>> Braude: TONIGHT ON "GREATER BOSTON": DEMOCRATS' NEARLY $2 TRILLION COVID RELIEF BILL IS BEING HAILED AS THE GREATEST ANTI-POVERTY MEASURE IN DECADES WITH DIRECT CHECKS, UNEMPLOYMENT AID AND MUCH MORE.

IS IT?

AND WHAT WILL THE LONG-TERM EFFECT BE?

AND WHAT EFFECT WILL IT HAVE ON THE ECONOMY?

WE'LL DISCUSS.

THEN, LATER, MIDDLESEX D.A.

MARIAN RYAN JOINS ME, ALONG WITH HER OFFICE'S FIRST-EVER DIRECTOR OF RACIAL JUSTICE INITIATIVES, ON WHAT THEY HOPE TO ACCOMPLISH WITH THIS NEW ROLE.

PLUS, HOW THE MICROSCOPIC NUMBER OF BLACK AND LATINO BUSINESS OWNERS PARALLELS BOSTON AND THE STATE'S INVESTMENT IN THEM.

AND FINALLY, SOME OF WHAT YOU'VE BEEN SENDING IN.

♪ ♪ ♪ >> Braude: WITH MORE THAN 60 MILLION PEOPLE WITH AT LEAST ONE VACCINE DOSE IN THE U.S. AND AROUND TWO MILLION MORE GETTING SHOTS EVERY DAY, NEARLY 3 MILLION YESTERDAY, THE CDC RELEASED LONG-AWAITED GUIDANCE TODAY AS TO WHAT PEOPLE SHOULD AND SHOULD NOT BE DOING ONCE THEY'RE FULLY VACCINATED.

ACCORDING TO THE GUIDELINES, TWO WEEKS AFTER GETTING A FINAL SHOT, FULLY VACCINATED PEOPLE CAN VISIT WITH OTHER FULLY VACCINATED PEOPLE INDOORS WITHOUT WEARING MASKS OR DISTANCING.

THEY CAN ALSO SAFELY VISIT INDOORS WITH A SINGLE HOUSEHOLD OF UNVACCINATED PEOPLE WHO ARE AT LOW RISK FROM COVID-19.

BUT BEYOND THOSE EXCEPTIONS, REGULAR MASKING AND DISTANCING GUIDELINES STILL APPLY, AND THE C.D.C.

STILL DISCOURAGES UNNECESSARY TRAVEL FOR EVERYONE, VACCINATED OR NOT.

>> WHILE WE WORK TO QUICKLY VACCINATED PEOPLE MORE AND MORE EACH DAY, WE HAVE TO SEE THIS THROUGH.

LET'S STICK TOGETHER.

PLEASE KEEP WEARING A WELL-FITTING MASK AND TAKING THE OTHER PUBLIC HEALTH ACTIONS WE KNOW WORK TO HELP STOP THE SPREAD OF THIS VIRUS.

>> Braude: IT'S STILL FAR FROM LIFE AS WE KNEW IT A YEAR AGO, BUT IT'S A MAJOR STEP TOWARD POST-PANDEMIC LIFE AND WELCOME NEWS FOR MANY WHO WILL BE ABLE TO VISIT WITH FAMILY FOR THE FIRST TIME IN A LONG TIME.

THE ANNOUNCEMENT ALSO COMES ON THE HEELS OF WELCOME NEWS FOR SOME OF THE MILLIONS STRUGGLING FROM THE FINANCIAL IMPACTS OF THE PANDEMIC AS WELL.

THE SENATE, MORE PRECISELY DEMOCRATS IN THE SENATE, PASSED THEIR VERSION OF BIDEN'S $1.9 TRILLION COVID RELIEF BILL OVER THE WEEKEND, WHICH THE HOUSE IS EXPECTED TO SIGN OFF ON AND SEND TO THE PRESIDENT'S DESK TOMORROW.

WHEN IT'S PASSED, THE PACKAGE IS EXPECTED TO LIFT MILLIONS OUT OF POVERTY, IN PART THROUGH $1,400 STIMULUS CHECKS, WHICH COULD START GOING OUT WITHIN DAYS OF BIDEN'S SIGNATURE, AND EXTENDED UNEMPLOYMENT BENEFITS.

L AND MORE.

THE BILL WOULD ALSO EXPAND THE CHILD TAX CREDIT AND BOOST FEDERAL HEALTHCARE INSURANCE SUBSIDIES, AMONG OTHER FORMS OF AID.

I'M JOINED NOW BY CHUCK COLLINS, THE DIRECTOR OF THE PROGRAM ON INEQUALITY AND THE COMMON GOOD AT THE PROGRESSIVE THINK TANK, THE INSTITUTE FOR POLICY STUDIES.

BEEN A LONG TIME CHUCK.

GOOD TO SEE YOU.

>> GREAT TO SEE YOU JIM.

>> Braude: SO I'M AMONG THOSE WHO ARE DESCRIBING THIS AS ONE OF THE MOST ANTIPOVERTY BILLS IN DECADES.

IS THAT HYPERBOLE?

>> NO, IT IS ACTUALLY, IT'S KIND OF AN FDR NATIONAL RECOVERY ACT SCALE INTERVENTION I THINK.

SO I THINK YOU'RE RIGHT.

I THINK IT'S BIG.

>> Braude: SO IT'S BIG FOR THOSE IN POVERTY ACROSS THE BOARD.

DOES IT DO ANYTHING TO ADDRESS THE WEALTH AND INCOME GAP BETWEEN BLACK AND WHITE AMERICANS, LATINO AMERICANS AND WHITE AMERICANS OR NO?

>> I THINK IT WILL INDIRECTLY DO THAT.

IT HAS A BUNCH OF THINGS THAT REALLY ADDRESS PEOPLE IN DEEP POVERTY.

THE CHILD TAX CREDIT, THE EARNED INCOME CREDIT ARE BOTH REFUNDABLE IN THIS CASE SO IT'S REACHING BELOW THE SORT OF LOWEST INCOME THRESHOLDS IN THE PAST.

THE STIMULUS CHECKS WILL OBVIOUSLY REACH PEOPLE IN THE EMERGENCY MOMENT BUT THERE'S A BUNCH OF THINGS THAT I THINK WILL LAG THE SUPPORT FOR NOT JUST THE VERY POOR, BUT SORT OF WORKING POOR AND EVEN MIDDLE CLASS ARE GOING TO HAVE SOME BENEFIT HERE IN TERMS OF THE BENEFITS THAT ARE BEING PUT IN THIS LEGISLATION.

>> Braude: REFUNDABLE MEANING, THE TERM YOU USE, EVEN IF YOU PAY NOTHING IN TAXES YOU STILL GET A CHECK OR SOMETHING IN PAYMENT.

A BUNCH OF PEOPLE WHO ACTUALLY SUPPORTED THE GENERAL DIRECTION OF THIS BILL THOUGHT THAT SOME OF IT WAS NOT AS TARGET ED AS IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN AND DIDN'T HELP POOR AND LOWER INCOME PEOPLE AS MUCH AS OTHERS.

GENERALLY, STIMULUS CHECKS, PROGRESSIVE ECONOMISTS THOUGHT THE UNEMPLOYMENT THING WAS PERFECT AND TARGETED.

THE STIMULUS CHECKS FOR FAR TOO MANY PEOPLE WERE GOING TO THE QUOTE, WHATEVER THIS MEANS, WRONG PEOPLE.

DO YOU AGREE WITH THAT ANALYSIS OR NO?

>> YOU KNOW I THINK PART OF WHAT WE'RE DOING RIGHT NOW IS SHOWING THAT GOVERNMENT COULD DO BIG THINGS FOR A LOT OF PEOPLE WHO ARE HURTING RIGHT NOW.

THAT INCLUDES, YOU KNOW, NOT THE VERY POOR BUT THERE ARE A LOT OF WORKING CLASS HOUSEHOLDS THAT ARE AFFECTED HERE.

SO I THINK THIS IS NOT A TIME REALLY TO NICKEL AND DIME AND QUIBBLE.

THIS IS A TIME FOR A BIG INFUSION.

IT WILL HAVE A POSITIVE ECONOMIC STIMULUS THROUGH THE WHOLE ECONOMY AND IT'S NOT GIVING AWAY TO THE BILLIONAIRES, WE KNOW THE BILLIONAIRES ARE DOING FINE AND THE TOP 10%, 20% ARE DOING FINE DURING THIS PANDEMIC BUT IT IS -- AND PARTICULARLY THOSE REFUNDABLE TAX CREDITS THOSE REALLY GO REACH PEOPLE WHO ARE -- DO REACH PEOPLE IN THE DEEPEST LEVEL OF POVERTY IN OUR SOCIETY.

IT IS GOING TO LIFT 45% OF CHILDREN WHO ARE IN POVERTY WILL BE PROLIFERATED ABOVE THE POVERTY LINE.

>> Braude: THAT IS STUNNING JUST STUNNING.

HOW MUCH WOULD A MINIMUM WAGE, FROM SEVEN AND A QUARTER TO 15, GRADUALLY OBVIOUSLY, HAVE THAT HAVE MADE?

IT OBVIOUSLY DIDN'T MAKE IT INTO THE BILL.

>> THE 12, 13 MILLION PEOPLE WHO IMMEDIATELY WOULD GET THAT PAY INCREASE AND IT WOULD HAVE THAT POSITIVE BOTTOM-UP STIMULUS IN THE ECONOMY.

MORE MONEY IN THE POCKETS OF WORKING PEOPLE.

AND I THINK WE FOCUSED A LOT ON THE FACT THAT IT'S NOT PART OF THE STIMULUS BILL BUT YOU KNOW THE MORE I LOOK AT IT, THE MORE THERE ARE REALLY INTERESTING THINGS IN THERE.

THERE'S YOU KNOW A PENSION BACKUP FOR UNDERFUND ID PENSION FUNDS THAT WILL HELP A MILLION BLUE COLLAR WORKERS WHO ARE NOT SURE THEY REQUEST RETIRE, AND FOR RURAL BROADBAND, LIKE THE ELECTRIFICATION PROGRAM FOR COMMUNITIES THAT NEED TO BE REINTEGRATED INTO THE ECONOMY.

THE MORE WE LEARN WHAT'S IN HERE THE MORE WE'LL SEE.

IT'S A FAR REACHING BILL.

YOU CAN UNDERSTAND AFTER WHATEVER A DECADE OF MITCH McCONNELL, TO BE ABLE TO PUT FORWARD A BILL THAT REALLY MOVES A BUNCH OF THINGS THAT HAVE BEEN BLOCKED FOR YEARS REALLY WILL MAKE A HUGE DIFFERENCE FOR PEOPLES'S LIVES.

>> Braude: HAD A WOULD YOU SAY, BACK ON THE MINIMUM WAGE, I WAS STUNNED TO SEE THOSE WHO VOTED NO ON THE MINIMUM WAGE FOLKS, JEAN SHEHEEN AND MAGE HASSON, AGAIN THEY VOTED NO, WITH ALL THE REPUBLICANS AND SIX OR SEVEN DEMOCRATS AND ONE INDEPENDENT, WHAT WHAT DO YOU SAY TO THEM?

>> WELL, I THINK THEY'RE GOING TO BE HEARING A LOT FROM THEIR CONSTITUENTS.

RAISING THE MINIMUM WAGE, THIS IS PART OF THE DEMOCRATIC PLATFORM.

THIS IS CENTRAL TO WHAT DEMOCRATS HAVE BEEN TALKING ABOUT.

IT'S HOW ONE OF THE KEY WAYS WE'RE GOING TO ADDRESS THESE EXTREME INYEALTS.

I UNG UNDERSTAND MAGGIE HASSON IS LOOKING OVER HER SHOULDER TO JOHN SINUNU, I THINK THE MINIMUM WAGE IS A NO BRAINER IT'S SO COMMON SENSE AT THIS POINT, IT'S PHASED IN OVER SO MUCH TIME TTYs NOT GOING TO HAVE ANY DOWN IMPACT ON THE -- IT'S NOT GOING TO HAVE ANY DOWN IMPACT ON THE ECONOMY.

>> Braude: I'M SURE VIEWERS ARE SAYING, TELL US SOMETHING WE DON'T KNOW BUT ONE THING I DO REMEMBER FROM ECONOMICS 101 IS WHEN YOU GIVE MONEY AND BENEFITS TO LOW INCOME PEOPLE THEY'LL SPEND IT, THEY'RE NOT GOING TO SAVE IT.

PARTICULARLY AFTER A WAYS LIKE THIS.

IN TERMS OF JUMP STARTING THE ECONOMY BEYOND BEING HUMANE TO PEOPLE WHO NEED IT MOST, IN TERMS OF JUMP STARTING THE ECONOMY THESE WERE THE EXACT RIGHT DECISIONS I ASSUME.

>> ABSOLUTELY.

I MEAN THE STIMULUS CHECKS, THE MINIMUM -- IF THE MINIMUM WAGE WOULD INCREASE, YOU KNOW THAT IS MONEY THAT LOW AND MIDDLE INCOME PEOPLE SPEND MONEY IN THE LOCAL ECONOMY.

YOU GIVE A TAX BREAK TO THE SUPERRICH IT CAN GO ANYWHERE ON THE PLANET AND KIT GO INTO SPECULATIVE INVESTMENTS.

BUT TARGETED INCOME SUPPORT, YOU KNOW, ANOTHER COMPONENT TO THIS BILL IS STATE AND LOCAL AID.

$350 BILLION GOING TO STATES AND LOCAL ADVERTISE.

THAT WILL BENEFIT TO ANYONE WHO LIVES IN A STATE OR LOITY.

LOCALITY.

1.4 TRILLION PEOPLE LOST THEIR JOBS IN STATE AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT AND THIS WILL HELP NOT JUST THE SHORT TERM BUT THE NEXT COUPLE OF YEARS IN RECOVERY.

>> Braude: I WANT TO TALK ABOUT THE NEXT COUPLE OF YEARS.

RICHIE NEIL THE CHAIR OF THE HOUSE WAYS AND MEANS COMMITTEE WAS ON A RADIO SHOW AND I ASKED HIM, THE CHILD TAX CREDIT WHERE KIDS UNDER 6 GOT A CHECK FOR $300 POTENTIALLY.

DID HE WANT TO MAKE IT PERMANENT?

HE SAID YES, SORT OF A UNIVERSAL BASIC INCOME THING.

LET'S ASSUME THEY BOTH FAIL THAT THE CHILD TAX CREDIT INCREASE IS FOR THE TERM OF THE PANDEMIC THIS YEAR.

THE STIMULUS PAYMENTS ARE THE LAST OF THEIR KIND.

WHAT HAPPENS TO THOSE WHO WERE LIFTED OUT OF POVERTY AS A RESULT OF THIS PACKAGE, WHEN THE PACKAGE DISAPPEARS?

>> WELL, YOU KNOW I THINK IN SOME OF THESE EXPIRE AS EARLY AS SEPTEMBER.

SO THEN -- >> Braude: UNEMPLOYMENT, YEAH.

>> WE GO OFF A CLIFF, WE GO UP TO POVERTY RATES GOING UP AGAIN FOR MILLIONS OF PEOPLE, MILLIONS OF CHILDREN.

SO I THINK, YOU KNOW, AGAIN IT'S A VERY COMMON SENSE THING.

WE NEED TO SORT OF REBUILD A DECENCY FLOOR, WE'VE SEEN WHAT'S HAPPENED TO ESSENTIAL WORKERS, THE MOST VULNERABLE PEOPLE IN OUR ECONOMY.

THIS IS MOMENT TO LIFT MILLIONS OF PEOPLE UPWARD.

>> Braude: WELL, THAT'S MY LAST QUESTION ABOUT WHETHER AMERICA IS READY FOR IT.

EVERYBODY TALKS ABOUT HOW THIS WAS A PARTISAN BILL WHICH IT WAS IN THE LEGISLATURE.

IT WAS NOT APARTISAN BILL IN TERMS OF THE PUBLIC.

IT WAS A BIPARTISAN MEASURE.

LET ME SHOW YOU SOME NUMBERS, FROM THERE MONMOUTH UNIVERSITY POLL OF A COUPLE OF DAYS AGO, DO YOU SUPPORT THE PLAN, 62% YES.

INCREASED UNEMPLOYMENT BENEFITS, 67%, THEN LET'S GO DOWN TO DO YOU THINK THE $1400 STIMULUS CHECK, THE COMBINATION OF SHOULD BE LARGER OR IS JUST RIGHT IS 81%.

81% QUICKLY CHIC IF YOU CAN.

ARE THESE NUMBERS A FUNCTION OF THE PANDEMIC SQUEEZE?

OR ARE THEY A FUNCTION OF A CHANGING AMERICA IN YOUR ESTIMATION?

>> YOU KNOW, THAT SUPPORT EXISTED PRIOR TO THE PANDEMIC FOR A LOT OF THE PROPOSALS WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.

SO EVEN REPUBLICANS AND INDEPENDENTS ARE WEIGHING IN AND SAYING WE NEED TO REDUCE THESE EXTREME INEQUALITIES AND THIS IS THE MOMENT WE'RE IN.

YOU KNOW THIS IS THE CRISIS THAT HAS MADE THIS POSSIBLE.

BUT I THINK THERE IS A POLITICAL -- POLITICAL OPINION SHIFT WHEN IT COMES TO SOME OF THESE THINGS THAT LIFT UP THE FLOOR AND REDUCE INEQUALITY.

>> Braude: CHUCK COLLINS, GOOD TO SEE YOU, THANKS FOR YOUR WORK, THANKS FOR YOUR TIME.

>> THANKS JIM.

>> Braude: NEXT UP, WHILE CALLS FOR POLICE REFORM HAVE BEEN THE MAIN FOCUS SURROUNDING SYSTEMIC RACISM IN LAW ENFORCEMENT, THERE ARE PLENTY OF OTHER ASPECTS OF THE LEGAL SYSTEM THAT PLAY A ROLE AS WELL.

TO THAT END, THE MIDDLESEX COUNTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY'S OFFICE JUST CREATED A NEW, DEDICATED POSITION AIMED AT ADDRESSING ISSUES OF EQUITY AND DISCRIMINATION.

I'M JOINED BY D.A.

MARIAN RYAN, ALONG WITH THE NEW DIRECTOR OF RACIAL JUSTICE INITIATIVES, ANTONIA SOARES THOMPSON-- A FORMER PUBLIC DEFENDER AND, MOST RECENTLY, THE RESTORATIVE JUSTICE PROJECT COORDINATOR AT THE MAYOR'S YOUTH SERVICES BUREAU IN STAMFORD, CONNECTICUT.

ANTONIA GOOD TO MEET YOU AND DISTRICT ATTORNEY, THANKS FOR JOINING ME.

>> NICE TO BE HERE.

>> Braude: MARIAN, GIVE ME AN EXAMPLE OF THE KIND OF RACIAL JUSTICE INITIATIVES YOU'RE LOOKING AT.

>> REALLY THREE.

MAKING SURE THAT PEOPLE ON OUR STAFF, THE PROSECUTORS GOING INTO COURT EVERY DAY MAKING CHARGING DECISIONS ARE MEANINGFULLY CONVERSANT ON THE RACIAL JUSTICE ARE, LOOKING THROUGH THINGS IN A RACIAL JUSTICE LENS.

SECOND IS MORE OUTWARD FACING.

HOW DO WE BEST COLLABORATE WITH THE STAKEHOLDERS, WITH OUR POLICE DEPARTMENTS AND EARN THE TRUST OF THE COMMUNITIES THAT WE'RE SERVING.

AND THE THIRDS IS, HOW DO WE ALWAYS HAVE IN -- THIRD IS HOW DO WALITIES HAVE IN OUR MIND IF POWER THAT PROSECUTORS HAVE, THAT WE LESSEN THE DISPROPORTIONATE IMPACT THAT THE CRIMINAL JUSTICE SYSTEM HAS ON SOME OF OUR COMMUNITIES.

>> Braude: SO WHEN YOU ELIMINATED CASH BAIL FOR PEOPLE UNLIKELY TO BE SENTENCED TO JAIL TIME SEVERAL YEARS AGO, THAT I ASSUME HAD IT NOT HAPPENED WOULD HAVE FIT NEATLY WITHIN THAT TRY UPTRIUMVIRATE RIGHT?

>> YES.

INCLUDING MINIMUM SENTENCES, LOTS OF THOSE PIECES.

>> Braude: ANTONIA, HOW DO YOU SEE YOUR JOB?

WHAT DO YOU THINK YOU'RE DOING?

>> I'M VERY EXCITED TO START THIS POSITION.

LIKE D.A.

RYAN JUST MENTIONED, IT'S ABOUT BRINGING POSITIVE OUTCOMES TO THOSE COMMUNITIES THAT HAVE HAD DISPROPORTIONATE OUTCOMES.

DIRECTLY IMPACTS THE PEOPLE THAT ARE BEFORE THEM.

SO THIS POSITION AND THE CONVERSATIONS, THE TOUGH CONVERSATIONS THAT WE'RE GOING TO BE HAVING WITHIN -- WITH OUR D.A.S AND THE COMMUNITY, HOPEFULLY WE WILL SEE THE END RESULT WILL BE THAT THE OUTCOMES WILL BE FAIR AND JUST AND EQUITY WILL BE SERVED WITHIN OUR COMMUNITIES.

>> Braude: I WANT TO TALK ABOUT THAT COMMUNITY AND ONE PARTICULAR PART OF IT.

LAST WEEK ROSA BROOKE WAS HERE WHO IS A GEORGETOWN LAW PROFESSOR WHO DECIDED TO BECOME A VOLUNTEER COP FOR FOUR YEARS IN D.C. SHE WROTE A BOOK, TANGLED UP IN BLUE.

AND SHE WROTE ABOUT THE TRAINING IN WHICH THE COPS IN TRAINING NEVER HEARD ONE WORD ABOUT RACISM BUT EVERY SINGLE DAY THEY HEARD ABOUT HOW MANY THEIR LIFTS WERE AT RISK, EVERY SINGLE DAY THEY WENT OUT INTO THE COMMUNITY, WHICH TO SOME DEGREE DOESN'T JUSTIFY, BUT EXPLAINS SOME OF THE BEHAVIOR.

WILL YOU BE ABLE TO ADDRESS THAT KIND OF ISSUE WITH POLICE, WITHOUT THEM THE CASE DOESN'T EVEN GET TO THE PROSECUTOR.

IS THAT PART OF YOUR JURISDICTION OR NO, ANTONIA,.

>> IT'S NOT JUST A QUESTION OF WILL WE BE ABLE TO?

WE HAVE BEEN DOING THAT.

OVER THE LAST FEW YEARS WE'VE BROUGHT NATIONAL EXPERTS TO MEET WITH OUR 54 POLICE DEPARTMENTS ABOUT ISSUES ABOUT BIAS, ON DEESCALATION.

PARTICULARLY DEALING WITH MESSAGE HEALTH ISSUES.

>> Braude: BY THE WAY, JUST -- OR THESE 54 POLICE DEPARTMENTS BOUGHT INTO THIS INITIATIVE OR YOU'RE JUST HOPING THEY'RE BOUGHT INTO THE INITIATIVE?

>> YOU KNOW, I THINK THAT EVERYBODY -- THIS IS A LEARNING CURVE.

WE CERTAINLY HAVE DEPARTMENTS THAT RECOGNIZE THE NEED TO BE HAVING THESE CONVERSATIONS AND MAKING THESE MOVES.

>> Braude: YOU KNOW, ANTONIA BACK TO YOU FOR A SECOND.

I READ A LITTLE BIT ABOUT WHAT YOU DID IN STANFORD AND RESTORATIVE JUSTICE WAS FOCUSED ON SCHOOLS.

IS THAT YOUR SENSE THAT THAT KIND OF DIVERSIONARY KIND OF THING COULD WORK WITH ADULTS?

>> ABSOLUTELY.

>>Sara: >> Braude: COULD WORK IN MIDDLESEX?

GIVE ME AN EXAMPLE OF WHAT YOU'RE THINKING ABOUT?

>> SURE, I BELIEVE MANY TIMES WHEN WE HAVE LOW LEVEL CRIMES, RESTORATIVE JUSTICE ALLOWS FOR THE PERPETRATOR OF THE CRIME AND THE VICTIM OF THAT CRIME TO COME TOGETHER AND HAVE AN HONEST CONVERSATION ABOUT THE CONSEQUENCES.

HOW DID THIS PERSON'S ACTION AFFECT A VICTIM?

AND SOMETIMES WE DON'T HAVE THAT CONVERSATION.

SOMETIMES WE JUST GO TO COURT AND WE THINK ABOUT.

PUNISHMENT, WHAT ARE THE CONVENTIONS THAT I DID TO THIS PERSON?

IT IS A ROBBERY OF A CAR OR A RADIO OR SOMETHING THAT WAS TAKEN, YET THE VICTIM WORKED REALLY HARD TO EARN THAT RADIO, WORK THOSE EXTRA HOURS.

AND ESPECIALLY FOR YOUTH, THE YOUNG ADULTS TO HEAR THESE CHOICES, THAT THAT BAD CHOICE I MADE IMPACTED SOMEONE IN A SERIOUS WAY, IT DOES ALLOW FOR THE DIALOGUE TO HAPPEN AND THE COMMUNITY TO HEAL FROM THAT PROCESS.

SO WHEN WE DO SEE THAT IN THE COURT AS A DIVERSIONARY PROGRAM WHETHER IT IS FROM JUVENILES OR FOR YOUNG ADULTS JUST ENTERING THE SYSTEM WE HOPE THAT THAT WILL JUST CHANGE THE WAY AS RECIDIVISM GOES DOWN AS PEOPLE COMMITTING CRIMES.

>> Braude: SO DISTRICT ATTORNEY, I KNOW YOU'RE THE BOSS IN THAT OFFICE BUT IS THE AVERAGE PROSECUTOR WHO HAS BEEN TRAINED A CERTAIN WAY WITH A CERTAIN MINDSET ABOUT WHAT HIS OR HER JOB IS, ARE THEY READY FOR SOMETHING LIKE WHAT ANTONIA JUST DESCRIBED, A DIFFERENT WAY OF DOING BUSINESS?

>> IT IS NOT NEW HERE, JIM.

YOU KNOW, UNDER MY LEADERSHIP, THE OFFICE OVER THE PAST EIGHT YEARS HAS REALLY TAKEN A DIFFERENT VIEW.

WE HAVE A VERY ROBUST DIVERSION PROGRAM.

AS YOU KNOW I COLLABORATED WITH SENATOR ELDRIDGE IN WRITING THE RESTORATIVE JUSTICE BILL.

WE HAVE BEEN USING IT IN MIDDLESEX COUNTY FOR OVER 7 YEARS.

SO PEOPLE COMING THROUGH OUR OFFICE, THIS IS ALREADY A WELL ENTRENCHED PART OF PEOPLE WE'RE PICKING TO COME TO THE OFFICE AND THE WANE WE ARE TRAINING THEM.

WE REPRESENT THE VALUES OF THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE PUT ME HERE IN THIS JOB.

>> Braude: IS THERE -- WAS THERE, MAYOR MAYOR YAIN RYAN, WAS THERE SOMETHING, TO BE COORDINATING ALL OF THIS, WAS THERE A SPECIFIC EVENT OR MOMENT OR IS IT JUST A GRAND PROGRESSION OF THINGS?

>> IT IS REALLY A PROGRESSION.

AS WE'VE BEEN WORKING THROUGH THIS, CONVERSATIONS BEEN HAVING AS WE ARE DEVELOPING THESE PROJECTS, WE'RE ALL BUSY AND IT BECAME CLEAR TO ME THAT WE NEEDED TO HAVE AN INTERNAL VOICE WHOSE PRIMARY RESPONSIBILITY WAS MAKING SURE WE WERE ALWAYS DOING THIS, LOOKING AT EVERY CHALLENGE HE DISCHARGING DECISION WITH THAT LENS.

>> Braude: SO I LIVE IN MILTDZ COUNTY, LET'S ASSUME THE TWO OF YOU ARE BACK ON THE SHOW IN, I DON'T KNOW, TWO YEARS MANY HOW DO I KNOW IF ANTONIA HAS SUCCEEDED IN HER JOB, MARIAN RYAN?

>> I THINK THERE ARE A NUMBER OF WAYS.

I THINK YOU WILL SEE AS WE HAVE BEGUN TO SEE IN MIDDLESEX COUNTY, THE BEGINNING OF THESE DIVERSIONARY PROGRAMS.

THIS IS AN AMAZING THING AND I'VE BEEN IN THE OFFICE LONG ENOUGH THAT IT IS AN AMAZING THING.

LAST YEAR THE CITY OF CAMBRIDGE, YOU KNOW THE SPRAWL OF CAMBRIDGE, WE HAD ONLY TEN JUVENILES THAT WERE PLACED UNDER ARREST.

THAT IS AN AMAZING CHANGE.

THE COLLATERAL DAMAGE, TO BE ABLE TO REDUCE THAT NUMBER, THAT IS A PARTNERSHIP AND THAT IS A DRAMATIC RESULT.

SO THERE ARE GOING TO BE -- I DON'T THINK WE SHOULD DO THINGS AND NOT BE ABLE TO MEASURE THEM.

THERE WILL BE VERY TANGIBLE CONTINUING SIGNS OF THE WAY OUR CASES HAVE DECLINED, OUR RECIDIVISM DECLINES AND THE PARTNERSHIPS AND THE COMMUNITY IMPACT THAT WE'RE HAVING.

>> Braude: I LOOK FORWARD TO THAT CONVERSATION.

MARIAN RYAN, ANTONIA SOARES THOMPSON, THANKS.

BY SOME ESTIMATES, AS MANY AS 40% OF BUSINESSES OWNED BY PEOPLE OF COLOR ACROSS THE COUNTRY HAVE CLOSED IN THE PANDEMIC.

THAT'S AN ESPECIALLY HARSH BLOW IN MASSACHUSETTS, WHERE BLACK AND LATINO PEOPLE MAKE UP MORE THAN 20% OF THE POPULATION BUT, EVEN BEFORE THE PANDEMIC, OWNED JUST 3% OF BUSINESSES WHICH HAD EMPLOYEES.

AS CHRIS BURRELL, FROM GBH'S CENTER FOR INVESTIGATIVE REPORTING TELLS US, THAT'S FAR BELOW THE NATIONAL AVERAGE.

>> THIS IS GOING TO BE NICE UP HERE.

>> Reporter: ARCHITECT DAVID LEE IS GOING OVER A PUNCH LIST WITH HIS BUILDER FOR THIS RENOVATION PROJECT HE DESIGNED AT A BRICK ROW HOUSE IN ROXBURY.

LEE HAS OWNED A FIRM IN THE CITY SINCE THE '60s AND CAN JUST ABOUT COUNT THE NUMBER OF BLACK-OWNED CONSTRUCTION COMPANIES ON ONE HAND.

>> THE NUMBERS HAVE NOT INCREASED.

CRUZ AND HIS FATHER HAVE BUILT A LOT AND OTHERS THAT HAVE COME ALONG.

THERE WAS A FIRM CALLED ARCHIBALD SHEPHERD.

GREG JANEY HAS NOW BUILT A REAL JUGGERNAUT.

BUT THE FACT THAT YOU CAN PROBABLY NAME THEM ALL IS PROBLEMATIC, YOU KNOW.

>> Reporter: EVEN AS BLACK AND LATINO ENTREPRENEURS IN THE STATE HAVE FOLLOWED IN LEE'S FOOTSTEPS AND STARTED UP HUNDREDS OF ENTERPRISES IN THE LAST DECADE, BUSINESS OWNERSHIP IS STILL DISPROPORTIONATELY DOMINATED BY WHITE MEN.

U.S. CENSUS SURVEYS ANALYZED BY GBH NEWS.

THE NATIONAL RATE IS MORE THAN 7%.

IT'S HARD TO PINPOINT WHAT ACCOUNTS FOR THAT DISPARITY.

CRITICS FAULT THE LACK OF PRECISE RACIAL AND ETHNIC DATA FROM THE STATE ON SMALL BUSINESS OWNERS THAT GET MILLIONS OF DOLLARS IN LOANS AND GRANTS FROM TAXPAYER-FUNDED PROGRAMS.

>> WE'RE AN EXCEPTIONAL STATE, WE'RE A WEALTHY STATE.

OUR NUMBERS SHOULD LOOK BETTER THAN THEY DO.

>> Reporter: MALIA LAZU, AT M.I.T's SLOAN SCHOOL, SAYS OTHER CITIES AND STATES ARE FAR MORE INNOVATIVE IN SUPPORTING BLACK AND LATINO ENTREPRENEURSHIP.

>> YOU HAVE TO FEED THE SUPPLY SIDE OF CREATING BUSINESSES AND YOU HAVE TO HOLD CORPORATES TO THE DEMAND SIDE OF BRINGING FOLKS IN AND GIVE YOURSELF 20 YEARS TO GET THAT RIGHT.

>> Reporter: SOME MINORITY BUSINESS OWNERS ARE ALREADY TAKING THE LEAD.

CITY FRESH FOODS, WHICH MAKES MEALS FOR SCHOOLS AND THE ELDERLY, JUST OFFERED LONGTIME EMPLOYEES, NEARLY ALL OF THEM PEOPLE OF COLOR, A CHANCE TO BE CO-OWNERS OF THE BUSINESS.

>> WE ALL KNOW THERE'S A BIG WEALTH GAP AROUND ASSETS, AND WHAT FOLKS HAVE.

ESPECIALLY IN THE COMMUNITY COLOR.

SO THIS IS A CHANCE FOR FOLKS TO GET A LITTLE SOMETHING.

>> Reporter: THAT LITTLE SOMETHING CALLED CAPITAL IS A HUGE BARRIER TO BLACKS AND LATINOS BECOMING ENTREPRENEURS COMPARED TO WHITES WHO HAVE ACCESS TO MORE EQUITY-- BIGGER SAVINGS, HIGHER RATES OF HOME OWNERSHIP AND RELATIVES WITH ASSETS.

ALL INGREDIENTS FOR HATCHING A BUSINESS.

>> WE'VE ACTUALLY CREATED FOLKS HERE WHO HAVE GONE OUT AND RUN THEIR OWN BUSINESSES.

IT'S BEEN PART OF OUR CULTURE, MORE WILL PARTICIPATE IN BRINGING US TO THE PROMISED LAND, SO TO SPEAK.

OR GETTING US THERE, RIGHT?

>> Reporter: LICINIO MONTROND HAS WORKED HERE SINCE HE GRADUATED HIGH SCHOOL.

HE'S IN THE PROCESS OF BUYING 80 SHARES.

>> YOU GET A CHANCE TO BECOME PART OWNER, WHY NOT JUMP IN AND TAKE THAT?

>> Reporter: AND BECOMING AN OWNER HAS CHANGED HIS VIEW OF THE PLACE.

>> I LOOK AT WASTE AND OTHER THINGS DIFFERENT.

NOW, I DON'T WANT TO BASICALLY THROW AWAY MY MONEY AND SO TO SPEAK.

>> Reporter: MONTROND NOW HAS A STAKE IN THE PROFITS AND MAYBE THE ABILITY TO HELP MOVE THE NEEDLE ON THE PROMISE OF EQUITY.

>> Braude: CHRIS BURRELL JOINS ME NOW.

CHRIS, I LOVE THAT HAIR THING YOU WERE WEARING BY THE WAY, IT LOOKED GREAT ON YOU, IT'S A NICE LOOK.

>> YES, IT KEEPS ME SAFE.

>> Braude: I LOVE THIS CITY FRESH MODEL, BUT I'M GUESSING IT'S THE ABERRATION RATHER THAN THE RULE.

THERE ARE NOT A LOT OF THESE RIGHT?

>> NO, I HAVE NOT HEARD A LOT OF THESE, WHERE MINORITY OWNED BUSINESSES ARE EXTENDING OWNERSHIP TO THEIR EMPLOYEES.

LARGELY WHAT WE'RE SEEING AND HEARING IS A COMBINATION OF STATE RUN PROGRAMS AND NONPROFITS WHO ARE TRYING TO TRAIN 81 YOUNG ENTREPRENEURS TO GET BUSINESSES STARTED.

>> Braude: YOU REPORTED EXTENSIVELY IN LOW RATE OF CITY AND STATE CONTRACTING WITH BUSINESSES OWNED BY BLACK AND LATINO PEOPLE.

YOU ARE NOW REPORTING ON THE LOW NUMBER OF BUSINESSES OWNED BY BLACK AND LATINO PEOPLE.

IT STRUCK ME, THESE ARE THE TWO SIDES OF THE SAME COIN ARE THEY CANNOT?

>> THEY ARE KIND OF A CHICKEN AND EGG PROBLEM.

IF THE CITIES AND STATES ARE NOT CONTRACTING WITH MINORITY OIND BUSINESSES THEY CAN'T GROW AND SPIN OFF INTO OTHER COMPANIES.

SO IT IS REALLY PROBLEMATIC.

AND IF THERE IS NOT A LOT OF COMPANIES THERE IN CERTAIN SECTORS THEY CAN'T BE AVAILABLE TO TAKE THESE CONTRACTS.

>> Braude: SO WHAT ARE THE ONE OR TWO THINGS MOST IMPORTANT LEADERS DO TO FIX THESE MESSES?

>> WELL I THINK THE GENERAL SENSE BOTH IN MASSACHUSETTS AND MY SENSE AROUND THE COUNTRY THIS IS AN UNDERCAPITALIZED ISSUE THAT THERE'S A HUGE DEMAND TO FUND THESE MINORITY BUSINESSES AND THERE'S NOT A HUGE AMOUNT OF MONEY THERE.

IT MAY BE COMING UP IN SOME OF THE STIMULUS MONEY COMING OUT OF WASHINGTON THAT MIGHT TRY TO REALLY REPAIR THIS HUGE, HUGE DEVASTATION THAT T E PANDEMIC CAUSED TO SMALL BUSINESSES AND ESPECIALLY MINORITY-ON THE OTHER HAND BUSINESSES.

-- MINORITY-OWNED BUSINESSES.

>> Braude: YET ANOTHER IMPORTANT STORY CHRIS THANK YOU.

>> THANKS SO MUCH.

GOOD IS.

>> Braude: AND FINALLY TONIGHT, A LITTLE BIT OF WHAT YOU'VE ALL SENT IN DURING THESE PANDEMIC TIMES.

KATHY TOOK THESE PICTURES OF THE LOWELL GENERAL HOSPITAL MASS VACCINE PROGRAM'S M.V.P.

TEAM, TRUE HEROES, IN MY VIEW.

BILL SAYS HIS BACKYARD TRAIL CAMERA CAPTURED THIS DEER PARADE ONE DAY AND A FOX WHO "LIKES TO CHECK ON THE WELL-BEING OF THE NEIGHBOR'S CHICKENS" AT NIGHT.

YIKES.

AND FINALLY, ROBERTA SAYS HER BULBS THAT ARE JUST STARTING TO BLOOM, NOW THAT IT'S "METEROLOGICAL" SPRING, HAVE LIFTED HER SPIRITS.

MINE TOO, ROBERTA.

THANK YOU ALL FOR SENDING THESE IN.

IF YOU HAVE SOMETHING YOU'D LIKE TO SHARE, PLEASE SEND IT TO US AT THE ADDRESSES ON YOUR SCREEN.

THAT'S IT FOR TONIGHT, BUT COME BACK TOMORROW: THE SENIOR LITIGATION COUNSEL FOR THE INNOCENCE PROJECT, NINA MORRISON WILL JOIN ME ON THE LATEST CHAPTER IN THE MASSACHUSETTS DRUG LAB SCANDAL SAGA, AND WHAT COMES NEXT FOR THE PEOPLE BEHIND WHAT SHE CALLED A "ONE-TWO PUNCH OF PROSECUTORIAL MISCONDUCT."

AND BE SURE TO JOIN GBH NEWS ON RADIO, TV AND ONLINE THROUGHOUT THE DAY WEDNESDAY AS WE REFLECT ON A FULL YEAR SINCE THE PANDEMIC BEGAN.

AS ALWAYS, THANKS FOR WATCHING, PLEASE STAY SAFE.

Captioned by Media Access Group at WGBH access.wgbh.org