>> IT HAS BEEN SIX MONTHS SINCE THE DEVASTATING WILDFIRES IN LAHAINA.

AND OUR NEIGHBORS BOTH IN MAUI AND ACROSS THE..

DEALING WITH THE AFTERMATH OF THIS UNPRECEDENTED TRAGEDY.

MANY OF THE SURVIVORS ARE STRUGGLING TO FIND LONG TERM HOUSING SOLUTIONS.

THE LEGISLATURE HAS VOWED TO MAKE LAHAINA A PRIORITY THIS SEASON.

WHAT IS THE LATEST ON THE MAUI RECOVERY EFFOR.. TONIGHT'S LIVE BROADCAST ON PBS HAWAII START NOW.

## ## >> Daryl: ALOHA AND WELCOME TO INSIGHTS ON PB.. DARYL HUFF.

THE UNPRECEDENTED DEVASTATION IN MAUI HAS FOR.. VALLEY ISLE.

MANY RESIDENTS ARE STILL SUFFERING FROM THE EFFECTS OF THE DISASTER -- LEFT WITHOUT LONG TERM HOUSING OR EMPLOYMENT.

IN THE WAKE OF THE FIRES THE GOVERNOR AND OTHER POLITICAL LEADERS VOWED TO MAKE LAHAINA A TOP PRIORITY THIS YEAR.

WE'LL LEARN THE LATEST DEVELOPMENTS IN THE ONGOING AND COMPLEX CRISIS.

WE LOOK FORWARD TO YOUR PARTICIPATION IN TONIGHT'S SHOW.

YOU CAN EMAIL OR CALL IN YOUR QUESTIONS.

AND YOU'LL FIND A LIVE STREAM OF THIS PROGRAM AT PBSHAWAII.ORG AND THE PBS HAWAII FACEBOOK AND YOUTUBE PAGES.

NOW, TO OUR GUESTS.

SENATOR ANGUS MCKELVEY SERVES DISTRICT 6 WHICH INCLUDES WEST MAUI.

HE WAS RAISED IN WEST MAUI AND SPENT MOST OF ..

LIVING AND WORKING IN LAHAINA.

PRIOR TO BEING ELECTED A STATE SENATOR IN 2022, HE SERVED IN THE HAWAI'I HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES FROM 2006.

HE LOST HIS RENTED APARTMENT IN FIRE.

MICHELLE GORDON IS A LOCAL 5 MEMBER AND HAS BEEN A COOK AT SHERATON MAUI FOR 16 YEARS.

MICHELLE'S FAMILY HAS LIVED IN LAHAINA FOR FOUR GENERATIONS.

THEIR FAMILY HOME WAS DESTROYED IN THE AUGUST FIRES.

ARCHIE KALEPA WAS BORN AND RAISED IN LAHAINA.

HE IS A RENOWNED WATERMAN AND THE FOUNDER OF LELE ALOHA -- A NON-PROFIT DEDICATED TO PROTECTING THE LAND AND WATER RESOURCES IN WEST MAUI.

HE WAS ALSO A CAPTAIN OF THE POLYNESIAN VOYAGING SOCIETY.

MICHELLE, I NOTICED WHAT HAPPENED WITH YOUR H.. WAS IT LIKE THAT DAY AND WHAT'S YOUR CIRCUMSTANCES NOW?

>> I WAS ACTUALLY AT WORK THAT DAY.

BUT IT WAS VERY, VERY WINDY.

I'VE SEEN SOMEONE'S ROOF FLY OFF BEFORE I LEFT FOR WORK.

MY PARENTS, THEY'RE IN THEIR 70s WAS HOME, AND MY OTHER HALF WAS HOME THAT DAY.

SHE DIDN'T HAVE TO GO TO WORK.

SO SHE STAYED BECAUSE SHE SAID, I'LL STAY HOME WITH YOUR PARENTS.

SO I WENT TO WORK, AND THERE WAS NO COMMUNICATION, BUT I FOUND OUT LATER THAT SHE WAS THE ONE THAT RESCUED MY PARENTS.

THEY WERE ABLE TO ESCAPE.

THEY'VE SEEN 505 FRONT STREET ON FIRE.

THE HOUSE WAS GETTING VERY SMOKY.

>>Daryl: 505 FRONT STREET IS LIKE A SHOPPING COMPLEX.

>> UNDERSTOOD TO BE RIGHT NEXT TO THE LAHAINA SHORES HOTEL.

AND SO THEY WERE ABLE TO ESCAPE.

>>Daryl: THAT'S OPERATE LATE -- PRETTY LATE, YEAH?

THEY WERE ABLE TO ESCAPE.

>> IT WAS ABOUT 3:00.

>>Daryl: IT CAME FAST.

FROM LAHAINALUNA TO FRONT STREET.

>> YEAH.

THE WEIRD THING IS WHERE MY HOUSE IS, IS RIGHT WHERE THE MOUNTAIN IS.

SO USUALLY MY HOUSE HAS NO WIND AT ALL EVER,..

IT WAS JUST DIFFERENT.

IT WAS VERY DIFFERENT.

>>Daryl: WE'RE GLAD YOUR FAMILY GOT OUT.

>> YEAH.

I DIDN'T KNOW ANYTHING UNTIL THE NEXT DAY.

>>Daryl: REALLY?

>> YEAH.

THEY WERE ABLE TO ESCAPE.

AND THEY ENDED UP IN THE TARGET -- NO, THE MA.. CENTER.

THEY WERE THERE WAITING.

JUST WAITING.

BECAUSE THEY WANTED TO COME THROUGH.

THEY WANTED TO FIND OUT WHERE ALL OF US WAS.

ME AND MY BROTHER AND OUR WHOLE FAMILY.

THEY SHUT THE ROADS, AND LUCKILY, PEOPLE REACHED OUT TO THEM AND HOUSED THEM ON THAT SIDE.

BUT NONE OF US WERE ABLE TO TALK TO EACH OTHER, AND -- >>Daryl: AND YOU'VE BEEN IN A HOTEL EVER SINCE.

>> YEAH.

I'M FORTUNATE.

I'VE BEEN WORKING FOR THE SHERATON.

SHERATON IS THE ONE HOTEL THAT HAS HOUSED DISPLACED WORKERS THE WHOLE TIME WITH NO PROBLEMS.

>>Daryl: ARCHIE NOW.

WE'LL TALK MORE ABOUT LIFE IN HOTELS.

I'VE GOT A NUMBER OF QUESTIONS.

BUT ARCHIE, YOUR HOUSE WAS SPARED BUT BARELY.

>> YEAH.

I HAVE A HOUSE.

BUT THE UNKNOWN DANGER IS FOR US, IN LEALII IS WE FEEL LIKE WE'RE LIVING WITH THE GHOST.

PART OF THAT IS, YOU KNOW, IT'S WHAT YOU CAN'T SEE.

IF YOU WERE TO GO TO LEALII TODAY, YOU WOULD SEE A LOT OF FLAGS.

HAWAIIAN FLAGS.

THOSE HAWAIIAN FLAGS ARE THERE SO WE CAN SEE .. WIND IS COMING FROM.

WHEN I OPEN THE DOOR TO THE HOUSE IN THE MORNING, AND IF THE FLAG IS BLOWING NORTH, I CLOSE THE DOOR.

THE FLAG IS BLOWING FROM IN ORDER TO SOUTH, IT'S OKAY FOR ME TO GO OUT.

BECAUSE EVERYTHING BEHIND ME, WHICH IS THE SOUTH SIDE OF MY HOME, IS GONE.

ALL BURNED DOWN.

>>Daryl: SO THE FLAGS ARE LIKE YOUR EARLY WARNING FOR AIR QUALITY?

>> YEAH.

IT'S A VISUAL YOU'D.

WE HAVE AIR MONITORS.

WE HAVE WEBSITES THAT WE CAN GO ON THAT GIVES US THE DATA ON WHAT THE AIR QUALITY IS LIKE, BUT FOR US, WHEN YOU OPEN THE DOOR AND YOU SEE THE FLAG, IT TELLS THE STORY.

>>Daryl: WHAT -- SPEAK OF WIND AND AS A NAVIGATOR OR WATER PLAN, YOU UNDERSTAND WIND.

WHAT HAPPENED THAT ONE HOUSE OR STREET WOULD GET DESTROYED AND HOUSES NEXT TO IT WOULD BE SPARED?

>> I WASN'T THERE THAT DAY.

I STUDIED THAT WIND TO A POINT THAT I'M PERSONAL WITH IT.

AND WHENEVER THE WIND IS BLOWING OVER 30 MILES AN HOUR, THERE'S A SHEER LINE THAT RUNS DIRECTLY WHERE THE BACK OF MY FENCE IS.

THAT'S THE SHEER LINE, SO WE HAVE THE WIND THAT BLOWS AROUND THE NORTH SIDE OF THE WEST MAUI MOUNTAINS.

WHEN IT'S TRADEWINDS, WHICH IS WAS.

EASTERLY WINDS, AND THE WIND THAT COMES AROUND FROM MAALAIA AND THE WINDS ARE THAT STRONG, THEY MEET RIGHT WHERE MY FENCE IS AND BLOWS TO SHORE.

BESIDES THE FIREFIGHTERS AND THE COMMUNITY THAT HELPED SAVE THE HOMES IN LEALII, A BIG PART OF THAT WAS THE WIND LINE OR WHAT IS THE SHEER LINE THAT WAS BUTTING UP AGAINST THE WINDS.

>>Daryl: SOUNDS LIKE A RIP CURRENT.

>> EXACTLY.

>>Daryl: SENATOR McKELVEY, WHAT WAS THE EXPER.. YOU?

>> I THINK THE "CIVIL BEAT" ARTICLE DETAILED..

INDIVIDUALLY AND DRAMATICALLY, I THINK FOR ME, I WAS RETREATED -- RETREAT FROM THE FIRE.

WE'VE GONE THROUGH THIS IN 2019 WITH LANE.

I USED TO LIVE IN AN AREA WITH MY FAMILY.

WE WOULD EVACUATE.

BUT THE FIRE WOULD PUSH THROUGH AND YOU WOUL..

THE IDEA IS OKAY, LET'S RETREAT TO THE EDGE, WAIT.

IF IT GETS UNDER CONTROL, WE CAN COME BACK IN, RIGHT?

SO I SEE -- LOOKS LIKE IT WAS PUSHING BACK.

WHERE MY BROTHER'S PLACE WAS.

I GOT SEPARATED BECAUSE THEY WERE AT THE LAHAINA HARBOR SIDE.

AND THE FIRE CAME HERE.

>>Daryl: HELP PEOPLE WHO DON'T LIVE ON MAUI WHAT THE GEOGRAPHY IS.

PEOPLE KNOW LAHAINA.

IT HAS SORT OF A PIE SHAPE QUALITY FROM THE MOU..

OCEAN.

WHERE IN THAT PIE WAS YOUR APARTMENT?

>> MY APARTMENT WAS UP HERE ON LEFT SIDE OF THE PIE WHERE I WAS AT.

SLIGHTLY DOWN BELOW.

>>Daryl: ABOVE THE HIGHWAY.

>> IT WAS ABOVE THE HIGHWAY.

I WAS BELOW THE MOI -- HIGHWAY.

I THOUGHT IT WOULD PUSH BACK.

I HAD MY BROTHER'S DOG WITH ME.

PART OF THE WHOLE STORY.

WE WENT BACK TO TRY TO GET FOOD AND SUPPLIES, THINKING IT WAS OKAY.

I COME OUT OF THE UNIT AND LOOK AND FRONT STREET A.. PULSING LIKE A FIRE.

ONE OF THE THINGS, TALK ABOUT WIND.

WAS THE GREEK FIRE.

YOU HAD ALL THESE CHEMICALS AND TOXIC THINGS, OIL BURNING.

HURRICANE FORCE WINDS DRIVING IT DOWN.

PEOPLE SEE THE FLAME WALLS COMING.

FIRES STARTING TO POP -- POP UP HERE AND THERE.

FELT LIKE A CONVECTION OVEN AT THANKSGIVING.

ALL OF A SUDDEN, THE PALM TREE BY THE BATHROOM -- ROOFS STARTING TO POP UP HERE, POP UP THERE.

>>Daryl: WHEN WE REVIEWED THE POLICE DEPARTMENT BODY CAMS, THEY WERE LIKE GOING THIS WAY.

THERE'S A FIRE.

NOT BURNING HERE.

THERE'S A FIRE.

NOT BURNING HERE.

WHAT YOU'RE DESCRIBING.

THE FIRES WERE POPPING UP ALMOST RANDOMLY.

>> IT WAS RAINING DOWN.

IT WAS BEHIND YOU.

IT WAS POPPING UP, AND THE AIR HEATS UP.

ALL OF THE PARTICLES STARTING TO BECOME MORE AND MORE HOT.

AND THERE'S THE SCREAMS.

THAT'S WHAT DRIVES ME.

WHEN THE WIND WOULD STOP SCREAMING, IT WOULD START THE SUCKING SOUND BEFORE THE NEXT WAVE CAME.

I WAS LISTENING.

THE SUCKING SOUND CAME IN.

THE WIND STOPPED SCREAMING, BUT THE SCREAMING WAS STILL THERE.

THE SCREAMING I WILL NEVER FORGET AS LONG AS I LIVE.

THE SOUND OF ABSOLUTELY AGONY.

>>Daryl: YOUR FAMILY -- I'M NOT OUT TO REHASH EVERYTHING THAT EVERYONE EXPERIENCED.

YOUR FAMILY ON THAT DAY, YOU COULDN'T REACH THEM.

YOU WERE ON THE OPPOSITE SIDE.

>> I WAS IN KAANAPALI.

>>Daryl: THEY WERE AT MA'ALAEA.

>> THEY WERE ON FRONT STREET.

>>Daryl: AFTER THE FIRE.

>> THEY WENT THAT WAY.

>>Daryl: AND FOR A WHILE, NO ONE REALLY REALIZED WHAT WAS GOING ON.

>> YEAH.

THEY DID EXACTLY WHAT YOU SAID.

THEY'RE LIKE, NO, WE'LL JUST HANG OUT ON THE BYPASS.

WE'LL WAIT AND GO BACK.

THEY DID THAT ALL NIGHT.

ALL NIGHT.

MY GIRLFRIEND DIDN'T EVEN WANT TO DRIVE ON THE PALI.

SEE SEEN A CAR IN FRONT OF HER FLIPPED FROM THE WIND.

AND THIS POLYNESIAN GUY CAME OUT OF NOWHERE AND FLIPPED THE CAR BACK.

[LAUGHTER] >>Daryl: SO YOU'VE NOW BEEN IN A HOTEL.

WHAT'S IT LIKE LIVING IN A HOTEL?

>> IT'S -- IT'S NOT WHAT ANYBODY WANTS.

IT'S BETTER THAN LIVING IN -- >>Daryl: YOUR HOTEL.

A LOT BETTER THAN WHAT A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE GOING THROUGH.

>> YEAH.

IT'S NOT A COT IN A GYM, YES, BUT IT'S ALSO ..

THERE IS NO KITCHEN.

THERE'S NO PRIVACY.

IN A HOTEL ROOM, THAT'S GOOD FOR VACATION FOR A SHO.. TIME, BUT IT'S NOT GOOD MENTAL -- >>Daryl: DID YOU IMAGINE YOU WOULD BE SIX MONTHS?

>> NO, NO.

>>Daryl: I'VE -- I'M GETTING COMMENTS.

WE WANT TO RESPECT OUR VIEWERS.

WE'RE LIVING IN A ONE ROOM HOTEL ROOM.

NO KITCHEN AND HAVE BEEN FOR SEVEN MONTHS.

WE CONTINUE TO PAY MORTGAGE.

A LOT OF QUESTIONS ARE PEOPLE STRUGGLING TO KEEP THEIR PROPERTIES, YOU KNOW, FINANCIALLY WHILE LIVING IN THIS WAY.

WE HAVE HOMEOWNERS INSURANCE, BUT WILL NOT P.. $13,000 A MONTH FOR A HOUSE BARELY LIVEABLE.

WE'VE APPEALED TO FEMA THREE TIMES AND DENIED THREE TIMES.

SENATOR McKELVEY, WHAT IS THE SITUATION NOW AND FORGIVE ME FOR ASKING YOU NOT TO BE TOO TECHNICAL, BUT FOR THE FOLKS IN THESE HOTEL ROOMS AND DEALING WITH FEMA, DEALING WITH THE STATE, DEALING WITH THE COUNTY, WHAT'S IT LIKE?

IS THERE A PLAN?

IS THERE A SYSTEM THAT IS COHERENT TO PEOPLE?

>> NO.

AND THAT'S WHY WE HAD THAT WAM -- >>Daryl: WAYS AND MEANS.

>> WAYS AND MEANS MEETING.

I TOLD THE CHAIR WE SHOULD HAVE DONE THIS FOUR MONTHS AGO.

IT FORCED EVERYBODY TO THE TABLE TO THE STANDARD OF WHAT IS THE PLAN?

WHAT -- HOW DO WE GO FROM SHELTER TO INTERIM.. LONG TERM HOUSING TO GET BACK IN YOUR HOUSING, REBUILD IT OR PERHAPS ACQUIRE, AS ARCHIE SAID, HOUSING FOR YOUR PLACE THAT MAY NOT BE REBUILDABLE.

EVERYTHING STEMS FROM THE FACT THAT FEMA IS A MOVING TARGET NOW.

IT'S A MOVING BUCKET.

PEOPLE COME IN ELIGIBILITY AND OUT.

>>Daryl: WHAT ARE THE FACTORS?

>> IT DEPENDS IF YOU'RE A RENTER, IF YOU'RE A HOMEOWNER.

AND RENTERS ARE 87%.

>>Daryl: YOU KNOW, ARCHIE KALEPA, YOU'RE A MEMBER OF THE MAYOR'S ADVISORY GROUP ON THE COMMUNITY.

WHAT IS THE COMMUNITY TELLING YOU NOW ABOUT THE STATUS QUO?

THE CURRENT SITUATION IN TERMS OF THE HOUSING AND SURVIVORS?

>> EVERYBODY WANTS HOUSING.

I THINK THAT'S THE LOUDEST VOICE RIGHT NOW, IS OUR COMMUNITY WANTS HOUSING.

AND, YOU KNOW, SITTING ON THE MAYOR'S ADVISORY BOARD WE LOOK AT PLACES WHERE HOUSING CAN BE PUT UP.

THE STRUGGLE HAS BEEN THE INFRASTRUCTURE WITH WATER, SO IT'S BEEN SUCH A HARD THING TO PUT OUR FINGER ON BECAUSE OF THE LACK OF WATER IN THE AREA.

AND WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT IS THE COUNTY -- COUNTY WATER.

THEN YOU HAVE THE PRICED SECTOR.

PLACES LIKE KAANAPALI.

THEY HAVE ALL THE WATER.

THEY NEED TO START LEARNING HOW TO SHARE THAT WATER SO THAT WE CAN BUILD THESE SHORT-TERM HOMES THAT EVERYBODY'S WANTING TO GET OUT OF THE HOTELS SO THERE CAN BE A SENSE OF NORMALCY FOR THEM LIVING IN A PLACE THAT THEY CAN COOK.

YOU KNOW, THEY CAN WALK OUT AND HAVE A LITTLE YARD.

THESE ARE IMPORTANT COMPONENTS THAT, I THINK, WE'VE TAKEN FOR GRANTED WAY TOO LONG.

>>Daryl: YEAH.

I'M WONDERING, WHEN IT COMES TO WATER, YOU K..

CONVERSATION -- CONTROVERSY OVER WATER IN WEST MAUI FOR DECADES.

>> 150 YEARS.

>>Daryl: YEAH.

DOES THE GOVERNMENT NEED TO STEP UP AND TAKE THE WATER AND RECLAIM THE WATER?

IS THAT WHAT NEEDS TO HAPPEN?

>> YES.

THEY NEED TO EMINENT DOMAIN THAT WATER FOR PU..

PRIVATE USE.

I THINK WHAT WE SEE IN WEST MAUI IS GREAT PER.. WATER -- 22% OF THE WATER IN WEST WATER IS CONTROLLED BY COUNTY.

THE REST OF THE WATER IN WEST MAUI IS CONTROLLED B..

ENTITIES.

WE NEED TO SHARE THE BURDEN NOW.

WE NEED TO SHARE THE BURDEN FOR THE NEXT 500 YEARS.

THAT WATER BELONGS TO EVERYBODY.

IT SHOULD BE FAIR USE.

IT'S REALLY SAD WHEN YOU LOOK AT KAANAPALI, THE GOLF COURSE IS GREEN.

EVERY PROPERTY IS GREEN.

AND YOU GO TO THE FIRST COUNTY PARK RIGHT NEXT TO THE HYATT REGENCY, AND THAT PARK IS DRY.

BROWN.

WHY IS THAT?

>>Daryl: SENATOR McKELVEY, IS THERE WILL IN THE LEGISLATURE -- THE STATE WOULD HAVE TO DO THAT?

>> NO, THE COUNTY CAN DO THAT TOO.

EMINENT DOMAIN FUNCTION, COUNTY HAS THAT.

IT STARTS WITH CONDEMNATION -- >>Daryl: YOU HAVE TO BUY IT?

>> YEAH.

GO CONDEMNATION THEN EMINENT DOMAIN.

NO MATTER WHETHER IT'S TWO BILLS THAT ARE STILL MOVING TO ADDRESS THE SITUATION.

ONE LOOKS AT TRYING TO -- LOOK AT A NUMBER OF MECHA.. ACQUIRE WATER SYSTEM.

NOT ONLY EMINENT DOMAIN BUT INCOME TAX, USING BONDED AND OTHER THINGS TO ACQUIRE IT.

AND SECOND IS OUTRIGHT EMINENT DOMAIN.

IF ALL THE WATER SYSTEMS FOR WEST MAUI ARE UNDER PUBLIC FRUSTRATE -- TRUST, WE CAN START TO CONNECT.

OKAY, WE HAVE THE ABILITY WITH ALL THE SYSTEMS CONNECTED TO BRING WATER WHERE PEOPLE NEED.

>>Daryl: I THINK WE'RE GETTING A LITTLE BIT AHEAD OF OURSELVES.

I GOT ONE OF THE QUESTIONS HERE.

MICHELLE WILL ENJOY THIS.

WHEN JAPAN HAD EARTHQUAKES, THEY HOUSED PEOPLE WITHIN SIX MONTHS.

WHY IS IT TAKING SO LONG?

FOR YOU, IS THIS A VERY COMMON FRUSTRATION?

LIKE, WOULD YOU BE HAPPY TO MOVE INTO SOMETHING THAT WAS CERTAINLY NOT YOUR HOME BUT SOMETHING MORE THAN A HOTEL?

>> YES.

BUT I THINK WITH THAT, THERE HAS ALWAYS -- IT'S THERE, BUT IT'S JUST NOT THERE FOR THE LOCAL RESIDENTS.

>>Daryl: THERE ARE HOUSES THERE?

>> THERE ARE PLACES WITH KITCHENS THAT CAN HOUSE FAMILIES.

>>Daryl: EVERY DAY, SITTING THERE ON THE HILL.

>> YEAH.

BUT THEY'RE NOT THERE FOR THE -- FOR THE PEOP.. >>Daryl: IS THERE ANGER ABOUT THAT?

>> ABSOLUTELY.

AND I'VE SEEN THAT THERE ARE PEOPLE THAT OWN THES.. THAT DON'T EVEN LIVE THERE THAT DON'T EVEN CONTRIBUTE TO THE COMMUNITY THAT WON'T EVEN WANT TO HOUSE ANYBODY IN THE COMMUNITY.

THEIR SENTIMENTS IS, IF YOU DON'T HAVE A JOB.. MOVE.

SO HOW CAN WE EVEN -- LAHAINA IS A REALLY UNIQUE COMMUNITY.

IT'S GENERATIONAL.

YOU DON'T REALLY FIND THAT ANYWHERE ELSE IN HAWAI'I.

LIKE, WE KNOW -- LIKE WHO'S YOUR FATHER?

WHO'S YOUR AUNTY?

MY GOD.

[LAUGHTER] THAT IS -- IT'S SO UNIQUE.

AND ONCE THE PEOPLE OF LAHAINA START MOVING AWAY, YOU WON'T GET THAT SENSE OF COMMUNITY ANYMORE.

>>Daryl: ARE YOU SEEING PEOPLE MOVING?

>> ABSOLUTELY.

IN MY HOTEL ALONE, I KNOW OF FOUR PEOPLE MOVI.. MAINLAND.

>> VOLUNTARILY RELOCATION.

>> BUT IT'S CHEAPER.

EVEN IF YOU CAN AFFORD, IT'S NOT AFFORDABLE TO GET ANYTHING IN MAUI NOW.

ESPECIALLY WITH THE PRICES BEING OUTRAGEOUSLY HIGH, WHICH FEMA IS A PART OF THAT EQUATION.

IT'S BARE -- BETTER TO MOVE TO THE MAINLAND BECAUSE YOUR DOLLAR WILL GO FARTHER.

YOU CAN GET SOMEPLACE THAT IS -- INSTEAD OF A ONE BEDROOM, YOU CAN GET FIVE.

>>Daryl: THEY'VE PROBABLY BEEN THINKING ABOUT.. ARCHIE KALEPA, WHAT'S THE SENTIMENT DO YOU SEE TOWARDS THE SHORT-TERM RENTALS IN THESE COMMUNITIES?

WHAT DO YOU THINK IS GOING TO HAPPEN WITH THAT SITUATION?

>> THE SHORT-TERM RENTALS?

>>Daryl: YEAH.

DO YOU SEE THE WILL AGAIN IN THE COUNTY TO RE..

PARTICULARLY THE THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS THAT ARE ON THAT LIST OF SORT OF GRANDFATHERED ONES THAT AREN'T QUITE PERMITTED BUT ALSO THEY DON'T WANT TO ESPECIALLY FORCE.

THERE'S A LOT LIKE THAT, RIGHT?

>> YOU KNOW, THE THING ABOUT THIS IS, IT'S GOING TO COME A POINT WHERE GOVERNMENT IS GOING TO HAVE TO PUT DOWN ITS FOOT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE TAKING CARE OF THIS COMMUNITY.

I THINK BETWEEN THE GOVERNOR AND THE MAYOR, IT'S ALL ABOUT THE PROCESS, RIGHT?

THEY'VE BEEN ALLOWING THE PROCESS TO TAKE ITS COURSE.

THERE COMES A POINT WHEN YOU GOT TO STEP IN BECAUSE THE PEOPLE THAT AREN'T FROM HERE THAT OWNS THESE VACATION RENTALS OR LIVING IN THE SHORT TERM SITUATION, IT'S NOT WORKING.

AND THE CLOCK'S TICKING.

WE'VE GOT TO GET OUR PEOPLE IN A SITUATION WHERE THEY FEEL LIKE THEY'RE GETTING THE HELP THAT THEY NEED.

THIS CRY IS A CRY THAT'S HAPPENING EVERY SINGLE DAY.

SAD PART ABOUT THIS IS 20 YEARS AGO, IT WAS ALL ABOUT THE LAND.

THE LAND BECAME EXPENSIVE.

THE ISSUE TODAY IS WATER.

WE DON'T HAVE THE WATER TO TEMPORARY DEVELOP THE LANDS FOR MIDTERM HOUSING.

>>Daryl: YEAH.

I WAS GOING TO ASK SENATOR THIS QUESTION, IS.. HOUSING SHORTAGE ALREADY, EXPECT MICHELLE WOULD SAY, WE HAD WRONG PEOPLE IN THE HOUSES.

BUT STILL, YOU HAD AN AFFORDABLE HOUSING SHORTAGE.

>> NOW YOU HAVE A COMMUNITY REMOVED FROM THE INVENTORY BY THE FIRE.

AND YOU CAN'T JUST IMMEDIATELY REPLACE ALL THOSE LOST UNITS.

YOU'VE GOT THIS DELAY.

SO THE INFRASTRUCTURE CAN'T SHIFT TO SUPPORT THESE AFFORDABLE AND TEMPORARY OR IMMEDIATELY TRANSITIONAL HOUSING PLACES.

WHY CAN'T WE FIX THAT PROBLEM?

>> SO I THINK PART OF IT IS SO THERE'S RIGHT NOW I KNOW OF FIVE PROJECTS BETWEEN FEMA, THE COUNTY AND THE STATE AND DHHL IS WORKING ON TO GET HOUSING.

GET MIDTERM HOUSING TO THE COMMUNITY OF LAHAINA RIGHT AWAY.

THOSE FIVE PROJECTS HAVE -- SO LIKE FEMA, THE PROJECT IN KAANAPALI 2020, WHICH IS 400 HOMES.

>> MODULAR HOMES.

>> MODULAR HOMES.

THEN YOU HAVE DHHL, WHICH I THINK INITIALLY WAS 200 HOMES.

NOW MAYBE 400 HOMES.

AND YOU HAVE THE COUNTY PROJECT THAT THE COUNTY'S WORKING ON.

BETWEEN ALL OF THOSE PROJECTS GETTING STARTED, THE ISSUES SURROUNDING THOSE IS VERY, VERY COMPLICATED, AND IT'S MORE THAN ONE ISSUE THAT IS CREATING ROAD BLOCKS.

THERE COMES A POINT WHERE WE HAVE TO JUST MOVE FORWARD.

>>Daryl: I WAS READING A NEWSPAPER STORY THE OTHER DAY.

THERE WAS A CHURCH BUILT VILLAGE THAT STARTED CONSTRUCTION IMMEDIATELY AFTER THE FIRE.

BUT THEY HAVEN'T BEEN ABLE TO GET WATER.

>> IS THIS IN KAHULUI?

>>Daryl: YEAH.

>> A LOT OF PEOPLE IN LAHAINA WERE PRETTY SH.. >> RIGHT ON THE HIGHWAY WHERE EVERYBODY CAN KIND OF STARE AT YOU.

>> I'D LIKE TO TAP INTO THAT.

I'VE BEEN WITH THE HOUSING PROJECT.

BESIDES THIS HOUSING, THE TOP THING THAT IS HURTING OUR COMMUNITIES, THE MENTAL HEALTH ISSUES.

THAT HOUSING PROJECT, ANY HOUSING PROJECT, THE INFRASTRUCTURE, THERE HAVE TO BE GRASS, TREES.

WE NEED THAT SPACE TO HELP US DEAL WITH THE MENTAL HEALTH ISSUES.

WE NEED TO BE ABLE TO GO TO THE BEACH.

WE NEED A BEACH PARK THAT IS A SAFE, HEALTHY ENVI.. YOU'D BE SURPRISED, LIVING THROUGH THIS MENTAL HEALTH ISSUE WITHOUT RECOGNIZING IT.

AND YOU GO TO THE BEACH AND JUMP IN THE WATER.

IT COMES TO THE SURFACE, AND YOU REALIZE HOW IMPORTANT IT IS TO BEING HEALTHY FOR YOURSELF, FOR YOUR FAMILY.

THESE ARE IMPORTANT THINGS THAT NEED TO BE THOUGHT OF WHEN WE BUILD THESE TEMPORARY HOUSING.

THESE MODULAR HOMES.

IT IS A LITTLE PLAYGROUND.

A COOKING BARBECUE AREA.

THESE ARE IMPORTANT COMPONENTS TO HAVING OR BUILDING A HEALTHY COMMUNITY ONCE AGAIN.

>>Daryl: THAT'S AN INTERESTING POINT OF VIEW BECAUSE SOME PEOPLE THINK JUST PUT OUT A SHIPPING CONTAINER AND PUT PLUMBING IN IT AND LET PEOPLE LIVE THERE UNTIL THEIR HOUSES CAN BE REBUILT.

>> YOU KNOW WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN, IT'S GOI..

LIVING IN A HOTEL.

THREE WEEKS LATER, YOU'RE GOING TO BE, I WANT BACK INTO A HOTEL.

THESE ARE THINGS WE HAVE TO THINK ABOUT.

>>Daryl: WHAT IS THE TIME LINE END UP BEING THEN?

IT JUST STRIKES ME BEING A LONG TIME.

AND MICHELLE'S GOING, YOU'RE NOT ANTICIPATING THIS HAPPENING OVERNIGHT.

>> OH, NO.

MY PROPERTY ISN'T EVEN CLEANED YET.

>> YEAH.

AND YOU HAVE THE ISSUE, THEY'RE GOING BY WHO.. FIRST?

THERE'S HOPSCOTCHING AROUND.

AND FOR INSTANCE, HAWAI'I HOUSING FINANCE DEVELOPMENT COOPERATION, WE HAVE FRONT STREET APARTMENTS THERE.

WE HAVE A PLAN TO REBUILD THEM.

HOWEVER, WE NEED THE CORPS TO CLEAN AROUND AND EVERYTHING.

WE'RE TRYING TO ALIGN.

SO PART OF COUNTY'S HOUSING STRATEGY IS TO COME INTO AREAS, GET THE INFRASTRUCTURE CLEAN UP AND REBUILD THERE BECAUSE IT'S READY TO GO.

WHICH TAKE PRESSURE OFF OF HAVING TO CREATE MORE HOUSING.

THE HOUSING ISSUE WAS A CRISIS BEFORE.

WE NEED A PATHWAY.

I AGREE WITH REP TOKUDA.

WE NEED TO TRY TO ALIGN A PATHWAY WHEREBY WE'RE CREATING MAYBE HUD MONEY IS THE ANSWER.

GOING TO INTERIM MOD DEW LAR TO LONG-TERM HOUSING.

>>Daryl: LET'S TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THE REBUILDING LAHAINA NOW.

AS A HOMEOWNER, WHAT HAVE YOU BEEN TOLD IS THE TIME LINE TO GO BACK?

FIRST OF ALL, DO YOU HAVE THE MEANS?

WILL YOU BE ABLE TO ARE BUILD YOUR HOUSE?

>> YES.

I'M LUCKY THAT MY MOM -- I DON'T KNOW, HAD GREAT INSURANCE.

SO WE ARE GOING TO REBUILD, BUT I'M HEARING FIVE YEARS.

HEARING 10 YEARS.

AND JUST -- >>Daryl: THAT SEEMS CRAZY.

>> IT IS.

>> YOU ALSO HAVE CULTURAL ISSUES.

THERE'S A MAP THAT CAME OUT -- >>Daryl: LET HER FINISH.

MICHELLE'S VERY POLITE.

SHE'S NOT GOING TO INTERRUPT YOU SO I'LL DO T.. WHAT ARE YOU LOOKING AT?

>> AND JUST TO GET TO THE PROCESS OF THAT.

LIKE, THE -- BEFORE I'M THINKING OF BUILDING, LIKE, ALL THESE THINGS I'M HEARING THAT IT WILL COST BETWEEN 800 TO A THOUSAND SQUARE FOOT TO BUILD.

THAT WILL MAKE ME A DOG KENNEL.

THAT'S JUST RIDICULOUS.

800 TO $1,000 SQUARE FOOT IS CRAZY.

I DID SEE AN ARTICLE THAT THE GOING RIGHT SH.. $200.

I KNOW THE PALAKIKOS ARE PUSHING FOR CONTRACT.. TO GET TO THAT POINT OF FINDING A CONTRACTOR AND GETTING THAT PART.

>>Daryl: WHAT ARE YOU TELLING YOU ABOUT THE .. HAVING YOUR LOT CLEARED?

>> THAT, YOU CAN'T REALLY GET AN ANSWER.

THE ONLY THING YOU CAN FIND OUT IS IF YOU'VE DONE ALL YOUR PAPERWORK.

>>Daryl: FRONT STREET IS FULLY SERVICED BY SE.. YOU HAVE CESSPOOLS?

>> WE DIDN'T ON OUR PROPERTY.

LAHAINA SHORES IS ACROSS FROM US.

LAHAINA SHORES HAD POSTED THEY'RE PLANNING ON OPENING AND HOUSING LAHAINA RESIDENTS.

I DON'T KNOW HOW TRUE THAT IS, AND I WAS LIKE, WAIT.

I GUESS THE BUILDING IS DEEMED OKAY.

>> IT LOOKED GOOD.

>> YEAH, IT DOES FROM THE OUTSIDE.

>>Daryl: PEOPLE WHO'VE SEEN IT, IT'S A VERY RECTANGULAR BUILDING.

ABOUT 10 STORIES HIGH.

RIGHT ON THE WATER.

ON THE SOUTH END OF THE BUSINESS DISTRICT.

AND YOU LIVED ACROSS THE STREET.

ARE YOU GOING TO REBUILD YOUR HOUSE THE WAY IT WAS?

MULTIGENERATIONAL.

HOW NEW WAS YOUR HOUSE?

>> IT BUILT IN THE '70s.

IT'S KIND OF UPDATED, BUT I'M NOT SURE.

>>Daryl: I'M SORRY TO INTERRUPT YOU.

>> IT WASN'T A PLANTATION HOUSE.

>>Daryl: BUT THAT STREET HAS SEWAGE.

IT HAS WATER.

AND YOU WOULD THINK THAT A PLACE LIKE THAT, THEY WOULD PUT A PRIORITY ON GETTING THOSE LOTS CLEARED.

THEY'VE GOT THE SEWER AND WATER.

WHAT'S THE HOLD UP ON SOMETHING LIKE THAT?

>> LET ME CHIME IN HERE.

SO CURRENTLY, ARMY CORPS OF ENGINEERS AS OF YESTERDAY, CLEARED 137 LOTS.

>> OUT OF HOW MANY?

>> 2800.

AND THAT'S SINCE JANUARY 16.

SO FROM JANUARY 16 TO NOW, AND THEY'RE STARTING -- >>Daryl: FIVE WEEKS.

>> FIVE WEEKS.

THAT'S IMPRESSIVE.

BUT I THINK THE THING IS, LIKE, WHERE MICHELLE LIVES, THERE'S ISSUES NOW.

SHORELINE SETBACK.

WHAT IS IT GOING TO BE?

WHAT IS IT GOING TO LOOK LIKE.

THERE'S OTHER THINGS THAT WE HAVE TO ADDRESS.

I KNOW THEY WANT TO FAST TRACK THE PERMITTING.

IF I WANTED TO REBUILD MY HOUSE EXACTLY TO THE PLANS THAT I PREVIOUSLY HAD BEFORE MY HOUSE BURNED DOWN?

THE COUNTY IS WORKING ON A FAST TRACK PERMITTING PROCESS TO ALLOW THAT TO HAPPEN SO THAT WE CAN GET CONTRACTORS ONBOARD WHEN IT'S TIME FOR YOU TO BUILD.

YOU WOULD MOVE RIGHT INTO BUILDING.

PERMITS IS A BIG PROBLEM.

NOT ONLY FOR MAUI COUNTY BUT STATEWIDE, APPROVING PERMITS FOR BUILDING.

SO THEY WANT TO FIND WAYS TO FAST TRACK THE PERMITTING PROCESS.

ONE OF THE WAYS IS BY YOU BEING ABLE TO SHOW.. WAS EXISTING AND USING EXISTING PLANS TO REBUILD YOUR HOME.

I'M HAPPY TO SAY I'M REALLY IMPRESSED WITH THE ARMY CORPS OF ENGINEERS AND THE WORK THEY'VE BEEN ABLE TO DO IN FIVE WEEKS.

CLEARING 137 LOTS.

>>Daryl: IS IT KIND OF HOPSCOTCHED?

>> NO.

THE REASON IS IF YOU WERE TO -- YESTERDAY, W..

HIM INTO THE BURN ZONE.

AND THERE'S SO MANY TEAMS CLEARING LOTS THAT IF THEY WERE TO CLEAR ONE AREA, ONE STREET, FOR EXAMPLE, IT'S TOO MUCH TRAFFIC IN ONE AREA.

IT WOULD CLOG EVERYTHING.

THE TRUCKS TAKING ALL THAT DEBRIS.

>> THAT'S WHY THEY'RE SEPARATED RIGHT NOW.

SO THAT THEY CAN GET -- THEY CAN MOVE FASTER.

>>Daryl: SENATOR.

>> FOR INSTANCE, ONE BLOCK OF STREETS ACROSS FROM THE SAFEWAY THERE.

THEY WANT TO DO THE WHOLE THING AS ONE CONTIGUOUS STRIP.

YOU'VE GOT ENTITIES, PROPERTY OWNERS THEY HAVEN'T GIVEN THE R.O.E.

THAT'S ONE OF THE CONCERNS.

>> WHAT ABOUT NEXT DOOR?

THIS POPPED UP IN COLORADO.

>> THAT GOES BACK TO THE MULTIGENERATIONAL THING.

>>Daryl: THEY CAN'T AGREE.

>> THAT PROPERTY HAS BEEN IN THE FAMILY FOR FIVE GENERATIONS.

SO BETWEEN THAT TIME, YOU KNOW -- >>Daryl: WHO'S ON TITLE NOW?

>> WHO'S ON TITLE?

MAYBE THE PERSON ON TITLE ISN'T LIVING ANYMORE.

THEY CAN'T GET YOU THE R.O.E.

PROCESS.

SAY SOMEBODY FOR MICHELLE, IF HER NEIGHBORS, MULTIGENERATIONAL, ORIGINAL OWNERS PASSED AWAY, R.O.E.

NOT SIGNED, IT'S GOING TO BE DIFFICULT.

THERE'S SO MUCH COMPLICATIONS.

>>Daryl: I SPOKE TO THE MAYOR THE OTHERS DAY AND ASKED HIM, WHEN IS THE FIRST PROPERTY GOING TO BE CLEARED SO SOMEBODY CAN PUT A HOUSE ON IT?

I DON'T KNOW.

HE WAS FRANK ABOUT IT.

HE SAID FEMA IS TELLING US THIS IS THE MOST COMPLEX DISASTER SCENARIO THEY'VE EVER SEEN.

THINGS LIKE THAT.

IS THERE A WAY OF FIXING THAT?

>> YOU'VE GOT A COMPLICATION.

PEOPLE -- TALKING TO EXPERTS, PARADISE FIRE, IT'S MORE LIKE LAHAINA.

NOT ONLY CONDITIONS.

BUT YOU HAVE A EPA DISASTER THAT CONTAINS TOX.. WHAT THEY SAID TOO, YOU'RE GOING TO RUN INTO THE ISSUE.

YOU HAVE A CULTURAL IMPORTANCE IN LAHAINA THAT DOESN'T EXIST OUT HERE FOR US.

WE CAN SCRAPE AND REBUILD.

AND ALREADY, THERE'S BEEN A MAP DONE OF THE IWI ALL OVER LAHAINA.

>> I THINK WHEN WE TALK ABOUT CULTURE COMPONENT, ONE THING THAT HAWAII IS GOING TO GIVE TO FEMA MOVING FORWARD WHEN THEY GO TO OTHER DISASTERS.

>>Daryl: NEW APPRECIATION.

>> NEW APPRECIATION FOR THE CULTURAL RESPECT.. THAT HAS NOW BECOME THE MOST IMPORTANT COMPONENT TO EVERY LOT MOVING FORWARD, THAT THE CULTURAL SURVEYORS THAT ARE ON SITE, THAT ARE IDENTIFYING THE CULTURAL -- HOW DO I SAY THIS?

>>Daryl: ATTRIBUTES?

THINGS THAT CAN BE THERE.

ARCHITECTURAL, ARCHEOLOGY AND SO ON.

LET ALONE IWI.

>> ALL OF THOSE THINGS TODAY ARE NO LONGER OVERLOOKED.

THEY'RE RESPECTED.

THEY'RE DOING THE RIGHT PROTOCOLS TO MAKING SURE THAT EVERYBODY UNDERSTANDS WHAT THAT IS.

SO I THINK RIGHT NOW THAT'S ONE THING FEMA WILL TAKE TO THEM TO THE NEXT DISASTER.

>>Daryl: IT'S GOING TO REQUIRE PATIENCE BY TH..

WAITING.

THAT'S GREAT, BUT IT'S GOING TO SLOW THINGS .. >> WHEN NOW REALLY THINK ABOUT THIS, SIX MONTHS IS NOT A LONG TIME.

PEOPLE MAY GET A LOT OF CARDS QUESTIONING THAT, BU.. ONE, GET READY FOR THE MARATHON.

IF YOU HAVEN'T ACTUALLY RUN A MARATHON, IT'S LIKE PADDLING THE MOLOKAI CHANNEL.

THE ISLAND IS THERE.

YOU PADDLE FOR TWO MORE HOURS, AND THE ISLAND HASN'T MOVED.

THAT'S KIND OF WHERE WE ARE.

>>Daryl: I GOT A QUESTION THAT WAS OCCURRING TO ME.

DO YOU SUPPORT THE REBUILD OF FRONT STREET OF WHERE IT WAS.

THIS IS YOUR STREET.

OR DO YOU THINK SETBACK SHOULD ACCOMMODATE SEA LEVEL RISE?

ARE YOU CONCERNED?

>> I'M ACTUALLY DIRECTLY ACROSS THE STREET FROM THE BEACHFRONT.

THERE'S A MONSTER HOME AND LAHAINA SHORE PROTECTING MY PROPERTY.

BUT WHEN THAT HOUSE ACROSS THE STREET WAS BUILT, THEY RAISED THE LAND.

AND SO I'M SURE THAT EVERYONE THAT IS BEACHFRONT, IT'S GOING TO BE AN ISSUE.

AND BECAUSE YOU GOT TO THINK LOOK AT NORTH SHORE ON OAHU.

>>Daryl: OR KAMEHAMEHA III SCHOOLS.

>> IT'S IN A FLOOD ZONE.

EVEN BACK IN THE DAY, GOVERNOR WAIHEE PROPOSED SELLING THE LANDS THERE AND BUILDING A BRAND NEW SCHOOL BY THE BOYS AND GIRL CLUB STATE OF THE ART.

BECAUSE OF THE TRADITION AND HISTORY, IT BECAME A STICKING POINT.

THE SCHOOL WAS OVERCROWDED.

NOW WE HAVE A CHANCE TO BUILD A BRAND NEW SCHOOL IN A SAFE AREA.

>> ONE OF THE THINGS I WANT TO MENTION IS TALKING TO CHIP FLETCHER -- >>Daryl: ONE OF THE SCARIEST PEOPLE TO TALK TO.

>> YEAH.

ESPECIALLY NOW.

TODAY WHEN I WAS DRIVING FROM LAHAINA, AND WHEN I SAW THOUSAND PEAKS, UKUMEHAME, ALL THE TREES ALONG THAT AREA WHERE EVERYBODY PARKS AND GO SURFING, ALL THE ROOTS ARE EXPOSED AND TREES ARE FALLING OVER.

RIGHT NOW IN WEST MAUI, IN WEST MAUI, THE ER.. 44% FASTER THAN ANY PLACE IN THE STATE OF HAWAI'I.

LAHAINA.

>>Daryl: ON THIS SUBJECT, WILL THE COUNTY REQ.. TO CONVERT TO SEPTIC SEWAGE?

HOW MUCH IS SEWER AN ISSUE?

CERTAIN PARTS A REAL PROBLEM.

>> THAT IS A REAL PROBLEM.

ON TOP OF BUILDING MY HOME AT $800 TO $1,000 A SQUARE FOOT, NOW I HAVE TO PAY FOR A SEPTIC TANK THAT IS GOING TO BE CAPABLE OF A THREE BEDROOM HOME.

THIS HAS BEEN A TOP DISCUSSION MOVING FORWARD THAT MAYBE WAIKULI, THAT WAS SUPPOSED TO BE TIED INTO THE SEWER SYSTEM YEARS AGO, MAYBE NOW WE CAN GET FEDERAL HELP TO HELP PUT THAT INFRASTRUCTURE IN TO TIE IN SEWER LIKE.

THE ISSUE BECOMES THAT AREAS IS ROCKS.

THAT ISSUE BECOME PEOPLE CAN MOVE HOME, BUT WHAT DO THEY DO IN THE INTERIM?

DO THEY PUT IN A SEPTIC TANK?

THESE ARE REAL HARD ISSUES.

>>Daryl: IT'S MIND-BLOWING.

SINCE LAHAINA WAS THE CAPITAL OF THE HAWAIIAN KINGDOM, WHY ISN'T LAND BEING RETURNED TO NATIVE HAWAIIANS?

WE HAVE A LOT OF PRIVATE OWNERSHIP AND A LOT OF GOVERNMENT LAND OWNERSHIP.

DO YOU SEE A LAHAINA BEING RESHAPED FROM THIS OPPORTUNITY?

>> OH, YES.

>>Daryl: ESPECIALLY ALONG PUBLIC AREAS?

TICKY-TACKY.

CHARMING STORES.

>> IF YOU DON'T MIND ME CHIMING IN HERE.

MOKUULA.

I THINK MOKUULA IS THE PEOPLE OF LAHAINA.

WE HAVE TO MAKE SURE THAT WE CEN RESTORE MOKUULA TO ITS ORIGINAL STATE.

BRINGING BACK THE POND.

>>Daryl: TELL ME ABOUT MOKUULA.

>> TODAY IT'S KNOWN AS MALUULUOLELE BASEBALL PARK.

AT ONE TIME, THAT WAS WHERE OUR KINGS AND QUEENS SPENT TIME.

THERE WAS A HEIAU HOUSE IN THE MIDDLE OF THE POND.

>>Daryl: THAT'S THE PICTURE WE ALL SEE?

>> YES.

SO PART OF BRINGING BACK THE WATER TO LAHAINA.. THAT PLACE.

BECAUSE IF WE CAN BRING THE WATER BACK TO THAT PLACE -- >>Daryl: THE NATURAL WATER.

>> NATURAL WATER.

THE WATER OF LAHAINA WILL COME BACK.

WE HAVE TO PUT THAT -- >>Daryl: THAT'S LIKE A PLUMBING THING IN A WAY?

IF YOU UNFILL AN AREA THAT'S BEEN FILLED, PERHAPS THE NATURAL WATER FLOW WILL BE RESTORED?

>> THE NATURAL WATER FLOW OF LAHAINA, IT WAS CALLED VENICE OF THE PACIFIC WAY BACK IN THE DAY.

WITH THE KING'S TARO PATCH.

HOWEVER, WHEN THE PLANTATIONS CAME IN, THEY DIVERTED ALL THE WATER AWAY, WHICH IS WHY MOKUULA TURNED INTO -- >> THAT'S THE 150 YEAR STORM.

>>Daryl: DOES THAT SYMBOLIC OR IS THAT ACTUAL CHANGE TO THE ENVIRONMENT AND -- >> BOTH.

>> AND CHANGE TO THE QUALITY.

>> BOTH.

I THINK WE HAVE A LOT TO LEARN FROM OUR PAST.

WHAT WE'VE SEEN HAPPEN TO LAHAINA IN THE LAST 150 YEARS FROM WHEN THE FIRST SUGAR FIELDS AND FIRST DIVERSION OF WATERS, THIS BATTLE FOR WATER HAS BEEN GOING ON OVER A HUNDRED YEARS.

>>Daryl: I NEED TO MOVE ON.

I'M GETTING A LOT OF QUESTIONS.

THIS QUESTION CAME UP AT THE LEGISLATURE THE OTHER DAY.

WHEN THIS HAPPENED, PEOPLE WERE POURING MONEY TOWARDS LAHAINA.

PEOPLE WERE GIVING MONEY TO ALL KINDS OF PLACES.

WHO'S CONTROLLING THE MONEY?

WHERE IS MONEY COMING FROM?

MICHELLE, IS THAT SOMETHING YOU FOLKS ASK?

LIKE, WHERE IS THAT MONEY GOING?

WHAT'S IT BEING USED FOR?

>> I HAVEN'T THOUGHT ABOUT IT.

>>Daryl: YOU'RE LIVING LIFE EVERY DAY, RIGHT?

>> YEAH.

I GO TO WORK.

>>Daryl: YEAH.

>> THAT'S THE MONEY I'M WORRIED ABOUT.

>>Daryl: WHAT THAT RAISES IS A QUESTION ABOUT WHO IS ULTIMATELY IN CHARGE OF MAKING ALL THESE DECISIONS AND DIRECTING ALL THESE RESOURCES?

SENATOR McKELVEY, YOU'VE PUT IN A BILL.

HOW MUCH CAN THE EXISTING GOVERNMENT STRUCTURE -- AT THE BEGINNING OF THIS CRISIS, MANY PEOPLE SAYING, THIS IS BEYOND THE CAMPAIGN CAPABILITY OF GOVERNMENT STRUCTURES.

IS IT SOMETHING -- WHAT ARE THE IDEAS FOR GOVERNING THIS PROCESS THAT CAN GET IT DONE EFFICIENTLY BUT STILL INVOLVE THE COMMUNITY AND SO ON?

>> THE COMMUNITY NEEDS TO BE INVOLVED.

PART OF THE FRUSTRATION IS DECISION HAVE BEEN MADE.

THERE WAS NO WHAT'S CALLED MEANINGFUL CONSULTATION.

HOW DO YOU BRINGS MEANINGFUL CONSULTATION?

WHAT FORM THAT TAKES.

THAT'S FOR THE COMMUNITY TO DISCUSS.

I THINK WE NEED TO BE ABLE TO HAVE OPEN, FRANK DISCUSSIONS AND EXCHANGE IDEAS AND NOT FEEL LIKE IT'S BASICALLY A THREATENING OR HIDDEN AGENDA.

LET LAHAINA LEAD.

WHAT DOES LAHAINA LOOK LIKE?

HOW WILL THAT WORK?

IS A SELF-GOVERNING STRUCTURE, COULD THIS CAUSE MORE PROBLEMS THAN BENEFITS?

THESE ARE THE HEALTHY DISCUSSIONS THAT NEEDS.. DURING THE SESSION >>Daryl: YOUR BILL WAS TO PROVOKE THAT CONVERSATION?

>> IT WASN'T TO PROVOKE IT.

SEVERAL PEOPLE ASKED ME, CAN YOU INTRODUCE THIS?

IT STEMS FROM ONE THING.

LET LAHAINA LEAD.

>>Daryl: YOUR PROPOSAL WAS FOR A BOARD OF ELECTED WEST MAUI RESIDENTS.

HOW IS THAT FLYING?

>> THERE'S CONCERN ABOUT IT.

>> PEOPLE ARE CONCERNED.

WHAT THEY'RE MOSTLY CONCERNED ABOUT IS IT REFERENCING A EXISTING COMMUNITY AUTHORITY STRUCTURE THAT AS EMINENT DOMAIN POWER.

THAT IS WHAT'S REALLY SCARING PEOPLE.

>>Daryl: COMING IN -- >> DISTRUST OF GOVERNMENT.

NOW YOU HAVE THIS FACELESS NAMELESS BOARD.

THE POTENTIAL OF ALL THE BAD THINGS.

WHEN YOU UNDERSTAND THESE ARE PEOPLE FROM THE COMMUNITY.

THERE IS A CONCERN BECAUSE THE ROAD TO HELL SOMETIMES IS PAVED WITH GOOD INTENTIONS.

>>Daryl: THAT BILL ISN'T PERFECT.

>> I THINK THERE NEEDS TO BE WHERE ADJUSTMENTS CAN BE MADE TO THE BILL SO IT'S PALATABLE TO THE ENTIRE COMMUNITY.

>>Daryl: THEY'RE STARTED HEARING IT NOW.

CAN I ASK MICHELLE, WE'VE GOT ABOUT TEN MINUTES LEFT.

ARE YOU HOPEFUL ABOUT THE FUTURE OF LAHAINA?

ALL OF THIS STUFF, THIS HAS BEEN LIKE 52 PICKUP, YOU THROW THE CARDS ON THE GROUND AND NOW YOU CAN PICK IT UP.

IT'S REALLY A CHANGE AGENT.

ARE YOU HOPEFUL ABOUT MAYBE BRINGING BACK THE LAHAINA THAT YOUR PARENTS LIVED IN?

OR AT LEAST SOMETHING THAT'S MORE COMMUNITY-FRIENDLY?

>> YES.

I MEAN, I WOULD LIKE TO HOPE THAT THE PEOPLE ..

IN LAHAINA.

AND UNFORTUNATELY, THEY ALSO HAVE TO BE THE VOICE, AN.. OF PEOPLE -- I'M ONE OF THEM.

WE JUST WANT TO STAY QUIET BECAUSE FOR ME PERSONALLY, I DON'T WANT TO DEALING WITH ANY BACKLASH BECAUSE I SEE HOW A PERSON THAT HAS GOOD INTENTIONS, THAT THEY'RE OUT THERE ON SOCIAL MEDIA, AND THEY GET BACKLASH.

I DON'T WANT TO DEAL WITH THAT KIND OF STUFF.

SO I'M SURE THAT'S WHY A LOT OF PEOPLE DON'T WANT TO RUN FOR GOVERNMENT.

THEY JUST DON'T WANT TO DEAL WITH ALL THE PEO.. JUST GOING TO TRASH TALK AND, YOU KNOW -- >>Daryl: IT'S BEEN LIKE THAT SINCE THE BEGINNING OF THIS CRISIS.

THERE WAS AA LOT OF DIVISION.

>> A LOT OF DIVISION.

A LOT OF FALSE STORIES AND IT'S HARD TO DECIPHER WHAT IS TRUE AND WHAT IS NOT, ALL THIS FALSE STUFF.

YEAH, THE GOVERNMENT IS OUT TO GET US AND WEEDING OUT THAT.

IT'S HARD TO KEEP THE COMMUNITY TOGETHER WHEN YOU HAVE SO MANY PEOPLE THAT TRYING TO TEAR IT APART FROM THE OUTSIDE.

>>Daryl: HOW MUCH DO YOU THINK IS OUTSIDERS?

>> I THINK -- I MEAN, FOR THE BAD INFORMATION, IT'S ALL OUTSIDERS.

AND THEN THEY GET PEOPLE THAT ARE INSIDE, AND THE INSI.. NO, THIS IS WHAT I HEARD.

>>Daryl: I'M GOING TO THROW SOME COMMENTS HERE.

25% OF DISPLACED OF THE FIRE VICTIMS MOVE OFF MAUI ALREADY.

I DON'T KNOW IF THAT NUMBER IS CORRECT.

PEOPLE FEEL LIKE IT.

>> JUST IN MY HOTEL, FOUR PEOPLE.

>> ONLY 25% OF THE POPULATION IS LEFT ON THE WEST SIDE BECAUSE OF THE INABILITY TO SECURE UNITS ON THE WEST SIDE.

YOU HEAR 1300 UNITS UNDER FEMA CONTRACT IS UNOCCUPIED NOW.

THAT IS INFURIATING.

>>Daryl: DO YOU THINK THE COUNTY SHOULD LEAD TO .. STATE?

IT STRIKES ME THAT THERE HAVE BEEN A LOT OF FALSE STARTS BY BOTH ENTITIES.

ARCHIE KALEPA, WHAT CONFIDENCE -- YOU'RE IN IT.

PEOPLE ASK YOU, WHAT CONFIDENCE DO YOU HAVE OF OUR ABILITY TO DO THIS?

>> WELL, I THINK THE PROOF IS IN THE PUDDING.

THE STATE AND THE COUNTY, I KNOW THEY'RE WORKING REALLY HARD.

TO GET THE MIDTERM HOUSING.

BUT AGAIN, IT'S JUST THE LACK OF RESOURCES.

THE LACK OF -- THE DEAD ENDS.

IT BOILS DOWN TO THE WATER.

IT'S JUST SO CRAZY THAT EVERY PLACE WE LOOK AT, WHEN YOU GET DOWN TO THE NITTY-GRITTY, IT LOOKS GOOD BUT THE END RESULT, WHICH IS THE MOST IMPORTANT THING, IS THE WATER IS NOT THERE.

>>Daryl: I HEARD WHEN I FIRST WENT TO MAUI A.. OF THE TRADITIONAL FARMERS, DREAM OF RESTORING STREAMS TO THEIR NATURAL STATE AND HOW THAT WOULD CREATE FIREBREAKS AND THAT WOULD CHANGE LITERALLY THE ENVIRONMENT, THE CLIMATE.

AND START FROM THERE.

>> SO KAHOMA STREAM WAS DRIED FOR 130 YEARS.

WE STORED THE WATER.

MYSELF, KAI, LAWRENCE, KAPALI.

WE RESTORED THE WATER.

WHAT WE'VE SEEN WAS SO TRANSFORMATIONAL.

>>Daryl: DO YOU HAVE HOPE, ARCHIE?

>> I HAVE 100% HOPE.

YOU KNOW, BUT IS IT GOING TO HAPPEN IN MY LIFETIME?

THAT'S THE REAL TRUTH TO THE MATTER.

>>Daryl: WHAT ABOUT ANYBODY'S LIFETIME?

>> WHEN I LOOK AT -- WE GOT TO BE HONEST HERE.

WHAT I THINK IS GOING TO BE THE FIRST HOME THAT IS GOING TO BE PUT UP IN LAHAINA IS FOUR YEARS.

AND I SAY THAT NOW LOOKING AT WHAT ARMY CORPS IS DOING.

HOW FAST WE CAN GET FROM PHASE TWO TO PHASE THREE.

FOUR YEARS TO FIVE YEARS.

WHAT SCARES ME IS EVERY PERSON THAT MOVES AWAY BECAUSE THEY CANNOT WAIT.

TO ME, IT'S LIKE HAVING THAT PERSON THAT PASS.. FIRE.

>>Daryl: I HAVE A QUESTION SOMEWHERE.

BASICALLY, EXPLAINING THE FINANCES OF THEIR PERSONAL FINANCES AND SAYING, I THINK A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE GOING TO END UP BEING HOMELESS OR THEY'RE GOING TO LEAVE.

BECAUSE THEY'RE HAVING TO PAY MORTGAGE.

>> A MILLION DOLLARS A DAY, AND SURVIVORS ARE COMING UP.

I ARGUED ABOUT THIS.

OUTSIDE EXPERTS SAID -- >>Daryl: A MILLION DOLLARS CURRENTLY BEING SPENT A DAY TO HOUSE SURVIVORS.

>> IN THE BEGINNING, OUTSIDE EXPERTS SAID YOU IT APPLY A STATE MARSHAL PLAN.

GIVE EVERYBODY LIQUID ASSETS.

>> JUST GIVE THEM MONEY.

>> YEAH.

TWO DAYS' WORTH OF SPENDING, $2 MILLION.

ESPECIALLY AFTER THE FIRE, PEOPLE WOULD HAVE DONE THEIR OWN THING.

AT THAT TIME, THERE WERE NO VISITOR.

THIS HARD REOPENING DEADLINE, THAT'S THE DAMAGE IT DID.

>>Daryl: REOPENING TO TOURISM?

>> YEAH.

>>Daryl: MICHELLE, AS A PERSON IN THE TOURISM.. FEEL CAUGHT IN THE MIDDLE OF THAT ARGUMENT A LITTLE BIT?

ARE YOU WORKING NOW?

>> BECAUSE I WAS STUCK IN KAANAPALI, AND I STAYED IN KAHANA THAT NIGHT, I WAS ONE OF THE VERY FEW THAT WAS ABLE TO STILL GO TO WORK.

SO I ACTUALLY DIDN'T LOSE ANY WORK HOURS BECAUSE WE -- >>Daryl: YOU COULD PHYSICALLY GET TO THE HOTEL.

>> YEAH.

AND SO MY ACTUAL PERSONAL VIEW IS I WORK FOR THE HOTEL, AND THAT'S WHERE I THINK THE TOURISTS BELONG.

I DON'T THINK THEY REALLY BELONG IN SHORT-TERM RENTALS.

>>Daryl: YEAH.

ANOTHER COMMENT, WE TALK ABOUT WATER.

TRYING TO GET TO SOME LEVEL OF AGREEMENT OR PRIORITY.

WATER.

THE OTHER THING IS THE SHORT-TERM RENTAL THING DO YOU FEEL LIKE MAUI GOT SOLD OUT?

>> OH, DEFINITELY.

>> DEFINITELY.

>> DEFINITELY.

I MEAN WE'RE BETTER OFF DOING TIME SHARE THA..

RENTAL BECAUSE TIME SHARE, YOU GET YOUR PLACE IN ONE WEEK BLOCKS.

SHORT-TERM RENTALS, IT'S PROBABLY OWNED BY PEOPLE THAT COME FOR A MONTH BUT RENT OUT FOR 11 MONTHS AND MAKE THEIR MONEY THAT WAY.

THE MONEY DOESN'T STAY IN THE COMMUNITY.

THEY DON'T LIVE IN THE COMMUNITY.

YOU LOSE ALL OF THAT WITH SHORT-TERM RENTAL.

INSTEAD OF HOUSING PEOPLE THAT LIVE IN THE COMMUNITY AND SPEND IN THE COMMUNITY AND RAISE THEIR KIDS IN THE COMMUNITY AND TAKE CARE OF THE COMMUNITY.

>>Daryl: IT VERY MUCH SEEMS LIKE WHAT YOU'RE.. ALL SEEM TO AGREE.

THIS IS THE MOST URGENT THING THAT NEEDS TO CHANGE.

>> YEAH.

>>Daryl: IT IS THE BIG LOW-HANGING FRUIT.

SENATOR McKELVEY, WHAT ARE YOUR HOPES?

DO YOU HAVE HOPE?

>> I HAVE HOPE BECAUSE I'M THERE WITH THE SURVIVORS ELBOW TO ELBOW EVERY DAY.

OUR OFFICE HELPED HUNDREDS AND HUNDREDS OF PEOPLE.

IT'S THAT LAHAINA RESILIENCE BECAUSE WE HAVE EACH OTHER.

THAT'S WHY I FIGHT SO HARD.

THAT'S WHY I HAVE MY VERY EMOTIONAL THING AT THE WAYS AND MEANS.

THESE ARE INDIVIDUALS, THESE ARE HUMAN BEINGS.

WE CAN'T TAKE CARE OF 6,000, 7,000 PEOPLE.

WHAT DOES THAT SAY ABOUT OUR STATE AND SOCIETY.

IF THERE'S A MEGA, MEGA DISASTER, HOW CAN GOVERNMENT RESPOND?

IT'S IMPERATIVE THE GOVERNMENT GETS IT RIGHT AND PROVIDES A CLEAR, CONCISE PLAN.

LAHAINA COMMUNITY, WE'VE GONE THROUGH SEVERAL FIRES IN THE PAST.

WE'VE LOST MANY BEFORE.

WE'VE ALWAYS REBUILT TOGETHER.

WE'RE ALWAYS GOING TO HAVE A DISAGREEMENT LIK.. TABLE, BUT WE'RE LAHAINA FAMILY.

GOT TO BRING PEOPLE HOME.

>>Daryl: GREAT WAY OF ENDING THIS SHOW.

THANK YOU SO MUCH.

MAHALO FOR JOINING US.

AND WE THANK OUR GUESTS -- SENATOR ANGUS MCKELVEY FROM DISTRICT 6, ARCHIE KALEPA OF LELE ALOHA, AND MICHELLE GORDON FROM STARWOOD HOTELS AND RESORTS.

INSIGHTS IS OFF NEXT WEEK FOR A NEW KAKOU: HAWAI'I'S TOWN HALL.

WHETHER WE LIKE IT OR NOT A.I.

IS HERE TO STAY AND IT IMPACTS ALL OF OUR LIVES.

ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE: EMBRACE IT OR FEAR IT?

PLEASE JOIN US THEN.

I'M DARYL HUFF FOR INSIGHTS ON PBS HAWAI'I, A.. #