- Just ahead on "American Black Journal" as we mark the 60th anniversary of the March on Washington and Detroit's Walk to freedom.

We're gonna take a look at the connection between Dr. Martin Luther King's speeches and the Motown record label.

Plus we'll talk about a TV series on the life of singer Jackie Wilson and meet the Detroit artist who's gonna play the lead role.

Don't go anywhere, "American Black Journal" starts right now.

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(upbeat music) - Welcome to American Black Journal.

I'm Stephen Henderson.

60 years ago this month, Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. delivered his iconic, I Have a Dream speech to a crowd of 250,000 at the March on Washington for jobs and freedom.

Of course, he also gave an early form of that speech.

In June at the 1963 Detroit Walk to Freedom, Motown founder Berry Gordy decided to promote Dr. King's cause by recording both versions along with some of his other famous speeches "American Black Journal" contributor, Cecelia Sharpe of 90.9 WRCJ, sat down with the Chairwoman and CEO of the Motown Museum, Robin Terry, to talk about Motown's legacy during the Civil Rights Movement.

- Thank you so much for taking time out of your busy schedule to talk with me.

- Well, thank you for having me and for being patient and getting this, making this conversation happen.

- So, Berry Gordy organically embodied social justice and equality and equal rights and sometimes faced a little bit of flack for that inclusivity during such a tumultuous time.

How did he naturally achieve those goals of the Civil Rights Movement of social justice and equality for everyone through Motown records?

- I don't know that he ever set out to achieve a goal of civil rights.

I think what he did so brilliantly was to one, establish a business and an enterprise where he could empower other people, not just Black people, but mostly people of color.

I think what he definitely did was he was able to create a music with the intention of creating music for all people.

So at no point was Berry Gordy trying to just make Black music for Black people.

He was trying to make music for all people.

Things like love and joy and hope and peace, things that everybody could relate to that resonated.

He didn't realize it was gonna resonate 'cause it was being made by young people with young people all around the world and become the sound of young America.

And in doing so, started to create this unity, this coming together of people who looked very different, had different backgrounds.

And my favorite quote is when Junius Griffin says you know, "Motown music allowed Black and White people to look at each other and say, there's a little bit of you in me and there's a little bit of me in you," and the power of that, that's what helped advance the Civil Rights Movement.

- And of course in 1963 we know that Berry Gordy, Motown Records, recorded the first version of the I Have a Dream speech in Detroit in 1960, 3rd of June, and then later he recorded the speech in August, 1963, the march, the Great March on Washington.

What impact has that, those recordings, have those recordings had on us today?

- Well, I mean those recordings are the reason we have access today and that's what makes it so powerful.

Motown as an independent record label at the time was in a position to document those speeches and then later Berry Gordy would give the rights to those speeches to the King family.

So I think it was a really, it was a foresight that Berry Gordy had that this was important to put in the right hand so that the world can have it, you know, in perpetuity.

I think that's one of Motown's biggest shining moments.

- You have created a lot more shining moments here at Motown as the CEO and Chairwoman of the Motown Museum and just expanded the museum and reached out into the community with a lot of programs, many summer camps for children, as well as another program with poetry and writing.

Talk a little bit about that program and also how you partnered with the Motown record label.

- So you're absolutely right.

So we're in the midst of a expansion to build a world-class campus that really pays tribute to Motown's legacy.

And not only in a nostalgic way, but also in a way that allows those that are inspired by this story to activate that inspiration, to be a part of a community of up and coming singers and songwriters and musicians and entrepreneurs.

And so we've created a whole space called Hitsville Next that's just devoted to that community.

Out of that also comes, you know, a commitment to giving artists a place and a platform to shine.

And one of the programs we created is for poets, it's for orators of today.

And that is a nod to Motown's Black Forum label.

When you talk about Dr. King's speeches, the Great March on Washington, those speeches were recorded on the Gordy label but they inspired what became the Black Forum label.

So Motown Mic, which is a nod to Motown's Black Forum label is a spoken word poetry competition.

- So there's so much going on here at the Motown Museum.

How can people get involved?

Can they take a class?

Can they sign up for Motown Mic, can they take a tour?

Can they take a hustle class?

- I love that you ask all those questions.

'cause they can do all those things.

I mean, there's, we have free activations on our new Rocket Plaza every Saturday in the summer so come hang out with us.

It's all free.

We dance.

You can take classes, there are marketplaces with, you know, up and coming entrepreneurs that we support.

But you can do that.

You can also sign up for classes on our website.

So if you go to motownmuseum.org, look under programs, and under programs are all of the offerings that we have not only from middle school, high school, kids, adults, ways that you can plug into this creative, you know, community if you're that, you know, aspiring artist or entrepreneur and then you can always donate or at a minimum become a member be a part of this journey with us.

And membership's $45.

- So there's something for everyone.

Come to the Motown Museum and support.

Thank you so much for your time talking about the history of Motown and Berry Gordy's vision.

I really appreciate you spending time with me here today and I look forward to visiting the Motown Museum.

- Thank you.

Thank you for having me.

- One of my next guests was this year's winner of the Motown Museums, Amplify the Sound of Detroit, singing competition.

He also took first place in Masterpiece Sound Studios cover song contest which was presented by the family of the late Motown songwriter and producer Sylvia Moy.

- [Narrator] Then we launched the cover song contest in partnership with Sony Music Publishing.

- Coming up next.

What up there y'all?

I'm Drey Skonie.

- And we are the Clouds.

- We are band right here from Detroit y'all.

What up though?

We chose, as a collective, Stevie Wonder "I was Made to Love Her."

- Get ready for an experience that will be everlasting because we are definitely here to bring back real musicality.

- There's not much that come through Detroit on this level, you know, especially for us, the bands and, you know, singers and stuff like this.

It's a lot for hip hop, but it's not a lot for us.

And they, you know I get to do my Motown thing, you feel me?

♪ I was born in Detroit ♪ Had a childhood sweetheart ♪ We was always holding hands ♪ I wear cowboy boots with the bottom bell ♪ ♪ Shorty had a ponytail ♪ I knew I loved her even then - The first place winner of the $25,000 cash award is Drey Skonie and the Clouds.

- Drey Skonie is also taking on the role of Detroit's own Jackie Wilson in a new television series about the legendary entertainer's life.

Here's my conversation with Drey, with Jackie Wilson's daughter, Brenda Wilson, and Letitia Macintosh, who is the production manager for the new TV show which is titled appropriately "Higher and Higher."

Drey, I'm gonna start with you man.

That was an incredible performance during the cover song contest honoring the songs of Sylvia Moy.

Not only do you make it your own, add your own personal interpretation, but you pay such respect and homage to the original artist.

Tell me how you approach that kind of work.

- Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I appreciate you saying all that.

I mean, the first key is to, like they say, study the greats.

So, you know, when it comes to like doing songs like that, you have to do it right.

You have to do it justice.

It's not an easy song to do.

But, you know, I had to study that song.

I had to practice a lot and just make sure I, you know, I made it me at the same time.

I didn't want to try to emulate and, you know, I felt like that would put me in a bad spot.

So if as much as I made it me, I felt like I could tell my story along with that, you know?

So that's pretty much how I came with that.

- Yeah, yeah.

And good practice for the television series where you're gonna play Jackie Wilson that's quite an honor as well.

- Thank you, thank you, thank you.

And I honestly, it was a super honor for me, you know?

Thank you Brenda, again for choosing me.

I honestly, those some huge, huge shoes to fill.

- Oh yeah.

- But you know, for, you know, Jackie's own daughter to see it in me and believe in me.

I can, you know, use that to believe in myself as well, so.

- Yeah, yeah.

Brenda, it's great to see you and I am always really impressed at the way you make sure your dad's legacy is taken care of first.

Also that it always seems to be on the move, right?

There's always something new that you're adding to it.

Another way to remember him.

And of course, remember the work.

- The TV series will tell the story about Jackie Wilson.

The movie just won't do it.

Jackie's life was, had a window from five to 40.

So with that being said, we're using a lot of youth and young adults from Detroit metropolitan area.

And not only that, we're using a lot of great, talented for Detroit.

So I think this, by Jackie being a native Detroiter born and raised here in Highland Park and stuff what better way to tell the story by using the people that were here in Detroit and then also by being historical it's also going be educational for generations to come.

- Yeah, yeah.

Tell me more about the story of Jackie's life and how important that is given the work that people know him for.

You know, we always appreciate the art that comes out of all of this, but we don't always know where it comes from.

We don't always know that backstory.

- Well, the backstory is Jackie had a life of, he loved music and he loved entertaining but he had a life that was filled of turmoiled and trials and tribulations and, you know, people that, you know, he thought loved him and didn't love him.

You know, he loved women, you know, he had a bunch of kids and, you know, stuff like that.

So his life started at a very young age, you know, having children and I'm one of them.

- Okay, I'm proud to say I'm one of them.

And so his life story, his backstory is very important because there's a lot of myths out there and there's a lot of misconceptions of who Jackie really was and the things that he went through.

- Yeah, Leticia, you're the production manager for the television series.

Tell us about telling this story on the screen.

- Well, I like to say thank you very much for including me on this panel.

I'm really honored and you know, the dichotomy of this whole situation is that Brenda and I started working together a little over a year ago.

I started working in an office and as a production manager.

I wanted to be able to, you know, help people tell their stories.

I actually worked on the cover song contest and the cover song contest is actually about Sylvia Moy.

- Sylvia Moy.

- And her family, right.

And that is what brought us all together.

Brenda wound up being a judge.

Drey Skonie was a contestant.

Brenda saw him, saw his performance, and was like, oh yeah.

And I am the glue that's right in the middle that's bringing this all together because it is a marriage of the music, the movie, all of our backgrounds, you know, God just made a perfect symmetry for us to all come together to be able to, you know, to bring this story to light.

And it's gonna be a really, really, very good project.

It's gonna allow the younger generation to get an opportunity to know who Jackie Wilson is before Motown.

Because most people, they go back as far as Motown and that's all they, that's their directive on music in this, you know, for our generation.

But it actually goes further back.

And so we're going to, you know, allow Brenda to tell her story about her father from her perspective and there's a lot to tell.

- Yeah, yeah.

We should talk a little about Sylvia Moy.

A lot of people don't know that name from Motown, but it's just as important as the stars who were singing the songs.

Talk a little about who Sylvia was.

- Detroit had a whole lot of firsts and the, it is an honor to be able to work with her family.

Unfortunately, she passed away, you know, in 2017 so I never personally had an opportunity to meet her.

But, you know, she was the first, just like Jackie Wilson was the first, she was the first to be a woman working in a record, working for a record company, producing records.

And she produced a record for Stevie Wonder that Drey Skonie covered in the cover song contest.

Him and, Drey Skonie and the Clouds covered it and it was a wonderful cover.

And then they did a good rendition in the actual showcase.

So that's the beauty of it.

But the fact that, you know, Sylvia Moy was the first, she discovered a lot of different people.

She had worked with a lot of different people.

And even in, even though she's no longer here there's still discovery happening.

I'm being discovered.

Drey Skonies' being discovered.

Brenda was already here, but now what she's being discovered is having an opportunity to talk about her story about her father.

That's the discovery.

So even in her absence she's still allowing a lot of firsts to happen.

- All right here in Detroit at the same time.

- Right.

- And in Detroit.

Yes, that's the beauty of it too.

- And absolutely.

- And this is a really important year to think about Detroit and to think about Motown, but also to think about what happened 60 years ago here, right, with Dr. Martin Luther King, whose work of course, was part of the inspiration around some of the work in Motown.

And of course the singers and the folks who were part of Motown were important figures in the Civil Rights Movement as well.

I imagine that some of that may come out in the television show, is that right?

- Yes, it will.

You know, Brenda, she is, and I have been, you know, working a lot behind the scenes.

One of the things that we wanna do is recreate some of those shows that were on TV that Jackie Wilson had an opportunity to be a first to be on.

He was the, he in many ways was a very eloquent and elegant man and an eloquent singer.

And so that is the reason why he was pulled in to do a lot of different shows and to do a lot a lot of different things and to represent himself.

And, you know, unfortunately, I would hate to say it this way, but to represent our people at that time in that era.

- Yeah, that's true.

- And there were others, but it was not a, it was a very eloquent way that he did it.

He was very classy, you know, and very handsome and so Drey Skonie fits into that very well because it's like.

- Yes, he does.

- It was like he was born for this.

- He was born for this, absolutely.

But then you been here before.

- My hair the same too you know.

- And that's what drew me to him, was his hair.

I'll just be honest with you, but just to to let you know, we do have some other a-listers like Omar Gooding, James Moses Black from Snowfall, Cynda Williams from Mo Better Blues.

And then we have a lot of Detroiters here like Kern Brantley, we have Ginuwine who's a comedian.

- Him and I.

- Yeah, and we're using a lot.

I mean, yes.

That's it.

And then we have a lot of youth and young adults that we given the opportunity to play different parts in this TV series and they're really excited, you know, we rehearse.

- All of the Jackie's, the five-year-old Jackie the teenage Jackie, and then this Jackie, all of them are first but they all have so much talent.

And you know, they're gonna be people that you're gonna see, you know, a lot more of going forward.

- Oh, and another person that you know too is King Bethel.

He's the teenage Jackie Wilson.

So we have three roles of Jackie Wilson that's from the, goes from the age of five to 40.

And this is gonna be really exciting TV stories.

- Yeah, yeah, so Drey, I'm curious about the way someone like you who is a singer in 2023 draws real inspiration from music that's so old now, right?

This is before you were born, it's before I was born a lot of it.

How does that shape the work that you do now and what other influences are there as well?

- Well, for instance, I'm just going, how I know about Jackie Wilson is through Michael Jackson.

So my favorite person was Michael Jackson growing up.

And you know, Michael Jackson's inspiration was Jackie Wilson.

So to hear that it makes you say, okay, who is that?

You watch the movies and all that stuff.

You like, who is that?

So now you gotta go back and study some more.

And now you gotta understand why Michael Jackson became Michael Jackson and you go to Jackie Wilson and you see all these people, James Brown, and you just go into this rabbit hole.

And what I realize about that type of music is a lot of people don't, are either thinking that it's too old or afraid to touch it now or it's too hard to do.

But, you know, I'm just one of those people, you know, I grew up in church, you know, just like the grace.

And I feel like, you know, that's the type of stuff I wanna do, stuff from the song, you know what I'm saying?

- Yeah, yeah, that continuity that draws forward right.

Motown is 60 years ago, a lot of the stuff, but the influences are all around us.

I imagine that the TV show will tell.

- And then guess what?

He got some moves that you won't even believe some Jackie Wilson moves.

When he did in front of me, I was like, oh my God, he got it, he got it.

And the women gonna love him.

I said, oh my God, this is just a reenacting of Jackie Wilson, you know what I'm saying?

I mean, and he got the style, he got the move, he got the it factor, you know, and he got that charisma.

He got that magnet that draws you to him, you know, so he's gonna be, he's excellent for the role - When it comes to the soul, that's what resonates.

That's why music can be generational.

That's why you can go to a concert.

That's why songs that were made 50 and 60 years ago can be remade now and it's like new.

So when it comes from the soul, it just touches you.

And the beauty of this whole thing is that, again, you mentioned Motown but Jackie Wilson was before Motown.

He influenced Berry Gordy and helped Berry Gordy.

Berry Gordy's very first songs were Jackie Wilson's song.

So that helps, so that's before that timeframe.

And that's the beauty of this.

And then what I really like about it just like you touched on earlier, it showcases Detroit and Detroit's talent.

Again, there's a lot of natural talent a lot of things are happening in Detroit not only on the music side, but on the film side, you know, and that's where I come in on the film side because you know, Detroit has carved out its own lane.

I say it all the time in the film industry we made our own lane in the independent film industry because we don't have the studios here like they are in Atlanta and like they've traditionally been in Hollywood.

But guess what?

We wanna invite them to come here.

We've got the talent in front of and behind the screen.

- All right, well congratulations to all three of you and we look forward to seeing the television series.

Thanks for being here on "American Black Journal."

- Thank you, Steve.

It's always a pleasure, thank you.

- That's it for us this week.

Thanks for watching.

You can find out more about our guests at americanblackjournal.org and you can always connect with us on Facebook and on Twitter.

Take care and we'll see you next time.

- [Announcer] From Delta faucets to Behr paint, Masco Corporation is proud to deliver products that enhance the way consumers all over the world experience and enjoy their living spaces.

Masco, serving Michigan communities since 1929.

Support also provided by the Cynthia & Edsel Ford Fund for Journalism at Detroit Public TV.

- [Announcer] The DTE Foundation proudly supports 50 years of "American Black Journal" in covering African-American history, culture, and politics.

The DTE Foundation and "American Black Journal," partners in presenting African-American perspectives about our communities and in our world.

- [Announcer] Also brought to you by Nissan Foundation and viewers like you, thank you.

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