Funding for New Mexico in Focus is provided by viewers like you.

>>Nash: This week on New Mexico in Focus Deb Haaland cruises to victory crashing through a host of barriers along the way.

>>Deb: In our nation's 250th year, I stand before you as the first Native American woman elected governor in U.S.

history >> Nash: And a nationwide backlash against President Trump helps lift the Democratic vote in our state to its highest watermark ever.

New Mexico in Focus starts now.

Thanks for joining us, I'm Nash Jones.

The Democrats had a monumental Election Night on Tuesday, flipping both the U.S.

House and Senate and doing so with a margin of victory the party hasn't seen since 1976, 50 years ago in the aftermath of Watergate.

According to an analysis by the New York Times.

And while sure, the party's most stunning wins can be found in the deepest red corners of the country, where voters rebuked an intensely unpopular President Trump and a painfully difficult economy, Democrats notch some bigger than expected wins and historical triumphs here in New Mexico, as well.

Take governor elect Deb Haaland, for instance, who was pulling just seven points ahead of Republican Greg Hull last month but ended up doubling that on Tuesday night, walking away with 57% of the vote over Hull█s 43%.

It's a historic win for Haaland, a member of Laguna Pueblo, but not her first.

She was one of the first two Native American women elected to Congress, and the 1st to serve as a cabinet secretary.

Now, as she heads to the fourth floor of the Roundhouse, Haaland becomes the first native woman elected governor anywhere in the country and the first Pueblo citizen to govern New Mexico.

Our crew was there as she took the stage at Laguna Pueblo's Route 66 casino to address the state.

>> Deb: It is our time.

[cheers from the crowd] It's time.

It's time for the single mother in Chaparral, working two jobs doing everything she can to keep food on the table to get ahead.

It's time for the college student in Albuquerque who wants to build a future but has no hope because housing prices are through the roof.

To feel like he can graduate and build a prosperous future right here in New Mexico.

It's time for families in rural communities who travel hours to see a doctor, unsure how they'll cover the cost to have affordable, accessible, high quality health care.

And it's time for union workers in New Mexico to have better access to good paying jobs, like helping build more affordable housing right here in our beautiful state.

And it's time to make it easier for every parent to give their children a better life that they have always hoped and dreamed of having.

And that's why I ran for governor.

>>Nash: It was a little later in the night at Hotel Albuquerque.

After hours of singing and dancing, despite what the early returns were showing that Hull addressed his supporters, ending a months long campaign where he was outraised and outspent 10 to 1.

>>Hull: We kept it clean and we were yes, they said.

I was naive for keeping it clean, but you know what?

At the end of the day, my integrity is worth far more than trying to tear somebody down to get into a political position.

We ran a campaign to be proud of and and I'm proud of each and every one of you.

And I'm thankful.

So I did just get off the phone with governor elect Haaland, and I congratulated her on a win.

And what we're going to do now is New Mexicans.

We're going to go forward and we're going to hold our government accountable.

Haaland was one of many New Mexico Democrats to outperform expectations voters have only narrowly sent.

Democratic representative gave Vasquez to DC twice before by less than 1% the first time and by 4% in 2024.

And the Reliable Surveyors at Research and Polling Inc.

had this year's race against Republican Greg Cunningham shaping up pretty similarly.

But New Mexico's second congressional district rolled along with the Democratic juggernaut that rumbled across the country, and Vasquez walked away with a resounding 18 point victory in the state's purplest district What we saw in this race today was a unified electorate, unified not just as Democrats, Republicans and independents, but as New Mexicans to get our country back on the rails and on the path to a better future.

Over the next two years, I am going to need your help.

I'm going to need your support to stand up to the worst impulses of this administration, and to protect every New Mexican who calls this district home.

>>Nash: Our crew was standing by for Cunningham's concession on election night, but it never came, despite the undeniable size of his defeat.

Instead, he sent out a statement midday Wednesday saying in part, the voters made their choice and I respect it and congratulate Congressman Vasquez.

That's how this works.

It's what I spent my life defending, first as a marine and then in law enforcement.

Tonight we will take the results of those races and others and work with a group of journalists and political analysts to put them in context, to understand why the margins were as they were and what these newly elected and reelected officials could mean for New Mexico and for you.

First, we gather a table of veteran political reporters to chop up the top of the ticket.

in Focus politics correspondent Gwyneth Doland is back, along with Source New Mexico's Joshua Bowling and Shaun Griswold, who covered the election for Buffalo's Fire and High Country News.

>> Nash: Welcome, thanks so much for being here.

It█s cool to be around a great group of journalists to talk about the election.

Shaun, I'd like to start with you.

You spent a lot of time reporting with the Haaland camp.

This is a historic victory.

First Native American woman governor in the US.

First Pueblo citizen to govern New Mexico.

What did you witness out there on the campaign trail?

>> Shaun: Yeah, so I started in earnest in January when Governor Elect Haaland went and submitted her petitions to run, and that's when I started the coverage for it.

Met her periodically throughout the campaign, published a report that was featured in High Country News in August.

So, I was able to sort of see some of the outsiders who came in and wrote about her, laid down the groundwork.

So what I saw was fairly consistent to what we've known and seen about Haaland, going back to when she was Secretary, primarily just her focusing on her experience, talking about her work with the Interior Department, developing as much of her sort of platform as it was going, and then also something that really was firm at the very beginning was that she was very strict about not having projection too much to what if█s or hypotheticals and conversations about what are you going to do when you're governor?

What are you going to do?

Who's he going to be around you?

How are you going to handle this policy?

It almost became hard to ask that question so many different ways, because the response was very consistent.

>> Nash: Do you think that served her well?

>> Shaun: I think it did.

I mean, she won the race.

So I think it certainly worked for her.

And I think what it's going to do for us now is where we are going to now be able to focus on is, “okay, we know what you did there, but now as you're now as governor, we can now hold you to everything that you said because you're going to be in that position.

>> Nash: Haaland brought in a record amount of money over $20 million, outspending Greg Hull 10 to 1.

Josh, what may have played into Haaland's win beyond this massive amount of cash?

>> Joshua: Yeah, of course, she has something of a national track record.

After serving in Congress and serving as Secretary of the Interior.

She has these national connections that she was able to tap into leading up to that.

I spent most of Election Day out at polling places across Albuquerque and Rio Rancho and nearly across the board folks told me that they were excited to vote for somebody that they thought had some shared lived experience with them.

She spoke often of her time as a working single mother, as somebody who attained sobriety.

And that really resonated with a lot of folks I met and nearly across the board, also, even in Rio Rancho, people told me that they were excited to have a hand in electing the nation's first Native woman governor.

>> Nash: I mean, obviously across the country, we saw Democrats dominate.

Gwyneth, how much do you think that Haaland█s win was about this national trend versus how much was about New Mexico based issues?

>> Gwyneth: Well, she ran slightly behind the other Democrats on the ballot.

So, I don't think you can blame it on that, exactly.

Because she didn't quite have the huge numbers that the other Democrats just below her name on the ballot had.

I think she did capture this passion and this sense of, I want someone running this state who I feel represents real New Mexico, who represents some part of what I am or what -- who we are, right, and -- and I think she also did have the benefit of having a “D” next to her name.

I don't think this was a low information election, even though she didn't engage with -- Hull in the debate.

I think she was out there a lot.

She did a lot of messaging.

She had good social media.

She did an interview with us, with you -- >> Nash: She can pay for a lot of advertising.

>> Gwyneth: Yeah, although how many people see ads right now?

That's a question.

People pay for them.

But how many people see them?

I don't know.

So, I think she was not swept up by the wave necessarily.

>> Nash: Right.

So, the party is not going to change hands in the governor's office.

But what do you all expect out of a Haaland governorship compared to Michelle Lujan Grisham, who's been in office eight years now?

>> Shaun: I think first and foremost is Haaland's full experience with the Democratic Party of New Mexico.

I mean, she's been paramount to what the party's been since 2014.

And so a lot of people who are going to be elected, and not only the cabinet or administrative roles, but also in the legislature owe a lot of their seats to her.

So she does have a little bit more of a control over the party than I think she ever led on to.

And I think that's going to be prominent in governing.

>> Nash: She didn't talk a lot about hypotheticals, you said.

Do you have a sense of who she is going to surround herself with?

>> Shaun: She's already surrounded herself with the party establishment, and we're going to see a lot of carryover from people who were elected, even her Lieutenant Governor is somebody who was prominent with State Land and sort of the elevation of the economics for that.

Now that's going to be somebody in the Executive Council, and then also the person who placing her is also in Land, Public Land is also going to be somebody who shares some of those similar values.

So I think we're going to see a lot of familiar faces.

And I think we're also going to see a lot more people with prominence nationally when it comes to public lands.

>> Nash: I think -- >> Gwyneth: I think it's going to be different too, though.

I mean, I was in the Senate chamber, in the House chamber watching her be received last year and the huge wave of applause, the huge outpouring of support for her, compared to Bregman, it was really noticeable.

And I think Haaland has more support among the younger, more progressive, newer folks in the legislature.

She's to the left of Lujan Grisham.

Lujan Grisham comes across as more establishment, a little bit more antagonistic -- >> Nash: Some people seem to not think -- not feel certain about that though.

How progressive Deb Haaland really is and how she's going to govern the state -- >> Gwyneth: Well, they think that she's like them.

>> Nash: They think so.

But I mean, do you think that, Shaun, that Haaland received any of that skepticism on the campaign trail about where her politics really lie, how far left she really is?

>> Shaun: Yeah, and that was actually tied directly to her time when she was Interior.

She was criticized for her actions on climate change and energy on public lands, especially when it comes to particular sacred sites outside of New Mexico.

There's a lot of people, tribal citizens themselves outside of New Mexico, who disagree with her completely because they think that she was acting in bad faith.

She deferred all of her actions to her boss, at the time, which was President Biden.

I'm very curious to see where she's going to go with that now that she is the boss.

And of course, we saw all of the criticism that came from her for her donations from Project Jupiter, as well as not giving it back, as well as, you know, some of her sort of, I guess you could say, while the debate I think was another element towards it, but also just sort of the late statements on data centers.

Those were certainly pushed to her by another faction that might be even further left than the people that are currently seated in the legislature that are the Progressive Party.

New Mexico has deeper shades of blue and progressives than most states do right now.

>> Joshua: I think that's maybe a possible point of departure from the current administration, if you go back to early 2025.

Lujan Grisham office is the first party to announce Project Jupiter, under a different name at the time, and now we are looking at potentially a data center moratorium Executive order on day one of Haaland -- >> Nash: These new data centers, right?

I mean, she's said repeatedly on the campaign trail, she can't do a lot about Project Jupiter.

>> Joshua: And she told me -- I raised this question with her the day that she announced her plan for the moratorium.

And the answer I received is that any guardrails that the legislature enacts will have Project Jupiter baked into them.

>> Nash: Okay -- let's move on to Congressional District 2, another huge race this election.

Historically, the Southern District, it had national attention as one that the Republicans thought they might be able to flip because Gabe Vasquez eked out wins in 2022, his first election, less than 1%, 2024.

The last election was a 4% margin, this time 18 points, massive compared to what we expected, just based on some really reliable polls, honestly.

Based on what we saw this week.

Gwyneth, should anyone still be viewing Congressional District 2 as purple?

>> Gwyneth: Yeah, I mean, I don't think that this election means this is a hard blue district.

So this year we had this big blue wave election and he beats Cunningham by 17.

The question -- 18, 17 and change.

The question is how much of that is Vasquez getting known in his district.

Getting around starting to make a difference, impressing people.

And how much of it is -- this wave flavor to it.

>> Nash: Now, you covered the redistricting process back in 2021, heavily.

This was the case where the Democrats in the legislature redrew this district.

The GOP sued, a judge found that it wasn't impossible for a Republican to win.

So is this the fruits of that labor coming to bear finally?

>> Gwyneth: Yeah, they drew this district to capture some of these Democrat-leaning neighborhoods in Albuquerque.

They surgically excised some Republican parts of the southeast, and they drew it to have a candidate like Vasquez win.

And yet, Trump won it two years ago.

>> Shaun: I think it's important to recognize that with that redistricting effort that map was also fully supported by the tribal nations in New Mexico.

And so you could even go so far as to say that tribal nations helped gerrymander the map, if you will.

And I think that's where Vasquez is going to certainly have more of a struggle.

If we look at this as -- possibly more of a blue -- I actually see it more blue than Gwyneth does here, because if Vasquez doesn't perform to the standards of what tribal nations want, and I think that's also where he saw a significant boost of numbers, was the overall native vote support, get out the vote efforts that were happening in his district.

I think that's where he could start to see more criticism is from people who want to see a Native American in that seat, but he's going to have to stick with the sort of sovereignty politics that support tribal nations, not just in New Mexico, but nationally -- >> Nash: And is it about identity they want to see?

>> Shaun: It's not about identity.

No, it's not about identity.

It's about sovereignty principles and policy.

Whether it comes to gaming, public lands, or even just respecting tribal jurisdictions and courts.

>> Nash: Do you think he'll shift on some of those issues?

>> Shaun: He hasn't necessarily had to shift, but he's going to see that challenged a lot more, and he's going to have to see if he can play a larger role, particularly in appropriations, now that he's going to be part of a majority in the House, that's going to ensure that money goes to tribal nations.

Tomorrow, Alamo Chapter House and the Navajo Nation is going to be opening up a new hospital that he helped get appropriations for $96 million from the Interior Department budget.

So he's going to have to consistently keep doing more of that.

>> Gwyneth: I think it's also about candidate quality, just to -- is it still a swing district?

Well, yes, because a candidate like Trump can win it, right.

So the next Republican who wants to run in that district is going to have to be a really high quality, visible, experienced, charismatic, out and about kind of candidate who has a Trump like flavor or even a Haaland, you know, story.

>> Nash: Now, we're running low on time, but I do want to talk about CD1 and 3, Melanie Stansbury, Theresa Ledger Fernandez.

They won in big ways, maybe not surprising ways, but they're now going to be a part of the House majority.

Joshua, what do you think that that means for how they're going to govern come January?

>> Joshua: Yeah, I think with Congresswoman Stansbury in particular, who I spoke with quite a bit leading up to the election, data centers have proved to be a really great ally to Democrats in this this election.

Project Jupiter is well outside of her district, and she spent a lot of the last couple of months before the election criticizing it for its water use its potential impacts on air quality.

And I think that's something she signaled that she's going to be tough on once the House -- once they were able to get back a majority in the House.

>> Shaun: She can be prominent in oversight as well.

That's where we're going to see a lot of the sort of pushback on the Trump administration come forward.

And Stansbury has already been vocal and loud about that, like she could be in leadership position roles when it comes to House oversight.

>> Nash: Yeah, and we'll keep an eye on that.

Stick around, we█ve got a lot more to get to later in the show, thank you.

>>Nash: Big thanks to Joshua Bowling, Shaun Griswold, and our own Gwyneth Doland for helping us wade through the top races of the season.

They will join me again a little later in the show with more insights from the campaign trail.

But first, we continue our analysis of the 2026 general with a couple a long time political pros, both of them refugees from the major political parties.

Eric Griego served on the Albuquerque City Council, then in the state Senate, as a Democrat.

He left the party a decade ago and now teaches public policy and political science at UNM.

Merritt Allen found her way to political independence from the other end of the street.

She's a PR executive and former Navy officer who for 36 years proudly called herself a Republican.

Allen bolted from the GOP after reading its platform in 2020.

For who better, then, to help us break down these historic results of this midterm election?

What they mean and the money that drove them.

That's where I begin.

Part one of my discussion with Allen and Griego.

>>Nash: Merritt, Eric, thank you so much for joining us.

Appreciate you being here.

Big election that we're going to unpack today.

So let's begin with the governor's race, Eric.

It was a huge win for Deb Haaland.

I don't think many people would be surprised that she won, but maybe be surprised by the margin compared to the polls that we were looking at.

Folks are looking at the national democratic headwinds that we saw.

Looking at her, a massive war chest, looking at her historic, candidacy as part of it.

What do you think made, Deb Haaland█s win such a wide margin?

>>Griego: Trump.

I looked at all the statewide races, and she actually had the narrowest margin of any of the statewide races, including, Ben Ray Lujan.

So 14 points is.

Sounds great, you know?

But she was at 57%.

All the other statewide candidates were 60 plus.

So she actually performed the least well of any of the statewide races.

And I think the theme was like, there is this huge sort of anti-Trump wave that we sat all the way down into the state legislative races.

So, I actually think that, I was surprised, given all the spending, given the dynamics, that her numbers were even stronger than they were.

You know, despite the fact that, you know, 14 points is a pretty massive victory.

But if you compare it to the numbers Ben Ray Luján got or the numbers that, even Raul Torres got there significantly lower.

>>Nash: How do you feel about that analysis?

>>Merritt: I completely agree.

And I was here in 2018, when I was a much, much younger.

And, the phrase blue tsunami was used about the New Mexico elections in 2018.

And our P&M never came back from that.

>>Nash: That█s the Republican Party in New Mexico.

>>Merritt: That's correct.

And so we have seen, strong Democratic dominance in this state.

There has not been a statewide Republican elected since 2018.

So to me-- >>Nash: In 2014, If you are not counting the, retention of Nakamura, the judge.

>>Merritt: Correct.

So, you know, it was no surprise that we were going to see, an outcome like this.

I think Gregg Hull was an incredibly strong candidate.

And I think the fundamental problem for, the New Mexico GOP is it is not willing to create a relationship with Albuquerque.

Half the state lives in Albuquerque.

>>Nash: Do you think Hull would have done better if he had more money or was there other things going on?

>>Merritt: You know, this was absolutely a race, a single issue race.

An issue was Trump.

And, you know, we look at the legislature where four, very I think moderate Republicans lost their seats, because of, repudiation of anything with an “R” after their name.

>>Nash: But, Hull kind of distanced themselves from the president.

>>Merritt: Correct, and that was what was so refreshing about this primary is, you know, for the first time in a couple cycles, the gubernatorial primary wasn't a trump off.

And so everybody really behaved well.

And talked about issues.

And it was a really good conservative values.

Republican gubernatorial primary in New Mexico.

I think Hull ran a really, solid race.

The one criticism I have is I don't think he engaged Albuquerque very well, and I think he could have spent more time concentrating in the Albuquerque, in the Albuquerque market.

>>Nash: Let's move on to Congressional District two, traditionally the southern district where Gabe Vasquez beat Greg Cunningham by a wider margin than he's ever won an election in that district.

Eric, I might know the answer to to my question, but what factored into Vasquez's massive win?

>>Griego: Again, controlling for the Trump factor, which I think is the dominant explanatory variable here.

Trump.

I mean, you know, I went to middle school with Greg Cunningham.

I think he's a decent guy.

I think after losing two races for the house, putting him up because he was a cop and a veteran again, seemed like a South Valley guy.

I think it became clear when this race got on the radar screen nationally that he just wasn't ready for for this level of competition.

And, you know, and to Gabe Vasquez, his credit, he has he was much, much stronger in terms of messaging, certainly in the debates-- >>Nash: Than he had been.

>>Griego: Than he had been previously, so it was again controlling for the Trump factor.

I really think that, when you look at the final numbers, which are pretty high given how tight that race was the last two cycles, I think, once you control for the other factors, I think it was, you know, he was not a, a great candidate.

He really-- outside of the outside of the law enforcement stuff and pretty like 2 or 3 issues that he was comfortable with.

He couldn't talk foreign policy, couldn't talk Iran.

And he unlike, unlike Hull who actually tried to at least distance himself from Trump, Greg made the mistake of just embracing the Trump agenda, I think was a fatal move for him.

You know, I feel like that was had.

He said, I'm going to be independent.

I'm going to be more independent.

I'm going to serve the people of New Mexico.

And he embraced the Iran war.

He embraced the Trump agenda.

Those ads were very, very powerful.

So I think that was a strategic sort of blunder.

>>Nash: Do you think someone who distanced themselves from the president maybe was stronger on some of the foreign policy that you're talking about?

Would they have done-- >>Griego: I think it was still lost.

I think the, you know, the the wave was just too, too big and too strong.

But I think it would have been a closer race had he been a little bit less joined at the hip to the president's agenda.

>>Nash: Now, Vazquez has been the most moderate of our congressional delegation.

He's voted with President Trump's position on issues a quarter of the time.

That's that that far outpaces the other delegates.

Merritt, do you think that with such a big win, 18 point margin that we'll start to see a more progressive Representative Vazquez.

>>Merritt: I think that's, that's a very excellent point.

I was going to describe Vazquez as kind of a milquetoast Democrat.

Because he's had to struggle keeping, you know, Roswell and, a much more southern focused, he's got, you know, the oil and gas, patch in his district, keep them mollified and keep some of those, votes on his side.

And so he hasn't, been with his caucus all of the time where, I, I think, a a Greg Hull type of candidate who is more traditionally and I'm thinking, you know, previous century to a 20th century Republican might have really made some great inroads in this race and picked up, some more votes.

You know, MAGA doesn't win in New Mexico.

It just traditionally hasn't, except for some, places in the oil patch.

>>Nash: Even in years when Trump historically unpopular.

>>Merritt: Greg Cunningham ran a 2018 campaign in 2026.

And that was just a strategic blunder.

>>Griego: Yeah, right.

Why do that?

>>Nash: Well, Congresswoman Melanie Stansbury s profile has continued to rise on the national level.

Probably the majority of that is coming from some viral moments.

Criticizing Trump.

I think this is not normal sign, that kind of stuff.

Eric, what new wrinkles could New Mexicans expect from Stansbury as she becomes now the part of, of the Democratic majority in the House?

>>Griego: Well, I think she's been phenomenal.

I, besides the role and oversight committee and really like the viral moments and really, I think she gets out front on issues.

I think it was a pretty bold of her to sort of take on Senator Heinrich on this, on the legislation that he's working on, which was, I think, caught a lot of Democrats by surprise.

She's she, she's she's incredibly articulate, thoughtful, well prepared.

I think she does a really, really good job of trying to stay in touch with her district.

And, you know, again, she she's a, I think the Republican opponent that race is play the strongest candidate they've had in a number of races.

>>Nash: And she had criticized Stansbury for not being the primary sponsor on bills that have become law.

That was one of the places where she was giving Stansbury.

Some of that can be chalked up to the fact that she's been in the minority.

So what kind of success are you expecting out of Stansbury, maybe newfound success now that she's part of-- >>Griego: I think she's going to have to choose, like a lot of Democrats are going to change because she sees herself very much as a progressive Democrat.

There's a whole as you know, there's a whole sort of movement to to decide whether Speaker Jeffries or-- Jeffries is speaker.

I think she's much more aligned with the sort of progressive wing of the Democratic Party in the caucus and in the Congress.

And I think, as you know, her fortune will will rise or fall, depending on who the speaker is.

If it's Jeffries, she might not do as well off as if it's as if it's they decide to go with someone who's a little more progressive.

She's been pretty clear about what she believes in.

And I think she's a rising star.

I think she's going to land in a good place regardless who the speaker is.

I do think if they can manage to sort of, unseat, Jeffries as and find a more progressive speaker, she might do really, really well, I could I don't know if she could make a chairmanship of one of the committees, but she could certainly be, take on a bigger role in some of the key committees.

>>Nash: And she may play a role in, in pushing Democrats.

>>Griego: And.

Absolutely.

I'm hoping, you know, I'm, you know, personally, I'm, I'm not, I'm hoping that there's change that I think the voters called for a change in terms of leadership.

And I'm hoping that the members of Congress, hear that?

I think she's heard it.

I don't know the rest of of her colleagues have heard the fact that I think a lot of people are looking for a change in the leadership in the Congress.

>>Nash: Eric already mentioned Stansbury█s, opponent, Dede Okpareke.

But she got a lot, while she lost pretty significantly on Election Day, she actually raised eyebrows in a good way throughout the campaign, particularly after her debate on KOAT.

Merritt did Dede█s candidacy give you some hope for New Mexico Republicans in any way?

>>Merritt: Well, it looks, absolutely.

And, you know, she did a lot of this herself.

And I think that's, one of my harshest criticisms for the Republican Party of New Mexico is, really failure to recruit candidates, this cycle.

I mean, it was a struggle.

You know, we had a write in, for, Senate for you, you know, just fielding candidates for statewide office was a struggle.

There's still not really a party chair.

I mean, there's just the inertia is hurting, the ability to field candidates.

And regardless of whether you agree with the Republican platform or not, there needs to be balance.

And there needs to be discussion from two sides.

Unilateral power is not something we want.

We've seen what that does at the federal level.

It's, it's not a good idea.

>>Nash: Dede█s success is that about her as a person?

>>Merritt: Absolutely, I she's, I think very inspirational.

I think she's very smart.

I think she's very disciplined.

I'd love to see her do more and maybe run for the legislature or a municipal office, because I think, she has a long way to go.

And I think it's important to know, talking about, Congresswoman Stansbury, this vote, this national vote, exit polls show nationally voters are not embracing the Democratic Party.

They're rejecting Trump and congressional Republicans.

53% of voters said, I don't approve of or support the Democratic Party.

I just want something else.

And so the pressure is on the Democrats in Congress and the Democrats in the New Mexico legislature and Democratic governors to deliver.

>>Nash: We█ll have to see what they'll do with this newfound power.

Well, thank you both so much for breaking down the top of the ticket.

Stick around.

We'd love to welcome you back to talk about some more down ballot races here in a moment.

We appreciate Merritt Allen and Eric Griego for taking the time in a busy election week.

I'm not done with them yet, though.

Stick around another 15 minutes or so and they will join me for round two.

Speaking of a second bite at the apple, let's get back to those journalists Gwyneth Doland Shaun Griswold, and Joshua Bowling back with me at the table to share more reflections and observations from a long election cycle.

The state constitution is getting some nips and tucks and what someone consider major reconstructive surgery, courtesy of big wins at the ballot box.

They'll also help us understand what the Democratic Party further cementing its suppressive in the roundhouse could mean for a bunch of nosy journalists looking to explain how power works to their readers, listeners and viewers.

That's where we're heading next.

>> Nash: Welcome back.

Let's get a little bit further down ballot.

Land Commissioner, Gwyneth, was a race that we paid a lot of attention to.

You did those interviews with us.

What do you think the implications are for Wanda Jesus Sanchez█s, was it 22 -- 22 point victory?

>> Gwyneth: I think that it was a vote for a continuation of Stephanie Garcia Richards policies.

He said that when I talked to him, he didn't want to make big changes.

He indicated, he'd be open to negotiating over the pipeline to the data center.

He open to negotiate.

He talked about continuing the school buffer, but not didn't want to put it in law.

So I think he's going to tread fairly carefully.

Stay in the same lane.

>> Nash: Okay.

Now, before we get to the state legislative races, let's talk about -- the constitutional amendment for these -- lawmakers are now going to get paid.

Well, not right away, but in 2029.

Joshua, how did that constitutional amendment turn out?

Heading into Election Day, it sure seemed like a toss up.

>> Bowling: Yeah, right.

I think some of the recent polling showed that it was almost split three ways between support, oppose and I don't know.

And the legislature interestingly, was similarly split.

You know, I was there in the session back in February when the House and the Senate voted on putting this to the ballot, and it passed narrowly out of both chambers.

So I spent the last couple of weeks talking with lawmakers on both sides of the issue, and some prominent Democrats who opposed it, who thought that this could change the makeup of the legislature, it could change the nature of the job, and could maybe lead to more advocacy groups bankrolling candidates to to further their agendas.

Of course, the argument in favor of it is that we need to expand beyond what they call the three Rs the rich, retired and resourceful.

The three types of people who can afford to run for office >> Nash: and that seem to resonate with folks.

>> Bowling: You know, like I said earlier, I spent most of the day last Tuesday at polling places, and I didn't meet a single voter who opposed it, even one voter who told me he voted MAGA all the way on his ballot, said, “Well, of course they deserve to get paid.

They're doing a job.

>> Nash: Part of the conversation was that this amendment should come hand in hand with some ethics reforms, that if these lawmakers are going to become professional lawmakers, they need to be held to some stricter accountability measures.

What did that consist of?

What do folks want to see?

>> Bowling: Yeah you know, as far as voters go, I heard from a lot of folks that there should be requirements that that you actually work out in the field, that you should actually meet with your constituents and have some sorts of requirements like that.

But on Election Day, broadly, I heard nothing but support from people at polling places.

>> Nash: Now, that wasn't the only constitutional amendment that passed.

All of them did, in fact.

But pocket vetoes are going to be no more.

Sean, you've been reporting on New Mexico politics for years.

What role has has pocket vetoes played in your ability to get access to what's actually happening in the law making process in New Mexico?

>> Griswold: Yeah, well, pocket vetoes come or have come before at the end of the legislative session.

And so we would sort of see sort of a clock run out to what the governor's priorities don't align with the legislature.

And it kind of can end when we saw with Lujan Grisham, I think it became sort of a non adversarial way to go after her friendly legislature.

But now with this new amendment, we're going to have to see a lot more explanation as to why that was pocket vetoed and I think that's going to provide us more transparency and greater understanding as to the decision making behind all of that.

== you know, the majority here work together and show their disagreements in a way that is at least going to be written down.

>> Nash: Yeah.

>> Gwyneth: Yeah, I mean, it could and -- but also the governor could just write some blather in there.

There's no requirement that it be true or detailed in any significant way.

>> Nash: Do you think that somebody would actually just put out a false position on why?

>> Gwyneth: Yes I do.

I think that, you know, you're looking at Deb Haaland.

She's got a legislature that she largely agrees with.

They pass something that she doesn't like for whatever reason.

Does she really want to go out and tell them exactly why?

No she doesn't.

I had, you know, significant technical issues with this.

>> Nash: Shawn, you followed the campaign closely.

How do you think it will land with Haalland?

>> Griswold: With Haalland in the legislature?

I think that she's going to land fairly successful.

I think that she's coming in with the objectives, with the mandate, not only nationally but in the state, >> Nash: but doing away with pocket vetoes Do you think?

Did she?

How will she feel about that?

>> Griswold: That's a very good question.

Actually, I don't have an answer for that.

Yeah.

>> Nash: I mean, she prioritized transparency a lot in the campaign.

She talked about that.

Not maybe not necessarily around the executive branch and the decisions that she'll make.

>> Griswold: Well, I think that when it comes to transparency on that part, we would it would be on us to have to ask for those questions and to press for those answers and again, to the part where there's going to be no more difference to a higher boss, to a president like she's going to be the stop.

>> Gwyneth: Yeah.

I don't think this has so much to do with party or who this particular candidate is.

It's about the role of governor and that being somewhat antagonistic to the role of the legislative branch.

This is built into the system.

There's a tension there on purpose.

And this speaks to that tension.

This is the legislature saying we want more power, we want more information.

And the governor is still going to be able to basically say no quickly.

>> Nash: Constitutional amendment 3 also passed.

This has to do with how regents for the public universities are selected, Joshua, This one's very much in your reporting wheelhouse around some of the drama with regions that we've seen over the years.

But give folks a little bit of context here.

Why did this come up now?

What will it change?

>> Bowling: You know, this has been a long running effort for Senator, excuse me, Senator Jeff Steinberg out of Las Cruces.

For a number of years, he has pitched ethics reforms and nominating changes for how regents are appointed to universities.

But a few years ago, when I broke the news about the lavish spending out of the President's office at Western New Mexico University, we saw that kind of elevate the urgency for the legislature.

You know, all of a sudden the attorney general's getting involved.

The speaker of the House is there to talk about proposed legislation aimed at preventing some of the things that I revealed from happening again.

So I think that really kind of helped Steinberg present a unified front for, for this sort of change.

And under this now it will operate similar to how the Public Regulation Commission works, where nominating committees will pick from applicants who they think should be a region, and forward that onto the governor.

>> Nash: And it could address some corruption issues also kind of preparedness issues.

The governor can't just pick a friend.

>> Bowling: Right, right.

There will be no you know, I think the intent is to do away with the possibility of favoritism or nepotism.

And the case of Western New Mexico University.

Similar criticism at the time was that these regions were benefiting from the spending going on overseas trips, staying at five star resorts.

So I think it's all aimed at eliminating the possibility of that happening.

>> Nash: Let's take a quick look at the state House.

Democrats won a supermajority.

You already mentioned that the legislature and governor elect Haalland may actually be seeing eye to eye quite a bit.

Sean, what impact do you think, if any, a supermajority of Democrats in the legislature will have?

>> Griswold: I think immediately you're going to see the public option in health care become day one.

The very first priority in figuring out how that's going to maneuver in a budget?

I think that's going to become more of a budgetary reform and how Medicaid is going to be able to cover and expand to more New Mexicans.

Both Javier and our speaker, Martinez, Javier Martinez, and Governor elect Haalland said they both support it.

I think you're going to see support for her agenda on the data moratoria, data center moratorium as well, and through the legislature.

And I think anything else that we see proposed by her is going to kind of fall in line with some of that, where there's going to likely be like a lot of issues contested is going to become a capital outlay.

She's made a lot of promises for a lot of millions of dollars to go out to a lot of communities, and so a lot of people are going to have their hand out.

And if any of that is shrunk to what they requested, or that's what you're going to start seeing.

Vision.

>> Nash: Democrats already had a sizable majority.

The supermajority basically means that they have a veto proof majority.

Do you think that will matter?

>> Griswold: That's going to be yet to be seen.

You know, I really wish.

I mean, that's that's the sort of the exciting part is that we're going to be entering a whole new era with a lot of this.

And while we are going to see some carryover, seeing exactly where those splinters happen is going to show up for us as we watch the legislature.

>> Gwyneth: And Haalland is known more as someone who wants to engage, wants to work towards consensus, wants to hear from people what they think, and kind of really work the process.

Michelle Lujan Grisham is a little bit more of it.

This is how it's going to be.

So I would expect to see a little bit less need for a veto proof majority.

>> Nash: Now people are if we took a kind of wider view at this election, people are talking about New Mexico.

It was a one party state.

Now what do you where do you think the action is going to be for a political reporter who is not necessarily going to be looking at the Democrats versus the Republicans, that access as much anymore?

Come, come January, as you covered the legislative session?

>> Gwyneth: Yeah, I think we've seen this pattern coming for a while now of the tension within the Democratic Party from the more progressive wing and the more moderate wing.

And sometimes that overlaps with veterans, people who've been doing this for a long time, who tend to moderate as they see how the process works.

You know, we see candidates coming in, they're all fired up on their side, and then they sort of see, oh, well, a little bit of compromise and a little bit of this is more necessary.

And they do slowly move toward the middle of it.

So even people who came in real hot as progressives or conservatives tend to moderate a little bit.

So we'll see a tension between newcomers, younger people, more progressives and the old guard who's like, wait, we tried this in 94.

Let's look back here again.

>> Nash: Joshua, I ran into you in the halls of the Roundhouse all the time.

What do you think?

What are you going to be watching for in January?

You know, with this election result in mind?

>> Bowling: Yeah, Governor Elect Haaland has expressed some intent to bolster the state's universal child care system.

I think certainly, as national politics goes, that is one of the key areas where the nation is looking at New Mexico for how we continue to invest or not in this program.

I think we've heard at legislative committees throughout the interim that there is a need to invest in booting capacity for providers.

There are months long wait lists to get your kid into childcare.

So I think that's going to be an interesting thing to watch.

The Democrats try -- >> Nash: questions about whether it'll be solvent.

On the campaign trail, Haaland said, we should be spending as much as we can muster out of these reserves, out of these funds.

>> Bowling: And she's equated it to public school that it should be no different of an investment for the state.

>> Nash: Shaun.

>> Griswold: Well, I'm also curious to see sort of from her background in history, working in tribal spaces where trust and treaty obligations, you know, demand specific financing or funding for programs or even just services from the federal government.

And oftentimes those only are guaranteed when a tribal nation sues the federal government.

So she not only has experience in understanding how that operates as a tribal citizen and working with the interior, she's also stated that she's going to try and take that approach as governor, and I'm very curious to see how that's going to land with the state of New Mexico suing the federal government.

And that's probably where we're going to see a lot of that pushback that█s going to get New Mexico a lot of national attention.

>> Nash: Gwyneth, we've talked a lot about what it means for the Democratic majority, for Governor Elect Haaland.

What do these election results mean for the Republicans in the Roundhouse?

>> Gwyneth: Call your Republican friends, they are not well.

They are licking their wounds.

They've really been trounced.

And I think what we have seen is, you know, some trouble in the New Mexico Republican Party with identity, with infighting, and with a lot of trouble to put forth viable candidates.

You know, we had a U.S.

senator, six term Congressman running agaisnt a businessman who had to qualify for the general election through a write in ballot.

We had a Secretary of State candidate with a PhD and eight years as a county clerk, running against a very nice retired nurse best known for election denial.

They are not able to surface the kind of candidates with the resumes that can compete with a Raul Torrez squeezing 25 billion out of Facebook.

And the guy he ran against who nobody knew, right.

>> Nash: What does this have to do with President Trump.

If anything, >> Gwyneth: Trump really caused rifts in the Republican identity and he squeezed out establishment Republicans.

Look at what we've lost in the legislature.

Not only did they lose four seats in the House, they lost their caucus chair.

But in the past six years, the past ten years, they lost the entire leadership of the Senate.

In 2024, eight Republican senators didn't run for reelection.

Five retiring senators resigned before their terms ended.

They've lost a massive amount of institutional knowledge and power.

The legislature is a huge training ground for the future of the Democrat and Republican Party in these candidates.

And the Republicans have almost no bench left.

So they're going to have to reimagine, re-envision, and they're going to have to figure out how to put up candidates with genuine experience, great resumes, great stories to tell in order to be competitive.

>> Nash: Thanks for sharing your take and your expertise.

Really appreciate your all the time.

Thanks again to Gwyneht, Shaun and Joshua, not just for joining us this week, but for all of their coverage this election cycle.

There is plenty more ground to cover tonight with our politics experts.

Former Democratic lawmaker Eric Griego and former Republican Merritt Allen.

We wanted their takes broadly on the state of the New Mexico GOP, and they were happy to share them.

But we begin the last bit of our conversation with a look at the mess in Bernalillo County that had us futilely refreshing the election results page even more than normal Tuesday night.

>>Nash: Welcome back to the table, y█all So it has been a while since we in New Mexico have had to be concerned at all about election administration.

It may be a glitchy, secretary of state website here and there, but on election night on Tuesday, Bernalillo County Clerk Michelle Cavanaugh decided to not release the early voting totals until, same day registration issue at the UNM polling site was was cleared up.

That meant that the results for Bernalillo County, the largest population center in the state, weren't released until around 10 p.m.

or so.

Eric, there was quite a bit of criticism of this, particularly with folks watching the election closely.

You couldn't really gauge what was going on until pretty late in the night.

Do you think the criticism was overblown?

Do you think that there's an issue there that needs to be addressed?

>>Griego: I think it is overblown.

I mean, I wish she had made the call.

And by the way, I think everything we can tell ascertain like it is discretion or like I think she legitimately was thinking she wanted everybody who was at the polls, which, apparently there's a big chunk of folks who were who were registering and voting, to feel like they their vote counted.

I mean, I think so.

Maybe she'd she had made a different call and said, okay, we've got a chunk of voters.

It's not consequential.

Like, let's let let's let people know.

I don't think that was a compensation.

I think it was a judgment call.

And I got to say, the fact that they could call most of these races without Bernalillo County speaks to what a blowout it was, right?

I mean, we didn't know a couple of these state legislative races in, in the city, but but, overwhelmingly like the the goose was cooked by at that point, right?

I mean, like the fact that we could declare winners at most of these races without Bernalillo County.

It was, I think, very unusual because it could have been we could have been hanging on for all these races till midnight.

Right?

>>Nash: Right.

Well, let's let's stick with the election administration for a little bit longer.

Democrat Amanda Lopez Askin is going to be our next secretary of state.

She defeated kind of, election denier adjacent Republican Ramona Goolsby.

Outgoing secretary Maggie Toulouse Oliver spent ten years in the post.

She endorsed Lopez, asking, Eric, what do you expect out of Lopez?

Asking, do you expect her to continue some of these initiatives that we have come to expect from Maggie Toulouse Oliver, or will she do something different?

>>Griego: She seems to be very competent, pretty independent.

She's talked about ranked choice voting.

She's talked about, she's very much as a as a county clerk, very much in, in favor of empowering county county clerks.

Kind of like what happened with here in Burlington County.

You have to support their judgment.

You have to give them the resources they need, the training, if they need it.

Right.

And she's very, you know, having been a clerk in a very big county, but she knows she knows how to run elections.

So I think she my sense is that she's going to try to continue some of the reforms.

The biggest complaint, which a lot of folks have had, is that website has to be modernized, that the secretary of State's office, Maggie's done a lot of incredible work, but I think that's been something that sort of vexed her for, for most of her term.

And I think, asking was asked directly, was she going to work on that?

And she said, yeah, like that's going to be a priority because we've got to make it in this day and age.

We've got to make it more accessible, more usable.

For, for not just for the insiders, but for the, for the general public right now.

>>Nash: What do you make of Goolsby candidacy?

What does that say about the New Mexico GOP?

>>Merritt: Well, I very much enjoyed, going to Dolan's interview with her last week that aired.

And, I found it, very telling.

And, you know, when she, made reference to the fact that, the, consultants retained by Otero County after the 2020 election, I think the Clements, you know, perhaps, merited some sort of, further consideration.

I was shocked and, the fact that we would, six years down the road, even still be having a conversation like that, I was stunned.

So I don't know that that really reflects, the state party.

I think it reflects, the level of candidate, in some cases for statewide races that were recruited.

So we need to do better.

>>Griego: That's but that's a great example of this larger force that was happening because, you know, given the weakness of that candidate, you think that that would have been much more of a blowout.

But she was sort of right at the 60% rate as well.

So like, you know, Lujan had had stronger when, Raul Torres had bigger numbers in that race.

So, like, given the weakness of a Republican candidate in the state secretary state's rate, you I would have thought that that would have been more of a blowout.

>>Merritt: But yeah, but there was a little drama around, the Democratic primary as well as I recall.

So, you know, and that's something I think that the New Mexico Democratic Party has to do better.

You know, Lisa Curtis getting dropped into, the general election after the primary because the winner of the actual primary in that race, pulling out, there was some governor candidate.

Yeah, yeah.

I mean, voters need to choose the candidates who go into the general election.

And, one of the things, 6 in 10 voters or if you want to put it this way, three out of five voters nationwide want less corruption.

And I think new, New Mexicans are like the rest of American voters.

We've had three, little scandals pop up beyond, Cheryl Stapleton.

William's conviction in.

>>Nash: William Stapleton.

>>Merritt: William Stapleton, conviction.

We've got, Andrea Romero somehow getting hired for to support the truth Commission, which she also chaired.

And she, kept her office, although she did finally resign her position.

We've got the Senate finance, chairman, in a, some, nepotism situation with the Department of Transportation.

>>Nash: When it comes to Romero, a very similar situation with Andrea Reeb.

>>Merritt: And she resigned her seat.

>>Nash: Well, and Romero resigned her position at the DA█s office.

>>Merritt: DEA, but she did not resign her seat.

And the district attorney said she was also said she was fine in her position and she resigned resigned her position.

>>Nash: I want to I want to keep on this topic of voters desire to end corruption in the roundhouse or more broadly, in politics.

CA4 the, the, the constitutional amendment for passed with a much wider margin that a lot of folks were expecting based on the polls.

That means that lawmakers are going to get paid a salary starting in 2029.

Erica, as a former state lawmaker, what kind of difference do you think that's actually going to make in the roundhouse?

>>Griego: I'm not sure it's gonna make a huge difference, because the truth is, first of all, the groups who ran that did phenomenal job.

I think, it's a big win.

I mean, I generally philosophically believe that legislators ought to be paid, but, I think if that's really the only factor that's going to decide who runs you because many legislate many, many legislators, you know, they have jobs and, you know, case of teachers, they've been given a lot of latitude in terms of being able to work and really, really manage to manage the legislative duties.

I had a full time job when I was when I was up there, so it was very difficult to do both.

Is it going to somehow change the face of it?

I hope what it does, and I think what they're hoping is that it attracts younger candidates to the legislature who perhaps aren't as far along in their law career, or have the kind of flexibility or seniority in their jobs to be able to say, like, I need to take this time off and have support from their from their employer.

So, I think the verdict is out.

I think the real win was the language of the ballot.

And it really sounded like the language in the constitutional memo really sounded like it was an anti-corruption sort of an issue where.

>>Nash: Limit limit lawmakers pay.

If a voter didn't know that lawmakers weren't making a salary to begin with, they may think it was actually reducing their.

>>Griego: Yeah, I think a lot of voters thought they were voting.

It was an anti-corruption initiative.

You can argue it is because I actually would argue that there's way too much sort of lobbyist money up there that really impacts a lot of these votes, because most people aren't getting paid.

And then they get they get the fancy dinners and so on.

>>Nash: You're talking a lot about, the desire to, to limit corruption.

Do you think this will do that?

And also, what impact could it have on GOP lawmakers in the House, especially considering this massive loss?

>>Merritt: Well, I, I'm a little concerned, about the level of salary, right now based on median income.

So we're looking around $65,000 a year, 68, 68, for a maximum of a 60 day session.

So we either need to increase the length of our sessions, because that's a lot of money for not a lot of work, frankly.

And I voted against it for that reason.

I wrote on this a couple of years ago and did analysis looking at other states, and I thought about 30,000 a year was a little more appropriate just for the time going.

I mean, that's, that's that's a lot.

But if we are paying our legislators, I think what this means is the self-dealing has got to end.

That means if, you're going to introduce legislation to create a new courtroom in the First Judicial District, and you are a trial lawyer who is bringing in seven and eight figure jury awards from that judicial district.

Senator worth, you need to recuse yourself from that vote.

Senator Cervantes.

Senator Dudek that's not okay.

And that was the case when you were unpaid.

But if you if I'm paying you to do that, you can't enrich yourself with your own legislation.

>>Griego: I hope this opens the door to a lot more reform, for sure.

I hope it now that like the case that that they're underpaid, underappreciated, I think I don't know if we put that to bed, but certainly paying them I know it's not going to take effect for a while.

But, you know, one of the biggest issues I had was trying to have a full time job is the interim committees.

So I'm hoping the does the work that happens between sessions will be much more important, better attended, more thoughtful.

They have district staff now, so I think we're kind of, as the speaker was saying, like, I think we're modernizing the legislature.

What comes with that is we're going to have to get rid of these old practices, culture of sort of the this cozy relationship that some legislators have with certain industries and so on.

>>Nash: There were a number of Republican lawmakers in the state House that were ousted on Tuesday from Rio Rancho to Berlin T or C, Silver City.

Merritt, is this down to, again, those national, trends that we saw on Tuesday, or was there something specific in New Mexico that factored in here?

>>Merritt: No, I think this was if you had an after your name, you were targeted because these are all really moderate, legislators.

In the case of, representative [inaudible] and Representative Dow, you know, you know, with, really strong, long records of good government and, you know, this is this is unfortunate.

I don't think it's the last, we'll see of them.

You know, I think, I think we'll hear back from them.

And I think what the New Mexico GOP has to do, and I think, the national GOP has to do is decide once and for all, the Trump ism is over.

It's it's it's rejected and and for good reason.

It's not good government.

>>Nash: There's a ton more to break down, but we are out of time.

Thank you both so much for hashing this all out with us.

Thanks to Merritt Allen and Eric Griego for their time and their candor.

This was a most consequential election for many reasons, and we hope some expert analysis of the ins and outs proved helpful.

Thanks as well to our crew.

The sights and sounds that we brought to you at the top of the show didn't just appear out of the ether, and we appreciate their long hours that they logged on election night.

And one final, thanks to the journalists, not only the ones who joined us tonight, but all the others who serve as your eyes and ears across the state during election season and beyond.

We're richer for your hard work.

For New Mexico PBS, I'm Nash Jones.

Until next week, stay focused.

Funding for New Mexico in Focus is provided by viewers like you.