Announcer> A production of the South Carolina Educational Television Network.

♪ Mike> Determination conquers all odds.

Tonight, on Carolina Journal, an update on Michael's Story .

The story of a deaf boy's determination to make it in a hearing world and succeeding.

Also tonight, Halley's Comet is on the way, and kids in the Charleston School System are ready to meet it with a project to be launched into space with the March shuttle flight.

We'll tell you more about that and the Great Space Experiment Contest.

And contributing editor Attorney Harvey Golden continues his series on divorce.

♪ Good evening, I'm Mike Collins.

There are many things which we take for granted in our everyday lives.

It seems very normal for a boy to go to school, take notes, participate in class and carry on a normal social life.

But when you take into account that the person is deaf, what seemed insignificant becomes insurmountable.

Years ago, the prospects for building a successful life would have been very dim indeed for Michael Tecklenburg.

But in today's world, with a lot of help and a lot of work, he's making it.

We're going to meet Michael Tecklenburg in a moment, but first, to introduce him to you, we have an excerpt from an award winning documentary ETV produced several years ago about this young man.

It's called Michael's Story.

And it tells of the agonizing decision his parents made to send him far away from home to a school for the deaf in St.

Louis for intensive oral training.

This school, one of the best in the country, helped Michael to master the skills of lip reading and even talking.

Producing sounds, he has never heard.

All of that while continuing with his regular education.

Jim and Carol Spehr provided a home for Michael during his stay in Missouri, and in this excerpt from Michael's Story , Jim and Carol talk about the philosophy of mainstreaming.

And we see Michael at home with his second family while finishing college preparatory school in 1982.

> We met Michael in 1974 when we were asked whether or not we would consider taking Michael into a family environment because the school was considering mainstreaming him, the following year.

And, he has been here now eight years.

And he's grown from a cute little fifth grader into a... 18-year-old high school graduate that's on his way to college.

The process of mainstreaming- The word "mainstreaming" has been coined by some of the special education community to indicate taking some child that has special needs, a learning problem, of some type, and integrating them into a more normal environment, such as a normal classroom environment.

> Mainstreaming is a very complex problem.

There's so many considerations to be taken.

Academically, they have to have many skills, language skills, speech skills, all the skills that are necessary to fit into a classroom where they are not disruptive, and that with a minimum amount of support system they can be in quotes "One of the children in the class."

Making those decisions, you have the faculty at Saint Joseph's, and you'd have the parents' support and then most important, the student's desire to mainstream and then also the support of the faculty at the school that he's going into.

> So I went to a small school called Linda Vista.

Which helped me understand that how the class is too small, and my class has about ten people in it.

Though I was able to anticipate some of the problems that I would have, later on.

For example... I have to learn to communicate with them because I have to really figure out what, what kind of thing do they talk about.

Do they talk about sports?

I had to learn how to do that.

Do they talk about... who's... who is dating who?

Then I have to try to learn how to and then talk their language?

Because it was different.

> Michael is classified as a profoundly deaf student.

He functions more as a hard of hearing.

He does pick up some sounds.

Without his hearing aid, he does not pick up anything.

With his amplification, he can- You can call him from the other room and he will respond.

He can use a hearing amplification instrument on a telephone and pick up most of the conversation, depending on his... comfortableness with the person on the other end.

Michael has had the fortunate training in auditory training.

He's used the telephone.

His desire has increased at a great deal.

When he became, of age to date, his desire to use the phone increased 100 fold.

He used some amplification on the phone, and then if he gets into a difficult situation, then it calls on either Jim or myself.

> Well, in Michael's case, Michael is a, very excellent lip reader and generally children that have had good oral, training early, in their early years, and have some sort of amplification assistance.

The amplification will get their attention and you will also have some form of distorted, speech that they are picking up.

But the most important thing is to make sure that, that you're speaking at the individual and, trying not to over... accentuate your words.

They will pick up normal speech patterns as long as you are normal speaking... Mike> Michael's Story will air in its entirety in this timeslot on Christmas Day.

Several years have passed since that program was taped, however.

Michael Tecklenburg is now a junior at the University- That is right, a junior, right?

<Right> At the University of South Carolina.

And he is our guest in this first segment of Carolina Journal , tonight.

Michael, welcome.

Michael> Thank you.

Mike> You and I had a chance to meet at a... kind of a unlikely location at the Democratic Convention in San Francisco.

Your father is very involved.

Has been very involved for years, Henry Tecklenburg in Democratic politics.

He wasn't there.

But you and your brother were.

What did you do at the convention?

> Well, I work at the convention as a security aide and, generally, and I also had a good time.

Mike> Yeah... (laughter) we won't talk about that tonight.

We won't talk about what kind of... I want to talk a little bit about you.

Because we only saw a small excerpt from that program.

And for those who have never seen Michael's Story , they may not know your full story.

So let's capsulize that just a little bit.

How much do you actually hear?

Michael> Without my hearing aid I don't hear anything.

And with my hearing aids, I am able to pick up certain sounds and... some good background noise and it amplifies my... my hearing I have.

It also helps me distinguish between different consonants.

For example... the consonant M,P, and B all have the same lip movements.

And the hearing aid can really help me, distinguish between the different consonants.

Mike> How long did it take you to learn, how to lip read?

Michael> I only... Well... I think, it probably didn't take, really doesn't take that long, because it's the only thing that you can rely on when you first begin to, like in any test of survival you take whatever means are available.

Mike> I was, in Charleston over the weekend and ran into a, believe it or not, a group of dancers, tap dancers.

And one of the guys in that group was deaf.

But he does not speak.

He only signs.

So it was difficult for the two of us to carry on a conversation.

I had to have someone sign.

He reads lips a little bit, but I couldn't understand what he said at all without that.

You have learned to read lips and remarkably, have learned to speak.

Are you in the minority?

Are deaf people who are totally deaf- And I assume that you are, for all practical purposes, totally deaf.

Are deaf people who are in that situation in the minority, those who can actually speak?

Michael> Unfortunately, with most of the deaf people totally deaf people, do not, are not fully trained to speak.

Mike> You've never heard the sounds really have you?

Michael> No, I'm more or less imitating the sounds.

Mike> But imitating, I mean, imitating something you've never heard is remarkable.

It is remarkable.

This is called mainstreaming, is it not?

It's part of mainstream?

Michael> It's part of mainstreaming, understanding that, learning how to speak, helps you function better in a hearing society.

Mike> But that's what mainstreaming is all about, to totally function in a hearing society.

Michael> Correct.

Mike> As opposed to signing, which means you need a, you need an interpreter.

Michael> Mhm.

With sign language, you need more of a support system and with the oral option in deaf education, the chances are much better that, that person can, not only learn how to speak better, but write better and communicate.

Mike> How do you think- When I think of sentences, when I think of what I'm going to say to you, for instance, I hear what I'm going to say, by remembering what it sounded like before.

What do you hear, when you think?

Or what do you- How do you think of speech?

How do you think of the words that are coming out?

Michael> Well, when you begin, the parts of communication the content... and repetition and imitation.

So therefore, you really don't think of speaking, it becomes much more of a mechanical response.

Mike> But not only are the words there, Michael, but the inflections are there and they're right.

I can't imagine how much work it took.

I just can't imagine it.

The- You are now a junior in college and you have, you're thinking about going on to law school.

How do you, how are you able to follow what's going on in some of those big lecture halls they have over there at USC and things like that?

Michael> Well, I haven't taken that many big classes.

Fortunately, in the honors program they have smaller classes.

There much more, better for education as far as I'm concerned.

And, in most of my classes, the teacher, coached in that so I can, comprehend what they're saying, and the class is small enough that I can also follow up for the most part, what everybody else is saying.

Mike> How seriously, impaired do you think you would be if you could not speak, if you had to rely on sign language?

Michael> I don't think I would be where I am today.

There's really no question about that.

I don't think I would be able to, use the English grammar as well.

Which is very essential for a college program.

Mike> Why is it that all people who are deaf don't- if they have the ability to learn to sign, why don't they go ahead and learn to, read lips and to speak?

I know it's more difficult, but are they just not given the opportunity?

Michael> I think that's part of it, not given the opportunity.

People are not aware of it.

Even though we made much progress in terms of public awareness in the last ten years, with the very best educational program.

The expansion of the educational program.

But, for example... I was trying to say, for example early screening... which you take a child, most pediatricians do not think that, that child can be tested for hearing under the age of two.

And, when actually you can be tested just a few days after a child is born.

They're not diagnosed early enough and they're not put in the right educational format.

Mike> When did you find out, when did your parents find out that you couldn't hear?

Michael> When I was four and a half.

Mike> Were there times, and there must have been rough times, were there times along the way when you thought, "I'm never going to be able to do this?"

Michael> Not really.

Partly because I had just a wonderful support system.

My parents, the school St.

Joseph's, Carol and Jim Spehr.

There was never any doubt that I would not succeed.

Mike> This program, unfortunately, because it's live, cannot be closed captioned.

So there may be... deaf people in our viewing audience who we are excluding from, understanding this interview if they can't lip read.

And we're not taking a shot of you while you're talking, or while I'm talking.

So what would you say to their support people?

Their parents, their friends, their spouses.

What would you say to them about their situation?

What would you recommend to those people?

Michael> Well, first of all, I would recommend the, that the first option that they consider in educating a deaf child is the oral option.

And don't get me wrong, not everybody can do this.

You have to have... this child has to be motivated, you have to be patient.

You have to, be determined to do this, and you have to have a good support system, and you also have to have a good educator.

And when you miss one of those three things, it's very difficult to... do that.

But I recommend the oral approach because I think it's the best chance for a deaf person to, mainstream in society.

And by mainstreaming, it's not only good for the individual himself, in a sense that he gets a greater sense of confidence and meeting challenges and being in a hearing society.

But it also, helps society as a whole because society will be able to... will be able to, understand and appreciate those who have to overcome hurdles, to function in society.

Mike> We've been spending the whole time here talking about very serious subjects, and Michael has a wonderful sense of humor.

I want to have you back on the show and we can just talk about light and frothy things, and you can show everybody that you... because you're you're incredibly funny sometimes.

A reminder that Michael's Story , the award winning ETV documentary about how Michael Tecklenburg learned to get along as a deaf man in a hearing world, will be rebroadcast in this timeslot on Christmas Day.

Coming up on Carolina Journal , we're going to tell you about a unique science project in the Charleston School System that will allow kids all over the state to get involved in an upcoming space shuttle flight.

And contributing editor Attorney Harvey Golden continues his series on divorce, with a closer look at two critical issues, particularly for Johnny Carson, alimony and child support.

Stay with us.

♪ ♪ ♪ > ...Child support are usually paid in South Carolina by the more dominant, financially dominant spouse to the less advantaged spouse, as it applies to financial ability.

Alimony and child support are based primarily on the need of the children, child, or spouse, balanced with the financial ability to pay of the dominant financial spouse.

For instance, if the husband makes 30,000 dollars a year and the wife makes 15,000 dollars a year, the wife is- And they have one or two or three children, the wife is not, completely... let loose as far as paying something toward the child support.

But, the U.S.

Supreme Court has said very clearly that the wife needs to pay something toward it and will.

In the event it's only a question of alimony, then obviously, if the parties make the same amount of money or practically the same amount of money, there may not be any alimony.

If however, the parties historically, through a long marriage, have had a disparate, amount of income and... and one of them has only come up very recently, to the same level of income as the other then that will be accounted for.

Alimony and child support are, sometimes in some states, subject to formulas, sometimes subject to rules of thumb.

Various judges, will say, "Well, I never give more than a third or I never give more than half."

Most judges and of course, the law in most states involves, treating each case on its own merits, as in all other cases in the law.

Each case stands on its own facts, and there can be good reason to pay more or less than what we would normally consider standard.

I'm Harvey Golden, for Carolina Journal .

Mike> Thank you, Harvey Golden.

And this is normally the point in the show when we ask you to send in your slides.

We still want them, and I got a couple of sets of slides sitting on my desk, and we'll get to them.

One set is a, set of winter scenes, which we will, show when it gets a little bit colder.

And one, came along with a very nice letter about a program that we did on the USS South Carolina's visit to Charleston, about a, little less than a month ago.

And we'll show you that in the next couple of nights, the slides.

And we'll also read part of the letter for you.

When the space shuttle Columbia goes back into space in March of 1986, its cargo promises to include a canister designed to carry a set of experiments created by a group of Charleston school students and some other experiments, yet to be selected from submissions by students from throughout South Carolina.

Although the shuttle flight is still more than a year away, that particular flight is a year away.

The deadline for the submission of experiment proposals is fast approaching, December 20th.

We'll give you the address to send in your proposals in a second.

Tonight, we've invited a couple of the masterminds behind this exciting project to be with us.

Dr.

William Kubinec is the Chairman of the physics department at the College of Charleston, and Nicholas Drake is an education consultant working with the "CAN DO" project.

The name given to this plan to... participate in the shuttle flight in March of 1986.

Gentlemen, welcome.

Nicholas> Hi.

How are you doing?

Mike> I'm fine.

The miracles of modern technology almost didn't have you with us here.

I want you to know it was touch and go all the way.

But here you are.

And we're going to talk about the "CAN DO" project.

We certainly did it tonight, didn't we?

> Yeah.

That's right.

Mike> Dr.

Kubinec, let's talk about this project.

It was sort of your brainchild.

You're the one that was responsible for writing to NASA in the first place, right?

Dr.

Kubinec> Well, yeah, it's really a long, almost a soap opera kind of story.

But roughly three years ago, Charles Trainor, middle school science teacher and I were doing some things with NASA and, quite unbeknownst to us, the Director of Langley Research Center came down and during a dinner speech, just laid this opportunity on us.

Mike> That opportunity being?

Dr.

Kubinec> Donated the use of the what's called a "getaway special canister" to the Charleston County School System.

Mike> Now... this is unique in several, several different ways because I understand it was absolutely free.

And that's something that's never done or hasn't been done before.

Is that correct?

Dr.

Kubinec> Not very often.

That's right.

Yes, indeed.

Yes.

Mike> Just so we can get an idea of what this canister is like and how much it cost, let's talk about that for a second.

Dr.

Kubinec> All right.

The canister is... about that big, roughly 20 inches in diameter.

And about so high, it's five cubic feet of space and ours has a door that opens on top.

And the price for the use of the canister and the door is 18,000 dollars.

Mike> Good Lord.

Now, Nicholas Drake, you're involved in one aspect of this canister, and I believe it's the photography of Halley's Comet.

Nicholas> No, actually, to clarify that for a second.

Dr.

Kubinec and I came up with this wild idea to expand the educational end of it with the children, because the design team, discovered they had some extra room leftover in the canister, for other experiments other than the Halley's Comet photography experiment.

So we designed the contest, and we've been going into the school systems, and we've been talking to the kids, doing experiments and giving them the idea that science is fun.

And explaining to them the history of the space program, what the space program is doing now.

And because that the space shuttle is reusable and makes, which makes space technology cheaper, that we can now afford to take their experiments and put them into space.

Mike> You've been out in the school system.

So tell me what kind of ideas these kids have been telling you, personally.

You don't have to give away any deep, dark secrets about submissions that have been coming in from elsewhere.

But what have they been telling you personally?

Nicholas> They've... they run the gamut.

One of them, which would be a sort of an interesting, particular sort of idea, is the idea of taking a radio FM radio receiver with a recorder on it and putting it inside the canister to see what could be recorded in outer space as the shuttle is orbiting.

Which is- Mike> Are we trying to pick up Earth FM stations or just FM audio from someplace else.

Nicholas> Well, that's as far as these three little kids, I think they were about eighth graders.

A group of them walked up to Dr.

Kubinec and myself and they said, "Hey, you know, we've got this idea.

How does this sound?"

So they run from that.

And that's a fairly decent idea.

The other ones run to anything, Like, "What would happen if I put, if I scratched ink on a piece of paper, and put it up there?"

So, I mean, there's a difference in the level of sophistication, but the whole purpose is an educational one, which is to get the kids thinking about what it's like in space.

Mike> Dr.

Kubinec, we don't have much time left.

But I would like to know what age groups you're specifically looking for in terms of who should, become part of this contest by December 20th?

Dr.

Kubinec> The, contest is running in the middle schools of the Charleston County School System.

And hopefully, we'll get all kinds of proposals from the students.

We hope it will wind up being a very tough job to pick these, several extra experiments to fly along as we photograph Halley's Comet.

Mike> Suppose somebody in the Spartanburg School System or the Columbia School System from watching this show, has a great idea.

What, could they write you?

Dr.

Kubinec> Yes.

We'd really like them to write us.

They could write me at the College of Charleston.

Mike> We also have this address, that they could write to, I do believe.

I think we're going to put it up on the screen now, which is, there it is.

Marcee Day at the Charleston County School District Three Chisolm Street in Charleston, South Carolina.

You have to have them in by December 20th.

Right?

Dr.

Kubinec> Right.

Yes, indeed.

Mike> Dr.

Kubinec and Nicholas Drake thank you for being with us.

Time is short and sweet, but I think we got the information out.

Coming up tomorrow night on Carolina Journal, The 50th anniversary of the Great Smoky National Park was the occasion for concerned Environmentalist to conduct a conference on the management of our remaining natural resources.

We'll take you to Gatlinburg, Tennessee, to tell you more about this conference on Biosphere Reserves and some ideas about our future.

And contributing editor Steve Hamm will have some consumer tips, while Bob Blimey has some holiday travel suggestions in store for you too.

Thank you for watching.

Good night.

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