Well, New Jersey Attorney General Matt Plotkin is preparing to step down after four years in the position, and many would argue that few attorneys general in recent memory have left a bigger imprint on the job.

A key ally of Governor Phil Murphy, Plotkin became a national figure after taking on the federal government, leading multiple lawsuits against the Trump administration while pushing for sweeping statewide police reforms here at home, taking on political power brokers, and reshaping how the state approaches public safety and civil rights.

His supporters call his tenure consequential.

His critics call it controversial.

Attorney General Matt Plotkin is with us now to explain how he sees it and what's next.

Attorney General, good to see you.

Thank you for coming in.

As I mentioned there, by most accounts, you have redefined what a modern state attorney general can be or looks like, but you have had plenty of critics on both sides of the aisle.

Your tenure hasn't been without controversy.

Is that what you set out to be, or did the circumstances present themselves where you felt like you needed to take a stand?

No, look, when I had the great privilege of being appointed to this position by Governor Murphy, I said the first day that I was going to follow something that I had always followed for my life, the pursuit of justice.

We were going to do what was right.

And I think the way this office is set up in our state is that we're supposed to be independent.

We're supposed to be the people's lawyer.

We're supposed to stand up against powerful interests, whether they be corporations who are hurting people and preying on our kids, or corrupt individuals who are betraying the public trust, or people engaged in gun violence, or human trafficking, you name it.

We're supposed to stand up for them.

So I made every decision over the past four years based on what the law said and what I thought was right.

And I felt if I started letting other factors make that decision for me, then I really wasn't doing my job the way it was intended to be done.

Yeah, I mean, because other states elect their attorneys general, ours is appointed, and so there does always come question with it, right?

Whether that person will stay with the governor whom you worked with prior to, as chief counsel, the youngest person to ever have that role, or really carve their own path.

And I would say you carved your own path for better or worse, I suppose, sometimes politically, no?

Well, look, I've had the great privilege of serving for almost the entirety of the Murphy administration.

I think Governor Murphy's been a tremendous governor.

He's been a great partner and a friend, and I'm really grateful for this role.

But again, when we created this office in 1947, it was meant to be independent.

It was meant to be a strong attorney general that stood up for the people of the state.

In 1970, when they vested essentially the entirety of law enforcement as the chief law enforcement officer in my office, they did it because there was a series of exposés about corruption and mafia influence in our state.

And they wanted a strong, independent chief law enforcement officer who could take on powerful interests and not be subject to political whims.

And I've tried to do that.

And I recognize not everybody likes that.

Okay?

That's fine.

If you do this job for four years, and you've never pissed anybody off, you're not doing this job the right way, in my opinion.

This job is meant to be a position that takes tough stances, that takes on tough fights on behalf of the 9.5 million people of this state.

I sleep very well knowing that I made every decision based on what I thought was right for the people who live in New Jersey and not for any other reason.

Let me ask you about some of those tough fights.

You became the most prominent Democratic attorney general to lead multiple lawsuits against the Trump administration.

Why was it so important to you that New Jersey be aggressive on the national stage?

Because, of course, critics came at you and said, you should be focused on Trenton and rooting out problems in Trenton and not be detracted or distracted from the problems here at home.

Why did you feel the need to take the lead on so much of that litigation?

Well, first of all, we haven't been distracted.

Lowest level of gun violence in state history.

Leading national fights to protect our kids online.

Largest environmental settlement in the history of our state.

Largest healthcare settlement in the history of our state.

We've been busy at home, too, so I don't want people to be confused.

You are safer in New Jersey today, period, than you've ever been.

But look, I said very clearly the day President Trump got elected, the day he was inaugurated.

I don't wake up dying to sue him.

That's not my job.

But my job is to protect the 9.5 million people who live here from people who break the law.

I don't care who you are, if you're a corporate polluter, if you're a social media company, if you're somebody engaged in gun violence or human trafficking, or if you're the President of the United States.

And this administration, this President, have broken the law at alarming rates.

And it started the very first day of an executive order eliminating birthright citizenship, something that has been in the Constitution since the Civil War.

And yet, with the stroke of a pen, he tried to eliminate it for thousands and thousands of New Jerseyans.

Was I supposed to sit idly by when he did that, illegally and in violation of the Constitution?

Or when he stripped thousands of children of services, children with special needs who have services in the families that rely on them, or took health care away from people, or fired law enforcement officers.

I could go on.

These are the suits we're talking about.

They're not some trivial things that I picked political fights over.

We stood up for the rule of law.

We've been successful in the overwhelming majority of our cases.

We protected tens of billions of dollars of federal funding that flow to our state and our residents, and we've stood up for core constitutional principles.

I'm extraordinarily proud that we've been in a position to do that.

I think it's doing my job.

Yeah.

SNAP being one of the most recent, the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program.

These were things, though, that you had to work with other attorneys general across the aisle on in order to get them done, or in order to get buy-in, at the very least.

Did you see the role sort of taking that turn?

Did you see it as your job to get that bipartisan support?

What did that look like?

Well, I wish we'd had more bipartisan support on the cases involving the administration.

We have not.

And that, I think, is disappointing.

You mentioned SNAP.

Eight hundred and fifty thousand or so New Jerseyans relying on SNAP for food.

Three hundred and fifty thousand children.

And yet, this administration, during the shutdown in November, for the first time in American history, weaponized hunger.

And so that lawsuit, which my team and I, and teams across this country, and Human Services, led by Commissioner Adelman, stayed up through the night to protect.

Now, so the Trump suits, we have not had bipartisan support.

But we have had support across the country and I've been proud to work with them.

But I am proud that attorneys general are sort of the last bastion of bipartisanship in this country.

And I'm proud that I've led lawsuits with 50 states on them, including cases against TikTok and Meta protecting our kids, environmental cases for things like PFAS, pollution in drinking water.

That's not a partisan issue.

That is one of the single biggest threats to the health and safety of Americans.

And I've led cases that have had bipartisan support on that score.

And I'm very proud of that.

Let me ask you about some of the other items that you ticked off.

You mentioned gun violence, which was something that you came out of the gate saying that you were going to tackle.

Also, police accountability and other reforms, particularly the program Arrive Together, which partners, and we've done a lot of reporting on, as you know, which partners a mental health professional with a first responder when there's a crisis call.

What has changed there?

What can residents look to to see?

This is something that you implemented and now here's what's better because of it.

Well, I got into public service because of gun violence.

I'd say I was part of the Columbine generation.

I thought we would have solved the problem by now.

The fact that I'm raising two kids in a nation where their single most likely cause of death is a firearm, something no other country in the world can say, should make us all embarrassed.

So I came in and said very clearly, we're going to do everything we can to treat gun violence like the public health crisis that it is.

We're going to use our best law enforcement tools, and we have the best law enforcement in the country, take an intelligence-based approach, go after the people who are truly driving violence.

We did that.

We've invested, thanks to the governor and the legislature, historic amounts in community-based responses to gun violence intervention work.

I started the first office of its kind to hold bad actors in the firearm industry accountable.

We've sued more bad actors in the firearms industry than the rest of the country combined.

Guess what?

Three years running, we've had the lowest level of gun violence since our state's been tracking these statistics.

We had never been below a thousand.

Last year we were below 600.

We are saving lives.

And we're saving lives through Arrive Together as well.

Arrive Together is a recognition that we have asked the 42,000 law enforcement officers in our state and the millions across this country to do too much.

No one person can be everything to everyone at all times.

And yet we have 911 be the call of last resort for everyone dealing with a mental health or emotional distress crisis.

So we did something very simple.

We gave law enforcement tools and partners who have training in mental health care.

And guess what?

We've helped 15,000 people now.

We're the first and only state in the country still with a statewide alternative crisis response program, Like Arrive Together, which was barely in its existence when I took office.

15,000 people, zero injuries.

So the >> That's a tool that by and large law enforcement has been grateful to have.

But how's your relationship particularly with the state police?

You were sued by state police unions.

There was an effort in the legislature to take the state police out from under your purview.

Is it particularly contentious?

How are you leaving that and what are you concerned about for the next attorney general coming in?

Look, I have a great relationship with law enforcement and we have the best law enforcement professionals in the country.

In New Jersey, we like to complain about everything.

It's sort of in our nature.

But if you look at the training and the professionalism of our law enforcement, you could stack them up against any of the other 49 states and they couldn't hold a candle to us.

I've seen some of the finest work.

I've been in the hospital with law enforcement officers who have been shot and their families at midnight.

I know the sacrifice they pay and I have enormous, enormous gratitude and frankly the greatest privilege of my life has been able to support them and stand shoulder to shoulder with them.

Look, the Attorney General's job is a tough one.

One of the things we are responsible for in New Jersey, unlike many other states, as the Chief Law Enforcement Officer, is you do have oversight over the policing profession.

And so there are standards that we have to make sure are followed.

And as the Attorney General, I've tried to do -- to ensure that people had trust in law enforcement.

If you don't have trust that when you pick up the phone and the person who's responding to your concern has your back, guess what?

You're not going to do that.

You're not going to pick up the phone and ask for help.

>> What's your main concern, Attorney General, if the state Police Department in this next Administration does get moved to Be its own stand-alone unit, I'll call it, out from under the Attorney General's office, What's your top concern about That?

>> I'll leave it to the Governor, incoming governor, and I understand that proposal is Not moving in this legislative Session.

I've worked with state troopers across the state in all forms.

Gun violence reduction, taking on the opioid epidemic and fentanyl, emergency management.

I've seen the incredible work our troopers do.

I work with them literally every day and I've been proud to work with them.

It is an agency within our department of 4,000 person, 3,000 sworn.

Any management is going to have its share of challenges, but I've been privileged to work with them, and I look forward to what I know will be both on behalf of the state police and on behalf of the 42,000-member law enforcement community more broadly, some incredible work coming in under Attorney General Jen Davenport's leadership.

Let me ask you, you took the rare step of taking on the South Jersey political bosses, the Camden County Democratic machine and George Norcross.

That case ultimately was dismissed.

There were questions about whether, how the public should view trust in your office after bringing a case like that, of course with lots of political ramifications to it as well.

Do you regret it?

- Well, first of all, that case was indicted by a grand jury, brought by career prosecutors and investigators, and the only people who have raised those questions are defense counsel in that case, so I leave you to your own conclusions there.

Look, I said very clearly, I said it in this interview, I've said it every day I've been in office.

We are not going to hold people to a higher standard or a lower standard.

We treat everybody the same.

If you break the law and career investigators and prosecutors or civil investigators and attorneys determine you've broken the law, we're going to hold you accountable.

I don't care if you're a powerful corporation, a political party boss, the president of the United States, I don't care.

If I decided that I was going to start treating people differently, that's when I would be doing something inappropriate.

I think what they are frustrated by is that they're not getting the same kind of special treatment.

I'm not speaking of any individual, but the general class of politically connected individuals and organizations in this state, they didn't get the same kind of special treatment from me that they might have gotten from others.

And I'm not saying other attorneys general, but we know corruption is a problem in this state.

And if you think it's not a problem, and if you think the public doesn't think it's a problem, you're living under a rock.

Trust in government is at its lowest levels since the Civil War.

And we should be doing everything we can do, both in substance and in appearance, to make sure that people know that those of us who have the privilege of serving them, I am the people's lawyer, I am their attorney.

My job is to stand up for them and protect them, because corruption is not a victimless crime.

When you skim off the top, it means we don't have more money for health care or property tax relief or our kids' schools.

We are all paying that bill.

I want to ask you two more quick questions if we have time.

You also made it a point to take on a lot of these big tech companies that are almost too big to take on in some cases, but specifically when it came to AI, social media, and how that affected our children.

What do you want to see, how do you want to see the ball carried forward when it comes to that fight?

Because I know it's personal for you.

Yeah, like you, I'm raising kids in this state, and I think this is the single biggest challenge facing the next generation.

Are we going to protect them from harms online?

And I'm not a Luddite.

I like technological innovation.

I use technology.

But technology shouldn't be treated differently than any other product.

You shouldn't get to put dangerous products that hurt our kids into the marketplace, tell people, including parents, that they're safe when you know it's not.

That's what Meta did.

We led that lawsuit for social media harms.

That's what TikTok did.

We led that lawsuit.

We were the first state to sue Discord, something that, a platform that has 200 million kids on it.

And yet we've seen all kinds of horrible things happen there.

I'm really proud of this work.

And I've been really sort of encouraged by what I've heard from Governor-elect Sherrill, who campaigned on this.

I know Attorney General Davenport, a designee who will be Attorney General in a couple of weeks, who I have just tremendous respect and admiration for.

I know they're going to prioritize this.

And I'm proud that something is true today that wasn't true before I took office.

New Jersey is now arguably the lead state when it comes to cases against big tech for protecting our kids.

There's a reason why we're leading multi-state cases and letters with 50 attorneys general on it, because they know we have the capability, the commitment, and the dedication to protecting our kids on these online platforms.

- Last thought from you, you were called at one point the most consequential Democrat not on the ballot.

Is this the end of public office for you, or what's next?

- Yeah, look, I think it's funny, I sort of laugh.

Everyone speculates about why I did things.

I did things 'cause I thought they were the right thing to do.

I know in New Jersey, maybe sometimes people can't imagine that's the reason.

- It's rare.

- But I think I'm the only person in Essex County not running for Congress right now.

What am I running for?

The job was to do the right thing every day on behalf of the people.

But I also didn't start caring about these things in 2022, and I'm not going to stop caring about them in 2026.

So in some way, shape, or form, I want to stay involved.

I know I'm staying here.

We're not going anywhere.

I love New Jersey.

And I've loved, loved, loved having the privilege of serving this state.

Attorney General Matt Plotkin, thank you for your service.

to talk with us.

Thanks for having me.

I really enjoyed it.

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