>> Braude: TONIGHT ON "GREATER BOSTON": CONGRESSMAN JAKE AUCHINCLOSS JOINS ME ON RUSSIA'S WAR ON UKRAINE.

HAVE WE DONE ENOUGH?

THE THREAT OF NUCLEAR WAR AND BIDEN'S FRAMING OF IT ALL AS A BATTLE FOR DEMOCRACY ITSELF.

PLUS, ATTORNEY GENERAL MAURA HEALEY ON HER BID TO BECOME MASSACHUSETTS' NEXT GOVERNOR.

♪♪ >> Braude: MORE THAN 2,000 UKRAINIAN CIVILIANS HAVE BEEN KILLED IN THE RUSSIA INVASION SO FAR, ACCORDING TO UKRAINE'S STATE OF EMERGENCY SERVICE, WHICH SAYS HOUSES, HOSPITALS, AND KINDERGARTENS HAVE BEEN DESTROYED.

AND RUSSIAN TROOPS HAVE BEEN STEADILY GAINING GROUND ON MAJOR CITIES, THOUGH THAT 40-MILE RUSSIAN CONVOY OUTSIDE KYIV APPEARS TO BE STALLED.

THE U.N. GENERAL ASSEMBLY VOTED OVERWHELMINGLY TODAY TO CONDEMN RUSSIA FOR ITS ACTIONS, BUT SUCH A VOTE COMES WITH LITTLE ACTION.

AND ACTION IS WHAT UKRAINE'S PRESIDENT HAS BEEN PLEADING FOR SINCE THE INVASION BEGAN A WEEK AGO.

STILL, JOE BIDEN REITERATED IN LAST NIGHT'S STATE OF THE UNION ADDRESS, THE U.S. WILL RELY ON SANCTIONS AND ECONOMIC MEASURES TO TRY TO STOP PUTIN, NOT TROOPS ON THE GROUND IN UKRAINE.

BUT HE MADE IT CLEAR: THERE IS A LOT ON THE LINE IN THIS WAR.

>> THROUGHOUT OUR HISTORY, WE'VE LEARNED THIS LESSON: WHEN DICTATORS DO NOT PAY A PRICE FOR THEIR AGGRESSION, THEY CAUSE MORE CHAOS.

THEY KEEP MOVING.

>> Braude: I'M JOINED NOW BY CONGRESSMAN JAKE AUCHINCLOSS OF NEWTON, A FORMER MARINE WHO SERVED IN AFGHANISTAN AND A MEMBER OF THE HOUSE SUBCOMMITTEE ON NATIONAL SECURITY, INTERNATIONAL DEVELOPMENT, AND MONETARY POLICY.

>> Braude: CONGRESSMAN, GOOD TO SEE YOU AGAIN.

>> YOU AS WELL.

>> Braude: YOU WERE HERE A COUPLE OF WEEKS AGO.

YOU SAID YOU PRAISED THE PRESIDENT FOR THREATENING SANCTIONS, WORKING WITH ALLIES, ORGANIZING THEM, AND OFFERING AID.

HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT HIS PERFORMANCE TWO WEEKS LATER?

>> HIS PERFORMANCE HAS BEEN SUPERB, VIS-AÀ-VIS, UKRAINE.

THIS SPEECH WILL BE REMEMBERED AGAINST THE CONTEXT OF THIS UNPROVOKED, UNJUST INVASION.

HE IS RALLYING THE FREE WORLD IN A WAY AMERICANS EXPECT THEIR COMMANDER IN CHIEF TO DO.

HE IS MAKING CLEAR IN THE LONG RUN THIS INVASION WILL LEAVE RUSSIA WEAKER AND AMERICA STRONGER.

AND HE IS MAKING DLEER WE CLEAR WE CAN USE DIPLOMACY, WHICH WILL BE THE KEY TO WEAKENING THE KREMLIN.

>> Braude: I'M SURE YOU'RE NOT SURPRISED THAT ALL OF YOUR COLLEAGUES, INCLUDING THE GOVERNOR FROM THE MIDWEST, WHO DISAGREED.

>> WE SHOULDN'T IGNORE WHAT HAPPENED IN THE RUN-UP TO PUTIN'S INVASION INVASION, WHILE ELIMINATING OIL PRODUCTION HERE AT HOME, FOCUSING ON POLITICAL CORRECTNESS RATHER THAN MILITARY READINESS.

REACTING TO WORLD EVENTS INSTEAD OF DRIVING THEM.

WEAKNESS ON THE WORLD STAGE HAS A COST.

AND THE PRESIDENT'S APPROACH TO FOREIGN POLICY HAS CONSISTENTLY BEEN TOO LITTLE, TOO LATE.

>> Braude: WHAT IS YOUR RESPONSE TO THE GOVERNOR, CONGRESSMAN?

>> IT IS DIFFICULT TO EVEN KNOW WHERE TO START WHEN THE PARTY OF DONALD TRUMP IS SAYING THAT PRESIDENT BIDEN IS TOO WEAK AGAINST VLADIMIR PUTIN.

I MEAN, THE IRONY IS ALMOST SUFFOCATING.

WE ARE TALKING ABOUT A GUY WHOSE PERFORMANCE IN HELSINKI WAS CALLED DISGUSTING BY JOHN McCAIN.

PRESIDENT BIDEN DID NOT LEVY THOSE SANCTIONS BEFORE THE INVASION BECAUSE WE NEEDED THEM AS A SOURCE OF DETERRENT.

AND NOW THAT VLADIMIR PUTIN HAS SEEN WHAT THE UNITED STATES SAYS IT IS GOING TO DO, WE ARE GOING TO DO, HE KNOWS WHEN WE SAY WE'LL DEFEND EVERY INCH OF NATO TERRITORY, WE MEAN IT.

THAT WILL DETER ANY ARMED CONFLICT IN POLAND, LITHUANIA, ROMANIA, AND OTHER STATES.

>> Braude: ARE THE SANCTIONS STRONG ENOUGH -- I READ WE WERE STILL IMPORTING ROUGHLY THREE-QUARTERS OF A MILLION BARRELS OF OIL FROM RUSSIA AT THE END OF THE YEAR.

I ASSUME THE NUMBERS ARE ROUGHLY THE SAME.

AND THE ONLY REASON WE CONTINUE TO DO IT BECAUSE POLITICIANS DON'T WANT TO CONFRONT THEIR CONSTITUENTS, SAYING YOU'RE SACRIFICE BY PAYING MORE AT THE PUMP IS NOWHERE NEAR THE SACRIFICE THES MEN AND WOMEN ARE MAKING IN UKRAINE, SO WE'VE JUST GOT TO DEAL WITH IT.

AM I WRONG?

>> I AGREE WITH YOU.

I'VE BEEN VERY CLEAR ON THIS ONE.

WHILE PUTIN HAS SUSTAINED BODY BLOWS WITH FINANCIAL AND TECHNICAL SANCTIONS AND WITH THE LETHAL AND HUMANITARIAN AID TO UKRAINE, HE HASN'T YET TAKEN A ROUND TO THE FACE, WHICH IS THE OIL.

WE NEED TO WORK WITH OUR OPEC AND EUROPEAN ALLIES, WE NEED TO SANCTION OIL AND NATURAL GAS.

IT IS, ONE, GOING TO TURBO CHARGE OUR OWN EMISSIONS TO A CLEAN ENERGY, AND, TWO, IT WILL DEMONSTRATE THAT THE FREE WORLD IS WITH UKRAINE.

>> Braude: SO WHY ISN'T BIDEN DOING IT?

>> BIDEN NEEDS TO WORK WITH AND THROUGH OUR ALLIES.

TO DATE, OUR STRENGTH HAS BEEN OUR UNITY ACROSS EUROPE AND THE UNITED STATES.

AND WHILE THE UNITED STATES COULD WITHSTAND VOLATILITY IN OUR OIL AND GAS MARKETS, OR EUROPEAN ALLIES ARE TREMENDOUSLY DEPENDENT, ESPECIALLY ON NATRAL GAS.

I FEEL LIKE WE SHOULD BE MOVING FARTHER FASTER AND STRONGER.

>> Braude: CONGRESSMAN, YOU SAID ABOUT THE LONG IMPACT.

BUT WHAT IS THERE IS NOT A LONG RUN.

A TERM, AND MILITARY EXPERTS TALK ABOUT POSSIBLE DECAPITATION OF PRESIDENT ZELENSKY, MEANING A REMOVAL OF THE GOVERNMENT.

AND OTHERS ARE TALKING ABOUT THE POSSIBILITY OF SOME, EVEN LIMITED, NUCLEAR ACTION.

OBVIOUSLY PUTIN THREATENED IT.

AND IF ZELENSKY WAS REMOVED, CONTINUED ASSAULTS AND KILLINGS OF CIVILIANS.

DO WE CONTINUE TO SIT BY OUR TELUS AND TELEVISIONS AND SAY HOW BRAVE UKRAINIANS ARE AND THAT'S IT?

>> I WANT TO COMPLICATE YOUR PREMISE SAYING THAT ALL AMERICANS ARE DOING IS SITTING BY THEIR TELEVISION.

WE HAVE LEVIED SANCTIONS THAT ARE THE HARDEST IN THE HISTORY OF AMERICAN HISTORY.

THE RUBLE HAS BEEN DESTROYED.

THEY'RE NOT GOING TO BE ABLE TO SUPPORT THE INDUSTRIAL COMPLEX, THEIR MARITIME OR AVIONICS COMPLEX.

RUSSIA IS IN SEVERE TROUBLE.

SO THIS HAS BEEN A SIGNIFICANT RESPONSE.

THOSE WHO ARE SAYING WE SHOULD DO MORE, AND OTHER THAN ENERGY, MY RETORT WOULD BE, WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT?

ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT MILITARY?

>> Braude: I'M ASKING YOU IF THE CIRCUMSTANCES CHANGE, DESPITE THE CRIPPLING NATURE OF THE SANCTIONS, LET'S ASSUME DESPITE THOSE AND THE LONG-TERM IMPACT ON THE ECONOMY AND POSSIBLY THE RULE OF PUTIN, THAT ZELENSKY IS DECAPITATED, THAT THE PEOPLE OF UKRAINE, AS COURAGEOUS AS THEY ARE, CONTINUE TO BE ASSAULTED AND MURDERED BY THE RUSSIANS.

WHAT DO WE DO THEN?

I DON'T HAVE AN ANSWER.

I DON'T WANT TO SEE TROOPS ON THE GROUND, EITHER.

I ASSUME MOST AMERICANS DON'T.

BUT CAN YOU IMAGINE TURNING ON YOUR TELEVISION AND SEEING A PUPPET IN OFFICE AND UKRAINIANS BEING BOMBED BY THE RUSSIANS AND SAYING WE'RE JUST GOING TO STAY THE COURSE ON SANCTIONS?

>> VLADIMIR PUTIN IS GOING TO LEARN THE HARD WAY THAT WARS ARE SIMPLE TO START AND THEY'RE A NIGHTMARE TO END.

WHAT WE'LL SEE OVER THE MEDIUM TURN IS A HIGHLY RESOLVED AND AFFECTIVE INSURGENCY THAT WILL BE REINFORCED BY WESTERN SANCTIONS.

AND, TWO, A DECLINING LIVING IN RUSSIA THAT ERODES HIS BASE OF SUPPORT.

THE TWO OF THOSE THINGS TOGETHER WILL BE A PINCHER MOVEMENT ON HIS CREDIBILITY.

I CAN'T PREDICT THE FUTURE, NOBODY CAN.

BUT WE ARE GOING ABLE TO CREATE A MORAS FOR HIM IN UKRAINE THAT I THINK WILL BE A SIGNIFICANT DETERRENT TO ANY FURTHER ACTION.

>> Braude: SORT OF WHAT WE FACED IN IRAQ WHEN WE THOUGHT WE WOULD BE GREETED BY CELEBRATION, OR AT LEAST OUR GOVERNMENT THOUGHT WE WOULD BE GREETED BY CELEBRATION.

CONGRESSMAN, CAN I BROACH A COUPLE OF THINGS THAT WERE NOT MENTIONED LAST NIGHT?

WERE YOU DISTURBED BY THE FACT THAT OTHER THAN 500,000 CHARGING STATIONS, THERE WAS NO MENTION OF THE GREATEST EXISTENTIAL THREAT TO OUR PLANET, CLIMATE CHANGE?

>> I WATCHED THIS MORNING SENATOR MANCHIN'S RESPONSE TO THE PRESIDENT DOMESTIC AGENDA, WHICH IS THE TO SAY THAT SENATOR MANCHIN WOULD SUPPORT NEGOTIATION OF DRUG PRICES AND HIGHER TAXES TO FUND INCREASED INVESTMENTS IN CLEAN ENERGY.

I'M WITH ELIZABETH WARREN.

I THINK THAT IS A GOOD DEAL AND WE SHOULD BE PURSUING THAT VIGOROUSLY BECAUSE CLEAN ENERGY INVESTMENTS HAVE MASSIVE IMPACTS ON NOT JUST THE UNITED STATES, BUT OUR GLOBAL CARBON FOOTPRINT.

>> Braude: HOW ABOUT BIDEN ESSENTIALLY NOT TOUCHING THE TOPIC?

>> PRESIDENT BIDEN CAMPAIGNED ON THE TOPIC, AND I DON'T THINK IT IS REALLY FAIR TO QUESTION WHERE HIS VIEWS AND POLICIES ARE.

HE PUT FORWARD SPECIFIC ACTION IN THE BUILD BACK BETTER AGENDA.

IT STALLED OUT AND WE'RE RESTARTING THOSE TALKS NOW.

AND SENATOR MANCHIN HAS BEEN CLEAR THAT CLIMATE IS ON THE AGENDA.

>> Braude: BUILD BACK BETTER AS OF LAST NIGHT IS NOT CALLED BUILD BACK BETTER, IT IS CALLED LOWER COSTS AND LOWER THE DEFICIT.

IF SOME CRITICAL ELEMENTS OF THAT ARE NOT LAW BY THE MID-TERM, SHOULD THE DEMOCRATS PAY A PRICE FOR THAT?

>> I THINK WE'RE GOING TO BE JUDGED AS A PARTY ON WHETHER WE'RE PUTTING COVID BEHIND US, PEOPLE FEEL LIKE THEY'RE LIVING THEIR NORMAL LIVES, WHETHER WE HAVE A STRONGER ECONOMY AHEAD OF US AND WHETHER WE'RE PROTECTING DEMOCRACY HOME AND ABROAD.

THOSE ARE THE THREE BIG PILLARS THAT AMERICANS NEED TO FEEL DEMOCRATS ARE DELIVERING ON.

NINE MONTHS IS AN ETERNITY IN POLITICS, AND I STILL FEEL CONFIDENT ABOUT OUR CHANCES IN THE MID-TERMS.

>> Braude: BEFORE YOU GO, I WAS THINKING, WHILE I WAS WATCHING THE SPEECH LAST NIGHT, ABOUT ALL OF YOU WHO HAVE SERVED IN THE MILITARY PRIOR TO YOUR SERVICE IN CONGRESS, WHEN THAT FOOL, THAT CONGRESSWOMAN FROM COLORADO GOT UP WHEN THE PRESIDENT WAS TALKING ABOUT SOLDIERS WHO DIED FOLLOWING EXPOSURE TO THESE MASSIVE BURN PITS, AND SHE STANDS UP AND YELLS AND HECKLES HIM.

WHAT WAS YOUR REACTION TO THAT, CONGRESSMAN?

>> SHE IS AN EMBARRASSMENT.

AND IT ANGERS ME THAT AMERICANS PERCEIVE HER, BECAUSE OF HER OUT-SIZED VISIBILITY ON CAPABLE NEWS AS SOME HOW REPRESENTATIVE OF MEMBERS OF CONGRESS.

SHE IS NOT.

SHE IS AN OUTLIER, SHE IS A JOKE.

WE, AS MEMBERS OF CONGRESS, OWE IT TO OURSELVES AND THE INSTITUTION TO EXHIBIT MUCH HIGHER LEVELS OF DECORUM THAN SHE DISPLAYED.

>> Braude: WELL EXHIBITING HIGHER LEVELS OF DECORUM IS NOT THAT HARD IN HER CASE.

JAKE AUCHINCLOSS, THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME.

>> TAKE CARE.

>> Braude: ATTORNEY GENERAL MAURA HEALEY ANNOUNCED HER RUN FOR MASSACHUSETTS GOVERNOR IN JANUARY.

SHE'S COMPETING WITH STATE SENATOR SONIA CHANG-DIAZ FOR THE DEMOCRATIC NOMINATION.

MAURA HEALEY JOINS ME NOW.

>> Braude: IT IS GOOD SEE YOU.

>> GREAT TO BE WITH YOU, JIM.

>> Braude: WHY ARE YOU RUNNING?

>> I LOVE MASSACHUSETTS.

I BELIEVE SO MUCH IN OUR STATE.

I BELIEVE IN OUR PEOPLE.

I ALSO BELIEVE MASSACHUSETTS HAS SOME OF THE BEST SCHOOLS AND HOSPITALS AND INNOVATIVE COMPANIES AND KNOW-HOW.

TOO MANY FAMILIES IN MASSACHUSETTS ARE JUST NOT SHARING IN THAT PROSPER R.I WANTPROSPERITIES.

I WANT TO INVEST IN OUR PEOPLE.

I WANT TO INVEST IN INFRASTRUCTURE, IN TRANSPORTATION, AND IN HOUSING.

I WANT TO BE THE MOST AGGRESSIVE GOVERNOR IN OUR K.WHENOURCOUNTRY WHEN IT COMES TO THE CLIMATE CHANGE.

I WANT TO BRING PRIORITIES OF MY OWN TO THIS OFFICE.

I HAVE SPENT A LOT OF TIME, AS YOU KNOW, WORKING ON ISSUES OF THE OPIOID EPIDEMIC AND SUBSTANCE ABUSE DISORDER.

AND AS GOVERNOR, I BELIEVE DEEPLY THAT WE NEED TO COMMIT RESOURCES TO MENTAL HEALTH SO THAT MORE PEOPLE IN THE STATE -- I DON'T WANT A SITUATION WHERE A SINGLE CHILD OR PERSON IN THIS STATE DOESN'T HAVE ACCESS TO THE BEHAVIORAL HEALTH SERVICES THAT THEY NEED.

AND, FINALLY, AS I'VE DONE AS ATTORNEY GENERAL, I WANT TO PUT EQUITY -- I WANT TO PUT EQUITY AS A LENS ON EVERYTHING THAT WE DO.

SO I HAVE THE VISION.

I HAVE THE IDEAS.

AND I KNOW WE ARE CAPABLE OF SO MUCH MORE IN THIS STATE.

IT IS A MATTER OF COLLABORATING.

IT IS A MATTER OF CONVENING.

IT IS A MATTER OF LEADING.

AND THAT'S WHAT I INTEND TO DO.

>> Braude: SO IF YOU WERE TO BE ELECTED, YOU WOULD FOLLOW A PRETTY POPULAR GUY AS GOVERNOR, CHARLIE BAKER.

YOU'RE QUOTED AS SAYING, A TERRIFIC SPEECH, A TERRIFIC POSITIVE MESSAGE, AND AT THE SAME TIME, YOUR OPPONENT BASICALLY TRASHED IT, SAYING NO SENSE OF URGENCY ON THINGS LIKE COVID AND CLIMATE.

LET'S LOOK AT SEVEN YEARS.

HOW WOULD YOU RATE CHARLIE BAKER'S YEARS IN OFFICE?

>> I THINK IN MANY RESPECTS, GOVERNOR BAKER HAS DONE A REALLY EXCELLENT JOB IN STEWARDING OUR STATE.

THERE ARE BEEN TIMES WHERE HE AND I HAVE NOT AGREED ON EVERYTHING.

WE HAVE HAD SOME DIFFERENT PHILOSOPHIES ON THINGS.

BUT HE ALWAYS BROUGHT TO THE TABLE AND BROUGHT TO THE GAME AN EARNESTNESS AND COMMITMENT TO DOING THE RIGHT THING TO HELP PEOPLE HERE.

I THINK THAT IS WHAT WE ASK OF THOSE WHO SERVE IN GOVERNMENT.

CHARLIE BAKER WILL NO LONGER BE GOVERNOR.

SO AS WE LOOK AHEAD, I'M TALKING TO PEOPLE AND LISTENING TO PEOPLE ABOUT WHAT THEY NEED AND WHAT THEY SEE HER IN THE STATE.

I KNOW I WILL BE A GOVERNOR WHO WILL LEAD WITH PRINCIPLES, WITH VALUES, WHO WILL PUT PEOPLE AT THE CENTER OF WHAT WE DO.

MY JOB HAS BEEN, OVER THE LAST SEVEN YEARS, TO TRY TO TAKE CARE OF RESIDENTS, TRY TO STAND UP FOR PEOPLE, LOOK AFTER THOSE WHO ARE VULNERABLE, TO WORK IN HELPING TO SUPPORT OUR SMALL BUSINESSES.

AS GOVERNOR, YOU HAVE TO HAVE THAT ABILITY TO BRING PEOPLE TOGETHER, TO LISTEN, INCLUDING TO OPPOSING VIEWS, AND TO TRY TO COLLABORATE WITH PARTNERS TO GET THINGS DONE.

AND I THINK THAT'S WHAT PEOPLE IN THIS STATE ARE LOOKING FOR.

THEY ARE LOOKING FOR ACTION.

THEY ARE LOOKING FOR RESULTS, PARTICULARLY IN THE AREAS THAT I'VE MENTIONED.

WE HAVE A REAL PROBLEM WITH THE HIGH COST OF LIVING IN THIS STATE.

WE'VE GOT A HOUSING CRISIS IN THIS STATE.

RENTS ARE UNAFFORDABLE, MORTGAGES UNATTAINABLE FOR SOME.

AND WE HAVE A DESPERATE NEED, AN URGENT NEED, PARTICULARLY AS WE'RE RECEIVING FEDERAL FUNDING, TO INVEST THAT MONEY IN MUCH-NEEDED INFRASTRUCTURE AND TRANSPORTATION.

WHEN IT COMES TO WHAT I THINK IS THE MOST SERIOUS ISSUE OF OUR TIME RIGHT NOW THAT WE'RE CONFRONTING, THE CLIMATE CRISIS, MASSACHUSETTS HAS AN OPPORTUNITY WITH THE NEXT GOVERNOR TO MOVE US FORWARD, TO MOVE US FROM FOSSIL FUELS TO RENEWABLES, TO BUILD A CLEAN ENERGY ECONOMY WHERE EVERYONE CAN THRIVE AND PROSPER AND SHARE IN, AND IT IS GOING TO REQUIRE INNOVATION, IT IS GOING TO REQUIRE KNOW-HOW AND IT WILL REQUIRE SOMEBODY OUT THERE LISTENING.

>> Braude: YOU SAID THAT CHARLIE BAKER HAS DONE A REALLY EXCELLENT JOB.

HAS HE DONE A REALLY EXCELLENT JOB OF CLIMATE?

>> I SAID GOVERNOR BAKER HAS DONE A REALLY EXCELLENT JOB IN MANY RESPECTS.

>> Braude: WHAT WOULD YOU HAVE DONE DIFFERENTLY ON CLIMATE?

>> ON THE OPIOID CRISIS, THAT'S AN AREA WHERE WE WORKED TOGETHER EXTENSIVELY.

I'M SURE THAT, THAT IF YOU GO BACK AND LOOK AT THE LAST SEVEN YEARS, PEOPLE CAN SEE THERE ARE TIMES WHEN WE DISAGREED ON THINGS.

BUT THE POINT, JIM, IS THIS: WE'RE MOVING FORWARD.

AND WE'RE MOVING FORWARD OUT OF A PANDEMIC.

WE'VE GOT REALLY SERIOUS ISSUES WE'VE GOT TO CONFRONT HERE IN THIS STATE.

THERE IS NOT AN INDUSTRY RIGHT NOW IN OUR STATE THAT ISN'T HAVE AN ISSUE WITH WORKFORCE DEVELOPMENT, LITERALLY FINDING WORKERS TO DO THE JOB.

ONE THING THE NEXT GOVERNOR NEEDS TO DO, AND I'M COMMITTED TO THIS, IS MAKING SURE WE HAVE THE JOB-TRAINING PROGRAMS AND THE LIKE IN PLACE, WORKING WITH OUR VOCATIONAL SCHOOLS, COMMUNITY COLLEGES, HIGH SCHOOLS, AND HIGHER ED, SO WE'RE TRAINING PEOPLE WITH THE JOB SKILLS THEY NEED TO ALIGN WITH THE JOBS THAT ARE AVAILABLE IN THE COMMONWEALTH HERE TODAY.

AND THAT'S JUST AN EXAMPLE OF SOMETHING THAT REQUIRES TREMENDOUS URGENCY.

I'M GIVING A LOT OF THOUGHT TO THAT RIGHT NOW.

I'M TALKING TO LOOT OF PEOPLEA LOT OFPEOPLE ABOUT THIS PROBLEM RIGHT NOW AS WE MOVE THROUGH COVID AND CONFRONT THIS SITUATION WE'RE IN RIGHT NOW.

MASSACHUSETTS, IN MY VIEW, IS THE GREATEST STATE IN THE COUNTRY, BUT WE HAVE OUR CHALLENGES.

AND BELIEVE WITH THOSE CHALLENGES WE HAVE SOME REAL OPPORTUNITIES TO DO THINGS GOING FORWARD.

>> Braude: WITH YOUR PERMISSION, THOUGH, LET ME ASK AGAIN, WHAT WOULD YOU HAVE DONE DIFFERENTLY ON CLIMATE ISSUES THAN CHARLIE BAKER?

>> I PROBABLY WOULD HAVE WORKED TO PUSH EVEN MORE AN EFFORT INTO RENEWABLES.

BUT I THINK THE ADMINISTRATION HAS REALLY DONE A LOT IN THAT REALM.

BUT I DON'T THINK THE VOTERS IN MASSACHUSETTS ARE PARTICULARLY INTERESTED IN WHAT COULD HAVE, SHOULD HAVE, WOULD HAVE BEEN DONE.

WHEN IT COMES TO CLIMATE, I'LL BE THE MOST AGGRESSIVE GOVERNOR ON CLIMATE, AND I WILL BE.

I ALSO KNOW IT IS NOT THE WORK OF ANY ONE GOVERNOR ALONE.

YOU HAVE TO WORK REGIONALLY WITH OTHER GOVERNORS, AND WITH THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT ON THIS ISSUE AS WELL.

HAVE YOU TO WORK WITH THE BUSINESS COMMUNITY ON THIS ISSUE AS WELL.

HAVE YOU TO BRING A RANGE OF STAKEHOLDERS TOGETHER TO GET TO WHERE WE NEED TO GO.

WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT WHAT WE NEED TO DO IN THE STATES, BUILDING UP THE INFRASTRUCTURE, BUILDING THE RESILIENCY, ELECTRIFYING OUR CARS AND OUR BUSES AND OUR TRANSIT SYSTEMS IN PARTICULAR.

WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT THE WORK THAT WE NEED TO DO TO MAKE SURE THAT THE WIND AND THE RENEWABLES OFFSHORE CAN GET TO THE BUSINESSES AND HOMES, SO PEOPLE BENEFIT FROM THAT -- THESE ARE THINGS WE NEED TO WORK ON -- WE'RE STARTING TO WORK ON THEM, BUT WE NEED TO DO SO WITH AN URGENCY AND INVESTMENT THAT WE HAVEN'T BROUGHT TO BEAR YET.

NOW WITH THE FEDERAL FUNDS COMING IN, WE HAVE THAT OPPORTUNITY, AND I LOOK FORWARD TO DOING THAT.

I WANT TO DO THAT AGGRESSIVELY AS GOVERNOR.

>> Braude: MAURA HEALEY, WE'RE THE ONLY STATE IN THE COUNTRY WHERE THE LEGISLATURE, THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE CLAIM AN EXEMPTION FROM THE PUBLIC RECORDS LAW.

WOULD YOU CLAIM THAT, AS GOVERNOR BAKER, OR WOULD YOU BE THE OPT-OUT IN THAT THREESOME.

>> I'M THE ONE WHO HAS COMPLIED WITH THE PUBLIC RECORDS LAW FOR YEARS.

MY OFFICE IS REGULARLY COMPLYING WITH THAT AND RESPONDING TO REQUESTS FOR PUBLIC INFORMATION.

JIM, I'M ABOUT TRANSPARENCY.

I'M ABOUT PROVIDING INFORMATION TO THE PUBLIC.

YOU KNOW, WE WORK REALLY AT THE BEST OF AND FOR TAXPAYERS WHO DESERVE ACCOUNTABILITY.

AS GOVERNOR, I'M NOT GOING TO CHANGE THAT.

WHETHER OR NOT THE LAW REQUIRES THAT, I HAVE ALREADY SAID I WOULD MAKE THE EXECUTIVE BRANCH SUBJECT TO THE PUBLIC RECORDS.

>> Braude: I WANT TO TALK ABOUT YOUR RECORD BRIEFLY AS ATTORNEY GENERAL.

YOU OPPOSED THE LEGALIZATION OF MARIJUANA, RECREATIONAL, DO YOU REGRET THAT SIX YEARS LATER?

>> I DON'T THINK I REGRET IT, JIM.

AT THE TIME IN 2016, I WAS VERY CONCERNED ABOUT THE AFFECT THAT THAT WAS GOING TO HAVE ON YOUNG PEOPLE WITH RESPECT TO USE, WITH RESPECT TO ADDICTION.

>> Braude: WERE YOU WRONG?

>> QEPT WITH RESPECT TO MENTAL HEALTH.

I'LL LEAVE THAT TO OTHER PEOPLE TO JUDGE.

I'VE WORKED REARLY HARD TO MAKE SOCIAL JUSTICE ADVOCATES MY APPOINTEES TO THE CANNABIS COMMISSION.

I WANTED IT TO GO DOWN TO THE BENEFIT OF COMMUNITIES THAT HAVE FOR FAR TOO LONG BEEN RAVAGED BY THINGS LIKE THE ILL-GUIDED WAR ON DRUGS.

I HAVE TRIED TO FOCUS ON THAT WITH THE APPOINTMENTS AND THE COMMISSIONS I HAVE CREATED.

I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT EVERYBODY IS ABLE TO SHARE IN THE BENEFITS AND THE GAINS OF THAT INDUSTRY.

AND I THINK WE STILL HAVE MORE WORK TO DO WHEN IT COMES TO THE SOCIAL JUSTICE ISSUES THAT WERE, IN FACT, DRIVING A LOT OF THE PROPONENTS OF THAT LAW.

>> Braude: MAURA HEALEY -- I'M SORRY.

OKAY.

MAURA HEALEY, YOU TALKED ABOUT BOTH TONIGHT, AND SINCE YOUR ANNOUNCEMENT, ABOUT LOOKING AT EVERYTHING FROM AN EQUITY LENS.

REPARATIONS, A REPARATIONS BILL LOOKS IN GOOD SHAPE IN THE UNITED STATES HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, NOT IN THE SENATE.

THE PRESIDENT SUPPORTS A COMMISSION.

THE CITY OF BOSTON IS TALKING ABOUT IT.

WHERE WOULD YOU TAKE MASSACHUSETTS ON THE ISSUE OF REPARATIONS, SHOULD YOU BE GOVERNOR?

>> YOU KNOW, REPARATIONS, JIM, IS SOMETHING I NEED TO GIVE MORE THOUGHT TO, TO BE HONEST.

I'M GLAD TO SEE CONGRESS TAKING IT UP, I'M GLAD TO SEE THEM TAKING THIS ON.

I THINK WHAT IS IMPORTANT HERE, THOUGH, IN MASSACHUSETTS, IS THAT WE MAKE SURE THAT ALL OF OUR POLICIES, THAT ALL OF OUR ACTIONS TAKEN OUT OF ANY GIVEN PARTICULAR STATE AGENCY ARE DONE, AS I HAVE DONE AS ATTORNEY GENERAL, WITH A CONSCIOUS, INTENTIONAL KNOWLEDGE AND FOCUS ON WHETHER THOSE ACTIONS ARE GOING TO MAKE RACIAL IS DISPARITIES WORSE OR BETTER.

AND THAT'S WHAT I MEAN ABOUT THE EQUITY LENS, THAT WE NEED TO APPLY ACROSS GOVERNMENT, ACROSS ALL AGENCIES, TO MAKE SURE WE'RE MINDFUL OF AND TAKING STOCK OF WHAT HAS HAPPENED THROUGH STRUCTURES AND SYSTEMS THAT FOR FAR TOO LONG HAVE DISADVANTAGED AND DISPROPORTIONATELY HURT PEOPLE OF COLOR IN THIS STATE.

I THINK THAT YOU HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY THROUGH BOTH BUDGETING DECISIONS, AS WELL AS THROUGH RULE-MAKING, POLICY-MAKING, AND THE ACTIONS OF STATE AGENCIES, TO REALLY HAVE AN IMPRINT OF EQUITY ACROSS ALL OF STATE GOVERNMENT.

>> Braude: MAURA HEALEY, REALLY GOOD TO SEE YOU.

THANKS SO MUCH FOF YOUR TIME.

>> I LOOK FORWARD TOIT, TO IT, JIM.

GREAT TO SEE YOU.

>> Braude: AND WE'LL CONTINUEOUR CONVERSATIONS WITH ALL THE CANDIDATES FOR GOVERNOR OVER THE COMING WEEKS, LEADING UP TO THE PRIMARY ELECTION ON SEPTEMBER 6th.

>>> THAT'S IT FOR TONIGHT, BUT COME BACK TOMORROW.

EMMY AWARD-WINNING ACTOR KIEFER SUTHERLAND, KNOWN FOR HIS ROLE AS JACK BAUER ON "24," JOINS ME ON HIS OTHER CAREER AS A COUNTRY-ISH MUSIC SINGER, OUT WITH A NEW ALBUM AND AN UPCOMING PERFORMANCE IN BOSTON.

THAT AND MORE TOMORROW AT 7:00.

THANKS FOR WATCHING, AND PLEASE STAY SAFE.

Captioned by Media Access Group at WGBH access.wgbh.org >> HEY, FOLKS, I'M EDWARD B. HERWICK III HERE FROM GBH NEWS "CURIOSITY DESK," WHERE YOU ASK QUESTIONS AND I FIND ANSWERS.

TODAY, HOW DID THIS 12-FOOT BRONZE PEAR END UP AT ONE OF DORCHESTER'S BUSIEST INTERSECTIONS?

♪♪ >> IF THERE ARE TWO THINGS YOU CANNOT SPIT WITHOUT HITTING IN THIS TOWN, IT'S A DUNKIN' DOUGHNUTS AND AN HISTORIC STATUE.

NOW, MOST OF THEM ARE PRETTY BY THE BOOK.

PAUL REVERE ATOP HIS HORSE IN THE NORTH END.

A MARTYR FOR RELIGIOUS FREEDOM, MARY DYER, SITTING CONTEMPLATIVELY OUTSIDE THE STATE HOUSE.

CELTICS COACH RED AUERBACH CHOMPING ON A CIGAR, ON A BENCH IN QUINCY MARKET.

BUT ARTIST LAURA BARING-GOULD HAD A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT KIND OF STATUE IN MIND FOR THIS SPOT IN DORCHESTER, BOSTON'S MOST DIVERSE NEIGHBORHOOD: AN ENORMOUS PEAR.

>> DOING PUBLIC ART IS ALWAYS A TRICKY ENDEAVOR BECAUSE WHO'S THE PUBLIC?

WHAT'S THE PUBLIC?

>> LADIES AND GENTLEMEN, I PRESENT TO YOU A SMALL, RANDOMLY SELECTED NON-STATISTICALLY SIGNIFICANT SAMPLE OF THE PUBLIC.

>> DO YOU HAVE A THEORY AS TO WHY THEY PUT A GIANT PEAR HERE?

>> THERE'S A BOOK CALLED "JAMES AND THE GIANT PEACH," AND THE MAYOR, IN 1963, READ THE BOOK AND DECIDED TO ONE UP IT.

>> I DON'T KNOW, IT'S DOING ITS JOB.

IT'S DOING ITS JOB.

>> I PASS BY WITH MY GRANDDAUGHTER, AND SHE HAS ASKED ME ABOUT THIS PEAR, AND I DON'T HAVE AN ANSWER.

I SAY, I DON'T KNOW, WHAT DOES THAT MEAN?"

I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW WHAT IS THAT?

>> ARE YOU GOING TO TELL ME WHY WE HAVE IT HERE NOW?

>> PEARS WERE ONCE GROWN IN ABUNDANCE HERE, AND ONE VARIETY WAS ACTUALLY CREATED HERE BY A GUY NAMED THADDEUS CLAPP.

NOW, HE TOOK A BARTLETT PEAR AND CROSSED IT WITH A FLEMISH BEAUTY TO CREATE A BRAND NEW PEAR UNIQUE TO DORCHESTER.

THE VARIETY WAS APTLY NAMED CLAPP'S FAVORITE.

>> BUT THAT'S NOT THE ONLY REASON FOR THIS ENORMOUS FRUIT.

BARING-GOULD SETTLED ON THIS PEAR IDEA AFTER MONTHS OF RESEARCH AND COUNTLESS CONVERSATIONS WITH PEOPLE ALL AROUND THE NEIGHBORHOOD THAT REVEALED A RICH AGRICULTURAL HERITAGE HERE THAT CUTS ACROSS CULTURE, CLASS, AND TIME.

>> I SEE IN THE VIETNAMESE COMMUNITIES PEOPLE GROWING CUCUMBERS IN THEIR GARDENS.

AND THEN AS YOU CROSS OVER THE CAPE VERDEAN COMMUNITIES, PEOPLE ARE GROWING BEANS.

>> SHE ALSO LEARNED ABOUT THE NEIGHBORHOOD'S 17th CENTURY FARMS, ITS 19th CENTURY ORCHARDS, AND SAW TONS OF 20th CENTURY PHOTOS OF KIDS PLAYING IN FRONT YARD FRUIT TREES.

>> AND IT COULD ALSO BE THIS UNLIKELY SYMBOL.

WHAT'S A PEAR DOING IN DORCHESTER?

WHY A PEAR?

>> AROUND THE PEAR ARE 10 SMALLER SCULPTURES HONORING DORCHESTER'S UNIQUE HISTORY THROUGH EVERYDAY OBJECTS.

THERE'S THE THREE SISTERS' CROPS: SQUASH, CORN, AND BEANS, VITAL TO THE AREA'S INDIGENOUS PEOPLE.

THERE'S DOG TAGS, HORNING LOCAL VETERANS, A TRIPLE-DECKER HOUSE, AND MORE.

BUT IT IS THE PEAR THAT LOOMS LARGEST HERE.

BARING-GOULD SEES IT AS A FITTING METAPHOR FOR DORCHESTER.

A SWEET, TOUGH-SKINNED, HYBRID FRUIT, SOMETHING WHOLLY NEW, ONLY MADE POSSIBLE BY CROSS-POLLINATION.

>> THANK GOD, NOW I KNOW WHAT I'M GOING TO SAY TO MY GRANDDAUGHTER.

>> SO THERE YOU HAVE IT.

DON'T FORGET TO LIKE AND SUBSCRIBE, AND, PERHAPS MOST IMPORTANTLY, LET ME KNOW WHAT YOU ARE CURIOUS ABOUT.

BECAUSE, HEY, I MIGHT JUST LOOK INTO IT FOR YOU.

I'M EDWARD B. HERWICK III.

STAY CURIOUS OUT THERE.

♪♪ >> PRETTY GOOD; THIS IS A TASTY PEAR.