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♪ >>> HEY, EVERYBODY, IT'S "REPORTERS ROUNDTABLE."

THANKS FOR JOINING US.

I'M DAVID CRUZ.

WE ARE SIX MONTHS FROM THE STATE'S -- STATEWIDE ELECTION AND THE NEW POLL OUT THIS WEEK FROM MONMOUTH UNIVERSITY FINDS GOVERNOR PHIL MURPHY IN PRETTY GOOD SHAPE, I THINK, BUT POLITICS IS A CRAZY MIXED-UP WORLD, SO WE LEAVE IT TO THE EXPERTS TO INTERPRET IT.

WE'VE GOT THE DIRECTOR OF THE MONMOUTH UNIVERSITY POLL WITH US TODAY, PATRICK MURRAY.

WELCOME BACK TO "ROUNDTABLE."

>> GOOD TO BE WITH YOU, DAVID.

>> SO, A NEW POLL OUT THIS WEEK, YOU COVER A LOT.

OUR ATTENTION IS DRAWN TO THE TOP OF THE TICKET, AS IT WERE.

THE GOVERNOR'S RACE WHICH, FOR BETTER OR WORSE, IS GOING TO BE THE SUBJECT OF A LOT OF NATIONAL ATTENTION IF ONLY BECAUSE IT'S ONE OF TWO GOVERNORS RACES THIS YEAR, BUT YOU GOT NUMBERS ON BIDEN, MENENDEZ, BOOKER, THE LEGISLATURE.

LET'S START WITH MURPHY.

AMONG REGISTERED VOTERS, 57% APPROVED, 36% DISAPPROVE, SO 57% IS PRETTY GOOD, RIGHT?

IT'S NOT 71%, BUT FOR A -- >> RIGHT, WHICH IS WHERE IT WAS A YEAR AGO.

>> SIX MONTHS OUT, NOT TOO BAD, RIGHT?

>> RIGHT.

I MEAN, YOU KNOW, WE HAD THE SAME THING WITH GOVERNOR CHRISTIE AFTER SUPER STORM SANDY HIT.

HE WENT UP TO THE HIGH 70s AND THEN, YOU KNOW, IT STARTED COMING BACK DOWN, ALTHOUGH HE WAS PROBABLY ABOUT 62%, IF I REMEMBER, AT ABOUT THE SAME POINT IN TIME BEFORE HIS RE-ELECTION BID, SO MURPHY'S A COUPLE POINTS BELOW THAT.

IT'S A DIFFERENT TYPE OF CRISIS, OF COURSE.

THAT'S BEEN ONGOING AND HIT EVERYBODY FOR A YEAR.

BUT THOSE ARE POSITIVE MARKS CONSIDERING THAT SOME OTHER GOVERNORS HAVE DROPPED A LOT MORE OVER THE PAST YEAR AS PEOPLE HAVE KIND OF GOTTEN ANTSY ABOUT IT.

I THINK ONE OF THE THINGS WE SEE IN OUR POLLING RIGHT NOW IS THAT NEW JERSEYANS BASICALLY APPROVE OF ALL THE RESTRICTIONS THAT HE HAS PUT IN PLACE OVER THE PAST YEAR, AND THEY ALSO APPROVE OF HIM LIFTING THE RESTRICTIONS AS HE'S ANNOUNCED HE'S DOING THIS MONTH.

SO HE'S BASICALLY BEEN WALKING THAT FINE LINE ON HOW RESTRICTIVE SHOULD SOCIAL DISTANCING MEASURES BE, AND HE'S GETTING GOOD MARKS ON IT, ON BOTH SIDES.

>> I SAW A HEADLINE SOMEWHERE THAT SAID, NEW JERSEY GOVERNOR'S POPULARITY DROPS DOUBLE DIGITS.

I GUESS THAT'S ONE WAY OF LOOKING AT THAT, RIGHT?

I MEAN, HE'S DOWN FROM -- >> YEAH, I MEAN, THAT'S A WAY OF LOOKING AT IT, BUT -- RIGHT.

IF YOU'RE LOOKING AT THE HIGH OF 71% A MONTH AFTER THE PANDEMIC HIT, WHEN EVERY GOVERNOR ACROSS THE COUNTRY WAS GETTING APPROVAL RATINGS IN THE 70s, JUST AS A RALLY AROUND THE FLAG EFFECT, YES, IT'S DROPPED SINCE THEN, BUT THAT'S -- THAT'S A REALLY DISHONEST CONTEXT TO PUT THIS IN, AND I'M NOT TOUTING ANYTHING THAT MURPHY'S DONE HERE.

IT'S JUST THESE ARE SOLID NUMBERS FOR WHERE WE ARE RIGHT NOW.

NOW, HIS RE-ELECT NUMBERS ARE A LITTLE WEAKER THAN THAT RIGHT NOW.

WE HAD HIM AT 48%, YOU KNOW, IN TERMS OF PEOPLE SAID HE DESERVES TO BE RE-ELECTED.

AND I THINK THAT'S A SIGN, RIGHT NOW, OF, YOU KNOW, WHERE BOTH OUR PARTISAN POLITICS ARE BUT ALSO WHERE NEW JERSEYANS ALWAYS ARE AT THIS EARLY STAGE IN A CAMPAIGN.

THEY DON'T TUNE INTO CAMPAIGNS UNTIL LATE IN THE GAME, SO YOU KNOW, ABOUT 77% OF DEMOCRATS SAY THAT THEY ARE READY TO RE-ELECT PHIL MURPHY.

BY THE TIME WE GET TO NOVEMBER, THAT'S GOING TO BE 90-SOME PERCENT.

IT'S BECAUSE NEW JERSEYANS KIND OF SIT ON THE FENCE RIGHT NOW.

THEY'VE ALREADY HAD A GOVERNOR THAT THEY'VE BEEN BITTEN BY WHO RODE A CRISIS TO HUGE RE-ELECTION MARGIN, SO YOU KNOW, THERE'S A LITTLE BIT OF RETICENCE THERE AND WE'VE SEEN THAT IN THE PAST WHERE NEW JERSEYANS WILL HOLD BACK AND SAY, MAYBE SOMETHING COULD GO SOUTH BY NOVEMBER AND I MIGHT CHANGE MY MIND.

SO, THOSE NUMBERS LOOK LIKE NUMBERS THAT WE'VE SEEN IN THE PAST WHERE THE RE-ELECT NUMBERS ARE SLIGHTLY BEHIND THE JOB APPROVAL NUMBERS FOR THE INCU INCUMBENT GOVERNOR.

>> SO, YOU LIST NUMBERS FOR ALL ADULTS AND FOR REGISTERED VOTERS.

WHY DO YOU DO THAT?

>> WELL, BECAUSE, YOU'RE ASKING TWO QUESTIONS FROM OUR POLL THAT, QUITE FRANKLY, I THINK, ARE THE LEAST IMPORTANT QUESTIONS.

THEY'RE GOOD BENCHMARKS FOR HOW MURPHY IS DOING BUT WE HAVE 100 OTHER QUESTIONS -- NOT 100 -- WE HAVE ABOUT 50 OTHER QUESTIONS IN OUR POLL ABOUT WHAT LIFE IS LIKE IN NEW JERSEY, ABOUT VACCINE HESITANCY, WHICH IS THE BIGGEST POLICY ISSUE RIGHT NOW, AND WE NEED TO ASK ALL NEW JERSEYANS ABOUT THOSE ISSUES IN ORDER TO UNDERSTAND IT.

THAT'S WHY I GOT INTO POLLING.

I DIDN'T GET INTO POLLING BECAUSE I WANTED TO SEE IF I COULD PREDICT ELECTIONS.

I GOT INTO POLLING BECAUSE I WANTED TO UNDERSTAND WHAT MADE PEOPLE TICK, WHAT MADE OUR PUBLIC TICK, AND IN ORDER TO DO THAT, YOU GOT TO ASK EVERYBODY.

>> RIGHT.

SO, THE SIGNIFICANCE OF SAYING, THESE ARE REGISTERED VOTERS REALLY DEALS SPECIFICALLY WITH THOSE ELECTION AND RE-ELECTION NUMBERS IS WHAT YOU'RE SAYING.

>> RIGHT.

YEAH.

WHEN WE GET TO THE ELECTION -- RIGHT.

>> THE BROADER QUESTION -- >> RIGHT.

AND QUITE FRANKLY, IF I'M -- I WANT TO KNOW WHAT EVERYBODY IN NEW JERSEY THINKS OF THE GOVERNOR RIGHT NOW, EVEN IF THEY'RE NOT GOING TO VOTE IN THE ELECTION COMING UP IN NOVEMBER.

THAT'S THE JOB THAT WE HAVE AS A POLLSTER.

WHEN WE GET TO NOVEMBER AND WE'RE TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHAT THE ELECTION LOOKS LIKE, YEAH, THEN WE'RE GOING TO BE LOOKING AT REGISTERED VOTERS AND LIKELY VOTERS BUT RIGHT NOW, THIS EARLY STAGE, NEW JERSEYANS AREN'T PAYING ATTENTION TO THIS ELECTION.

WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THIS ELECTION, BUT THE VAST MAJORITY OF VOTERS, LIKE 99.9% OF VOTERS OUT THERE IN NEW JERSEY REALLY AREN'T GIVING NOVEMBER A SECOND THOUGHT RIGHT NOW.

>> RIGHT.

RIGHT.

SO, I MEAN, YOU MENTIONED THAT 48% NUMBER.

AND IT NOT BEING A RINGING ENDORSEMENT.

IS THAT WHERE SOMEONE LIKE A JACK CIATTARELLI AND THE NEW JERSEY REPUBLICANS WOULD WANT TO SAY, HEY, THERE'S A GOOD NUMBER FOR US RIGHT NOW?

>> WELL, HERE, IF YOU DIG DOWN INTO THE POLL, WE DID ASK ABOUT DIFFERENT ISSUES AND DIFFERENT GROUPS THAT PHIL MURPHY HAS BENEFITTED, LIKE, YOU KNOW, HE'S DONE REALLY WELL BY POOR RESIDENTS.

HIS POLICIES ARE GOOD THERE.

THERE'S ONE GROUP FROM PHIL MURPHY IS GETTING REALLY BAD GRADES AND THAT'S HOW HE'S DEALT WITH PROPERTY TAXPAYERS.

NEARLY HALF SAY HE'S HURT THEM.

NOW, THE THING IS, NEW JERSEY PROPERTY TAX IS A PERENNIAL ISSUE.

IT'S NOT AN ISSUE RIGHT NOW.

SO ONE THING THAT'S POSSIBLE IS IF BY NOVEMBER, THE PANDEMIC SOMEHOW, LIKE, TOTALLY CLEARS UP AND NEW JERSEYANS CAN PUT THEIR ATTENTION TO OTHER ISSUES, LIKE THAT PERENNIAL ISSUE OF PROPERTY TAXES, THERE IS AN ENTRY POINT, YOU KNOW, FOR JACK CIATTARELLI OR WHOEVER THE REPUBLICAN NOMINEE IS TO KIND OF MAKE, YOU KNOW, IF YOU CAN CHANGE PEOPLE'S MINDS ABOUT WHAT'S THE MOST IMPORTANT ISSUE, WHETHER IT'S PROPERTY TAXES RATHER THAN THE PANDEMIC, JACK CIATTARELLI HAS AN OPPORTUNITY TO DENT THE GOVERNOR BUT OUR POLLING SHOWS THAT'S NOT THE TOP ISSUE SO EVEN IF THEY DON'T LIKE THE JOB HE'S DOING WITH PROPERTY TAXES, THAT DOESN'T SEEM TO BE IMPACTING HIS RE-ELECTION CHANCES AT THIS POINT IN TIME.

>> I THOUGHT IT WAS INTERESTING WHEN IT CAME TO THE QUESTION ABOUT WHETHER THE GOVERNOR WAS IN THIS FOR NEW JERSEY OR IN IT FOR HIMSELF, ALMOST HALF THE PEOPLE SAID THEY THOUGHT HE WAS IN IT FOR JERSEY.

I MEAN, IS THAT AN INDICATION THAT THE GOVERNOR'S KIND OF EARNING HIS JERSEY BONA FIDES?

>> YES, I THINK SO, BECAUSE THAT WAS -- THAT BECAME -- THAT WAS A QUESTION WE STARTED ASKING WITH CHRIS CHRISTIE BECAUSE THAT BECAME A KEY INDICATOR FOR US, MORE SO THAN ANYTHING ELSE, ABOUT WHERE THE DIRECTION OF PUBLIC OPINION WAS GOING TO GO ON CHRIS CHRISTIE.

YOU KNOW, HAS THE GOVERNOR ABANDONED THE STATE OR IS THE GOVERNOR SIMPLY USING HIS CURRENT OFFICE AS A STEPPING-STONE TO NATIONAL POLITICS?

SO, RIGHT NOW, THOSE NUMBERS ARE A NET POSITIVE FOR PHIL MURPHY, MORE PEOPLE THINK HE'S IN IT FOR THE STATE THAN IN IT FOR HIMSELF, BUT AGAIN, I SAID I THINK ONE OF THE REASONS WHY HIS RE-ELECT NUMBER IS BELOW 50% RIGHT NOW IS THEY FELT THAT WAY ABOUT CHRIS CHRISTIE BEFORE HIS RE-ELECTION IN 2013, AND THEN THAT NUMBER SHIFTED DRAMATICALLY, I MEAN, BY THE TIME CHRISTIE LEFT OFFICE, ONLY 14% SAID HE WAS IN IT FOR THE STATE AND I THINK IT WAS 79% WHO SAID IN IT FOR HIMSELF AND THAT'S, I THINK, WHAT A LOT OF PEOPLE IN NEW JERSEY ARE WORRIED ABOUT AFTER WE GET PAST THIS ELECTION.

>> YOU MENTIONED HE HAD PRETTY BAD NUMBERS AMONG TAXPAYERS, BUT ALSO PEOPLE WHO IDENTIFY AS MIDDLE CLASS SAY THAT HE HAS NOT HELPED THEM, AND THAT'S A BIG CHUNK OF PEOPLE.

WE'RE GOING TO BE HEARING LOTS ABOUT THE MIDDLE CLASS THIS ELECTION SEASON.

>> RIGHT.

YOU KNOW, THE COST OF LIVING, PROPERTY TAXES, ALL THOSE THINGS PILE TOGETHER.

ALTHOUGH, HIS NUMBERS AREN'T GREAT ON THE MIDDLE CLASS, BUT LOOKING BACK AT PAST GOVERNORS AND PARTICULARLY JOHN CORZINE, WHO CHRIS CHRISTIE BEAT IN 2009, HIS NUMBERS AREN'T HORRIBLE THERE.

THEY COULD, IN FACT, BE WORSE.

SO, THAT'S NOT THE BIGGEST THING THAT I SEE IN THIS POLL THAT IS A POTENTIAL WARNING SIGN FOR HIM.

IT COULD BE DOWN THE LINE, BUT IT'S -- IT'S ACTUALLY, THOSE NUMBERS ARE A LITTLE STRONGER THAN THEY MAY HAVE BEEN FOR A PRIOR DEMOCRATIC GOVERNOR, SO THAT'S ACTUALLY NOT A BAD SIGN FOR HIM THAT THEY'RE NOT AS HORRIBLE AS YOU MIGHT THINK.

>> SO, THE PRESIDENT, AS EXPECTED, I GUESS, DOING WELL IN BLUE JERSEY.

MEANWHILE, SENATOR CORY BOOKER DOING BETTER THAN SENATOR BOB MENENDEZ, ALTHOUGH MENENDEZ BEING IN THE MAJORITY WITH SENIORITY MAY NOT CARE TOO MUCH ABOUT THIS, BUT I THINK THIS POLL IS ACTUALLY AN IMPROVEMENT FOR HIM SLIGHTLY, BUT IS HE EVER GOING TO BE LOVED AGAIN, BOB MENENDEZ?

>> YEAH, I MEAN, WHO KNOWS WHETHER HE'LL EVER BE LOVED AGAIN.

THINGS CAN CHANGE.

ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE SEE, LIKE, CORY BOOKER'S NUMBERS ARE HIGHER, HE'S GOT A SLIGHTLY BETTER REPUTATION BUT HE'S ALSO BETTER KNOWN FROM HIS NATIONAL PROFILES, PRESIDENTIAL RUNS AND SO FORTH.

SO, THE FACT THAT -- YOU KNOW, BOB MENENDEZ, WHEN HE RAN FOR -- STARTED RUNNING FOR RE-ELECTION, YOU KNOW, IN 2020, IS THAT INITIALLY AS THE CAMPAIGN STARTED, HIS NUMBERS WEREN'T ALL THAT GREAT BECAUSE HE WAS COMING OFF HIS TRIAL, BUT THEN THEY IMPROVED AND HE'S GOT A NET POSITIVE NOW AND HE'S BEEN HOLDING ON TO THAT NET POSITIVE SO NOTHING'S CHANGED THAT SO FOR HIM, THAT'S A POSITIVE.

CORY BOOKER, ON THE OTHER HAND, HIS NUMBERS HAVE GONE UP AND HE'S GOT THE BEST RATING THAT HE HAS HAD IN OUR POLLS AT 57% SINCE HE TOOK OFFICE IN 2013.

>> ALL RIGHT.

LOTS OF GOOD STUFF IN THIS POLL.

GOOD INFORMATION.

PATRICK MURRAY, DIRECTOR OF THE MONMOUTH UNIVERSITY POLL, GOOD TO SEE YOU, MAN.

THANKS FOR TAKING A FEW MINUTES.

>> SAME HERE.

THANKS A LOT, DAVID.

>> ALL RIGHT, LET'S BRING IN OUR PANEL NOW.

KAREN YEE COVERS THE STATE FOR WNYC RADIO.

SEAN SULLIVAN IS WITH NJ ADVANCE MEDIA AND CHARLES IS THE POLITICAL COLUMNIST FOR THE RECORD "USA TODAY" NETWORK.

PANEL, GOOD TO SEE YOU ALL.

WHAT DO YOU THINK OF THIS POLL, AND SHOULD THE MURPHY CAMPAIGN BE CHEERING THE NUMBERS, CHARLES?

THOUGHTS?

>> WELL, I THINK THAT'S -- GIVEN THAT THEY'RE COMING OFF A PANDEMIC, GIVEN THERE'S BEEN A LOT OF BLOWBACK IN SOME QUARTERS OVER HIS LOCKDOWNS, AND SOME POCKETS OF PEOPLE CONCERNED ABOUT HIS HANDLING OF THE NURSING HOME INDUSTRY, I THINK THOSE ARE -- HE'S COMING OUT OF IT IN A PRETTY STRONG -- FAIRLY STRONG POSITION.

AND WITH ALL THE POWERS OF INCUMBENCY THAT HE HAS, I THINK, YEAH, THROW THAT POLL NUMBER IN, AND IT 57%, I BELIEVE, APPROVAL USUALLY -- MY UNDERSTANDING WAS ALWAYS YOU HAD TO BREAK THAT 50% THRESHOLD, AND HE'S STARTING OUT AT 57% AFTER COMING DOWN FROM THE STRATOSPHERE, SO YEAH, I THINK HE'S IN A GOOD POSITION RIGHT NOW.

>> WE SPOKE EARLIER IN THE WEEK, YOU AND I, TALKING ABOUT SOME OF THE FREE MEDIA THAT THE GOVERNOR GETS AND NOW HE REALLY HAS TAKEN ADVANTAGE OF THE -- HIS -- THE REACTION TO HIS REACTION TO THE PANDEMIC AND HE HAS REALLY BENEFITTED FROM THAT A LOT, NO?

>> OH, YEAH.

I THINK THIS -- IT'S COMING -- THE SLACKENING OF THE PANDEMIC, THE IMPROVEMENT IS COMING RIGHT AS THE ELECTION RAMPS UP, AND HE IS GOING TO GET OUT IN FRONT OF THAT PARADE AND TAKE CREDIT FOR IT, AND THAT IS ONE OF THE PERKS OF INCUMBENCY.

IT'S THE SAME KIND OF THING WITH THE ECONOMY, EVEN THOUGH YOU MAY NOT NECESSARILY -- THE ECONOMY MAYBE IS NOT AN EASY ANALOGY BECAUSE THAT TAKES ITS OWN VOLITION AND HERE, HE CAN TAKE SOME DIRECT CREDIT FOR, TO A DEGREE, OF MANAGING THE CRISIS.

BUT HE'S GOING TO GET OUT IN FRONT OF THAT PARADE, TAKE CREDIT, AND A LOT OF PEOPLE SEE IN HIM THE MOST VISIBLE POLITICIAN IN NEW JERSEY WHO HAPPENS TO BE RUNNING FOR RE-ELECTION AND WILL BE ON TV AND AD BLITZES.

REALLY, I HAVE YET TO SEE A DEMOCRATIC CANDIDATE OR ANY GOVERNOR BE THIS WELL SET UP FOR A RE-ELECTION THAN PHIL MURPHY.

I THINK CHRISTIE, IN 2013, WAS PRETTY STRONG, BUT THIS IS, I THINK, EVEN SURPASSING THAT.

>> SEAN, THERE'S STILL A LOT OF TIME BETWEEN NOW AND NOVEMBER, THOUGH.

WE HEAR ABOUT THE DEBACLES AT UNEMPLOYMENT, MOTOR VEHICLES, THE LONG-TERM CARE FACILITIES.

ARE THOSE STILL AREAS OF VULNERABILITY FOR THE GOVERNOR?

>> I THINK THEY CAN BE, DEPENDING ON HOW MUCH THE PANDEMIC CONTINUES TO DOMINATE OUR ATTENTION.

YOU KNOW, PARTICULARLY THE NURSING HOME ISSUE.

YOU KNOW, WHEN I HEAR FROM CONSERVATIVE READERS, THAT TENDS TO BE THE THING THAT THEY BRING UP, AND SOME OF MY COLLEAGUES HAVE DONE SOME DEEP DIVE REPORTING ON THE NURSING HOME ISSUE THAT SHOWS THAT THAT WAS A MAJOR MISSTEP, BOTH IN NEW YORK AND NEW JERSEY.

OBVIOUSLY, YOU KNOW, MURPHY HASN'T BEEN SUBJECT TO THE SAME KIND OF BAD PRESS THAT CUOMO HAS IN NEW YORK, BECAUSE THERE HASN'T BEEN EVIDENCE OF -- AS MUCH EVIDENCE AND ALLEGATIONS OF TRYING TO COOK THE BOOKS, BUT YOU KNOW, THE ACTUAL ISSUE ITSELF, I THINK, IS GOING TO END UP BEING A LIABILITY FOR HIM, AND I SEE THAT BEING A MAJOR STICKING POINT WITH WHOEVER HIS REPUBLICAN OPPONENT IS GOING TO END UP BEING.

>> I MEAN, THERE'S ALSO THE LIKELIHOOD THAT BY NOVEMBER, GIVEN THE SHORT ATTENTION SPAN AND SHORT MEMORIES OF VOTERS, THAT THIS COULD ALL BE FORGOTTEN, THOSE, YOU KNOW, THE UNEMPLOYMENT AND ALL THE THINGS WE JUST TALKED ABOUT.

THAT COULD ALL BE FORGOTTEN, AND WE COULD ALL BE SAYING, WOW, WHAT A GREAT SUMMER WE HAD, RIGHT?

>> YEAH, BUT YOU KNOW, THERE'S NEW JOBS NUMBERS OUT TODAY AND IT'S -- THOSE NUMBERS, I MEAN, THIS ISN'T JUST NEW JERSEY.

THIS IS NATIONALLY, BUT UNEMPLOYMENT IS -- SEEMS TO HAVE TAKEN EVERYBODY BY SURPRISE, AND SO I THINK IT'S REALLY GOING TO COME DOWN TO HOW THE REOPENING HAPPENS THIS SUMMER, HOW SMOOTHLY IT GOES, YOU KNOW, WHETHER WE HAVE A SPIKE IN CASES, ALL THE -- ALL THE REOPENING MEASURES THAT ARE GOING INTO EFFECT, YOU KNOW, IF THOSE STAY IN EFFECT, IF THERE IS A SPIKE IN CASES AND THE GOVERNOR HAS TO GO BACK AND SHUT DOWN BUSINESSES AGAIN, YOU KNOW, I THINK THAT YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE A LOT OF PANDEMIC FATIGUE AMONG VOTERS.

>> YEAH.

KAREN, YOU COVER A LOT OF COMMUNITIES THAT ARE TRADITIONALLY UNDERCOUNTED IN A LOT OF THESE POLLS.

WHAT ARE PEOPLE TELLING YOU ABOUT THE GOVERNOR IN YOUR TRAVELS AROUND THE STATE?

>> I THINK WHAT I'M HEARING IS THAT WHILE THEY'RE HAPPY, YOU KNOW, MURPHY'S A PROGRESSIVE, HE'S PASSED THE $15 MINIMUM WAGE, HE'S DONE SO MUCH FOR THE MIDDLE CLASS, FOR LOWER INCOME RESIDENTS, BUT I THINK WHERE I'M HEARING A LOT OF PUSHBACK AND A LOT OF CONCERN IS WHY NEW JERSEY HASN'T DONE ANYTHING TO HELP UNDOCUMENTED IMMIGRANTS, RIGHT?

YOU HAD, ACROSS THE RIVER, NEW YORK PASSING THIS $2.1 BILLION FUND FOR UNDOCUMENTED IMMIGRANTS, STATES LED BY REPUBLICAN GOVERNORS DIRECTING FEDERAL FUNDS TO UNDOCUMENTED IMMIGRANTS THAT HAVE BEEN SHUT OUT OF RELIEF, SO I THINK THERE'S CONCERN ABOUT, WHAT ABOUT THE MOST VULNERABLE, AND WHY ARE THEY BEING LEFT OUT?

WHEN, YOU KNOW, HE'S DONE REALLY GREAT THINGS BUT WHEN IT MATTERS TO HELPING THESE PEOPLE BE ABLE TO PAY THEIR BILLS, PAY THEIR RENT, HE HASN'T REALLY DELIVERED.

>> THESE ARE THEORETICALLY HIS ALLIES ON THE LEFT AND THE, I GUESS, CONVENTIONAL WISDOM IS WHERE ARE THEY GOING TO GO?

THEY'RE NOT GOING TO GO TO A JACK CIATTARELLI OR WHOEVER THE REPUBLICAN CANDIDATE IS FOR GOVERNOR, RIGHT?

>> RIGHT.

>> RIGHT.

EXACTLY.

AND I THINK THAT'S -- AND YOU KNOW, UNDOCUMENTED IMMIGRANTS CAN'T VOTE, RIGHT, SO IT'S A HARD -- BUT I THINK WHAT I HEAR IS EVEN THOUGH UNDOCUMENTED IMMIGRANTS CAN'T VOTE, THEY HAVE TO HAVE MEMBERS WHO CAN AND INCREASINGLY, I THINK THE PLIGHT AND THE STRUGGLES OF IMMIGRANT POPULATIONS ARE BECOMING A PROGRESSIVE ISSUE.

YOU SEE HOW MUCH THE DETENTION OF IMMIGRANTS AND I.C.E.

'S ROLE HERE IN NEW JERSEY REALLY BECAME A PROGRESSIVE ISSUE OVER THE SUMMER, AND YOU KNOW, YOU SAW DEMOCRATS CAVE INTO THAT WITH THEM CANCELING A LOT OF CONTRACTS ACROSS THE STATE WITH I.C.E.

>> ALL RIGHT, CHARLIE, YOU WROTE ABOUT THE GOVERNOR KIND OF RECASTING HIMSELF AS A MODERN DAY FDR.

NEXT, WE TAKE BERLIN, HE SAID THIS WEEK.

WORLD WAR II REFERENCES?

WHO IS HE TALKING TO?

>> WELL, I THINK HE'S JUST TRYING TO GLOM ON TO THE BIDEN MYSTIQUE OR THE -- I THINK HE'S TRYING TO GLOM ON TO BIDEN'S GLOMMING ON OF THE ROOSEVELT MYSTIQUE.

IT'S POPULAR RIGHT NOW.

IT'S GENERATING A GOOD VIBE IN THE ELECTORATE, PARTICULARLY IN THE DEMOCRATIC BASE, AND SO, WHY NOT WRAP YOURSELF IN ROOSEVELT'S CAPE THAT HE WORE AT YALTA, YOU KNOW?

AND YOU'D ALMOST, YOU KNOW, REMEMBER, HE'S -- THAT REFERENCE IS IN HIS FRONTAL LOBE A LITTLE BIT.

HE WAS A FORMER AMBASSADOR TO GERMANY.

AND HE'S USED THIS SORT OF MARSHALING THE TROOPS SORT OF CRISIS COMMANDER MILITARISTIC LANGUAGE IN THE -- EARLIER.

AND I THINK IT HAS HELPED, YOU KNOW, GALVANIZE THE PUBLIC'S SUPPORT.

>> SUMMER'S GOING TO BE PIVOTAL, OBVIOUSLY, FOR THE STATE AND FOR THE GOVERNOR.

THE PLAN IS TO REOPEN ALMOST EVERYTHING, AND THAT DEPENDS A LOT ON THESE VACCINATION RATES.

THAT'S A KEY COMPONENT.

KAREN, YOU HAD A COUPLE OF PIECES THIS WEEK ON HOW THAT'S GOING.

YOU WERE IN NEW BRIUNSWICK AND YOU HAD ANOTHER PIECE ABOUT PRIMARY CARE PHYSICIANS WHO ARE EXPECTED TO TAKE ON SOME OF THE VAX LOAD.

TELL ME ABOUT THAT.

>> I THINK THE GOVERNOR'S STRATEGY AND THE STATE'S STRATEGY UP UNTIL THIS POINT HAS BEEN, GET AS MANY SHOTS INTO ARMS AND PART OF THAT IS BECAUSE THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT SAID, USE THEM OR LOSE THEM.

THE DISTRIBUTION WAS VERY MUCH ABOUT, IF YOU DON'T USE THE VACCINES, YOU'RE NOT GOING TO GET SUPPLY, SO THEY REALLY FUNNELED THEIR SUPPLIES INTO THESE MASS SITES, THESE SIX MEGA SITES, YOU KNOW, THE FEMA OPENED A SITE IN NEWARK, BUT I THINK WHAT THAT DID IS IT LEFT OUT PEOPLE WHO MAY NOT HAVE TRANSPORTATION TO SITES, MAY NOT SPEAK ENGLISH, MAY BE HOMEBOUND, MAY BE SENIOR RESIDENTS WHO COULDN'T GET APPOINTMENTS ONLINE, AND SO WHAT YOU HAVE TAKING PLACE -- THAT'S TAKEN PLACE IN THE LAST FEW WEEKS AND COMMUNITY GROUPS STEPPING UP AND SAYING, WE ARE GOING TO TRY AND VACCINATE OUR OWN PEOPLE AND PARTNERING WITH LOCAL CLINICS ACTUALLY MAKES RESERVATIONS FOR PEOPLE, SO I THOUGHT IT WAS AN INTERESTING MODEL IN NEW BRUNSWICK BECAUSE A CLINIC THERE TOLD ME THAT WHEN THEY OPENED UP THEIR APPOINTMENTS USING THE STATE REGISTRATION SITE, THEY WERE GETTING PEOPLE FROM TWO HOURS AWAY, FROM SOUTH JERSEY, FROM ACROSS THE STATE.

WHEN THEY STOPPED DOING THAT AND THEY PARTNERED WITH 12 LOCAL GROUPS, INCLUDING A LOCAL BOARD OF EDUCATION, THEY STARTED GETTING LOCALS, PEOPLE WHO WERE REFERRED TO THEM BY THE BOARD OF EDUCATION, REFERRED TO THEM BY CHURCHES OR NONPROFITS.

SO THAT WAS A MORE LOCALIZED STRATEGY, AND SO I THINK THAT CAN BE A MODEL, AND WE'RE NOW SHIFTING GEARS.

MURPHY IS NOW SHIFTING GEARS TO TRY AND GET THE VACCINE, AS HE PUT IT, INTO ALL THE CREVICES, SO WORKING MORE WITH CHURCHES AND TRYING TO REACH PEOPLE, I THINK, WHO WANT IT AND DON'T HAVE ACCESS, WHO MADE IT AND NEED TO TALK TO SOMEBODY THEY TRUST AND I THINK THE MORE CHALLENGING PART IS HOW YOU GET IT TO PEOPLE WHO REALLY DON'T WANT IT, HOW DO YOU CONVINCE THEM TO GET THE VACCINE.

>> IS A SHOT AND A BEER, IS THAT CAMPAIGN GOING TO DO IT?

>> WELL, I MEAN, I THINK IT HAS BEEN A LOW STAKES, LOW INVESTMENT PROGRAM TO GET PEOPLE TO WANT TO GET THE SHOT AND IT MAKES IT A SOCIAL THING, A THING YOU CAN INSTAGRAM.

AND MORE PEOPLE GET THE SHOT OR THEY TELL THEIR FRIENDS, YOU KNOW, I DON'T THINK IT'S -- YOU KNOW, IF IT WORKS, IT WORKS, RIGHT?

LIKE, IT'S NOT HUGE MONEY THAT'S GOING INTO IT.

I THINK IT'S MURPHY SAYING, WE GOT TO TRY EVERYTHING, AND I THINK THE STATE REALLY DOES HAVE TO GET CREATIVE TO MAKE SURE WE HIT THE GOAL OF VACCINATING 70% OF THE ELIGIBLE POPULATION BY JUNE 30th, BUT YOU KNOW, WE REACH A POINT OF HERD IMMUNITY.

SO, WHEN THINGS REOPEN, THERE'S -- IT COMES WITH SAFETY.

PEOPLE AREN'T GETTING SICK AND GOING TO THE HOSPITALS IN THE NUMBERS WE WERE SEEING ALL LAST YEAR.

>> SEAN, YOU ALSO HAD A PIECE ABOUT POLICE REFORM AND HOW THE STATE IS FALLING SHORT OF ITS RHETORIC IN THAT REGARD.

TELL ME A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THAT.

>> YEAH, I MEAN, I'VE BEEN LOOKING EVER SINCE ALL THE UNREST LAST SUMMER AND, YOU KNOW, THIS IS AN ISSUE I FOLLOWED FOR A LONG TIME, JUST AT SOME OF THE REFORMS THAT FOLKS ARE TALKING ABOUT AROUND THE COUNTRY, AND YOU KNOW, AFTER THE DEREK CHAUVIN VERDICT FOR THE MURDER OF GEORGE FLOYD, I NOTICED THAT PRETTY MUCH EVERY ELECTED OFFICIAL IN THE STATE OF NEW JERSEY PUT OUT SOME SORT OF EFFUSIVE STATEMENT, AND SO I JUST WANTED TO CHECK IN AND SEE WHAT SOME OF THESE REFORM MEASURES THAT ADVOCATES HAVE BEEN PUSHING, YOU KNOW, WHERE THEY STAND, AND FRANKLY, THE LEGISLATURE AND THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE MOSTLY SEEMED CONTENT TO LET THE ATTORNEY GENERAL DRIVE THE BUS ON THIS AND I THINK PART OF THAT IS BECAUSE WE'RE IN AN ELECTION YEAR AND YOU KNOW, HE'S NOT AN ELECTED OFFICIAL.

BUT I LOOKED AT EVERYTHING FROM INTERNAL AFFAIRS TRANSPARENCY, WHICH HAS BEEN A BIG ISSUE HERE IN NEW JERSEY.

WE'RE BEHIND FLORIDA IN THAT REGARD.

YOU CAN GET ACCESS TO RECORDS IN THE STATE OF FLORIDA AND IN MOST OTHER STATES BUT NEW JERSEY'S ONE OF 20 STATES THAT DOESN'T DO THAT.

AND EVEN THE ATTORNEY GENERAL, HE'S DONE A LOT OF -- HE'S KIND OF MADE POLICE REFORM ONE OF HIS MARQUEE ISSUES BUT AT THE SAME TIME, HIS OFFICE HAS BEEN THE SUPREME COURT JUST LAST WEEK ARGUING TO UPHOLD POLICE'S POWER TO PULL YOU OVER BECAUSE YOUR LICENSE PLATE HOLD E THE ONE YOU GET FROM THE CAR DEALERSHIP, COVERS THE WORDS "GARDEN STATE" ON THE PLATE.

AND SO, YOU KNOW, THEY SIMILARLY WENT TO BAT TO PREVENT CIVILIAN REVIEW BOARDS FROM GETTING SUBPOENA POWER, WHICH IS SOMETHING THAT A LOT OF ACTIVISTS AND SOME OFFICIALS IN MAJOR CITIES LIKE NEWARK, ESPECIALLY, REALLY WANTED TO BEEF UP THEIR CIVILIAN REVIEW BOARDS AND IF THEY DON'T HAVE THE POWER TO SUBPOENA RECORDS FROM POLICE DEPARTMENTS, THEY ARE RELYING ON PUBLIC DISCLOSURE, AND SO THE PROPONENTS OF THIS ARGUE THEY CAN'T DO THE JOB OF ACTUALLY OVERSEEING THE POLICE BECAUSE THEY'RE LOCKED OUT THE SAME WAY THE REST OF THE PUBLIC IS.

>> CHARLIE, IN AN ELECTION YEAR, NO ONE SHOULD HOLD OUT ANY HOPE FOR ANY CONTROVERSIAL ISSUES TO BE DEALT WITH, RIGHT?

>> WELL, IT DEPENDS.

THERE HAS BEEN SOME MOVEMENT ON THE CIVILIAN REVIEW BOARD BILL.

IT CLEARED COMMITTEE IN MARCH.

WE'LL SEE WHERE IT GOES FROM NOW.

I THINK THE SPEAKER, CRAIG COUGHLIN, HAS BEEN SOMEWHAT MUM ABOUT ITS PROSPECTS AND I THINK SOME OF THE THINGS THAT SEAN'S TALKED ABOUT, I DON'T SEE MUCH PROSPECT FOR THEM AS THING CRANK UP FOR THE CAMPAIGN.

>> ALL RIGHT.

INACTION IS AN ACTION.

CHARLES, SEAN, KAREN, GOOD TO SEE YOU ALL.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

THAT'S "ROUNDTABLE" FOR THE WEEK.

THANKS ALSO TO PATRICK MURRAY.

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