTY SETS FORTH THE PLATFORM AND KIND OF THE VALUES.

I GET SO MANY CALLS FROM MEMBERS ASKING ABOUT BILLS OR HELP WITH LEGISLATION.

I THINK THAT SAN IMPORTANT ROLE OF THE PARTY.

I THINK ANYTIME I'M TALKING ABOUT A LEGISLATIVE SESSION, SOMETHING I TALK ABOUT IS NO LEGISLATIVE SESSION IS PERFECT.

THERE'S ALWAYS SOMETHING WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE DONE OR THIS PERSON WOULD LIKE TO SEE DONE.

THE FOUNDERS CREATED A SYSTEM WHERE IT WAS HARD TO PASS LEGISLATION.

THAT'S A GOOD THING.

SOMETIMES IT TAKES TWO OR THREE YEARS.

AND SOME OF THE WORK WE HAVE SEEN I'M VERY PROUD OF THIS SESSION.

THINGS LIKE PAYING OFF OUR DEBTS AND REFUNDING ALL OF OUR RAINY DAY FUNDS.

FISCALLY IT WAS A GOOD SESSION AND THE LARGEST TAX CUT IN ALABAMA HISTORY WITH CUTTING THE GROCERY TAX.

THAT IS SOMETHING THE PARTY WAS SUPPORTIVE OF AND OF COURSE THERE ARE OTHER AREAS WE WOULD HAVE LIKED TO SEE LEGISLATION PASS, VOTER INTEGRITY, LOOKING AT ABSENTEE BALLOT REFORM.

AND NO CHILD SHOULD BE DEFINED BY THEIR ZIP CODE.

AND THEN OF COURSE THE DIVISIVE CONCEPTS.

WE ARE CHALLENGING THE IDEA WE NEED TO TEACH OUR CHILDREN WOKE POLICIES AND TRANSGENDER EDUCATION.

THAT SHOULD BE LEFT UP TO PARENTS.

LET THE PARENTS TEACH DIVISIVE CONCEPTS.

NOT EVERYTHING GOT ACROSS THE FINISH LINE BUT THERE'S ALWAYS NEXT SESSION.

THAT'S THE WONDERFUL THING ABOUT LEGISLATION.

GOOD LEGISLATION USUALLY GETS PASSED.

IT JUST TAKES A WHILE.

>> THAT'S VERY TRUE.

THAT'S A POINT I MAKE ON THE SHOW OFTEN.

YOU TAKE THE SCHOOL CHOICE VOUCHER THING, IT IS A RELATIVELY NEW CONCEPT.

NOT NEW CONCEPT BUT NEW LEGISLATION.

PRETTY SERIOUS LEGISLATION.

I WASN'T SURPRISED IT MAY TAKE A COUPLE OF YEARS.

ON THAT ISSUE SPECIFICALLY, I KNOW THAT THERE HAVE BEEN, YOU KNOW, A LOT OF REPUBLICAN SUPPORT OVER THE YEARS.

DO YOU SEE THAT MOMENTUM GROWING IN TERMS OF YOUR RANK AND FILE REPUBLICAN VOTERS, THE BASE REALLY PRESSING THE LEGISLATURE ON THIS ISSUE?

IS IT GOING TO BE A GROUND SWELL?

>> I THINK SO.

OVER THE LAST FEW YEARS, IT BECOMING MORE AND MORE IMPORTANT TO VOTERS, NOT JUST THE PARTY BASE BUT THE VOTERS OF ALABAMA WHETHER REPUBLICANS OR DEMOCRATS.

WE ARE SEEING THIS OVERARCHING IDEA OF SCHOOL CHOICE BEING INCREDIBLY POPULAR, ESPECIALLY MINORITY VOTERS.

IT IS MORE POPULAR AND IT IS SOMETHING WE WILL SEE COMING BACK FROM A PARTY PERSPECTIVE AND VOTERS' PERSPECTIVE.

I THINK SOMETHING WE WILL SEE HIGHLIGHT THAT IS THE PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN.

WE WILL SEE A LOT OF THE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATES TALKING ABOUT PARENTAL RIGHTS, SCHOOL CHOICE AND HOW TO GET PARENTS INVOLVED IN THE EDUCATIONAL PROCESS FOR THEIR CHILDREN.

>> SPEAKING OF THE PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN, YOU HAVE GOT A BIG GUEST COMING IN TO THE STATE OF ALABAMA AS A GUEST AT YOUR SUMMER DINNER ON AUGUST 4TH.

TELL US ABOUT IT.

>> ABSOLUTELY.

THE REPUBLICAN PARTY IS EXCITED TO HAVE DONALD TRUMP KEYNOTING OUR SUMMER DINNER.

THIS IS A TREND OF BRINGING IN THE BIGGEST NAMES IN POLITICS.

SO, IT'S IMPORTANT FOR ME THAT WE HELP ALABAMA GET THE CREDIT IT DESERVES AND HIGHLIGHT ALABAMA NATIONALLY.

WE ARE A SUPER TUESDAY STATE.

I BELIEVE ALABAMA REPRESENTS A LOT OF VOTERS ACROSS THE COUNTRY.

WE'RE THE RED STATE THAT REPRESENTS THE REPUBLICAN PRIMARY.

I WANT TO SEE ALABAMA BE A BELLWETHER STATE WHERE WE SEE NATIONAL FIGURES WANTING TO COME HERE AND MEET THE PEOPLE OF ALABAMA AND HAVE A CHANCE FOR THE PEOPLE OF ALABAMA MEET THEM.

I'M EXCITED WHERE WE ARE GOING.

I'M EXCITED TO HAVE THE FRONTRUNNER HERE THIS AUGUST.

>> I WOULD IMAGINE THE CONVERSATION ABOUT BOOKING A GUEST LIKE THIS, THE FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES AND ARGUABLY THE FRONTRUNNER FOR THE NOMINATION PROBABLY TOOK PLACE MONTHS AGO AND BEFORE THIS RECENT INDICTMENT, THIS FEDERAL INDICTMENT IN FLORIDA.

ARE THERE ANY CONCERNS ABOUT THAT?

ARE THERE ANY CONVERSATIONS WHETHER OR NOT THIS IS A GOOD IDEA CONSIDERING ALL THE LEGAL THINGS GOING ON, OR ARE YOU NOT CONCERNED ABOUT THAT?

>> I'M NOT CONCERNED ABOUT IT.

I'LL TELL YOU WHY.

FOR ME, THE REPUBLICAN PARTY'S JOB IS TO REPRESENT THE STATE AND THE REPUBLICAN VOTERS AND WHAT I HEAR FROM VOTERS IS THEY ARE SKEPTICAL OF THE INDICTMENT.

THEY FEEL JOE BIDEN HAD PAPERS AND WHY ONLY AN INDICTMENT FOR TRUMP?

A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE FEELING LIKE IT IS POLITICAL ATTACK AND MISUSE OF THE JUSTICE SYSTEM.

ON TOP OF THAT WE SHOULD ALWAYS ALLOW PEOPLE DECIDE THEIR OPINION ON SOMEONE OR THEIR GUILT.

THAT'S NOT THE ROLE OF THE PARTY.

I WANT TO GIVE PEOPLE THE CHANCE TO HEAR THEM AND THEIR MESSAGE AND THEIR VISION FOR AMERICA AND WE TRUST THE VOTERS OF ALABAMA TO MAKE THEIR DECISION IN THE PRIMARY NEXT MARCH.

>> LIKE YOU SAID, YOU HAD GOVERNOR DESANTIS IN JANUARY OR FEBRUARY.

>> MARCH 12.

>> I REMEMBER THAT EVENT HAD TO CHANGE VENUES BECAUSE YOU HAD SO MANY PEOPLE SIGNING UP, CAPACITY ISSUE WHICH IS -- WHEN YOU ARE A CANDIDATE THAT'S A GREAT PROBLEM TO HAVE.

I'M CURIOUS NOW THESE TWO HAVE BEEN COMPETING IF TRUMP WILL TRY TO HAVE THE SAME PROBLEM.

I DON'T KNOW IF THERE IS A BIGGER VENUE IN MONTGOMERY THAN THE RENAISSANCE.

>> I DON'T THINK THERE IS.

WE CAN SEAT 2400 GUESTS AT TABLES AND I WILL BE HONEST, WE EXPECT TO SELL OUT.

I WOULD ENCOURAGE ANYONE INTERESTED TO GET YOUR TICKETS QUICKLY BECAUSE IT LOOKS LIKE A SELLOUT CROWD.

>> DO YOU EXPECT THERE TO BE -- I WAS WATCHING THE LIVE COVERAGE OF THE ARRAIGNMENT AND ALL OF THIS AND IT IS A CIRCUS DOWN THERE IN MIAMI.

THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE SHOW UP.

THAT TENDS TO HAPPEN A LOT OF PLACES WHERE THE FORMER PRESIDENT GOES.

ARE YOU EXPECTING -- NOT JUST ATTENDEES BUT DO YOU EXPECT OR ANTICIPATE CROWDS SHOWING UP?

FOR AND AGAINST BECAUSE IT IS PEOPLE PROTESTING AND SUPPORTING HIM.

IT TENDS TO HAPPEN WHEREVER HE GOES.

>> THAT'S SOMETHING WE HAVE TO EXPECT.

LIKE YOU SAID, PROTESTERS AND FANS.

I THINK THAT IS SOMETHING WE WILL BE MINDFUL OF.

I WOULD EXPECT IT.

TO A WHAT LEVEL, WE WILL HAVE A BETTER IDEA OF THAT THE NEXT FEW WEEKS WATCHING OTHER EVENTS AND TAKE A GAUGE FROM THOSE FOR WHAT WE NEED TO BE READY FOR.

>> IT WILL BE INTERESTING.

MONTGOMERY, AUGUST 4TH, FORMER PRESIDENT TRUMP SPEAKING TO THE ALABAMA REPUBLICAN PARTY.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME AND LOOK FORWARD TO SEEING YOU THEN.

>> ALWAYS GOOD TO BE ON THE SHOW AND APPRECIATE YOU AND LOOK FORWARD TO BEING BACK SOON.

>> OKAY.

>> WE'LL BE RIGHT BACK.

>> YOU CAN WATCH PAST EPISODES OF "CAPITOL JOURNAL" ONLINE AT VIDEO@APTV.ORG.

"CAPITOL JOURNAL" EPISODES ARE ALSO AVAILABLE ON APTV'S FREE MOBILE APP.

YOU CAN CONNECT WITH "CAPITOL JOURNAL" AND LINK TO PAST EPISODES ON "CAPITOL JOURNAL'S" FACEBOOK PAGE.

AND YOU CAN LISTEN TO PAST EPISODES OF "CAPITOL JOURNAL" WHEN YOU ARE DRIVING OR ON THE GO WITH "CAPITOL JOURNAL" PODCASTS.

KEEP UP WITH WHAT'S HAPPENING WITH "CAPITOL JOURNAL."

>> JOINING ME NEXT IS JIMMY ENTREKIN, GENERAL COUNSEL FOR THE LEGISLATIVE SERVICES AGENCY.

JIMMY, THANK YOU FOR COMING ON THE SHOW.

>> GLAD TO BE HERE.

THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME, TODD.

>> OF COURSE, WE ARE TALKING ABOUT REDISTRICTING.

WE DON'T HAVE TO GET INTO THE POLITICS.

OUR PREVIOUS TWO GUESTS DID THAT FOR US.

BUT IT'S BASICALLY ASSURED NOW THAT WE ARE GOING TO HAVE A SPECIAL SESSION OF THE LEGISLATURE DEDICATED TO REDISTRICTING AGAIN, TO REDRAW THE MAPS.

THE SUPREME COURT SAID THEY DON'T COMPLY WITH THE VOTING RIGHTS ACT.

THAT BEGINS A WHOLE PROCESS.

WE DID IT IN 2021.

IT HAPPENS EVERY TEN YEARS, BUT SINCE YOU SPECIALIZE IN THIS PARTLY, I WANT TO HAVE YOU ON THE SHOW TO HELP US UNDERSTAND HOW THE PROCESS WORKS.

>> SURE.

BE GLAD TO.

THE PROCESS FOR THIS PARTICULAR OCCASION IS ACTUALLY GOING TO WORK THE SAME AS THE PROCESS WOULD AFTER ANY REGULAR CENSUS IS TAKEN AND THE TEN-YEAR REDISTRICTING OCCURS.

THE SAME KIND OF PROCESS BUT HERE'S WHAT THE PROCESS INVOLVES.

IT STARTS WITH THE PERMANENT LEGISLATIVE COMMITTEE ON REAPPORTIONMENT.

THAT IS THE COMMITTEE THAT HELPS TO FUNNEL, PLAN, ORGANIZE AND CRAFT DISTRICTING MAPS FOR THE LEGISLATURE TO CONSIDER, BUT -- I WANT TO PAUSE ON THAT FOR A SECOND AND JUMP A LITTLE BIT FORWARD TO THE LEGISLATIVE PROCESS, EVEN THOUGH IT STARTS WITH THE COMMITTEE WORK.

I WANT TO JUMP TO THE LEGISLATIVE PROCESS BECAUSE THAT WILL HELP TO SET THE FRAMEWORK FOR HOW THE COMMITTEE PLAYS INTO THAT.

WITH THE LEGISLATIVE PROCESS, I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT FOR OUR VIEWERSHIP TO KNOW THAT THE REDISTRICTING MAPS GO THROUGH THE LEGISLATURE JUST LIKE ANY OTHER REGULAR BILL WOULD.

IT'S THE SAME LEGISLATIVE PROCESS.

>> IT'S ON PAPER AND RIGHT THERE.

>> IT'S ON PAPER.

STILL THE PAPER.

IT HAS TO GO THROUGH THE WHOLE COMMITTEE PROCESS.

IT HAS TO PASS BOTH CHAMBERS IN IDENTICAL FORM.

IN ADDITION TO THAT T IT IS SUBJECT TO AMENDMENTS AND CHANGES LIKE ANY OTHER BILL WOULD AND ANY LEGISLATOR CAN FILE THEIR OWN REDISTRICTING PLAN, WHETHER IT WAS CRAFTED BY THE COMMITTEE OR NOT.

SO, HAVING SAID THAT, LET'S JUMP BACK TO THE COMMITTEE WORK, WHICH STARTS BEFORE THE LEGISLATIVE PROCESS EVEN BEGINS FOR A PARTICULAR PLAN.

SO, THE COMMITTEE IS MADE UP OF 11 SENATORS AND 11 HOUSE MEMBERS.

IT IS CO-CHAIRED BY REPRESENTATIVE PRINGLE FROM SOUTH ALABAMA FOR SENATOR LIVINGSTON FROM NORTH ALABAMA.

AND WHAT THIS COMMITTEE WILL DO IS IF AND WHEN, AT THE APPROPRIATE TIME, IT WILL KIND OF, AS I SAID, HELP TO PLAN, ORGANIZE AND GATHER INFORMATION.

IT WILL THEN ADOPT GUIDELINES AND CRITERIA THAT, IN ITS OPINION, FITS THE RELEVANT U.S. AND FEDERAL AND ALABAMA LAW.

THEN IT WILL ADOPT AN OFFICIAL RECOMMENDED PLAN OF THE COMMITTEE.

THAT COMMITTEE PLAN WILL BE TURNED INTO A BILL AND FILED WITH THE LEGISLATURE FOR ITS CONSIDERATION.

SO, YOU KNOW, AT THAT POINT, AS I SAID, THE OTHER THINGS KICK IN.

I WILL SAY THE LEGISLATURE IS NOT ACTUALLY BOUND TO ADOPT THE PLAN OF THE COMMITTEE, BUT THE COMMITTEE STILL EXERTS A LOT OF INFLUENCE BECAUSE THE LEGISLATURE IS ALWAYS GIVEN GREAT DEFERENCE TO THE COMMITTEE'S PLAN, BUT IT'S NOT BOUND BY IT.

I WANT TO SAY THAT THERE IS STILL A REQUIREMENT THAT ANY PLAN ABOUT TEN DAYS PRIOR TO INTRODUCTION TO THE LEGISLATURE MUST STILL BE SUBMITTED TO THE COMMITTEE FOR ITS REVIEW AND ANY AMENDMENT TO ANY BILL OR PLAN THAT THE LEGISLATURE IS CURRENTLY CONSIDERING HAS TO BE DRAFTED BY THIS REAPPORTIONMENT COMMITTEE AND THERE'S GOOD REASON FOR THAT.

IT IS DESIGNED BECAUSE THESE PLANS ARE HIGHLY CONVOLUTED.

THERE'S A LOT OF DATA AND YOU CHANGE ONE AREA AND MAY OR MAY NOT IMPACT THE REST OF THE STATE.

IT HELPS TO FOCUS THE ENERGY AND ATTENTION AND HELPS TO ENSURE PLAN ACCURACY BY GOING THROUGH THIS PLAN.

>> I WANTED TO GET INTO THAT.

TALK ABOUT LEGISLATION AND THE DIFFERENT COMMITTEES AND EVERYTHING, BUT AT SOME LEVEL, SOMEBODY IS GOING TO BE THERE WITH THE COMPUTER OR WHATEVER DRAWING THE DISTRICT LINE.

LIKE YOU SAID, ONE LITTLE CHANGE CAN AFFECT, HAS A RIPPLING EFFECT.

HOW DOES THAT WORK?

IS THERE A COMPUTER PROGRAM WHERE YOU ARE PHYSICALLY MOVING THE DISTRICT LINES AROUND?

HOW'S THAT WORK?

>> THAT'S RIGHT.

THE COMMITTEE HAS THAT SYSTEM SET UP.

THE COMMITTEE ITSELF CAN MAKE THOSE CHANGES.

THAT DOESN'T MEAN THAT ANYBODY ELSE CAN'T MAKE THOSE CHANGES.

IT'S LIKE ANY OTHER SOFTWARE PROGRAM REALLY BECAUSE THE PLANS, AS YOU MENTIONED EARLIER, ARE DESCRIBED ON PAPER.

THERE'S A PHYSICAL MAP THAT GOES WITH IT, BUT THOSE MAPS ARE DRAWN BY COMPUTER PROGRAMS, ESPECIALLY WHEN YOU CONSIDER ALL OF THE DATA THESE PROGRAMS ARE CONSIDERING.

>> OH, YEAH, YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT LITTLE BLOCKS OF LAND.

>> CENSUS TRACTS AND POPULATION, RACIAL, ALL KINDS OF VARIOUS DEMOGRAPHIC DATA.

THERE ARE COMPUTER PROGRAMS AND IT CAN BE PURCHASED BY ANYBODY.

USE THE RIGHT PROGRAM AND YOU CAN DRAW YOUR OWN MAP WITH THOSE TOOLS.

IN FACT, THE REAPPORTIONMENT COMMITTEE HAS A TAB ON THE LEGISLATURE WEBSITE WHERE PEOPLE CAN GO AND CLICK ON IT AND IT HAS ALL KINDS OF INFORMATION, INCLUDING THE RIGHT FORMAT TO SUBMIT A PLAN THROUGH.

ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT SOMEBODY WANTING TO DRAW A PLAN, WHICH IS HOW YOU DESCRIBED, YOU CLICK ON DIFFERENT BUTTONS TO SEE WHAT THE PLAN WOULD LOOK LIKE IF A AREA OF LAND WERE IN DISTRICT ONE OR TWO FOR INSTANCE.

SO, ANYWAY, THERE ARE A LOT OF GREAT RESOURCES AVAILABLE FOR THAT.

BUT SOMEONE IS LITERALLY DRAWING THE MAPS OUT AND IT TRANSLATES IN TO PAPER FORM.

>> WE CAN LOOK FORWARD TO THOSE READ AT LENGTH BY THE COMPUTER.

I'M THINKING BACK TO BE 2021.

I WAS AN INTERN HERE AT THE STATEHOUSE.

THAT'S THE FIRST THING I REMEMBER THEM DOING IS REAPPORTIONMENT.

BUT IT WASN'T JUST ONE MAP.

RIGHT.

YOU HAVE THE COMMITTEE MAP.

ALSO YOU HAD THE HOUSE DEMOCRATS HAD A MAP.

JOE REED HAD A MAP.

IT WASN'T JUST ONE PLAN.

SO, DO YOU THINK THAT'S WHAT WE CAN EXPECT?

DURING THE LAST -- IN 2021, THERE WERE OTHER PROPOSALS SUBMITTED AND EVERYTHING.

EVEN WHEN YOU GET TO THE FLOOR YOU COULD SEE MULTIPLE COMPETING MAPS, RIGHT?

>> THAT'S EXACTLY RIGHT.

WHETHER IT STARTS WITH MULTIPLE MAPS IN THIS CASE OR MULTIPLE AMENDMENTS TO A MAP THAT IS INTRODUCED BY THE LEGISLATURE MIGHT BE A MORE LIKELY POSSIBILITY, GIVEN THE POTENTIAL SHORTER TIME FRAME FOR WHICH THAT WILL OCCUR.

YOU ARE EXACTLY RIGHT.

THERE WILL MOST LIKELY BE MULTIPLE PLANS OR AMENDMENTS TO PLANS BUT EVENTUALLY A MAJORITY WILL COALESCE AROUND ONE PLAN THAT WILL RISE TO THE TOP AND PASS BOTH CHAMBERS AND BY APPROVAL OF THE GOVERNOR WILL BECOME THE LAW OF THE LAND, UNLESS FURTHER COURT BATTLES REQUIRE OTHER CHANGES.

>> YOU CAN PRETTY MUCH COUNT ON THAT.

IT WILL BE INTERESTING.

HERE WE ARE AGAIN IN REDISTRICTING AND IT WILL BE FUN TO WATCH.

OF COURSE, YOU AND YOUR OFFICE, MAYBE THOUGHT YOU WERE GOING TO GET A LITTLE BIT OF A BREATHER AFTER THIS SESSION.

HERE WE ARE COMING RIGHT BACK.

WHO KNOWS WHEN IT WILL BE CALLED.

TALK ABOUT THAT.

WE HAVE ALL TALKED ABOUT HOW THIS WAS A BUSIER THAN NORMAL SESSION, ESPECIALLY IF YOU GO BACK TO THE SPECIAL AT THE BEGINNING, BACK TO THE ORGANIZATIONAL.

IT HAS BEEN A VERY BUSY SEVERAL MONTHS.

FOR YOU AND THE LEGISLATIVE SERVICES AGENCY YOU ALL ARE WORKING ON EVERY BILL AND HAS IT BEEN A CHALLENGE FOR THE STAFF TO KIND OF WORK THROUGH THIS MONSTER SESSION?

>> IT REALLY HAS FELT LIKE ONE REALLY, REALLY LONG SESSION GOING BACK TO JANUARY.

ESPECIALLY DEALING WITH THE NEW VOTING SYSTEM AND DOCUMENT SYSTEM AND ALL OF THE CHAMBERS AND LSA HAS HAD TO WORK THROUGH.

THERE HAVE BEEN CHALLENGES BUT FOR THE MOST PART IT COMES DOWN TO HAVING A GOOD TEAM, HAVING A GOOD TEAM I'M OF PEOPLE WILLING TO STAY LATE, WILLING TO TAKE ON NEW ROLES AND RESPONSIBILITIES AND HELP PROVIDE EXTRA COMMUNICATION TO OTHER LEGISLATIVE STAFF AND TO LEGISLATORS LETTING THEM KNOW WHAT'S GOING ON AND PROVIDING THEM WITH THE RESOURCES THEY NEED.

AS FAR AS THIS PARTICULAR SESSION, THE REAPPORTIONMENT COMMITTEE I WOULD SAY PROBABLY HANDLES THE BIGGEST LOAD OF THE LEGISLATIVE STAFF LOAD.

HOWEVER, LSA AND OUR TEAM ASSIST IN THAT PROCESS, BUT AS WE KNOW FROM ANY SPECIAL SESSION THERE CAN BE OTHER THINGS CONSIDERED ALONG THE WAY AS LONG AS THERE IS ENOUGH VOTES TO CONSIDER SOMETHING.

IT DOESN'T HAVE TO BE LIMITED TO A REDISTRICTING CALL.

WE HAVE TO BE ON CALL AND STAND READY TO GO FOR SURE.

>> YOU ALL DO A GREAT JOB.

WE HAVE TALKED ON THE SHOW BEFORE, COMPARED TO OTHER STATES WE DON'T HAVE AS MUCH SUPPORT STAFF SO I THINK LSA, YOUR TEAM PUNCH ABOVE YOUR WEIGHT AND SHOULD BE CONGRATULATED AND I GUESS WE WILL SEE YOU BACK HERE SOON IN SPECIAL SESSION.

>> SOUNDS GOOD.

LOOKING FORWARD TO IT.

>> THANK YOU FOR COMING ON THE SHOW.

>> THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.

>> WE'LL BE RIGHT BACK.

>> YOU CAN WATCH PAST EPISODES OF "CAPITOL JOURNAL" ONLINE ANYTIME AT ALABAMA PUBLIC TELEVISION'S WEBSITE APTV.ORG.

CLICK ON THE "ONLINE VIDEO TAB" ON THE MAIN PAGE.

YOU CAN ALSO CONNECT WITH "CAPITOL JOURNAL" AND LINK TO PAST EPISODES ON "CAPITOL JOURNAL'S" FACEBOOK PAGE.

>> THE USS ALABAMA IS A WORLD WAR II ERA BATTLESHIP THAT FIRST SERVED IN THE ATLANTIC THEATER BUT BETTER KNOWN TO TAKE JAPANESE HELD ISLANDS BETWEEN '43 AND '45.

THE ALABAMA STATE-OF-THE-ART RADAR ALERTED THE FLEET TO INCOMING AIRCRAFT PROVIDING AMERICANS ENOUGH TIME TO DECIMATE THE ATTACKING FORCE.

LATER, THE ALABAMA SERVED DURING THE BATTLE AND ANCHORED IN TOKYO BAY TO UNLOAD ALLIED FORCES.

IN 1964, THE STATE OF ALABAMA TOOK POSSESSION OF THE BATTLESHIP.

ALABAMA SCHOOL CHILDREN RAISED $100,000 IN NICKELS AND DIMES TO BRING THE SHIP TO MOBILE AND CREATE THE BATTLESHIP MEMORIAL PARK.

IT FEATURES THE ALABAMA, THE USS DRUM AND AN AMERICAN MILITARY AIRCRAFT COLLECTION.

BATTLESHIP MEMORIAL PARK IS ONE OF THE STATE'S MOST VISITED ATTRACTIONS.

>> THAT'S OUR SHOW FOR THIS WEEK.

THANK YOU FOR WATCHING.

WE WILL BE BACK NEXT WEEK WITH MORE "CAPITOL JOURNAL" RIGHT HERE ON ALABAMA PUBLIC TELEVISION.

FOR OUR "CAPITOL JOURNAL" TEAM, I'M TODD STACY.