>> Braude: TONIGHT ON "GREATER BOSTON": WHEN MASSACHUSETTS VOTED TO LEGALIZE RECREATIONAL MARIJUANA, EQUITY WAS BAKED INTO THE PROPOSAL.

BUT FIVE YEARS LATER, THE GOAL HAS NOT BEEN MET.

SO, WHAT WENT WRONG, AND WHAT CAN WE DO TO FIX IT?

AND WHAT'S GONE RIGHT SO FAR?

THE CHAIR OF THE CANNABIS CONTROL COMMISSION, STEVEN HOFFMAN, JOINS ME ALONG WITH THE FORMER COMMISSIONER WHO CO-AUTHORED THE 2016 BALLOT QUESTION, SHALEEN TITLE.

THEN, LATER, THE NEW HEAD OF THE STATE'S HIGH SCHOOL SPORTS ASSOCIATION, BOB BALDWIN, ON HOW HE PLANS TO HANDLE THE ACCUSATIONS OF MISCONDUCT AGAINST DANVERS VARSITY HOCKEY AND MANY OTHER TEAMS; AND PREVENT RACIST, HOMOPHOBIC AND BULLYING BEHAVIOR ON THE FIELD AND IN LOCKER ROOMS FROM HAPPENING IN THE FUTURE.

AND FINALLY, COMEDIAN JIMMY TINGLE ON HIS LATEST HUMOR FOR HUMANITY FUNDRAISER.

>> Braude: IT WAS JUST OVER FIVE YEARS AGO THAT THE VOTERS OF MASSACHUSETTS SAID "YES" TO LEGALIZING RECREATIONAL MARIJUANA.

NEARLY 20,000 JOBS HAVE BEEN CREATED, AND THE STATE AND CITIES AND TOWNS HAVE TAKEN IN HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS IN TAX REVENUE.

BUT A KEY ELEMENT OF THE WHOLE THING WAS SUPPOSED TO BE EQUITY.

BLACK AND LATINO ENTREPRENEURS WERE TO GET HELP TO OPEN STORES IN THE SAME COMMUNITIES THAT HAVE LONG BEEN OVER-POLICED AND WHERE PEOPLE HAVE BEEN OVER-CONVICTED AS A RESULT OF THE WAR ON DRUGS.

THE STATE EVEN CREATED A SOCIAL EQUITY PROGRAM TO MAKE IT HAPPEN.

BUT FIVE-PLUS YEARS ON, FAR TOO MANY ARE STILL WAITING.

REPORTING BY THE "BOSTON GLOBE" FINDS JUST 8% OF COMPANIES THAT HAVE OPENED MARIJUANA FACILITIES IN MASSACHUSETTS ARE OWNED BY PEOPLE WHO PARTICIPATED IN THAT EQUITY PROGRAM.

SO, WHAT'S GONE WRONG, AND WHAT NEEDS TO CHANGE FOR EQUITY IN THE LOCAL POT INDUSTRY TO BE FULLY REALIZED?

I'M JOINED NOW BY THE CHAIR OF THE MASSACHUSETTS CANNABIS CONTROL COMMISSION, STEVEN HOFFMAN; AND SHALEEN TITLE, A FORMER COMMISSION MEMBER WHO CO-WROTE THE LANGUAGE FOR THAT 2016 BALLOT QUESTION AND IS NOW C.E.O.

OF THE DRUG POLICY THINK TANK, PARABOLA CENTER.

STEPH OF STEVE HOFFMAN, SHALEEN TITLE, THANKS FOR BEING HERE.

>> NICE TO BE HERE W. >> HAPPY ANNIVERSARY FOR YOU BOTH, STARTING WITH YOU STEVE, HOW WOULD YOU RATE HOW FAR WE HAVE COME IN THE FIRST FIVE YEARS OF LEGALIZATION?

>> WELL, LET ME START BY SAYING THAT YOU KNOW, THE FIVE YEAR ANNIVERSARY SINCE QUESTION FOUR WAS PASSED, I VIEW IT AS THE REAL START DATE WAS SEPTEMBER 1ST, OF 2017, WHEN THE COMMISSION, THE LEGISLATED TURE PUT QUESTION 4 ON HOLD FOR ABOUT EIGHT MONTHS BEFORE THE LEGISLATION WAS FINALLY SIGNED BY GOVERNOR BAKER IN JULY OF 2017.

IT HAS BEEN FIVE YEARS AT LEAST AS FAR AS IMB IMSH GOES BUT IT HAS BLN A A LONG TERM.

I AGREE WITH THE HEADLINE, IT IS UNFINISHED BUSINESS, I THINK WE MADE A LOT OF PROGRESS NOT JUST IN TERMS OF THE YOAFORT ALL SIZE AND REVENUE GENERATION OF THE INDUSTRY BUT WE MADE PROGRESS ON EQUITY.

WE ARE NOWHERE NEAR WHERE WE NEED TO BE BUT IF YOU LOOK AT OUR NUMBERS WHICH WE SHARE PUBLICLY EVERY MONTH AT OUR PUBLIC MEETING, EVERY MONTH WE SEE MORE AND MORE SOCIAL EQUITY CANDIDATE CANDIDATES GETS PROVISIONAL LICENSES, GET LICENSES, OPEN FOR BUSINESS.

SO WE ARE MAKING PROGRESS BUT WE KNOW WE HAVE A LONG WAYS TO GO.

>> SHALEEN TITLE, WOULD YOU SHARE THAT FIVE YEAR END REVIEW?

>> YEAH, ABSOLUTELY.

WE ARE MAKING PROGRESS IN OUR STATE.

BUT I THINK THERE ARE A COUPLE OF VERY CLEAR CONCRETE SOLUTIONS THAT WOULD ADDRESS THESE ISSUES THAT ALL THREE OF US HAVE BEEN TALKING ABOUT AT LENGTH FOR YEARS.

BOTH ENDING THE ESSENTIALLY LEGAL EXTORTION AND CORRUPTION AT THE LOCAL LEVEL BY ADDRESSING POST COMMUNITY AGREEMENTS AND GIVING THE COMMISSION THE AUTHORITY TO REVIEW THEM.

AND THEN CREATING A FUND FOR SOCIAL EQUITY BECAUSE THEY'RE CURRENTLY IN AN IMPOSSIBLE SITUATION WHERE THEY CAN'T GET FINANCING.

AND SO WE CAN USE NEW CANNABIS TAX REVENUE TO CREATE THAT FUND.

THOSE THINGS ARE SIMPLE.

THEY ARE NO-BRAINER FIXES.

VIRTUALLY EVERYONE AGREES WITH THEM.

AND SO THE CANNABIS COMMITTEE AND THE LEGISLATURE REALLY NEEDS TO DECIDE, ARE THEY GOING TO IMPLEMENT THOSE FIXES OR CONTINUE WITH INACTION WHICH IN THAT CASE THEY'RE REALLY PROACTIVELY DEED SIDING THAT THIS MULTIBILLION DOLLAR INDUSTRY IS GOING TO BE FOR WEALTHY WHITE MEN AND BIG TOBACCO.

THOSE ARE REALLY THE TWO TESTS.

>> Braude: IF I WASN'T CLEAR THE SOCIAL EQUITY PROGRAM WAS INTENDED TO HELP SMALL ENTREPRENEURS OF COLOR, AS YOU BOTH KNOWED.

OBVIOUSLY YOU LEAD THE CHARGE SHALEEN AND I KNOW IT IS FULLY EMBRACED BY THE CHAIRMAN AS WELL.

I WANT TO PLAY FOR YOU, STEVE, SOMETHING THAT KOBE EVANSS OF PURE O SAY-- OASIS, FIRST PERSON OF COLOR OWNER WHO WAS ON THE SHOW SEVERAL TIMES BUT THIS WAS FROM 2019.

WHILE HE GOT THAT FIRST LICENSE AS A PERSON OF COLOR HE IS TALKING ABOUT FRUSTRATIONS IN OTHER COMMUNITIES WHERE HE HAD SOWT LICENSES.

HERE IS WHAT KOBE HAD TO SAY.

>> UNFORTUNATELY THE CCC IS HAMSTRUNG BY LOCAL MUNICIPALITIES AND MY APPLICATION AS WELL AS EVERYONE ELSE'S IS DEPENDENT ON HOST AGREEMENT AND LOCAL MUNICIPALITIES DON'T RECOGNIZE EQUITY, THEY DON'T RECOGNIZE THE WILL OF THE VOTER AS IT RELATES TO DIVERSITY IN INDUSTRY.

>> Braude: IT IT DOES SEEM HOST COMMUNITIES OBVIOUSLY SAY WE ARE THE BIG, BIG WEED, BIG MARIJUANA AND HIS POINT ABOUT EQUITY, I HOPE PEOPLE REALIZE IS NOT RHETORICAL.

WHILE YOU STATEWIDE ARE BOUND BY EQUITY, THE ABSURDITY OF THE LEGISLATURE'S POSITION IN THIS, AT LEAST FROM MY PERSPECTIVE IS YOU DON'T MANDATE THE SAME EQUITY REQUIREMENTS ON THE LOCAL LEVEL.

IT IS AN EASY FIX AND IT SHOULD HAPPEN, SHOULDN'T IT?

>> YEAH, I AGREE.

AS YOU MIGHT BE AWARE, OUR EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR SEAN COLLINS AND I WROTE A LETTER TO THE LEGISLATURE AND ALSO PUBLISHED AN OP ED PIECE, SAYING EXACTLY THAT, WHICH IS THAT WE CAN ONLY GIVE OUT LICENSES TO APPLICANTS TO MAKE IT THROUGH THE HOST COMMUNITY AGREEMENT PROCESS IN WHATEVER CITY OR TOWN THEY WANT TO OPERATE.

ESSENTIALLY THEY ARE THE GATE KEEPERS TO EQUITY.

WHILE WE HAVE EXPLICIT EQUITY ON STATE LEVEL, THE CITIES AND TOWNS DO NOT.

I WILL SAY I DON'T WANT TO PAINT WITH TOO BROAD A BRUSH, THERE ARE A NUMBER OF CITIES AND TOWNS THAT ON THEIR OWN HAVE TAKEN UP EQUITY AS A MANDATE, BOSTON, HOLYOKE AND MANY OTHERS, SO IT IS NOT THAT NO CITIES OR TOWNS THINK EQUITY IS IMPORTANT, I THINK A LOT DO.

IT IS BECAUSE THEY THINK IT IS IMPORTANT, NOT BECAUSE THEY ARE MANDATED TO DO.

SO I THINK THAT IS A SHORTCOMING IN THE LAW.

YOU KNOW WHILE STEVE HOFFMAN DOESN'T WANT TO PAINT WITH A BROAD BRUSH I WANT TO PAINT THE LEBLG SLATE TURE WAY BROAD BRUSH.

THEY NEVER WANTEDDED THIS LEGISLATION.

THREE BALLOT QUESTIONS HAD TO PASS FOR DECRIMINALIZATION, MEDICAL MARIJUANA, AND THEN ECK RATIONAL MARIJUANA.

AND BEYOND THIS EQUITY ISSUE THAT ALL OF US SEEM TO AGREEMENT ABOUT IN TERMS OF THE FIX, ON THE LOCAL LEVEL, THERE SAY CONSENSUS THIS IS JUST 3% FEE IS USED AND ABUSED BY LOCAL COMMUNITIES.

AND SUPPOSED TO OFFSET THE COST OF HAVING A LEGAL MARIJUANA FA SIMENT-- FACILITY BUT AS THE POINT WAS MADE, IN DAN ADAMS FAVE YEAR REVIEW THE OTHER DAY, OTHER LEGAL BUSINESSES DON'T NEED TO PAY THESE KIND OF THINGS AND THE HORROR STORIES ABOUT WHAT WILL HAPPEN IN LOCAL COMMUNITIES FOR THE MOST PART NEVER MATERIALIZED.

SO IT IS PURELY BECAUSE STATE LEGISLATURES ARE AT THE KNEE OF LOCAL OFFICIALS THAT THEY DON'T FEEL IT, IS THAT NOT FAIR?

>> I THINK THAT'S FAIR.

BE EXCEPT FOR NORTHAMPTON AND LEE, I GIVE THEM CREDIT.

>> THEY A POLL-- ABOLISHED THE FEES.

>> AND I HOPE OTHERS FOLLOW, BUT IN GENERAL THE LEGISLATURE REALLY NEEDS TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT THIS.

WE HAVE AGAIN NEAR CON SEN TUS, THE COMMISSION HAS ASKED FOR IT THE CHIEF JUSTICE OF THE SUPREME JUDICIAL COURT POINTED OUT THAT THERE IS MUCH NEEDED CLARITY IN THE GAPS HERE.

THERE HAS BEEN NEWS ARTICLES, RESEARCH STUDIES, THERE HAS BEEN HEARINGS, THERE WAS A HEARING ALMOST SIX MONTHS AGO WITH NEAR UNANIMOUS TESTAMENT FROM EXPERTS AND PEOPLE AFFECTED.

AND SO THERE IS REALLY NO EXCUSE AT THIS POINT FORP NOT FIXING THIS.

>> STEVE, SINCE SHALEEN MENTIONED THE CHIEF JUSTICE THE APTBY NAMED KIMBERLY BUD, I SHOULD SAY, WHAT SHE SAID, >> IMPLEMENTING THE FRAMEWORK GOVERNING THE NEW RECREATIONAL MARIJUANA INDUSTRY HAS REVEALED GAPS THAT THE LEGISLATURE AND COMMISSION LIKELY DID NOT ANTICIPATE.

HAVE YOU NOT DONE ALL YOU CAN ON THE ISSUES WE'RE TALKING ABOUT TONIGHT, IS THERE STILL ROOM FOR THE COMMISSION TO MOVE?

>> I'M PROBABLY THE LEAST COMPLACENT PERSON YOU WILL EVER MEET, WE HAVE DONE A LOT BUT WE CONTINUE TO HAVE OUTREACH TO THE COMMUNITY AND GET IDEAS, I JUST HAD A MEETING A FEW WEEKS AGO WITH SOME OF THE NEWLY LICENSED DELIVERY CURRIERS, A VERY IMPORTANT STEP OF EQUITY BECAUSE THEY ARE LOW CAPITOL, AND THEY ARE STRUGGLING AS THEY ARE GETTING INTO, IT ALL NEW BUSINESS TO STRUGGLE BUT WE LISTEN TO THEM, WE GOT SOME IDEAS FROM THEM AND WE'RE GOING TO STEE WHAT WE CAN DO TO MAKE IT EASIER FOR THEM TO GET ENTRY.

>> BUT STEVE WHY IS THIS.

>> IT IS ONE MORE STEP WE CAN TAKE.

>> YOU SUPPORTED THE LEGISLATIVE CREATION OF A LONE FUND THAT SHALEEN WAS TALKING ABOUT.

THE SELF-PAYING BY THE INDUSTRY, BRIEFLY IF YOU CAN, WHAT IS THE ARGUMENT AGAINST IT?

>> ARE YOU ASKING ME TO PUT WORDS INTO OTHER PEOPLE'S MOUTHS.

>> AGAIN, I'M SORRY, MY ATTITUDE IS, THE ARGUMENT AGAINST IT IS IT THERE HELP SMALL ENTREPRENEURS WHICH THE BIG BOYS DON'T WANT TO HAVE HAPPEN.

>> AGAIN, I'M NOT GOING TO SPECULATE ON THE MOTIVE OF OTHERS, I WILL SAY SOME OF THE ARGUMENTS I HEARD AGAINST AN EQUITY FUND IS THE MONEYS GENERATED BY MARIJUANA SALES CAN BE BETTER USED IN OTHER PLACES.

AND AGAIN I'M NOT GOING TO-- THAT IS ONE ARGUMENT.

SECOND ARGUMENT IS WELL SHOULDN'T THE PRIVATE SECTOR BE PART OF THIS OR RESPONSIBLE FOR CREATING THIS FUND.

AND YOU KNOW, MY ANSWER TO THAT IS THE PRIVATE SECRETARIER IS WILLING TO STEP UP BUT THE STATE HAS TO STEP UP.

IF THE STATE STEPS UP AND CREATES THE FUND, I'M 100 PERCENT CERTAIN THAT THE PRIVATE SECTOR WILL PARTICIPATE IN THAT FUND BUT THE STATE NEEDS TO-- LEAD HERE.

THERE ARE ARGUMENTS AGAINST T I DON'T AGREE WITH THOSE ARGUMENTS BUT I'M NOT GO TO ATTRIBUTE MOTIVES TO PEOPLE THAT DISAGREE WITH ME.

>> Braude: HOW ABOUT FEDERAL LEGISLATION, IF WE NO LONGER IN THE SAME SCHEDULE ONE AS HEROIN, WOULD THAT HELP LOCALLY, QUICKLY IF YOU CAN.

WITH IT BE HELPED.

>> IN SMALL WAYS IT WOULD HELP WITH BANKING.

IT MAY HELP WITH CAPITAL.

BUT THE BIGGER PROBLEM IS THAT MASSACHUSETTS HAS ACTUALLY DONE ONE THING REALLY WELL WHICH IS PREVENTING CORPORATE DOMINATION OF THE MARKET BY A FEW BIG COMPANIES.

>> BY LIMITING THE NUMBER.

>> I'M SORRY.

>> Braude: BY LIMITING THE NUMBERS.

>> BY LIMITING THE NUMBERS.

>> Braude: YEAH.

>> EXACTLY, YOU CAN OWN OR CONTROL UP TO THREE LICENSES.

AND THE EXITION HAS DONE A GREAT JOB OF ENFORCING THAT.

SO FEDERALIZATION COULD POTENTIALLY UPEND THAT, START INTERSTATE COMMERCE AND TOTALLY CHANGE THE MASSACHUSETTS MARKET.

SO WE WANT TO DO THAT DELIBERATELY AND INTENTIONALLY RATHER THAN QUICKLY WITHOUT THINKING ABOUT IT.

>> Braude: STEVE ONLY 30 SECONDS, I WANT TO END WITH SOMETHING YOU HAVE NO CONTROL OVER WHICH IS THE STIGMA.

68 PERCENT OF THE PEOPLE IN AMERICA INCLUDING A TON OF REPUBLICANS SUPPORT LEGALIZATION.

I THINK HALF OF AMERICA LIVES IN STATES WHERE THEY LEGALIZE BUT THERE IS STILL A STIGMA.

STILL NOT SEEING LIKE ALCOHOL, QUICKLY WHY DO YOU THINK THAT IS?

>> I THINK STIGMAS CAN'T BE LEGISLATED OR REGULATED AWAY, I THINK THEY TAKE TIME AND I'M ACTUALLY SEEING PROGRESS ON THAT IN MASSACHUSETTS AS PEOPLE SEE THIS AS A SAFE INDUSTRY, A WELL REGULATED INDUSTRY, PROFESSIONALLY RUN INDUSTRY.

SO I DON'T THINK YOU CAN DO ANYTHING BUT JUST GET PEOPLE TIME TO SEE THIS IS A NORMAL BUSINESS, A GOOD ADDITION TO ANY COMMUNITY.

>> NONE OF THE FEARS THAT THE OPPONENTS LIKE MORE GREATER, MUCH GREATER USAGE BY YUNG PEOPLE, ALL THAT SORT OF STUFF HAVE COME TO PASS.

STEVE HOFFMAN, SHALEEN TITLE, THANKS FOR YOUR WORK, HAPPY ANNIVERSARY AND GOOD TO SEE YOU BOTH.

>> THANKS, JIM.

>> Braude: DESPITE WIDESPREAD OUTRAGE OVER RACISM, BULLYING, AND ASSAULT ACCUSATIONS AGAINST MEMBERS OF THE VARSITY BOYS HOCKEY TEAM IN DANVERS, AND HOW SCHOOL OFFICIALS KEPT THE WHOLE THING QUIET FOR A YEAR AND A HALF, THE SCHOOL COMMITTEE TOOK NO ACTION AT A MEETING EARLIER THIS WEEK.

IT WAS THE "BOSTON GLOBE" THAT BROUGHT THE WHOLE THING TO LIGHT EARLIER THIS MONTH WHEN IT PUBLISHED A STORY, BASED ON HEAVILY REDACTED REPORTS FROM THE SCHOOL DISTRICT.

THE REPORTS DETAILED HOW ONE STUDENT "TOLD SCHOOL OFFICIALS, POLICE, AND THE SPECIAL INVESTIGATOR THAT A PLAYER TOUCHED HIM INAPPROPRIATELY AFTER THE TEAM STRIPPED NAKED IN A LOCKER ROOM RITUAL KNOWN AS 'GAY TUESDAYS.'"

AND IN ANOTHER RITUAL CALLED "HARD 'R' FRIDAYS," TEAM MEMBERS ALLEGEDLY APPROACHED PLAYERS AND COMMANDED THEM TO SHOUT THE N-WORD.

THE ALLEGED VICTIM SAID HE HAD SEEN TEAMMATES WHO REFUSED TO OBEY BE HELD DOWN AND BEATEN WITH A PLASTIC SEX TOY CALLED "THE PINK DRAGON" UNTIL IT LEFT AN IMPRINT ON THEIR FACES.

THE REPORTS ALSO NOTED THAT AT LEAST ONE MEMBER OF THE TEAM'S COACHING STAFF WITNESSED ONE OF THE RITUALS.

AND IN GROUP TEXT MESSAGES OBTAINED BY THE "GLOBE," PLAYERS MADE SO-CALLED JOKES ABOUT THE HOLOCAUST, LYNCHINGS, AND THE VIOLENT DEATHS OF BLACK PEOPLE.

BUT IT'S NOT JUST DANVERS.

IN MARCH, DUXBURY FIRED ITS HIGH SCHOOL FOOTBALL COACH AFTER HIS PLAYERS USED ANTI-SEMITIC AND OTHER OFFENSIVE LANGUAGE ON THE FIELD.

IN SEPTEMBER, ROXBURY PREP COACHES SAID GEORGETOWN HIGH FOOTBALL PLAYERS SHOUTED RACIAL SLURS AT THEIR TEAM AND THAT FACULTY AND STAFF JOINED IN, WHICH LED TO A BRAWL ON THE FIELD.

AND IN HYANNIS LAST MONTH, ST. JOHN PAUL SCHOOL SUSPENDED FOOTBALL ACTIVITIES AFTER THE TEAM USED RACIST LANGUAGE TOWARDS MEMBERS OF ANOTHER TEAM DURING A GAME.

IT'S PRACTICALLY AN EPIDEMIC OF ABHORRENT BEHAVIOR, WHICH THE NEW EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF THE MASSACHUSETTS INTERSCHOLASTIC ATHLETIC ASSOCIATION, BOB BALDWIN, IS PLEDGING TO ADDRESS.

HE JOINS ME NOW.

O BOBK IT IS GOOD TO MEET YOU, THANKS SO MUCH FOR BEING HERE.

>> THANKS FOR HAVING ME, SWRIM, PLEASURE TO BE HERE.

>> Braude: BOB, WHAT WAS YOUR REACTION ABOUT WHAT WAS ALLEGED TO HAVE HAPPENED IN THE LOCKER ROOMING AND THE RESPONSE FROM THE SCHOOL DISTRICT IN DANVERS?

>> SO WHAT WHEN I FIRST-- I FOUND OUT FIRST BY READING THE "BOSTON GLOBE" ARTICLE AND THE WORD I HAVE BEEN USING IS SPEECHLESS.

BECAUSE THERE WERE SO MANY OTHER WORDS THAT CAME INTO MY HEAD.

AND WHAT I JUST HEARD YOU SAY, YOU KNOW, YOU ALMOST WANT TO RAMP IT UP TO DISGUSTING.

BUT SPEECHLESS WAS THE WAY I COULD BEST DO IT IN A CIVIL MANNER.

>> Braude: THEY PUT OUT A STATEMENT I THINK IT WAS MONDAY NIGHT IN PART, A FULL PAGE STATEMENT, THEY SAY WE REGRET THAT OUR SCHOOL DISTRICT AND THE SUPERINTENDENT, WITHOUT BY THE WAY WALKED OUT A SIDE DOOR AT THE MEETING, WOULD NOT SPEAK TO THE PUBLIC, THE SUPERINTENDENT, WE "WE REGRET THAT OUR COMMUNICATION TO THE PUBLIC UPON THE CONCLUSION OF THE INVESTIGATIONS FELL SHORT IN RE-- THE TERM THEY USED.

BY MY WAY OF LOOKING AT WHAT THEY DID, IT DIDN'T FALL SHORT, IT WAS A COVERUP, WERE IT NOT FOR THE FACT THAT THE GLOBE WENT THROUGH THE STATE PUBLIC RECORDS DEPARTMENT TWICE AND FORCED DANVERS TO DISGORGE THIS INFORMATION.

THEY TRIED TO HIDE IT FROM THE PUBLIC, DIDN'T THEY?

>> I DONE KNOW THE PARTICULARS OF WHAT HAPPENED BUT THERE ARE LEGAL FRAMEWORKS AND OBLIGATIONS REGARDING PROTOCOLS FOR REPORTING.

THAT WE IN EDUCATION ARE AWARE OF.

AND I LIVE BY THAT MY WHOLE LIFE IN LIVING AS A SUPERINTENDENT IN MY PREVIOUS LIVELIHOOD HERE.

>> Braude: YOU WERE QUOTED IN THE GLOBE AS SAYING I KNOW THIS IS A REALLY BOLD STATEMENT.

WE NEED TO CERTIFICATE VEEN IMMEDIATELY.

SHOULDN'T BE A BOLD STATEMENT BUT IT IS CONSIDERING HISTORY.

WHAT IS INTERVENTION MEAN.

WHAT POWER DO YOU HAVE, WHAT DO YOU INTEND TO DO?

>> SO IT IS A GREAT QUESTION.

WE AS AN ASSOCIATION DO NOT HAVE LOCAL AUTHORITY, LOCAL JURISDICTION.

HOWEVER IS THERE NOT A SPOT PLIGHT ON ATHLETICS AND WOULDN'T WE NOT BE A PLATFORM FOR CHANGE AND BEHAVIORAL CHANGE.

IT IS NOT OKAY TO BEHAVE THIS WAY.

AND I THINK IT FORNT THAT SERVING MAYBE AS A FACILITATOR AND A CONNECTOR, WE DON'T HAVE ALL THE ANSWERS BUT MAYBE WE CAN BRING PEOPLE TOGETHER TO TRY AND PROVIDE SOME CHANGE AND BEHAVIOR AS SOON AS WE CAN.

>> Braude: SO WHEN YOU ARE QUOTED IN THAT GLOBE STORY SAYING YOU CAN'T SANCTIONS SCHOOLS OR STUDENT ATHLETES, I DON'T WANT TO PUT WORDS IN YOUR MOUTH T IS NOT BECAUSE YOU WOULDN'T CONSIDER IT, IT IS BECAUSE YOU DON'T HAVE THE POWER TO DO IT; IS THAT CORRECT?

>> THAT IS A GREAT QUESTION, BEING AGAIN IN MY OTHER WORLD, THERE IS LOCAL TROAL CONTROL, THERE IS JURISDICTION, THERE IS POLICY.

AS YOU KNOW, HOW THE GOVERNMENT WORKS.

IN THAT REALM.

BUT I ALSO BELIEVE THAT THERE ARE OTHER THINGS WE CAN DO.

AND WE HAVE STARTED TO DO THAT, A LITTLE BIT.

BUT IT SHOULD GO DEEPER THAN US.

IT SHOULD GO, IT IS A SOCIETIAL PROBLEM, IT IS A PROBLEM EVERYWHERE.

>> Braude: WHAT DOES DEEPER MEAN?

I MEAN OBVIOUSLY.

>> DEEPER MEANS, YOU SO SINCE THIS CAME OUT, I HAVE BEEN IN CONVERSATION FOR ALL THE RIGHT REASONS WITH THE ATTORNEY GENERAL'S OFFICE.

AGENCIES SUCH AS DESI, THE NATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF SCHOOL SUPERINTENDENTS.

TOGETHER THIS CAN'T BE ONE ISOLATED GROUP, THESE ARE PROBLEMS NOT JUST HAPPENING ON ATHLETIC FIELDS, THEY ARE HAPPENING EVERYWHERE, WE NEED TO WORK ON THIS TOGETHER.

>> Braude: THAT IS A GOOD POINT.

OBVIOUSLY YOUR GOAL I ASSUME IS PREVENTION.

>> TRUE.

>> Braude: IT IS NICE TOO SANCTION HORRIBLE BEHAVIOR AFTER THE FACT.

IT IS BETTER TO NOT HAVE HORRIBLE BEHAVIOR.

BUT TO PREVENT IT YOU NEED TO KNOW THE CAUSE.

I KNOW YOU HAVEN'T DELVED AS DEEPLY INTO THIS AS YOU INTEND BUT YOU HAVE BEEN IN THE BUSINESS FOR YEARS EVEN THOUGH ARE YOU IN THIS NEW JOB RELATIVELY RECENTLY.

WHERE DOES THIS COME FROM?

IS IT PARENTS?

IS IT THE AGE OF TRUMP WHERE INCIVILITY IS THE COIN OF THE REALM?

WHAT IS IT IN YOUR ESTIMATION.

>> I WILL GIVE YOU MY OPINION BUT I BELIEVE BEHAVIOR IS NOT JUST AROUND ATHLETIC FIELDS, ARE SYMPTOMATIC OF A DEEPER AND BROADER PROBLEM.

WE HAVE A CIVIC RESPONSIBILITY.

STUDENTS HAVE BEEN AWAY FROM ORDER AND BEING WITH ADULTS FOR AWHILE.

THEIR ABILITY TO SELF-REGULATE DOESN'T EXITION AS IT DID.

HOWEVER, LOOK AT THE OF ABOUT A HEAR-- BEHAVIORS OF ADULTS AND ADULTS ARE LEARNING AND MODELING D-- CHILDREN ARE LEARNING AND MODELING WHAT THEY SEE FROM THEIR ADULTS.

IT STARTS FROM THE ADULTS TO CHANGE THE BEHAVIOR OF OUR KIDS.

>> I CALL IT AN EPIDEMIC I MY WORD NOT YOUR, YOU HAVE BEEN AROUND IN THIS PART OF THE WORLD FAR LONGER THAN I. I AM JUST AN OBSERVER, IN A HIGH SCHOOL WAS A CENTURY AGO.

IT IS THE WORST IT HAS BEEN, IS IT NOT.

IT IS NOT JUST BECAUSE THERE IS SOCIAL MEDIA, IT IS THE WORST IT HAS BEEN.

>> IT IS ABSOLUTELY AS BAD AS IT HAS EVER BEEN ACROSS-THE-BOARD.

AND WHEN I TALK TO OTHER STATE ASSOCIATIONS IT'S NOT JUST IN THE COMMONWEALTH OR LOCAL, IT'S EVERYWHERE AND I JUST HAVE TO GO BACK TO OUR-- HAVE CHILDREN BEEN WATCHING ADULTS FOR THE PAST FEW YEARS, AND IS THAT PART OF THE ISSUE, I HAVE TO THINK THAT THAT HAS TO BE PART OF IT.

>> DO YOU WORRY ADD THAT, IF IT TURNS OUT YOU PROVIDE A FORUM OR WHATEVER WORD USED A MINUTE AGO TO HELP GENERATE PREVENTION AND EDUCATE AND TEACH CIVILITY, EVEN THOUGH GOD, WE SHOULDN'T HAVE TO TEACH IT, AND MAYBE YOU SHOULD LEARN IT AT HOME TO BEGIN WITH, YOU'RE RULING OUT AGAIN, I DON'T KNOW IF IT IS POWER OR DECISION MAKING, YOU ARE RULING OUT SANCTIONS FROM OTHERS, LIKE OTHERS STATES WITH THEIR OWN MIAA, HAVE TAKEN.

INCLUDING BANNING STUDENTS OR FAMILIES FROM GAMES, ISN'T A STICK AS WELL AS A CARROT NEEDED TO FIX THIS?

ABSOLUTELY.

OH, ABSOLUTELY.

PARTICIPATION IN INTERSCOL ASIC ATHLETICS IS A PRIF LING, NOT A RIGHT.

AND WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT THOSE THAT ARE PARTICIPATING HAVE A DECORUM THAT THEY FOLLOW IN THE WAY THEY SHOULD ACT.

BUT THAT, THOSE ARE THINGS THAT LOCAL POLICIES AND, I WILL BE HONEST WITH YOU TOO, IN LOOKING AT SOME OF THE BEHAVIORS THAT HAVE HAPPENED THAT I AM AWARE OF, THERE HAVE BEEN SOME STRONG DECISIONS MADE BY SUPERINTENDENTS AND PRINCIPALS REGARDING BEHAVIORS SUCH AS THIS.

SO YOU KNOW, YES, THERE SHOULD BE A SANCTIONING SIDE AS WELL.

>> Braude: YOU KNOW, ONE OF THE PLACES WHERE THERE HASN'T BEEN THAT GOOD RESPONSE, AT LEAST IN MY OPINION, IS DANVERS.

WHAT SHOULD HAPPEN TO THESE KIDS ASSUMING ALL THESE ALLEGATIONS ARE TRUE?

>> YOU KNOW, YOU ARE ASKING ME TO SPECULATE AND I'M NOT THERE, AND SO BELIEVE ME, I WOULDN'T WANT SOMEBODY LIKE ME COMING ON AND SPECULATING.

, BUT PEOPLE NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.

AND WE ONLY LEARN FROM OUR MISTAKES.

AND WE'RE IN THE EDUCATION BUSINESS AND WHEN YOU LEARN FROM A MISTAKE, IT DOESN'T MEAN YOU ARE A HORRIBLE PERSON, IT MEANS THAT I WILL NEVER DO THAT AGAIN.

THE ONLY WAY TO CHANGE BEHAVIOR IS TO HOLD PEOPLE ACCOUNTABLE, GIVE THEM EXPECTATIONS.

EDUCATE THEM BEFORE HAND, AND DO THE BEST WE CAN TO MODEL THAT AS ADULTS.

>> Braude: DO YOU HAVE SUPPORT OF YOUR MEMBER ORGANIZATIONS THROUGHOUT THE STRONG ACTION HERE OR ARE THEY CONCERNED THAT THEY DON'T WANT TO TAKE IT OUT ON DISTRICT X BECAUSE IT MAY COME HOME TO ROOST IN THEIR DISTRICT?

>> I'M OVERWHELMED AT THE OUTPOURING OF INDIVIDUALS COMING TO ME, AS I SAID, THE ATTORNEY SUPERINTENDENTS, AGENCIES SUCH AS DESI AND OTHERS REACHING OUT.

WE WANT, DON'T WE ALL IN SOCIETY JUST WANT TO BE A LITTLE KINDER AND NICER.

>> I HOPE SO.

>> YEAH, AND MAYBE THIS, YOU KNOW, WE'RE NOT UNIFIED AS A GREATER SOCIETY.

OUR KIDS AND THEIR BEHAVIORS COULD THEY FINALLY BE SOMETHING THAT UNIFIES US.

AND I KNOW SPORTS IS NOT, YOU KNOW, IT IS A DEEPER PROBLEM IN SPORTS BUT PEOPLE CARE A HECK OF A LOT ABOUT WHAT GOES ON ON THE PLAYING FIELD, MAYBE WE COULD BE THAT PLATFORM.

>> Braude: GOOD LUCK, BE TOUGH, GOOD TO MEET YOU, HOPE TO TALK TO YOU AGAIN SOON.

>> THANK YOU SO MUCH.

NEXT UP, WHILE IT FEELS LIKE HUMOR AND HUMANITY ARE SERIOUSLY LACKING IN MANY PLACES THESE DAYS, LUCKY FOR US, ONE LOCAL COMEDIAN HAS BEEN FIGHTING TO BRING BACK BOTH.

YOU MAY RECOGNIZE COMEDIAN JIMMY TINGLE FROM HIS FOUR DECADES ON FILM, TELEVISION, AND THE STAGE, INCLUDING HIS 20-YEAR PARTNERSHIP WITH THE REGENT THEATRE IN ARLINGTON.

IT BEGAN WITH 20 SOLD-OUT SHOWS STARTING IN 2001, A RUN THAT HELPED LAUNCH THE THEATER UNDER ITS THEN-NEW OWNERSHIP.

AND TINGLE'S MADE HIMSELF AT HOME THERE EVER SINCE FOR MULTIPLE PERFORMANCES INCLUDING MANY FUNDRAISING SHOWS LIKE 2007'S "RECHARGING THE REGENT," 2008'S "DING HO REUNION FOR BOB LAZARUS," AND 2010'S "GIVE US YOUR POOR: THE CAMPAIGN TO END HOMELESSNESS."

THAT LAST ONE WAS ONE OF HIS KEY PLATFORMS IN HIS 2018 CAMPAIGN FOR LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR OF MASSACHUSETTS, ALTHOUGH I'M NOT CONVINCED HE WAS AWARE THAT IF HE WON, HE'D ACTUALLY HAVE TO SERVE, TOO.

JIMMY RETURNS TO THE REGENT STAGE A WEEK FROM SATURDAY WITH HIS "HUMOR FOR HUMANITY SHOW" AND JOINS ME NOW.

JISMY TINGLE, GREAT TO SEE YOU.

>> GREAT TO SEE YOU AS WELL, JIM, THANKS SO MUCH FOR HAVING ME ON.

GREAT TO BE RECONNECTED AGAIN.

>> Braude: IT'S A PLEASURE.

SO THIS MUST HAVE BEEN A TYPO.

BUT I THINK I READ TODAY THAT THE TICKET PRICE IN 2001 WHEN DID YOU THAT SOLD OUTRUN IS THE EXACT SAME TICKET PRICE AS IT IS IN 2021.

IS THAT A TYPO OR IS THAT REAL?

>> NO, THAT IS CORRECT, JIM, THAT IS THE TINGLE ANTI-INFLATION STIMULUS PLANE.

>> Braude: IS IT TRILLION 25 BUCKS THEN.

>> YES, $25, IN 2001, IT IS STILL $25, YEAH.

THE EXACT SAME ACT.

>> Braude: SO I WOULD ARGUE THAT BEING A COMEDIAN, I'M NOT ONE THESE DAYS, IS NOT AN EASY LIFT.

THERE IS SNOT THAT MUCH FUNNY TO SAY, I WOULD SAY, ABOUT INFRA VUK TURE AND VACCINES, AM I WRONG?

>> NO, OF COURSE THERE IS SERIOUS SUBJECTS.

BUT THE WHOLE THING WITH POLITICAL SAT TIRE OR COMEDY IN GENERAL IS TAKING SERIOUS THINGS AND MAKING THEM FUNNY.

FOR EXAMPLE THE VACCINE, I AM SO EXCITED THAT WE GOT THE VACCINE.

I THINK MOST OF AMERICA IS.

I CAN'T BELIEVE SOME PEOPLE WON'T TAKE IT I HAVE A FRIEND OF MINE, HE IS A RECOVERING HEROIN ADDICT, HE WON'T TAKE THE VACCINE.

I SAID WHY WON'T YOU TAKE THE VACCINE.

HE HIS EXACT WORDS ARE, YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT IT S IN IT I SAID YOU HAVE BEEN BUYING ILLEGAL DRUGS ON THE STREETS FROM STRANGER, WHAT DO YOU THINK, THAT WAS APPROVEDDED BY DR. FAUCI.

WHAT DO YOU THINK, THERE IS A PICTURE OF THE SURGEON GENERAL ON THE BAG.

I MEAN COME ON.

>> Braude: I GUESS THERE IS HUMOR IN VACCINES.

SO YOU ARE, YOU LIVE TO DO LIVE PERFORMANCES, IT MASS BEEN A LONG TIME, WHAT DO YOU DO FOR THIS 207 MONTHS OR WHATEVER IT HAS BEEN.

WHAT DID YOU DO?

>> WELL, I DID A LOT OF SHOWS ON ZOOM, JIM.

WE BROUGHT THE ORGANIZATION THAT I FOUNDED, HUMOR FOR HUMANITY, TO A NEW LEV AND DID A LOT OF THINGS ON ZOOM, A LOT OF FUNDRAISERS FOR NONPROFLTS, POLITICAL ORGANIZATIONS, THAT KEPT ME REALLY ENGAGED SO THAT WAS A REAL LIFESAVER.

BUT PRIMARILY ON ZOOM AND NOW WITH JUST COMING BACK OUT, WE SARTED IN JUNE AS THINGS STARTED TO OPEN UP AND GOT BACK OUT THERE AND WORKED ON THE CASE AT THE COUTURE CENTER FOR THE ARTS AND THE WHAT THEATER IN WELLESLEY, AND DID SOMETHING UP AT THE GLOUCESTER STAGE COMPANY IN AUGUST.

AND NOW WE'RE GOING TO THE REGENT THEATER AND CELEBRATING 20 YEARS OF WORKING THERE.

AND WE JUST WANT PEOPLE TO COME OUT AND HAVE A GOOD TIME, TOGETHER WITH PEOPLE, IT IT HELPS THE COMMUNITY, IT HELPS THE REGION, IT HELPS ME, IT HELPS EVERYBODY.

SO WE'RE EXCITED TO BE THERE ON THE 27th.

>> 27th, SO WHAT ARE THEY GETTINGK I KNOW THEY ARE GETTING YOU BUT WHAT ARE THEY GETTING, WHAT ARE YOU DOING.

>> WE WILL BE DOING A SHOW ABOUT WHAT HAS BEEN HAPPENING WITH THE PANDEMIC SINCE WE WENT INTO LOCKDOWN.

THE LAST SHOW THAT I DID WAS AT SANDERS THEATER IN 2020.

AND AFTER THAT, WE ARE IN LOCKDOWN.

I DIDN'T TAKE IT THAT I HAVE TO BE CONFESSED, I DIDN'T TAKE THE PANDEMIC THAT SERIOUSLY INITIALLY.

I SAID OH, THIS WILL BLOW OVER T IS NO BIG THING UNTIL TOM HANKS TESTED POSITIVE.

JIM, WHEN TOM HANKS TESTED POSITIVE, I SAID OH MY GOD, I WATCHED FORREST GUMP THREE WEEKS AGO, AM I AT RISK.

AM I AT RISK, CAN THE VIRUS COME THROUGH THE TELEVISION SET AND GET ME, APPARENTLY IT CANNOT.

IT IS REMARKABLE, JIM.

ONE OF THE THINGS HAVE I BEEN DOING IS JUST PAYING ATTENTION TO FOR EXAMPLE THE ESSENTIAL SERVICES, WHAT IS ESSENTIAL AND WHAT ISN'T ESSENTIAL, NATIONALLY T WAS UNBELIEVABLE.

LIQUOR STORES OPENED.

AA MEETINGS, CLOSED.

NATIONALLY, GUN STORES OPEN.

CHURCHES, CLOSED.

THOU SHALL NOT KILL, YES, YOU CAN.

POT SHOTS, JIM, NATIONALLY OPEN, HEALTH CLUBS CLOSED.

>> Braude: OKAY.

>> I MEAN JIM DID YOU FIND IT ODD THAT MARIJUANA WASN'T EVEN LEGAL FIVE YEARS OKAY AND NOW IT IS AN ESSENTIAL SERVICE.

PEOPLE EXPLAINED IT TO ME, THEY SAID JIMMY, LISTEN, PEOPLE ARE LOCKED IN THEIR HOMES WITH THEIR FAMILIES.

THEY NEED DRUGS.

>> Braude: JIMMY TINGLE, YOU MADE MY DAY, WILL YOU MAKE EVERYBODY'S DAY ON NOVEMBER 27th, GOOD LUCK AND I HOPE TO SEE YOU ON THE STREETS AT CAMBRIDGE SOMETIME SOON.

>> I HOPE SEEING YOU AS WELL JIM.

AND THANK YOU FOR HAVING US ON AND THANKERS EVERYBODY FOR SPORGTS THE REGENT THELT THETTER, GOOD FOR THE ECONOMY, TOWN OF ARLINGTON, GOOD FOR THE PARMERS, FILMS AND MUSICIANS THEY PRESENT THERE.

>> Braude: THANK YOU, GOOD IT TO SEE YOU, AGAIN, YOU CAN CATCH HUMOR FOR UN HUMANITY NOVEMBER 27th AT THE REGENT THEATER IN ARLINGTON.

THAT'S IT FOR TONIGHT.

WE'LL BE BACK TOMORROW.

AND ON FRIDAY, A REMINDER AGAIN TO JOIN ADAM REILLY AND TEAM AS THEY DISCUSS THE HISTORIC TRANSITION TO BOSTON'S NEWEST MAYOR, MICHELLE WU, AND THE HIGH HOPES MANY HAVE FOR HER GROUNDBREAKING CLIMATE AGENDA.

AND THEN, PLAN TO TUNE INTO "BOSTON PUBLIC RADIO" WITH MARGERY EAGAN AND ME NEXT TUESDAY FOR OUR VERY FIRST "ASK THE MAYOR" OF THE NEW ADMINISTRATION WHEN MICHELLE WU WILL JOIN US TO TAKE YOUR QUESTIONS.

THAT'S TUESDAY THE 23rd ON GBH RADIO 89.7, AND ONLINE AT www.gbhnews.org.

FOR NOW, THANKS FOR WATCHING, AND STAY SAFE.

Captioned by Media Access Group at WGBH access.wgbh.org