♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ >> Renee: GOOD EVENING, WELCOME TO KENTUCKY TONIGHT.

I'M RENEE SHAW.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR JOINING US.

OUR TOPIC TONIGHT.

WORK SHIFTS.

AS THE PANDEMIC EASES, MILLIONS OF AMERICANS ARE RETHINKING WHERE THEY WORK, HOW THEY WORK AND WHAT THEY WANT OUT OF WORK.

MEANWHILE, BUSINESSES ARE FACING HIRING CHALLENGES AS THEY SEEK TO KEEP PACE WITH THE ECONOMIC RECOVERY.

THERE IS DISAGREEMENT ABOUT HOW TO SOLVE THAT PROBLEM WITH SOME SAYING IT'S TIME TO END ADDITIONAL UNEMPLOYMENT BENEFITS.

AND OTHERS SAYING IT'S JUST NOT ABOUT THE MONEY.

LAST THURSDAY, GOVERNOR ANDY BESHEAR ANNOUNCED HIS SOLUTION TO INCENTIVIZE A RETURN TO WORK.

>> I'VE SET ASIDE $22.5 MILLION IN CORONAVIRUS RELIEF FUNDS IN ORDER TO PROVIDE A ONE-TIME $1500 PAYMENT TO THE FIRST 15,000 UNEMPLOYMENT INSURANCE CLAIMANTS WHO RETURN TO WORK BY JULY 30 AND WHO QUALIFY FOR THE INCENTIVE.

NOW I'M GOING TO BREAK DOWN SOME OF THE QUALIFICATIONS ON THAT BECAUSE WE ARE TRYING TO MEET THE CHALLENGE.

AND THAT IS IT NEEDS TO BE INDIVIDUALS WHO ARE CURRENTLY RECEIVING THAT $300 BENEFIT OR ONE LIKE IT AND THAT DON'T ALREADY HAVE A RETURN TO WORK DATE; THAT WE ARE TRULY INCENTIVIZING TO GET BACK INTO THE WORKFORCE.

SO IN ORDER TO QUALIFY, YOU HAVE TO BE 18 YEARS OF AGE.

YOU'VE GOT TO BE AN UNEMPLOYED KENTUCKY RESIDENT AS OF YESTERDAY, JUNE 24, 2021.

HAVE YOU TO HAVE AN ACTIVE NON-FRAUDULENT KENTUCKY UNEMPLOYMENT INSURANCE CLAIM AS OF JULY 23, 2021 AND HAVE REQUESTED PAYMENTS FOR WEEKS IN 2021.

YOU HAVE TO BE EMPLOYED TO GET THIS BY A KENTUCKY BUSINESS.

AGAIN, YOU HAVE TO START SOMETIME BETWEEN JUNE 24 AND JULY 30, 2021.

MOST IMPORTANTLY, YOU GOT TO BE AMONG THE FIRST 15,000 THAT ACCEPT THEIR EMPLOYMENT AND THAT WE ARE ABLE TO VERIFY TO PROVIDE AND THAT VERIFICATION WILL OCCUR BETWEEN AUGUST 1 AND OCTOBER 1 IN ORDER TO RECEIVE THESE DOLLARS.

>> Renee: BUT THAT PLAN WAS IMMEDIATELY DENOUNCED BY HOUSE SPEAKER DAVID OSBOURNE, A REPUBLICAN, WHO CALLED IT A CLASSIC GOVERNMENT SOLUTION AND AN INSULT TO PEOPLE WHO WORKED THROUGH THE PANDEMIC.

A STATEMENT RELEASED THURSDAY READS IN PART: NOT ONLY IS PAYING PEOPLE $1500 TO GET A JOB EXTREMELY INSULTING TO THOSE WHO WORKED THROUGHOUT THE PANDEMIC.

IT DEFIES LOGIC THAT THEY WOULD CHOOSE TO DO SO AS LONG AS THE ADDITIONAL FEDERAL PAYMENTS ARE AVAILABLE.

THIS IS A CLASSIC GOVERNMENT SOLUTION TO A REAL WORLD PROBLEM AND PROBLEMATIC ON MANY LEVELS.

THE FACT THERE ARE MORE THAN 100,000 AVAILABLE JOBS, MANY OF WHICH ALREADY OFFER STARTING BONUSES, SHOULD SERVE AS PLENTY OF INCENTIVE WITHOUT A ONE-TIME PAYMENT.

THIS IS JUST ANOTHER EXAMPLE OF STATE GOVERNMENT USING TAXPAYER DOLLARS TO PICK WINNERS AND LOSERS.

SO FOR MORE OPINIONS ON THIS AND WORKPLACE SHIFTS, WE ARE JOINED IN OUR LEXINGTON STUDIO BY CAITLIN BLAIR, POLITICAL AND COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR FOR THE UNITED FOOD AND COMMERCIAL LOCAL 227.

BETH DAVISSON, VICE PRESIDENT OF WORKFORCE DEVELOPMENT FOR THE KENTUCKY CHAMBER OF COMMERCE, KENNETH TROSKE, PROFESSOR IN THE GALLTI COLLEGE.

AND MIKE CLARK, CENTER FOR BUSINESS RESEARCH IN AT THE UNIVERSITY OF KENTUCKY.

AND JOINING US BY SKYPE IS CYNTHIA KNAPEK, PRESIDENT OF THE LEADERSHIP LOUISVILLE CENTER.

WELL, WELCOME TO ALL OF OUR GUESTS.

WE APPRECIATE YOU ALL BEING HERE TO TALK ABOUT THIS VERY TIMELY AND CRITICAL ISSUE.

SO I WANT TO GO RIGHT TO THE RESPONSE TO THE GOVERNOR'S ACTIONS ON THURSDAY.

WE ARE TAPING THIS PROGRAM ON FRIDAY.

SO BETH DAVISSON, I WANT TO GO RIGHT TO YOU.

DO YOU AGREE WITH THE GOVERNOR'S ACTIONS?

THE KENTUCKY CHAMBER HAS ISSUED STATEMENTS BEFORE THAT THERE ARE 112,000 KENTUCKIANS WHO LEFT THE WORKFORCE DURING THE PANDEMIC AND OF WHOM HAVE NOT RETURNED.

DO YOU THINK THIS WILL GET THE JOB DONE?

>> WE ARE IN A DIRE SITUATION IN KENTUCKY.

I THINK WHAT WE HAVE TO BE VERY HONEST ABOUT IS THAT WE HAVE THE SECOND SMALLEST AVAILABLE WORKFORCE IN OUR NATION.

AND SO WHEN YOU LOOK AT A PROBLEM THAT SIZE, WHERE OUR WORKFORCE PARTICIPATION RATE IS 48th IN THE NATION.

OUR WORKERS ARE RETURNING BACK ON THE JOB AT SLOWER PACES THAN THE REST OF THE COUNTRY.

AND OUR BUSINESSES ARE DESPERATE FOR WORKERS.

WE HAVE TO GET OUR WORKERS BACK AND TO DO THAT WE HAVE TO THINK ABOUT A MULTIFACETED APPROACH.

IS THERE WON'T BE ONE ACTION THAT CAN FIX THIS.

I MEAN WE HOPE AND ARE ENCOURAGED THAT A RETURN TO WORK INCENTIVE CAN HELP.

BUT WE ALSO HAVE TO THINK ABOUT PHASING OUT THE U.I.

BENEFITS WHEN IT COMES TIME AND ANOTHER BIG ISSUE WE NEED TO CONSIDER AND TALK ABOUT AND FIX IS CHILD CARE.

AND I KNOW WE SAW MORE SUPPORT GOING TOWARDS THAT FROM THE GOVERNOR YESTERDAY BUT CHILD CARE REMAINS A KEY, KEY USUAL.

AND SO WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT WORKFORCE PARTICIPATION, CHILD CARE, LEVELING OFF THOSE BENEFITS, WE ARE ALSO LOOKING AT BIG SITUATIONS WITH, YOU KNOW, WHAT WE ARE CALLING THE GREAT RESIGNATION.

THE QUITTERS.

I MEAN NEARLY FOUR MILLION PEOPLE IN AMERICAS HAVE QUIT THEIR JOBS AND THAT'S ALG ALL TIME HIGH.

SO WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT THIS, IT'S NOT ONE THING THAT IS GOING TO FIX THIS.

WE HAVE TO GO AT THIS WITH GUSTO AND USE EVERYTHING WE CAN TO HELP WITH CHILD CARE ISSUES AND THINKING ABOUT GETTING WORKERS BACK.

>> Renee: WE ARE GOING TO DRILL DOWN TO EACH OF THOSE.

WE KNOW THERE IS A PARADIGM SHIFT AND MAYBE A WORKER REVOLUTION IN SOME WAYS.

CAITLIN BLAIR, IT'S GOOD TO HAVE YOU BACK.

IT'S BEEN A WHILE.

FROM A UNION PERSPECTIVE AND FROM A LABOR PERSPECTIVE, WHEN YOU HEAR WHAT THE GOVERNOR HAS DONE THAT RESEMBLES WHAT OTHER STATES HAVE DONE: I BELIEVE COLORADO RECENTLY ANNOUNCED A SIMILAR PROGRAM BUT $1600.

DO YOU THINK THAT'S THE RIGHT INCENTIVE AT THE RIGHT TIME?

>> YOU KNOW, I AGREE WITH BETH THAT THIS IS SOMETHING THAT'S GOING TO TAKE A LOT OF DIFFERENT SOLUTIONS TO SOLVE.

AND I BELIEVE AT THAT PRESS CONFERENCE, THE GOVERNOR SAID THIS IS NOT MEANT TO BE A SILVER BULLET.

YOU KNOW, THE REALITY IS THAT IN MARCH OF 2020, WE LOOKED AT LOW WAGE WORKERS AND WE SAID WHAT YOU DO IS SO IMPORTANT TO THE SURVIVAL OF OUR COMMUNITIES, WE ARE GOING TO ASK YOU TO RISK YOUR HEALTH AND RISK THE HEALTH OF THE PEOPLE THAT LIVE WITH YOU, THE ONES THAT YOU LOVE, BECAUSE WE NEED YOU TO GO TO WORK.

AND WE ARE ASKING PEOPLE TO RETURN TO THOSE VERY SECTORS.

BUT WE ARE ASKING THEM TO RETURN AT NINE AND $10 AN HOUR AND IN A POST-COVID ECONOMY, THAT'S JUST NOT GOING TO WORK.

BUT YOU KNOW THERE ARE MULTIPLE FACTORS HERE THAT PEOPLE SAY THEY'RE STAYING HOME FROM.

U.S. CENSUS DATA TELLS US IN THE FIRST QUARTER OF 2021, IN THE STATE OF KENTUCKY, THE NUMBER ONE REASON THAT PEOPLE AREN'T COMING BACK TO WORK IS BECAUSE THEY'RE SICK OR THEY'RE DISABLED AND IT'S NOT RELATED TO CORONAVIRUS.

TO BETH'S POINT, NUMBER 2, IT'S CHILD CARE.

SO IF YOU DON'T HAVE CERTAIN THINGS-- IF YOU DON'T HAVE THE WAGES, IF YOU DON'T HAVE CHILD CARE, IF YOU DON'T HAVE SUPPORT FOR YOUR HEALTH AND THE HEALTH OF THOSE THAT YOU LOVE, IF YOU DON'T HAVE VACCINES, THEN YOU ARE NOT WORK READY.

AND THOSE ARE ALL BIG ISSUES.

SOME OF THEM WERE HERE BEFORE COVID AND THEY'RE MADE WORSE BY COVID AND ALL OF THAT STUFF IS WHAT WE ARE GOING TO HAVE TO LOOK AT TO SOLVE THIS PROBLEM TOGETHER.

>> Renee: YOUR PERSPECTIVE, IT WOULDN'T TAKE AN EXTRA $5 AN HOUR TO GET PEOPLE BACK.

IT'S ALL THESE OTHER THINGS THAT COMPOUND THE ISSUE OF BEING WORK READY AS YOU SEE IT.

>> DEFINITELY.

IT COSTS MONEY TO HAVE A JOB.

TRANSPORTATION, OR PAYING FOR CHILD CARE.

IT COSTS MONEY TO HAVE A JOB.

SO WE ARE GOING TO HAVE TO FIGURE OUT A LOT OF THE BIG ISSUES TOGETHER.

>> Renee: PROFESSOR TROSKE, THERE EVERYBODY REPUBLICAN VOICES THAT SAY THE U.I.

PAYMENTS ARE DETERRING PEOPLE FROM GETTING BACK TO WORK.

FROM A RESEARCH PERSPECTIVE AND WHAT YOU HAVE READ, SEEN AND STUDIES, IS THAT TRUE?

DOES IT HAVE A SUBSTANTIAL IMPACT ON WHETHER PEOPLE RETURN TO WORK?

>> SO WHAT I'VE SEEN FROM A RESEARCH STANDPOINT IS THERE IS SOME EFFECT, AND WE'VE SEEN STUDIES BOTH BEFORE THE PANDEMIC AND AFTER THE PANDEMIC THAT WHEN YOU PAY PEOPLE ADDITIONAL MONEY TO STAY HOME, GO FIGURE IT OUT, THEY STAY HOME.

WHEN YOU PAY PEOPLE TO DO THINGS THEY OFTEN DO THAT.

THE QUESTION IS HOW BIG OF AN EFFECT IT IS.

WE KNOW THAT THESE BENEFITS WILL END IN OCTOBER.

IF YOU'VE GOT A CHANCE TO GET A JOB NOW THAT YOU THINK IS GOING TO LAST MORE THAN OCTOBER AND IT HAS HEALTH BENEFITS AND SOME OTHER THINGS THAT YOU THINK ARE VALUABLE, YOU ARE PROBABLY GOING TO TAKE IT.

IF IT PAYS ENOUGH, YOU ARE PROBABLY GOING TO TAKE IT.

I THINK IT HAS A DETERRENT EFFECT.

THE QUESTION IS HOW BIG IS THAT DETERRENT EFFECT.

I'LL ECHO THE OTHER TWO AS WELL.

A LOT OF ISSUES.

ONE THING WE CONTINUE TO SEE IS THE PEOPLE MOST AFFECTED, ONE GROUP THAT WAS STRONGLY AFFECTED BY THE PANDEMIC WERE WOMEN.

THEY LEFT THE LABOR MARKET IN LARGE NUMBERS.

WHY?

BECAUSE IN OUR SOCIETY, THEY'RE STILL THE PRIMARY CAREGIVERS IN SOCIETY.

WE COULD HAVE A LONG CONVERSATION ABOUT WHY THAT, BUT THEY ARE.

SO THEY TAKE CARE OF THE YOUNG AND THE ELDERLY AND THERE WERE ELDERLY FOLKS GETTING SICK AND SCHOOLS WERE CLOSED AND DAYCARE WAS CLOSED.

AND THAT STILL REMAINS THE CASE FOR A LOT OF WOMEN WE HAVE EVEN MIEF HIVE WE HAVE NOT SEEN THE REBOUND OF WOMEN COMING BACK IN THE LABOR MARKET THERE.

WAS A SPIKE IN RETIREMENTS OVER THIS TIME PERIOD.

YOU ARE 50 SOMETHING YEARS OLD, YOUR HEALTH MIGHT BE THREATENED OR YOU ARE 60, NOW MIGHT SEEM LIKE A GOOD TIME TO RETIRE, ESPECIALLY WHEN THE STOCK MARKET HAS GONE UP AS MUCH AS IT HAS.

SO I THINK THERE ARE A LOT OF THINGS-- AND PEOPLE WERE TOLD THERE WERE A LARGE NUMBER OF PEOPLE WHO WERE TOLD, I MEAN EVERY DAY THE GOVERNOR GOT UP FOR A LONG PERIOD OF TIME AND SAID YOU ARE IN DANGER OF GETTING SICK AND DYING IF YOU TRAVEL OR DO OTHER THINGS.

SO WE SCARE PEOPLE INTO STAYING HOME AND WE PAID PEOPLE TO STAY HOME.

AND SO NOW, TO THINK THAT ALL OF A SUDDEN PEOPLE ARE GOING CHANGE THEIR MIND TO COME BACK, WHEN, FOR THE BETTER PART OF A YEAR, THEY HAVE BEEN TOLD DON'T GO OUT, DON'T GO ANYWHERE.

IT'S A LOT TO OVERCOME.

IT DOESN'T HAVE TO BE A LOT OF PEOPLE, EITHER.

OUR LABOR FORCE PARTICIPATION RATED RIGHT NOW IS 60%.

IT WAS 63% BACK IN JANUARY OF 2020.

YOU KNOW, 70 OR EIGHT MILLION PEOPLE OUT OF A TOTAL OF 160 MILLION, THAT'S WHAT WE ARE LOOKING AT.

IT'S HARD TO SAY EXACTLY WHAT THE BIGGEST IMPACT IS.

WHAT ONE THING YOU WOULD ADDRESS.

MY OWN OPINION IS I THINK HELPING CHILD CARE WILL HAVE A BIGGER IMPACT GETTING PEOPLE BACK INTO THE LABOR MARKET THAN $1500.

AND SO I THINK THAT'S A BIGGER IMPACT.

BUT, YOU KNOW, THE EXTENDED BENEFITS CERTAINLY HAS HAD AN EFFECT.

HOW LARGE?

HARD TO SAY.

BUT IT CERTAINLY HAS.

>> Renee: PROFESSOR CLARK TO YOU BECAUSE I KNOW HAVE YOU WORKED WITH THE CHAMBER IN PRODUCING THESE QUARTERLY REPORTS DURING THE PANDEMIC ABOUT THE ECONOMIC RECOVERY AND SO I WANT TO GET YOUR PERSPECTIVE ABOUT THIS.

ARE WE LOOKING AT A YOLO, YOU ONLY LIVE ONCE EFFECT, PEOPLE TAKING EARLY RETIREMENTS.

MAYBE THEY HAD A WHOLE YEAR TO SAVE AND THEY'RE REEVALUATING AND REPRIORITIZING.

WHAT ELSE ARE WE MISSING IN THIS CONVERSATION?

>> AS HAS BEEN STATED HERE SEVERAL TIMES, YOU KNOW, THERE ARE SEVERAL REASONS WHY PEOPLE HAVE LEFT THE LABOR FORCE AND ARE NOT COMING BACK.

CERTAINLY INCENTIVES MATTERS IN THIS SITUATION AND WE ARE SEEING SOME INCENTIVES BEING OFFERED IN THE FORM OF HIGHER WAGES.

AND THAT'S STILL NOT REALLY ATTRACTING ENOUGH WORKERS TO FILL THE VACANCIES THAT WE HAVE.

SO CERTAINLY INCENTIVES MATTER AND THAT IS PLAYING A ROLE.

BUT WE DO SEE, YOU KNOW, THAT WORKERS ARE LOOKING AT THE SITUATION VERY DIFFERENTLY.

YOU KNOW, WITH EARLY RETIREES, YOU KNOW, YOU ARE SEEING A LOT OF PEOPLE, ESPECIALLY HERE IN KENTUCKY THAT ARE LOOKING AT THE SITUATION THINKING OKAY, IF I HAVE LOST MY JOB AND I'M MAYBE IN MY LATE 50s, WHAT DO I COME BACK TO?

IF MY JOB NO, SIR LONGER THERE, IF-- IF MY JOB IS NO LONGER THERE, I I HAVE TO RETRAIN.

THERE MAY NOT BE A LONG TIME TO GET A RETURN ON THEIR INVESTMENT.

THEY'RE SEEING THEMSELVES IN A SITUATION WHERE THE RETURNS TO STAY IN THE LABOR FORCE ARE NOT AS HIGH.

THEY'RE RECOGNIZING THIS WAS A DISEASE THAT MAYBE THEY MAY BE A LITTLE MORE SUSCEPTIBLE TO BEING OLDER.

SO FEARS OF GOING BACK TO WORK COULD POTENTIALLY BE AN ISSUE THERE AS WELL.

OUR ECONOMY CAN'T MAINTAIN IN THAT TYPE OF SITUATION WE TEND TO SEE RETIREES INCREASE IN RECESSIONS ALL THE TIME.

BUT ALSO IT JUST SEEMED THAT THE STOCK MARKET DID REALLY, REALLY WELL DURING THIS TIME PERIOD SO A LOT OF PEOPLE WHO MAY HAVE BEEN LOOKING AT THE SITUATION, THINKING ABOUT, YOU KNOW, DO I GO AHEAD AND RETIRE EARLY, MIGHT HAVE FOUND THEMSELVES IN A FINANCIAL SITUATION WHERE THEY COULD AFFORD TO DO THAT.

SO I THINK WE HAD A LOT OF THINGS BREAK IN SUCH A WAY THAT IT REALLY DID ENCOURAGE PEOPLE TO REASSESS THEIR EMPLOYMENT SITUATION DID THEY REALLY WANT TO CONTINUE WORKING OR WAS THIS AN OPPORTUNE TIME TO PULL OUT OF THE LABOR FORCE AND THESE WORKERS MAY NOT COME BACK.

SOME OF THEM WILL, BUT MANY OF THEM ARE LIKELY NOT TO RETURN TO THE LABOR FORCE.

AND AS A RESULT, WE MAY NOT HAVE THE SAME TYPE OF LABOR FORCE THAT WE HAD PRIOR TO THE PANDEMIC.

>> RIGHT.

AND I WANT TO GET TO A POINT THAT PROFESSOR TROSKE MADE, THERE WAS 63 PS-- 63% LABOR PARTICIPATION.

IS THAT A SIGNIFICANT ENOUGH NUMBER WHERE WE ARE SAYING THERE IS A LABOR SHORTAGE.

WE HEAR BUSINESSES CAN'T FIND ENOUGH WORKERS AND ALL OF THOSE DIFFERENT THINGS.

IS THAT A NARRATIVE WE ARE BUYING INTO WITHOUT SUBSTANTIAL EVIDENCE THAT THERE IS REALLY A WORKER SHORTAGE AT PLAY HERE?

>> THE THING ABOUT WORKER SHORTAGES IS THOUGHT OF IN A DIFFERENT WAY THAN A LOT OF OTHER PEOPLE.

WE THINK ABOUT SHORTAGES AS SOMETHING THAT THE MARKET WORKS THROUGH.

IF THERE IS A LABOR SHORTAGE, YOU CAN'T FIND ENOUGH WORKERS, THEN WHAT IS LIKELY TO HAPPEN THAT EMPLOYEES WILL RECOGNIZE THAT TO ATTRACT THE WORKERS THEY WANT, THEY HAVE TO IMPROVE THE COMPENSATION PACKAGE, WAGES, WORKING CONDITIONS, BENEFITS.

THEY HAVE TO CHANGE THAT TO BE ABLE TO COMPETE FOR THESE WORKERS.

AND SO AS A RESULT, YOU KNOW, WE SHOULD SEE THESE SHORTAGES CLEAR RELATIVELY QUICKLY.

IF THEY MAKE THE CHANGES.

BUT IT MAY TAKE A WHILE FOR US TO SEE THAT PARTIALLY BECAUSE THERE MAY BE TRAINING ISSUES.

YOU MAY NOT BE ABLE TO JUST GET TRAINED WORKERS INTO YOUR PARTICULAR POSITION.

SO, YOU KNOW, WE DO HAVE THESE LABOR SHORTAGE ISSUES.

THAT'S CERTAINLY AN ISSUE THAT WE HAVE THERE.

>> KEEP IN MIND, JANUARY OF 2020, FARMERS WERE SCREAMING ABOUT NOT BEING ABLE TO HIRE WORKERS, FOR THE FIRST TIME SINCE THE GREAT RECESSION.

WE WERE SEEING INCREASES IN WAGES, TO BE ABLE TO ATTRACT PEOPLE INTO THE LABOR MARKET AND FIRMS BEING CONCERNED ABOUT HOLDING ON TO PEOPLE, LEAVING FOR AN EXTRA QUARTER AN HOUR AND WAGES STARTING TO GO UP.

SO THEN WE SHUT DOWN THE ECONOMY.

WE ARE STARTING IT UP REALLY QUICKLY BUT WE HAVE SOME OF THE SAME PROBLEMS BUT MAYBE EXAS PAY THE-- EXACERBATED.

THIS IS A CONTINUATION OF WHAT WE WERE SEEING BEFORE.

IT HAS PROBABLY BEEN PUSHED A LITTLE HARDER BECAUSE OF AND-- AND A LOT OF INDUSTRIES THAT ARE STRUGGLING, THEY SHUT DOWN, GOT RID OF A LOT OF WORKERS AND THEN THEY FIGURED OUT, YOU KNOW, TAKEOUT IS GOING TO WORK.

SO THEY BROUGHT SOME OF THEM BACK BUT NOT ALL OF THEM, RIGHT?

SO THE WORKERS THAT WEREN'T BROUGHT BACK THAT NEEDED TO WORK, THEY HAD TO FIND SOMETHING ELSE AND THEY FOUND ANOTHER JOB.

SO IT'S THOSE INDUSTRIES THAT ARE REALLY SUFFERING.

>> Renee: I WANT TO COME BACK TO THAT POINT BUT I WANT TO BRING IN CYNTHIA KNAPEK JOINING US VIA SKYPE.

GOOD TO SEE YOU CYNTHIA.

THANK YOU FOR BEING WITH US.

JUST YOUR TAKE ON WHERE THE CONVERSATION IS RIGHT NOW WHEN YOU HEAR ABOUT LABOR SHORTAGES AND WHEN YOU HEAR ABOUT WORKFORCE PARTICIPATION AND MAYBE THESE CHANGING DYNAMICS IN WORK, CULTURE AND EXPECTATION WHAT COMES TO YOUR MIND?

>> YOU KNOW, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT LEADERSHIP OF LOUISVILLE CENTER DOES IS WE TEACH FOLKS ABOUT CIVIC LEADERSHIP AND HOW WE ALL COME TOGETHER TO SOLVE BIG PROBLEMS.

AND I LOVE WHAT MY FELLOW PANELISTS WERE SAYING ABOUT MULTIFACETS BECAUSE CLEARLY IT IS.

IT IS A COMPLEX CHALLENGE THAT WE NEED TO FIGHT ON LOTS OF DIFFERENT FRONTS, RIGHT?

ONE OF THE THINGS THAT IS KIND OF IN OUR FOUNDATION IS WE TALK TO CIVIC LEADERS, WE TALK TO THEM ABOUT IF YOU ARE GOING TO PLAN AN INTERVENTION AND TRY TO DRIVE CHANGE, THEN FOCUS ROOT CAUSE.

FOLLOW THIS PROBLEM UPSTREAM AND SEE IF YOU CAN WORK THERE.

WE ALSO TALKED TO THEM ABOUT INCENTIVIZING THE BEHAVIOR THAT WE WANT TO REWARD.

SO I DO THINK THAT THERE IS A LOT OF STUDYING THAT WE CAN DO, WHAT INTERVENTIONS WE NEED TO BE FOCUSED ON.

I'M GOING TO MENTION ONE WE HAVEN'T TALKED ABOUT YET BECAUSE I DO AGREE WITH THE THINGS WE HAVE DISCUSSED IF WE ARE GOING TO LOOK AT ROOT CAUSE, BIG ONES ARE CHILD CARE, RIGHT?

ESPECIALLY FOR WORKING MOMS.

WE KNOW THAT FOR SURE.

BUT I ALSO THINK THAT IF WE WANT TO MAKE-- WE NEED TO MAKE BUSINESSES, ORGANIZATIONS THE PLACES THAT THE WE WANT TO GO.

SO IF WE WANT TO REWARD THE BEHAVIOR THAT WE WANT, THEN REWARDING BUSINESSES WHO KIND OF FOLLOW THOSE MANTRAS OF GREAT PLACES TO WORK.

WOE KNOW THE ANSWER TO THE QUESTIONS.

THE GALLUP, DELOITTE, ALL THE BIG RESEARCH CENTERS HAVE BEEN MAPPING FOR US, BLUEPRINTING WHAT GREAT PLACE TO WORK-- WHAT A GREAT PLACE TO WORK LOOKS LIKE.

WE NEED TO FOCUS MAKING THE PLACES TO WORK SOMEWHERE PEOPLE WANT TO COME BACK TO LIKE UNCONSCIOUS BIAS AND WORK CULTURE, THINGS LIKE FLEXIBILITY.

WE NEED TO BE LOOKING AT PROVIDING GROWTH OPPORTUNITIES.

SO IF WE FOCUS ON THIS, THEN ALL OF A SUDDEN, PEOPLE WANT TO COME BACK TO WORK AND I THINK THAT'S WORTH BEING PART OF THE SOLUTION AS WELL.

>> Renee: WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT IS A CULTURE SHIFT.

UNCONSCIOUS BIAS IN TERMS OF A BUSINESS ATMOSPHERE IS NOT SOMETHING THAT WE HEAR COMMONLY.

THAT SEEMS LIKE THAT COULD TAKE SOME TIME TO COME TO FRUITION.

>> YOU KNOW WHAT?

YES AND NO.

THERE ARE INTERVENTIONS THAT CAN BE DONE FAIRLY QUICKLY TO ELEVATE WORKPLACE CULTURE, TO MAKE IT A PLACE THAT IS WELCOMING AND INCLUSIVE AND A LACE THAT PEOPLE WANT TO BELONG AT.

I THINK A GOOD PORTION OF THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE OPTED OUT OF WORKING SIMPLY FELT LIKE WORK WAS NOT A PLACE WHERE THEY WANTED TO.

BE.

IT IS GOING TO TAKE A LONG TIME TO UNPEEL THE LAYERS OF WHAT GOES ON, TOXICITY IN WORK CULTURES BUT THERE ARE A FEW THINGS WE CAN DO REALLY QUICKLY AND REALLY EFFECTIVELY AND REALLY EASILY.

ASHED A LOT OF IT WHAT IS TO DO WITH JUST HOW WE TRAIN OUR WORKFORCE TO GET ALONG WITH OTHER PEOPLE, TO BE GOOD CLAB QLAB RATERS?

-- COLLABORATOR GLRS I WONDER IF THAT IS A CONVERSATION PEOPLE WHO ARE IN LOWER WAGE EARNING POSITIONS CAN HAVE.

I WANT TO BE AT A PLACE WHERE I FEEL WELCOME AND INCLUDED AND AT THE TABLE.

ARE THEY EVEN THINKING ABOUT THOSE CONSIDERATIONS WHEN THEY'RE WORKING AS A SERVER OR A CUSTOMER SERVICE REPRESENTATIVE FOR UNDER $10 AN HOUR?

>> ABSOLUTELY, RENEE.

WHEN PEOPLE COME TO US, WORKERS COME TO US AND THEY WANT TO FORM A UNION AT THEIR WORKPLACE, MOST OF THE TIME THEY'RE ACTUALLY NOT COMING TO US BECAUSE THEY'RE UPSET ABOUT THEIR WAGES OR THEIR BENEFITS.

THEY'RE UPSET ABOUT NOT HAVING A VOICE AND HAVING RESPECT ON THE JOB.

BUT YOU KNOW, THIS CONVERSATION IS ALL ABOUT JOB QUALITY.

SO THERE IS AN ARTICLE IN THE WASHINGTON POST ON MONDAY THAT SAID THAT THE RETAIL INDUSTRY SAW THE LARGEST EXODUS OF WORKERS IT HAS EVER SEEN SINCE 20 YEARS AGO WHEN THE LABOR DEPARTMENT STARTED KEEPING TRACK OF THESE NUMBERS THIS SPRING.

A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE HIRING AND COMPANIES THAT PAY BETTER THAN RETAIL JOBS AND LOW WAGE JOBS, THEY OFFER BETTER BENEFITS, THEY PROVIDE PREDICTABLE SCHEDULING, THEY'RE HIRING, TOO.

SO WE ARE SEEING PEOPLE IN THE INDUSTRIES, ESPECIALLY WHO ARE FRONT LINE ESSENTIAL WORKERS, WHICH INCLUDE RESTAURANT WORKERS, SAYING TO THEMSELVES, WAS THIS WORTH IT?

OR NINE OR $SO AN HOUR AND THIS IS ACTUALLY THEY TALK TO WORKERS IN THIS WASHINGTON POST ARTICLE IN ONE OF THE QUOTES THAT STRUCK WITH ME IS BEING PAID NINE OR 10 AN HOUR DURING A NATIONAL CRISIS REALLY LEFT A SOUR TASTE.

SO WHEN WE ARE TALKING ABOUT WHAT CAN BE DONE, EMPLOYERS NEED TO BE ASKING THEMSELVES, WHAT AM I PROVIDING THAT IS VALUABLE FROM THE PERSPECTIVE OF MY EMPLOYEES?

AND ALSO LOOKING AT OTHER GROUPS TO CONSIDER HIRING.

BETH, I THOUGHT THE OP-ED YOU HAD IN THE "COURIER JOURNAL" WAS GREAT.

LET'S TAKE THE BOX THAT SAYS HAVE YOU BEEN CONVICTED AS A FELONY OFF THE PAPER.

ASK IT AS THE LAST THING IN AN INTERVIEW.

AS ONE OF THE SOLUTIONS TO GETTING MORE PEOPLE INTO THE WORKFORCE.

GIVE PEOPLE THE SECOND CHANCE AND THE OPPORTUNITY.

>> Renee: THAT HAS BEEN A STRATEGY, HAS IT NOT?

BAN THE BOX WAS AN EFFORT OF THE PREVIOUS GOVERNOR'S ADMINISTRATION FOR WORK WORK AND WE KNOW THAT HAS BEEN A GREAT MOVEMENT.

WHEN WE TALK ABOUT REENTRY AND CRIMINAL JUSTICE REFORM, THAT HAS BEEN A PART OF THAT, TO MAYBE GRAB THE LOW HANGING FRUIT, THE POPULATIONS WHO ARE DISPLACED FROM THE WORKFORCE.

THAT'S BEEN AN EFFORT ONGOING IN KENTUCKY FOR SEVERAL YEARS.

BUT ARE WE REAPING THE BEN FUTURES FROM IT?

-- THE BENEFITS FROM IT?

>> IT IS AND EMPLOYERS ARE STARTING TO OPEN THEIR DOORS AND UNDERSTAND THAT THIS IS AN UNTAPPED TALENT POOL AND, YOU KNOW, IN KENTUCKY, WHEN WE HAVE THE STORIES ON THE OVERDOSE AND WHEN WE KNOW WHAT JOBS CAN DO TO BITE DOWN ON RECIDIVISM AND TO KEEP PEOPLE OUT OF JAIL, WE KNOW THAT IT'S A STRATEGY THAT WORKS.

AND AT THE SAME TIME EMPLOYERS NEED PEOPLE.

AND SO WHAT WE'VE SEEN AT THE KENTUCKY CHAMBER IN OUR KENTUCKY COME BACK CAREER, WE HAVE RECRUITED 18,000 SECOND CHANCE JOBS.

I THINK EMPLOYERS ARE WORKING TO BECOME AN EMPLOYER OF CHOICE.

WHAT WE'VE SEEN FROM THEM IN RECENT YEARS, EVEN PRE-PANDEMIC IS TO THE POINT THAT WAS MADE ON INCREASING WAGES, CREATING WORKPLACE ENVIRONMENTS THAT BREED GOOD CULTURE BECAUSE THEY HAVE TO BECOME AN EMPLOYER OF CHOICE.

AND WE ARE EVEN SEEING NOW WITH THE QUITTERS, THE PRUDENTIAL SURVEY THAT CAME OUT.

50% OF PEOPLE ARE THINKING ABOUT LEAVING THEIR JOB AND ANOTHER 25% OF THINKING POST-PANDEMIC TO LEAVE THEIR JOB.

AND WHEN WE THINK ABOUT WHERE WE ARE NOW, WHAT PERPLEXES ME IS, YOU KNOW, WE TALK ABOUT KIND OF THE LIFE GUARDS AND THE RESTAURANT JOBS AND THESE FRONT LINE JOBS.

WE ARE MOST LIKELY TO SEE AUTOMATION TAKE THOSE JOBS.

AND WHAT REALLY SCARES ME, AND KEEPS ME UP AT NIGHT, IS WHAT HAPPENS TO OUR KENTUCKIANS THEN?

WE NEED THEM TO GET HIGHER SKILLS AND EARN BETTER WAGES.

BUT THE OTHER THING I THINK ABOUT IS, I WAS A SUBWAY SANDWICH ARTIST WHEN I WAS 16.

>> Renee: SUBWAY SANDWICH ARTIST.

>> I PAID TAXES AS SOON AS I COULD.

SO THOSE JOBS WERE MEANT FOR OUR YOUTH.

THEY WEREN'T MEANT TO BE CAREER ORIENTED POSITIONS THAT LAST FOREVER.

YOU CAN GROW UP IN THE HOSPITALITY BUT A LOT OF FRONT LUN JOBS ARE MEANT TO BE JUST WHAT THEY ARE, ENTRY LINE JOBS THAT FEED AND FUEL YOU TO MOVE TO THE NEXT STEP AND THE NEXT STEP AND IN KENTUCKY I THINK WE ARE KEEPING TOO MANY CITIZENS IN THESE ENTRY LINE JOBS AND FORGETTING-- WE ARE NOT GETTING THEM SKILLED UP AND EDUCATEDDED IN THE JOBS THAT MATTER IN THE FUTURE AS AUTOMATION IS RAMPING UP QUICKER THAN WE HAVE EVER SEEN.

>> Renee: I WANT TO ASK THE ECONOMIST THE QUESTION ABOUT WHEN WORKERS DON'T TAKE THE JOBS THAT ARE FOR HIRE, WILL BUSINESSES BECOME MORE CREATIVE?

YOU CAN LOOK AT THE NUMBER OF AUTOMATED SELF CHECKOUTS AT YOUR LOCAL GROCERIES OR RETAILERS.

WILL BUSINESSES FIND WAYS TO REPLACE WORKERS BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T TAKE THE CHANCE WHEN THEY COULD HAVE, TO BE EMPLOYED.

>> THAT SEEMS TO BE ONE OF THE THINGS LEFT OUT OF THE CONVERSATION.

BUSINESSES HAVE VERY STRONG INCENTIVES TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO FIX THE PROBLEM.

IT'S NOT CLEAR THAT THEY NEED A LOT MORE INCENTIVE BECAUSE IF YOU CAN HIRE PEOPLE RIGHT NOW, BUSINESSES ARE GROWING, THEY'RE PROFITABLE.

THEY'RE BEING VERY SUCCESSFUL.

IN FACT, THEY'RE SCRAMBLING TO HIRE MORE PEOPLE SO THAT THEY CAN SERVE MORE CUSTOMERS SO THEY CAN MAKE MORE MONEY AND MAKE MORE PROFITS.

THERE IS A VERY, VERY STRONG INCENTIVE FOR BUSINESSES TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO DO THIS.

AND WHEN THERE IS A VERY STRONG INCENTIVE FOR THEM TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO OVERCOME THIS PROBLEM, THEY USUALLY DO.

AND SO IT'S NOT CLEAR THAT WE NEED A LOT OF OTHER INTERVENTIONS TO FIX THAT.

IT IS CLEAR THAT BUSINESSES ARE GOING TO FIGURE OUT WAYS TO DO THINGS AND THEY DID.

WE FIGURED OUT WAYS TO DO THINGS IN THE MIDST OF THIS PANDEMIC THAT WE NEVER-- THAT THE TECHNOLOGY WAS THERE, JUST NEVER GOT ADOPTED.

NOW IT'S GOTTEN ADOPTED, YOU KNOW, THEY SEND YOU YOUR BILL TO YOUR PHONE AT A RESTAURANT NOW AND THEN YOU JUST PAY IT AND WALK OUT THE DOOR.

THAT'S MORE CONVENIENT FOR ME.

IT'S MORE CONVENIENT FOR THEM.

IT'S A LOT BETTER.

BUSINESSES ARE GOING TO FIGURE OUT WHAT IT TAKES TO GET THE LABOR THAT THEY NEED.

AND I THINK WORKERS HAVE A PRETTY STRONG INCENTIVE.

THEY'RE GOING TO FIGURE OUT WHAT IT TAKES TO BECOME THE WORKERS THAT THEY NEED TO BE BECAUSE, AGAIN, THERE IS A LOT OF OPPORTUNITY TO MAKE A FAIR AMOUNT OF MONEY RIGHT NOW AND SO WAGES ARE GOING UP.

THE DIFFERENCE IN WAGES BETWEEN BEING A FACTORY WORKER RIGHT NOW AND WORKING IN A RESTAURANT IS THE SMALLEST IT HAS EVER BEEN IN RECORDED HISTORY.

SO FACTORIES ARE GOING HAVE TO START FIGURING OUT HOW TO PULL THE WORKERS INTO THE FACTORIES.

RESTAURANTS GOING TO HAVE TO FIGURE OUT WHO TO GET MORE WORKERS.

I THINK THEY WILL BE CREATIVE ABOUT DOING THAT BECAUSE AGAIN, THE INCENTIVE IS THERE FOR THEM TO BE CREATIVE AND MAKE IT WORK.

>> Renee: Dr.

CLASH, I THINK THERE WAS A WALL STREET JOURNAL REPORT EARLIER THIS WEEK OR A COUPLE WEEKS AGO ABOUT THE TUG BETWEEN FACTORY WORKERS AND THOSE WHO WORK IN THE SERVICE INDUSTRY, FOOD SERVICE OR ET CETERA, THAT, THE WAGE COMPENSATION-- WAGE COMPETITION GOING ON.

WHO STANDS TO GAIN AND WHO STANDS TO LOSE?

WHAT SECONDERS WILL BE WINNERS AND WHAT SECTORS COULD BE LOSERS?

>> WELL, YOU KNOW, I THINK RIGHT NOW WORKERS REALLY HAVE A SITUATION WHERE THEY STAND TO GAHN IN THIS ECONOMY.

WE ARE IN A SITUATION RIGHT NOW WHERE THERE IS SUCH HIGH DEMAND FOR WORKERS AND THERE ARE FEW WORKERS AVAILABLE, THAT, YOU KNOW, THE WORKERS WHO ARE OUT THERE ACTUALLY DO HAVE CHOICES, THEY HAVE OPTIONS.

SO YOU ARE SEEING WORKERS MORE WILLING TO STEP AWAY FROM THEIR JOBS.

THE NUMBER OF QUITS INCREASING BECAUSE THEY NOW BELIEVE THAT THEY HAVE THE FLEXIBILITY TO FIND WORK SOMEWHERE ELSE AND MOVE TO ANOTHER JOB THAT MAY BE EVEN BETTER EITHER IN TERMS OF WAGES OR WORKING CONDITIONS, WHICH HAS BEEN DISCUSSED HERE.

SO THEY'RE RECOGNIZING THEY HAVE A LOT OF OPTIONS.

SO RIGHT NOW I THINK WORKERS ACROSS THE BOARD ARE REALLY STARTING TO BENEFIT FROM THIS.

AS WE GO ON, I THINK, YOU KNOW, WE START TO MOVE INTO EXACTLY WHAT Dr. TROSKE WAS DESCRIBINGS.

BUSINESSES ARE GOING TO RECOGNIZE, RIGHT NOW THEY'RE HAVING TO PAY MORE TO THE WORKERS TO ATTRACT THEM BUT AS THEY DO THAT, THEY'LL RECOGNIZE LABOR IS COSTING ME MORE SO I NEED TO ADAPT.

IF I'VE GOT ANOTHER OPTION HERE IN TERMS OF ADOPTING TECHNOLOGY SO I DON'T HAVE TO UTILIZE AS MUCH LABOR, I'M GOING TO DO THAT.

I'M GOING TO FIND THE MIX THAT IS MOST PROFITABLE.

WE MIGHT SEE THIS SITUATION GO AWAY OVER TIME.

I'M NOT SURE HOW LONG THAT IS BUT WE ARE IN A MOMENT RIGHT NOW WHERE WORKERS HAVE A CONSIDERABLE AMOUNT OF POWER TO FIND BETTER JOBS OR NEGOTIATE BETTER SITUATIONS.

WE START THINKING, YOU KNOW, THE COMPETITION BETWEEN THESE DIFFERENT SECTORS, YOU KNOW, REALLY GOOD COMPETITION TO HAVE BECAUSE WHAT IT DOES IS IT ALLOWS WORKERS TO MOVE INTO THESE OTHER TYPES OF JOBS OR MAYBE THEY CAN DEVELOP THESE SKILLS.

AND SOAP IT GIVES THEM, AGAIN, A CAREER PATHWAY WHERE THEY CAN MOVE INTO HIGHER PAYING JOBS, DEVELOP THEIR SKILLS AND EARN A RETURN FROM THOSE SKILLS.

>> BUSINESSES ARE RECEPTIVE TO PROVIDING THE ON THE JOB TRAINING AT THEIR EXPENSE TO MAKE SURE THEY GROW THAT TALENT AND RETAIN IT.

>> ABSOLUTELY.

WE HAVE SEEN BUSINESSES REALLY DIVE IN WITH THEIR EMPLOYEES AND CREATE THESE EARN AND LEARN PROGRAMS BECAUSE THEY UNDERSTAND THAT JOBS ARE GOING AWAY.

I THINK BUSINESSES ARE DOING A GREAT JOB.

WHAT I ALSO LIKE TO SEE AND I WOULD LIKE FOR OUR STATE TO WRAP OUR MANDZ AROUND IS FOR THE FIRST TIME IN HISTORY, WE ARE RECEIVING A RECORD BREAKING INFLUX OF FEDERAL MONEY COMING IN FROM THE CARES ACT AND ARPA.

THE AMERICAN RESCUE PLAN.

IF BEE HAVE THIS RECORD INFLUX OF SUPPORT COMING IN, HOW ARE WE SPENDING THOSE RESOURCES TO SKILL UP AND EDUCATE OUR KENTUCKIANS IN THE WAYS THAT THE ECONOMY NEEDS.

BECAUSE IF WE KNOW THIS AUTOMATION IS COMING, IT'S HERE, HOW DO WE BUILD THE FUTURE JOBS?

THE HIGHER SKILLED JOBS WILL BECOME MUCH MORE IMPORTANT AND MUCH MORE NEEDED, WHICH PAY HIGHER WAGES WHICH GIVE PEOPLE BETTER LIVES.

IF WE CAN TAKE AND SPEND THE FUNDS IN THE WAY THAT WILL PROPERLY SKILL THE KENTUCKIANS TO BE ON THE PATH WAY AS AUTOMATION HITS, WE WILL BE A HEALTHIER STATE.

>> WE ARE HAVING THIS CONVERSATION SIX MONTHS AGO, WE HAD NO IDEA WE WOULD BE IN THIS SITUATION.

AND YOU KNOW, I THINK BOTH PANDEMIC HIT, WE WERE ON A PANEL THAT THE UNIVERSITY PUT TOGETHER NONE OF US KNEW WHAT WAS GOING TO HAPPEN.

WE SAW THE ECONOMY CRATER IN APRIL AND MAY OF 2020 AND REBOUNDED RAPIDLY.

SO THERE WAS DISPLACEMENT GOING DOWN AND DISEQUILIBRIUM GOING DOWN AND DISEEK EQUILIBRIUM GOING BACK UP.

IT IS NOT SURPRISING THAT WE ARE IN THIS SITUATION.

IT'S JUST GOING TO TAKE A LITTLE BIT TO ADJUST BECAUSE OUR ECONOMY WENT FROM DECLINING BY 30% IN A QUARTER TO GROWING BY 6% IN A QUARTER HIGHEST GROWTH WE'VE EVER SEEN IN THE FIRST QUARTER, WE HAD OVER 6% GROWTH IN THE FIRST QUARTER.

WE HAVEN'T SEEN 6% GROWTH IN MOST OF OUR LIFETIMES IT SHOULDN'T BE TERRIBLY SURPRISING THAT PEOPLE AND BUSINESSES ARE STRUGGLING TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO ADAPT.

BUT GIVEN TIME, THEY'RE GOING TO FIGURE IT OUT BECAUSE AGAIN THERE IS A LOT OF INCENTIVE TO GET IT RIGHT.

AND SO FOR EVERYBODY.

AND SO I DO THINK, TOO, IT'S USEFUL TO TAKE A BREATH AND SAY WE'VE BEEN THROUGH A LOT.

SO IT'S NOT SURPRISING THAT SOME PEOPLE ARE TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHAT THE FUTURE HOLDS FOR THEM BECAUSE WE REALLY DIDN'T KNOW FOR SO LONG.

>> Renee: CYNTHIA, LET ME GET CYNTHIA KNAPEK IN REAL QUICK AND THEN BACK TO YOU CAITLIN.

>> THERE IS A PIECE OF THE PUZZLE THAT SHOULD NOT BE SURPRISING.

WE SHOULD HAVE SEEN THIS TRAIN COMING, WHICH IS GENERATIONAL SHIFT IN THE WORKPLACE.

AND THE QUANTITY OF BABY BOOMERS THAT ARE REQUIRING-- THATY RETIRING, THE SMALLNESS OF MY GENERATION, GEN X WHICH SHOULD BE A BRIDGE BUT BECAUSE WE ARE SO SMALL AND THE GENERATION AFTER US IS SO LARGE, IT CREATES A PRETTY SIGNIFICANT SHIFT IN WHAT PEOPLE ARE LOOKING FOR IN THEIR WORK AND I THINK IT WAS EXACERBATED BECAUSE WE TALKED ABOUT EARLIER AND WE HAD AN ELEVATION AND A NUMBER OF BABY BOOMERS WHO OPTED INTO RETIREMENT BECAUSE OF COVID BECAUSE THE TIMING WAS RIGHT OR SICKNESS, THOSE KINDS OF THINGS.

SO LOOKING AT GENERATIONAL SHIFT IS, I THINK, ALMOST ONE OF THE MOST SEISMIC SHIFTS IN THAT WHOLE WORKPLACE SHIFT BECAUSE WHAT THE NEXT GENERATION WANS OUT OF-- WANTS OUT OF A WORKPLACE IS SO VASTLY DIFFERENT THAN THE WORKPLACES OUR BABY BOOMER GENERATION CONSTRUCTED AND SOME OF WHAT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT, THEY'RE BUILT FOR NOT JUST HAVING ONE CAREER.

THAT'S WHAT THEY WANT-- THEY WANT THAT RAPID CHANGE OF I'M GOING TO DO THIS FOR 10 YEARS AND THEY EXPECT TO YOU TRAIN THEM UM AND DO SOMETHING ELSE FOR 10 YEARS.

I'M HOPEFUL THAT THE WAY THE NEXT GENERATION IS ENGINEERED WILL LEND ITSELF TO SOME OF THAT SKILL-UP QUICKLY, GET PEOPLE OUT OF THE-- LOVE THE SAPPED WITCH ARTIST JOBS, MY HUSBAND CAN RELATE TO THAT.

HE STILL WORKS FOR THE SANDWICH ARTIST COMPANY, BUT HE HAS WORKED HIS WAY BEYOND THE SANDWICH ARTIST LEVEL.

BUT ALL OF THAT COMES INTO HITTING A GENERATIONAL WAVE INTO THE NEXT LEVEL.

>> I WOULD LIKE TO GO BACK TO EMPLOYERS ARE GOING SEE WHAT NEEDS TO BE DONE TO ATTRACT WORKERS AND INCREASE THEIR WAGES AND BENEFITS BECAUSE IT'S IMPORTANT TO POINT OUT THAT THERE ARE CERTAIN SECTORS OF OUR ECONOMY THAT ARE STRUGGLING RIGHT NOW TO HIRE PEOPLE LIKE RATEL BECAUSE THEIR WAYS AND MEANS ARE LOW AND BENEFITS ARE POOR AND THEIR SCHEDULES ARE UNPREDICTABLE.

THESE SECTORS, RETAIL GROCERY IN PARTICULAR, BOOMED DURING THIS PANDEMIC.

THEIR PANDEMIC PROFITS WERE OFF THE CHARTS.

BROOKINGS INSTITUTE LOOKED AT 13 RETAILERS, AMAZON, WAL-MART, KROGER, COSTCO, TARGET, AND FOUND THEIR INCREASE IN PROFITS IN 2020, THEIR TOTAL PROFITS WERE AROUND $63 BILLION.

ALL 13 RETAILERS SAW A 16.7 BILLION INCREASE IN PROFITS IN 2020 FROM 2019.

THESE RETAILERS HAVE THE MONEY TO SHARE WITH THEIR WORKERS WHO WERE THE ONCE WHO WERE CHECKING PEOPLE OUT, WHO WERE PUTTING STUFF ON THE SHELVES, MAKING SURE THAT WE HAD THE MEAT THAT WE NEEDED TO MAKE SURE OUR FAMILIES GOT THROUGH THIS CRISIS.

SO TO SAY THAT WE CAN'T DO ANYTHING FOR WAGES OR BENEFITS, YOU KNOW, WE SEE THE NUMBERS RIGHT HERE.

SOME OF THE SECTORS, THEY EXPERIENCED TREMENDOUS SUCCESS AND NOW THEY'RE SAYING WE WANT TO YOU COME TO WORK BUT WE WANT TO YOU COME TO WORK IN THE SAME CONDITIONS BEFORE COVID.

AND THAT'S JUST NOT GOING TO CUT IT.

>> DO YOU BELIEVE THAT IF THERE WAS A FORCED FEDERAL RAISE OF THE MIP, IT WOULD GET AT WHAT YOU ARE CONCERNED ABOUT?

>> YOU KNOW, I WOULD LIKE TO SEE THE FEDERAL MINIMUM WAGE INCREASED.

THE LAST TIME WE DID IT WAS 2009.

IT HAS STAYED AT 7:25 FOR THAT LONG AND WHEN WE LOOK AT THE COST OF LIVING, WHEN WE LOOK AT THE COST OF GOODS, THEY'VE ALL GONE UP.

WHEN YOU LOOK AT FOOD AND BEVERAGES.

THEY'VE INCREASED 24% SINCE LAST TIME WE INCREASED THE MINIMUM WAGE AND WE HAVEN'T INCREASED WORKER WAGES.

AND TO BETH'S POINT, SOME OF THE FRONT LINE JOBS WERE MADE FOR TEENAGERS STARTING OUT.

THAT MIGHT BE WHAT THEY WERE MEANT FOR BUT THAT'S NOT THE REALITY OF WHO IS WORKING IN THESE JOBS TODAY.

AND SO I DO THINK THAT THERE NEEDS TO BE A CONVERSATION ABOUT INVESTMENT INTO SOME OF THESE PROGRAMS THAT HELP PEOPLE TO SKILL UP.

YOU KNOW, THE ONE THAT COMES TO MIND IS THE LOUISVILLE URBAN LEAGUE KENTUCKY BUILD PROGRAM.

THEY DID A TREMENDOUS JOB AND THEIR STAFF WORKS SO HARD AND IT'S SO MUCH MORE THAN JUST THE SKILLS, TO WRAP AROUND THEIR ARMS AROUND EACH INDIVIDUAL.

THE ONLY THING YOU CAN DESCRIBE IT IS JUST LOVE, TO GET THESE PEOPLE TO BE SUCCESSFUL IN THESE JOBS.

AND WE FEED TO BE INVESTING IN PROGRAMS LIKE THAT.

AND SCALING THEM UP SO THAT WE CAN HELP SOLVE THIS PROBLEM.

>> Renee: DO YOU BELIEVE, Dr. CLARK, THAT IF THERE WERE A FEDERAL RAISE OF THE MINIMUM WAGE THAT'S ARTIFICIALLY INFLATING THE WAGE, THAT THE WE ALREADY SEE EVIDENCE ARE DOING IT ON THEIR OWN BECAUSE THE MARKET IS DEMANDING IT?

>> I THINK YOU HAVE TO BE CAREFUL ABOUT UNDERSTANDING, YOU KNOW, WHAT THE TRADE-OFFS ARE WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT RAISING THE MINIMUM WAGE AND THE DIFFERENT SKILLS THAT YOU ARE POTENTIALLY TALKING ABOUT.

YOU KNOW, THE CURRENT MINIMUM WAGE, YOU KNOW, YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT, IT HASN'T BEEN ADJUSTED FOR INFLATION IN A LONG TIME.

PURCHASING POWER HAS ERODED OVER TIME.

AND CERTAINLY BUSINESSES HAVE RECOGNIZED THAT THEY CANNOT ATTRACT THE WORKERS THEY NEED-- NOT ALL BUSINESSES BUT MANY BUSINESSES.

AND SO FOR A LOT OF BUSINESSES THAT ARE HIRING FROM, YOU KNOW, INTO THESE ENTRY LEVEL JOBS, YOU ARE SEEING THEY'RE HAVING TO PAY WELL ABOVE THE CURRENT MINIMUM WAGE.

THE OTHER QUESTION IS WHAT ARE THE POTENTIAL TRADE-OFFS OF INCREASING MINIMUM WAGE?

IT DEPENDS ON HOW BIG OF AN INCREASE YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT?

IF YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT INCREASING THE MINIMUM WAGE AND ADJUSTING FOR COST OF LIVING, THERE IS PROBABLY NOT A LOT OF PEOPLE IT WOULD AFFECT.

>> Renee: FROM 7:25 TO 15.

>> YOU MIGHT BE TALKING ABOUT MORE OF A TRADE-OFF WHERE YOU ARE STARTING TO LOOK AT YOU ARE MAKING WORKERS MORE COSTLY TO EMPLOY IF YOU GET THAT MINIMUM WAGE ABOVE WHAT THE MARKET IS TOWGHT SUGGESTING, THEN YOU HAVE THE CONCERN YOU MAY BE MILWAUKEEING WORKERS MORE COSTLY AND AS A RESULT, YOU'LL INCENTIVIZE BUSINESS TO MAKE THOSE ADAPTATIONS, TO MOVE TOWARDS TECHNOLOGY TO REDUCE THE NUMBER OF WORKERS THEY HAVE TO HAVE.

>> Renee: HAVE MORE PART TIME WORKERS THAN FULL TIME.

>> OR YOU MAY NOT SEE JOB LOSSES BUT WHAT YOU MAY SEE IS SLOWER JOB GROWTH START OF THAT.

THERE IS QUESTIONS ABOUT HOW BIG AN EFFECT THIS IS.

WILL WE SEE THE SIGNIFICANT DECREASE IN THE NUMBER OF JOBS AND WITH THE INCREASE IN MINIMUM WAGE OR WILL IT BE RELATIVELY SMALL?

THERE ARE STUDIES THAT SEEM TO BE MIXMENT Dr. TROSKE CAN PROBABLY ELABORATE ON THIS BUT I THINK THE ISSUE IS HOW HIGH DOES THAT MINIMUM WAGE GET RELATIVE TO WHAT THE MARKET WAGE IS?

THE HIGHER THAT MINIMUM WAGE IS, THE MORE LIKELY YOU ARE TO RISK JOB LOSS AS A RESULT OF THAT.

POLICY MAKERS REALLY NEED TO UNDERSTAND THAT WHILE, YES, THERE IS THE POTENTIAL OF INCREASED WAGES THROUGH MINIMUM WAGE AND HELP WORK EARNS AUTO-- WORKERS, THERE IS A COST THEY NEED TO KEEP IN MIND AS WELL.

>> THE ONLY THING THAT'S ARTIFICIAL ABOUT THE MINIMUM WAGE IS HOW LOW IT IS.

>> Renee: Dr. TROSKE.

>> WHAT Dr. CLARK SAID.

I THINK THE BEST STUDY THAT WE HAVE SEEN ON THE MINIMUM WAGE CAME FROM THE CONGRESSIONAL BUDGET OFFICE AND THEY JUST ANALYZED THEIR ESTIMATES WHAT OF THE IMPACT OF THE MINIMUM WAGE WOULD BE IF YOU RAISED IT TO 10, 12 AND $15 AN HOUR.

THERE WAS SUBSTANTIAL-- PEOPLE GOT HIGH WAGES.

PEOPLE LOST THEIR JOBS.

AND YOU GOT TO TRADE THOSE TWO OFF.

HOW DO YOU WANT TO THINK ABOUT THOSE TWO?

I THINK, YOU KNOW, THAT STUDY HAD A SIGNIFICANT IMPACT ON THE DEBATE IN CONGRESS, WHICH IS WHY WE DIDN'T SEE AN INCREASE IN THE MINIMUM WAGE.

>> Renee: WHEN WE THINK ABOUT HOW THAT TRANSLATES TO CONSUMERS, HOW ABOUT WILL THAT CHANGE THEIR ATTITUDE AND THEIR BEHAVIOR WHEN IT COMES TO HAVING MAYBE TO PAY MORE FOR GOODS AND SERVICES BECAUSE THE WORKERS ARE BEING PAID IMPORTANT.

>> IT'S GOING TRANSLATE TO HIGHER PRICES.

NOW, YOU KNOW, FOR MANY PEOPLE, PROBABLY NOT TOO BIG OF AN IMPACT.

THERE HAS BEEN A STUDY OF THE MINIMUM WAGE, WHO IS GOING TO PAY THE HIGHER MINIMUM WAGE?

TURNS OUT THAT, YOU KNOW, WHO IS GOING TO RAISE THEIR PRICES OF THEIR GOODS THE MOST?

THE PEOPLE WHO HIRE MINIMUM WAGE WORKERS.

WHO ARE THOSE PEOPLE?

PEOPLE IN RURAL AREAS AND WITH BUSINESSES THAT THE ACTUALLY SUPPLY GOODS TO LOW INCOME INDIVIDUALS THAT ARE IN POORER NEIGHBORHOODS SO IT TURNS OUT THAT MINIMUM WAGE WORKERS ARE MORE LIKELY TO FACE HIGHER PRICES.

HIGHER INCOME WORKERS AREN'T BECAUSE THE BUSINESSES THEY FREQUENT DON'T EMPLOY MINIMUM WAGE WORKERS.

>> Renee: DO YOU HAVE A DIFFERENT PERSPECTIVE ON THAT?

THAT ABOUT WAL-MART?

I THINK YOU MENTIONED TO ME WHEN WE DISCUSSED ABOUT THE COST OF GOODS, WHAT THAT REALLY TRANSLATES FOR CONSUMERS?

>> YEAH, AND I THINK Dr. TROSKE TOUCHED ON IT A LITTLE BIT.

THAT RISE IN PRICE MAY BE BE MINIMAL, AND THERE ARE STUDIES THAT SUGGEST THAT IT WOULD BE.

BUT, YOU KNOW, I THINK THAT WHEN YOU PUT MORE MONEY INTO THE POCKETS OF PEOPLE WHO SPEND THAT PAYCHECK, WE ARE PUTTING MORE MONEY BACK INTO THE ECONOMY.

AND IT'S A WIN-WIN FOR EVERYBODY INVOLVED.

>> >> Renee: ANYTHING ELSE ON THAT, Dr. TROSKE.

>> SOME PEOPLE WIN AND SOME PEOPLE WILL LOSE.

YOU ARE GOING HAVE PEOPLE THAT LOSE.

YOU ARE GOING HAVE PEOPLE THAT LOSE THEIR JOBS.

AND ARE GOING HAVE A LOT LESS MONEY.

AND SO YOU GO THE TO TRADE THOSE OFF AND IT'S A DIFFICULT TRADE-OFF, NO QUESTION ABOUT IT BUT HAVE YOU TO THINK ABOUT THE OVERALL IMPACT.

AND AGAIN, I THINK THERE IS A NICE STUDY OUT THERE FOR PEOPLE TO LOOK AT AND THERE IS PROBABLY AN OPTIMAL LEVEL.

WE ARE GETTING TO THE POINT.

LET'S FACE IT.

AMAZON IS PAYING $15 AN HOUR AND WAL-MART WILL GET THERE SHORTLY AND SO IF THAT'S WHAT YOU ARE FOCUSED ON, BUT THAT'S NOT WHERE , YOU KNOW, THE BIG IMPACT ON MINIMUM WAGE IS GOING TO BE.

>> Renee: TO THAT QUESTION.

IF AMAZON AND OTHER BIG BOX RETAILERS ARE ABLE TO PAY THESE REALLY-- MUCH HIGHER WAGES, WHAT DOES IT DO TO SMALL MOM AND POP BUSINESSES TRYING TO COMPETE IN THOSE SAME COMMUNITIES.

>> THEY WILL HAVE TO ADJUST.

THEY MAY NOT HAVE THE ABILITY TO DO THAT IS THE ISSUE.

SO THOSE BUSINESSES WILL STRUGGLE AS A RESULT OF THAT.

SIMPLY A SITUATION WHERE IF THEY CAN'T COMPETE, YOU KNOW, THRE HAVE A HARDER TIME REMAINING IN PLACE.

BUT I THINK WE TALK ABOUT MINIMUM WAGE AND IT'S IMPORTANT TO UNDERSTAND NOT ONLY DO WE HAVE A TRADE-OFF BUT IT'S IMPORTANT TO GO BACK TO WHAT IS THE POLICY OBJECTIVE ASSOCIATED WITH THE MINIMUM WAGE?

WHAT IS THE MOTOR MOTIVATION FOR INCREASING THE MINIMUM WAGE?

IT'S USUALLY A MATTER OF TRYING TO INCREASE THE WELFARE OF LOW WAGE WORKERS.

MINIMUM WAGE IS ONE POLICY OPTION TO DO THAT AND AGAIN THERE IS A TRADE-OFF, YOU KNOW, THAT YOU HAVE.

AND THERE IS A TRADE-OFF WITH ALL POLICY OPTIONS THAT YOU ARE GOING TO BE OR DEALING WITH.

BUT THERE ARE OTHER POLICY OPTIONS THAT, YOU KNOW, COULD HELP THESE SAME INDIVIDUALS AS WELLING.

INCOME TAX CREDITS ARE A POLICY OPTION THAT YOU MIGHT LOOK AT WHAT CH ONE PROVIDES, YOU KNOW, THE TYPES OF BENEFITS YOU ARE HOPING FOR.

MIN MUZS THE POTENTIAL-- MINIMIZES THE POTENTIAL COST.

IMPROVEMENTS IN EDUCATION.

SO THAT WORKERS AREN'T IN THESE POSITIONS FOR AS LONG.

WHEN YOU TAKE ABOUT THE MINIMUM WAGE, IT'S IMPORTANT TO CONSIDER WHAT IS THE POLICY OBJECTIVE THERE AND WHAT ARE THE POTENTIAL OPTIONS, DIFFERENT POLICY LEVELS THAT HAVE YOU TO WORK TOWARDS WHATEVER THAT OBJECTIVE IS.

>> IT'S IMPORTANT TO POINT OUT THE CARES ACT WHEN THEY DECIDED THEY DIDN'T RAISE THE MINIMUM WAGE AFTER THE SENATE SAID IT WAS, YOU KNOW, THEY NEEDED A SUPER MAJORITY, THEY INCREASED THE GENEROSITY OF THE EARNED INCOME TAX CREDIT AND MADE IT MORE GENEROUS TO SINGLE PEOPLE WITHOUT CHILDREN AND SO WE SAW AN INCRESS IN THE CHILD CARE TAX CREDIT THAT WAS PART OF THIS ACT AND SO THOSE ARE THINGS THAT PROBABLY, IF YOU ARE TRYING TO HELP LOW INCOME, LOW WAGE PEOPLE, MUCH MORE EFFECTIVE WAY TO DO THAT THAN A MINIMUM WAGE, WHICH HELPS LOW WAGE PEOPLE BUT IT, OF COURSE, HELP THE CHILDREN OF HIGH WAGE INDIVIDUAL.

THERE ARE A FAIR NUMBER OF PEOPLE WHO EARN THE MINIMUM WAGE, SANDWICH ARTIST BUT PROBABLY DIDN'T LIVE IN A POOR HOUSEHOLD.

I DON'T KNOW THE MINIMUM WAGE, I DIDN'T LIVE IN A POOR HOUSEHOLD.

I DID IT WHEN IT WAS 2.35 AN HOUR.

THE CHILD CARE TAX CREDIT ARE THINGS THAT CONGRESS CHOSE TO DO, WHICH PROBABLY, IN MY OWN OPINION AND I THINK THE EVIDENCE FROM RESEARCH ARE MORE EFFECTIVE, AT HELPING TRULY POOR PEOPLE THAN THE MINIMUM WAGE WHICH HELPS LOW WAGE PEOPLE.

>> Renee: I WANT TO ASK CAITLIN ABOUT THAT.

SO THERE ARE OTHER POLICY AGENDAS, OTHER APPROACHES THAT COULD THE HELP THE COMMUNITIES THAT YOU TALK ABOUT.

SO EARNED INCOME TAX CREDIT IS ONE.

CHILD CARE IS ANOTHER.

IT'S NOT ALL JUST ABOUT THE WAIMGS.

>> -- THE WAGES.

>> YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT.

PAID FAMILY AND MEDICAL LEAVE IS ANOTHER ONE THAT WOULD HELP RAISE THE QUALITY OF THESE JOBS AND WHETHER THAT'S DONE BY EMPLOYERS OR THAT'S DONE BY THE GOVERNMENT, IT'S A SOLUTION.

I MENTIONED EARLIER IN THE PROGRAM THAT ONE OF THE THINGS THAT PEOPLE ARE LOOKING FOR TO COME BACK TO WORK IS SUPPORT FOR THEIR HEALTH.

AND THERE IS LOTS TO UNPACK IN THAT.

IT IS ACCESS TO HEALTHCARE AND AFFORDABLE HEALTHCARE AT THAT.

AND IT IS ALSO IF I GET SICK, IF MY LOVED ONES GET SICK, DO I HAVE TO TAKE UNPAID TIME OFF.

DO I HAVE TO MAKE THE CHOICE OF THE HEALTH OF MY FAMILY OR A PAYCHECK.

IF I GET THE VACCINE AND I'M NOT FEELING SO WELL, AM I GOING TO BE ABLE TO HAVE TIME OFF TO RECOVER FROM THAT OR AM I GOING TO GO UNPAID OR SOME EMPLOYERS HAVE NO FAULT ATTENDANCE POLICIES, WHERE IT DOESN'T MATTER WHY YOU ARE TAKING OFF, YOU STILL GET POINTS TOWARDS, YOU KNOW, EVENTUAL TERMINATION.

SO THERE ARE A LOT OF DEMPT THINGS THAT WE CAN BE LOOKING AT TO SUPPORT THESE LOW WAGE WORKERS WHO HAVE BEEN THE BACKBONES OF OUR COMMUNITY BECAUSE EVERY SINGLE ONE OF US HAD TO GO TO A GROCERY STORE.

EVERY SINGLE ONE OF US PROBABLY GOT TAKEOUT FROM A RESTAURANT AND IF IT WEREN'T FOR THOSE PEOPLE, WE WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO GET THROUGH THIS CRISIS AND SO IT'S UP TO US TO LOOK AT, USING THE AMERICAN RESCUE PLAN FUNDS, TO REALLY MAKE INVESTMENTS IN MAKING THEIR LIVES BETTER BECAUSE THEIR HARD WORK HAS EARNED IT AND DESERVE IT AND TO SPEAKER OSBOURNE'S CRITICISM OF THE GOVERNOR, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT THE AMERICAN RESCUE PLAN FUNDS CAN BE USED FOR IS A PREMIUM PAY FUND FOR ESSENTIAL WORKERS.

AND YOU KNOW, SO IF HE CLEARLY CARES ABOUT THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE BEEN WORKING THROUGH THIS CRISIS, WOULD I LOVE TO MEET WITH HIM AND TALK ABOUT HOW WE CAN SET THAT UP IN THE STATE OF KENTUCKY BECAUSE CONGRESS HAS MADE IT CLEAR THAT WAS ONE OF THEIR INTENTS FOR THAT MONEY AND TREASURY HAS BACKED IT UP WITH THEIR GUIDANCE.

>> Renee: CYNTHIA KNAPEK.

>> ONE OF THE THINGS I WAS THINKING ABOUT AS YOU WERE TALKING IS THE QUANTITY OF SERVICE PROFESSIONALS, PEEP IN THE SERVICE INDUSTRY THAT ARE WOMEN.

AND I WAS ALSO THINKING ABOUT JUST HOW WE DISCUSSED EARLIER THE MASS QUANTITIES OF WOMEN THAT HAVE LEFT OF THE WORKFORCE.

WE STUDY A WHOLE LOT OF ISSUES AROUND WOMEN'S LEADERSHIP AND WHEN WOMEN ARE AT THE TABLE AND IN ORGANIZATIONS, IT'S REALLY GOOD FOR POLICY AND THEY HAVE A DIFFERENT WORLD VIEW AND CAN IMPACT SOME OF THESE POLICY LEVEL DECISIONS THAT THE WE ARE TALKING ABOUT.

AND SO I DO HAVE A REALLY BIG CONCERN ABOUT THE MASSIVE SHIFT IN WOMEN WHO ARE LEAVING THE WORKFORCE.

YOU KNOW, THE 75 ISSUE MILLION PEOPLE THAT ARE WORKING, ALMOST LIKE 20 MILLION, BUT IN PARTICULAR WERE WORKING MOMS.

AND I THINK, REALLY EXCITED ABOUT SOME OF THE CHILD CARE THINGS THAT WE ARE DOING BECAUSE I DO THINK THAT WILL IMPACT THAT.

BUT I REALLY WANT TO SEE OUR LEADERS FOCUS ON HOW DO WE, LIKE IT'S A MULTIFACETED, RIGHT?

EVERYBODY'S IMPORTANT.

AND IF I WERE TO PICK AN AREA THAT WE HAVE TO FOCUS ON, AND SAY THIS HAS RIPPLE EFFECTS, THIS HAS DOMINOES IMPORTANT TO THE SERVICE INDUSTRY, DOMINOES IMPORTANT TO POLICY, I WOULD FOCUS ON HOW DO WE GET OUR WOMEN BACK IN THE WORKFORCE.

>> AND TO THAT POINT, I WANT BETH DAVISSON BECAUSE THIS IS AN ISSUE WE'VE TALKED ABOUT BEFORE, CHILD CARE IN PARTICULAR IS ONE OF THOSE AREAS THAT CAN HELP GET WOMEN BACK INTO THE WORKFORCE.

TO CAITLIN'S POINT ABOUT RESPONSE TO THE GOVERNOR'S $15 0 BONUS, THE KENTUCKY RETAIL FEDERATION ISSUED A STATEMENT IN PART ON THURSDAY ABOUT THAT BONUS.

IT SAYS WHILE THE EXTRA UNEMPLOYMENT BENEFITS HAVE BEEN HELPFUL FOR GROCERS AND RETAILERS AS PEOPLE ARE RETURNING TO SHOP IN PERSON, WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THERE ARE ENOUGH STORE ASSOCIATES TO PROVIDE THE IN STORE SERVICE CUSTOMERS EXPECT.

THE KENTUCKY RETAIL COMMUNITY FULLY SUPPORTS THE RETURN TO WORK INCENTIVE WITH SO MANY BUSINESSES FACING WORKFORCE SHORTAGES, WE THINK THIS IS A STEP IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION.

WE ARE ALSO ENCOURAGED BY THE $763 UNTIL IN FEDERAL FUNDS THAT WILL GO TO KENTUCKY'S CHILD CARE PROVIDERS.

LACK OF CHILD CARE IS A CONSISTENT AND SIGNIFICANT BARRIER FOR MANY KENTUCKIANS WANTING TO GET BACK TO WORK.

SO THIS $763 MILLION, 29,, WE HAVE TALKED ON SEPARATE PROGRAMS ABOUT PROFESSIONALIZING THE CHILD CARE INDUSTRY THAT K-12 EDUCATOR IS PAID MUCH MORE THAN AN EARLY EDUCATION PRE-K EDUCATOR.

THERE IS PARITY ISSUES THAT GO ALONG WITH THAT THAT IS BEYOND WHAT WE CAN ACCOMPLISH IN SIX AND A HALF MINUTES BUT WHEN WE TALK ABOUT GETTING WOMEN BACK INTO THE WORKFORCE, IS CHILD CARE THE KEY?

>> IT IS A HIGH MUNG US PIECE-- HUMONGOUS PIECE OF IT.

WE DIALED BACK ON OVER TWO DECADES OF WOMEN'S PROGRESSION IN THE WORKPLACE.

THAT'S A LONG TYPE IN THE HISTORY OF WORKING WOMEN.

I KNOW I'VE SAID THAT BEFORE ON YOUR SHOW.

AND AT THE SAME TIME, KENTUCKY KIDS, 50% OF OUR KIDS SHOW UP READY FOR KINDERGARTEN.

THOSE ARE EARLY CHILD CARE ISSUES.

SO NOT ONLY IS IT PLAGUING THE WOMEN IN THE WORKFORCE, IT'S PLAGUING OUR FUTURE WORKFORCE AND WHAT HAPPENS TO THE HEALTH OF OUR KIDS AS THEY GO THROUGH THE SCHOOL CONTINUUM.

AND SO IT IS ABSOLUTELY A HUGE ISSUE.

AND YOU KNOW, SEEING THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT, THE STATE GOVERNMENT COME TOGETHER ON IT IS VERY GOOD.

I THINK THE INFLUX OF RESOURCES IS GOING TO BE KEY.

WE ARE SEEING EMPLOYERS REALLY BECOME MUCH MORE SUPPORTIVE AND GIVING LEEWAY IN SUPPORT FOR CHILD CARE ISSUES AND FLEXIBLE SCHEDULES.

>> Renee: PAID LEAVE.

>> I MEAN SO MUCH OF THIS HAS HAPPENED.

AND WE ARE SEEING THAT INCREASE IN WAGES.

AND IT'S ALMOST, YOU KNOW, WHEN WE GO BACK TO THE U.I.

PIECE, IT'S ALMOST AS IF THE MARKET IS STARTING TO CORRECT ITSELF.

AUTO IT'S LIKELY WE ARE GOING TO SEE A MINIMUM WAGE WAGE INCREASE BUT THE MARKET REALLY IS INCREASING ITSELF.

AND I THINK THE THING WE PROBABLY-- WE HAVE ALL AGREED WITH EACH OTHER SO MUCH ON THIS STAGE AND WITH CYNTHIA ON ZOOM BUT THE ONE THING WE WOULD ALL AGREE IS THAT NONE OF US BELIEVE THAT COMPANIES SHOULD BE COMPETING WITH THE GOVERNMENT FOR WAGES.

AND RIGHT NOW, WITH SO MANY ON U.I., THAT'S WHAT'S HAPPENING.

SO AN EMPLOYER HAS TO PAY $17.50 TO MATTER THE WAIM TO GET SOMEBODY OFF U.I.

AND MAKE IT WORTH THAT PERSON'S WHILE.

PEOPLE ARE GETTING LOGICAL.

THEY ARE STAYING HOME WITH THEIR KIDS THEY HAVE THE FINANCIAL SUPPORT TO DO IT RIGHT NOW.

WHAT HAPPENS IN OCTOBER?

THAT'S A BIG PIECE.

WHAT HAPPENS TO THE BUSINESSES?

THEY CAN'T GET THE WORKERS BACK.

DO THEY GO TO OTHER STATES?

KENTUCKY HAS THE SMALLEST WORKFORCE IN THE ENTIRE NATION AND IF WE LOSE THESE BUSINESSES, WHAT JOBS WILL THERE BE TO COME BACK TO ON TOP OF AUTOMATION?

WE CAN'T HAVE BUSINESSES COMPETING WITH THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT FOR WAGES.

>> Renee: CAITLIN, THAT'S A GOOD POINT ABOUT BUSINESSES, YOU KNOW, COMPETING WITH GOVERNMENT WHEN IT COMES TO WAGES.

YOUR RESPONSE.

>> THERE IS RESEARCH OUT OF UNIVERSITY OF CHICAGO AND I THINK I SAW ANOTHER STUDY FROM JAIL THAT LOOKED AT THE $600 FEDERAL UNEMPLOYMENT ASSISTANCE EXPANSION IN THE CARES ACT.

AND THEY LOOKED AT THE PEOPLE RETURNING TO THE WORKFORCE BEFORE THAT EXPIRED AND AFTER.

AND WHAT THEY CONCLUDED WAS THAT THERE WAS NOT A BIG DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THAT OR THE OTHER.

THE OTHER THING I HAVE TO SAY IS, YOU KNOW, THE U.S. CENSUS DATA AS OF YOU KNOW, QUARTER ONE IN TWN 2021 SAID ONE IN FOUR KENTUCKIANS WHO HAD APPLIED FOR UNEMPLOYMENT HAD NOT RECEIVED ANY BENEFITS.

SO IF 25% OF WORKERS ARE NOT RECEIVING ANY BENEFITS AND THEY'RE STILL STAYING HOME, THAT JUST SUGGESTS THAT THIS MIGHT BE THE CASE FOR SOME PEOPLE THAT THEY'RE STAYING HOME, BUT IT IS CERTAINLY A LARGER ISSUE AND CUTTING OFF $34 MILLION A WEEK, >> Renee: THAT'S WHAT THE GOVERNOR SAID DURING HIS PRESS CONFERENCE.

>> $34 MILLION A WEEK GOING INTO THE KENTUCKY ECONOMY, THAT COULD BE A WALL FOR WHAT'S ONLY A RECOVERY OF OPENING UP IN A MONTH AND A HALF, NOT EVEN A MONTH SINCE JUNE 11.

SO YOU KNOW, FAMILIES NEED THAT TO PLUG THEIR BUDGETS RIGHT NOW.

AND THERE ARE STUDIES THAT SUGGEST THAT THIS IS NOT A MARATHONING MOTIVATING FACTOR FOR PEOPLE STAYING HOME OR RETURNING TO THE WORKFORCE; THAT THERE ARE OTHER THINGS AT PLAY LIKE CHILD CARE, TRANSPORTATION IS SOMETHING WE HAVEN'T TOUCHED ON, WHICH IS A BIGGIE.

>> Renee: WHAT SHOULD BE DO THAN IN THAT AREA?

WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY TRANSPORTATION IS A BARRIER?

>> I WISH I HAD THE ANSWER FOR THAT ONE.

THIS IS A PROBLEM, TRANSPORTATION, THAT WAS A PROBLEM BEFORE COVID-19, A BIG PROBLEM WHEN IT CAMES TO WORKFORCE DEVELOPMENT AND BARRIERS TO WORK.

SO THERE ARE PROGRAMS THAT ARE LOOKING AT UBER AND LYFT TO GET PEOPLE TO WORK UNTIL THEY QUALIFY FOR PROGRAMS LIKE GOODWILL HAS THAT ARE WHEELS TO WORK.

THERE ARE A LOT OF DIFFERENT THINGS WE CAN LOOK AT BUT EXPANDING PUBLIC TRANSPORTATION IS A BIG ONE, YOU KNOW.

IN LOUISVILLE, WHERE I LIVE, AND WHERE A LOT OF MY MEMBERS WORK, IF YOU WORK ON SECOND OR THIRD SHIFT, THERE ARE PLACES WHERE YOU WORK WHERE YOU ARE OUT OF LUCK WHEN YOU GET OUT OF WORK IF YOU WANT TO GET HOME.

SO LOOKING AT THESE TYPES OF THINGS, AND SOLVING THESE BIG PROBLEMS THAT WERE THERE BEFORE AND JUST MADE WORSE BY COVID-19 IS SOMETHING THAT WE ALL NEED TO BE COMING TOGETHER TO DO.

>> Renee: SO IN A MINUTE AND A HALF LEFT, IT'S HARD TO GET A QUESTION AND ANSWER IN THAT TIES IT ALL TOGETHER BUT I'LL YIELD TO OUR ECONOMISTS.

A FINAL TAKEAWAY ABOUT WHERE WE ARE.

>> SO BACK TO-- I DON'T WANT TO-- CHILD CARE IS A REAL ISSUE AND IT IS SERIOUS AND TRANSPORTATION.

BUT ONE OF THE THINGS BUSINESSES HAVE DISCOVERED IS THE ABILITY TO HAVE A MORE FLEX BIBL WORKPLACE-- FLEXIBLE WORKPLACE.

AND IT IS CLEAR WOMEN BORE THE BRUNT OF LEAVING THE JOB MARKET.

BUT I ACTUALLY THINK IN THE LONG RUN, THEY MAY REAP A BIGGER BENEFIT BECAUSE ONCE EMPLOYERS GET USED TO HAVING A FLEXIBLE WORKPLACE, THEN WOMEN ARE BETTER ABLE TO BALANCE TABLING CARE OF CHIRP, TAKING CARE OF THE ELLIE, -- THE ELDERLY, MAYBE CONVINCING HUSBANDS TO PLAY ALONG AND PARTICIPATE IN THAT AS WELL.

BECAUSE NOW FOR THOSE THAT ARE CAPABLE OF WORKING FROM HOME, I THINK THIS WILL BE A MAJOR BENEFIT AND I THINK GOING FORWARD, WE'LL SEE WOMEN ABLE TO KEEP THEIR CAREERS, ATTACHMENT TO THE LABOR MARKET AND STILL RAISE A FAMILY.

>> Renee: THAT'S ONE THING WE DIDN'T TALK ABOUT ENOUGH.

THE FLEXIBILITY AND REMOTE WORK ABILITIES AND INCENTIVES PASSED BY THE LEGISLATURE TO ENABLE REMOTE WORK.

THANK YOU ALL.

THIS HAS BEEN A GREAT DISCUSSION.

I APPRECIATE YOU VERY MUCH.

WE APPRECIATE ALL OF YOU.

MAKE SURE YOU TUNE INTO COMMENT ON KENTUCKY ON FRIDAYS AT 8:00 EASTERN SEVEN CENTRAL.

BILL BRYANT AND THE GANG OF JMENTS WILL BREAK DOWN THE NEWS OF THE WEEK AND I'LL SEE NEW TWO WEEKS ON KENTUCKY TONIGHT TAKE