>> Braude: TONIGHT ON "GREATER BOSTON," SUFFOLK COUNTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY RACHAEL ROLLINS JOINS ME ON THE MURDERS OF TWO BLACK PEOPLE IN WINTHROP.

BOTH REQUIRED IN SERVICE TO OUR COUNTRY AND OUR STATE.

THE SHOOTER WAS KILLED BY POLICE AT THE SCENE BUT A HATE CRIME INVESTIGATION CONTINUES.

PLUS, HER RECENT CRITICISM FOR FORMER MAYOR MARTY WALSH AND HIS HANDLING OF THE DENNIS WHITE POLICE COMMISSIONER NOMINATION, AND WHETHER A 22 AND A HALF YEAR SENTENCE FOR DEREK CHAUVIN IS ENOUGH.

THEN, THE LATEST DEMOCRAT TO JUMP IN THE RACE FOR GOVERNOR, STATE SENATOR SONIA CHANG-DIÍAZ.

AND LATER, HOW COVID MAY AFFECT THE BUILDINGS WE LIVE AND WORK IN LONG AFTER LIFE GETS BACK TO NORMAL.

♪♪♪♪ >> Braude: THE MAN WHO MURDERED AN AIR FORCE VETERAN AND A RETIRED POLICE OFFICER IN WINTHROP OVER THE WEEKEND WAS LIKELY DRIVEN BY HATE.

THAT'S ACCORDING TO SUFFOLK COUNTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY RACHAEL ROLLINS, WHO SAID IN A STATEMENT THAT LAW ENFORCEMENT, WHO ARE INVESTIGATING THE ATTACK AS A HATE CRIME, HAVE "UNEARTHED TROUBLING WHITE SUPREMACY RHETORIC AND STATEMENTS WRITTEN BY THE SHOOTER."

ON SATURDAY, 28-YEAR-OLD NATHAN ALLEN STOLE A BOX TRUCK FROM A PLUMBING COMPANY AND CRASHED IT INTO A HOUSE ON SHIRLEY STREET.

THEN, OFFICIALS SAY, HE WALKED OFF AND PASSED MULTIPLE OTHER PEOPLE WHO WERE NOT BLACK BEFORE SHOOTING.

60-YEAR-OLD FORMER AIR FORCE STAFF SERGEANT RAMONA COOPER AND 68-YEAR-OLD RETIRED STATE TROOPER DAVID GREEN REPEATEDLY.

THAT'S WHEN A POLICE SERGEANT, WHO THOUGHT HE WAS RESPONDING JUST TO A CAR CRASH, RAN IN-- SHOOTING AND KILLING ALLEN AFTER HE REFUSED TO DROP HIS GUN.

IN HER STATEMENT, ROLLINS EMPHASIZED THE MOMENTS BEFORE THE SHOOTER OPENED FIRE, SAYING HE "WALKED AWAY FROM THE WRECKAGE, INTERACTING WITH MULTIPLE INDIVIDUALS AND CHOOSING ONLY TO SHOOT AND KILL THE TWO BLACK PEOPLE HE ENCOUNTERED."

IS THE DISTRICT ATTORNEY JOINS ME NOW.

RACHAEL ROLLINS THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR GIVING ME, SOME TIME.

>> OF COURSE.

>> Braude: I MENTIONED YOU WERE INVESTIGATING THIS WAS A HATE CRIME.

CAN YOU TELL ME WHAT FACTS SPECIFICALLY GOT YOU THERE?

>> THE WRITINGS OF THIS INDIVIDUAL ARE MASS STATE POLICE SERGEANT DETECTIVE HAS BEEN WORKING AROUND THE CLOCK TO FIND OUT MORE ABOUT NATHAN ALLEN AND WHAT THIS PERSON WAS DRIVEN BY, WHAT HE BELIEVED, AND WHAT THE EVIDENCE SHOWS US.

AND SO THE STATE POLICE, WITH THE ABLE HELP OF THE WINTHROP POLICE DEPARTMENT, WITH OUR FEDERAL LAW ENFORCEMENT PARTNERS AS WELL, IS SLOWLY STARTING TO PEEL BACK LAYERS TO FIND OUT A LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT THIS INDIVIDUAL.

SO IT'S HIS WRITING, BUT THEN IT'S ALSO FACTUALLY WHAT ACTUALLY OCCURRED THERE.

IF HE WALKED BY MULTIPLE PEOPLE THAT WERE NOT VISIBLE PEOPLE OF COLOR AND SPARED THEIR LIVES, BUT ONLY CHOSE TO TARGET THESE TWO, I THINK THOSE TWO THINGS COMBINED MAKE US COMFORTABLE AT THIS POINT SAYING WE BELIEVE HE WAS MOTIVATED BY HATE.

>> Braude: WHAT SPECIFICALLY DID HE SAY ABOUT BLACK PEOPLE AND JEWS DISTRICT ATTORNEY?

>> SO WE'LL BE RELEASING I THINK A LITTLE BIT MORE INFORMATION ABOUT THAT.

BUT WE KNOW THAT SPECIFICALLY IN HIS OWN HANDWRITING THERE WERE SWASTIKAS HE TALKED ABOUT THE WHITES BEING A SUPERIOR RACE, BEING APEX PREDATORS, HATE FILLED LANGUAGE AND SORT OF RANTINGS OF A PERSON THAT IN MY OPINION IS BECOMING OR HAS ALREADY BEEN RADICALIZED.

SO THERE ARE SOME CONCERNING PIECES OF LANGUAGE.

>> Braude: WHY DOES IT MATTER IF THIS IS CLASSIFIED AS A HATE CRIME, IF THE GUY WHO DID THE KILLING IS DEAD, AND IF HE ACTED ALONE AS YOU BELIEVE HE DID?

>> IT'S A REALLY IMPORTANT PART OF OUR JOB, JIM, AS DISTRICT ATTORNEYS, NO MATTER WHETHER IT'S DRIVEN BY HATE OR A TAKING OF A LIFE.

IS EXPLAINING TO THESE FAMILIES, WHO OUR STATE POLICE HAD TO CALL AND NOTIFY, YOU KNOW, TROOPER GREEN'S FAMILY, THEY HAD TO CALL AND NOTIFY STAFF SERGEANT RAH MOANL AH COOPER'S FAMILY.

THEY ALSO HAD TO CALL AND NOTIFY NATHAN ALLEN'S FAMILY.

IT IS PUTTING THE PIECES TOGETHER AS TO WHAT IT IS THE LAST MOMENTS OF YOUR LOVED ONE'S LIFE WAS.

AND ANSWERING THOSE REALLY AWFUL QUESTIONS.

BUT THERE'S ALSO A COMMUNITY THAT HAS BEEN DEEPLY IMPACTED BY THIS VIOLENT OUTBURST AND THREE LIVES LOST, ON SATURDAY AFTERNOON.

SO THE PEOPLE OF WINTHROP AS WELL AS STAFF SERGEANT COOPER AND TROOPER GREEN'S FAMILY DESERVE ANSWERS.

>> Braude: BUT MY SENSE FROM YOU IS IT ISN'T JUST THOSE TWO REASONS.

YOU SEEM TO BELIEVE THIS IS JUST YET ANOTHER EXAMPLE OF THIS GROTESQUE BEHAVIOR THAT IS SWEEPING THIS COUNTRY, THAT SADLY, WAS VISITED ON TWO APPARENTLY WONDERFUL PEOPLE IN WINTHROP THE OTHER DAY.

IS THAT NOT SO?

>> WE HAVE SEEN, JIM, OVER THE YEARS, RIGHT, WHERE WE -- YOU KNOW WE THINK ABOUT THE EMANUEL AME CHURCH IN 2015 IN CHARLESTON, SOUTH CAROLINA.

WE THINK ABOUT THE PULSE NIGHT CLUB IN ORLANDO IN 2016, 49 KILLS, RIGHT?

WE THINK ABOUT THE TREE OF LIFE SYNAGOGUE IN PITTSBURG, WE THINK ABOUT WALMART IN EL PAST PASO, WE THEY ABOUT ATLANTA, IT'S NOT US AS NORTHERNERS TO THINK THAT THAT DOESN'T HAPPEN HIRE OR THAT'S JUST A SOUTHERN PROBLEM, LOOKING AT THE INSURRECTION ON JANUARY 6th, WE BELIEVE OH WE DON'T KNOW PEOPLE LIKE THAT, THOSE ARE PEOPLE THAT WE READ ABOUT.

THIS HAS NOW INCREMENT INTO OUR COMMUNITY.

AS NORTHERNERS WE ARE DEALING WITH SOME OF THOSE ISSUES AND WE NEED TO BE REALLY HONEST WITH EACH OTHER ABOUT THAT.

>> Braude: DOES ANY OF THIS SHOOTER'S WRITINGS REFERENCE ANY OF THE WHITE SUPREMACIST RACIST ACTS IN THIS COUNTRY?

>> WE ARE STILL UNEARTHING A LOT OF HIS DOCUMENTS.

AND REMEMBER, WE START AT THE SCENE AND START WORKING OUR CIRCLE LARGER AND LARGER.

SO THE STATE POLICE HAVE NOT ONLY LOOBD LOOKED AT WHAT HE HAD ON HIS PERSON SO WITH RESPECT TO FIREARMS AND OTHER THINGS LIKE THAT, THEN WE GO TO HIS HOME AND WE ARE STARTING TO UNEARTH MORE AND MORE.

AS WE LEARN MORE JIM WE WILL ABSOLUTELY BE NOTIFYING NOT ONLY THE LOVED ONES BUT THE COMMUNITY.

AS OF RIGHT NOW WE BELIEVE THIS INDIVIDUAL ACTED ALONE, AT THIS STATE OF EMERGENCY IN OUR INVESTIGATION, BUT WE'RE GOING TO BE SEEING WHETHER THERE WERE READINGS, WEBSITES, YOU KNOW, LIKE SORT OF WRITINGS THAT HE HIMSELF DID OR THAT HE WAS LOOKING AT, AND WHETHER THERE ARE TIES TO ANY OTHER KNOWN ENTITIES.

>> Braude: YOU KNOW, IN YOUR ORIGINAL STATEMENT, YOU MENTIONED THE SHOOTER HAD A DOCTORATE HE WAS MARRIED HE WAS EMPLOYED.

WHY DO WE CARE ABOUT THAT?

WHY DOES IT MATTER?

DO YOU WORRY THAT HE IS MORE THAN AKILLER?

>> I THINK WE ALL HAVE IMPLICIT BIAS.

I HAVE IT.

RIGHT?

AS A WOMAN, AS A PERSON OF COLOR.

WE ALL BELIEVE WE KNOW WHAT DOMESTIC VIOLENCE LOOKS LIKE, WE ALL BELIEVE WE KNOW WHAT YOU KNOW DOMESTIC TERRORISM MIGHT LOOK LIKE OR WHAT A TERRORIST LOOKS LIKE.

WHETHER THIS IS WINTHROP OR OTHER CIRCUMSTANCES WE'RE TALKING ABOUT WE HAVE TO RECOGNIZE THAT THIS INDIVIDUAL FOR ALL INTENTS AND PURPOSES, HOWEVER WE DEFINE THIS, APPEARED NORM, RIGHT?

HE WAS -- NORMAL, RIGHT?

HE WAS MARRIED.

I THINK THERE WAS A WRITEUP ABOUT HIS ENGAGEMENT IN THE GLOBE WITHIN THE LAST -- >> Braude: THERE WAS A BIG COLUMN ABOUT THIS FANTASTIC STORY ABOUT THE WEDDING HAPPENING IN FRONT OF HIS WIFE'S GRANDPARENT.

IT WAS -- >> ABSOLUTELY.

>> Braude: SHOCKING.

>> THAT CAN BE TRUE AS WELL AS THIS BUBBLING RIGHT UNDERNEATH THE SURFACE.

SO I THINK WHAT WE HAVE TO DO, JIM IS START HAVING SOME TOUGH CONVERSATIONS ABOUT, THERE ARE PEOPLE THAT ARE EDUCATED, THAT APPEAR OUTWARD-FACINGLY TO BE INNOCUOUS OR YOU KNOW, NORMALIZED AND THEY HAVE TROUBLING BELIEFS THAT THEY FIRMLY BELIEVE AND WE HAVE TO START HAVING THOSE TOUGH CONVERSATIONS ABOUT, YOU KNOW, RACE AND, YOU KNOW, INCLUSION OF ALL TYPES, RIGHT?

OF PEOPLE FEELING AS IF THEY'RE BEING LEFT BEHIND, OR MADE INVISIBLE.

AND THAT DOESN'T MEAN THAT WE ARE GOING TO CONDONE VIOLENCE, AND THIS TYPE OF RHETORIC.

BUT I DO THINK WE START -- WE NEED TO START HAVING THESE TOUGH CONVERSATIONS, OR SADLY, WE'RE GOING TO SEE MORE OF THIS TYPE OF OUTBURST.

JIM THIS PERSON HAD NO CRIMINAL RECORD AND WENT FROM ZERO ENTRIES ON THEIR CRIMINAL RECORD TO A DOUBLE HOMICIDE.

AND MANY OTHER POTENTIAL CRIMES AS WELL.

>> Braude: SO YOU DON'T HAVE -- JUST ONE FINAL THING JUST TO BE CLEAR.

YOU DON'T YET HAVE INFORMATION THAT GIVES YOU INSIGHT AS TO THE GENESIS OF THIS RACISM AND ANTISEMITISM?

>> WE DO NOT.

>> Braude: I UNDERSTAND YOU HAVE EXAMPLES OF IT.

>> WE DO NOT.

>> Braude: YOU DO NOT.

PLEASE SWISH -- >> WE ARE STILL ONLY THREE DAYS FROM THE INCIDENT ITSELF AND THE STATE POLICE HAVE BEEN THERE ROUND THE CLOCK WITH THE WINTHROP POLICE.

>> Braude: I UNDERSTAND.

UNDERSTOOD.

>> AND NORTHEAST MASS LAW ENFORCEMENT COUNCIL HAVE BEEN WORKING AROUND THE CLOCK TO TRY TO GET ANSWERS BUT WE DON'T HAVE ONE YET THERE.

>> Braude: I WANT TO CHANGE GEARS FOR ACOUPLE OF MINUTES.

YOU KNOW ON FRIDAY DEREK CHAUVIN WAS SENTENCED BY THE JUDGE OUT THERE IN MINNESOTA.

HERE IS WHAT CHAUVIN HAD TO SAY AND THE JUDGE HIMSELF.

>> AT THIS TIME DUE TO SOME ADDITIONAL LEGAL MATTERS AT HAND, I'M NOT ABLE TO GIVE A FULL FORMAL STATEMENT AT THIS TIME.

BUT FOR BRIEFLY THOUGH, I DO WANT TO GIVE MY CONDOLENCES TO THE FLOYD FAMILY.

THERE'S GOING TO BE SOME OTHER INFORMATION IN THE FUTURE THAT WOULD BE OF INTEREST.

>> THE COURT COMMITS YOU TO THE CUSTODY OF THE COMMISSIONER OF CORRECTIONS FOR A PERIOD OF 270 MONTHS.

THAT'S 2-7-0.

THAT IS THAT 10 YEAR ADDITION TO THE PRESUMPTIVE SENTENCE OF 150 MONTHS.

>> Braude: YOU KNOW I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THE HELL CHAUVIN WAS TALKING ABOUT WITH THAT FUTURE INFORMATION BUT PART OF SENTENCING DECISIONS FOR JUDGES IS ABOUT DETERRENCE.

DO YOU BELIEVE THAT A SENTENCE THAT'S ABOVE THE GUIDELINES, 22 AND A HALF YEARS, I KNOW THE FLOYD FAMILY HOPED FOR MORE, WILL THAT HAVE A DEFERRING EFFECT, DETERRENT EFFECT OR IS THAT AN OUTLIER KIND OF CASE?

>> I HOPE IT CERTAINLY DOES.

I HOPE IT WILL, THE COUNTRY AND THE WORLD WATCHED THIS.

I THINK THE JUDGE DID A VERY GOOD JOB EXPLAINING ALL THE ANALYSIS THAT WEPT INTO THIS.

AND, YOU KNOW, WE WERE WATCHING.

AND ALTHOUGH, YES, THE FLOYD FAMILY MIGHT HAVE WANTEDFULED -- WANTED MUCH MORE AND CERTAINLY THEY BELIEVE AS OTHERS DO THAT GEORGE'S LIFE WAS WORTH MORE THAN 22 AND A HALF YEARS BUT THIS IS AN EXTRAORDINARY SENTENCE CONSIDERING IT'S A MEMBER OF LAW ENFORCEMENT THAT DID NOT HAVE A CRIMINAL HISTORY PRIOR TO THAT.

HE MIGHT HAVE HAD A LOT OF ENTRIES ON HIS INTERNAL AFFAIRS AND OTHER THINGS LIKE THAT BUT THIS IS AN EXTRAORDINARY SENTENCE.

I HOPE IT IS A DETERRENT AND I THINK IT'S THE BEGINNING OF A SEA CHANGE WE'RE GOING TO SEE WITH RESPECT TO LAW ENFORCEMENT.

AND THERE ARE SO MANY MEMBERS, JIM, THAT ARE ACTUALLY SUPPORTIVE OF THIS SENTENCE, RIGHT?

BECAUSE HE DOES NOT REPRESENT THE OVERWHELMING NUMBER OF MEN AND WOMEN THAT DO THIS JOB, LIKE THE SERGEANT IN WINTHROP THAT SPRINTED TO THE HARM, RIGHT?

TO STOP A THREAT TO HIS COMMUNITY, AND OTHER PEOPLE, AND I DO WANT TO SAY, THESE TWO BLACK INDIVIDUALS, THEY WERE BROTHERS AND SISTERS, THEY WERE DAUGHTERS AND SONS OF WINTHROP.

THEY WERE LOVED BY THE PEOPLE OF WINTHROP EVEN THOUGH IT IS AN OVERWHELMINGLY WHITE TOWN.

TROOPER GREEN AND RAMONA COOPER, STAFF SERGEANT COOPER THEY WERE LOVED.

SO I THINK SENTENCE WITH CHAUVIN IS JUST.

I THINK IT'S EXTRAORDINARY AND I HOPE IT'S THE BEGINNING OF A LOT OF DETERRENCE FOR LAW ENFORCEMENT.

>> Braude: WANT TO FLAY ONE MORE CLIP FOR YOU.

THIS IS VERY QUICK CREAKS, THIS IS YOU ON WCVB ABOUT A WEEK AGO ON THE RECORD DISCUSSING MAYOR WHRAMP'S APPOINTMENT OF DENNIS WHITE.

HERE IS WHAT YOU HAVE TO SAY MANY >> THIS IS A BAD SITUATION OVERALL BECAUSE EITHER HE KNEW ABOUT IT AND HE'S LYING, OR HE DIDN'T KNOW ABOUT IT AND YOU'RE A TERRIBLE MANAGER, RIGHT?

ASIDE FROM THE MAYOR, IS THERE ANYTHING BIGGER THAN THE COMMISSIONER OF THE BOSTON POLICE DEPARTMENT?

AND THERE WAS NO VETTING PROCESS IN THIS?

OBVIOUSLY THE IT YOU REFERENCE WAS THE HISTORY OF DOMESTIC VIOLENCE.

SO YOU TRASH THE SECRETARY OF LABOR, WHO WAS PICKED BY THE MAN WHO YOU HOPE PICKS YOU TO BE THE U.S. ATTORNEY LEADING SOME TO CONCLUDE THAT YOU'RE NO LONGER ON THE SHORT LIST FOR THAT JOB AND FRANKLY WE ALL THOUGHT AT THE TOP OF THAT LIST.

IS THAT TRUE?

>> JIM, LOOK.

I AM THE CHIEF LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICER OF SUFFOLK COUNTY.

I AM INEXTRICABLY TIED TO THE COMMISSIONER OF THE BOSTON POLICE DEPARTMENT.

WHEN THE POLICE ARREST, THEY BRING THEM TO US.

AND WHEN I NEED SOMEBODY ARRESTED, I ASK THE POLICE TO DO SO.

SO WHAT I CAN TELL YOU IS, THE MONEY AND TIME THAT HAS BEEN WASTED ON THE COMMISSIONER WHITE SITUATION COULD HAVE BEEN BETTER SPENT AND USED AT MASS AV OR FOR THE SOLVING OF OUR OVER 1,000 UNSOLVED HOMICIDES.

I AM A -- >> Braude: ARE YOU ON THE SHORT LIST FOR U.S. ATTORNEY?

>> WHAT CAN I TELL YOU IS I'M VERY HAPPY WITH THE JOB I'M DOING RIGHT NOW AND I AM CONVINCED THAT BEING MAYOR IS A HARD JOB.

I HAVE RESPECT FOR MAYOR WHRAMP.

WALSH.

I'M JUST NOT HAPPY WITH THE FACT THAT WE ARE DEALING WITH A BUNCH OF PROBLEMS IN THE BOSTON POLICE DEPARTMENT.

>> Braude: ARE YOU STILL ON THE SHORT LIST FOR U.S. ATTORNEY?

>> WHAT I CAN TELL YOU MY UNDERSTANDING IS THERE ARE THREE PEOPLE ON THAT LIST AND I BELIEVE MY NAME IS STILL ONE OF THOSE THREE BUT I'M VERY HAPPY WITH THE JOB I'M DOING RIGHT NOW AND I'M FOCUSED EXCLUSIVELY ON THE THREE PEOPLE THAT WERE MURDERED OR THE THREE HOMICIDES THAT JUST HAPPENED IN WINTHROP AND I BELIEVE THAT THE SECRETARY OF LABOR IS HOPEFULLY FOCUSED ON ALL OF THE WORK THAT HE'S DOING FOR OUR UNITED STATES.

>> Braude: RACHAEL ROLLINS IT'S GOOD TO SEE YOU.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME.

APPRECIATE IT.

>> YOU BET.

>> Braude: NEXT UP, WHILE GOVERNOR CHARLIE BAKER CONTEMPLATES WHETHER OR NOT TO RUN FOR RE-ELECTION AND THE RIGHT WING OF HIS PARTY WEIGHS A PRIMARY CHALLENGE; DEMOCRATS IN MASSACHUSETTS ARE HITTING THE GROUND RUNNING WITH THREE CANDIDATES ALREADY OFFICIALLY IN THE RACE.

THERE'S STATE SENATOR-TURNED SOLAR ENERGY EXECUTIVE BEN DOWNING, HARVARD PROFESSOR AND AUTHOR DANIELLE ALLEN, AND THE LATEST TO JUMP IN: STATE SENATOR SONIA CHANG-DIÍAZ, WHO DECLARED HER CANDIDACY LAST WEEK.

SHE JOINS ME NOW.

SENATOR, CONGRATULATIONS FOR YOUR CANDIDACY.

>> THANK YOU JIM.

PLEASURE.

>> Braude: WHY ARE YOU RUNNING?

>> IT WON'T COME AS A SURPRISE, I'M TIRED FOR WAITING FOR GOVERNMENT TO TACKLE THE SYSTEMIC CHANGES THAT WORKING FAMILIES NEED AS THE SCALE AND THE URGENCY THAT WE NEED IN ORDER TO REALLY MATCH WHAT WORKING FAMILIES ARE EXPERIENCING OUT THERE IN THE REAL WORLD, DAY IN AND DAY OUT.

AND I AM BOTH FED UP WITH WAITING AND I ALSO HAVE A DEEP AND ABIDING CONFIDENCE THAT IT IS POSSIBLE FOR US TO DO BETTER AS A STATE.

AND I HAVE THAT CONFIDENCE BECAUSE I HAVE LIVED THROUGH MANY CHANGES OVER THE PAST 12 YEARS THAT PEOPLE SAID WERE IMPOSSIBLE.

WHEN WE FIRST STARTED THEM.

BUT THAT WE HAVE BEEN ABLE TO MAKE HAPPEN ON BEACON HILL SO I KNOW WE CAN DO BETTER AS A STATE.

>> Braude: THE PUBLIC LOVES GOVERNOR BAKER.

YOU DON'T.

WHAT ARE THEY MISSING?

>> WELL, LOOK.

I THINK THAT THERE ARE MANY THINGS THAT GOVERNOR BAKER DESERVES CREDIT FOR.

FOR EXAMPLE, THE WAY THAT HE HAS SHOWN AN INDEPENDENT MIND RELATIVE TO THE NATIONAL REPUBLICAN PARTY.

AND I SUSPECT LIKE ME MANY VOTERS GIVEN HIM CREDIT FOR THAT.

-- GIVE HIM CREDIT FOR THAT BUT THAT IS DIFFERENT THAN TACKLING THE STRUCTURAL PROBLEMS WE HAVE HERE IN MASSACHUSETTS WITH ENERGY AND URGENCY, AND I THINK PEOPLE ARE FED UP WITH SITTING IN TRAFFIC FOR HOURS ON END WHEN THEY COULD BE AT HOME WITH THEIR KIDS HELPING THEM WITH THEIR HOMEWORK.

PEOPLE ARE FED UP WORKING THEIR REAR ENDS OFF FOR YEARS AND YEARS AND YEARS AND NEVER SEEING A RAISE RELATIVE TO INFLATION.

THEY ARE WORKING FOR THEIR KIDS AND ARE CARRYING DECADES OF DEBT ON THEIR BACKS.

I THINK THERE ARE THINGS THAT PEOPLE CAN HOLD IN THEIR MINDS AT THE SAME TIME, AND THEY HAVE A HUNGER FUNDAMENTALLY FOR US TO DO SOMETHING DIFFERENT AND BETTER COMING OUT OF THIS PANDEMIC.

>> Braude: IN YOUR VIDEO ANNOUNCING YOUR CANDIDACY, YOU SAID BEACON HILL INSIDE ERST DRAG THEIR FEET EVERY STEP EP OF THE WAY THEY THINK SMALL.

I THINK YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT YOUR DEMOCRATIC AND AS WELL AS THE GOVERNOR RIGHT?

>> I THINK THERE IS PARTNERSHIP THAT GOES AROUND.

BUT I'M RUNNING FOR GOVERNOR BECAUSE I KNOW THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE THAT IS A BIG PART OF THE PUZZLE WHEN IT COMES TO DELIVERING THE STRUCTURAL CHANGE THAT FAMILIES NEED.

I CAN DELIVER THAT AS IN THE 12 YEARS I'VE BEEN AS STATE SENATOR, BUT WE NEED TO GET REAL ABOUT OUR TROUBLES.

>> Braude: BUT THERE ARE A LOT OF THINGS THAT MATTER TO YOU THAT CAN'T BE REALIZED IF THE DEMOCRATS WHO ESSENTIALLY RUN THE LEGISLATURE WITH VIRTUALLY NO OPPOSITION, VERY FEW REPUBLICANS, DON'T PUT IT THERE.

FOR EXAMPLE, YOU WERE DEEPLY COMMITTED TO POLICE REFORM, A LOT OF THE ADVOCATES AND I THINK INCLUDING YOU, WERE DISAPPOINTED THAT THE LANGUAGE ON QUALIFIED IMMUNITY WHICH PROTECTS POLICE OFFICERS AND OTHER PUBLIC EMPLOYEES, FROM PERSONAL LIABILITY, WHEN THERE'S BEEN WRONGDOING, WAS SO WEAK, IT WAS SO WEAK BECAUSE YOUR FELLOW DEMOCRATS IN THE HOUSE MADE IT WEAK, NOT CHARLIE BAKER.

SO WHAT DO YOU SAY ABOUT THEM?

>> I THINK IT'S UNFAIR TO GIVE GOVERNOR BAKER A PASS BECAUSE HE'S A REPUBLICAN.

MANY PEOPLE SAY WE TAKE THE EXPECTATION ET CETERA FOR HIM TO BE A PUBLIC SERVANT FIRST AND FOREMOST OFF THE TABLE.

BUT THAT'S THOUGHT WHAT PEOPLE ARE LOOKING FOR FROM THEIR GOVERNMENT RIGHT?

IT'S NOT DEMOCRAT, REPUBLICAN AND WE HAVE DIFFERENT STANDARDS FOR YOU DEPENDING ON WHICH LABEL YOU CARRY.

THE QUESTION IS ARE WE SOLVING THE PROBLEMS WE NEED TO SOLVE IN BAKER.

SOME MY FELLOW DEMOCRATS, AND THE BAKER-PALIDO ADMINISTRATION DID NOT HAVE ADEQUATE COMMUNITY REPRESENTATION ON THE GOVERNING BODY, THE GOVERNOR DIDN'T SUPPORT MANY OF THE COMPROMISES THAT CAME OUT OF THE CONFERENCE COMMITTEE, THE HARD-WON COMPROMISE AND PACKAGE THAT WE NEGOTIATED FOR MONTHS AND FINALLY PUT ON THE GOVERNOR'S DESK THERE WERE CHANGES THAT HE STILL OPPOSED AND PUSHED FOR THE BILL TO BE WATERED DOWN EVEN FURTHER.

THAT IS A RESPONSIBILITY THAT THE GOVERNOR HAS TO OWN.

>> Braude: YOU ALSO SAID IN YOUR ANNOUNCEMENT VIDEO THAT YOU WERE GOING TO TACKLE THE RACIAL WEALTH DIVIDE THAT IS JUST APPALLING AND MY GUESS IS THAT TAKING BOSTON AS AN EXAMPLE AND LOOKING BACK AT THAT FEDERAL RESERVE STUDY FROM 2015, I'M GUESSING EVERY SINGLE PERSON IN THIS AUDIENCE HAS MEMORIZED $247,000 FOR A WHITE FAMILY, ONLY $8,000 FOR AFRICAN AMERICANS, CARIBBEAN BRAKS, BLACKS, 1/20th AS MUCH.

YOU SEE ADMIN CON ZERO.

THERE IS A LOT OF RHETORIC TALKED ABOUT THIS.

CONCRETELY WHAT DOGS GOVERNOR CHANG-DIAZ DO TO ELIMINATE OR REDUCE THOSE GAPS?

>> JIM, I'M SO GLAD YOU PUT THOSE NUMBERS UP ON THE SCREEN.

IT'S IMPORTANT THAT WE LOOK THEM IN THE FACE AND RECOGNIZE THIS IS A GREAT EXAMPLE OF WHERE WE NEED TO ACT WITH GREATER URGENCY.

EDUCATION I WOULD SAY SQUARE 1 FOR HOW WE SOLVE THAT PROBLEM.

IT IS NOT THE A SILVER BULLET BUT IT IS ONE OF THE SINGLE MOST IMPORTANT LEVER THAT WE HAVE, AGAIN, WE HAD TO DRIVE GOVERNOR BAKER FOR FOUR OR FIVE YEARS, EVEN AFTER HE SIGNED INTO IT LAW JUST A FEW SHORT MONTHS LATER IN THE FIRST BUDGET PROPOSAL THAT HE PUT OUT FOR IMPLEMENTING THE LAW HE SHORTED THE MONEY THAT WAS DUE TO LOW INCOME COMMUNITIES IN THAT BILL.

IF WE WANT TO SOLVE RACIAL DISPARITIES AND THE WEALTH DIVIDE IN OUR STATE WE HAVE GOT TO GET IT RIGHT IN OUR EDUCATION SYSTEM.

>> Braude: HOW MANY YEARS WERE YOU WORKING ON THAT BILL?

YOU WERE CHAIR OF THE EDUCATION COMMITTEE FOR YEARS, HOW MANY YEARS DID YOU WORK ON THAT?

>> FIVE OR SIX YEARS DEPENDING ON WHEN YOU START THE COUNT.

THAT IS A FULL ELEMENTARY SCHOOL CAREER.

HUNDREDS AND HUNDREDS OF KIDS THAT WAS THEIR WHOLE ELEMENTARY CAREER.

>> Braude: I COULDN'T AGREE WITH YOU MORE.

BUT WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT WHAT THE GOVERNOR IS NOT WILLING TO DO AT THE END OF THE PROCESS I.T.

TOOK FIVE OR SIX YEARS FOR YOUR FOAM DEMOCRATS TO DECIDE THINGS YOU THOUGHT WERE IMPORTANT FOR A GENERATION OF KIDS WERE IMPORTANT ENOUGH FOR THEM TO APPROVE AND SEND TO HIS DESK.

I GUESS I'M HARKENING BACK TO THE NOTION THAT THE PROBLEM DOESN'T REST I THINK IN YOUR MIND IN THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE BUT AMONGST YOUR COLLEAGUES AS WELL.

WE ONLY HAVE A MINUTE LEFT, SENATOR.

AS I MENTIONED THERE IS ANOTHER COLLEAGUE, FORMER COLLEAGUE, DANIELLE ALLEN, PRETTY IMPRESSIVE RESUME IN ACADEMIA AND OTHER THINGS, WHY YOU ARE A BETTER CHOICE FOR DEMOCRATS?

>> THE RECORD I'VE BEEN ABLE TO ACCOMPLISH ON BEACON HILL BUT I CAN'T LEGALITY GO OF WHAT YOU WERE JUST SAYING.

>> Braude: FEEL FREE.

>> THE JOB OF THE GOVERNOR IS NOT TO JUST SIT BACK AND WAIT UNTIL A BILL FLOATS ACROSS HIS OR HER DESK.

THIS IS A FUNDAMENTAL RESPONSIBILITY THAT ONE OF THE THREE BRANCHES OF GOVERNMENT HAS TO TACKLE WITH UTTERS THE PROBLEMS THAT WORKING FAMILIES ARE FACING AND THIS IS EXACTLY THE PROBLEM THAT I'M TALKING ABOUT JIM.

WE NEED A GOVERNOR WHO IS GOING TO GET OUT THERE AND BE FRO ACTIVE AND NOT JUST BE NIBBLING AROUND THE EDGES AND NOT SEE WHAT THE TIDE FLOATS IN TO HIS DESK.

>> Braude: I'M GLAD YOU CHOSE THE ANSWER TO THE OTHER QUESTION, THAT'S MORE IMPORTANT, A YEAR PLUS OUT THAN THE ONE I ASKED.

SONIA CHANG-DIAZ, THANKS FOR JOINING US, I HOPE TO SEE YOU A LOT.

>> THANKS JIM.

>> Braude: OVER THE PAST YEAR, COVID HAS TRANSFORMED THE WAY WE LIVE, CREATING BRAND-NEW HABITS AND DISRUPTING ROUTINES WE USED TO TAKE FOR GRANTED.

NOW, AS WE SLOWLY EMERGE FROM THE PANDEMIC, THERE COULD BE LASTING IMPLICATIONS FOR THE BUILDINGS WHERE WE SPEND BIG CHUNKS OF OUR LIVES.

ADAM REILLY HAS MORE.

>> Reporter: IF YOU WORK, OR USED TO, IN A RELATIVELY NEW BUILDING, LIKE GBH HEADQUARTERS, THE WINDOWS AROUND YOUR DESK PROBABLY DON'T OPEN.

FOR A COUPLE GOOD REASONS, SAYS ARCHITECT RUSSEL FELDMAN.

>> WE'VE BECOME INCREASINGLY CONCERNED WITH ENERGY EFFICIENCY AND THE IMPACT OF COURSE ON OUR OPERATING COSTS.

>> Reporter: BUT RIGHT NOW, SO-CALLED "INOPERABLE WINDOWS" ARE A PUBLIC-HEALTH LIABILITY, SINCE LESS AIR FLOW MEANS MORE RISK FROM THE VIRUS.

AS WE EMERGE FROM THE PANDEMIC, FELDMAN THINKS THAT INSIGHT WILL ABIDE.

>> WE'RE GOING TO SEE A LOT OF CONVERSIONS OF CURRENT SEALED BUILDINGS INTO BUILDINGS THAT WOULD HAVE WINDOWS THAT OPEN.

ALONG WITH NEW BUILDINGS WHERE THEY OPEN AS A MATTER OF COURSE.

>> Reporter: AND THAT'S NOT THE ONLY WAY THE WORKPLACE MAY GET AIRIER.

>> Reporter: A NUMBER OF OFFICE BUILDINGS HAVE BEEN LOOKING TO PROVIDE OUTDOOR SPACE FOR THEIR TENANTS.

SPECIFICALLY, SAYS THE BOSTON PLANNING AND DEVELOPMENT AGENCY'S MICHAEL CANNIZZO, ROOF DECKS, WHICH USED TO BE A MOSTLY RESIDENTIAL AMENITY.

THERE ARE TWO RELATED IMPULSES HERE: A PUSH TO MAKE OFFICES HEALTHIER AND, MUCH MORE INVITING, AS SOME WONDER IF THEY'RE STILL NECESSARY AT ALL.

>> WHEN THE BUSINESS COMMUNITY SAYS IT'S TIME TO COME BACK TO THE WORKPLACE, THE QUESTION IS--WHY?

>> Reporter: ARCHITECT MIKE DAVIS AND HIS COLLEAGUES ARE TRYING TO ANSWER THAT QUESTION THEMSELVES, CREATING DECENTRALIZED WORK AREAS, AND CURATED COMMON SPACES WHERE EMPLOYEES DO THE DECORATING.

IN OTHER WORDS, THEY'RE MAKING THEIR OFFICE MORE LIKE HOME.

OF COURSE, OFFICES WERE JUST ONE PART OF BOSTON'S PRE-PANDEMIC BUILDING BOOM.

RESIDENTIAL BUILDINGS WERE A DRIVER, TOO AND THEY'RE ALSO GETTING A RETHINK.

>> SPENDING A LOT MORE TIME IN OUR HOMES, YOU START TO NOTICE SOME THINGS YOU DIDN'T BEFORE, AND CRAVE CERTAIN THINGS.

>> Reporter: LIKE FRESH AIR AND OPEN SPACE.

AT 2147 WASHINGTON STREET, IN BOSTON'S NUBIAN SQUARE.

THEY'LL BE FURNISHED BY AN INTERIOR COURTYARD THAT WILL ALSO BE OPEN TO THE PUBLIC.

>> ANYONE FROM THE NEIGHBORHOOD CAN COME TO THAT COURTYARD, AND ENJOY IT AND HAVE, WITH DISTANCE BETWEEN THEMSELVES AND OTHERS--FRESH AIR AND DAYLIGHT.

>> Reporter: BUT INSIDE RESIDENTIAL BUILDINGS, THE RECENT VOGUE FOR BIG, SHARED SPACES MAY BE OVER.

EVEN BEFORE COVID, DESIGNER LINDSAY BACH SAYS.

>> AT THE LARGE COMMUNAL TABLE, ONCE ONE PERSON WAS THERE, NOBODY WANTED TO SIT THERE.

>> Reporter: SHE PREDICTS A SURGE IN NEW PRIVATE SPACES INSIDE THOSE COMMON AREAS, ASSEMBLED AND REASSEMBLED THROUGHOUT THE DAY.

>> COWORKING BY DAY, AND THEN OPEN IT UP AND IT'S DINING BY NIGHT.

>> Reporter: THE LIST OF POSSIBLE CHANGES GOES ON.

AT A BUILDING NEAR THE T MIGHT NOT BE AS MUCH OF A NO-BRAINER AS IT WAS AT RESTAURANTS, WALK-UP WINDOWS AND OUTDOOR DINING COULD BE HERE TO STAY.

AND IF ENOUGH PEOPLE KEEP WORKING, EMPTY OFFICES MIGHT BE CONVERTED INTO HOUSING.

ONE THING SEEMS CERTAIN: BUILDINGS DESIGNED AFTER COVID WON'T BE THE SAME AS BUILDINGS DESIGNED BEFORE.

ADAM REILLY, GBH NEWS.

>> THAT'S IT FOR TONIGHT.

PLEASE STAY SAFE.

Captioned by Media Access Group at WGBH access.wgbh.org GB TEST