JON CAMPBELL IS FROM GOTHAMIST AND WNYC AND ZACH WILLIAMS IS FROM THE "NEW YORK POST."

THANK YOU BOTH FOR BEING HERE.

THANK YOU.

THANK YOU.

JON, I WANT TO TURN TO YOU FIRST ABOUT THIS METHANE THING.

WE HAVE EXPLAINED THE SCIENCE SO WE DON'T HAVE TO REHASH THAT.

WE EXPLAINED THE COST SAVINGS.

I'M MORE INTERESTED IN KIND OF LIKE THE REALLY BIG PUSH FOR THIS AT THE START OF THE WEEK FROM HOCHUL ADMINISTRATION AND BY THE MIDDLE OF THE WEEK, THEY BACK OFF AND SAID, NEVER MIND.

YEAH.

ABSOLUTELY.

AND WHAT HAPPENED IN BETWEEN.

YOU SAW ENVIRONMENTAL GROUPS AND ENVIRONMENTAL ADVOCATES REALLY RISE UP AGAINST IT AND SAY IT WOULD BE A WAY OF ESSENTIALLY GUTTING THIS TOP-IN-THE-NATION CLIMATE LAW THAT THEY WERE SO PROUD OF JUST A COUPLE YEARS AGO.

IT WAS-- YOU SAW THE STRENGTH OF THE ENVIRONMENTAL MOVEMENT STAND UP.

THAT SAID, IT'S NOT DEAD, DEAD.

I MEAN, THE HOCHUL ADMINISTRATION SAYS, WELL, YOU KNOW, WE'RE NOT GOING TO PRIORITIZE IT IN THE BUDGET NEGOTIATIONS, BUT IT'S STILL GOING TO BE HANGING AROUND.

IT'S STILL GOING TO BE A STAND-ALONE BILL EVEN IF IT DOESN'T FIND ITS WAY IN HERE.

AND THERE WILL BE MORE DEBATE ABOUT THIS IN THE FUTURE.

I'M SO INTERESTED IN THE BEHIND-THE-SCENES PART OF THIS WHOLE THING THAT WE'RE PROBABLY NEVER GONNA FIND OUT WHERE ON MONDAY, IT WAS LIKE A VERY BIG PRIORITY AND THEN TWO DAYS LATER, THEY HAD TO JUST CLAW IT BACK BECAUSE OF, YOU KNOW, SOME VERY POWERFUL VOICES AT THE CAPITOL FROM THE ENVIRONMENTALISTS AND I KNOW THE GOVERNOR, IN PARTICULAR, WANTS CLIMATE TO BE PART OF HER LEGACY.

I CAN IMAGINE THAT IS A BIG DEAL.

ZACH, I SAW THIS AS KIND OF-- KIND OF PART OF A LARGER PATTERN FROM THIS ADMINISTRATION OF KIND OF TRYING TO DO SOMETHING AND THEN PEOPLE WOULD MIGHT BE CONSIDERED MORE PROGRESSIVE KIND OF STOPPING THAT BECAUSE THEY HAVE A GROWING POWER AT THE CAPITOL.

WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT THAT?

WELL, WE'VE SEEN IN RECENT MONTHS THE GOVERNOR MAKE A SERIES OF KIND OF BAFFLING MOVES, YOU KNOW, NOMINATING JUDGE LASALLE TO BE THE CHIEF JUDGE OF THE COURT OF APPEALS AND NOW WITH THIS ENVIRONMENTAL PROPOSAL WHERE WE KIND OF PUT IT OUT THERE.

SHE COULDN'T POSSIBLY HAVE THOUGHT THAT IT WAS GOING TO GO OVER WELL, BUT SHE DID IT ANYWAYS ONLY TO BACKTRACK AFTER AT LEAST IN THIS CASE A PRETTY STUNNING DISPLAY OF PRESSURE FROM THE ENVIRONMENTAL MOVEMENT THAT I THINK MAKES AN INTERESTING COMPARISON WITH WHAT WE'VE SEEN ON BAIL REFORM, HERE, WE HAVE THE GOVERNOR ENRAGING THE LEFT ON MULTIPLE FRONTS BUT WHEREAS, SHE QUICKLY RETREATED ON THE ENVIRONMENTAL PROPOSAL ON RECALCULATING METHANE EMISSIONS.

SHE'S STILL STICKING TO HER GUNS ON THIS VERY CONTROVERSIAL PROPOSAL TO OVERHAUL CASH BAIL LAWS DESPITE, YOU KNOW, YEARS OF PRESSURE AND THAT IS CONTINUING UP AND THROUGH BUDGET TALKS, AND I GUESS THE GOVERNOR, IN THIS CASE, BIT OFF A LITTLE BIT MORE THAN SHE COULD CHEW AND KIND OF STOOD BACK AND SAID, NO, I WANT TO FIGHT ABOUT BAIL AND CONCENTRATE ON THAT.

SO WE'RE TALKING FRIDAY MORNING.

IF YOU ARE WATCHING ON SUNDAY, I APOLOGIZE.

THIS MAY BE A LITTLE BIT OF OLD NEWS NOW BUT BUDGET NEGOTIATIONS WILL BE HAPPENING EVERY DAY.

THEY WILL HAPPEN THIS WEEKEND.

IT'S A HOLIDAY WEEKEND.

THE LEADERS WILL STILL BE IN TOWN PRESUMABLY.

IS BAIL REFORM STILL THE STICKING POINT IN YOUR EYES, ZACH?

IS THAT KIND OF WHERE WE ARE STILL COMPARED TO THE EARLY PART?

BAIL REFORM HAS REALLY SET THE TONE FOR ALL THE NEGOTIATIONS BETWEEN THE GOVERNOR AND THE LEGISLATURE.

ALL THE TALK ABOUT THE DELAYED BUDGET THAT'S MOSTLY BECAUSE OF BAIL.

THERE HAVE BEEN DISAGREEMENTS ABOUT HOUSING AND OF COURSE, SOME OTHER PROPOSALS BUT YOU KNOW, SPEAKER CARL HEASTIE EARLIER THIS WEEK SAID THAT BAIL WAS SUCKING UP LIKE 90% OF THE POLITICAL OXYGEN IN BUDGET TALKS.

RIGHT.

NOW THERE WERE HINTS A LITTLE BIT LATER IN THE WEEK THAT THEY WERE COVERING OTHER TOPICS AS WELL, BUT I THINK EVERYBODY THAT'S WATCHING THESE NEGOTIATIONS CLOSELY WOULD SAY THAT UNTIL THEY FIGURE OUT BAIL AND WHAT THE LEGISLATURE GETS AND WHAT THE GOVERNOR GETS, IT'S GOING TO BE PRETTY HARD TO KIND OF BRANCH OUT INTO ALL THE OTHER ISSUES THAT THEY GOT TO SOLVE HERE.

JON, CAN YOU TALK ABOUT THE DYNAMICS OF THIS FOR MEMBERS OF OUR AUDIENCE WHO MAY NOT BE FAMILIAR WITH THE BUDGET PROCESS?

THE GOVERNOR HAS EXTRAORDINARY POWER IN THE BUDGET PROCESS IN NEW YORK.

YOU KNOW, IS THIS A TYPICAL MOVE FROM A GOVERNOR IN NEW YORK, TO TRY TO GET WHAT THEY WANT?

WELL, IT WAS A TYPICAL MOVE IN THE PRE-CUOMO YEARS.

YES.

I MEAN, BUDGETS WERE LATE AND VERY LATE, AND GOVERNORS OFTEN TRIED TO USE THAT TO THEIR ADVANTAGE, USE THAT AS LEVERAGE TO GET THINGS THAT THEY WANTED.

IN PART BECAUSE WHEN THE BUDGET IS LATE, LAWMAKERS DON'T GET PAID.

THEIR PAY IS WITHHELD UNTIL THAT WHOLE BUDGET IS IN PLACE.

THAT'S THE SITUATION WE HAVE NOW.

GOVERNOR HOCHUL HAS MADE VERY CLEAR IN HER TWO YEARS THAT SHE IS WILLING TO PUSH THE BUDGET LATE IN ORDER TO GET WHAT SHE WANTS.

SHE GOT SOME BAIL CHANGES LAST YEAR.

SHE GOT THE BUFFALO BILLS STADIUM DEAL INCLUDED IN THE BUDGET LAST YEAR, IN PART BY GOING NINE DAYS LATE.

WE'RE SEEING THAT HAPPEN THIS YEAR AS WELL AND WHETHER OR NOT SHE'LL BE SUCCESSFUL, I MEAN, SHE IS REALLY HOLDING OUT FOR HER CHANGES TO THE BAIL LAWS.

SHE WANTS TO REMOVE THE LEAST RESTRICTIVE STANDARD, QUOTE, UNQUOTE, AND SHE'S MAKING VERY CLEAR THAT THAT'S WHAT SHE WANTS AND THAT'S WHAT SHE'S GOING TO HOLD OUT FOR.

YOU KNOW, I DID FIND IT INTERESTING, AS YOU SAID, ZACH, BY THE MIDDLE OF THE WEEK THEY SEEMED TO BE TALKING OTHER THINGS BESIDES BAIL.

PROBABLY NOT TO A GREAT EXTENT, BUT I THINK THE OTHER BIG CONFLICT HERE IS THE HOUSING PROPOSAL FROM THE GOVERNOR.

IT'S GOTTEN A LOT OF PUSHBACK, PARTICULARLY FROM PEOPLE IN THE SUBURBS WHO DON'T LIKE THE REQUIREMENT TO BUILD HOUSING NEAR TRANSIT, FOR EXAMPLE, AND HONESTLY, THEY JUST DON'T LIKE THE REQUIREMENT TO BUILD HOUSING.

THEY WANT TO DO IT ON THEIR TERMS AND IN THEIR OWN WAY.

JON, DO YOU STILL SEE THAT AS A STICKING POINT IN THE PROCESS?

OH, ABSOLUTELY.

I MEAN, THAT'S THE OTHER BIG STICKING POINT.

YEAH.

IS THE IDEA OF WHETHER OR NOT-- AS ANDREA STEWART-COUSINS, THE SENATE LEADER SAID, ARE WE GOING WITH THE CARROT APPROACH OR STICK APPROACH?

AND WHETHER OR NOT THEIR-- HOUSING PLAN IS GOING TO BE BASED ON, YOU KNOW, QUOTE, UNQUOTE, PUNITIVE MEASURES WHERE THE STATE CAN STEP IN AND OVERRIDE LOCAL CONTROL OR IF IT'S GOING TO START WITH OFFERING INCENTIVES TO TRY TO INCENTIVIZE THE BUILDING AND THE HOUSING LOCALLY.

THAT SAID, THERE ARE OTHER BIG ISSUES OUT THERE.

YES.

BEYOND THOSE TWO THAT WE HAVE NO IDEA WHERE THEY'RE AT RIGHT NOW.

CHARTER SCHOOLS IS ONE WHERE THE GOVERNOR AND THE LEGISLATURE ARE DIAMETRICALLY OPPOSED.

THE GOVERNOR WANTS TO EXPAND CHARTER SCHOOLS IN NEW YORK CITY.

THE LEGISLATURE VERY MUCH DOES NOT.

THE TEACHERS UNION VERY MUCH DOES NOT AND THEY'RE A VERY POWERFUL FORCE IN ALBANY.

EVEN AFTER YOU GET PAST BAIL AND HOUSING, YOU STILL HAVE THESE OTHER ISSUES THAT YOU HAVE TO TACKLE.

I WAS JUST GOING TO BRING UP FUNDING FOR THE MTA TO GO TO USAC.

IT'S ANOTHER ONE OF THOSE ISSUES AND AS YOU SAID, JON, THERE ARE THESE -- I DON'T WANT TO CALL THEM SMALLER ISSUES, BUT I THINK THEY ARE ISSUES THAT MAYBE THE GENERAL PUBLIC MAY NOT BE AS FAMILIAR WITH.

CHARTER SCHOOLS ARE VERY BIG IN NEW YORK CITY.

NOT SO BIG IN AREAS OF UPSTATE.

BUT MTA FUNDING, IN SOME WAYS, AFFECTS THE ENTIRE STATE, YOU KNOW, FOR PEOPLE IN THE FIVE BOROUGHS AND THE SUBURBS, IT'S LITERALLY LIKE THE BLOOD IN THEIR VEINS OF THAT CITY, BUT THE MORE MONEY YOU PUT TOWARD THE MTA, YOU MAY HAVE TO TAKE AWAY MONEY SOMEWHERE ELSE SO I THINK THAT THAT'S A REALLY INTERESTING THING TO BE WATCHING RIGHT NOW.

WHAT DO YOU THINK THAT LOOKS LIKE RIGHT NOW, ZACH?

DO WE KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THE FUNDING FOR THE MTA?

WELL, THERE'S ANOTHER ACTOR IN THESE NEGOTIATIONS DOWN THE HUDSON IN NEW YORK CITY AND THAT'S MAYOR ERIC ADAMS AND WHAT'S SO INTERESTING IS FOR A MODERATE DEMOCRAT, AS HE'S OFTEN CALLED, HE'S BEEN REALLY SIDING WITH THE LAWMAKERS ON SEVERAL KEY ISSUES.

WHILE THE GOVERNOR HAS PROPOSED THAT NEW YORK CITY PAY $500 MILLION MORE INTO THE MTA EVERY YEAR AND FOR OBVIOUS REASONS, THE MAYOR DOES NOT LIKE THIS IDEA.

AND HE HAS ALSO BEEN VERY QUIET ON BAIL REFORM, AN ISSUE THAT HE HAS SPOKEN QUITE VOCALLY ABOUT IN THE PAST AND ALSO KIND OF TRY TO HAVE IT BOTH WAYS WITH CHARTER SCHOOLS, SOMETHING HE SPOKEN FAVORABLY ABOUT IN THE PAST.

WHEREAS, THE GOVERNOR MAYBE IN THE PAST COULD HAVE LEANED ON MAYOR ADAMS OR AT LEAST HOPED SHE COULD LEAN ON HIM TO AT LEAST HELP WITH SOME OF THESE PROPOSALS, YOU KNOW, HE REALLY SEEMS TO BE HOLDING OUT WITH THE LEGISLATIVE LEADERS TRYING TO MAXIMIZE FUNDING FOR HIS OWN CITY, AND THAT'S GOING TO GIVE THE LEGISLATIVE LEADERS ANOTHER TOOL IN THEIR TOOLBOX, AS WE SAY, TO KIND OF, YOU KNOW, COME BACK AT THE GOVERNOR AND TRY TO GET HER TO NOT ONLY ABANDON THAT PROPOSAL FOR THE MTA BUT HER PROPOSED INCREASED TAX ON PAYROLL TAX ON BUSINESSES, SOMETHING THAT'S, YOU KNOW, SPEAK OF ANOTHER GROUP IN THE LEGISLATURE THAT'S VERY POWERFUL, MODERATE, SUBURBAN LAWMAKERS.

THEY DON'T LIKE THAT IDEA.

THEY DON'T LIKE THE HOUSING PLAN AND THEY'RE NOT SO KEEN ON WHAT THE GOVERNOR ALSO WANTS TO DO ON SOME OTHER FRONTS, CHARTER SCHOOLS, FOR INSTANCE.

THE GOVERNOR, IF SHE WANTS TO OVERCOME THIS RESISTANCE, IS GOING TO HAVE TO DO IT SEEMINGLY UNILATERALLY BECAUSE THE MAYOR OF NEW YORK CITY DOESN'T SEEM TOO EAGER TO HELP.

JON, 30 SECONDS, IS THAT A CHALLENGE FOR THE GOVERNOR?

OF COURSE IT'S A CHALLENGE FOR THE GOVERNOR.

THIS WHOLE THING IS A CHALLENGE FOR THE GOVERNOR.

THEN, YOU KNOW, THERE ARE OTHER ISSUES EVEN ON TOP OF THAT.

SHE WANTS A BAN ON MENTHOL CIGARETTES AND THAT'S SOMETHING THE LEGISLATURE IS RESISTING.

SO THERE'S JUST NOT A LOT OF UNIFORMITY RIGHT NOW ASIDE FROM MAYBE EDUCATION FUNDING, WHICH IS USUALLY A BIG PROBLEM.

RIGHT.

IT'S INTERESTING TO SEE BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, FIVE YEARS AGO I THINK THAT WE WOULD KNOW MORE BY NOW ABOUT THE BUDGET BUT BECAUSE OF THE NATURE OF KIND OF LIKE ZOOM LEADER MEETINGS AT POINTS, NOT ALWAYS, WE DON'T ALWAYS HAVE THE INFORMATION THAT WE USUALLY HAVE.

HOPEFULLY WE WILL KNOW MORE NEXT WEEK.

THANK YOU BOTH FOR YOUR TIME.

ZACH WILLIAMS FROM THE "NEW YORK POST" AND JON CAMPBELL FROM GOTHAMIST AND WNYC.

JUST A REMINDER THAT WE HAVE UPDATES EVERY DAY FROM THE STATE CAPITOL ON OUR WEBSITE, AND RIGHT NOW, WE HAVE A LIVE BLOG RUNNING TO GIVE YOU REAL-TIME UPDATES ON THE STATE BUDGET.

YOU CAN FIND ALL OF THAT AND A LOT MORE AT NYNOW.ORG, BUT THERE'S ONE THING WE'RE NOT