>> THE LES WEXNER CONNECTION IS BROUGHT UP ON CAPITOL HILL AND WILL THE NATIONAL GUARD HAD TWO MORE CITIES AFTER DC?

>>WELCOME TO COLUMBUS ON THERECORD.

I'M AMY JURAVICH, HOST ALLSIDES ON 89 POINT SEVEN NPR NEWS AND I'M SITTING IN FOR MIKE THOMPSON.

AS PRESSURE MOUNTS FOR ALL OFTHE JEFFREY EPSTEIN FILES TO BERELEASED, AN ABUSE SURVIVORSTOOD OUTSIDE ON CAPITOL HILLLAST WEEKEND ENJOYED INVOKEDTHE NAME OF OHIO'SRICHEST MAN .

ANTIVIRUSES LES WEXNER SUPPLIEDENORMOUS AMOUNTS OF EPSTEIN'SWEALTH, AND AS SUCH, SHE TOLDREPORTERS THAT HE SHOULD FACERAMIFICATIONS.

>> I JUST WANT TO SAY ONE THINGVERY CLEAR.

WHEN PEOPLE SAY PLEASE SHARENAMES, THERE ARE NAMES THAT AREVERY WELLKNOWN LIKE THAT OFLES WEXNER, WHO EVERYONE KNOWSSUPPLIES AN ENORMOUS AMOUNT OFEPSTEIN'S FINANCIAL WEALTH ANDALLOWED HIS OPERATION TOHAPPEN, SO IT'S CONFUSING TOMANY OF US WHY THERE HAVE NOTBEEN MORE RAMIFICATIONS FOR HIMAND HE WAS A VICTIMWHENCLEARLY I BELIEVE THERE'S MORETO IT.

>> IT IS IMPORTANT TO POINT OUTTHAT WEXNER HAS NOT BEENCHARGED WITH ANY CRIME OR TIEDTO THE SEX TRAFFICKING CHARGESTHAT LANDED EPSTEIN INJAIL,BUT THIS PRESS CONFERENCE WASSIGNIFICANT IN THE FACT THATWEXNER'S NAME CAME UP.

IS IT SOMETHING TO MAKE ACOMMENT ABOUT?

WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT THESECOMMENTS MADE ABOUT LES WEXNER?

>> I THINK THERE HAS BEEN ALOT OF PEOPLE TYING WEXNER TOEPSTEIN FOR QUITE SOME TIME,AND THERE'S BEEN A LOT OFREPORTING TO THAT EFFECT.

FOR EXAMPLE, WEXNER GAVEEPSTEIN HIS POWER OFATTORNEY.

THERE WAS A POINT WHERE EPSTEINWAS THE ONLY CLIENT FOR MR. WEXNER AND WEXNER, WHOOBVIOUSLY IS A VERY FINANCIALLYSOUND PERSON IN OHIO, LIKE YOUSAID, THERICHEST PERSON, WASCERTAINLY CONTRIBUTED TO THEFINANCES OF MR. EPSTEIN.

THERE WAS ALSO THE WALL STREETJOURNAL REPORT ABOUT THISBIRTHDAY CARD FOR EPSTEIN, ALSOINCLUDED A NOTE FROM MR. WEXNER, SO THE NAME DOES POP UPBECAUSE OF THEIR SIMILARCIRCUMSTANCES.

WEXNER HAS SAID THAT HE CUTTIES WITH EPSTEIN AFTER CHARGESWERE BROUGHT OF HIM ABUSING A14-YEAR-OLD GIRL,AND SO,THAT'S KIND OF WHERE WE STANDRIGHT NOW.

>> YEAH, AND EPSTEIN WASWEXNER'S MONEY MANAGER INTHE'80S.

HE HAD A LOT OF POWER OVER ALLOF WEXNER'S MONEY ANDINVESTMENTS.

HE SAYS HE SUFFERED TIES IN2007, WHEN ALL OF THE SEX CRIMEALLEGATIONS SURFACED, BUT WHATANNIE PARKER WAS SAYING IN THATCLIP WHENEVER IT'S SAID WEXNERIS SEEN AS IF IT HIM, THAT'SMONEY RELATED HE LOSTMONEY,WEXNER LOST MONEY BECAUSEOFEPSTEIN.

SO JAKE, WHAT DO YOU MAKE OFTHIS STORY?

BECAUSE IT OBVIOUSLY HAS SOMEFROMOHIO TIES.

WEXNER'S NAME IS ON A LOT OFBUILDINGS, INCLUDING OHIO STATEMEDICAL CENTER.

DO YOU THINK THAT SOMENONPROFITS AT SOME POINT WILLSTART THINKING ABOUT CUTTINGTIES WITH WEXNER?

>> I DON'TKNOW ENOUGH WILL DO.

I JUST THINK OF THE ASSOCIATIONREALLY ENTERS NO EVIDENCE THATI'M AWARE OF, AT LEAST, THATWAS WEXNER HAS CREATED ANY SORTOF CRIMES BUT CLEARLY HE'STAKEN ON A LOT OFREPUTATIONALDAMAGE.

WE ARE ALL IN THE MEDIA TALKINGABOUT HIM.

YOU GOOGLE HIS NAME AND JEFFREYEPSTEIN ARTICLES,.

I DON'T KNOW TO WHATEXTENTTHESE NONPROFITS DEFINITIONDRIVE PAST NATIONWIDE, USINGTHE ABIGAIL WEXNER BUILDING.

IS JUST PLASTERED ALL OVER THECITY.

TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION, IDON'T KNOW EXACTLY WHAT ANONPROFIT MIGHT BUTI THINK THEMORE, YOU JUST SAID ITYOURSELF, IT'S COMING UP ONCAPITOL HILL, IT'S COMING OUTOF THE NATION'S CAPITAL.

I THINK HE'S REALLY TIED TOTHIS ONE, WHETHER HE EXIT WERENOT.

>> SARAH, POLITICALLY THIS ISONE ISSUE THAT FRUMP IS FACINGFLAK ABOUT WITHIN HIS PARTY.

THERE AREDEFINITELY PEOPLE ONBOTH SIDES OF THE AISLE,THERE'S DEFINITELY REPUBLICANSCALLING FOR THE RELEASE OF THEEPSTEIN FILES.

>> I BELIEVE THAT INCLUDESREPRESENTATIVE MAX MILLER, WHOOF COURSE, HEWAS A FROM PAIDAND IS A BIG SUPPORTER OFTRUMP.

I BELIEVE IS ONE OF THE FEWREPUBLICANS WHO'S BEEN CALLINGFOR THE RELEASE BUT ITCERTAINLY HAS BEEN INTERESTINGTO WATCH THE POLITICS BECAUSEYOU'VE SEEN A FEW REPUBLICANS,CONSERVATIVEFIREBRAN DS, COMEOUT AND SAY, THIS IS WHAT WEWERE CALLING FOR ALL ALONG.

TRUMP HAS DEFINITELY IN RECENTMONTHS TRIED TO DIVERTATTENTION AWAY FROM THEEPSTEINSTORY EVERY TIME SOMETHINGBREAKS WITH EPSTEIN.

YOU SEE SOME OTHERSORT OF [INAUDIBLE ] ON TRUMP'S PART.

SO I THINK A LOT OF ANALYSTSWILL TELL YOU THAT'S DIFFERS.

SOME OTHER PEOPLE WILL SAY IT'SNOT A DIVERSION BUT I DON'TKNOW.

I MEAN IT'S DEFINITELY --IDON'T KNOW THAT WHEN VOTERS GOTO THE BALLOT IN 2026, DURINGTHEMIDTERM, THEY'REVOTINGLIKE NUMBER ONE ON EPSTEIN.

I DON'T KNOW THAT THAT HAS THATSORT OF POLITICAL RAMIFICATION,I THINK PEOPLE PARTICULARLYFOLKS ON THE RIGHT WHO HAVE PUTA LOT OF EFFORT INTO CALLINGFOR THE RELEASE OF THEEPSTEINFILES, WHATEVER FORM THESEFILES TAKE, BECAUSE IT'S NOTTOTALLY EVEN CLEAR, I THINKTHERE'S DEFINITELY BEEN SOMEDISAPPOINTMENT THERE.

>> JESSE, YOU KNOW DR. AMY ACTONSAID THIS WEEK, CAME OUT WITH APRESS RELEASE, SHE'S RUNNINGFOR GOVERNOR AS A DEMOCRAT ANDSHE CALLED ON HER CHALLENGER,REPUBLICAN CHALLENGER VIVEKRAMASWAMY TO JOIN HER INDEMANDING THE RELEASE OF THEEPSTEIN FILES.

POLITICIANS ARE TRYING TO GAINSOME ATTENTION WITH THIS TOPIC.

>> YEAH, I THINK EPSTEINISOBVIOUSLY A TOPIC PERSON TO BEASSOCIATED WITH SO A LOT OFPOLITICIANSARE TRYING TO TIETHEIR OPPONENTS OR THEIROPPONENTS OPINION TO HIM INWHATEVER WAY POSSIBLE.

I THINK SARAH'S POINT IS FAIRTHAT THIS IS PROBABLY NOT GOINGTO BE A TOP VOTING ISSUE IN2026, IF IT'S A WAY TO GET SOMEPUNCHES IN, A WAY TO MAKE YOUROPPONENT LOOK LESS TRANSPARENT,THEN THAT'S CERTAINLY SOMETHINGPEOPLE ARE GOING TO TRY TO DO.

>> WILL IT MAKE IT AN OHIOTOPIC BECAUSE OF THE WEXNERTIED TO CENTRAL OHIO?

BECAUSE I WOULD THINK THEEPSTEIN FILES IS MORE OF AWASHINGTON, D. C. , INSIDE THEBELT THING, UNTIL YOU MAYBE ADDIN AN OHIOANS NAME.

>> I'MACTUALLY MORESKEPTICAL.

I THINK JEFF EPSTEIN IS NOW AHOUSEHOLD NAME, THAT JEFFREYEPSTEIN IS NOT A CITYCOUNCILMAN UNFORTUNATELY NAMEDJEFF EPSTEIN FROM CLEVELAND BUTI THINK IF THERE IS GOING TO BEANY SORT OF POLITICAL DAMAGEHERE IT'S GOING TO BE COMINGFROMJEFFREY EPSTEIN.

>> ALL RIGHT.

WE ARE GOING TO MOVE ON TO OURNEXT TOPIC.

GOVERNOR MIKE DeWINE SENT OHIONATIONAL GUARD TROOPS TOWASHINGTON, D. C. AT THE REQUESTOF THE TRUMPADMINISTRATION.

NOW PRESIDENT TRUMP SAYS HE'SREADY TO SEND TROOPS TO MORECITIES, WHERE HE SAYS CRIME ISOUT OF CONTROL.

THE NEW YORK TIMES HAD A REPORTTHAT SHOWED THAT CRIME INCLEVELAND, DAYTON AND TOLEDO ISCOMPARABLE TO WASHINGTON, SO ITBEGS THE QUESTION, WHY NOT SENDOHIO TROOPS TO OHIO CITIES TOHELP WITH CRIME?

GOVERNOR DeWINE'S SPOKESMANTOLD THE NEW YORK TIMES THATTHE MAYORS OF CLEVELAND, TOLEDOAND DAYTON WOULD NEED TO ASKFOR HELP FIRST BEFORE HE WOULDDO ANYTHING.

SO JAKE ZUCKERMAN, DO YOU THINKTHE OHIO NATIONAL GUARD ISGOING TO END UP IN CHICAGO ORBALTIMORE NEXT?

>> I HAVE I KNOW WHAT I DO KNOWIS THAT IT'S SOMETHING OF AFICTION TO SAY THAT THE MAYOROF DC OR ANYONE IN THEHE'SGOVERNING STRUCTURES WANTED THENATIONAL GUARD THERE.

THEY ARE ACTIVELY SUING TO GETTHE NATIONAL GUARD OUT, SO IT'SJUST UNTRUE TO SAY THAT THEGUARD IS THERE BECAUSE THEY AREWANTED THERE.

THE SAME IS TRUE IN OHIO.

DOES THAT MEAN THEY'RE NOTGOING TO COME HERE?

I DON'T KNOW BUT IT'S HARD TOUNDERSTAND THE STANDARD OFWHEREAND WHY TROOPS ARE BEINGDEPLOYED INTO AMERICAN CITIESRIGHT NOW.

>> SARAH, YOU TALKED WITHSENATOR BERNIE MORENO ABOUTOHIO NATIONAL GUARD TROOPSBEING IN DC.

WHAT DID HE HAVE TO SAY?

>> HE POINTED SPECIFICALLY TOCLEVELAND ANDYOU MENTIONEDDAYTON, TOLEDO AND CLEVELAND.

CLEVELAND'S VIOLENT CRIME RATEIN 2024 WAS ACTUALLY HIGHERTHAN WASHINGTON SEES VIOLENTCRIME RATES.

WHEN I ASKED MORENO IF HE FEELSA SIMILAR ACTION IS WARRANTEDTO SEND NATIONAL GUARD TROOPSINTO ANY OF THESE OHIO CITIES,HE SAID HE WOULD NOT LIKE TONECESSARILY SEE IT GET TO THATPOINT BUT HE SAID THAT HE FEELSTHAT CLEVELAND OFFICIALS ARENOT DOING ENOUGH TO CONTROLCRIME, THAT HE FEELS THAT THEVIOLENT CRIME RATE IN CLEVELANDISTOO HIGHAND THE FEDERALGOVERNMENT FEELS THEY NEED TO,THEY WILL.

THAT BEING SAID, I THINK IT ISIMPORTANT TO POINT OUT AND IKNOW THAT THE TRUMPADMINISTRATION HAS CAST DOUBTON SOME OF THESE STATISTICSVIOLENT CRIME IS DOWN ACROSSTHE COUNTRY, LIKE CRIME RATESHAVE BEEN DROPPING.

VIOLENT CRIMES WERE DOWN ITHINK 4.

5% BETWEEN 2023 AND2024 POINT I THINK BOTH SIDESUSE CRIME AS A BOGEYMANIN SOMECIRCUMSTANCES.

YOU KNOW WHEN ONE PARTY IS INPOWER, CRIME IS OUT OF CONTROL,AND VICE VERSA, BUT ESPECIALLYREPUBLICANS.

I JUST DO THINK IT'S IMPORTANTTO THROW THAT STATIN THEIR,TOO.

>> JESSE, DeWINE HAS GOT A LOTOF PUSHBACK ABOUT THIS IDEA OFSENDING THE NATIONAL GUARDTROOPS TO BEGIN WITH.

HE WAS ONE OF THE FIRSTGOVERNORS TO SO.

WHAT IS HE SAID ABOUT IT >> GOVERNOR DeWINE HASBASICALLY SAID THAT THIS ISCONSISTENT WITH OTHER ACTIONTHAT IS TAKEN, WHICH WE CANLOOK AT WHEN THE MAYORS OFCOLUMBUS ASKED FOR ASSISTANCEAFTER THE DEATHOF GEORGE FLOYDAND THE MURDER OFGEORGE FLOYDIN MINNEAPOLIS, AND THERE WASPROTEST AND REACTION TO THAT.

SO THAT WAS A SITUATION WHERETHE MAYOR WAS ASKING THEM TOCOME.

HE SEES BEING ASKED BY THE DCNATIONAL GUARD AND THESECRETARY OF THE ARMY AS THESAME REQUEST, AS JAKE HASPOINTED OUT, THE DC OFFICIALSARE NOT ASKING FOR THIS.

THOUGH I THINK THE CRITICSWOULD SAY THERE IS A DIFFERENCEIN THIS SCENARIO.

>> JAKE, DO WE HAVE ANY IDEAHOW MUCH IT COSTS OR WHO PAYSFOR THE OHIONATIONAL GUARD TOBE IN DC?

WHERE DOES THAT MONEY COMEFROM?

>> I HAVE ASKED THE OHIONATIONAL GUARD FOR THAT NUMBER.

THEY HAVE NOT GIVEN ME ANY COSTESTIMATE THEY SAID THE FEDERALGOVERNMENT IS PICKING UP THETAB BUT I BELIEVE --I WISH IREMEMBERED THE NUMBER OF HAND.

GOERING GOVERNOR DeWINE SENTSEVERAL OHIO HIGHWAY PATROLTROOPERS DOWN TO THE SOUTHERNBORDER, I GIVE YOU THE FIGUREOF A COUPLE HUNDRED THOUSANDDOLLARS FOR A COUPLEDEPLOYMENTS FOR CLOSER COSTESTIMATES ON THE FRONT END, NOTTHE BACKEND.

THERE'S NOT A LOT OFTRANSPARENCY BUT I DID THESENSE THAT THERE'S THISATTITUDE OF WELL, SOMEONE ELSEIS PAYING FOR IT SO WHY GET TOOHUNG UP ON THE COST?

>> SARAH, YOU SAID THE DISTRICTOF COLUMBIA, DCC TO END THEDEPLOYMENT THERE AND A FEDERALJUDGE RULED THAT THE L. A.

DEPLOYMENT WAS ILLEGAL PURPOSEOR DO YOU THINK THAT ALL OFTHIS IS JUST GOING TO BE CAUGHTUP IN COURT GIMMICK LIKE WILLANYTHING COME OF THIS?

>> I MEAN EVERYTHING PRESIDENTDONALD TRUMP HAS DONE IN HISSECOND ADMINISTRATION HASPRETTY MUCH GONE THROUGH THECOURTS AND I THINK THAT'S BEENTRUMP AND A LOTOF TRUMPSUPPORTERS ARGUMENTS, THAT THEYFEEL THAT THE COURTSARE PLAYINGIN ALARGER-THAN-LIFE ROLE INTHE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION.

THERE OF COURSE, WE LIVE IN ACOUNTRY WITH CHECKS ANDBALANCES SO THAT'S KIND OF THEWHOLE POINT OF THE COURTS BUTYES, I'M SURE THIS WILL END UPIN FEDERAL OR.

I DO THINK IT'S INTERESTINGBECAUSE WHEN YOU START TO LOOKAT THE CITIES THAT THESEDEPLOYMENTS OF HAPPENED IN,HAVE BEEN MAJOR CITIES OR THENATIONS CAPITAL, LOS ANGELES,DC, AND NOW POTENTIALLYCHICAGO.

WHEN YOU START TO THINK ABOUTTHIS MORE MODERATELY SIZEDCITIES, LIKE A CITY LIKECLEVELAND, I WONDER IFTHE CITYWANTS TO SEE WHAT THE RECORDSLOOKS LIKE TO TAKE ON THEFEDERAL GOVERNMENT YET AGAIN.

>> JESSE, YOU FEEL LIKE WITHTHE PUSHBACK THAT MIKE DeWINEHAS BEEN GETTING ABOUTSENDING'S, DO YOU THINK HEWOULD HESITATE OR BEFORESENDING THEM TO CHICAGO, OR ISIT JUST TO GET IF HE ASKS, HEWILL?

>>I THINKBASED OFF OF WHAT HESAID TO THE NEW YORK TIMES ANDALSO TO LOCAL REPORTERS, IF HEDIDN'T GIVE AN EXPLICIT REQUESTFOR THE MAYOR OF CLEVELAND,WHICH I WOULD BE SURPRISED IFJUSTIN BIBB WAS LIKE, YEP, COMEON DOWN, I THINK IT WOULD BEREALLY, REALLY HARD TO DEPLOY,EVEN IF PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMPASKED HIM TO BUT THATWOULD BEQUITE A POSITION FOR OURREPUBLICAN GOVERNOR IF THAT WASTHE CASE.

>> DeWINE, OHIO, TO THE MAYOROF CLEVELAND, AN EXAMPLE, NEEDSTO ASK FOR THE HELP, BUT IFPRESIDENT TRUMP DECIDESCLEVELAND NEEDS HELP, WHICHCOMES FIRST?

>> I THINK THAT'S WHERE WE FINDOUT IN THAT SCENARIO, SO THATIS THE CONCERN OF PEOPLE AT THEACLU AND OPPONENTS OF THISPARTICULAR MOVE, IS IF YOUSTART WITHWASHINGTON, D. C. ORINCULPATORY, ARE YOU GOING TOSTART GOING TO ALL THESE OTHERCITIES NEXT?

>> WELL FOR OUR NEXT TOPIC,OHIO LAWMAKERS WILL BE DRAWINGNEW CONGRESSIONAL MAPS THISFALL.

THIS REDRAWING HAS NOTHING TODO WITH CALLS TO REDRAWMAPSAROUND THE COUNTRY.

HERE IN OHIO, THE 2022 MAP DIDNOT GET BIPARTISAN SUPPORT,ANDTHEREFORESTATE LAW SAYS ITMUST BE REDRAWN FOR 2026.

BUT WITH THE TRUMPADMINISTRATION LEANING ON REDSTATES TO DRAW MAPS THAT FAVORREPUBLICANS AND DEMOCRATICGOVERNORS LIKE GAVIN NEWSOM INCALIFORNIA SAYING THEY WILLREDRAW THEIR MAPS TO BENEFITDEMOCRATS, THIS STATE-BY-STATEMAP DEBATEIS BOUND TO BE AMESS THIS FALL.

SARAH DONALDSON, DO YOU EXPECTA BIG FIGHT OVER OHIO'S MAPSINTHE NEXT FEW WEEKS?

>> IS GOING TO BE OVER THE NEXTFEW MONTHS.

I THINK THAT IT WILL --YOUKNOW THE FIRST KIND OF DEADLINEIS AT THE END OF SEPTEMBER, BUTTHAT'S FOR A BIPARTISAN VOTE ONMAPS AND I KNOW MINORITY LEADERDENNY ISAACSON HAS ALREADYTOLD, I THINK CLEVELAND.

COMTHAT THE DEMOCRATS AREN'T GOINGTO GO FOR A MAP THAT DOESN'THAVE AT LEAST SEVEN FAVORABLEDISTRICTSFOR DEMOCRATS.

>> THEY HAVE FIVE RIGHT NOW.

>> THEY HAVE FIVE RIGHT NOW.

THAT'S LIKE A REPUBLICAN-CONTROLLED SUPER MAJORITY.

THAT IMMEDIATE KNOW FROM THEREPUBLICANS.

IT REQUIRES A CERTAIN LEVEL OFBIPARTISAN SUPPORT FOR THEMAPS, LIKE YOU SAID, OR THEYKEEP GETTING KIND OF PUSHEDBACK SO ONCE YOU GET TO THATSEPTEMBER DEADLINE, IF THEYDON'T PASS BIPARTISAN MAPS,WHICH THEY LIKELY WON'T, ITWILL GO TO THE REDISTRICTINGCOMMISSION AND THAT COMMISSIONSKEWS HEAVILY REPUBLICAN.

>> JESSE,HOUSE SPEAKER MATTHOFFMAN, SENATE PRESIDENT ROBANNOUNCED LAST WEEK THATTHEY'RE LAUNCHING A WEBSITE TOALLOW THE PUBLIC TO SUBMITPROPOSEDCONGRESSIONALREDIS TRICTING PLANS.

WHAT LED THEM TO DO THIS?

WHY ARE THEY ASKING FOR PUBLICINPUT HE'LL >> OHIO VOTERS ACTUALLY VOTEDON A NUMBER OF REFORMS IN 2018TO HOW WE DRAW A CONGRESSIONALMAP.

PART OF IT REQUIRES PUBLICINPUT, PUBLIC MEETINGS.

WE SAW IN '22 AND'21 THAT ALOT OF THESE STEPS WERE KIND OFPERFUNCTORY, LIKE A, SUBMIT AMAP WE'RE NOT GOING TO LOOK ATIT TOO CLOSELY SOI THINK THEREIS SOME SKEPTICISM THAT THESEMAPS WILL BE PART OF AMEANINGFUL CONVERSATION, BUTTHIS IS A NEWPROCESS ANDYOUCAN ALWAYS START FRESH.

>> JAKE, DO YOU THINK THEY WILLLOOK AT SOME OF THESE PUBLICLYSUGGESTED MAPS?

WHAT IF A PROFESSIONAL MAPMAKERSUBMITTED MAP INTO THIS PUBLICFORUM?

>> I GUESS I DON'T SEE WHY THEYWOULD.

IF YOU'RE IN CONTROL OF THESITUATION, WHY WOULD YOU?

THANK YOU FOR YOUR SUBMISSION.

WE'LL PUT THAT RIGHT IN A PILEWITH ALL REST OF THEM, BUT IFYOU HAVE THE POWER, WHYOUTSOURCE IT HE'LL >> YEAH, AND LAWMAKERS HAVEUNTIL THE END OF SEPTEMBER TOPASS A MAP.

I'M NOT SURE OF THE DEADLINES.

SARAH, DO YOU KNOW THEM OFF THETOP OF YOUR HEAD HE'LL >> I DID.

I KINDA STARTED THE TIMELINE.

LAWMAKERS HAVE UNTIL THE END OFSEPTEMBER TO PUT A MAP OF THEANTACID WITH 60%BIPARTISANSUPPORT OF THE FORM, ANYONE CANFACT CHECK ME IF I'M WRONG, BUTTHEN IT GOES THROUGH THEREDISTRICTING CONNECTION SO ITIS ALL THAT LIKELY TO GO TO THEREDISTRICTING COMMISSION.

THEIR FINAL DEADLINE IS IN LIKEEARLY NOVEMBERSO THATSTARTSTO GET CLOSER AND CLOSER,ESPECIALLY IF THERE ARE LEGALCHALLENGES TO THE FILINGDEADLINES FOR CANDIDATES, THEPRIMARY FILING DEADLINES FORCANDIDATES, SO THERE ISCERTAINLY A CHANCE THAT PRIMARYDATES GETPUSHED OR LIKE ANOLDER MAP IS USED.

I THINK IT'S KIND OF ANYTHINGIS ON THE TABLE UNTIL IT'S ADONE DEAL BUT DEMOCRATS BEINGVERY UNLIKELY TO GET ONBOARDWITH THE REPUBLICANS ARE DOING,AND IN THIS CIRCUMSTANCE, ALLTHE DEMOCRATS REALLY DON'T HAVEMUCH BARGAINING POWER,REPUBLICANS HAVE A SUPERMAJORITY, THERE IS SOMEEXPECTATION OF BIPARTISANSUPPORT FOR THE MAPS WHERE THEYGO TO --IN THIS CASE,AMIDDECADE REDISTRICTING ISHAPPENING BECAUSETHERE WASN'TBIPARTISAN SUPPORT.

>> JESSE, DO YOU SEE ANYTHINGHAPPENING HERE IN OHIO LIKEWHAT'S HAPPENING IN OF STATESAROUND THE COUNTRY, WHEREBECAUSE THE TRUMPADMINISTRATION IS ASKING FORMORE REPUBLICANS, RIGHT NOW WEHAVE, WHAT IS IT, 10REPUBLICANS AND FIVE DEMOCRATS?

THE THEM AS BEING DRAWN IN ABIG DIFFERENCEWHERE THEY'RENOT GOING TO STAY 10 AND 5?

>> I THINK IT LIKELY THATREPUBLICANS ARE GOING TO TRY TOGET AT LEAST 12 CONGRESSIONALDISTRICTS ON THEIR SIDE.

THE MOST LIKELY TARGETS WILL BEIN THE TOLEDO AREA,REP MARCYCAPTOR, WHO REALLY HAS BEENOUTPERFORMING DEMOCRATS IN THATAREA, IT WAS A DISTRICT THATVOTED FOR PRESIDENT DONALDTRUMP BUT SHE WAS ABLE TO EKEIT OUT AGAINST REPUBLICANCOMPETITOR AND ALSO A THIRDPARTYCANDIDATE.

I THINK YOU'D LOOK AT THE AKRONAREA, REPRESENTATIVE AMELIASYKES.

IF YOU ARE GETTING REALLYAGGRESSIVE, YOU COULD LOOK ATTHE CINCINNATI AREA.

PART OF THE CHALLENGE THERE ISTHAT THE ENTIRECITY OFCINCINNATI HAS TO BE KEPT INONE CONGRESSIONAL DISTRICTBECAUSE OF THE RULES, ANDTHAT'S A PRETTY DEMOCRATICAREA, AND JUST TO OUR TIMELINEDISCUSSION BEFORE,THE DROPDEADDEADLINE IS THE END OFNOVEMBER, AND AT THAT POINTREPUBLICANS COULD PASS A MAPWITHOUT ANY DEMOCRATIC BUY-IN.

>> THEY'RE ALLOWED TO WANT TOGET THAT FAR IN THE PROCESSHE'LL >> CORRECT.

>> JAKE, JUST FORCLARIFICATION, THIS IS JUSTCONGRESSIONAL MAPS THAT WE ARETALKING ABOUT YOUR.

LIKE OUR STATE SENATE MAPS INOUR STATE REPRESENTATIVE MAPS,THEY'RE THE SAME?

>> I'M SORRY, CAN YOUSEE THEQUESTION AGAIN?

>> STATE REPS AND STATESENATORS, THESE MAPS ARESTAYING THE SAME, JUST THECONGRESSIONAL DISTRICTS AREBEING REDRAWN?

>> WE'REONLY DOINGCONGRESSIONAL DISTRICTS,SOMEONE SAVE ME.

>> [ INAUDIBLE ] BECAUSE IF THEMOST ARDENT REDISTRICTINGFOLLOWERS REMEMBER THEDEMOCRATS IN THE HOUSE ANDSENATE WHO WERE ON THEREDISTRICTING COMMISSION ENDEDUP VOTING FOR STATEHOUSEMAPSIN LIKE 2023, I WANT TO SAY, SOTHOSE MAPS ACTUALLY GOTBIPARTISAN SUPPORT.

UNIT DEMOCRATS WILL ARGUE THATTHEY'RE GERRYMANDERED BUT THEYDID GET SUPPORTFROM DEMOCRATS.

PARTIALLY BECAUSE OF COURSE WEDID HAVE THAT WHOLEREDISTRICTING BALLOT AMENDMENTTHAT I IMAGINE SOME DEMOCRATSWERE PROBABLY HOPING WOULDPASS, AND IT DIDN'T.

>> SOLOCAL MAPS FOR LOCAL REP,SENATOR STAY THE SAME BUT WHOYOUR CONGRESSPERSON IS OR YOUARE VOTING FOR I GUESS COULDCHANGE SLIGHTLY DEPENDING ONWHERE YOU ARE, MAYBE IF WE ARESPEAKING MORE LIKE THE AMELIASLIGHTS/MARCYCAPTOR DISTRICTS,A LOT PEOPLE MIGHT SEE A SLIGHTSHIFT?

>> IT'S REALLY HARDTO SAY BUTANYTIME YOU PULL A STRING OVERHERE IT'S GOING TO AFFECTSOMETHING OVER HERE BECAUSEEACH OF THESE DISTRICTS HAVE TOHAVE THE SAME POPULATION.

SO IT'S HOW IT ENDS UPHAPPENING AND THIS IS REALLYPART OF A NATIONWIDE, AS YOUSAID, KIND OF ARMSRACE TO PICKUP DISTRICTS AND I THINK WITHREPUBLICAN CONTROL IN OHIO WECAN EXPECT AN ARMS RACE TO COMETO US SOON.

>> ALL RIGHT.

FOR OUR LAST TOPIC, AT LEASTFOUR OHIO JAILS AND TWOREGIONAL CORRECTIONALFACILITIES ARE HOLDING HUNDREDSOF PEOPLE FOR I. C. E. FOR A FEE.

THE PEOPLE IN THESE OHIO JAILSARE WAITING FOR DEPORTATION ANDTHE SHERIFF SAYS THISIS ACLEAR MONEYMAKER FOR THEIRCOUNTIES.

JAKE ZUCKERMAN, HE REPORTED THESTORY FOR SIGNALOHIO.

DOES THE U. S. DEPARTMENT OFIMMIGRATION AND CUSTOMSENFORCEMENT, KNOWN AS I. C. E. ,DO THEY HAVEENOUGH THAT THEYNOT HAVE ENOUGH BEDS ELSEWHERE?

IS THAT WHY THEY'RE COMINGTOOHIO?

>> IF YOU JUST THINK ABOUT HOWBIG THE COUNTRY IS AND HOW MANYOF DOCUMENTED IMMIGRANTS AREBELIEVE TO BE HERE, AND YOUTHINK ABOUT JUST THE LOGISTICALPROCESS OF TRYING TO GET ALL OFHIS PEOPLE OUT OFTHE COUNTRY,THAT'S A MASSIVE, MASSIVEOPERATION.

I. C. E. , LIKE YOU SAID, DOES NOTHAVE THE BED SPACE FOR THATPURPOSE YOU ARE SEEING THINGSLIKE ALLIGATOR ALCATRAZ COMINGUP IN THE NEWS.

SO I. C. E. IS BASICALLY OUTSOURCING SOMEOF THAT TO ANY WILLING AND ABLESHERIFFS DEPARTMENTS ORREGIONAL JAILS, LIKEYOUMENTIONED, AND IN OHIO THEUPTAKE IS ACTUALLY LESS THANWHAT I WOULD'VE EXPECTED.

THERE ARE ABOUT EIGHT COUNTYSHERIFF'S THAT HAVE SIGNEDTHESE CONTRACTS, FOUR ACCORDINGTO I. C. E. DATA THATCURRENTLY HAVEINMATES THERE WAS ANYTHINGBETWEEN $100-$125 PER HEAD, PERDAY, HOLDING THESE PEOPLE ANDIT COMES OUT TO MILLIONS OFDOLLARS.

IF YOU DO THE MATH, THERE ARENEWS REPORTS PUT IN BUTLERCOUNTY THERE ARE ABOUT 400, 450I.

C. E. DETAINEES IN THERE SO IF YOUMULTIPLY THAT BY 125×365 DAYS AYEAR YOU HAVE A PRETTYSIGNIFICANT CHUNK OF CHANGECOMING FROM I. C. E. TO THESE SHERIFFS DEPARTMENTS.

>> JAKE MUSTANG WITH YOU, YOUTALK WITH ONE SHERIFF WHO SAIDHE'S BASICALLY CREATING A RAINYDAY FUND WITH THISMONEY BECAUSEI WANT TO CALLIT EASY EXTRAMONEY.

I DON'T KNOW THAT IT'S EASY.

>> MAHONING SHERIFF JERRYGREENE ACTUALLY DID NOT RETURNMY PHONE CALLS BUT HE DID TELLTHE VINDICATOR THAT LIKE YOUSAID, HE SAID THERE'S A STARTQUOTE CLEAR FINANCIAL BENEFIT.

HE SAID YES, WE TALKED ABOUTTHE CREATION OF A RAINY DAYFUND SO I SPLIT THE SHERIFFSINTO TWO.

THERE ARE SOME JUST SEE MONEY.

THIS IS JUST A REVENUEOPPORTUNITY, A WAY TOCAPITALIZE ON OTHERWISE EMPTYJAIL BEDS AND THEN THERE'SSOMEMORE IDEOLOGICAL PUSH BEHINDSOME SHERIFFS LIKE SHERIFFJONES IS ONE OF THE MOSTOUTSPOKEN PEOPLE ON THEIMMIGRATION ISSUE IN THE STATE.

HE HAS A SIGN OUTSIDE THE JAILTHAT'S AS ILLEGAL ALIENS HERE.

SHERIFF [ INAUDIBLE ] UP INPORTAGE COUNTY, HE CAME INTOTHE NEWS COMPARING THE LEGALIMMIGRANTS TO START QUOTELOCUSTS AND NOW HE'S ONE OF THESHERIFFS WHO HAVE THESECONTRACTS SO THE IDEOLOGICALTHING BEHIND SOME OF THOSE ANDYOU MENTIONED SOME SHERIFFSJUST CAPITALIZING ON THE BEDHE'LL JUST, WEHEAR ABOUTI.

C. E. RAIDS AROUND THE COUNTRY.

I DON'T KNOW THAT THERE'S BEENGIANT RAIDS IN OHIO THAT HAVEMADE HUGE NATIONAL NEWS BUT ITIS AN ISSUE THAT HAS COME UPTIME AND TIME AGAIN HERE INOHIO.

>> I THINK THERE HAVE BEEN AFEW INSTANCES THAT HAVE NOTREALLY PROMINENT HIS ATTENTION.

FOR EXAMPLE, THERE WAS ACHAPLAIN INCIDENT CANETTICHILDREN'S HOSPITALWHO GOT ATREMENDOUS AMOUNT OF ATTENTIONTO HIS CASE DOWN THERE, WHICHIS STILL PROCEEDING AND IS INBUTLER COUNTY JAIL, THAT JAKEREPORTED ON.

SO I THINK IF YOU'RE INTHECOMMUNITY , CERTAINLY THIS ISSOMETHING THAT IS ON YOUR MINDREGULARLY.

IF YOU'RE NOT IT'S MAYBE ONLYSOMETHING YOU HEAR ABOUT ON THENEWS.

>> AND SARAH, SPRINGFIELD COMESTO MIND WHENEVER YOU THINKABOUT IMMIGRATION, AND FORSPRINGFIELD THE TEMPORARYPROTECTED STATUS OF THEHAITIANS IN SPRINGFIELD WASSUPPOSED TO EXPIRE IN 2026.

PRESIDENT TRUMP CHANGED ITTOAUGUST BUT AUGUST HAS COME ANDGONE SO I GUESS THE DATE HASBEEN MOVED AGAIN.

DO YOU FEEL LIKE --HAVE YOUHEARD ANYTHING ABOUT THE PEOPLEIN SPRINGFIELD, ESPECIALLY THEHAITIANS FEEL LIKE THEY'RE INLIMBO WHEN IT COMES TO ALL OFTHIS?

>> I PERSONALLY HAVEN'T BEENOUT TO SPRINGFIELD SINCE LASTYEAR, JUST BECAUSE THINGS WEREPRETTY HOT LAST YEAR BEFORETHEELECTION BUT YOU CERTAINLY READREPORTING ABOUT FOLKS IN THECOMMUNITY THERE WHO ARECONCERNED.

I DON'T KNOW THAT ANYONE'SPOSITIONS HAVE CHANGED ONE WAYOR ANOTHER.

GOVERNOR MIKE THE WIND STANDSBEHIND THE FACT THAT, YOU KNOW,TAKING THAT MANY WORKERS AWAYFROM THE COMMUNITY IS PROBABLYGOINGTO HURT THE COMMUNITYRATHER THAN HELP IT.

SENATOR BERNIE MARINO WOULDPROBABLY TELL YOU THAT IF THEYWANT TO WORK, THEY SHOULD BEHERE LEGALLY, ALTHOUGH OFCOURSE THERE IS ARGUMENT OVERTHAT TEMPORARY PROTECTED STATUSAS IT STANDS, IS IT LEGAL ORNOT.

BUT I MEAN, I THINK ONCE THEMOVE TO ACTUALLY DEPORT THESEFOLKS HAPPENS, ITWILL BELIKEA LOT OF FIREWORKS.

>> JAKE, IN YOUR REPORTING ONTHIS, DID YOU FIND OUT HOW LONGTHEY'RE WAITING FORDEPORTATION, LIKE HOW LONG THEYSTAY IN ONE OF THESE FOUR OHIOJAILS BEFORE ANYTHING HAPPENS?

>> ACCORDING TO I. C. E. AND SOME OF THE JAILS, UP TO 58DAYS ON AVERAGE BUT THESE AREINDEFINITE STAYS.

THEY ARE IN JAIL UNTIL I. C. E. GETS AROUND TO DOING WHATI.

C. E. IS GOING TO DO WITH THEM.

MIND YOU, IMMIGRATION IS ACIVIL OFFENSE.

THESE PEOPLE HAVE NOT BEENACTED WITH A CRIME.

THEY'VE NOT BEEN CHARGED WITH ACRIME AND THEY ARE JUST SITTINGIN THE JAILS EFFECTIVELYINDEFINITELY AND THEY'RE BEINGHELD BY SHERIFFS'S GENERAL JOBIS TO UPHOLD STATE LAWS, ISSUECCW PERMITS,GUARD COURTHOUSES.

THIS IS VERY UNUSUAL MANDATEFOR SHERIFFS TO BE TAKEN ON .

>>NOW IT IS TIME FOR OUR FINALOFFTHE RECORD PARTING SHOTS.

JAKE ZUCKERMAN, YOU HAVE AN OFFTHE RECORD HE'LL >> I DON'T REALLY CARE ABOUTOHIO STATE'S GAME TOMORROW BUTNEXT WEEK THEY WILL BE TAKINGON THE MIGHTY, MIGHTY OHIOUNIVERSITY BOBCATS, A COUPLEALUMNI AROUND THE TABLE AND I'MCALLING THE UPSET OF THECENTURY.

'S BE MET NOT IT.

>> GO BOBCATS.

I'M ALSO ON THEFOOTBALL SCENEBECAUSE THERE'S KIND OF A CHILLIN THE AIR.

I'M VERY EXCITED FOR NFLFOOTBALL TO BE BACK AND IJOINED MY FIRST ENTITY LEAGUEIN MY LIFETIME, SO I'M VERYEXCITED TO SEE WHAT MY PLAYERSDO FOR ME.

>> I SAY GO STEELERS AFTERTHAT, OBVIOUSLY.

SARAH AND I HAVE THATCONNECTION.

JESSE MUELLER, OFF THE RECORDHE'LL >> AS ALWAYS, GO CATS.

AS A FORMER MEMBER OF THEMARCHING 110 I'M EXCITED ABOUTTHE GRAMBLING STATE AND PLAYINGAT THE OHIO STATE GAME SO GOBAND.

>> GO BANDS TO GO BANDS ANDGOCATS.

MY OFFTHE RECORD, IT ISACTUALLY A PLUG.

I HOST ALL SIDES ON 89.

7 NPRNEWS AND DOING A SPECIAL FIVE-PART SERIES: TANGLED, THE COSTOF LEARNING, AND WE'RE GOING TOLEARNED HOW WE PAY FOR OHIOSCHOOLS AND WE'RE GOING TO TRYTO ANSWER THE QUESTION IS THEREA BETTER WAY.

YOU CAN LISTEN MONDAYS AT 11:00ON 89.

7 NPR NEWS OR YOU CANSUBSCRIBE TO THE UNTANGLEDPODCAST, AND THAT'S A WRAP FORCOLUMBUS ON THE RECORD FOR THISWEEK.

YOU CAN CONTINUE THECONVERSATION ON FACEBOOK OR YOUCAN WATCH US ANYTIME AT OURWEBSITETHAT'S WSU.

ORG/ [INAUDIBLE ] WE ARE ALSO ONYOUTUBE AND ON THE PBS VIDEOAT.

I'M AMY GUREVICH.

HAVE A GOOD WEEK.