>> Announcer: DONNYBROOK IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE MEMBERS OF NINE PBS.

>>> HEY, THANKS TO JOINING US FOR ANOTHER EDITION OF DONNYBROOKS ABOUT GREAT TO HAVE YOU WITH US, AND BEFORE THIS HOUR IS OVER, WE'RE GOING TO TALK TO THE HEAD OF THE MISSISSIPPI RIVER CITIES AND TOWNS INITIATIVE.

HE'S COLIN WELLENKAMP, THE EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR THERE, WHO AS WE GET MORE OF THESE SPRING RAINS, WE'LL TALK ABOUT HOW THAT AFFECTS CITIES AND TOWNS FROM MINNESOTA TO LOUISIANA AND HOW MAYORS ARE GETTING TOGETHER TO TRY AND MAYBE THINGS BETTER, AT LEAST IN TERMS OF AGRICULTURE, MANUFACTURING, AND TOURISM.

WE'LL TALK ABOUT OLD MAN RIVER, THAT IS IF THE CREEK DON'T RISE BEFORE THE HOUR IS OVER.

FIRST LET'S MEET OUR PAENLISTS.

WENDY IS TAKING THE WEEK OFF, SO WE MEET JOE HOLLEMAN FROM THE ST. LOUIS POST-DISPATCH.

ALSO WITH US FROM THE ST. LOUIS POST-DISPATCH, I SEE A PATTERN HERE, MR. BILL McCLELLAN.

NOW WE BREAK THE PATTERN.

HE'S RAY HARTMANN FROM THE RIVERFRONT TIMES, RAW STORY.COM AND THE BIG 550 KTRS.

AND FROM THE ST. LOUIS AMERICAN AS WELL AS 590 AM AND 97.1 FM, OR ARE YOU MOVING TO KMOX, YOU MIGHT BE, ALVIN REID.

>> I HAVEN'T BEEN OFFICIALLY ON KMOX YET, BUT I DID UPDATE AT THE END OF MY COLUMN, I HAVE DAVE GLOVER SHOW ON KMOX.

SO THERE'S YOUR FREEBIE.

YOU GOT THEM, EVERYBODY'S GETTING THEM.

>> NOW WE HAVE TWO REPRESENTATIVES FROM KMOX AND TWO WITH THE POST-DISPATCH FOR THIS PROGRAM ANYWAY.

SORRY, RAY, BUT WE START WITH YOU.

BILL McCLELLAN, I WONDERED HOW YOU FELT THE DEBATE BETWEEN ALDERMEN CARA SPENCER AND TREASURER TISHAURA JONES WENT THIS PAST WEEK.

I THOUGHT THERE WERE SOME INTERESTING MOMENTS.

I THOUGHT THAT OVERALL TREASURER JONES SEEMED TO BE MORE IN COMMAND.

SOME PEOPLE SAID THEY DIDN'T FEEL THAT WAY.

BUT WHEN SHE SAID SHE WOULD NOT WORK WITH JEFF ROORDA WHO'S THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNION, I THOUGHT I'M NOT SURE THAT'S HER CALL.

I THINK UNIONS GET TO PICK THEIR MANAGEMENT, NOT MUNICIPALITIES.

AND SHE SAID SHE WAS THINKING OF GOING ANOTHER DIRECTION AND NOT KEEPING JOHN HAYDEN AS THE POLICE CHIEF OF THE CITY OF ST. LOUIS.

AS WE ALL KNOW, LEGISLATION HAS CHANGED.

VERY DIFFICULT TO GET RID OF POLICE CHIEFS.

I WONDER HOW THAT WILL WORK OUT.

WHAT WERE YOUR IMPRESSIONS OVERALL?

>> I THOUGHT TISHAURA JONES WENT IN AS THE FAVORITE AND I THOUGHT SHE DID WHAT A FAVORITE HAS TO DO AND THAT'S MAINTAIN, AND I THOUGHT SHE DID PRETTY WELL.

I THOUGHT HER STRENGTH WAS WHEN SHE TALKED ABOUT HER RELATIONSHIP WITH OTHER LEADERS IN THE REGION AND THECOUNTRY.

I THOUGHT HER WEAKNESS WAS ON PUBLIC SAFETY WHEN SHE, A COUPLE TIMES, TALKED ABOUT IT'S A QUESTION OF SENDING THE RIGHT PROFESSIONAL TO THE RIGHT JOB.

YOU KNOW, THE MANTRA FOR THE PEOPLE WHO WANT TO SEND HEALTHCARE -- HEALTHCARE PROFESSIONALS OUT TO SCENES THAT POLICE NOW GO TO, BECAUSE AS THE POLICE WILL TELL YOU, YOU DON'T KNOW UNTIL YOU GET TO THE SCENE WHETHER YOU CAN SEND A SOCIAL WORKER OR A COP.

SO I THINK IT'S KIND OF AN EASY WAY OUT TO JUST SAY, YOU KNOW, WE'RE GOING TO SEND MORE SOCIAL WORKERS AND FEWER COPS, BUT OVERALL, I THOUGHT TISHAURA JONES DID WHAT SHE HAD TO DO TO MAINTAIN THE LEAD.

>> WELL, IF WE'RE TAKING FOR GRANT SHE HAS THE LEAD, YOU KNOW, I THINK THAT -- THEY HAVE SO MUCH MORE IN COMMON THAN THEY HAVE APART.

THAT IT'S, YOU KNOW, KIND OF HARD TO DIFFERENTIATE.

I WISHED ONE WOULD -- AND I GUESS MAYBE NOT LIKE AN ELECTION CYCLE SURPRISE, BUT I WISH ONE WOULD HAVE, YOU KNOW, BASICALLY SAID, HEY, I DO HAVE A BIG PLAN FOR ST. LOUIS AND I KNOW IT'S HARD TO START WITHOUT TALKING ABOUT CRIME IN THE CITY OF ST. LOUIS, BUT YOU KNOW, JUST SOME REAL HUGE FORESIGHT I THOUGHT WAS KIND OF MISSING.

AND AS FAR AS CONSTITUENCIES ARE CONCERNED, I THINK TISHAURA HAD TO SAY THAT SHE HAS NO USE FOR JEFF ROORDA EVEN THOUGH THOSE ONE OF THOSE CALLS WHERE MAYBE SHE HAS TO WORK WITH HIM, BUT AS FAR AS DEBATE PURPOSES, I WOULD HAVE SAID I ONE WORK WITH HIM, I'M JUST GOING TO TRY TO FORCE CHANGE.

>> I THOUGHT YOU HIT IT ON THE HEAD WHEN THE CANDIDATES HAD NO BIG PLANS, NO MAJOR STADIUM BRINGING AN NBA TEAM AND THE RIVERFRONT.

IT SEEMS LIKE RIGHT NOW IN THE CITY OF ST. LOUIS, WE'RE PUTTING OUT FIRES, EVEN THOUGH IT'S AMAZING, THE NEXT ADMINISTRATION WILL GET 500 MILLION FEDERAL DOLLARS.

NOTHING LIKE THIS IN THE PAST.

IT'S REALLY INCREDIBLE.

I GET MAYOR SHARES THAT DUTY WITH OTHER MEMBERS OF THE BOARD OF ESTIMATE AND APPORTIONMENT, I UNDERSTAND IS THAT CORRECT BUT THERE'S NOTHING LIKE THAT WE'VE EVER SEEN.

>> CHARLIE, I DON'T -- AS FAR AS TISHAURA SAYING THAT ABOUT ROORDA, LYDA KREWSON CALLED FOR HIM TO BE FIRED FOUR YEARS AGO, OKAY?

VERY DIRECTLY.

SO THIS ISN'T SOMETHING NEW AND I DON'T THINK IT'S SOMETHING THAT SEPARATES THE CANDIDATES.

I AGREE WITH ALVIN.

I MEAN, THIS IS A -- FIRST OF ALL, I DO NOT THINK, I'M NOT SURE WHAT WE BASE -- I GUESS I CAN SEE BILL SAYING TISHAURA IS A FRONT RUNNER BASED ON SOME RUBS, BUT I THINK THE -- SOME NUMBERS, BUT I THINK THE REAL UNKNOWN IN THIS ELECTION, WHICH IS GOING TO BE AN UNKNOWN, THE CITY OF ST. LOUIS HAS NEVER IN OUR LIFETIME HAD A GENERAL ELECTION BETWEEN TWO DEMOCRATS, OKAY?

IN OTHER WORDS, IN THE APRIL ELECTION, IT HAS NOT HAD ANY MEANING FOR DECADES AND DECADES AND THE X-FACTOR HERE IS NOW PEOPLE THAT DON'T LIKE EITHER OF THOSE TWO CANDIDATES ARE GOING TO TURN OUT AND VOTE.

I DON'T THINK WE KNOW BECAUSE WE HAVEN'T SEEN IT BEFORE AND, YOU KNOW, I DON'T THINK -- THAT'S ALL I'M -- >> I HEAR WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, RAY, BUT I THINK BILL'S ON TO SOMETHING JUST BY THE FACT THAT TISHAURA JONES GOT 10 OR 11 MORE POINTS IN THE PRIMARY, WHICH MEANS SOMETHING, SO SHE'S THE PRESUMED FRONT RUNNER.

>> I'M NOT ARGUING, I GET THAT, AND YOU'RE RIGHT, BILL.

SHE CERTAINLY -- IF THAT'S THE MEASURE, SHE CERTAINLY -- I THOUGHT IT WAS ONE OF THOSE MANY DEBATES WHERE YOU PROBABLY LIKED THE PERSON IN THE DEBATE THAT YOU LIKED GOING INTO THE DEBATE.

>> BUT A COUPLE OF THOUGHTS ON THE DEBATE FROM A CITY RESIDENT.

YOU GUYS WANT TO GO AHEAD AND LISTEN TO THAT.

FIRST OF ALL, I AGREE WITH RAY THAT I THINK VERY FEW PEOPLE, IF ANYBODY'S MINDS ARE EVER CHANGED BY A DEBATE UNLESS SOMEONE ABSOLUTELY IMPLODES AND JUST REALLY MESSES UP AND TO BILL'S POINT, TISHAURA DIDN'T DO THAT AND BECAUSE OF HER PRIMARY VICTORY BEING THE NUMBER ONE VOTE GETTER, I THINK UNTIL SOME OTHER POLL SAYS OTHERWISE, YOU HAVE TO LOOK AT HER AS THE FRONT RUNNER.

I DO THINK, HOWEVER, IF YOU COME INTO PICKING -- BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT THESE ARE.

THESE ARE REYLT SHOW KIND OF THINGS WHERE AT THE END OF THE DAY YOU VOTE WHO WON, I BELIEVE THAT, LIKE BILL SAID, TISHAURA WON IN THE SENSE THAT IF SHE IS THE FRONTRUNNER, SHE DIDN'T LOSE ANY GROUND.

I THINK IF YOU TOOK TWO PEOPLE WHO WEREN'T ACQUAINTED WITH THE STET OR EITHER CANDIDATE OR THEIR HISTORIES OR THEIR CONNECTION, I THINK CARA SPENCER CAME OUT BETTER IF ONLY FOR THE POINT THAT THERE ACTUALLY WERE PLANS THERE.

SHE ACTUALLY ALLUDED TO HAVING ACTUAL PLANS WHERE I THINK TISHAURA STAYED WITH THE SAFER MATTIE TUPD OF WE -- PLATITUDES OF WE ALL HAVE TO WORK TOGETHER AND SO ON SAN ON FORTH.

I THINK FROM THAT, I WOULD GIVE CARA SPENCER AN EDGE, BUT THEN AGAIN, LIKE I SAID, I DON'T THINK VIEWS GET CHANGED.

I THINK PEOPLE TURN INTO DEBATES TO ROOT FOR THEIR CANDIDATE.

>> HEY, JOE, JOE, SINCE YOU ARE OUR REPRESENTATIVE FROM THE CITY, 22% OF YOUR FELLOW RESIDENTS VOTED IN THE PRIMARY.

IS IT YOUR SENSE THAT THERE'S MORE INTEREST IN THE FINAL ELECTION?

>> I THINK -- WELL, NOT MUCH MORE.

I MEAN, YOU KNOW, THERE'S NOT A LOT OF TURNOUT FOR MUNICIPAL ELECTIONS, PERIOD.

BUT I THINK THERE WILL BE, THERE WILL BE A LACK OF CONFUSION.

THERE WILL BE MORE PEOPLE VACCINATED AND AS RAY SAID, IT'S ACTUALLY A RACE THIS TIME IN APRIL.

SO WE'LL HAVE, ONE WOULD THINK, NICER WEATHER, SO ON AND SO FORTH.

DO I SEE THE 22% BEING EXCEEDED?

YES, I DO, BUT STILL IF YOU GET ONE-THIRD OF THE CITY TO COME OUT AND VOTE IN A MAYORAL ELECTION, YOU'RE DOING A GOOD JOB.

I WOULD HOPE -- I WOULD LOVE TO SEE EVERYONE VOTE, BUT WE KNOW THAT'S NOT GOING TO HAPPEN.

I THOUGHT THE OTHER THING WAS, I THOUGHT BOTH OF THEM WOULD HAVE BEEN MUCH MORE COMFORTABLE DEBATING LEWIS REED, BUT WILL GO AT ALVIN'S POINT, I THINK THEY WERE ALL READY TO BE THE PROGRESSIVE AGAINST THE BUSINESS AS USUAL.

AND HERE YOU HAD TWO PROGRESSIVES AND THERE WAS NO BUSINESS AS USUAL PERSON TO TURN ON, AND I THINK BOTH OF THEM WERE PROBABLY FIGURING LEWIS REED MIGHT BE THEIR OPPONENT AND THEY COULD DRAW THESE VAST DIFFERENCES.

AND LIKE ALVIN SAID, THEY WERE TRYING TO MAKE THEMSELVES VERY DIFFERENT AND THEY ONLY SEEMED TO DIFFER ON A COUPLE OF POINTS.

>> THERE'S A SADNESS TO IT, TOO, THAT YOU -- I FIND MYSELF WISHING THAT THESE TWO WOMEN WHO ARE SIMILAR POLITICALLY SEEM MORE FRIENDLY, LIKE I'LL HELP YOU IF YOU WIN, BUT INSTEAD, I GET THE SENSE THAT THESE ARE PEOPLE WHO DON'T LIKE EACH OTHER.

>> AND IN FAIRNESS, THAT'S THE DYNAMIC THAT'S REAL.

OBVIOUSLY, THAT'S NOT GOING SOB SOMETHING THAT'S HIDDEN.

AGAIN, I'M OBVIOUSLY ON THEIR SIDE POLITICALLY.

I THINK BOTH WOULD MAKE GOOD MAYORS.

I THINK THE BUSINESS AS URBAN WHO THEY RUN AGAINST IS -- AS USUAL WHO THEY RUN AGAINST IS WHAT IS PERCEIVED AS THE STATUS QUO IN THE CITY.

I AGREE WITH JOE, THERE WOULD HAVE BEEN A VERY DIFFERENT -- WELL, THERE WAS A DIFFERENT DYNAMIC WHEN LEWIS WAS IN THE RACE.

CARA SPENCER AND LEWIS HAD THE OUT IN A DEBATE.

>> OKAY, HEY, HERE'S THE DEAL -- >> WE'LL SEE.

IT WILL BE DIFFERENT.

>> THE NEXT DEBATE IS MONDAY NIGHT AND IT'S HERE ON NINE PBS AND IN CONJUNCTION WITH THE ST. LOUIS PUBLIC MEDIA -- PUBLIC RADIO, EXCUSE ME, AS WELL AS 5 ON YOUR SIDE, KSDK.

THAT'S RIGHT HERE MONDAY THE 30th.

RAY, I WANT TO ASK YOU ABOUT A COUPLE OF ANNOUNCEMENTS BY REPUBLICANS WHO TRY AND WIN THE SENATE SEAT CURRENTLY HELD BY ROY BLUNT.

THE SENIOR SENATOR OF MISSOURI IS RETIRING, SO NOW THE TWO ERICS ARE IN THE RACE.

ERIC GREITENS, FORMER GOVERNOR, AND ERIC SCHMITT, CURRENTLY THE ATTORNEY GENERAL.

WHAT ARE YOUR THOUGHTS?

I KNOW IT'S EARLY, BUT YOU WRITE ABOUT THIS IN THIS WEEK'S RIVERFRONT TIMES.

WHO WOULD HAVE THE ADVANTAGE RIGHT NOW, RAY?

>> FIRST OF ALL, IT'S INTERESTING THAT TWO GUYS WHO WERE BORN JUST MILES APART IN ST. LOUIS COUNTY, WENT TO SCHOOL MILES APART IN ST. LOUIS COUNTY ARE THE CHOICES RIGHT NOW.

ABOUT A YEAR APART.

I THINK GREITENS WAS BORN IN '74 AND SCHMITT IN '75 AND THAT'S ABOUT WHERE THE SIMILARITIES END.

OH, EXCUSE ME, THEY ALSO PANDER TO DONALD TRUMP AND THEY'RE ALSO VERY DIFFERENT PEOPLES THAT THERE WERE AS RECENTLY AS 2015, AT LEAST TO THE PUBLIC.

BECAUSE THEY SEEMED KIND OF NORMAL AND NOW IT'S A BATTLE, RACE TO THE BOTTOM TO SEE WHO CAN BE THE TRUMPIEST.

CERTAINLY THE BIG MATCHUP IS BETWEEN ERIC GREITENS AND THE REST OF THE REPUBLICAN PARTY.

DESPITE HIS FICTITIOUS NARRATIVE THAT GEORGE SOROS AND THE LEFT DID HIM IN, HE WAS DONE IN, I THINK JUSTIFIABLY, BY THE MAINSTREAM REPUBLICAN PARTY WHICH HE RAN AGAINST AND BULLIED ONCE HE GOT THERE.

AND SO I THINK THE BIG QUESTION IN THIS RACE IS HOW MANY OTHER REPUBLICANS WHO ARE IN THE MAINSTREAM GET IN.

IF ANN WAGNER WHO'S RUMORED TO GET IN OR JASON SMITH, A CONGRESSMAN FROM SOUTHEAST MISSOURI F THEY GET IN THE RACE, THE MORE PEOPLE THAT ARE MAINSTREAM REPUBLICANS, THE BETTER IT IS FOR ERIC GREITENS.

HE HAS A VERY NARROW LANE AND I'LL SAY ONE LAST THING.

I DO THINK THAT ERIC GREITENS IS POTENTIALLY THE MOST BEATABLE CANDIDATE BY A DEMOCRAT AND I DON'T THINK IT'S 100% OUT OF THE QUESTION.

BUT YOU CAN ALSO BE CAREFUL WHAT YOU WISH FOR BECAUSE IF ERIC GREITENS WERE THE NOMINEE, YOU GET ABOUT A BILLION DOLLARS OF DARK MONEY COMING IN.

SO WHO KNOWS.

>> WELL, I WOULDN'T BE GETTING ANY OF THAT, SO WHY DO I CARE?

YOU KNOW, ERIC GREITENS IS GOING TO RUN FOR SENATE AND IF THE REPUBLICANS CAN'T STAND UP AGAINST HIM, YOU KNOW, THEN IT'S ON THEM.

BOY, I DON'T REALLY HAVE VERY MUCH NICE TO SAY ABOUT JOSH HAWLEY AT ALL, BUT AT LEAST HE DID SAY, LOOKING BACK, I WOULDN'T CHANGE MY POSITION WHICH CALLED FOR HIM TO RESIGN WHEN HE WAS GOVERNOR.

NOW, HE COULD COME BACK TOMORROW AND SAY THAT WAS THEN AND THIS IS NOW.

BUT, YOU KNOW, WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO, REPUBLICANS?

YOU KNOW, IT SEEMS TO ME THAT YOU DON'T MIND HAVING PEOPLE REPRESENT YOU THAT YOU WOULDN'T LEAVE YOUR KIDS AROUND, SO THAT'S KIND OF ON YOU.

>> NO, IT'S REALLY ODD, HERE'S ERIC SCHMITT WHO SUED CHINA AND HE'S JUST DONE ALL THESE SILLY THINGS, AND YET TO ME, HE'S HEADS AND SHOULDERS ABOVE ERIC GREITENS.

I MEAN F I HAD TO HAVE ONE OF THEM AS MY SENATOR AND I THINK WE WILL, I MEAN, I WISH, RAY, THAT I THOUGHT THE DEMOCRATS HAD A CHANCE, BUT YOU KNOW, MISSOURI HAS JUST BECOME SUCH A BRIGHT RED STATE, THAT I CAN'T SEE WHO THE DEMOCRATS ARE GOING TO PUT UP THAT COULD BEAT ANYBODY.

SO I SEE ERIC SCHMITT AS SENATOR.

>> I THINK ONE PROBLEM COMES FROM WHAT WE TALK ABOUT, WELL, HE'S TIED HIMSELF TO TRUMP.

DONALD TRUMP GOT 58% OF THE VOTE IN THE STATE OF MISSOURI FOR PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES, SO I THINK WHAT SOME PEOPLE IN URBAN AREAS CONSIDER AN INSULT, SAYING YOU'RE TIED WITH TRUMP, I'M NOT SURE THE STATE THINKS THAT.

>> RIGHT.

>> SO THE IDEA THAT THAT'S SOME NEGATIVE MIGHT ONLY EXIST IN AREAS OF ST. LOUIS AND KANSAS CITY.

>> NO, I WASN'T SAYING IT WAS A PROBLEM -- >> THE REST DOESN'T THINK -- >> I WAS TALKING ABOUT SORT OF A MORAL NEGATIVE, NOT AN ELECTORAL ONE.

I THINK THAT'S TRUE, WHICH I TALKED ABOUT THE OTHER X-FACTOR.

WE DON'T KNOW WHERE MISSOURI IS GOING TO BE WITH TRUMP BECAUSE WE'LL SEE WHERE TRUMP IS, 25 LAWSUITS FROM NOW, A YEAR FROM NOW.

WE DON'T KNOW.

>> OR HE'S GOING TO PICK ONE AND MY GUESS IS HE'S GOING TO PICK GREITENS, OKAY?

>> WELL, I DON'T KNOW.

>> NO, I JUST THINK THAT'S THE WAY IT IS, AND RAY IS RIGHT.

GREITENS IS THE MOST BEATABLE BECAUSE ONCE HE GOT THE NOMINATION -- >> I DON'T KNOW, ALVIN.

DON'T FORGET, ATTORNEY GENERAL SCHMITT WAS ONE OF THE ATTORNEY GENERALS WHO FILED WITH TEXAS TO CHALLENGE THE ELECTION RESULTS.

SO HE MIGHT BE IN VERY GOOD STEAD WITH DONALD J. TRUMP AT THIS POINT.

>> BUT CHARLIE, WHAT I WAS GOING TO SAY, IF THERE WAS ANY REPUBLICAN CANDIDATE WHERE SOME STUFF COULD START BLOWING UP 24 HOURS AFTER HE GOT THE NOMINATION, IT'S ERIC GREITENS.

>> OKAY.

>> HE'S NOMINATED AND NOW ALL OF A SUDDEN -- >> CHARLIE, NO LESS AN AUTHORITY THAN HEWITT, A NATIONALLY KNOWN CONSERVATIVE RADIO HOST DESCRIBED VERY CLEARLY, HE JUST ANNIHILATED GREITENS IF YOU WANT TO GOOGLE AN INTERVIEW THAT'S INTERESTING, JUST A COUPLE DAYS AGO.

HE CALLED HIM TODD AIKEN 2.0.

>> LET'S MOVE ON FROM THIS TOPIC.

WE HAVE TWO YEARS TO TALK ABOUT THIS, SO WE'RE GOOD FOR NOW.

HOW ABOUT YOU, JOE?

WE LOST ONE OF THE GREATS IN ST. LOUIS SPORTS HISTORY.

MAYBE NOT SO MUCH ON THE ICE.

HE PLAYED 615 GAMES FOR THE BLUES, BUT HE MIGHT HAVE BEEN NUMBER ONE IN THE HEARTS OF BLUES NATION.

BOBBY PLAGER DIEDY -- DIED YESTERDAY IN A TRAGIC AUTO ACCIDENT ON HIGHWAY 64.

TEM US A THING OR TWO ABOUT THIS MAN WE LOST YESTERDAY.

>> I REMEMBER THE BLUES, ESPECIALLY WHEN I WAS A KID BACK IN 67 AND '68, EVERYBODY OVERNIGHT STARTED BAIG STREET HOCKEY WHERE YOU HAD TO PICK UP THE GOALS AND NETS WHEN A CAR CAME DOWN THE STREET AND EVERYONE WAS EITHER RED BARRINGTON BECAUSE HE SCORED THE GOAL, OR BOB PLAGER BECAUSE EVERYBODY LIKED HIM.

I THOUGHT OVER THE YEARS, IT'S SORT OF LIKE THE YADER MOLINA, EVEN THOUGH THAT'S A GREATER PHENOMENON, BUT HE WAS ALWAYS FAVORITE AND A LOT OF HIM HAD TO DO WITH HUSBAND ENTHUSIASM TO MIX IT UP WITH PLAYERS ON THE OTHER TEAM, BACK WHEN WE WERE ALL GETTING FAMILIAR WITH HOCKEY WHERE WE THOUGHT, YOU CAN JUST STOP THIS GAME AND HAVE A FIGHT?

WE THOUGHT THAT WAS NEAT IN BASEBALL AND FOOTBALL, TOO, AT 10, 11 YEARS OLD.

HE HAD THAT LOVEABLE COCKINESS, NUMBER 5 IN YOUR PROGRAM, NUMBER ONE IN YOUR HEART.

I THINK THAT'S WHAT HE WAS.

AND HE WAS AROUND AND AROUND, AND IT LITERALLY WAS -- HAVING LOST CONTACT WITH HOCKEY FOR A WHILE, AND MY FRIENDS ARE WATCHING SAYING, YOU TRAITOR BECAUSE I QUIT FOLLOWING HOCKEY FOR A WHILE, BUT WHEN ST. LOUIS WON THE STANLEY CUP, THE FIRST THOUGHT IN MY MIND WAS, I'M GLAD BOB PLAGER GOT TO SEE IT.

THAT'S WHERE I TIED HIP TO THE BLUES.

HE WAS MR. BLUES.

>> HE WAS REALLY ALSO MR. ST. LOUIS.

HE WAS VERY ICONIC.

I ONLY HAD A CHANCE TO MEET HIM A COUPLE TIMES, LIKE SO MANY OTHER PEOPLE, AND I HAD THE SENSE THAT FOR SOME REASON, EVEN IF YOU DIDN'T KNOW HIM WELL, YOU FELT LIKE YOU LOST A FAMILY MEMBER OR DEAR FRIEND.

I WAS IN THE SEATS FOR THOSE YEARS, IN THE NOSE BLEED SEATS WHEN THEY WERE THERE THE FIRST YEAR, BUT I THINK JOE HAS AN INTERESTING POINT.

ATHLETES SAID A LOT OF THINGS, BUT I THINK WHEN BOB PLAGER SAID IT WAS MEANINGFUL TO HIM WHEN THEY WON THE CUP AS IF HE WAS ON THE TEAM, AND I THINK HE MEANT IT ALSO.

AND BOSLEY ALSO A VERY ICONIC PART OF BLUES HISTORY BECAUSE HE PASSED AWAY, IT'S HARD TO OVERSTATE HOW SAD THIS IS FOR BLUES FANS.

>> WELL PUT, GENTLEMEN.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

ALVIN, LET'S SWITCH TOPICS AND MOVE TO WASHINGTON UNIVERSITY WHERE APPARENTLY SINCE LAST SUMMER, THE STUDENTS HAVE BEEN PROTESTING THE EXISTENCE OF SORORITIES AND FRATERNITIES ON CAMPUS.

SOME CALLING THEM VIOLENT, SOME CALLING THEM MISOGYNISTIC, OTHER SAYING THEY'RE SEXIST OR RACIST AND THE NUMBER OF PLEDGES HAS DECREASED BY ABOUT 50% OR SO WE READ IN THE STUDENT NEWSPAPER AND THROUGH ST. LOUIS PUBLIC RADIO, AND I'M JUST WONDERING, DO YOU THINK IN 2021 AT WASHINGTON UNIVERSITY, WHERE HAROLD RAMOS WAS A MEMBER OF THE XBT FRATERNITY AND HE LATER WROTE ANIMAL HOUSE, DO YOU THINK THAT IT'S POSSIBLE THAT THE FRATERNITIES SHOULD GOT WAY OF THE DODO BIRD?

>> I'LL ALSO THROW IN TYPICALLY ST. LOUIS.

HE WANTED TO SHOOT THE FILM IN ST. LOUIS AT WASHINGTON UNIVERSITY AND THE POWERS THAT BE WANTED NO PART OF THAT.

SO IT WENT TO THE UNIVERSITY OF OREGON.

WISE DECISION.

I'M IN A FRATERNITY AND I WILL SAY WE WEREN'T INTO THIS, YOU KNOW, BINGE DRINKING THING AND ALL THAT, BUT IT WAS A DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE.

I'LL JUST PUT IT OUT THERE.

THE HAZING THING, YEAH, IT WENT ON, OKAY?

BUT I CAN'T SAY THAT OTHER STUDENTS GET TO DECIDE WHETHER YOU HAVE FRATERNITIES AND SORORITIES ON YOUR CAMPUS.

MOST MEN IN FRATERNITIES DON'T GET IN TROUBLE.

MOST WOMEN IN SORORITIES STAY OUT OF TROUBLE.

DON'T PUT THEMSELVES IN DANGER, MAKE LIFELONG ACQUAINTANCES.

I THINK THAT'S A COMPLETE AND TOTAL OVERREACTION.

NOW, IF PEOPLE DON'T WANT TO JOIN ANYMORE, THAT'S FINE.

THAT'S ON THE INDIVIDUAL, YOU KNOW, PANHELLENIC COUNCIL AT EACH UNIVERSITY ON HOW THEY ATTRACT STUDENTS TO BE INVOLVED, BUT TO SAY WE DON'T WANT THEM ON CAMPUS ANYMORE, I DISAGREE WITH THAT TOTALLY.

>> I THINK IT DEPENDS ON THE FRATERNITY AND ITS HISTORY.

I'M WITH ALVIN, I THINK IT SHOULD BE A -- THE BETAS, THERE'S A WHOLE LIST OF THEM, ABOUT EVERY YEAR, ANOTHER SUBSTANTIAL UNIVERSITY IS NOT JUST SUSPENDING THEM, BUT BANNING THEM, BUT I THINK IT'S FINE IF THEY WANT TO MAKE THAT DECISION, BUT IT HAS TO BE ON A CASE-BY-CASE BASIS.

I WAS NOT IN A FRATERNITY, BUT, YOU KNOW, I THINK -- >> BUT, OKAY, I UNDERSTAND THAT -- >> PEOPLE ARE AGAINST THEIR EXISTENCE AT ALL, I'M NOT -- >> WELL, THE THING IS, THEY DO GOOD WORK.

THAT IS CHARITY.

THEY'RE RAISING MONEY FOR BLIND KIDS AND THAT'S GOOD AND THEY MAKE A BIG CAMPUS SMALLER AND THEY PROVIDE FRATERNITY AND SORORITY, BUT AT THE SAME TIME, THEY TEND TO BE PRETTY EXCLUSIVE.

LIKE YOU SAY I WANT TO JOIN AND THEY MAY REJECT YOU OR NOT ASK YOU TO BE THERE, AND IS THAT REAL THE COLLEGIAL SPIRIT?

I KNOW THERE WAS PROBABLY A TIME WHEN ON COLLEGE CAMPUSES, PEOPLE REALLY WANTED TO PAIR OFF WITH PEOPLE WHO REED -- REFLECTED THEMSELVES, BUT IS THAT WHERE WE ARE IN 2021?

>> IT IS, CHARLIE.

COUNTRY CLUBS ARE EXCLUSIVE, BUT DOES THAT MEAN WE SHOULD BAN COUNTRY CLUBS?

I'M WITH ALVIN.

IF KIDS WANT TO JOIN A FRATERNITY, THE REST OF THE CAMPUS SHOULDN'T BE SO WOKE THAT THEY SAY NO, YOU CAN'T DO IT.

IF THEY DIE A NATURAL DEATH, FINE.

MY DAUGHTER WAS IN A SORORITY AND IT WAS NICE FOR HER TO GO THROUGH SCHOOL AND HAVE A GROUP OF FRIENDS.

MY SON WASN'T IN A FRATERNITY, FINE FOR HIM.

NOBODY IS SAYING YOU CAN'T BE EXCLUSIVE.

>> WELL, I -- >> WHEN YOU -- IF YOU WANT TO HAVE A SET OF FRIENDS, YOU HAVE THEM.

NOBODY CAN SAY YOU HAVE TO LIKE EVERYBODY, THAT'S CRAZY.

>> WELL, I GUESS I HAVE -- >> I THINK IT COMES, AND I THINK BILL TOUCHED ON IT, IT'S A WOKE THING, PURE AND SIMPLE.

AND IT COMES DOWN TO BECAUSE WHAT WE IDENTIFY NOW IS SOMETHING WE DON'T LIKE, SO INSTEAD OF NOT SEEING THAT MOVIE OR NOT READING THAT BOOK OR NOT JOINING THAT CLUB, WE ALSO WANT TO BAN THAT BOOK OR ABOLISH THAT CLUB.

I WOULD SUGGEST THAT ANYONE WHO HAS ANY OPPOSITION TO THE FRATERNITY/SORORITY WAY OF LIFE -- AND THERE ARE A NUMBER OF THEM.

I NEVER JOINED, I NEVER WANTED TO JOIN ONE.

BUT WHO WAS IT TO SAY HA THAT GUY NEXT TO ME OR THAT GAL NEXT TO ME COULDN'T JOIN ONE?

FEEL FREE, GO RIGHT AHEAD, MAKE YOUR OWN CHOICES, BUT -- >> JOE, THIS IS NOT A NEW, KIND OF LIKE A NEW THING.

WHEN I WAS IN COLLEGE, ON CAMPUS, PEOPLE HATED FRATERNITIES AND SORORITIES.

>> THAT'S TRUE.

>> BUT THE DIFFERENCE IS ALL THIS SOCIAL MEDIA -- >> ALVIN IS RIGHT.

>> -- YOUR RIGHT, IT GETS A LOT MORE COVERAGE, BUT TRUST ME, PEOPLE HAD TOTAL DISDAIN FOR THE PANHELLENIC SYSTEM.

>> I'VE BEEN TOLD THAT MYSELF.

>> FOR YOU GUYS TO MAKE THIS LIKE IT'S SOME NEW WOKE -- FIRST OF ALL, I'M NOT WOKE, OKAY?

BUT THIS IS IN THE A WOKE ISSUE.

THERE'S A LOT OF ISSUES ON CAMPUSES ABOUT FREE SPEECH YOU CAN TALK ABOUT.

THIS ISN'T ONE OF THEM.

THIS ISN'T A CAUSE OF THE WOKE -- >> I THINK IT IS A WOKE -- [ ALL SPEAKING AT ONCE ] >> THERE WAS PEOPLE A FEW YEARS AGO, THERE WAS SO MUCH RACISM IN THE FRATERNITY SYSTEM, 50 YEARS AGO AT MIZZOU.

THAT DOESN'T MEAN IT EXISTS TODAY.

>> BUT IT DOES, BUT SO WHAT?

>> SO YOU'VE BEEN WOKE FOR 50 YEARS.

>> OKAY, OKAY, LET'S MOVE ON TO ONE MORE WOKE TOPIC BEFORE WE GET TO NEXT UP, AND FOR THIS ONE, WE ARE GOING TO GO TO -- WHO'S NEXT?

I WANT TO BE FAIR HERE.

OH, WE'LL MAKE IT BILL McCLELLAN.

BILL, THERE IS SENATE BILL 26 IN JEFFERSON CITY WITH TWO MINUTES TO GO, IT'S GOT FIVE PROVISIONS, BUT TWO OF THEM THAT MIGHT BE OF INTEREST TO OUR VIEWERS IS THEY'RE GOING TO INCREASE THE PENALTIES FOR PROTESTERS WHO BLOCK TRAFFIC AND INCREASE PENALTIES FOR PROTESTERS WHO VANDALIZE MONUMENTS.

ARE YOU FOR IT OR AGIN' IT?

>> I'M AGIN' IT.

I THINK WE HAVE ENOUGH RULES ALREADY.

I'VE SAID ON THIS SHOW A NUMBER OF TIMES, I WORRY ABOUT PEOPLE PROTESTING ON THE HIGHWAY IN CASE AN AMBULANCE WANTS TO GET BY, AND I'M NOT ONE FOR DEFACING MONUMENTS, BUT WE ALREADY HAVE, YOU KNOW -- PEOPLE CAN BE CHARGED WITH IT AND AS LONG AS THE PEOPLE UNDERSTAND THAT'S WHAT CIVIL DISOBEDIENCE IS ABOUT, YOU BREAK THE LAW, YOU GET CHARGED WITH IT, I'M FINE.

I DON'T THINK WE NEED TO INCREASE THE PENALTIES.

>> AND WE'RE ABOUT SEVEN WEEKS, I THINK IT IS, FROM NOW TO THE END OF THE LEGISLATIVE SESSION, AND WE'RE AT ABOUT THE POINT WHERE YOU HAVE TO START TRYING TO SORT OUT WHICH BILLS ARE FOR POLITICAL SHOW AND IN THIS CASE, IT'S A RED MEAT BILL TARGETING BLACK LIVES MATTER, PERIOD, END OF REPORT.

THE QUESTION IS WHETHER THEY'RE SERIOUS ABOUT IT OR THEY JUST SCORED POINTS FOR THE BASE, AND I GUESS WE'LL KNOW MORE IN SEVEN WEEKS ABOUT WHETHER THIS IS A SERIOUS ONE.

I'M GUESSING IT'S NOT.

>> RAY, THIS COULD APPLY IN THE CITY IF THE OATH KEEPERS OR PROUD BOYS OR WHATEVER THEY ARE SHOW UP.

>> THIS BILL WAS WRITTEN AS AN ANTI-BLACK LIVES MATTER, BILL.

>> BUT IT APPLIES TO THE ENTIRE STATE.

>> BUT CHARLIE, THIS IS WOKE CONSERVATISM.

IT SAYS WOKE ON IT.

HEY, WE GOT TO WAKE UP!

>> ALL RIGHT.

HEY, THAT'S IT FOR THIS EDITION OF DONNYBROOK, BUT IN A MOMENT ON NEXT UP, WE'RE GOING TO TALK ABOUT OUR GREATEST NATURAL RESOURCE, THE MISSISSIPPI RIVER, WHICH FLOWS, OF COURSE, RIGHT BY THE ARCH AND WE'RE GOING TO TALK TO COLIN WELLENKAMP WHO JOINS US FROM MISSISSIPPI RIVER CITIES AND TOWNS INITIATIVE AND WE'LL GET THE LATEST ON THIS BEAUTIFUL RIVER AND THAT'S NEXT.

>> Announcer: DONNYBROOK IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE MEMBERS OF NINE PBS.

>>> HEY, THANKS FOR JOINING US FOR NEXT UP, AND ON THIS EDITION, WE'RE GOING TO TALK ABOUT THE MIGHTY MISSISSIPPI WHICH PRESUMABLY IS RISING RIGHT NOW AS A RESULT OF THE RAIN THAT WE'RE HAVING IN THE GREATER ST. LOUIS AREA.

BUT, WOW, WITH ALL THAT SNOW IN COLORADO, WILL THAT MEAN THAT WE HAVE A MORE SERIOUS FLOOD SEASON THAN USUAL?

LET'S TALK TO COLIN WELLENKAMP, WHO'S KIND ENOUGH TO JOIN US.

HE'S THE EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF THE MISSISSIPPI RIVER CITIES AND TOWNS INITIATIVE.

MR. WELLENKAMP, THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR JOINING US ON NINE PBS.

>> THANK YOU, CHARLIE, FOR HAVING ME.

REALLY GREAT TO BE HERE.

>> WELL, WITH ALL THAT SNOW THAT WAS IN DENVER, DO YOU THINK THAT WE'RE GOING TO HAVE A PRETTY SERIOUS FLOOD SEASON ALONG THE MISSISSIPPI IN 2021?

>> IT DOES NOT LOOK LIKE IT.

THE PROBABILITY FOR OUR RIVER BASIN TO HAVE MAJOR FLOODING IS RELATIVELY LOW RIGHT NOW.

THAT CAN ALWAYS CHANGE AS WE GET FURTHER INTO THE SPRING AND BEGINNING OF THE SUMMER.

BUT AS OF NOW, ALL THAT SNOW THAT'S IN THE COLORADO RIVER BASIN, DIFFERENT BASIN.

WE WON'T BE IMPACTED BY THAT.

A LOT OF THE SNOW THAT WAS UP NORTH HAS MELTED GRADUALLY, WHICH IS WHAT WE WANT, AND THE RAINS FOR SPRING SO FAR ARE RELATIVELY NORMAL.

WE WERE A LITTLE ON THE DRY SIDE, SO IT WAS WELCOMED WATER.

BUT RIGHT NOW, THINGS ARE MOVING ALONG SMOOTHLY.

WE'LL SEE IF THAT STAYS THE SAME WAY.

>> ALVIN.

>> I WAS, YOU KNOW, JUST A CHILD AND SO MANY ST. LOUISANS LIKE ME, WE WOULD GO DOWN TO THE RIVERFRONT SOMETIMES AND JUST WATCH THE RIVER GO BY.

AS I'VE GROWN OLDER, YOU KNOW, THE FIRST THOUGHT AND PEOPLE WHO VISIT HERE ASK ME THIS, AND THEY SAY WHY DON'T YOU DO MORE WITH YOUR RIVERFRONT RIGHT THERE BY DOWNTOWN ST. LOUIS?

IF THE RIVER ITSELF A PROBLEM BECAUSE OF FLOODING, THAT IT WOULD BE DIFFICULT TO REALLY, YOU KNOW, BUILD UP LIKE AN ENTERTAINMENT DISTRICT OR SOMETHING DOWN THAT WAY BECAUSE THE RIVER IS JUST TOO UNPREDICTABLE AND IT'S NOT CONTROLLABLE IN THIS STRETCH RIGHT HERE BY ST. LOUIS?

>> IT'S -- SO WE HAVE 100 MAYORS IN OUR ASSOCIATION, 100 CITIES IN TEN STATES ALONG ALL 2500 MILES OF WATERWAY THROUGH THE MIDDLE OF THE CONTINENT.

AND WE AS MAYORS HAVE SORT OF CHANGED OUR ENTIRE PARADIGM ON HOW WE EXIST WITH THE RIVER OVER THE LAST SEVERAL YEARS.

FOR THE LAST CENTURY, IT'S BEEN MORE OF WE'RE GOING TO CHANGE THE RIVER TO MEET OUR NEEDS AS A SOCIETY.

NOW THAT HAS MOVED AWAY AND WE ARE GOING TO FORM OUR CITIES AROUND THE RIVER INSTEAD OF TRYING TO FORM THE RIVER AROUND OUR CITIES.

THIS HASN'T SUNK IN ON ALL LEVELS OF SOCIETY BY ANY STRETCH OF THE IMAGINATION.

THIS IS A RELATIVELY RECENT PARADIGM SHIFT, SO I WOULD SAY IF YOU CONSIDER THE RIVER, THE MISSISSIPPI, TOO UNRULY TO EXIST NEXT TO, IT REALLY DEPENDS ON HOW YOU VIEW THAT RESOURCE.

IF YOU VIEW IT AS A RESOURCE THAT NEEDS TO BE CHANGED TO FIT YOUR NEEDS, THEN YES, YOU'RE GOING TO BE GRAVELY DISAPPOINTED, ESPECIALLY IN OUR NEW CLIMATIC REALITY, BUT IF YOU ARE ADAPTIVE, INNOVATIVE, AND YOU VIEW THE RIVER AS AN INDISPENSABLE RESOURCE PARAMOUNT TO YOUR EXISTENCE AND YOUR DRAW AS A COMMUNITY AND YOU'RE READY TO FORM YOURSELF AROUND WHAT THE RIVER WANTS TO DO, THEN IT'S NOT TOO UNRULY TO BE NEXT TO.

IN FACT, IT'S A GORGEOUS, BEAUTIFUL, NATURAL ECOSYSTEM AND ASSET TO HAVE IN OUR BACKYARD.

>> WELL, OKAY, WHAT DOES THAT MEANEXACTLY?

IF I HAD $80 BILLION AND I SAID I'M GOING TO TURN THE RIVERFRONT DOWN BY THE ARCH WHERE THE RIVER GOES BY ST. LOUIS INTO AN AREA THAT DRAWS PEOPLE AND HAS RESTAURANTS AND THINGS LIKE THAT, DO THEY ALL HAVE TO BE FLOATABLE TO WHERE THEY CAN RISE AND FALL, OR IS IT JUST NOT POSSIBLE?

I MEAN, I THINK WE WASTE OUR RIVERFRONT.

YOU TELL ME, HOW DO WE NOT WASTE OUR RIVERFRONT?

>> NO, I WOULD SAY THAT THE SOLUTIONS TO RIVERFRONT DEVELOPMENT ALONG THE MISSISSIPPI RIVER ARE NOT CONFINED TO OUR OWN JURISDICTION.

THEY ARE SYSTEMIC THROUGHOUT THE CORRIDOR, AND THE RIVER SYSTEM NEEDS TO BE MANAGED AT CORRIDOR SCALE INSTEAD OF INDIVIDUAL CITIES TRYING TO MANAGE IT IN THEIR OWN BACKYARDS.

WE ARE TRYING TO DEPLOY THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS OF ACRES OF NATURAL INFRASTRUCTURE ALONG THE WHOLE CORRIDOR, ALVIN, IN ORDER TO MAKE THE RIVER SAFER TO BE NEXT TO BECAUSE WE ARE RESTORING THE NATURAL ASSETS THAT USED TO BE ALONG THAT WOULD ABSORB AND BUFFER OUR COMMUNITIES NATURALLY AGAINST THESE DISASTERS.

ALL OF THAT SAID, ALL OF THAT SAID, TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION SPECIFICALLY ABOUT ST. LOUIS, IT'S A GOOD IDEA TO BUILD OUT OF FLOODPLAIN, OF COURSE, UP ON BLUFF, AND IT IS A GOOD IDEA TO MAKE SURE THAT WHATEVER YOU ARE BUILDING INTO THE RIVERFRONT IS NOT EXACERBATING DISASTER VULNERABILITY FOR ANYBODY ELSE, EITHER ON THE OTHER SIDE OR JUST DOWN RIVER FROM YOU.

WOULD I SAY THAT WE WASTE OUR RIVERFRONT?

I WOULD SAY THAT OUR VIEW OF OUR RIVERFRONT IS RATHER LIMITED, AND IT NEEDS TO BE A LOT MORE EXPANSIVE AND IT NEEDS TO INCLUDE A GEOGRAPHY THAT'S NOT JUST IN FRONT OF THE ARCH, BUT ALL THE WAY UP TO 270, ALL THE WAY DOWN TO HER KCULL -- HER CAN ALSO CULINIUM.

AND ALL THE WAY OVER TO THE OTHER SIDE.

>> THERE WERE HEADLINES THIS LAST ROUND ABOUT THE NEED TO RETHINK RIVER MANAGEMENT.

DIDN'T WE HAVE A CONVERSATION IN ARNOLD AND IN CHESTERFIELD VALLEY AND IN SO MANY OF THESE PREVIOUS FLOODS, IT SEEMS LIKE AFTER EVERY BIG FLOOD, THERE IS THERE CONVERSATION THAT WE NEED TO RETHINK IT.

WHAT IS DIFFERENT ABOUT THIS TIME, BECAUSE THIS ISN'T THE FIRST FLOOD WE'VE HAD IN RECENT MEMORY AND THEY'VE ALL BEEN DEVASTATING AND THEY'VE ALL PROMPTED THE SAME, I THINK, IT SEEMS LIKE PEOPLE TALKING ABOUT RETHINKING IT.

>> YES, SO WHAT'S DIFFERENT NOW IS THE PERSISTENCE OF THESE STASERS AND THE MAGNITUDE.

WE USED TO SUSTAIN 200- TO 500-YEAR FLOOD EVENT, IF YOU CAN THINK OF IT THAT WAY, IN THE EARLIER PART OF THE CENTURY MAYBE ONCE EVERY 50 YEARS, WHICH IN ITSELF IS NOT QUITE YET, BUT IT WAS LONG ENOUGH FOR US TO RECOVERY, MOVE ON, AND NOT WORRY ABOUT THE NEXT ONE FOR ANOTHER GENERATION.

THOSE DAYS ARE GONE.

WE'RE ENCOUNTERING RECORD EVENTS NOW CENTER 18 MONTHS, 18 TO 24 MONTHS OR IN 2019'S PERSPECTIVE, IT WAS A RECORD EVENT THAT NEVER WENT AWAY ALL YEAR LONG.

WE HAD 271 CONSECUTIVE DAYS OF FLOODING IN 2019.

A WHOLE NEW NATIONAL RECORD EVER RECORDED.

AND THAT WAS ON THE HEELS OF THE 2016 FLOOD, THE 2011 FLOOD, THE 2012 DROUGHT.

IT GOES ON AND ON BACK TO 1993.

NOW THESE THINGS ARE GETTING SO STACKED UP CLOSE TOGETHER AND THEY ARE SO VERY POWERFUL, THAT WE CANNOT HOPE TO HAVE ENOUGH RECOVERY PERIOD TO IGNORE IT.

WE HAVE TO CHANGE OUR ENTIRE APPROACH TO RIVER MANAGEMENT.

IT CAN NO LONGER BE LOTS OF WALLS, LOTS OF LEVEES, LOTS OF BUILT IMPLEMENTS TO CHANNEL WATER DOWN TO THE GULF.

WE REALLY NEED TO LOOK AT NATURAL STORAGE, HOLDING WATER NATURALLY, CREATING NATURAL ASSETS THAT ABSORB THESE IMPACT OVER TIME.

THAT'S WHERE WE SEE OUR SOLUTIONS COMING FROM.

AND QUITE FRANKLY, RAY, IT'S THE ONLY SOLUTIONS WE CAN AFFORD.

WE CAN'T AFFORD A BUNCH OF NEW INFRASTRUCTURE THAT WE HAVE TO BUILD AND MAINTAIN AND THEN REBUILD.

THE NATURAL STUFF IS GREAT THAT WE DON'T HAVE TO SPEND A BUNCH OF MONEY REBUILDING IT EVERY TIME AND IT HAS OTHER AMENITIES THAT COME ALONG WITH IT.

OUTDOOR RECREATION, TOURISM, CLEANER WATER, BETTER QUALITY OF LIFE.

THOSE ARE ALL NICE BOTTOM-LINE DOLLAR VALUE ADDED.

>> BILL.

>> I'D LIKE TO GO BACK TO ALVIN'S GOOD QUESTION.

A FRIEND AND I TOOK A LITTLE 21-FOOT BOAT FROM MINNEAPOLIS TO ST. LOUIS AND FROM ST. LOUIS DOWN TO THE OHIO.

WE TOOK A LEFT AND WENT DOWN TO MOBILE BAY.

THROUGH A LOT OF RIVER SYSTEMS, AND SO MANY RIVER CITIES HAD -- THE RIVER WAS A CENTRAL PART OF THEIR DOWNTOWN AND THEY HAD MARINAS AND THEY HAD -- IS IT POSSIBLE FOR ST. LOUIS TO DO MORE WITH ITS RIVERFRONT, OR IS IT BECAUSE OF THE FLOODING, IS WHAT WE HAVE ABOUT ALL WE CAN HAVE?

>> NO, I THINK THERE'S MUCH MORE WE CAN DO WITH OUR RIVERFRONT.

I MEAN, YOU LOOK AT THE ENTIRE NORTH SIDE WHERE THE OLD POWER PLANT IS AND PLACES LIKE THAT AND YOU HAVE SOUTH WHERE THE -- THE SOUTHERN SIDE WHERE RIVER DE PERE FEEDS INTO THE CITY.

AND THE RIVER CONFLUENCES.

WE HAVE SIGNIFICANT DYNAMIC GEOGRAPHY THAT THERE'S A LOT WE CAN DO WITH, BUT WE HAVE TO BUILD IN SUSTAINABLE PROTECTIONS IN THAT PLAN.

IT'S NOT GOING TO BE SIMPLE, BILL.

IT'S GOING TO REQUIRE MULTILATERAL APPROACHES THAT INCORPORATE MAJOR GREEN SPACE, A LOT OF NATURAL FLOOD STORAGE AREAS.

ONE OF THE PROPOSALS THAT I'VE SEEN THAT I COMPLETELY AGREE WITH THE RENATURING RIVER DEPERE.

RIPPING UP ALL THAT CONCRETE.

THIS IS WHAT PHILADELPHIA DID TO PORTIONS OF THE DELAWARE.

RIPPING UP A LOT OF THAT CONCRETE AND ALLOWING AND BASICALLY PUTTING IN A NATURAL CORRIDOR AGAIN.

DUBUQUE DID THE SAME THING, DUBUQUE, IOWA.

THEY HAD A SORT OF RIVER DE PERE THAT RAN THROUGH THE CITY OF THEIR CITY AND MET THE MISSISSIPPI RIVER.

A CENTURY AGO, THEY BURIED IT.

THEY DIDN'T EVEN PUT CONCRETE, THEY MADE IT INTO A PIPE.

THOSE PIPES BROKE ALL THE TIME BORROWING -- BLOWING UP PARTS OF THE CITY AND THEY DECIDED TO GIVE IT BACK TO A NATURAL RIVER AND WHAT USED TO BE THE MOST UNDESIRABLE HIGH RISK PROPERTY IN DOWNTOWN DUBUQUE IS NOW THE MOST DESIRABLE, HIGHEST PRICED PROPERTY BECAUSE THEY RENATURED THAT ENTIRE STREAM LEADING TO THE MISSISSIPPI RIVER.

I THINK GOING IN THOSE DIRECTIONS, LOOKING AT THOSE STRATEGIES, LOOKING AT WHAT PHILADELPHIA DID TO BRING THE DELAWARE RIVER EXPERIENCE DEEPER INTO THE CITY, AND QUITE FRANKLY, OTHER MISSISSIPPI RIVER CITIES ARE DOING THE SAME THING, MEMPHIS HAS A PLAN, ST. PAUL IS DESIGNING A NEW GRAND MISSISSIPPI RIVER WATERFRONT PARK THAT WILL BE DESIGNED TO TAKE ON WATER AND ABSORB RISK FOR THE CITY, SO IT DOESN'T INTO STREETS.

DAVENPORT DID THIS IN THE '90s, AND I THINK IF WE PURSUE IT IN THAT REGARD, A LOT MORE OPPORTUNITIES WOULD OPEN UP FOR US.

>> JOE.

>> YEAH, I THINK BECAUSE WHEN YOU MENTION THAT YOU WORK IN -- WITH 100 CITIES IN TEN STATES -- >> YES.

>> -- HOW DIFFICULT IS IT TO KEEP THE FOCUS OF TEN STATES' WORTH AND 100 CITIES' WORTH OF POLITICIANS ON THE CLEAR PROBLEM AS OPPOSED TO JUST GETTING OFF INTO SOME DEBATE OVER CLIMATE CHANGE?

YOU KNOW, SORT OF THIS PHILOSOPHICAL TO WHERE, YOU KNOW, WE WANT TO STAKE OUT SOME PHILOSOPHICAL SIDE THAT WE'RE NOT ACTUALLY DEALING WITH THE PROBLEM AND YOU'VE GOT 100 CITIES AND TEN STATES?

THAT SEEMS TOUGH.

>> IT IS -- IT ACTUALLY IS NOT AS DIFFICULT AS YOU MAY IMAGINE BECAUSE WHEN YOU'RE DEALING WITH THE MAYORAL LEVEL, JOE, IT'S A LOT LESS IDEOLOGY THAN YOU WOULD IF YOU WERE A MEMBER OF CONGRESS OR A GOVERNOR.

IT IS -- IT'S VERY PRACTICAL.

IT GETS -- REALLY, THE POLITICS SORT OF MELT AWAY IN THAT REGARD AND IT REALLY GETSOWN TO THE SOLUTIONS.

I'LL GIVE YOU AN EXAMPLE.

SO ONE OF OUR CO-CHAIRS -- WE HAVE TWO MAYORS THAT ARE THE TOP DOGS IN OUR ASSOCIATION.

THE MAYOR OF BATON ROUGE, LOUISIANA, MAYOR SHARON WESTON BROOME.

SHER CITY IS CELEBRATING 300 YEARS THIS YEAR AND MAYOR BOB GALLAGHER OF BETTENDORF, IOWA.

TWO VERY DIFFERENT PARTS OF THE COUNTRY, TWO VERY DIFFERENT CITIES.

THEY WORK AND GET ALONG GREAT BECAUSE, AS MAYOR GALLAGHER LIKES TO PUT IT, WE SET ASIDE ALL THE ALARMIST RHETORIC AROUND CLIMATE CHANGE.

WE DON'T GET INTO THAT AT ALL.

WE FOCUS ON THE SOLUTION.

IT'S LIKE MAYOR BROOME OF BATON ROUGE SAYS, I'M NOT REQUESTING -- NOT GOING TO ARGUE WITH YOU ON THE CAUSES OF CLIMATE CHANGE WHILE MY CITIZENS GO UNDER WATER.

I'M SIMPLY GOING TO SOLVE THIS PROBLEM AS MAYOR BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT I'VE BEEN ELECTED TO DO.

THAT IS REALLY WHERE THE RUBBER MEETS THE ROAD WITH OUR MAYORS ON THESE ISSUES IS THE SOLUTIONS AND NOT THE RHETORIC.

>> WELL, IT SEEMS TO ME, COLIN THAT IF YOU DON'T TAKE THE OVERFLOW OF THE RIVER, WHICH SEEMS TO BE GREATER AND GREATER, AND TURN IT INTO RIVERS LIKE YOU RECOMMEND OR LAKES FOR TOURISM AND RECREATIONAL PURPOSES, WE'LL PROBABLY HAVE TO BUY OUT SOME CITIES AND TOWNS ALONG THE WAY, OR AT LEAST REPLACE THEIR FRONT STREETS AND FIRST STREETS AND SECOND STREETS.

AM I RIGHT?

>> YEAH, ADAPTIVE MANAGEMENT TO THE RIVER TO GIVE IT ROOM TO DO WHAT IT NEEDS TO DO, ESPECIALLY IN THESE NEW CLIMATE IMPACTS THAT WE'RE EXPERIENCING, IS ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY AND YOU SEE CITIES DOING THAT.

CAPE GIRARDEAU HAS BEEN BUILDING A LARGE CONSERVATION AREA THAT WAS FULL OF HOMES.

THEY'VE MOVED EVERYBODY OUT AND NOW IT IS DESIGNED TO FLOOD.

THE SAME WITH ARNOLD AND KENSWICK.

ALL THESE CITIES ARE CREATING NATURAL AREAS, AGAIN TO, LAND BACK OVER TO THE RIVER.

THESE ARE REPETITIVE LOSS AREAS, AREAS THAT TYPICALLY DO FLOOD AND A BUNCH OF HOMES WERE ALWAYS GO UNDER WATER.

GRAFTON HAD THE SAME THING.

YOU HAD A NUMBER OF FEDERAL EFFORTS THAT OVERLAY THIS LIKE A FEMA BUYOUT PROGRAM, BUT I THINK YOU'RE GOING TO SEE MORE OF THAT, BUT YOU'RE ALSO GOING TO SEE MORE ADAPTIVE APPROACHES TO BUILDING.

SO THE NEW DOCK AND THE NEW FORT THAT'S GOING INTO KENSWICK THIS YEAR, WHICH THEY ALREADY BROKE GROUND ON, THE WHOLE FACILITY IS DESIGNED TO GO UNDER WATER.

IT'S DESIGNED TO FLOOD, AS IS BEALE STREET LANDING CONVENTION CENTER IN MEMPHIS.

ALSO DESIGNED TO BE UNDER WATER.

SO THESE ARE THINGS THAT ARE JUST -- THAT JUST, BY DESIGN, ALLOW THE RIVER TO COME AND WASH OVER THEM AND THEN THERE'S NOT MUCH MESS ON THE OTHER END.

IT'S THAT KIND OF APPROACH THAT I THINK IS GOING TO DICTATE THE FUTURE FOR OUR CITY.

>> ALVIN.

>> YOU MENTIONED, YOU KNOW, A LOT OF TOWNS, CITIES, MAYORS, PROJECTS.

YOU DIDN'T MENTION ST. LOUIS.

WHAT IS YOUR RELATIONSHIP WITH, YOU KNOW, CITY HALL IN ST. LOUIS?

I KNOW WE'RE ABOUT TO CHANGE MAYORS, BUT WHAT IS -- WHERE IS ST. LOUIS IN ALL THIS PROCESS?

>> YES, SO WE'RE HEADQUARTERED HERE AND MAYOR FRANCIS SLAY WAS ONE OF OUR FOUNDING MAYORS BACK IN 2012, SO HE'S -- HE WAS VERY MUCH SOLD ON THIS AND WANTED TO SEE IT HAPPEN AND WAS ONE OF OUR FIRST CO-CHAIRS.

I'M FROM ST. LOUIS, BORN AND RAISED HERE, SO THIS IS MY HOMETOWN.

I THINK ST. LOUIS -- ST. LOUIS HAS A NUMBER OF OPPORTUNITIES FOR, AS DOES BOTH SIDES OF THE RIVER, ALSO EAST ST. LOUIS, ILLINOIS, GRAFTON, ALTON, ALL THOSE COMMUNITIES, THERE'S A NUMBER OF OPPORTUNITIES TO IMPROVE ON OUR RELATIONSHIP WITH THE MISSISSIPPI RIVER, BUT IT REALLY NEEDS TO COME DOWN TO VIEWING AS NOT SOMETHING TO CONTROL, BUT SOMETHING TO LET IN AND REALLY BRING CLOSER INTO THE COMMUNITY EXPERIENCE.

AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE.

WE ALSO, UNLIKE A LOT OF MY OTHER CITIES, ST. LOUIS HAS A VERY SIGNIFICANT INDUSTRIAL FOOTPRINT RIGHT NEXT TO DOWNTOWN.

I DON'T REALLY HAVE -- I DON'T HAVE THAT IN ANY OTHER CITY EXCEPT IN BETWEEN BATON ROUGE AND NEW ORLEANS AREA, ALL THOSE CHEMICAL PLANTS.

SO I THINK, YOU KNOW, WORKING WITH THE INDUSTRIES THAT ARE THERE TO MAKE THEIR EMISSION AND LOT LESS NOXIOUS, A LOT LESS NOTICEABLE, WORKING WITH THEM TO REALLY LIMIT THEIR IMPACTS AND MAYBE EVEN CREATE SOME NATURAL BUFFERS BETWEEN THOSE FACILITIES AND THE REST OF THE CITY, IS A GOOD APPROACH.

ALSO, THERE IS A LOT OF OPPORTUNITY FOR DISASTER MITIGATION DURING -- IN THESE CONFLUENCE AREAS OF THE ILLINOIS, THE DE PERE RIVER AND THE MERAMEC THAT I THINK ST. LOUIS SHOULD GET AHOLD OF.

I'LL TELL YOU, ALVIN, THOUGH, ALL FAIRNESS TO OUR FORMER MAYOR OR ABOUT TO BE FORMER MAYOR, MAYOR KREWSON WHO JUST ABOUT TO CHECK OUT, SHE HAD A FAIR AMOUNT OF SIGNIFICANT DISTRACTIONS THAT WERE ALSO NOT NEARLY AS ACUTE.

SO THE VIOLENT CRIME SITUATION IN ST. LOUIS, I DON'T REALLY HAVE AS ACUTE THAT SITUATION IF MY OTHER CITIES, SO I UNDERSTAND HOW THAT COULD CREATE SOME DISTRACTION, BUT I ALSO THINK THAT THE WAY WE TREAT THE RIVER AND THE WAY THAT WE CAN CREATE A RENAISSANCE FOR A LOT OF THESE NEAR-WATER COMMUNITIES WOULD ACTUALLY HELP SOLVE SOME OF OUR OTHER PROBLEMS LIKE THE VIOLENT CRIME, THE UNEMPLOYMENT, SCHOOLS.

THESE OTHER, YOU KNOW, VERY LOUD PROBLEMS THAT TAKE UP A LOT OF OXYGEN FOR ST. LOUIS.

I THINK THAT WE COULD HELP THOSE BY TACKLING SOME OF THESE OTHER OPPORTUNITIES.

>> COLIN, I'M THE GUY THAT JOE WAS THINKING ABOUT WHEN HE ASKED THE QUESTION ABOUT CLIMATE CHANGE.

NO ONE WOULD EXPECT THAT YOUR MAYORS SHOULD BE FOCUSED ON TALKING ABOUT THE KEYSTONE PIPELINE OR, YOU KNOW, FRACKING OR SOMETHING, THE BROADER ISSUES, BUT CERTAINLY CLIMATE CHANGE, WHICH IS -- YOU USED THE WORD "RHETORIC," BUT IT'S SCIENCE.

IS IT NOT AN IMPORTANT DISCUSSION IN TERMS OF -- I'LL BE HONEST, FLOOD MANAGEMENT IS WAY ABOVE MY PAY GRADE, BUT EVERYTHING FROM -- CERTAINLY THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION, THEY WERE ERASING MENTION OF CLIMATE CHANGE, BUT WHETHER IT'S THE FUNDING OF THE CORPS OF ENGINEERS, THE LONG-TERM STRATEGY, CAN YOU REALLY JUST SORT OF PUT CLIMATE CHANGE IN A DIFFERENT COMPARTMENT THAT DOESN'T HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH THE DECISIONS THAT NEED TO BE MADE ABOUT THE LONG-TERM HERE?

>> WE DON'T PUT IT INTO A DIFFERENT COMPARTMENT.

WE ABSOLUTELY TACKLE IT HEAD-ON, BUT WHAT WE DON'T GET BOGGED DOWN IN IS, ARE HUMANS TO BLAME FOR ALL THIS AND, WELL, WE'VE GOT TO SEQUESTER CARBON JUST FOR SEQUESTERING CARBON'S SAKE.

NO, WE APPROACH THESE THINGS WITH COBENEFITS.

SO IT'S GREAT IF WE CAN SEQUESTER CARBON AND WE CAN REDUCE GAC EMISSION, ABSOLUTELY, BUT WITH THOSE ACTIVITIES HAS TO COME JOBS, HAS TO COME TRAINING, HAS TO COME AN EXPANSION OF OTHER ECONOMIES.

THERE HAS TO BE A ONE-FOR-ONE TRADEOFF HERE.

THERE HAS TO BE OTHER COBENEFITS THAT COME WITH CLIMATE CHANGE OR WHAT WE CALL CLIMATE PERFORMANCE.

SO, YOU KNOW, I GOT ASKED, OH, ABOUT 13 TIMES BY THE PRESS, NEW YORK TIMES, "WALL STREET JOURNAL," WHAT DID WE THINK OF THE GREEN NEW DEAL?

AND WE THOUGHT THE GREEN NEW DEAL WAS REALLY NOT COUCHED IN REALITY FOR MIDDLE AMERICA BECAUSE ANY KIND OF CLIMATE AGENDA NEEDS TO HAVE BENEFITS FOR -- THAT ARE SELLABLE TO OUR FOLK AND THAT MEANS MORE JOBS AND MORE TRAINING FOR NEW JOBS, BUT IT ALSO HAS TO MEAN MITIGATION AND ADAPTATION OPPORTUNITIES.

I'LL GIVE YOU AN EXAMPLE.

WE JUST -- WE JUST HAD OUR D.C. MEETING AT THE BEGINNING OF THIS MONTH, MARCH 2nd THROUGH THE 4th.

IT WAS VIRTUAL.

WE WEREN'T ACTUALLY THERE, BUT WE TALKED TO SENATOR ROY BLUNT, WE TALKED TO SENATOR KLOBUCHAR, SENATOR DURBIN, SENATOR TAMMY DUCKWORTH WERE ALL ON THE AGENDA.

AND WE TOLD THEM, LOOK, IF PRESIDENT BIDEN IS SERIOUS ABOUT MAKING A CLIMATE AGENDA LAST LONGER THAN 2022, I.E., THE NEXT ELECTION WHERE CONGRESS -- A REPUBLICAN CONGRESS CAN THEN JUST COME IN AND WINE IT OUT, THEN HE -- WIPE IT OUT, THEN HE HAS TO BRING MIDDLE AMERICA ALONG FOR THE RIDE.

WHAT DOES THAT MEAN?

IT MEANS FULLY FUNDING THINGS LIKE THE RESILIENCE REVOLVING LOAN FUND, WHICH JUST PASSED THIS YEAR.

IT MEANS PASSING OUR PROPOSAL FOR A NEW SAFEGUARDING THE MISSISSIPPI RIVER TOGETHER ACT, WHAT WE CALL THE SMART ACT.

CREATING THE OFFICE OF WHITE HOUSE CHIEF RESILIENCE OFFICER IN THE WHITE HOUSE.

AND FINALLY, INCENTIVIZING NATURAL INFRASTRUCTURE DEPLOYMENT THROUGH THE HIGHWAY BILL, THE FARM BILL, THESE OTHER LARGER VEHICLES.

WE JUST SIGNED AN AGREEMENT WITH DUCKS UNLIMITED ON MARCH 4th TO DEPLOY NATURAL INFRASTRUCTURE UP AND DOWN THE MISSISSIPPI RIVER FOR DISASTER MITIGATION AND HABITAT, AND ALSO TO SEQUESTER CARBON.

SO THESE WETLANDS, FORESTS AND RIPARIAN AREAS THAT WE'RE GOING TO PUT BACK BECAUSE WE LOST 80% OF THEM THE LAST 100 YEARS, THEY'RE GOING TO SUCK UP A LOT OF CARBON, THEY'RE GOING TO SUCK UP A LOT OF GAC EMISSIONS AND THAT'S A COBENEFIT ALONG WITH THIS OTHER STUFF THAT WE CAN SELL.

WE CAN SELL IT TO OUR CITY COUNCILS AND OUR FOLK.

THAT'S REALLY WHAT IT COMES DOWN TO.

>> COLIN, THE RIVER, OF COURSE, IS STILL A HIGHWAY AND WITH SHIPPING THE BIG BUSINESS, DO WE HAVE AN INFRASTRUCTURE PROBLEM WITH LOCKS AND DAMS OR ARE WE OKAY THERE?

>> NO, WE'RE NOT OKAY.

THE LOCKS AND DAMS SYSTEM IS IN A STATE OF COMPROMISE, I WOULD SAY.

BEFORE 2019, THE PRICE TAG TO BRING ALL OF OUR GLOBAL COMMODITY SUPPLY CHAIN INFRASTRUCTURE UP TO A STATE OF GOOD REPAIR ALONG THE ENTIRE MISSISSIPPI RIVER WAS 12 BILLION.

THAT WAS SOUP TO NUTS.

4 BILLION TO KEEP IT FROM FAILING, 12 BILLION TO GIVE US ALL NEW SHINY STUFF.

AFTER 2019, THAT PRICE TAG HAS JUMPED UP TO ABOVE 16 BILLION BECAUSE OF ALL THE DISASTERS WE EXPERIENCED THAT YEAR, ALL THAT PERPETUAL FLOODING.

SO -- HOWEVER, SO AT 16 BILLION, TO GIVE US A NEW GOLD COMMODITY EXPORT SYSTEM ALONG THE RIVER, WE GENERATE 164 BILLION OFF OF THAT ACTIVITY ANNUALLY.

I'D SAY IF YOU GIVE -- I GIVE YOU $16 AND YOU GIVE ME $164 BACK, I'D SAY THAT'S A PRETTY GOOD DEAL FOR ME AND THAT'S WHERE WE'RE COMING DOWN.

THAT $164 BILLION BILL IS ACTUALLY WITH ALL THE DELAYS AND CLOSURES WE EXPERIENCE TODAY.

IF WE DON'T HAVE THAT ANYMORE AND WE HAVE ALL THAT RELIABILITY WITH NO DELAYS, THEN THAT $164 BILLION FIGURE, WELL, IT CAN GO WAY UP.

>> WE GOT A MINUTE TO GO.

>> I THINK IT MAKES ECONOMIC SENSE, BUT PEOPLE TELL ME OUR CHANCES OF GETTING THE MONEY TO FIX THE LOCKS AND DAMS IS A BIG UPHILL FIGHT.

DO YOU THINK WE CAN DO IT?

>> I THINK WE'RE GETTING -- WE'RE CLOSER NOW THAN WE EVER HAVE BEEN BECAUSE THE CORPS OF ENGINEERS BOUGHT -- >> HE MUTED HIMSELF.

>> AND OUR -- A CALL CAME IN.

AND NOW WITH THIS INFRASTRUCTURE PACKAGE COMING TOGETHER, THERE'S SOME PLANETS ALIGNING RIGHT NOW THAT HAVE NOT BEEN ALIGNING OVER THE PAST EIGHT TO TEN YEARS.

>> GOOD, GOOD.

>> ONE OF THE BIG ONES IS EARMARKS.

WITH EARMARKS COMING BACK, EARMARKS USED TO BE THE GREASE THAT MADE THE GEARS OF CONGRESS TURN SMOOTHLY.

IT WAS -- IT WOULD ALLOW MEMBERS OF CONGRESS THAT ABSOLUTELY COULDN'T STAND EACH OTHER AND ARE DIAMETRICALLY OPPOSED IDEOLOGICALLY, TO COME TOGETHER ON PROJECTS.

I HATE EVERYTHING YOU STAND FOR, BUT I'LL SUPPORT YOUR PROJECT IF YOU SUPPORT MY PROJECT.

THAT'S THE BEAUTY OF EARMARKS.

WITH THOSE COMING BACK, I THINK YOU'RE GOING TO SEE THIS ABILITY OF CONGRESS TO GET A LOT MORE DONE AND WE HAVE A PRIZ THAT IS -- THIS IS DEBATABLE -- >> IN WELLEN CAMP, WE HAVE TO HOLD YOU TO THAT RIGHT THERE.

THE NEXT TIME YOU JOIN US, WE'LL TALK ABOUT EARMARKS AND MORE.

UNTIL THEN, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING US ON NEXT UP AND WE WISH YOU THE VERY BEST.

THANKS FOR YOUR TIME.

>> YOU BET.

GOOD TO BE HERE, THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU SO MUCH.

SEE YOU NEXT WEEK, EVERYBODY, AT THE SAME TIME.

>> Announcer: DONNYBROOK IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE MEMBERS OF NINE PBS.