>> GOOD EVENING.

FROM OUR STATEHOUSE STUDIO IN MONTGOMERY, I'M DON DAILEY.

THANKS FOR JOINING US!

WE BEGIN TONIGHT WITH THE EFFORT TO BUILD NEW STATE PRISONS.

GOVERNOR KAY IVEY SAID THIS WEEK THAT THE PRIVATE LEASE DEAL SHE HAD SPEARHEADED WAS OFF THE TABLE, AFTER A DEADLINE PASSED FOR HAVING A FINANCING PLAN IN PLACE.

THREE UNDERWRITERS PULLED OUT OF THE DEAL IN THE LAST COUPLE OF MONTHS.

IVEY ANNOUNCED THIS WEEK THAT SHE'LL BE MEETING WITH LEGISLATIVE LEADERS NEXT WEEK TO TALK ABOUT A POSSIBLE STATE BOND ISSUE TO BUILD THREE NEW MEN'S PRISONS.

>> PRISONS HAVE BEEN IRREPARABLE FOR DECADES.

THEY ARE LONG PAST SERVING THEIR TIME.

SO WE HAVE TO BUILD NEW PRISONS AND START REHABILITATING OUR PRISONS.

THAT'S A MAJOR EFFORT WITH THE LEGISLATURE.

WE'LL MAKE THE PROJECT HAPPEN.

>> THE STATE IS, OF COURSE, ALSO THE SUBJECT OF A FEDERAL LAWSUIT WHICH CALLS OUR PRISON CONDITIONS ‘UNCONSTITUTIONAL.'

IVEY AND OTHERS SEE NEW PRISONS AS KEY TO ADDRESSING OUR PROBLEMS.

LAWMAKERS HAVE TACKLED NEW PRISON CONSTRUCTION BEFORE BUT HAVE NEVER GIVEN FINAL APPROVAL TO A PLAN.

REPRESENTATIVE STEVE CLOUSE OF OZARK, THE CHAIRMAN OF THE HOUSE GENERAL FUND BUDGET COMMITTEE, WILL BE AMONG THE LEGISLATIVE LEADERS MEETING WITH THE GOVERNOR NEXT WEEK.

HE TELLS "CAPITOL JOURNAL" THAT HE BELIEVES HIS COLLEAGUES WILL NOW LARGELY SUPPORT A BOND ISSUE.

>> I THINK ALL IN ALL, I THINK THE VAST MAJORITY OF THE LEGISLATURE REALIZES WE HAVE TO HAVE NEW PRISONS.

THE ONES WE HAVE ARE DILAPIDATED AND FALLING IN ALL AROUND.

WE HAVE, OBVIOUSLY, ISSUES WITH THE FEDERAL COURTS.

THEY WON'T SOLVE ALL OF OUR PROBLEMS, BUT IT WILL GO A LONG WAY.

>> REPRESENTATIVE CLOUSE WILL JOIN US ON THE BROADCAST SHORTLY TO TALK MORE ABOUT IT.

>> IN THE MIDST OF DEALING WITH THE STATE'S PRISON PROBLEMS, GOVERNOR IVEY THIS WEEK ALSO LAUNCHED HER RE-ELECTION CAMPAIGN.

SHE ANNOUNCED THAT SHE WILL BE SEEKING ANOTHER FOUR YEARS AS THE STATE'S LEADER IN 2022.

IN A VIDEO RELEASED BY HER CAMPAIGN, IVEY SAID THERE'S STILL A LOT THAT SHE WANTS TO DO FOR ALABAMA.

>> I'M PROUD TO BE YOUR GOVERNOR.

I'D BE HONORED TO SERVE YOU FOR A SECOND TERM.

WE'VE GOT A LOT MORE TO DO HERE IN ALABAMA BUT THERE'S NO STEP TOO HIGH FOR A HIGH STEPPER.

ALABAMA IS WORKING AGAIN AND THE BEST IS YET TO COME.

>> IVEY WAS LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR IN 2017 WHEN FORMER GOVERNOR ROBERT BENTLEY RESIGNED AS PART OF A PLEA AGREEMENT RELATED TO ETHICS VIOLATIONS.

SHE ASSUMED THE OFFICE AND WAS ELECTED TO A FULL TERM IN 2018.

IN ANNOUNCING SHE WOULD LIKE FOUR MORE YEARS AT THE CAPITAL SHE WAS ASKED ABOUT THE UNFINISHED BUSINESS SHE'D LIKE TO ADDRESS.

>> WE HAVE SEVERAL ITEMS THAT NEED ATTENTION, ONE IS MEANINGFUL EDUCATION REFORM.

CERTAINLY WE'LL FINISH THE PRISON PROJECT.

I'LL BE WORKING WITH THE LEGISLATORS ON THAT PROJECT AND KEEPING OUR PEOPLE GAINFULLY EMPLOYED AND ADDING MORE JOBS TO THE TOTAL WE HAVE ALREADY, 44,000.

>> ONLY ONE OTHER REPUBLICAN HAS SO FAR, ANNOUNCED A RUN FOR GOVERNOR NEXT YEAR, OPELIKA MINISTER DEAN ODLE.

NO DEMOCRAT HAS YET ENTERED THE RACE.

>> LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR WILL AINSWORTH WAS OFFICIALLY KICKING OFF HIS RE-ELECTION CAMPAIGN TONIGHT AT AN EVENT IN HIS HOMETOWN OF GUNTERSVILLE.

GOVERNOR KAY IVEY WAS EXPECTED TO BE A SPECIAL GUEST.

AINSWORTH IS, OF COURSE, A FORMER STATE REPRESENTATIVE WHO WAS ELECTED LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR IN 2018 AND IS NOW SEEKING A SECOND TERM.

MEANTIME, ATTORNEY GENERAL STEVE MARSHALL ANNOUNCED THIS WEEK THAT HE WILL RUN FOR RE-ELECTION NEXT YEAR.

ON THURSDAY, MARSHALL SAID HE WANTS TO USE HIS OFFICE TO HELP TURN BACK WHAT HE CALLED A SURGE IN VIOLENT CRIME ACROSS THE COUNTRY LAST YEAR.

>> INNOCENT CHILDREN SPRAYED WITH BULLETS, MOBS MENACING INNOCENT VICTIMS AND SKYROCKETING MURDER RATES ACROSS OUR COUNTRY AND OUR MAJOR CITIES.

I PROMISE YOU THIS, THE WAVE OF THE PAST WILL NOT BE THE WAVE OF THE FUTURE.

THERE WILL BE -- THERE WILL BE LAW AND ORDER IN THE STATE OF ALABAMA.

AS LONG AS I'M THE STATE'S CHIEF LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICER, I'LL FIGHT FOR IT AND I'LL SEE THAT MISSION THROUGH.

>> MARSHALL WAS ELECTED TO HIS FIRST FULL TERM AS ATTORNEY GENERAL IN 2018, AFTER BEING APPOINTED TO THE JOB A YEAR EARLIER BY FORMER GOVERNOR ROBERT BENTLEY.

>> ALABAMA LAWMAKERS WHO SUPPORT BOTH A PROPOSED STATE LOTTERY AND A MORE COMPREHENSIVE GAMBLING PLAN SAY THEY REMAIN COMMITTED TO HAVING THE ISSUE ON NEXT YEAR'S ELECTION BALLOT.

A GAMBLING PLAN DIDN'T MAKE IT OUT OF THE LEGISLATURE THIS YEAR, BUT THE ISSUE'S EXPECTED TO BE BACK NEXT YEAR.

IN OUR IN-DEPTH REPORT TONIGHT, "CAPITOL JOURNAL'S" KAREN GOLDSMITH TAKES A CLOSER LOOK.

>> THE SPEAKER OF THE ALABAMA HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES SAID HIS MEMBERS DIDN'T HAVE ENOUGH TIME TO TACKLE GAMING LEGISLATION.

>> SENATE TOOK THE LEAD ON THE GAMING ISSUE.

IT BECAME MORE THAN A LOTTERY.

IT WAS A COMPREHENSIVE GAMING PACKAGE.

THEN ALL OF A SUDDEN, IT WENT BACK TO A LOTTERY AND THEN ALL OF A SUDDEN BACK TO A COMPREHENSIVE PACKAGE.

THROUGH ALL OF THEIR WORK -- NOT TO DISCREDIT THEIR WORK -- BUT THROUGH ALL OF THEIR WORK -- KEEP IN MIND THEY DIDN'T HAVE BUT FIVE LEGISLATIVE DAYS TO WORK WITH.

WE WENT TO WORK IMMEDIATELY.

THEY WORKED VERY HARD, A LOT OF HOURS AND WEEKENDS.

>> BUT A SENATOR WHO'S BEEN THE LEAD AUTHOR OF SEVERAL GAMING BILLS IS NOT ACCEPTING THAT PERSPECTIVE.

>> THAT'S A POOR EXCUSE.

I'M NOT GOING TO DEFEND ANYBODY.

THE BILL WAS THERE.

ATTEMPTS WERE MADE TO WORK WITH THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE AND THE HOUSE.

THERE WAS NOT THE DESIRE TO GET IT DONE.

>> THE SENATE MINORITY LEADER SAID WITH THE EXECUTIVE AND LEGISLATIVE BRANCH WORKING TOGETHER TO CREATE A COMPREHENSIVE BILL, ROAD BLOCKS CAN OCCUR BUT -- >> WE DID A LEGISLATIVE BILL.

IT WASN'T A LOBBYIST BILL BUT A BILL WE CRAFTED AS LEGISLATORS AND PUT SOMETHING TOGETHER BEST FOR THE STATE OF ALABAMA.

I FEEL OPTIMISTIC THAT GAMING WILL STILL PASS.

>> I THINK THERE WILL BE A MAD DASH NEXT YEAR TO DO SOMETHING.

I THINK THIS ISSUE IS OF IMPORTANCE ENOUGH TO THE PEOPLE THAT IF I WERE -- AND I HAVE MADE IT CLEAR, I'M NOT RUNNING FOR STATE SENATE AGAIN, OKAY, BUT IF I WERE RUNNING FOR OFFICE, THIS ISSUE -- I WOULD WANT TO KNOW I GOT THIS ISSUE TO THE PEOPLE TO MAKE A DECISION ON IF I'M ON THE BALLOT.

I WOULDN'T WANT TO BE THE GUY OR GAL THAT KEPT IT FROM GOING TO THE BALLOT FOR THE PEOPLE.

>> FOR "CAPITOL JOURNAL," I'M KAREN GOLDSMITH.

>> THIS WEEK'S RELEASE OF A TROVE OF DR. ANTHONY FAUCI'S EMAILS HAS RAISED SOME QUESTIONS ABOUT HIS LEADERSHIP DURING THE CORONAVIRUS PANDEMIC.

SO MUCH SO, THAT ALABAMA CONGRESSMAN JERRY CARL OF MOBILE TELLS "CAPITOL JOURNAL" THAT HE'S DRAFTING A MEASURE THAT WOULD CALL FOR FAUCI, WHO IS PRESIDENT JOE BIDEN'S CHIEF MEDICAL ADVISOR, TO STEP DOWN.

>> WE HAVE TO AT LEAST LET THE BUREAUCRATS KNOW, THAT RUN SO MUCH OF WASHINGTON, AMONG, THE WORLD IS FULL OF BUREAUCRATS.

WE HAVE TO LET THE BUREAUCRATS KNOW THEY ARE ANSWERABLE TO THE PEOPLE IN SOME WAY.

IT MAY NOT BE AN ELECTION BUT THEY ARE ANSWERABLE TO THE PEOPLE.

>> CONGRESSMAN CARL WILL JOIN US LATER IN THE BROADCAST TO TALK MORE ABOUT IT.

FOLLOWING THE RELEASE OF HIS EMAILS, DR. FAUCI HAS BEEN ACCUSED OF, AMONG OTHER THINGS, MISLEADING PEOPLE ON THE ORIGINS OF THE CORONAVIRUS.

FAUCI HAS CONTENDED THAT HIS EMAILS HAVE BEEN MISCONSTRUED AND PRESIDENT BIDEN HAS SAID DR. FAUCI CONTINUES TO HAVE HIS CONFIDENCE.

>> U.S.

SENATOR TOMMY TUBERVILLE OF AUBURN WAS IN MONTGOMERY THIS WEEK AND SAID THAT HE WAS SUPPORTIVE OF PRESIDENT BIDEN'S PLAN TO SHARE OUR COUNTRY'S EXCESS VIRUS VACCINE SUPPLY WITH POORER COUNTRIES.

TUBERVILLE SPOKE ON THURSDAY AT DANNELLY FIELD.

>> WE'RE GOING TO HAVE ENOUGH VACCINES FOR US IN THIS COUNTRY.

I THINK IT'S GOOD THAT PRESIDENT BIDEN IS LOOKING FORWARD AND SAYING IF WE HAVE ENOUGH, LET'S HELP OTHER PEOPLE IN OTHER COUNTRIES.

THERE ARE PEOPLE THAT CAN'T AFFORD IT.

>> SENATOR TUBERVILLE CONTENDS THAT IF THE CORONAVIRUS LINGERS IN CERTAIN LOCATIONS AROUND THE WORLD, IT COULD COME BACK HERE AND THAT WE NEED TO PREVENT THAT FROM HAPPENING.

PRESIDENT BIDEN HAS ANNOUNCED THAT THE U.S. WILL DONATE 75% OF ITS UNUSED COVID VACCINE TO THE COVAX GLOBAL VACCINE SHARING PROGRAM.

>> MOST EXPERTS AGREE THAT ALABAMA'S ECONOMY IS COMING BACK AFTER THE DIFFICULT EFFECT OF THE CORONAVIRUS PANDEMIC.

BUSINESSES ARE SEEING CUSTOMERS RETURN, BUT SOME ARE STRUGGLING TO LURE EMPLOYEES BACK.

"CAPITOL JOURNAL'S" RANDY SCOTT REPORTS FOR US TONIGHT.

>> YOU SEE THE SIGNS EVERYWHERE -- BUSINESSES ARE BACK AND THEY WANT CUSTOMERS TO COME BACK, BUT THEY ARE FACING NEW ISSUES AFTER THE CORONAVIRUS.

>> IN ALABAMA, 99.4% OF BUSINESSES ARE CONSIDERED SMALL BUSINESSES.

SO, WE ARE THE ECONOMY IN ALABAMA.

>> NATIONAL FEDERATION OF INDEPENDENT BUSINESS STATE DIRECTOR ROSELEBASHEMARY ALABASH SAID IN TERMS OF BRINGING THE ECONOMY BACK PEOPLE SHOULD THINK SMALL.

>> SOME OF THEM WERE CLOSED DURING THE PANDEMIC.

SO IT FORCED THEM TO LAYOFF EMPLOYEES.

>> THE CORONAVIRUS OUTBREAK PUT A PAUSE ON MANY PARTS OF SOCIETY FROM SCHOOLS TO HEALTHCARE TO BUSINESSES AND THE ECONOMY.

MANY AMERICANS WERE LOCKED OUT.

NOW IT IS CHANGING AND LIFE IS STARTING TO RETURN.

MANY FEEL THE KEY TO RESTARTING THE ECONOMY IS WITH BIG BUSINESS.

THERE ARE SOME SMALL BUSINESS OWNERS WHO SAY THEY PLAY A ROLE AS WELL.

>> THE RIPPLE EFFECT, WHEN YOU HAVE A BUSINESS YOU ARE NO LONGER ORDERING FROM A SUPPLIER, FROM A WHOLESALER.

IT AFFECTS EVERYBODY FROM THE PERSON THAT DELIVERS TO YOU, TO THE MANUFACTURER AND ALL IN BETWEEN.

>> NOW A NEW PROBLEM, FINDING PEOPLE TO FILL JOB OPENINGS.

SHE SAID THERE IS HOPE THIS WILL BE SOLVED SOON.

>> 88% OF THEM HAVE JOB OPENINGS.

SO YOU LOOK AT THAT AND LOOK AT OUR UNEMPLOYMENT RATE AND YOU CAN SEE THAT BUSINESSES CANNOT COME BACK TO BE FULLY OPEN WHEN THEY HAVE GOT THAT MANY JOB OPENINGS RIGHT NOW ON THE TABLE.

>> FOR "CAPITOL JOURNAL," I'M RANDY SCOTT.

>>> YOU CAN WATCH PAST EPISODES OF "CAPITOL JOURNAL" ONLINE ANYTIME AT ALABAMA PUBLIC TELEVISION'S WEBSITE AT APTV.ORG.

CLICK ON THE ONLINE VIDEO TAB ON THE MAIN PAGE.

YOU CAN CONNECT WITH "CAPITOL JOURNAL" AND LINK TO PAST EPISODES ON "CAPITOL JOURNAL" FACEBOOK PAGE.

>> NEXT UP ON THE BROADCAST, REPRESENTATIVE STEVE CLOUSE OF OZARK IS BACK IN THE STUDIO WITH US.

GOOD TO SEE YOU.

>> GOOD TO BE HERE.

>> WELCOME BACK TO "CAPITOL JOURNAL."

>> THANK YOU.

YOU SERVE AS THE CHAIR OF THE GENERAL FUND BUDGET COMMITTEE IN THE HOUSE AND YOU HAVE BEEN INVITED TO TAKE PART IN A MEETING WITH THE GOVERNOR ON WHAT IS NEXT FOR NEW PRISON CONSTRUCTION.

OF COURSE THE GOVERNOR SAID THIS WEEK THE PRIVATE LEASE DEAL SHE HAD NEGOTIATED, AT LEAST AS IT EXISTED WAS NO MORE BECAUSE THE FINANCING FELL APART AND NOW SHE IS TURNING TO LAWMAKERS TO POSSIBLY COME UP WITH PLAN B.

THERE WAS A BILL DRAFTED THIS YEAR THAT WOULD INVOLVE A STATE BOND ISSUE TO BUILD NEW PRISONS.

IT WAS NEVER FORMALLY INTRODUCED BUT IS THAT A GOOD STARTING OFF POINT YOU THINK?

>> I THINK SO.

I WAS SOMEWHAT PATTERNED OFF THE BILL IN 2016 AND 2017 AND CAME CLOSE TO PASSING.

I REALLY THOUGHT WE WOULD HAVE A CHANCE TO PASS THAT BOND ISSUE IN 2017.

THEN GOVERNOR BENTLEY, AT THAT TIME, HAD SOME ISSUES AND RESIGNED FROM OFFICE.

AND PRETTY MUCH ENDED THAT SESSION.

WE ALSO HAD A CONTROVERSIAL REDISTRICTING ISSUE THAT WE HAD TO ADDRESS THAT THE FEDERAL COURTS MADE US IN 2017 BEFORE THE 2018 ELECTION.

THAT SORT OF TOOK THE PRISON ISSUE OFF THE TABLE THEN.

2018 WAS AN ELECTION YEAR.

YOU KNOW, WE JUST HAVE A SERIES OF BAD LUCK.

LAST YEAR COULD HAVE BROUGHT IT UP THEN.

WE HAD TO SUSPEND THE SESSION BECAUSE OF COVID-19.

SO, YOU KNOW, BAD LUCK, BAD TIMING.

I COMMEND THE GOVERNOR FOR EXPLORING DIFFERENT OPTIONS AS THIS BILL LEASE PROCESS WAS A DIFFERENT OPTION.

IT SEEMED TO BE PROMISING AT ONE TIME, BUT THEN THE FINANCING DOES NOT APPEAR TO BE ABLE TO COME THROUGH LIKE PEOPLE HAD HOPED.

THERE WITH WAS ALSO ISSUES WITH THE WHOLE PROCESS OF A LEASE PLAN WHERE AT THE END OF 30 YEARS WE WOULD NOT OWN THE PRISON.

I THINK IT IS A GOOD IDEA NOW TO START FROM SCRATCH AND GO BACK TO THE PLAN WE ARE LOOKING AT FIVE YEARS AGO AND FOR US TO BE ABLE TO OWN THE PRISONS.

>> IS YOUR PREFERENCE ALWAYS BEEN A STATE BOND ISSUE VERSUS PRIVATE LEASE?

>> YES.

I HAVE ALWAYS WANTED TO DO THAT.

BUT, YOU HAVE TO GO THROUGH THE LEGISLATURE ON THE BOND ISSUE.

THERE ARE SOME ISSUES THERE.

THERE ARE PEOPLE IN THE LEGISLATURE THAT HAVE PRISONS IN THEIR DISTRICT OR NEAR THEIR DISTRICTS.

PROBABLY KNOW THIS IS THE RIGHT WAY TO GO BUT PROBABLY NOT GOING TO BE ABLE TO VOTE FOR POLITICAL REASONS OR THERE'S SOME OTHERS THAT JUST DON'T WANT TO BORROW THE MONEY PERIOD.

I THINK, ALL IN ALL, I THINK THE VAST MAJORITY OF THE LEGISLATURE REALIZES NOW THAT WE HAVE TO HAVE NEW PRISONS.

THE ONES WE HAVE NOW ARE DILAPIDATED AND FALLING IN ALL AROUND.

WE HAVE, OF COURSE I WILL, ISSUES WITH THE FEDERAL COURTS.

THEY WON'T SOLVE ALL OF OUR PROBLEMS, BUT IT WILL GO A LONG WAY IN HELPING TO ENCOURAGE PEOPLE TO WORK AT DEPARTMENT OF CORRECTIONS AND SECURITY AND WORK AS MENTAL HEALTH PROFESSIONALS AT THE COURTS HAVE INDICATED.

WE HAVE TO HIRE MORE OF THEM AND IT IS A DAUNTING TASK TO HIRE PEOPLE TO GO IN THESE TYPE OF FACILITIES THE WAY THEY ARE NOW.

>> GOVERNOR IVEY EMBARKED ON THE PRIVATE LEASE PLAN AFTER A COUPLE OF UNSUCCESSFUL ATTEMPTS TO GET THE STATE BOND ISSUE OUT OF THE LEGISLATURE.

AS YOU MENTIONED YOU CAME CLOSE LAST TIME YOU WERE ABLE TO TACKLE THIS.

AS YOU ALLUDED TO, ATTITUDES SEEM TO BE CHANGES AND DO YOU THINK IT MIGHT BE EASIER TO GET OUT OF THE LEGISLATURE VERSUS PAST YEARS?

>> I THINK SO.

I THINK WE NEED TO COME UP WITH WHAT THE PLAN IS AND LET EVERYBODY SEE IT.

I THINK THAT -- I THINK WE CAN GET IT PASSED.

>> GOVERNOR IVEY WAS ASKED WHETHER OR NOT SHE MAY CONSIDER CALLING A SPECIAL SESSION TO DEAL WITH THIS ISSUE AND SHE SAID NOT RIGHT NOW.

NOT UNTIL I HAVE SEEN THE PLAN AND GONE THROUGH IT WITH A FINE-TOOTH COMB AND WORKED WITH LEADERS, LIKE YOURSELF ON WHAT MIGHT BE ULTIMATELY PUT ON THE TABLE.

>> THAT'S RIGHT.

I THINK SHE IS THE ONLY ONE THAT CAN CALL A SPECIAL SESSION.

I BELIEVE WE WILL COME TO AN AGREEMENT OF WHAT WE NEED TO DO WITH THE EXECUTIVE BRANCH AND THE LEGISLATIVE BRANCH AND MOVE FORWARD FROM THERE.

WE'LL HAVE TO HAVE A SPECIAL SESSION TO DEAL WITH THIS.

ALONG THOSE SAME LINES, WE HAVE THE RESCUE PLAN FUNDS THAT HAVE TO BE APPROPRIATED.

SO, I THINK WE CAN DO ALL OF THAT IN ONE SPECIAL SESSION.

>> SPEAKING OF THE RESCUE MONEY, TALKING ABOUT THE FEDERAL STIMULUS MONEY, THERE'S BEEN SOME CONVERSATION THAT ALABAMA MIGHT BE ABLE TO USE SOME OF THE FEDERAL STIMULUS MONEY FOR PRISON CONSTRUCTION PLAN.

I GUESS YOU ARE LOOKING IN TO THE RAMIFICATION AND SEEING IF THAT IS DOABLE.

>> STILL LOOKING AT IT AND GETTING GUIDANCE FROM TREASURY.

I THINK WE CAN USE SOME.

I DON'T KNOW HOW MUCH.

IT IS SORT OF A MOVING TARGET RIGHT NOW BUT ANY AMOUNT WE COULD USE IN THAT PROCESS WOULD CERTAINLY HELP TO FRAY EXPENSES OF THE -- WHATEVER THE TOTAL AMOUNT OF THE BOND ISSUE IS.

I THINK IT WOULD BE A WIN-WIN SITUATION FOR THE TAXPAYERS OF ALABAMA.

>> YOU THINK A SPECIAL SESSION IS MERITED ON THE PRISON CONSTRUCTION PLAN AND ALSO ON HOW WE SPEND THESE STIMULUS DOLLARS.

THERE'S ALSO, OF COURSE, THE POSSIBILITY, THE LIKELY POSSIBILITY OF IF NOT A FOREGONE CONCLUSION THAT WE WILL HAVE TO HAVE A SPECIAL SESSION ON REDISTRICTING THIS YEAR.

WILL WE NEED TWO SPECIAL SESSIONS?

SOME COULD ARGUE THEY ARE TOO WEIGHTY FOR ONE SPECIAL SESSION.

>> I THINK WE WOULD HAVE TO HAVE TWO SPECIAL SESSIONS.

THE REDISTRICTING IS ALWAYS CONTROVERSIAL AND WHEN YOU THROW IN CONGRESSIONAL -- OF COURSE WE DID GET A BREAK BY NOT LOSING A SEAT, SO IT WON'T AS CONTROVERSIAL AS IF WE HAD LOST A SEAT BUT WE WILL HAVE CONTROVERSY AROUND IT WHENEVER YOU MOVE LINES AND WE HAVE TO DRAW THE STATE SCHOOL BOARD LINES.

SO THOSE THREE AREAS, RIGHT THERE, WE MAY BE ABLE TO DO THOSE IN ONE SPECIAL SESSION BUT IT WON'T BE A FIVE-DAY SESSION.

IT WILL HAVE TO GO TO THE FULL 12 DAYS IN A 30-DAY PERIOD.

I REALLY DON'T THINK WE SHOULD ADD PRISONS AND RESCUE PLAN IN WITH THAT SPECIAL SESSION.

>> THE THINKING IS THAT THE REDISTRICTING SPECIAL SESSION WILL PROBABLY HAPPEN THIS FALL, PERHAPS IN OCTOBER, ONCE WE GET ALL OF THE DATA WE NEED FROM THE CENSUS BUREAU.

I'LL REMIND OUR VIEWERS, WE DIDN'T GET IT DONE IN THE REGULAR SESSION BECAUSE WE DIDN'T HAVE THAT BECAUSE OF THE PANDEMIC DELAYS.

A SPECIAL SESSION IN THE FALL PROBABLY ON REDISTRICTING WITH PRISONS AND THE STIMULUS SPENDING ISSUES PROBABLY COME IN ANOTHER SPECIAL SESSION BEFORE OR AFTER THAT, OR IS IT TOO SOON TO TELL RIGHT NOW?

>> PROBABLY TOO SOON.

MY BEST GUESSTIMATE ON IT WOULD BE BEFORE.

I WOULD THINK PROBABLY SOMETIME -- LOOKING AT THE CALENDAR, PROBABLY MID AUGUST TO DO THE PRISON ISSUE AND RESCUE PLAN.

THAT'S WHAT I WOULD SUGGEST.

>> DO YOU FEEL A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF PRESSURE, GIVEN THE FEDERAL LAWSUIT OVER OUR PRISONS HERE AND THE WATCHFUL EYE THEY ARE KEEPING OVER OUR MANEUVERINGS HERE WHERE OUR PRISONS ARE CONCERNED?

>> I THINK SO.

AND WE HAVE TO BE COGNIZANT OF THAT AND MOVE FORWARD AND SHOW THAT WE ARE SERIOUS ABOUT THAT.

WE ARE SERIOUS.

IT'S JUST BEEN A SERIES OF SOME UNFORTUNATE EVENTS HERE, BUT IT'S AN ISSUE THAT WE NEED TO ADDRESS.

THROUGH THE YEARS, PRISONS, NOT ONLY IN THE STATE OF ALABAMA, BUT ALL OVER THE COUNTRY HAVE ALWAYS BEEN SHORTCHANGED.

THERE'S NOT A VOTING CONSTITUENCY THERE.

AND WHETHER IT IS CITY OR COUNTY GOVERNMENT DEALING WITH LOCAL JAILS OR STATES WITH THEIR PRISONS, THESE APPROPRIATIONS ALWAYS GO TO THE BOTTOM OF THE BARREL BECAUSE THERE'S NOT A CONSTITUENCY THERE.

AT THE END OF THE DAY SOMETHING WE HAVE TO TAKE CARE OF AND MAKE SURE THEY DON'T GET IN A DILAPIDATED SHAPE THEY ARE IN.

>> THERE IS A POLITICAL DEBATE OVER WHETHER BUILDING NEW PRISONS WILL SOLVE OUR PROBLEMS BUT THEY COULD ADDRESS THINGS LIKE OVERCROWDING AND IMPROVING SECURITY MEASURES, AMONG OTHER THINGS, BUT THERE ARE BROADER ISSUES LIKE SENTENCING REFORM, WHICH WE ADDRESSED SOMEWHAT IN THE JUST WRAPPED UP LEGISLATIVE SESSION.

>> YES.

THAT'S PART OF A BIG PIE THAT WE HAVE TO BAKE HERE.

THE SENTENCING IS PART OF THAT.

WE TOOK SOME ACTION ON SOME ISSUES.

ONE FOR NON-VIOLENT OFFENDERS, TO BE ABLE TO TAKE WORK TRAINING COURSES SO THEY WOULD HAVE A JOB WHEN THEY COME OUT OF PRISON.

IF THEY COMPLETELY COMPLETED THE COURSE, THEIR SENTENCE WOULD BE REDUCED BY AS MUCH AS A YEAR.

SO, THINGS LIKE THAT.

YOU KNOW, WE HAVE TO MAKE SURE THAT WE DON'T HAVE THE ISSUE OF RECIDIVISM THERE WHERE PRISONERS WHO GET OUT CAN'T FIND A JOB, THEY GO BACK TO A LIFE OF CRIME AND THEY ARE BACK IN AGAIN.

THOSE ARE CERTAINLY ISSUES WE HAVE TO MOVE FORWARD ON ALSO.

>> FROM A BIG PICTURE PERSPECTIVE, ARE YOU OF THE THOUGHT THAT NEW PRISONS COULD GO A LONG WAY IN SOLVING A LOT OF -- >> I THINK SO.

WE JUST HAVE TO DO IT.

IT IS LIKE A SCHOOL OR -- SOONER OR LATER YOU HAVE TO HAVE SOME NEW BUILDINGS.

WE HAVE SOME THAT HAVE LASTED A LONG TIME.

THESE FACILITIES, UNLIKE SCHOOLS, WHICH RIGHT NOW DON'T HAVE ANY STUDENTS IN THEM OR TEACHERS FOR A TWO-MONTH PERIOD AND THEY HAVE TIME TO HAVE DEFERRED MAINTENANCE DONE ON THEM AND SPRUCED UP SOME AND THAT TYPE THING.

WHEREAS A JAIL IS 24/7.

I MEAN IT TAKES A LOT OF ABUSE EVERY DAY IN THE BATHROOMS, THE LOCKS ON THE DOORS, THE SHOWERS, THE KITCHENS, JUST A TREMENDOUS AMOUNT OF ABUSE OF THESE FACILITIES.

>> WE CERTAINLY DO HAVE A VERY AGING COLLECTION OF STATE PRISONS AROUND THE STATE, SOME OF THEM DATING 50, 60, 70, EVEN 80 YEARS AND GOVERNOR IVEY, IN PROMOTING HER PREVIOUS PRIVATE LEASE DEAL SAID DEFERRED MAINTENANCE COULD HELP TO PAY FOR IT.

DO YOU SUPPORT THAT THEORY?

>> WELL, YES.

THE WHOLE ISSUE OF CONSOLIDATION.

WE PAY A LOT OF MONEY RIGHT NOW FOR OVERTIME FOR OUR EMPLOYEES.

IT REALLY COSTS THE DEPARTMENT OF CORRECTIONS BUDGET A LOT OF MONEY.

WE CAN CUT DOWN ON OVERTIME AND ON TRANSPORTATION COSTS AS FAR AS TRANSFERRING PRISONERS FROM ONE PRISON TO ANOTHER WHEN AVAILABLE SPACE IS MADE AVAILABLE IN ANOTHER PRISON.

TRANSPORTATION COSTS TO HOSPITALS, JUST THE HEALTHCARE COSTS IN GENERAL NEED TO BRING THAT DOWN ALSO.

>> YOU SAID YOU HAVE ALWAYS BEEN MORE OF A PROPONENT FOR A STATE BOND ISSUE VERSUS A PRIVATE LEASE PLAN WHERE BUILDING NEW PRISONS IS CONCERNED.

WERE YOU DISAPPOINTED THE GOVERNOR'S PLAN WAS TAKEN APART.

SHE MADE A BOLD STEP IN PUSHING IT FORWARD.

>> I DON'T KNOW THAT DISAPPOINTMENT IS THE WORD.

A LOT OF THINGS WE HAD BEEN TOLD WERE NOT COMING TO FRUITION, PARTICULARLY ON THE COST PART.

THE COST SEEMED TO BE GOING UP AND THE AMOUNT OF SPACE, AS THE NUMBER OF PRISONERS WE COULD HOLD IN A FACILITY WAS GOING DOWN.

IT WAS OBVIOUS THAT, YOU KNOW, THE NUMBERS WERE NOT MATCHING UP.

THE WAY WE NEEDED THEM TO.

SO, YOU KNOW, AS I SAID, IT WAS A BOLD EFFORT TO TRY TO SEE IF THIS PLAN WOULD WORK.

I KNOW THERE ARE PROBABLY SOME SMALL POCKETS THEY THINK A LEASE-TYPE PROGRAM MIGHT WORK.

WE'LL SEE.

I THINK WE NEED TO OWN THE PRISONS OURSELVES.

>> I WILL REMIND FOLKS WHAT GOVERNOR IVEY PROPOSED IS BUILDING THREE NEW REGIONAL MEN'S FACILITIES TO REPLACE OTHER EXISTING FACILITIES.

DO YOU THINK THAT IS A GOOD STARTING OFF POINT HERE?

>> I THINK SO.

I THINK THE WHOLE CONCEPT IS THE RIGHT CONCEPT.

IT IS A MATTER OF THE FINANCING.

THAT'S WHERE WE NEED TO CONCENTRATE ON NOW IS DOING IT OURSELVES.

>> I BRING UP THE THREE NEW MEN'S FACILITIES BECAUSE THERE ARE SOME, ESPECIALLY IN THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY THAT SAID WE NEED TO BUILD A NEW WOMEN'S PRISON, BUT DO YOU THINK WE JUST START WITH THE MEN'S PRISONS?

>> I THINK THE TUTWILER PROJECT NEEDS TO BE LOOKED AT ALSO.

IT IS THE OLDEST IN THE STATE, ALMOST 90 YEARS OLD.

THERE'S BEEN A LOT OF IMPROVEMENTS AND RENOVATION.

IT DOESN'T TAKE QUITE THE ABUSE, THE WOMEN'S PRISONS THAT THE MINUTES DO.

IT IS IN OKAY SHAPE BUT WE NEED TO LOOK AT IT ALSO.

>> AS YOU MEET AND OTHER LEGISLATIVE LEADERS MEET, YOU THINK TUTWILER NEEDS TO BE ON THE TABLE FOR DISCUSSION.

>> I DON'T KNOW THAT IT WILL BE ON THE TABLE.

NEXT WEEK I THINK WE ARE TALKING ABOUT BROAD-BASED FINANCING TERMS.

SO WE WILL SEE WHERE IT GOES.

>> ARE YOU OPTIMISTIC THAT SOMETHING CAN BE DONE.

>> I THINK SO.

I THINK THERE IS COOPERATION BETWEEN THE LEGISLATURE AND THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE AND I BELIEVE SOMETHING CAN BE WORKED OUT.

>> REPRESENTATIVE CLOUSE, ALWAYS A PLEASURE TO HAVE YOU ON THE SHOW.

THANK YOU FOR BEING HERE.

>> APPRECIATE IT.

>> YOU BET.

"CAPITOL JOURNAL" WILL BE RIGHT BACK.

>> YOU ARE WATCHING ALABAMA PUBLIC TELEVISION.

NEXT UP ON THE BROADCAST, CONGRESSMAN CARL IS IN THE STUDIO.

LET'S BEGIN BY TALKING ABOUT DR. FAUCI.

HE'S BEEN A CENTRAL FISH FOR OVER A YEAR NOW AS WE DEALT WITH THE PANDEMIC HERE IN THE COUNTRY.

YOU HAVE SOME CONCERNS ABOUT HIM, ENOUGH CONCERNS THAT I BELIEVE YOU ARE DRAFTING A BILL.

>> WE HAVE.

WE ARE DRAFTING A BILL RIGHT NOW.

WE'RE TRYING TO PUT IT TOGETHER WHILE I'M HERE IN MONTGOMERY.

IT IS BEING PUT TOGETHER IN DC.

WE ARE BASICALLY ASKING FAUCI FOR HIS RESIGNATION.

WE ARE ASKING HIM TO QUIETLY STEP DOWN AND MOVE ON.

THE E-MAILS THAT HAVE COME OUT AND THINGS SURFACING AS THEY SIFT THROUGH THAT ARE TREMENDOUSLY DAMAGING AS FAR AS HE AND HIS REPUTATION ARE CONCERNED.

I HAVE A LOT MORE CONCERN WITH WHAT I THINK IS A BIGGER STORY AND A BIGGER ELEMENT WHEN YOU ARE DEALING WITH HIM.

TO BE A BUREAUCRAT AND HAVE THAT MUCH CONTROL, THEY'LL STEP ON THE STAGE AND MAKE A STATEMENT ABOUT MASKS AND THEN TWO MONTHS LATER CHANGE DIRECTION WITH THAT, I'M CURIOUS WHAT HIS INVESTMENTS LOOK LIKE.

I'M CURIOUS TO SEE WHAT AND HOW HE COULD HAVE PROFITED FROM THIS FINANCIALLY.

BEING A BUREAUCRAT, WE DON'T HAVE ACCESS TO HIS FINANCIAL INFORMATION LIKE YOU WOULD MYSELF, ELECTED OFFICIALS.

OUR INVESTMENTS ARE PUBLIC, BUT IN A POSITION HE IS IN, I UNDERSTAND HE DOES NOT HAVE TO DISCLOSE THAT.

THAT REALLY DEEPLY CONCERNS ME, BUREAUCRAT HAVING THAT MUCH CONTROL AND SHIFT THE STOCK MARKET IN A PARTICULAR FIELD, THE HEALTHCARE FIELD FOR EXAMPLE AT HIS OPINION.

>> A LOT TO UNPACK THERE.

LOATHES START WITH YOU THINK HE NEEDS TO RESIGN.

YOU MENTIONED SOME E-MAILS HAVE COME OUT.

TELL US WHAT YOUR CONCERNS ARE THAT HAVE MADE YOU SAY YOU THINK HE NEEDS TO RESIGN.

>> IT IS STILL EARLY.

2,000 E-MAILS WERE RELEASED, EVERYONE IS SIFTING THROUGH THOSE AND A LOT OF THOSE HAVE SOME STORIES THAT DON'T MATCH UP, TIME FRAMES AND ALSO OPINIONS.

A LOT OF THEM INSINUATE HE WAS TRYING TO COVER UP FOR THE LAB IN CHINA, WHICH IS A DIFFERENT ISSUE THAN WHAT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT HERE IN MY MIND.

LET'S START WITH THE BASICS.

THE BASICS IS WE NEED SOMEONE TO GIVE US ADVICE GOING THROUGH THESE PANDEMICS IF THEY HAPPEN IN THE FUTURE.

GOD HOPE THEY DON'T, BUT WE NEED TO HAVE SOMEONE THAT IS ANSWERABLE TO THE PEOPLE.

THE PEOPLE AS AN ELECTED OFFICIAL AND A METHOD OF WATCHING OVER THIS PERSON AND HOW THEY DO THEIR INVESTMENTS.

I THINK THAT IS A HUGE, HUGE PROBLEM.

IF I KNOW WE ARE GOING TO PAINT ALL BATTLESHIPS A NEW COLOR AND THE ONLY PAINT WE ARE GOING TO BUY IS ONE SOURCE AND I STEP OUT AND BUY STOCK TWO DAYS BEFORE THAT CONTRACT, IT IS INSIDER TRADING.

IN HIS POSITION, IF HE KNEW HE WAS GOING TO SWITCH THE MASK, AS AN EXAMPLE, JUST AN EXAMPLE.

I HAVE NOTHING TO PROVE BASIS ON AND HE BUYS STOCK IN A MASK COMPANY AND TWO DAYS LATER SAYS WE ARE GOING TO THE MASK, THERE'S THE STORY RIGHT THERE.

WE NEED TO KNOW.

THE COUNTRY IS MAD RIGHT NOW.

THEY ARE UPSET WITH ALL OF THIS.

PART FEEL LIKE IT DIDN'T HAPPEN.

I LOST FIVE FRIENDS THAT DIED FROM IT.

SO I KNOW IT IS A REAL FACTOR.

I HAVE HAD MY VACCINATION.

I HOPE YOU HAVE HAD YOURS.

I HOPE EVERYBODY IN AMERICA THAT WANTS IT GETS IT.

IF YOU DON'T WANT IT, IT'S YOUR LIFE.

YOU CONTROL THAT.

BUT I THINK WE HAVE TO HAVE SOME METHOD OF THESE PEOPLE, LIKE DR. FAUCI, THAT HAVE SO MUCH POWER TO WILL THE STOCK MARKET AND JUST THE WHIFF OF A SENATE -- I WANT TO KNOW HOW HE INVESTED HIS MONEY.

>> DO YOU HAVE ANY EVIDENCE THERE MIGHT BE WRONGDOING THERE?

>> NO, THERE'S ZERO EVIDENCE BECAUSE THERE IS NO WAY TO LOOK AT HIS INVESTMENTS.

THERE IS NOT.

I'D LOVE CONGRESS TO PULL HIM IN AND ASK HIM QUESTIONS ON THAT BASIS.

NOW, WILL IT GO ANYWHERE?

I HAVE NO IDEA.

WE HAVE TO LET THE BUREAUCRATS KNOW THAT RUN SO MUCH OF WASHINGTON, MONTGOMERY, THE WORLD IS FULL OF BUREAUCRATS.

WE HAVE TO LET THE BUREAUCRATS KNOW THEY ARE ANSWERABLE TO THE PEOPLE IN SOME WAY.

IT MAY NOT BE AN ELECTION, BUT THEY ARE ANSWERABLE TO THE PEOPLE.

>> YOU MENTIONED, AMONG OTHER CONCERNS, YOU HAVE WITH DR. FAUCI IS THE LAB WHERE MANY BELIEVE THE VIRUS MAY HAVE STARTED IN THE WUHAN, CHINA LAB.

DID I HEAR YOU SAY HE MAY HAVE MORE KNOWLEDGE THAN HE IS FORTHCOMING?

>> THE E-MAILS -- I HAVEN'T PERSONALLY SEEN THE E-MAILS BUT IT IS SET UP FOR COVER.

THEY KNEW IT HAPPENED AND WERE TRYING TO COVER IT UP.

THAT'S A SCARY THOUGHT.

CHEMICAL WARFARE AND DISEASE WARFARE HAS BEEN AROUND FOR HUNDREDS IF NOT THOUSANDS OF YEARS.

THAT'S HOW WE KILLED MOST OF THE NATIVE AMERICAN INDIANS, IF YOU THINK ABOUT IT, WAS SMALLPOX.

IF WE -- IT'S A SITUATION THAT WE HAVE MORE CONTROL OF, WE HOPE, BUT TO TAKE A COUNTRY, LIKE CHINA, WHICH WE ARE NOT FRIENDLY.

THEY ARE NOT FRIENDLY WITH US, AND INVEST IN THEIR LAB AND AT THE LEAST THEY COULD HAVE DONE IS SAY YES, WE DID IT AND MAKE SOME TYPE OF RESTITUTION.

WHAT THAT IS I HAVE NO IDEA.

THERE'S NO WAY W. I MEAN 2 MILLION PEOPLE, IF MY NUMBERS ARE RIGHT, HAVE DIED FROM THAT SPILL IN A LAB THAT THEY ARE INSINUATING.

THAT IS HALF OF WHAT WAS KILLED IN THE HOLOCAUST.

I'M NOT COME A PAIRING IT TO THE HOLOCAUST BY NO MEANS BUT THAT'S HUGE NUMBERS AND A LOT OF LIVES.

WE NEED TO TAKE THIS IN FOCUS AND HOLD THE CHINESE ACCOUNTABLE.

>> I KNOW THERE ARE AMONG 200 REPUBLICANS WHO RECENTLY SIGNED A LETTER TO NANCY PELOSI ASKING FOR AN INVESTIGATION INTO THE WUHAN LAB BECAUSE OF THE QUESTIONS THAT HAVE ARISEN IN RECENT DAYS AND PRESIDENT BIDEN SAID HE THOUGHT IT MERITED FURTHER INVESTIGATION.

AT THE SAME TIME THERE IS NO EVIDENCE THAT YOU HAVE OR ANYONE ELSE IN CONGRESS HAS THAT DR. FAUCI MAY HAVE BEEN INVOLVED SOMEHOW BUT YOU WANT QUESTIONS ANSWERED.

>> SURE.

THE AMERICAN PEOPLE DESERVE THAT.

ALL WE EVER ASK FOR IS ANSWERS.

THEY TOLERATE A LOT FROM US ELECTED OFFICIALS.

THEY REALLY DO.

BUT ONE THING THEY WANT IS ANSWERS.

DID WE GIVE THEM MONEY, AMERICAN MONEY, WE DID.

WAS WIT USED ON THIS PARTICULAR PROJECT.

FAUCI SAID HE HAS NO WAY TO KNOW IF THEY DID OR NOT.

THERE'S A LOT THERE.

I DON'T WANT TO RUIN A MAN'S CAREER OVER ONE CONVERSATION HERE BUT I THINK THE AMERICAN PEOPLE HAVE A RIGHT TO KNOW.

I THINK WE, AS ELECTED OFFICIALS, HAVE THE RESPONSIBILITY TO ASK THE QUESTIONS AND THAT'S WHAT I'M ENCOURAGING MY COLLEAGUES IN CONGRESS TO DO.

>> YOU THINK THIS IS ENOUGH THAT DR. FAUCI SHOULD STEP DOWN?

>> I THINK HIS CREDIBILITY IS SHOT.

IT'S GONE.

BECAUSE HE'S CHANGED HIS STORY SO MUCH.

IT HAS SHIFTED BACK AND FORTH.

I THINK THE NEW ONE IS THAT SCIENCE CHANGES, OUR OPINIONS CHANGE.

I WOULD HAVE SAID THAT AT THE BEGINNING.

I WOULD HAVE SAID, LOOK, THIS IS A MOVING TARGET.

WE ARE GOING TO DO THE BEST WE CAN DO.

AGAIN, IT'S STRIPPED A LOT.

A LOT OF PEOPLE FEEL LIKE IT STRIPPED A LOT OF THEIR RIGHTS.

IF YOU THINK OF IT, YOU HAVE TO WEAR A MASK.

YOU CAN'T GO HERE AND THERE AND YOU ARE LOCKED DOWN.

PEOPLE FEEL IT STRIPPED THEM OF A LOT OF THEIR RIGHTS, BUT IN REALITY IT MAY HAVE SAVED A LOT OF LIVES.

I'LL NEVER ARGUE WITH THAT.

SHOULD WE HAVE DONE IT?

HINDSIGHT IS 20/20, WE DIDN'T HAVE 3 MILLION THAT DIED.

BUT I WANT SOME ANSWERS.

THE VOTERS DESERVE IT.

>> LET'S LOOK AT OTHER HEADLINE MAKING ISSUES THIS WEEK.

I WANT TO START WITH RUSSIAN HACKS.

THIS WEEK WE HEARD ABOUT A TRANSIT SYSTEM IN THE NORTHEAST THAT HAD BEEN HACKED AND IT'S BELIEVED RUSSIAN CRIMINAL ACTORS ARE RESPONSIBLE.

IT IS ALSO BELIEVED SIMILAR RUSSIAN CRIMINAL ACTORS WERE RESPONSIBILITY OF THE HACK OF THE PIPELINE AND MEAT PROCESSORS.

DO YOU THINK THAT RUSSIA SHOULD BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE?

>> WE SHOULD HOLD THEM ACCOUNTABLE, OF COURSE.

BUT AS TECHNOLOGY CHANGES SO FAST, HOW DO YOU STAY AHEAD OF IT?

WE NEED TO ADDRESS THIS, OF COURSE, WITH RUSSIA AND TRY TO FIGURE OUT WHO'S DOING IT.

EVERYONE SAYS THAT THE RUSSIAN GOVERNMENT IS INVOLVED IN IT.

I HAVE NO WAY OF KNOWING THAT, ANYMORE THAN YOU DO.

I KNOW THERE'S SOME HACKERS OVER THERE FOR A NUMBER OF YEARS THAT ARE YOUNG PEOPLE THAT DO NOTHING BUT SIT AROUND AND HACK.

OBVIOUSLY THEY ARE PRETTY GOOD BUT WE HAVE TO STEP OUR GAME UP IN THIS COUNTRY.

WE HAVE TO STOP WORRYING ABOUT SOME OF THE SOCIAL ISSUES WE SEEM TO BE SO BOUND UP ON AND START -- ONE THING THAT THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT'S RESPONSIBILITY IS THE PROTECTION OF THE PEOPLE AND THE COUNTRY AND THAT INCLUDES THE INTERNET.

WE HAVE TO STEP OUR GAME UP.

WE HAVE TO DO A BETTER JOB.

I CAN'T BLAME THAT TOTALLY ON THE PRESIDENT AND I WON'T TOTALLY BLAME THAT ON THE PRESIDENT.

IT'S GOING TO TAKE A LOT OF PRIVATE INDUSTRY TO GET INVOLVED AND DO THAT.

WE HAVE TECHNOLOGY OUT THERE I FEEL LIKE WE DON'T KNOW ABOUT THAT WE CAN HELP IMPROVE AND GET TO THE PRIVATE SECTOR.

>> PRESIDENT BIDEN IS GOING TO MEET WITH THE RUSSIAN PRESIDENT THIS MONTH IN SWITZERLAND.

DO YOU EXPECT ANYTHING SUB SUBSTANTIVE?

>> I THINK ONE THING WE ARE SEEING WITH THESE HACKS IS RUSSIA IS TRYING AND POKING AND SEEING HOW FAR THEY CAN PUSH US, THE NEW ADMINISTRATION.

I THINK WE ARE SEEING THE SAME THING OUT OF THE CHINESE.

SO MANY OF THESE COMMUNIST-BASED COUNTRIES THAT'S THE WAY THEY DO IT.

THEY ARE TRYING TO GET A FEEL FOR HIM AND HOW FAR THEY CAN PUSH HIM AND HOW HE WILL REACT WHEN THEY FINALLY GET HIM TO THAT POINT.

TRUMP, WHETHER YOU LIKED HIM OR NOT, YOU DIDN'T PUSH HIM.

YOU POKE HIM AND HE WOULD COME OUT OF A CAVE WIDE OPEN AFTER YOU.

BIDEN IS NOT THAT WAY AND THEY ARE TRYING TO FIGURE OUT HOW FAR THEY CAN PUSH HIM AND WHAT THEY CAN DO.

THAT'S WHAT THEY DO EVERY DAY.

FOR ALL OF US FOR THAT MATTER.

>> CONGRESSMAN, KAMALA HARRIS IS SET TO MEET WITH THE LEADERS OF MEXICO AND GUATEMALA NEXT WEEK AND TOP ON THE AGENDA IS EXPECTED TO BE ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION INTO THE COUNTRY.

WHAT DO YOU THINK OF THE PROSPECTS?

>> I THINK GOING THAT ROUTE IS RIDICULOUS.

I THINK SHE WILL PROBABLY GOING TO PROMISE A BUNCH OF MONEY AND DRY IT UP.

A FEW WEEKS AGO I WAS THERE AND THEY WERE COMING FROM CUBA AND EUROPE.

>> YOU WERE AT THE BORDER.

>> I WAS AT THE BORDER FOR THREE DAYS AND I SAW THINGS THAT ABSOLUTELY WOULD DISGUST YOU.

WHAT WE HAVE CROSSING DOWN THERE.

A LOT OF THEM ARE FINE FAMILIES, ESPECIALLY THE EUROPEANS.

THEY SEEM TO BE LEGITIMATE PEOPLE THAT CAN'T GET IN THE STATE.

SO THEY BUY A TICKET TO A TOURIST TOWN AND GET A VISA AND COME TO A BORDER TOWN.

THEY WALK ACROSS.

YOU WANT TO FIX IT, IT IS SIMPLE.

FINISH THE WALL.

SIMPLE AS THAT.

FINISH THE WALL.

WE KNOW WHERE THEY WILL CROSS AND WE CAN BE THERE.

THE ONES THAT WE DO CATCH, HOLD THEM IN SOME TYPE OF CONFINEMENT FOR 15 DAYS AND THAT WILL DISCOURAGE THEM FROM COMING HERE.

IF THEY THINK THEY WILL STAY IN ONE PLACE FOR 15 DAYS THEY WILL NOT COME HERE.

THOSE ARE NOT MY IDEAS, THAT THREE DAYS OF CONVERSATION WITH THE BORDER PATROL.

THAT'S WHERE THE VICE PRESIDENT OUGHT TO BE TALKING TO THE PEOPLE WORKING ON THE ISSUES AND NOT MEETING WITH BUREAUCRATS IN ANOTHER COUNTRY TO FIGURE OUT HOW MUCH MONEY THEY CAN GET FOR THE U.S. GOVERNMENT.

>> YOU DON'T THINK THERE IS MERIT TO ADDRESSING THE ROOT CAUSES OF THIS CONSISTENT MIGRATION PROBLEM, LIKE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AND FOOD INSECURITY IN SOME OF THESE COUNTRIES.

>> I DON'T DISAGREE WITH THAT.

RIGHT NOW WE NEED TO STOP THE BLEEDING AND THAT IS OPEN BORDERS.

SOME ARE STILL WAITING HOPING IT WILL GET STARTED UP.

I HAD DINNER WITH SOME CONTRACTORS THERE.

THEY ARE ON THE GROUND AND WAITING TO SEE IF WE WILL GET IT UP AND GOING.

I THINK WE HAVE TO STOP THE BLEEDING.

WE KNOW WHERE THEY ARE CROSSING.

147,000 LAST MONTH ALONE.

THEY ARE COMING IN -- THAT DOESN'T COUNT THE DRUGS.

THE DRUGS IS THE SAD PART OF THE SCENARIO.

EVERYONE WANTS TO TALK ABOUT BODIES BUT IN REALITY IT IS THE HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF POUNDS OF METHAMPHETAMINE AND COCAINE COMING ACROSS THE BORDER KILLING SMALL TOWN AMERICA.

WHEN I TALK TO PEOPLE, I SAY HAS ANYONE NOT BEEN AFFECTED BY ILLEGAL DRUGS?

I HAVE AND I'M SURE YOU HAVE, TOO.

>> AS WE WRAP UP THE CONVERSATION I THINK IT MERITS A BRIEF MENTION OF THE HUMANITARIAN CRISIS CREATED AT THE SOUTHERN BORDER.

>> THE BORDER PATROL IS DOING AN EXCELLENT JOB.

YOU GO DOWN AND SEE PALLETS OF FORMULA, PACIFIERS, DIAPERS, TOOTHPASTE, ALL THE NEEDS, CLOTHES.

THEY HAVE EVERYTHING AND THEY ARE DOING A GREAT JOB OF BRINGING THEM IN AND CLEANING THEM UP, GIVING THEM SHOWER FACILITIES.

IN 24 HOURS THEY ARE DOING -- THEY ARE DOING WHAT THEY ARE TOLD TOLL DO, HAVING THEM ON A BUS OR PLANE AND BRINGING THEM INTO AMERICA AND TURNING THEM LOOSE.

THAT'S WHERE THE REAL PROBLEM FOR ME STARTS.

WHO ARE THESE PEOPLE?

WE DON'T KNOW.

THEY COME ACROSS THE BORDER AND THEY HAVE AN ADDRESS ON A PIECE OF PAPER.

THAT'S THE ADDRESS THEY SEND THEM TO.

IF WE HAD TIME I'D TELL YOU THE WHOLE STORY.

IT IS SO SIMPLE TO GET INTO AMERICA RIGHT NOW.

IF YOU DON'T HAVE A CHILD, YOU CAN RENT A CHILD.

IF YOU DON'T WANT TO RENT ONE AND YOU CAN BUY ONE, BUY A CHILD AT THE BORDER AND YOU CAN COME ACROSS AND THEY WILL NOT SEND YOU BECAUSE YOU HAVE A CHILD WITH YOU.

THINK ABOUT THAT.

THAT IS ABLE ABOUT AS HORRIBLE AS IT GETS BUT GO AND TALK TO THE BORDER PATROL.

YOU DON'T NEED TO TALK TO A CONGRESSMAN OR A FOREIGN GOVERNMENT, TALK TO BORDER PATROL.

THAT'S ONE THING THE VICE PRESIDENT HAS NOT DONE.

>> CONGRESSMAN CARL OF MOBILE, IT'S ALWAYS A PLEASURE TO HAVE YOU ON THE SHOW.

>> THANK YOU, SIR.

>>> "CAPITOL JOURNAL" WILL BE RIGHT BACK.

>> STAY IN TOUCH WITH "CAPITOL JOURNAL" ONLINE, ON FACEBOOK AND ON TWITTER.

YOU CAN ALSO CONTACT US BY E-MAIL AT DDAILEY@APTV.ORG OR BY E-MAIL.

>> FINALLY ON THE BROADCAST TONIGHT, IT'S OUR WEEKLY DISCUSSION OF THE PANDEMIC AND THE COVID VACCINATION EFFORT.

OUR GUEST ON ALL OF THESE SEGMENTS SINCE LAST MARCH, DR. SCOTT HARRIS IS ON A MUCH-DESERVED VACATION THIS WEEK BUT WE ARE HONORED TO HAVE DR. WILLIAMS, PRESIDENT AND CEO OF THE ALABAMA HOSPITAL ASSOCIATION.

WELCOME BACK.

>> GLAD TO BE HERE.

>> LET'S BEGIN WITH OUR HOSPITALIZATION RATE.

WE HAVE BEEN FORTUNATE FOR WEEKS NOW THAT IT HAS REMAINED STABLE.

THAT'S A GOOD THING, BUT I THINK IT BEARS REPEATING FOR FOLKS HERE THAT EVEN THOUGH THE NUMBER OF HOSPITALIZED COVID PATIENTS REMAINS LOW THERE ARE STILL SICK PEOPLE BEING TREATED.

>> WE WILL HAVE 90 TO 100 PEOPLE IN THE ICU WITH COVID AND 50 OR SO ON VENTILATORS EVERY DAY WITH COVID AND WE STILL HAVE AROUND 250, 275 PEOPLE IN THE HOSPITAL EACH DAY WITH COVID.

TODAY, WE SAW ABOUT 400 NEW CASES DIAGNOSED.

YESTERDAY WE HAD OVER 500 NEW CASES DIAGNOSED.

SO WHILE WE CERTAINLY HAVE SEEN DRAMATIC IMPROVEMENTS, AND WE CONTINUE TO SEE DAILY DECLINES IN OUR SEVEN-DAY AVERAGES IN TERMS OF HOSPITALIZATIONS, THE BATTLE ISN'T WON.

SO, IT IS STILL INCUMBENT ON US TO DO THE RIGHT THINGS TO MOVE US TO WHERE WE CAN PUT THIS TOTALLY BEHIND US.

>> THERE CONTINUE TO BE SO MANY ENCOURAGING SIGNS.

FOR INSTANCE, I TALKED TO DR. HARRIS ABOUT A COUPLE OF HOSPITALS AROUND THE STATE REPORTED THEY HAD NO COVID PATIENTS.

>> AND THAT'S ENCOURAGE, BUT THOSE ARE POINTS IN TIME.

JUST BECAUSE A HOSPITAL HAS NO COVID CASES TODAY OR TOMORROW DOESN'T MEAN THEY WON'T HAVE SOMEONE ADMITTED IN THE NEXT DAY OR THE NEXT WEEK.

SO IT IS AN EVOLUTIONARY, A CHANGING DYNAMIC, BUT THE ONE THING THAT IS CONSISTENT IS THAT ALL OF OUR HOSPITALS ARE DEALING WITH SUBSTANTIALLY FEWER CASES THAN WE WERE A MONTH AGO AND HEAVEN KNOWS FAR FEWER THAN SIX MONTHS AGO.

>> OUR DAILY CASE COUNTS REMAIN STABLE, TOO, EVEN THOUGH YOU POINT OUT WE ARE AVERAGING 400 TO 500 NEW CASES REPORTED DAILY.

IS THERE ANYWAY, IN MY OPINION, GIVEN THE PROGRESSIVE TRAJECTORY WE HAVE BEEN MAKING, IS THERE ANY WAY WE CAN MESS THIS UP?

>> WE CAN STILL MESS THIS UP.

HUMANS HAVE THE ABILITY TO MESS UP A LOT OF THINGS.

THIS IS ONE WE COULD.

I THINK TO ME THE MOST LIKELY WAY WE MESS THIS UP IS RIGHT NOW, IF YOU LOOK AT WHERE WE ARE IN ALABAMA, WE HAVE 29% OF OUR POPULATION THAT'S HAD TWO DOSES.

WE HAVE 38.5% THAT HAVE HAD AT LEAST ONE DOSE.

SO, THAT MEANS THAT MORE THAN 60% OF OUR POPULATION HAS NOT BEEN VACCINATED.

NOW, SOME OF THOSE HAVE SOME LEVEL OF IMMUNITY BECAUSE THEY HAVE HAD DISEASE, BUT THERE'S GOING TO REMAIN A RESIDUAL POPULATION IN OUR -- OUT THERE THAT ARE NOT VACCINATED AND THEY ARE NOT IMMUNE.

IT'S IN THAT POPULATION THAT TWO THINGS CAN HAPPEN.

NUMBER ONE, THAT'S WHERE WE CAN SEE THE OUTBREAKS OF DISEASE.

WE CAN SEE INCREASED NUMBERS OF CASES ARISING IN THAT POPULATION.

THE SECOND THING THAT HAPPENS IS A VIRUS THAT GETS SPREAD, THE VIRUS REPLICATES.

AS THE VIRUS REPLICATES, IT HAS THE ABILITY TO MUTATE.

WE HAVE BEEN FORTUNATE.

IN ALABAMA, OUR DOMINANT VARIANT IS THE U.K.

VARIANT.

THAT VARIANT REMAINS HIGHLY SUSCEPTIBLE TO THE VACCINE AND THE VACCINE PROVIDES PROTECTION.

THE INDIAN VARIANT, THAT IS NOW SWEEPING THROUGH THE U.K., THAT VARIANT, AT LEAST IN THE PFIZER STUDIES, REMAINS VERY SUSCEPTIBLE TO THAT VACCINE.

ON THE OTHER HAND, THERE ARE VARIANTS OUT THERE.

THE SOUTH AFRICAN BEING ONE WHERE THE VACCINES DO NOT SEEM TO PROVIDE THE SAME LEVEL OF PROTECTION.

I THINK THE THING THAT WORRIES ME THE MOST IS THE IDEA THAT WE GET SOME SUSTAINED TRANSMISSION IN UNVACCINATED, NON-IMMUNE INDIVIDUALS AND OUT OF THAT POPULATION EMERGES A VARIANT THAT HAS SOME OF THE CHARACTERISTICS OF THE SOUTH AFRICAN VARIANT.

IN THAT CASE, WHAT YOU NOW HAVE IS A VIRUS THAT HAS THE ABILITY TO SPREAD TO PEOPLE WHO HAVE ALREADY BEEN VACCINATED.

SO THAT DOESN'T JUST PUT THAT POPULATION THAT IS UNVACCINATED AT RISK, IT PUTS ALL OF US AT RISK AGAIN.

HOW DO WE PREVENT THAT?

THE WAY YOU PREVENT A VIRUS FROM MUTATING IS BY PREVENTING IT FROM REPLICATING.

THE WAY YOU PREVENT IT FROM REPLICATING IS YOU HAVE NO SUSCEPTIBLE HOST.

THE WAY YOU PRESENT A SUSCEPTIBLE HOST IS YOU HAVE TO GET IMMUNITY IN THE POPULATION.

YOU HAVE TO GET TO THAT MAGIC NUMBER, WHETHER IT IS 70ER 85%.

YOU HAVE TO GET THE DISEASE THE IMMUNITY LEVEL HIGH ENOUGH, SO THAT IF SOMEBODY GETS THE VIRUS, THEY GET THE VIRUS BUT THEY DON'T HAVE ANYBODY TO SPREAD IT TO.

SO YOU DON'T HAVE OUTBREAKS OR SUSTAINED TRANSMISSION.

ARE WE THERE YET, NO.

BECAUSE WE ARE CLEARLY HAVING MORE THAN 200 PEOPLE DIAGNOSED EVERY DAY.

WE ARE CONTINUING TO HAVE MORE THAN 100 PEOPLE IN THE HOSPITAL EVERY DAY.

CAN WE GET THERE?

WE ABSOLUTELY CAN, BUT IT'S GOING TO TAKE PEOPLE NOT YET VACCINATED BEING WILLING TO BE VACCINATED.

>> THAT SEEMS TO BE TAKING SOME DOING LATELY.

WE HAVE RESORTED TO ALL SORTS OF THINGS.

WE HEARD THIS WEEK THE PRESIDENT OF THE BIRMINGHAM CITY COUNCIL LAID OUT A PROPOSAL FOR A VACCINE LOTTERY.

WE HEARD ABOUT OTHER THINGS.

THE PRESIDENT, IN PROMOTING HIS PLAN TO GET TO 70% VACCINATION BY JULY 4th WAS PROMOTING THINGS LIKE FREE BEER.

IS IT GOING TO TAKE THOSE KINDS OF THINGS.

>> YOU HAVE TO FIGURE OUT WHY ARE PEOPLE NOT VACCINATED.

I REALLY THINK -- THIS IS PURE SPECULATION, WE DON'T HAVE THE SCIENCE BUT WE KNOW THERE ARE EARLY AND LATE ADOPTERS.

EARLY ADOPTERS ARE PEOPLE WHO COULD HARDLY WAIT TO GET THE VACCINE.

THEY GOT THE VACCINE AND THEY ARE VACCINATED AND THEN THE LATE ADOPTERS.

THEY ARE MOST RESISTANT TO BEING VACCINATED AND PEOPLE IN THE MIDDLE WHO ARE LIKE MOST FOLKS.

THE CHALLENGE IS FIGURING OUT WHAT ARE THE CAUSES FOR PEOPLE WHO HAVE NOT YET BEEN VACCINATED, WHY HAVEN'T THEY BEEN VACCINATED?

IN SOME CASES, I SUSPECT IT IS OPPORTUNITY.

IT'S NOT THAT THE VACCINE ISN'T AVAILABLE, BUT IF YOU ARE WORKING A SHIFT THAT PAYS YOU BY THE HOUR, YOU MAY NOT HAVE THE TIME TO TAKE OFF TO GO GET VACCINATED.

SO THE SOLUTION THERE MIGHT BE TAKING VACCINES TO MORE CONVENIENT LOCATIONS, CHURCHES ON SUNDAY AFTERNOON, THOSE SORTS OF THINGS.

THEN SOME PEOPLE HAVE A HESITANCY ABOUT THE VACCINE AND THERE THE GOAL IS TO IDENTIFY INDIVIDUALS WHO ARE TRUSTED IN THE COMMUNITY, WHO CAN BE THE SPOKESMAN TO TRANSMIT THAT MESSAGE.

NOW, I SAW THE COMMERCIALS THAT NICK SABAN DID AND FOR ALABAMA FANS WHO HAD HESITANCY, BEING MOTIVATED TO GET TO THE STADIUM MAY BE AN ENCOURAGEMENT.

I SAW WHAT TALLADEGA DID AND CERTAINLY SOME PEOPLE WHO WOULD OTHERWISE NOT BEEN VACCINATED GOT VACCINATED TO DRIVE A RACE CAR.

I THINK WE ARE IN A DIFFERENT PLACE.

WE HAVE NEVER TRIED IN THIS SHORT OF A TIME PERIOD TO GET THIS MANY PEOPLE VACCINATED.

I THINK IT WILL TAKE CREATIVE AND NOVEL APPROACHES TO GET WHERE WE WANT TO GET.

>> WE REMAIN AMONG THE LOWEST IN THE NATION WHERE VACCINATION RATES ARE CONCERNED.

I THINK JUST ABOVE THE BOTTOM OF THE HEAP SO TO SPEAK.

DR. FAUCI SAID THIS WEEK HE WAS WORRIED ABOUT STATES LIKE ALABAMA AND THOSE AT THE BOTTOM OF THE HEAP IN POSSIBLY SEEING AN UPTICK.

WE JUST CAME THROUGH THE MEMORIAL DAY HOLIDAY.

WE MAY SEE AN UPTICK, ALTHOUGH IT MAY NOT BE AKIN TO WHAT WE HAVE SEEN OVER THE LAST YEAR.

>> I THINK THE THING TO WORRY ABOUT THERE IS A MISUNDERSTANDING OF WHAT THE CDC GUIDANCE WAS.

THE CDC GUIDANCE WAS VERY SPECIFIC IN TERMS OF WHEN YOU NEEDED TO WEAR A MASK, WHO NEEDED TO WEAR THAT MASK.

AND IF YOU LOOK AT THAT GUIDANCE, IT WAS REALLY CLEAR.

INDIVIDUALS WHO HAD NOT BEEN VACCINATED, NOTHING CHANGED FOR THEM.

IF THEY GO INTO AN INDOOR AREA, THEY NEED TO STILL WEAR THEIR MASK.

THEY NEED TO MAINTAIN SIX FEET OF SOCIAL DISTANCE.

FOR VIGILS WHO HAVE BEEN VACCINATED, THAT'S WHERE THE CDC SAID YOU DIDN'T HAVE TO WEAR YOUR MASK.

SO, I WORRY THAT THAT COULD BE MISUNDERSTOOD.

I WILL NOT BE SURPRISED TO SEE SOME SLIGHT UPTICK IN CASES AS A RESULT OF MEMORIAL DAY.

HOWEVER, I'M FAIRLY OPTIMISTIC.

WHILE WE HAVE NOT MAYBE DONE AS GOOD OF A JOB IN VACCINATING THE POPULATION AS ANYONE WOULD LIKE, OUR VACCINATION RATES AMONG INDIVIDUALS 65 AND OLDER IS TWO-THIRDS.

THAT WAS THE POPULATION MOST LIKELY TO BE HOSPITALIZED, MOST LIKELY TO HAVE BAD OUTCOMES.

SO I'M FAIRLY OPTIMISTIC THAT IF WE GET AN UPTICK IN CASES WE WILL NOT SEE DRAMATIC HOSPITALIZATIONS.

COULD WE SEE AN INCREASE AMONG YOUNG, HEALTHY PEOPLE?

SURE.

COVID DOES STRANGE THINGS AND SOME YOUNG, HEALTHY PEOPLE HAVE HAD VERY BAD OUTCOMES.

WE COULD SEE AN UPTICK BUT I DON'T THINK WE WILL SEE THE EXPLOSIONS WE SAW AROUND THE FOURTH OF JULY OR THANKSGIVING, CHRISTMAS.

>> WE HAVE SEEN SOME HEADLINES THIS WEEK ABOUT THE POSSIBLE NEED FOR BOOSTER SHOTS COMING UP IN THE FUTURE.

THAT'S ALWAYS BEEN OUT THERE AS A POSSIBILITY.

THE QUESTION WAS HOW SOON AFTER GETTING THE ORIGINAL SHOTS, RIGHT?

>> YEAH.

I THINK IF YOU LOOK AT THE SCIENCE, SOMEWHAT SPECULATIVE STILL.

WE KNOW, BASED ON DATA WE HAVE GOT TO THIS POINT, ABOUT SIX MONTHS WORTH OF DATA THAT ANTIBODIES FOR THE VACCINES REMAIN HIGH, AT LEAST FOR SIX MONTHS.

THE SPECULATION IS IT MAY LAST LONGER.

SO, IF YOU LOOK AT WHY WOULD YOU NEED BOOSTERS, THERE ARE TWO REASONS.

NUMBER ONE, IS IT BECAUSE OF WANING ANTIBODY LEVELS, THE PASSAGE OF TIME, THE IMMUNITY WANES AND YOU NEED A BOOSTER.

WE WILL PROBABLY KNOW THAT BY THE FALL.

THAT IS ONE ISSUE.

THE OTHER IS THE EMERGENCE OF THE VARIANTS.

LIKE WITH THE FLU WE HAVE TO HAVE A DIFFERENT SHOT EVERY YEAR BECAUSE THE VIRUS CHANGES.

WE COULD HAVE A SITUATION WHERE AS THE VIRUS MUTATES IF THE VACCINES WE HAVE CURRENTLY DON'T ADEQUATELY PROTECT AGAINST THAT VARIANT, WE NEED A DIFFERENT VACCINE TO PROVIDE PROTECTION AGAINST THE VARIANT.

WOULD I BE SURPRISED IF WE NEED BOOSTERS?

ABSOLUTELY NOT.

I THINK THE QUESTION IS WHEN AND WHAT TYPE WILL IT BE.

>> FOR THOSE THAT GET FRUSTRATED HEARING US TALK ABOUT BOOSTERS -- BELIEVE ME, IT'S BEEN A YEAR OF FRUSTRATIONS FOR MOST FOLKS WHERE THIS IS CONCERNED, I THINK IT BEARS REPEATING THIS IS STILL A LEARNING CURVE FOR US.

WE HAVE NEVER HAD TO DEAL WITH COVID BEFORE.

>> NO.

LOOK, IT'S ALWAYS FRUSTRATING IN HEALTHCARE WHEN YOU DON'T HAVE ALL OF THE ANSWERS.

THIS IS ONE -- WE DIDN'T EVEN HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT 18 MONTHS AGO.

WE HAD NEVER HEARD OF COVID IN THE HUMAN POPULATION.

YES, THERE WERE CORONAVIRUS CIRCULATING IN BATS.

WE HAD DEALT WITH OTHER CORONAVIRUS ILLNESSES IN HUMANS, SARS, MEDITERRANEAN, RESPIRATORY SYNDROME, BUT IN TERMS OF COVID-19, THAT VIRUS HAD NEVER CIRCULATED IN HUMANS.

SO IT IS AMAZING TO ME WHAT WE HAVE LEARNED IN THE LAST, NOW, 15 MONTHS.

WHAT IS MORE AMAZING IS HOW MUCH THERE WILL BE MORE TO LEARN OVER THE NEXT 15 MONTHS.

WE'LL NOT ONLY LEARN MORE ABOUT THE VIRUS, BUT WE'LL LEARN ABOUT WHAT ARE THE LONG-TERM IMPLICATIONS IN PEOPLE WHO HAVE BEEN INFECTED WITH THE VIRUS?

DO THEY HAVE LONG-TERM HEALTH OUTCOMES.

THOSE WILL BE ISSUES WE WILL BE STUDYING FOR YEARS.

>> COVID WILL PROBABLY BE ONE OF THOSE THINGS WE GET VACCINATED FOR ON A YEARLY BASIS LIKE THE FLU?

>> IT COULD BE OR IT COULD BE THAT, YOU KNOW, IT TURNS OUT OUR IMMUNITY LASTS FOR THREE, FOUR, FIVE, TEN YEARS.

WE DON'T GET A TETANUS VACCINE, FOR EXAMPLE, EVERY YEAR.

WE BOOST IT EVERY TEN YEARS.

WE REALLY DON'T KNOW WHAT FREQUENCY, IF AT ALL, WE WILL NEED BOOSTERS.

I WOULD EXPECT WE WILL BUT WE DON'T HAVE THE SCIENCE YET.

>> DR. DON WILLIAMS, PRESIDENT AND CEO OF THE ALABAMA HOSPITAL ASSOCIATION.

PLEASURE TO HAVE YOU ON THE SHOW.

>> GLAD TO BE HERE.

>> YOU BET.

AND "CAPITOL JOURNAL" WILL BE RIGHT BACK.

>> YOU CAN WATCH PAST EPISODES OF "CAPITOL JOURNAL" ONLINE ANYTIME AT ALABAMA PUBLIC TELEVISION'S WEBSITE APTV.ORG.

CLICK ON THE ONLINE VIDEO TAB ON THE MAIN PAGE.

YOU CAN ALSO CONNECT WITH "CAPITOL JOURNAL" AND LINK TO PAST EPISODES ON "CAPITOL JOURNAL'S" FACEBOOK PAGE.

>> AND THAT'S "CAPITOL JOURNAL" FOR TONIGHT.

COMING UP NEXT FRIDAY NIGHT AT 7:30, WE'LL HAVE THE LATEST FROM THE STATEHOUSE, INCLUDING DETAILS ON A MEETING BETWEEN GOVERNOR KAY IVEY AND LEGISLATIVE LEADERS OVER SALVAGING A PRISON CONSTRUCTION PLAN.

WE'RE SCHEDULED TO BE JOINED BY SENATOR JIM MCCLENDON OF SPRINGVILLE, WHO'LL DISCUSS GAMBLING'S FUTURE LEGISLATIVE PROSPECTS AND HIS DECISION NOT TO SEEK RE-ELECTION NEXT YEAR.

WE'RE ALSO SET TO BE JOINED BY REPRESENTATIVE MERIKA COLEMAN OF PLEASANT GROVE, WHO'LL DISCUSS THE GOVERNOR SIGNING A RESOLUTION SHE SPONSORED THAT WOULD FORM A COMMISSION TO REMOVE RACIST LANGUAGE FROM THE STATE CONSTITUTION.

AND STATE HEALTH OFFICER DR. SCOTT HARRIS WILL RETURN TO DISCUSS THE LATEST ON THE PANDEMIC AND VACCINATIONS.

FOR ALL OF US AT "CAPITOL JOURNAL," THANKS SO MUCH FOR JOINING US.

I'M DON DAILEY.