(crowd cheering) (crowd applauding) - David Morales is gonna have a lot of goodwill from a lot of people.

There was passion for him that you've never seen before, probably since Buddy Cianci.

- Block has always been a fairly strong candidate.

The real question is, can he close that final gap?

Hey, at least now we got a proper governor's race.

- He kind of goes out of his way to kill Sabina Matos with kindness.

While he has done really well in the debates, who's watching lieutenant governor's debate?

(esteemed music) - And welcome to our latest episode of "Lively."

I'm Jim Hummel, joined this week by Providence Journal State House reporter Patrick Anderson and Boston Globe columnist Dan McGowan.

Well, now it is a race.

Independent Ken Block has gained significant ground against Democrat Helena Foulkes, according to a poll released this week by Emerson College and WPRI-TV.

Here's the breakdown in the campaign for governor.

Foulkes has 44%, Block has 35%, and Republican Aaron Guckian comes in at 10%, just 9% remain undecided.

Surprised by this poll or not?

Ken Block has made up some ground.

- Maybe a little bit.

Not hugely surprised.

A lot of times these races do tighten up towards the end.

And I think Block has always been a fairly strong candidate.

The real question is, it's great to get it to 10, 9 points, make it a real race.

Can he close that final gap?

That's a real big question.

It's gonna be a real challenge to get that final percentage down.

But, hey, at least now we got a proper governor's race.

That's somethin'.

- Well, better than primary, right?

- [Patrick] Yeah.

- Yeah, I mean, look, Ken Block is in position, but the position right now is, still looking at the polls, is that he might be sitting here two years from now complaining about how he's not the governor, right?

And so he's got a lot of work to do to get over the top here.

And, you know, there's so much debate about whether or not Aaron Guckian should drop out of the race.

But what it's starting to kinda look like is if you go back to 2018 when Joe Trillo was in the race, we all think of that as the Joe Trillo third-party candidacy, actually that race ended up Gina Raimondo and Allan Fung combined to get about 90% of the vote, the others got 10% of the vote.

That's kinda where we're at right now.

It looks like Aaron Guckian will be somewhere in that 10% range, the two other nominal candidates will get 1% of the vote.

And so what Ken Block, and I think Joe Fleming from Channel 12 kinda pointed this out this week, Ken Block needs to eat into Helena Foulkes's numbers.

You know, I don't think Aaron Guckian's gonna get much smaller than 8% to 10%.

- I mean, don't you think 10% is the absolute floor?

You just sign up and you probably get 10%.

- Yeah, and even if he did drop out, he's gonna be on the ballot.

- Right.

- So a certain percentage are gonna go to him anyway.

There's a certain- - And short of giving an endorsement, which is never gonna happen.

He would have to come out in full throat and say, "I want all of my people to vote for Ken Block," which is- - Even then, if he's on the ballot, he's the endorsed Republican candidate.

There are gonna be some voters who are gonna show up and they're gonna vote for the Republican candidate.

And the thing that is tough for Block, and you really saw in that last poll, is that his support really is Republicans, conservatives, Trump voters.

He really didn't do well.

When you break down the presidential vote from 2024, he did worse than John Loughlin in the lieutenant governor's race among voters who voted for Kamala Harris for president.

And that math isn't gonna work for him, because obviously more people in Rhode Island voted for Kamala.

So he's got a small, fighting for a small... He needs that larger chunk to eat into what Helena has 'cause he's gonna have, even the Trump vote, some portion of that is gonna go to Aaron Guckian, even if he did drop out.

- Yeah, I think the two challenges, right, for Ken Block are, okay, he's got this problem of an Aaron Guckian or just any number of votes that don't go to him.

He's staring at that challenge.

And he's also just a candidate who, you know, is not... We don't know that he's organized enough yet to run a modern campaign, you know, in 2026.

You know, what's his early vote strategy?

What's his mail ballot strategy when it comes- - [Jim] That the machine of a party- - [Dan] Can do, right.

- I remember talking to Linc Chafee when he was running against Ken Block the first time in 2010.

Frank Caprio was the Democrat and John Robitaille, he almost pulled it out.

And I remember Linc saying, "The one downside is I don't have a party hatchet man who can go after somebody and do the dirty work and all the infrastructure."

Now he won, but I think that was a confluence of the Chafee name and everything else.

But that goes right to what is your strategy of the nuts and bolts of running an election?

- Yeah.

And Helena Foulkes, you know, suddenly all of these labor unions are saying, "We love you.

We've always loved you."

- Who would've predicted?

- Yeah, right.

"And we've got all this money to throw at you."

So she's gonna have that.

She's obviously a great fundraiser in and of her own.

There's probably gonna be some other third-party money coming into this race.

There's just gonna be a lot of organization behind Helena Foulkes where you could see a scenario, yes, I could see it really tightening up and Helena Foulkes winning by a couple of points.

I could also see a scenario where she gets over 50% of the vote.

It ends up being like a 52-37 race, or something like that.

- Yeah, 'cause the other part of that is she still has dry powder on advertising.

- Yeah.

- And he has a dilemma in that when you, another thing in that poll, is he has really good favorables compared to her, which is good for him and is really a fact the pride that he hasn't been through damaging primaries.

But those favorables go down if you get, once you get into an air war and a negative campaign war, once he starts attacking her and she starts attacking him, his good favorables are gonna drop like a rock.

- But that largely hasn't happened.

We're three weeks out- - [Patrick] No, but he's in the dilemma.

- But are those in the pipeline, do you think it's gonna go negative?

- Well, Helena has that in her back pocket if she needs it.

The real dilemma for him is does he go there?

'Cause he's, right now, in that kind of prisoner's dilemma when you have a three-way race where if he goes negative, then his favorables go down.

- Yeah.

- Helena's probably at a floor 'cause she's been pounded by Dan McKee- - [Jim] Right.

- for, what, for six years.

- [Jim] Right.

- And then you still have the Guckian problem where he kind of gets a free ride.

I mean, that was part of the reason why when you go back to 2022 and Helena came into the race late and didn't do anything and was quiet and didn't attack Dan McKee, 'cause she was worried about Nellie Gorbea and she didn't want- - Oh, right, yeah.

- And so that is a kinda another problem for Ken.

- Yeah, I mean, you know, I don't wanna discount Ken's chances.

I think those favorable numbers are really good.

They're way better than I actually would've anticipated if you were to ask me ahead of that poll.

So he is in a perfectly good spot.

It's just not quite there.

At least I'm not sure I'm buying that he's quite there to get over the top in this race.

- You know, I've heard some people say he could've gone the Republican primary route, you know, most likely taken out Guckian.

And then it would be head-to-head, which is what he wanted.

I think the problem with that is having an R next to your name in this election, it's all the baggage... Look, Linc Chafee found that out when he ran against Sheldon Whitehouse 20 years ago.

He had 65% approval ratings, but because, no, it was Congress.

- Right.

- But people didn't want a Republican.

So what do you think about that?

- [Dan] Yeah.

- That theory, he should've gone the Republican primary route?

- Well, look, there's gonna be a lot of woulda, coulda, shouldas if the race shakes out to, you know, him almost winning, right?

So there's gonna be a lot of that.

I think when it comes to the, you know, whether or not he should've run as a Republican, I think you're exactly right.

You know, yes, maybe it would've made sense to get a heads-up one-on-one race, but having the R next to your name is not very good in Rhode Island.

And so- - Especially this year.

This is not a year you want that.

- It's a bad year to be a Republican.

And I think Ken Block, kind of, sometimes gets high in his own supply a little bit.

He thinks that, "Oh, everybody knows that I went after Trump," or, "I've disproved Trump.

I wrote a book about it."

- [Jim] Which is why he's doing that ad right now.

- Right, but nobody actually knows that.

Nobody remembers that.

That book didn't sell, you know, it wasn't a New York Times bestseller forever, or anything like that.

So he does have this challenge of, yeah, you know, she can paint him as a traditional Republican, bad word in Rhode Island.

He has to spend a lot of time saying, "No, no, I've taken on Trump, but I'm also conservative."

It's a tough message.

- But he's also not very well-liked by the Republican Party 'cause the people have long memories.

They think he cost John Robitaille the race back in 2010.

And that ugly primary with Allan Fung in 2014.

- I mean, right now, the Rhode Island Republican Party, it's difficult to find who they like.

They can't consolidate around anything.

Yeah, I mean, there are kind of whisper campaigns going on about will Republicans try to get Aaron Guckian out of the race?

You know, I don't know if that's gonna happen, he's still on the ballot anyway.

Yeah, I mean, another interesting thing is you see the Democrats, both Helena and then the Democratic governors, running ads linking Ken Block to Trump and then also linking Aaron Guckian to Trump to try to make sure voters- - [Jim] Remember.

- remember him and keep him salient and kind of keep him up around at least that 10%.

- Lieutenant governor's race, that was the undercard, but maybe should've been the headline.

It has John Loughlin in a statistical basically tie, maybe a little ahead of Sabina Matos.

What do you make of that?

- Yeah, I mean, look, John Loughlin has always been, I think, a formidable candidate in this race, right?

He's a charming guy.

He's run before and did well against David Cicilline.

And so, you know, he's kinda somebody who I think is liked by the press generally.

He's affable, he gives good quotes, those kinda things.

You know, to have him in the lead, I'm sure he feels like he's in a great spot.

Getting from 45 to 50, though, this is a one-on-one race, I think that's gonna be very difficult.

Now, his numbers look really good among independents.

He's obviously gonna win, virtually, all of the Republicans.

So he is in a real spot here, but, you know, it's the Allan Fung problem, is can you get from 45, 46 to 50, 51- - [Jim] In a two-way race.

- in a two-way race.

- Yeah, it's gonna be interesting to see what turnout is in Providence.

I don't know if Sabina Matos' campaign wants to kind of boost Dave Talan in the mayoral race so then David Morales gets back in and gets more of that vote to boost turnout- - You give me a headache thinkin' about all of those scenarios.

But at the end of the day, it comes down to what Dan said, and a little bit about Helena Foulkes, do Democrats come home at the end of the day?

Does Loughlin even have to pull a few Democrats in addition to independents?

- Yeah, probably.

In the last couple of cycles, that has been what's happened.

I mean, you look at Seth Magaziner versus Allan Fung.

I mean, you look at Gina Raimondo's races.

I mean, she did better in the final analysis than her polling before the election.

I mean, this is a midterm year with a unpopular, in Rhode Island, Republican president.

So that's not a great dynamic.

- You know what John Loughlin has done really well so far in this campaign has been, if you look at the debates, he kind of goes out of his way to kill Sabina Matos with kindness.

He says, "You're a great-" - "I love your story, but your policies are awful."

- Yeah, but you're just totally incompetent, right?

But it's a smart strategy because I think the- - It's disarming.

- It's totally disarming, and it counteracts the argument that Sabina Matos probably wants to make, which is, "You're a big, bad Republican," you know, "You're a misogynist, you're racist," those kinda things.

John Loughlin is not coming across that way.

The challenge for him is that, you know, in these last couple of weeks, she probably will get a little bit of outside money help.

She'll probably get some Democratic Lieutenant Governor's Association money, I'm not sure he's gonna get very much.

And while he has done really well in the debates, who's watching lieutenant governor's debate?

You can kinda run a very strategic playbook of he's a big, bad Republican.

That's what she can do, and I think that's probably what she will do in the last couple of weeks.

- All right, just a couple more weeks and we will find out.

Providence is going to look a lot different beginning in January, at least at city hall where Democratic socialist David Morales is poised to become mayor and a progressive city council will likely be sworn in.

Add to that, a dysfunctional school board and there will be a lot to keep track of.

And who better to keep track of it than Mr.

Providence himself?

It is gonna be a big shift.

You know, always kinda the guardrail is you only have so much money to do what you wanna do, right?

So reality of campaigning and governing is gonna set in.

- Yeah.

I mean, look, I think everyone, if you like David Morales as the new mayor, you're gonna say that socialism works.

And so if, you know, you get a reduction in crime or you get the streets plowed really well, there's gonna be a bunch of people who really like him who are gonna say, "Well, it's clearly because he's a Democratic socialist."

If it goes off the rails, you're gonna hear people say, "Oh, it's entirely because he's a Democratic socialist."

The thing is it's gonna be because he did a good job, you know, plowing the streets or keeping crime, you know, if the police did a good job.

You know, realistically, I think it is true.

The city's finances are still in a pretty precarious position.

There's not a lot of- - Unfunded pension liability, all of that.

- And payments to that pension system going up by 5% every single year.

It's really hard to do a lot of big things.

But, you know, David Morales is gonna have a lot of goodwill from a lot of people.

Like, he ran a really good campaign.

He organized lots of people.

There was passion for him that you've never seen before, probably since Buddy Cianci.

They're obviously very different people, but the passion behind, you know, and the supporters, I think that's what's pretty comparable.

So, you know, I think he's in a good spot right now.

Just it's gonna be hard to imagine him doing very much based on what the city's financial condition looks like.

- Yeah, I mean, a lot of people are watching who he's... I mean, we haven't gotten through the general, well, the caveat that- - Is that Dave Talan's not gonna beat him but, all right.

- Just with that caveat out of the way, a lot of folks are watching who he hires when he gets in office.

And the New York City echo is relevant.

And Zohran Mamdani, when he got in, he kept a lot of veteran city hall people and people with a lot of government experience and did not fill it entirely with activists.

And I think that's what a lot of Democrats are, kinda statewide Democrats, are looking at with David Morales.

Does he bring in a lot of experienced people who, you know, they know and kind of trust?

And does he pivot a little bit more to pragmatism and more practicality rather than go after some of the more kind of ideological ideas?

And does he welcome development?

I think that's like a question that people are gonna be looking at.

He was very hostile to developers and landlords in the campaign, but, you know, they're gonna come and ask and see, you know, whether he wants them to build in the city.

- And they're the ones who are gonna widen the tax base and ultimately help you financially.

But Providence is not an easy place to build either.

- No, it's very difficult to build, especially without tax subsidy.

Patrick and I have covered years and years of tax stabilization agreements, you know, for developers of all kinds.

And that is kind of, as Mayor Smiley would say, "It's one of the only tools in your toolbox when you're the mayor of Providence, it's giving out tax breaks to developers."

Look, I think he's gonna have to moderate a little bit on those issues.

He's gonna have to find a way, you know, to work with developers, probably add in some, you know, clauses in some of those deals that, you know, require more union work or require things that developers don't like but they can kind of deal with.

I think Patrick's exactly right.

You know, there's this big question of who he's gonna put around him.

I think the truth is there are a lot of people who work in government currently who are more progressive than the current mayor or than Governor McKee.

And so there are people, you know, who he's looking at who have real-life government experience, who just happen to also be maybe, you know, closeted democratic socialists.

- Are government jobs as attractive as they, management jobs, as 10 or 20 years ago?

Is he gonna have a problem bringing, for the salary you get and all of the aggravation, or is it, "Wow, this is a new experiment, this is a new Providence, it'll be public service for me," what- - I think he'll be fine.

I think he'll find the people that he wants to find.

There's still, you know, 150, $200,000 jobs in city government.

Those are pretty good jobs for people who wanna go into, you know, public service.

I think bigger questions arise at, you know, the DOT director, there's always the debate around whether or not they should have a big salary.

But at the city level, you wanna be the chief of staff, you wanna be like the director of administration or whatever they call that job now.

Those jobs pay just fine and I think he'll be able to fill it out.

It's a question of, "Is he gonna fill it out with people, you know, who are credible within state government and within city government, or is he gonna surround himself with, you know, activists?"

- Yeah.

And then the schools will be another thing.

Dan knows a lot more about that.

- That's a dumpster fire right now, though, right?

- Yeah, I mean, I don't know what's going on there with the school board.

They wanted it.

They wanted the schools back in their control.

- [Jim] Now they got it.

- Now they got it.

And- - Maybe that's Smiley's revenge.

He pushed for it.

Now it's like, "You know what?

I'm outta here."

- Yeah.

So that's what we're gonna be watching.

And then we're gonna be watching, a little bit, especially people like me, where some of the folks from the Smiley administration go.

- [Jim] Yeah.

- Do they go into state government because a lot of those people did come from Gina Raimondo's administration.

You know, do you have a shuttling backup to- - Right, if it's potentially Helena Foulkes, right?

- Right.

- Yes.

Where does the mayor go, right?

- Right, exactly.

We don't know where... I mean, I was a little surprised.

I know the campaign was, you know, a little personal and a little harsh.

I was a little surprised at the tone that Mayor Smiley took after the vote, after the primary.

You know, I don't know what he gains by- - You mean not endorsing?

- Not endorsing and really not being, I don't know, kind of contrite to the voters and saying, you know, "Well, the voters have spoken."

I mean, obviously he's not challenging the vote, but there was just a real sense of, you know, I still don't like this guy.

- [Jim] Yeah, you know- - But you don't see that often within the party.

- I understand your point about the way he went about it, but it always has driven me nuts when people just beat the hell out of each other, and then, "I endorse this person."

I mean, McKee did that immediately with friends.

- It usually happens.

- It always happens.

But I mean, I give credit, if he doesn't believe in anything he's saying, why would he endorse him?

- I think the endorsement is one thing.

I think to Patrick's point, what Mayor Smiley has done post-election is he hasn't, in many ways, it certainly appears as though he's not lifting a finger to help in any way.

- [Jim] Right.

- And so- - [Jim] That's another- - use the US Conference of Mayors as a good example.

That conference was gonna pull out if Brett Smiley lost.

That was gonna happen.

That's sort of how this works.

Mayor Smiley could have, you know, stood with David Morales and said, "Look, this is good for economic development.

We need this conference here."

Even if- - [Jim] Did nothing.

- He did nothing of the sort.

Now, he says behind the scenes he's working hard to, you know, get a smooth transition.

I'll take him at his word for that.

But he isn't shy about talking to The Providence Journal, talking to the Globe, talking to anybody about why he doesn't like David Morales, why he doesn't agree with Democratic socialism.

He's not hiding any of it.

- Yeah, pipe down on that.

The last thing on this, you know, we're getting a preview with the flock cameras that he doesn't like it, the city council, they're not gonna take a vote this week, but, you know, the word is out, we're gonna get rid of it.

And I wonder how that's gonna square with the police chief who's very much behind it and what his relationship's gonna be.

I've heard the union president on talk radio.

How that's gonna flush out with his administration and an old guard public safety?

- Is Morales gonna keep the police chief?

I mean, that's part of that staffing question where we don't know where he's gonna go.

Is he gonna find someone completely new, someone from out of the city?

Does he stick continuity to reassure people that, "Oh, wow, it was a big campaign and there was a lot of big talk and big ideas, but I'm gonna be very pragmatic about it and keep the status quo."

That's what the personnel is policy kind of thing.

- And that's what Mamdani did.

He kept in New York.

- [Dan] He kept Jessica Tisch.

- Yeah, exactly.

What do you think about public safety?

- Well, what I was gonna say was, you know, it's what he has said, he wants to keep, you know, Chief Perez as the chief.

But what we're wondering is, you know, it's like if I say I wanna hire Patrick, but I wanna send Patrick to New Hampshire to cover politics or something like that, right, he wants to keep Chief Perez- - [Jim] What's the job gonna be?

- But what's it gonna actually look like?

And this Flock situation- - If he hires a public safety person over the top of him- - Exactly.

- who takes all of his responsibility, right?

- That's exactly right.

And these guys are gonna have a real issue on Flock.

When you're the mayor, right now it's easy to say, "We don't like Flock.

We don't like Flock."

But the first time one of those cameras solves a major crime- - Like the Brown shooting- - Like the Brown- - Or it doesn't.

Or the next time there's a shooting and they don't have the suspect in custody- - Right.

- And they're gonna say, "Who is it?"

Well, we don't know.

- 'Cause we don't, right, we don't have the tools.

- Because during that Brown shooting, I mean, this was less than a year ago.

I went to press conference after press conference and people were screaming, "There are not enough cameras."

I mean, you couldn't believe the way that public opinion on this changed- - [Jim] Shifted, right.

- Where you couldn't have enough surveillance.

- Well, and let's also just face it.

The reality is, and with all respect to the Providence Police Department, the first time they can't solve a crime, they're gonna be calling Jim Hummel and Patrick Anderson, Dan McGowan, complaining, whether privately or publicly, about how they're hamstrung, you know?

- Just lastly, before we get to outrageous and kudos, you had a great story on the truck tolls.

I've been kinda wondering, the state has invested so much money with the lawsuit and getting the technology back up to stuff.

Now you have three candidates for governor saying, "We don't want 'em."

So what happens?

- Yeah.

I mean, it's not up to them exclusively.

It's in state law.

The legislature approved it.

So even on day one, they can't just say no truck tolls.

But on the other hand, it's difficult- - But the administration could say, "We're not gonna implement it."

- Right, exactly.

They have to enforce it.

It's not just like the tax code where it's mechanical.

You have to set up these gantries, which it's taken them, I don't know what takes two and a half to three years- - [Jim] To figure out the technology.

- Yeah, I mean there are cameras on poles.

I mean, it's not AI we're trying to figure out here.

But I think there has been some foot dragging from the McKee administration.

I don't think it's a coincidence that they did not light up right before the election.

But it's gonna be a big decision for the legislature and the next governor.

You know, would I be completely shocked if Helena Foulkes won and then gets an office and say- - [Jim] Change her mind.

- "Well, we have to look at this.

We have to study this.

We have to think a little more carefully about the budget and where we're gonna get the money and-" - Well, you gotta plug a $40 million hole, but that's a lot different on a $15 billion budget.

Plus, the DOT's budget is increasing.

- Tell that to the laborers who are just writing a check to her and who got the truck tolls passed in the first place.

- Yeah, that is true.

- Yeah.

And I mean, the thing I, when I was reading Patrick's story about this this week, the most telling quote probably came from the speaker's office, which said, you know, they can basically essentially put this in the budget if they want to.

There is a part of me that wonders if maybe, to Patrick's point, you get a scenario where if Helena does become the governor, now completely all bets are off if anyone else does, but if Helena becomes the governor, you get a situation where maybe the House is the one that kinda takes this on the chin and says, "No, no, no, we're going forward with it.

We already approved it.

We've already been through these fights.

You're gonna do this."

And then she could kinda throw up her hands and say- - "Oh, I gotta kinda do it."

- "What was I supposed to do," you know?

- Right, and there is a sunk cost, a significant sunk cost in the legal bills and all of the money that they have put in to try to stand this thing out.

- Yeah, but that's yesterday's news.

When you have Cardi's and Ocean State Job Lot, and all these businesses that it's gonna be on their backs, that's an awful, yeah, it's a hump to get over, right?

- Yeah, well, which is why you probably have to, you know, my guess is they probably will not implement it.

I think that, if we're betting a man, if everybody says that they're not gonna do it, that's probably what will happen.

- All right, let's do outrage and/or kudo.

Mr.

Anderson, what do you have this week?

- Well, I've gotta go to the story that every media outlet seemed to have, everyone seemed to be in Cranston a couple of weeks ago at the Santa Maria Di Prata Society, I guess, meeting over whether women should be allowed at their meetings.

And, you know, I take no position on the underlying question, but it is just amazing.

Can't we get along in a social... I mean, the idea is to have community, have fun, to enjoy yourself.

And just the fighting, I can't believe it.

- They were channeling their inner Gloria Steinem.

- Yeah, I think so.

And then just one other note about it is that it does receive taxpayer funding.

- Oh, it does.

- This and other social clubs have grants from- - Legislative grants.

- Exactly, from the General Assembly.

So you are paying for this.

- [Jim] That's wild.

- And what are we gonna do about the eggplant?

The eggplant.

- So the Globe and the Journal both had stories on this.

I commend you to read that.

What do you have this week?

- Well, the Rhode Island Comprehensive Assessment System scores came out last Friday.

And once again, Rhode Island is kind of certainly lagging behind Massachusetts and kind of kept its scores stable but didn't improve in any way.

I think the thing that I'm most outraged about is I'm old enough to remember when people got mad at low test scores.

You used to have the business community and the politicians and everybody stepping up to say, "We have to do something."

- Now it's meh.

- Complete silence.

- [Jim] Yeah.

- And even this governor's race, you have to ask them to give any sort of opinion on anything.

- Do you think they kinda resigned to the fact we're never gonna get beyond mid?

- Which is terribly tragic.

We're two guys that have young children in these school systems.

And, you know, when you're talking about a third, only a third of the population can do math or read at grade level.

Now, look, it's not all about tests, but there's no question that we have a challenge, you know, an increasingly challenging situation in our schools, not just the, you know, the ones we suspect to be bad, Providence and things like that, and there's just complete crickets from everybody on how we're gonna fix it.

- All right, Dan and Patrick, thank you.

We're gonna be reading your stuff going down the stretch.

And thank you for joining us.

Be sure and check us out on Facebook, X, Instagram, and on the Ocean State Media YouTube channel and wherever you get your favorite podcast.

We'll see you next time right here on "Lively."

(enigmatic music) - [Presenter] "Lively" is generously supported in part by John Hazen White's "Lookout."