- Perfect is very subjective.

I try not to think too much about perfect.

If I'm close, I'm, I'm okay with that because ultimately it's the image.

It's the image of someone really excited and throwing up their arm.

That's gonna be a really powerful picture.

If it's a little bit off or if it's not, it's still a powerful picture.

And that's what I try to keep in mind.

The perfect part of it is, is when you print it, you know, does it look good when you print it, is it overall too muddy or does it have good tonality?

That's what I'm, I'm kind of looking for.

So yes, it has.

I used to be a lot more particular when you'd print in the dark room and you'd print, you know, a picture 20 times.

When I was in college a long time ago, my professor had photographed a couple derbies in Miami, and since then I've been fascinated with it.

It's very dangerous.

I mean, cars are hitting each other.

They're wearing helmets and ne neck braces.

They have rules to protect them, but it is dangerous.

- It's just like chaos, illegal way to reckon to other cars and still enjoy it.

- A driver that I root for the most is probably Andy.

Andy Anderson.

He is a local firefighter, retired navy.

- I get a lot of questions from my family in Spain.

They'll like Facebook message me and be like, Hey, like what do you do?

You don't get hurt.

- Andy's a really nice guy.

I know his wife, his family.

I always thought he was a crazy guy and just, you know, 'cause he'd win and he would be like, so unassuming.

- My dad derby when I was a little kid and I've always wanted to do it.

And then when I was in the military, I got stationed here and one day I was sitting around, I was like, I wanna build a derby car.

And I built it and it just, it was like from there on I was good.

A lot of people just go out there, like you said, they think it's just, oh, go, go, go.

Crash, crash, crash.

You know, destroy your car.

But it's not about that.

It's where you put the car, how you put the car when you make your hits, make all your hits count.

- Several favorite moments.

When, when I'm photographing Andy, my friend driver, and when he wins, that's always exciting.

- The more calm you are, the better driver you are.

Even before a derby, before I'll run like a lot of people around talking and everything else.

Help Michael tell you, I'll go sit in the car by myself and be like, Hey, leave me alone.

Let me sit in the car by myself.

Let me my zone - And photographing it can be dangerous.

I'm pretty close.

I I don't use big long tail photo lenses when I'm photographing.

You kind of want to be calm.

I think that's a similarity.

Yeah.

'cause if you get too excited because of what's happening in front of you, it's hard to concentrate and make good pictures, like good framing.

It's like if somebody is just wins a derby and they're jumping on the car and, and, and you know, screaming, you might not see, you know, a little boy in front of the car that's, you know, looking at the driver in, in awe.

So you kind of have to remain calm so you can see the whole picture of how things might not be right in front of you.

- Biggest difference, - I don't put myself in danger.

I, a lot of times I get hit with mud because the tire spin and, and it just shoots it out.

- I could see my driveway's just covered in mud.

Especially when like the derby that are in the Red Clay that the clay is so bad it just sticks everywhere and it stains everything and then when it rains it just plugs everything up.

It's just, oh, it's horrible.

- I find that, you know, the mud kind of gets everywhere and that, that, to me, those little details are more interesting than the smashing.

- When you're in the car, it's, it's complete chaos.

You're just worried about other cars and doing other things.

So when I see his pictures I'm like, wow, I didn't know I did that.

Or I didn't know I, I had that angle on that person or other things.

So it's, it's actually helped out a lot.

- It is mixed gender.

There are many women that drive.

This is Renee and she had won the Mad Dog Trophy and the Mad Dog is the most aggressive driver.

You've won that before though?

- I've actually, yeah, I've won, I've won a couple Mad Dogs.

I actually won of the biggest shows, it's called B for Cash up in Ohio and I got a Mad Dog there one year.

So that's, I think that's one of my best trophies.

- Andy always asks me if I want to drive and I really don't have a desire to be out there.

I'm fine just watching it.

- I actually have tried to get Mike into a car.

He tells me no, he tells me I'm crazy actually.

'cause he does a lot for me.

You know, I love the guy.

He takes pictures.

He lets me see it from a different angle, so I'm always like, Hey Mike, I'll let you drive a car.

And he's like, no, no.

I was like, come on, Mike.

- Being a good photographer is, I think just taking yourself and your work seriously.

I don't change anything around.

I don't manipulate anything.

They are as authentic as I can make them.

Sometimes I use a, a light and, and light someone's face, but most of the time it's natural light.

But it's such an unusual event that, that you really don't have to do anything to make it look more interesting.

And they're out smashing up cars, so they're really, they're not thinking about, you know, how they look or their hair or if their shirt, I mean, they're usually mechanics and you know, they're greasy because they're working on the cars.

They don't think about that stuff, how they look or how they're presented at all.

They're just real people doing something that's really crazy Sometimes - My home track, which would be in South Oak at the Peanut Festival, that's, that's probably my all time favorite track just because it's home and it's close, my family can go see me there.

And I've done really, really well At the Peanut Festival, - The best people to photograph are the ones that are natural and authentic.