- Okay, sir.

- Good evening, thank you- - My pleasure.

- ... for all you do at at NPR and at PBS, it means a whole lot to us.

And we've been devotees and in love with your work for such a long time.

As you spoke, I kept on having and being haunted by the words from Cool Hand Luke, "What we have here is a failure to communicate."

You know, that there, to me, there's so much of value that is being put out in the words message, messaging and communication.

Just repeat.

They're on loop.

And I think of who is doing the speaking for you.

You know, who are we looking to, to get the messages across?

And especially in this time of treacherous waters with regard to language, how you navigate that, how you find the spokespeople to do that work.

So I will stop there.

- So whose responsibility is it?

Who should be drafted into service?

'Cause I think what you said about you gotta tell your story is an absolutely certain thing, right?

You've gotta tell your story.

Who should be telling your story?

- Well, I think we for starters have a responsibility to tell our story.

And I'll say something that I think is true of NPR in particular.

I don't know enough about, you know, everybody else in public media, I'll just speak for my own organization.

We, over the years, as we grew and invested and as we were able to bring in additional money to do the work that we do, did the classic thing that all nonprofits do, which is we invested in the mission, we invested in the reporting.

- Yeah.

- And all of that is excellent.

And we did not invest in the infrastructure to support that in a way that would allow us to tell our story.

So if you were to say, I mentioned marketing earlier, what percentage of our budget goes to marketing?

Less than 1%.

- Yeah.

- Right.

And we do almost nothing to support and work with our network of stations, because it's not just about NPR marketing itself, it's how do we support all of public radio?

- [Host] But of course, they're presumably telling their own stories and their- - They are.

- ... in their own communities.

- Absolutely, but we have a story to tell together.

And it doesn't mean that I'm telling somebody else's story for them.

It's how do we tell that story together in a way that's appropriate for the local community that is consistent, right?

It's not like telling one story out of one side of my mouth and another story outta the other side.

But that speaks to the needs of a community and what communities are interested in.

I would love for us to start doing that work.

So us and then, you know, we also, it would be great for us to find ways to be more part of the public conversation.

And what I mean by that is I've mentioned some of the reporting that we do.

I came across a story in a newspaper paper record in which one of our reporters was just listed as a blank reporter as opposed to NPR is such and such reporter.

And it's just interesting to me.

I was like, "Oops, that's a little bit of a," you know, we broke this great story and we didn't even get credit for breaking the story, even though our reporter's name was there.

What they do is there, but their NPR was nowhere to be found.

- Right, okay, hi.

- Oh, you already started answering my question, but I was very curious about what telling your own story looks like and marketing yourself looks like.

Just very curious.

- Oh, yeah, I mean, I think also there's so much cultural relevance to what we do, and we don't necessarily engage with the zeitgeist of cultural relevance either.

We talked almost all exclusively about news today.

We didn't talk at all about Tiny Desk.

I'm here in Austin, right?

We should be talking about music.

I think that there are ways in which there's enormous fan base of young people, not just in this country, but around the world, who love the fact that they find and discover emerging artists is Chappell Roan who has had a runaway gangbuster a year, you know, she was on Tiny Desk before she like, really took off, right?

So what are the ways in which we can maybe be engaging in the zeitgeist and thinking about how we collaborate and partner with other organizations and institutions to help get out the story, not of NPR, but of how important this public infrastructure is for the nation and how it connects us all.

And it celebrates the diversity of our country, but it also connects around the common values we share.

- Well, the thing about the culture piece, I mean, one reason we may not have talked about it today is that the- - Well, the news has been in the news.

- The threat is not over the cultural programming.

- Correct.

- You know, James Comer could care less presumably about Tiny Desk, right?

- I mean, he may be a fan.

- He might.

(audience laughs) He might.

- I bet he's got family members.

- However, there's no accusation of Tiny Desk somehow being anti-American.

- No.

- That's the point, right?

- Where the threat is, is where the threat is.

- Well, there's nothing more American than freedom of the press, so.

- Correct, sir.

- Hi, I wanted to talk a little bit on polarization and the role NPR has on that.

I know recently or in the past decade, more people don't have degrees in America at the end.

Some people do.

So to me, I'm wondering, NPR'S role is to not be biased.

So if just reporting on just stuff that's happening, like, "Oh, we're still being polarized, we're still having this divide."

What message that you've seen in your past year at NPR that makes you reflect on that?

Just to inform of just things that keep happening, keep the separation of the American people?

Or do you think there's something that you should tell the American people while you inform them, like the certain type of language you need to use?

- That's a great question, and two thoughts on that.

One is that when we went out and did audience research with folks across the country, people who knew NPR didn't know NPR people who had college degrees, didn't have college degrees, people who identified every political stripe and color, right?

One of the things we found is that often the tone of the way that we speak is not something that people can relate to.

My favorite example of this is that we asked people to describe what the NPR party sounded like, and people were like, well, people are probably really nice, really nice and really smart, and they speak in hushed tones and they house has mid-century modern furniture and they serve cheese and wine and there's probably no beer at the NPR party.

And it ends early.

And I went, "I love beer and I like a good party."

But actually the thing that also broke my heart was that one of the people who we interviewed said, "And I don't think I'm invited to be a guest.

I think I'd be working there."

(audience gasps) And I thought.

- Yeah.

- Ugh.

And that to me feels like a question of tone.

And that to me feels like an approachability question.

The other thing that you sort of touched on that you didn't speak to directly, but it made me think of something that I often think about is when we started doing research about college-educated Americans, that's great.

That's a wonderful cohort of our fellow, you know, citizens and also education levels of attainment today, although this was not true 20 or 30 years ago, correlate very highly with political belief.

And so while that was not true when we started doing that research, it is true today.

And my view is that, you know, it may also be that we have had movements that are independent of our reporting and are much more about changes in the body politic as a whole for the nation.

And so it's really important that we are attuned to that.

And, you know, I think that's why it's so critical that we're out there doing this research and thinking about how we speak to people and who's invited to the NPR party.

- Thank you.

- Thank you for your question.

It can't come as a surprise to you that some people may perceive NPR to be for elites.

- It doesn't come as a surprise to me.

- Yeah, I mean the finding in that research seems to comport with what the, at least the rap is or the stereotype is.

- It doesn't, but I also really don't want to buy into that stereotype either, because we hear from people all across the nation of all different backgrounds, all colors of the collar who listen to NPR, who like NPR who feel connected to public radio and who view it as valuable in their lives and in their communities, especially young people who will often tell you, "That I learned something that I didn't get to learn at school.

I connected to an idea that wasn't close to my hometown or my community."

So I really don't wanna like, it's important to acknowledge, but it's also not important not to buy into the idea that there's truth in that.

- Well, that's the story that you have to tell.

- That's absolutely right?

- That's the story.

Ma'am.

- Hi, thank you.

I'm from Austin, but I- - [Catherine] Thank you for getting out.

- Just take a moment.

- Take a moment.

You're totally good.

- I'm a survivor of Helene the hurricane.

- I'm so sorry.

- And I will say if it wasn't for NPR, there would've been many more lives lost.

It was our lifeline.

And so I am so fearful of us losing this wonderful resource.

And are there plans to maybe gather some of the heads of the areas to maybe do national fundraising to keep this light alive?

- This is through the emergency.

What exactly did they do?

- NPR station was the very first communications our community had, right?

- Was this Blue Ridge Public Radio?

- Yes.

- They're incredible.

- And they slept in studios.

- Yeah, yeah.

- We had to hike food and water to them, because they didn't wanna leave.

- Yeah.

- I mean, it was invaluable.

- Yeah, yeah, yeah.

- And so I am just terrified of losing this resource.

I don't think when you're speaking about rural communities, I don't think that the national public really realizes how it does save lives.

And it wasn't just for either side of the party, it was for everyone.

And so I just would love to be more involved and see what we can do about raising more funds nationally to keep everyone going.

But I was, are y'all planning maybe doing a conference of programmers and everything from across the country to try to strategize a fundraising effort?

- I will first of all, just thank you so much for standing up and I can't even imagine.

I've seen photographs from my colleagues at Blue Ridge Public Radio and I just, everyone who made sure that the community came together to support not just the station, but one another.

It truly remarkable.

And I think that if there's anything that's true for me and my values, it's fairness, but it's also belief in humanity.

And it is so clear in moments of crisis and disaster that one value that this our nation has is we support each other in those moments.

And so I'm just so glad that we were able to be there for you and thank you for being here today for us.

We are indeed talking with all of our colleagues across our stations about what the appropriate approach is right now.

We don't want to be overly, we don't want to take advantage of a moment that is a really serious moment, right?

And what I mean by that is you don't wanna go out and sort of bang the drum around fundraising when in reality what we really want to do is preserve public support, because that's the most important thing.

But we are of course thinking about how do we support stations and how do we think about what does it mean vis-a-vis stations with fewer resources, the next generation warning system, which is a big part.

I know you didn't, you were talking about the community component, the way that we were speaking to each other, but there's also a public safety component and absolutely that's one of the things we talk about with Congress all the time.

Public radio is part and public radio, public television too we're part of the state emergency plans in more than half the states across the country.

And there's been a big investment in that.

I mentioned the 60 million in infrastructure investment.

That's a big piece of it.

And so it's easy to say, of course, you know, but we have all these other options and we've got the internet and, you know, and so on and so forth.

But when the internet is down and electricity is down, and you know, cell phone services are down, there's radio.

And I joke about the fact that, you know, you don't necessarily wanna be known as the technology that comes on in the disaster movies when, you know, the world is ending.

- Right.

- But also, we are the first technology that connected this country in national conversation and we are here today to do the same.

And that sometimes that's at the scale of a community and sometimes it's at the scale of a nation.

And I think it's really important we protect that.

- You alluded to the idea that, well, you know, we don't wanna go around and do fundraising in this moment necessarily.

We wanna preserve the public money.

But you understand that a time may come and it may come soon.

- Yeah, we do.

- When they pull the rug out from under you on funding at the national level, and you have to go around with your cup and say to communities, if you do value this, I mean the money could conceivably be...

I was so surprised when I saw 121 million.

- I always like to say it's a lot of money.

It's not a lot of money.

- It's not that, but it's also not that much money.

And the fact is- - But it's people's jobs.

So it is a lot, it is a lot of money.

- But you could go around the country and raise money to replace the money that you're losing at the federal level.

And by the way, in the process, untether yourself from the government.

So that the vagaries of an election outcome don't necessarily put you at risk.

There could be a value in that.

- There could.

- Yeah, you don't wanna get to that point though.

- You don't wanna get to that point.

- I understand.

- Yeah, as a veteran and a firm PBS supporter never misses, I was just amazed to find out the impact you had on saving veterans mortgages.

I think you'd really need to do a better job of patting yourself on the back a little bit.

- Thank you.

- Because I mean, the fundraising where you have all the, you know, very nice people are very good.

If you'd have had two veterans out there that said, "PBS helped save my home," you're gonna get some people very, very interested.

- There's that kind of story right there, right?

Good suggestion, thank you.

- Thank you.

And I will let our veterans reporter- - [Host] We'll take one more, Steve, is that right?

- ... know that you expressed your support.

- [Host] Last one, sir.

- Thank you so much for coming.

This is a very big deal.

And so appreciate you gracing us.

My big question, I guess is media literacy.

We talked a little bit about it in a bunch of different ways today, but I was curious about not everybody knows the difference between a story and a blog or a op-ed or it's an opinion piece.

- Yeah, right.

- Or it's like an editorial.

And I was curious, it's like about we have the media landscape, which talks about content.

And, but there's kind of hard to kind of discern.

It's like, what does it take to kinda get something to air or to print?

And I was curious, it's like, about how do you tell that story in addition to all the other stories that you're telling?

- Yeah, I have to say, yesterday during the hearing when you talked about editorial standards- - Yes.

- And Chairman Comer said, "Wait a minute, you do editorials?"

(audience laughs) And I was like, "Oh, oh, oh no."

I mean, it could be hard at all levels- - It is.

- ... for people to understand the terms we use to talk about our work.

- Also, did you know op-ed is not opinion editorial, it's opposite the editorial page.

I mean just, we did this to ourselves people- - [Host] We did this to ourselves.

- ... we did this to ourselves.

Yes, the media literacy thing is very real.

It's a real challenge.

I also think very often we respond to questions of media literacy in ways that I find kind of patronizing.

And I think that that is also a bit of a problem.

I always go back to this story and it is not apocryphal.

I know it's real.

I just don't know the details of where and when it happened.

But I think it was NPR with one of our member stations hosted an event, not unlike this, with a lot of folks in a room who are big public media supporters.

And they walked through some tricky stories and they asked the audience to engage, how would you have done X, Y, and Z?

How would you have handled this, that, and the other?

And it was, everybody who attended that said it was one of the best events they'd ever been to.

They understood so much more about the way that journalism is made, the choices, the trade-offs, the editorial standards.

I always like to say journalism is actually in a remarkably self-regulating industry.

Good journalists, everybody knows and respects them and bad journalists, everybody knows and does not respect them.

And those folks don't tend to keep working at good organizations, right?

The public doesn't know that, there's no Hippocratic Oath.

We don't talk about that.

There's no bar that we can look to in terms of, you know, different professions with professional standards.

So I think about we have a real responsibility, not to educate in as in talking down to, but to really open our doors.

Sorry, I promise I'm almost done.

I have one last thought.

- No, it's all right.

- I think about public libraries and in my previous work I used to work a lot with public libraries and they are just, they are places where everyone walks in and understands how the whole thing works.

Maybe not the Dewey decimal system, but everything else, right?

That's why we have librarians.

I was at our offices at NPR and I came down one day early in my time there and there was a young woman who had come in and was asking the guards if she could go on, she'd come to DC she to see all of our national institutions and she wanted to come see public radio.

And there was nowhere that we could bring her in to show her, because we are not open to the public and in the way that libraries for example are.

And it is true too of our, most of our stations also don't have that.

And it's because people are busy and they're doing their jobs and they're reporting and they're on deadline.

And I get it, I really do, I really get it.

I think some of the things that other media organizations, I actually really respect some of the things that New York Times has been doing about putting faces and voices and behind the story.

I'd love, you know, guts me that it was them, not us, but like, hey, you know the, what is it artist, great idea.

Bad artist borrow and great artist steal or something, right?

So anyway, my view is that we have to not tell our story to people, but show our story to people.

And there's a lot of work to do there.

- Yeah, all right.

Give Catherine Moore a big hand.

Thank you so much for being here.

(audience applauds) Thanks.

Thanks all of you, we'll see soon.