(intriguing groovy upbeat music) Hey there, welcome to "Monograph."

(laughs) Hey there, I'm your host, Jennifer Wallace Fields.

We've been doing this show for so long now that we've decided it's time to catch up with some old friends.

Byron Sonnier was featured in our very first season seven years ago.

I paid a visit to his home studio to see what he's been up to.

But, first, let's have a little refresher on his original segment.

(mellow enchanting rock guitar music) I started doing art, it really just came from graffiti.

Got into skateboarding, punk rock, and all that stuff in my teen years, and I started writing graffiti, and that just took over my life.

With graffiti, there's a lot of rules within in the subculture, but part of it is breaking rules too, and it's just constantly evolving.

That part of it has always helped me not get stuck in a rut with like certain, like, "Okay, I see this thing, I wanna bend it this way, I wanna put my own spin on it."

Everything I do has to do with the landscape or stuff I see out back roads.

Graffiti led me to find a lot of abandoned places and train yards, and we were constantly traveling back roads to try to find spots to paint.

And so, you're always like looking out the window, like, looking at different things, and then somewhere along the way, like churches started catching my eye.

And the South is completely full of religion, it's everywhere, so I wanted to show that, but not exploit it.

(mellow enchanting rock guitar music) I used to be super into this shape of revival tents, I just love the way they look, and I realized that revival tents looked just like these firework tents that we have down in Louisiana, like the tent is just like such this cool shape.

And I never was drawn to like the cross at all, even though I grew up like in a Catholic family and all that kinda stuff.

I never really noticed that symbol too much until it just... I think I ran out things to look at, and I was like, "Oh my God, the cross is everywhere."

And it's really hard for me to paint anything without it now.

I think I use the cross a lot because people relate to that being good or bad, and I've never had anyone look at it and go, you know, "Why are you painting this?"

Like, it's a universal symbol that I think people embrace for whatever reason, even if they're like not into religion, that somewhere deep inside, they, like, are drawn to that.

(mellow upbeat rock music) So I have like this little library of different characters and different shapes and stuff.

I'm not the kind of person that just sits down and doodles or draws.

I'm more interested in putting objects together and how they fit in more of a design way.

When I finally do doodle and create a character, it'll stay exactly the same throughout the entire process.

So like every piece is literally the same little person, or animal, fire, every little piece like that is the same.

So I just rearrange them.

(intriguing mellow upbeat rock guitar music) One of my favorite concepts in art or music is how people create a myth about them.

Like, going back to graffiti, that's the same thing, like, you just create this like persona that is so much bigger than you are, it's like this name.

And people, you know, put together all these thoughts about who you are and what it is and no one knows what you look like, and you just created this thing, and I've always wanted my art to have that feel.

(intriguing mellow upbeat rock guitar music) I don't know, growing up Cajun, it's like you craft and, you know, like you're a man, and you're supposed to like fish and hunt and build and all that stuff.

So, I do try to approach my art in that way a little bit, like, "Okay, I can build this, like, I can put this together, you know?

We're like MacGyver," you know, like... (chuckles) My grandmother, you know, knitted and crocheted and all that stuff, like, she was always working on something.

I definitely got that, like, productive gene from them, like, you just always have to be doing something.

You don't just sit around.

Yeah, putting work out, that's a complicated situation, because a lot of times, especially when you work is personal, it's almost just like letting a balloon go, like, as a kid it is like very exciting, like, "Cool, there it goes," but you're like, "Wait, like, I want that back.

I shouldn't have let that go, like, what are people gonna think," you know?

And whenever I set up a show, like, I get really excited about it, and then, like, before I step in, I'm always like, "Oh my God, what did I just do?

Like, what is this?

Like, you know, like, how how do I back this up?"

So, yeah, it's scary but it's also very exciting.

(intriguing mellow upbeat rock guitar music) -Hey, Byron.

-Hello.

[Jennifer] How are you?

Doing great.

So what have you been up to lately?

I always got some project going on, probably have five or six going on at one time.

Latest thing I've been doing is compiling a zine of all of my religious ephemera and different things I've been collecting.

I'm gonna try to have that done by the end of the year.

-Cool.

-And it's gonna be in two volumes, 'cause I have so much stuff.

Yeah.

So what would you say has been inspiring you creatively lately?

I have dwelled into music a lot, like, that's kind of like taken over a lot of my creative energy.

But that also came from collecting religious tapes, the little cassettes and all that.

And that's where, like, originally, I wanted to make electronic music, but I wanted to... I didn't think I could sing, I would be able to, so I was like, "I'll take these tapes, take samples out of it, and put these songs together."

So that kind of started that going.

And then, I realized I could possibly sing if I disguise my voice through a machine or something, so I started doing that.

♪ We dance away our misery ♪ What has been the most surprising, either good or bad, feedback that you've gotten from some of your new musical endeavors?

I mean, there's definitely been some crowds that are not sure what is happening.

(Byron and Jennifer laughing) But I have learned that there's always gonna be people in the crowd that you can talk to in a way, and, you know, right now, it's like the goths.

Yeah, finding that connection.

I'm curious, what would you say that past Byron would be most surprised about with present Byron?

Definitely singing, 100%, like that is... No way.

I mean, I've done background vocals or whatever, you know, in a band, but not just like by myself singing songs.

In that same vein, is there anything that, looking forward, like if we came back in another five or six years, is there any area that you would've hoped to dig into more or explore or be surprised by?

I definitely wanna push art a little more, and, you know, and I hopefully record more music.

I mean, I have all this stuff to do it, I'm just... You know, it's hard to put it out there -when it's just you.

-Yeah.

-Right.

-So I would like to be better about it because I have a lot of things to show and I just need to like, "Hey, here it is."

[Jennifer] In Season 2, we met Montgomery photographer, Sydney A. Foster, just as her career was beginning to accelerate.

Things have really taken off for her since then, and it was a joy to have her chat with me at my house about how she's grown and evolved.

Before we get to that though, let's take a look at her piece from Season 2.

(vocalists vocalizing) My name is Sydney A. Foster, I'm a photographer based in Montgomery, Alabama.

I like to bridge the gap, bring people together, that's what I'm good at.

(vocalists vocalizing) The main scope of my work is, of course, Black culture, African-American culture, to capture the rawness of people.

You know, though I shoot fashion, I have side projects that enable me to see the real life of people, and it could be like how somebody wears their hair, a certain type of clothes they wear, or their nose, or their mouth, just the essence of people.

I'm in the process now of bringing people together from all walks of life to just do experimental things or non-conservative things, or really the unorthodox that Alabama is not used to, right?

Make people think thought-provoking things, but to create positivity and unity, just make people realize like, "Hey, we can all get along, we can all create, and we can respect one another in the midst of all of that."

-(vocalists vocalizing) -(enchanting orchestral music) What I found about Montgomery in particular, like we don't know who we are, you know, because we've been silenced no matter what your race is, but in particular African-American people, we've been silenced, so our self-esteem is not where it could be, so we don't think we're worthy enough, or we don't think we're great enough to produce the type of work we want to produce.

No, we're gonna embrace it and we're gonna show it to the public and make them embrace it too and challenge their way of thinking.

-(vocalists vocalizing) -(enchanting orchestral music) When you're young, you want things to like stimulate you, you know, you wanna be able to go like, "Oh my gosh, wow, this is in Montgomery, like, this is cool art, like, look at the shape of this.

This is making me feel this way, this is so bold and it's out there.'

What are we scared for?

What are we waiting for?

People are coming from all over the world to come to Alabama, specifically, Montgomery, so let's give 'em some of that, and we can do it and be tasteful, we don't have to disrespect people, but we gotta do it.

(vocalists vocalizing) We're like a block away from the Equal Justice initiative Lynching Memorial.

How dare you have that up five, six years ago, you know?

We try to run from the truth here, I feel like, and we can't, 'cause we have to embrace it and we have to talk about it and see it for face value and don't run away, because we can mend those like broken times of trauma.

We can, but it takes some time to get Caucasian people to think about how Black people really feel like when they're silenced.

And it's not to put another race down, or to continue to cause friction or tension, it's just about seeing it from a different perspective.

-(vocalists vocalizing) -(enchanting orchestral music) Art is so important, just the correlation of human behavior and art, and how it shifts the way we think is amazing.

But I think it is an important role to communicate messages because it challenges human behavior and the way we think or see things, because if I'm just telling you like, "Hey, I don't like this, this is the way you make me feel," you might not get it, but if you can see it illustrated, or see it depicted from a visual or a sound perspective beyond just me talking to you, or just merging all of the senses together, and it being projected to you in a different way, you might then be like, "Oh, dang, that's how it felt."

-(vocalists vocalizing) -(enchanting orchestral music) You have to be open-minded to give it a shot, because art tells a story that sometimes you can't tell with your mouth.

-(vocalists vocalizing) -(enchanting orchestral music) Hey, Sydney.

What it do?

-(Jennifer chuckles) -What's up, Jen?

I am so thankful to have this opportunity to catch up with you and hang out.

It's been a long time.

[Jennifer] It has been.

So much has happened.

Well, let's just start there.

What have you been up to lately?

I would say my biggest project right now is like returning back to myself, and whatever that means.

I spend a lot of time in the woods, in the nature, sitting in grass.

And, right now, I'm working on this project called "Pray the Gay Away."

This project is crazy.

I didn't think I was gonna be exploring my family lineage from a art project, like, that's not something that has been on my radar, but I'm not just taking pictures anymore.

So, I know that you have accomplished so much- -Yeah.

-Since your last "Monograph."

Would you be able to just give us some of the highlights or like some key milestones that you've accomplished in your journey?

Well, I survived Atlanta.

And while I was there, I've like worked with some of the best in the best in Hollywood.

I found myself working in the costume department of a show, and then from there, I got to work with Dior in Paris for Fashion Week.

-Wow.

-That was like, I couldn't believe I was there, you know?

Do you feel like there's anything that your younger self needs to hear now from you and where you are?

Dang, you would ask me that question.

(Jennifer chuckles) Yeah, I would tell my younger self like, "Keep being eccentric, like, you don't have to hide.

Say what you need to say, you're not gonna get in trouble, and just keep creating.

And, like, even when you're embarrassed, like forgive yourself to keep going, like, begin again.

Who's gonna stop you?

You know, it's like you're a phoenix."

Well, my younger self didn't know what that meant then, but like now it's like "You're a phoenix."

Yeah, "You can do hard things."

Yeah.

That's solid advice.

Yeah.

Please don't cry, we just started.

(Jennifer laughing) I'm not ready to cry yet.

Yeah.

Do you feel like as you've moved into this place of like more authenticity, that it has changed who you're able to reach, like the people, your audience, I guess?

I moved back to Alabama, and like in that return of moving back to Alabama, I feel like my most authentic self.

The cliche is like, "Be yourself so that your people can find you," I finally feel like, because I am like just being myself, my art can heal people that it needed to find, you know?

I agree.

It's hugely important for artists from Alabama to stay here, come back here, be here- -Yeah.

-And be exactly who you are here- [Sydney] Yeah.

So, like you say, other people can find you.

[Sydney] Yeah.

What is something that you have coming up that you're super excited about?

Mm... Ooh, what do I have coming up that I'm super excited about?

I have noticed that people need a lot more care, and I've like spontaneously started this collective called ART PAYS US, and it's just for the artists, and it's just a way to like show them that I love them, but also like be human capital to say like, "Hey, I might know the answer, I might know some people," or, "Hey, I see you've been working a lot, maybe we should go sit in some grass."

That's something that's on my radar, but really just continuing to develop this new art project, "Pray the Gay Away," is something that I never would've thought that somebody would say, "Yeah, let's give her the funds," or, like, "Let's encourage her to do this thing."

[Jennifer] Yeah.

Art takes a long time to make, you know?

Yeah.

A long time.

-Yeah.

-Yeah.

Some might say your whole life.

It does take your whole life, yeah.

Do you say that?

I do say that.

Yeah, you're right.

A lot of times people ask, "How long did it take you to make this?"

And my answer is "My whole life."

-Yeah.

-Because everything that you experience and process, you synthesize and create your artwork and- -Yeah.

-You couldn't have made what you made without one single step along the way.

Yeah, that's so true.

It all adds up.

Well, I can't wait to see the final project.

No pressure.

No pressure- -Yeah.

-But also I'm just here for the journey to like see you go through that and create that and become.

Thank you, Jen.

If I call you crying, it's because I probably quit, and I need you to say, "Don't quit."

I will.

-(Jennifer laughing) -All right.

-I got you.

-(Jennifer and Sydney laughing) Yeah.

Well, on that note, I see that you have been working a lot, and maybe we should go hug one of my favorite trees.

You know, I'd love that.

-Okay.

-Let's do it.

(mellow orchestral upbeat music) [Jennifer] Let's hug.

To close out our walk down memory lane, here's a conversation our old pal and host Jackie Clay had with Jenny Fine in Dothan at the Wiregrass Museum at the beginning of Season 2.

Afterwards, we'll see what Jenny's been up to lately.

[Jenny] They do a lot of workshops here with children.

You know, I'm from, like, 30 minutes down the road.

[Jackie] Where's that?

[Jenny] Enterprise, it's just down the road.

Mm-hmm.

Grew up there.

And we would come here on field trips, this is the closest museum around.

And I came up here as a kid and did art projects.

What's cool is that now, the kids are doing projects inspired by the work I've done down in the gallery.

-Mm-hmm.

-That's awesome.

The other day they made these underwater seascapes after they went downstairs, into the installation.

What did they do?

How did they make the seascapes?

The education person does 'em.

[Jackie] Mm-hmm.

And so, it was a project that she came up with, and so, then the kids gotta kind of make their own imaginary seascapes.

The kids were like beaming.

It's just really cool though to see that and to see them on the stairs holding their picture up on Instagram of their seascape that they made, and like remembering that I walked up those stairs, and... Anyway, it's just interesting that it's full circle.

So this museum was an influence on your practice.

[Jenny] Yeah.

And now you're shaping new artists -in practice.

-Yeah, totally.

And Dana and the team here are very supportive.

She just trusted the vision before she could really even see anything.

I don't know, I think that that thing is kind of rare, especially around here.

And so, yeah, totally, totally.

I think part of that being called back home and feeling like I needed to move home maybe is the spirit of this place too, who knows?

(mellow enchanting orchestral music) So, you said you love oysters, -don't you?

-That is true, yes.

(Jenny chuckles) I have a little surprise for you.

-(Jackie chuckles) -Let's go over here.

Okay.

Oh, what... (Jackie laughing) (Jenny chuckles) So, you know, I made some oyster costumes.

I just realized, yes.

Do you wanna wear one?

I do.

(laughs) Great.

Let's do it.

Takes a little bit of finagling.

You gotta dive in.

(Jackie laughing) It's like being born.

-Yeah.

-(Jackie chuckles) All right.

[Jackie] I feel like I'm in my truest form.

(Jenny chuckles) [Jenny] Hmm... There you go.

[Jackie] This is pretty cool.

You did a good job.

[Jenny] Thanks.

You look good in there.

[Jackie] I feel good in here.

(Jackie and Jenny chuckling) (enchanting mellow orchestral music) I'm Jenny Fine and I'm an artist.

I am definitely a hoarder in some ways, you know, but I think I'm more of a collector, you know?

I tend to like see or find materials, and if I find the material beautiful, or that I think, "Oh, this could be used to create a coral reef or something," then I will drag out my trailer and go pick it up off the side of the road.

I began studying photography after I took a break from school.

I was very lost, I didn't know what I wanted to do.

The opportunity to move to China came up, and so, I went.

And before I left, my mom bought me a 35-millimeter camera.

The camera was my closest ally during that time.

And I began to really love photography and its ability to capture the outside world.

And so, I came back to the University of Alabama and began studying photography with Gay Burke.

But I would always talk to her about how the photograph wasn't enough.

I was really interested in photographing people, like, I wanted the body in the image.

And so, I would often take my grandmother out with me.

And so, as I was working with the focus and the aperture and the shutter speed and ISO and all of that, she would be telling me stories, so it's sort of mythology around who I come from.

And so, I began to then try to use my family to reenact these sort of family narratives.

And it made it easier for us to pretend to be ourselves.

Like, my family, you know, the relationships are very challenging, you know, and complicated, which in a lot of ways I think just really mirrors the culture that we find ourselves in.

Anyway.

So she passed away, so those images are actually the last living images of my grandmother.

And it goes back to that whole like the photograph as a stand-in where the photograph becomes presence and absence at the same time.

And so, I began to think about ways in which I could create photographic atmospheres that she could be placed within, and then I started thinking about "How can I reverse the camera's crop and add space and time to the photograph?"

And so, then I started thinking about creating her photograph as a costume.

That sort of became the impetus or the birth of Flat Granny, because I thought this was a really wonderful way to be able to continue collaborating with her beyond death.

As my grandmother got older, she started to have dementia.

So she lost a lot of her recent memory, but she remembered a lot of her history.

In 1968, she was Woman of the Year, and you ride a parade float down Main Street.

And in the middle of Main Street in my hometown is the Boll Weevil Monument.

And I just thought that was a really interesting story, but it also was this idea of a moving image, this parade float moving through this procession.

And so, I created the landscape of my dad's field in cotton.

So it was really about what was going on around me and my history, but also I began to gain other perspectives of the boll weevil, and how it is a way of whitewashing and erasing the very important work that George Washington Carver did traveling through all of these counties.

The history of the boll weevil that I have been told growing up is that the boll weevil came and it destroyed the cotton, and so, somebody got a great idea to switch over to peanuts.

So I learned a lot from this narrative.

I learned a lot, and I'm still learning a lot from it.

-(vocalists vocalizing) -(ethereal music) The Synchronized Swimmers came from my experience of swimming in my grandmother's pool in her backyard, and that was Grandmother Fine's house.

The rain would come and she would come up and tell us to get out of the water, and we'd go get under the safety of the metal umbrella, (laughs) and then she would tell us stories.

And, again, she was a teacher, really, teaching was very seamless for her.

The stories that she told us were often stories from history, and they were often pretty dark stories, like, she would often tell us about swimming witches and travel by water, she taught us about Odysseus and the Sirens.

And so, I started thinking about these ideas and themes of women in water.

And so, I would start dreaming, I was in like her pool, and I would, like, swim, and as I got deeper, it would turn into like, underwater, the ocean or whatever.

Anyway, and that was sort of a repetitive dream over time.

I knew Flat Granny was gonna be in the image, and I also wanted Granny Caldwell.

And so, I started thinking about the Sirens, and when Odysseus passed by, and they were unable to lure him in, I was like, "Well, what happened to them?"

And I think that they're on the bottom of the ocean floor eating hot dogs, (laughs) that's just what I think.

(laughs) -(vocalists vocalizing) -(ethereal music) But, anyway, long story short, I decided that I wanted to create something that I had personally, within my body experience, I started working with a narrative of water, and then my sister died.

She was one of the girls that would swim with us.

And I made these three oysters, 'cause I'm the middle of two girls, and so, like, one of the oysters died.

And so, I don't know, it's evolved.

At the show at Alabama School of Fine Arts, one of the oysters was on its side with these legs, these tape-cast legs of my legs.

So she, instead of being a performing oyster, she just laid in the scene or whatever.

And I didn't realize I was doing that until it's done, you know?

And that's how a lot of my work is, like, it happens really intuitively.

I made, I learned, and so, I crossed them.

[Crew Member] Oh wow.

And you couldn't see this at the time, but... Anyway, all to say, the work has turned into a lot about care and who gets it and who doesn't get it, who deserves it.

-(vocalists vocalizing) -(intriguing orchestral music) It rounds out a very complicated narrative.

And being able to tell stories from a small community, American stories, that inform the larger understanding of the South, which, as Imani Perry says, is the soul of the nation.

The more that we can tell, the more that we can understand who we are, and change what we don't like.

(enchanting bright instrumental music) (enchanting bright instrumental music continues) (vocalists vocalizing)