>>> LEGISLATIVE GRIDLOCK IN COLUMBUS.

♪♪ >>> WELCOME TO "COLUMBUS ON THE RECORD."

LEGISLATIVE GRIDLOCK IS NOT CONFINED TO WASHINGTON.

IT'S LOCKING THINGS UP IN COLUMBUS.

REPUBLICANS CONTROL EVERY ASPECT OF STATE GOVERNMENT, BUT LAWMAKING IS MOVING SLOWLY.

ANIMOSITY BETWEEN THE GOVERNOR AND LEGISLATURE, ANIMOSITY AMONG REPUBLICANS IN THE HOUSE, AND A BUDDING RIVALRY BETWEEN THE LEADERS OF THE HOUSE AND SENATE ARE TO BLAME.

THE LATEST EXAMPLE IS A NEARLY $1.5 BILLION SPENDING PACKAGE THAT INCLUDES LOTS OF MONEY FOR SCHOOLS AND PUBLIC WORKS PROJECTS.

THE SENATE HAS PASSED IT, BUT THE HOUSE SPEAKER SAYS HIS CHAMBER WON'T APPROVE IT.

JESSIE BALMERT, WHAT IS GOING ON?

IS THIS JUST A MINOR SQUABBLE, OR IS THIS GOING TO BALLOON INTO FULL-FLEDGED GRIDLOCK DO YOU THINK?

>> WELL, LIKE YOU SAID, IT'S REALLY JUST THE RESULT OF A PAST SPEAKER FIGHT AND THEN A FUTURE SPEAKER FIGHT.

AND YOU KNOW, WE SAW THIS IN WASHINGTON, D.C., IN A SIMILAR CONCEPT HAPPENING HERE IN COLUMBUS.

I THINK EVERYONE IN THE LEGISLATURE WANTS TO GIVE MONEY TO LOCAL PROJECTS THAT LOCAL INDIVIDUALS ARE INTERESTED IN, YOU KNOW, MAKING AND GOING FORWARD ON.

AND SO I'M SURE THIS MONEY WILL EVENTUALLY BE APPROVED, BUT MAYBE AFTER THE PRIMARY.

>> MY QUESTION, THE PRIMARY'S THREE WEEKS AWAY.

WE'RE VOTING NOW.

IS THAT WHAT'S GOING ON HERE?

PEOPLE DON'T WANT TO GIVE AN ADVANTAGE TO -- BECAUSE THERE ARE PRIMARIES AMONG REPUBLICANS IN THE LEGISLATURE.

>> YEAH.

I MEAN, I THINK THAT'S CERTAINLY ONE REASON WHY.

IT'S REALLY THE SENATE HAS BEEN DOING ITS OWN THING, AND THE HOUSE HAS BEEN DOING ITS OWN THING FOR PAST YEAR AND A HALF.

THIS IS PAR FOR THE COURSE.

YOU'RE SEEING IT ON THINGS LIKE MARIJUANA LEGISLATION, SEEING IT ON THINGS LIKE THIS HIGHER ED REFORM BILL.

THERE'S A LOT OF THINGS THAT ARE GETTING GUMMED UP IN THIS GENERAL ASSEMBLY.

>> BOB, ARE THEY DISAGREEING ON POLICY, ARE THERE PHILOSOPHICAL DIFFERENCES?

IS THIS MORE PERSONAL IN POWER PLAYS?

>> IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH IDEALOGY OR PHILOSOPHY.

IT'S ALL ABOUT POWER.

IT'S ABOUT WHO'S GOT THE POWER.

IT'S, YOU KNOW, WHO'S GOING TO BE THE NEW SPEAKER.

THE DEMOCRATS, WE'VE GOT THEM IN SUCH A BAD SITUATION THAT THEY WANT TO BE RELEVANT, AND THEY FOUND A WAY TO BE RELEVANT IN JOINING WITH JASON STEVENS AND 21 OTHER REPUBLICANS, AND THEY WERE ABLE TO ELECT HIM SPEAKER.

THE DEMOCRATS WANT SOME KIND OF POWER, AND THAT'S WHY THEY DID WHAT THEY DID.

EVERYTHING IN POLITICS REVOLVES AROUND WHO'S GOT THE POWER AND HOW ARE THEY GOING USE IT.

>> THE DEMOCRATS HAPPY WITH WHAT'S GOING ON HERE?

>> IT'S ALWAYS FUN TO WATCH MANO A MANO OF REPUBLICANS ON REPUBLICAN CRIME HERE.

THAT'S WHAT'S GOING ON.

IT IS ABOUT POWER, IT'S NOT ABOUT PEOPLE.

WHAT'S HAPPENING NOW IS SENATE PRESIDENT HOFFMAN WHO WANTS TO BE THE NEXT SPEAKER WHEN HE MOVES OVER HAS HIS OWN SLATE OF CANDIDATES, AND THE CURRENT SPEAKER, STEVENS, HAS HIS OWN SLATE OF CANDIDATES.

AND SO THEY'RE PLAYING A GAME TRYING TO PUNISH EACH OTHER BACK AND FORTH.

WHEN IT'S OVER IT WILL PASS.

BUT IT'S REALLY A SHAME THAT WASHINGTON-STYLE POLITICS, WHICH WASN'T ALWAYS THE CASE, HAS COME TO COLUMBUS.

AND THAT'S WHAT'S HAPPENING HERE.

THE REPUBLICAN PARTY IS FRACTURED.

IT IS SPLIT BETWEEN SORT OF MAGA REPUBLICANS AND TRADITIONAL CHAMBER OF COMMERCE REPUBLICANS.

AND THAT PLAYS INTO SOME OF THIS.

>> JESSIE, WHERE'S THE GOVERNMENT IN ALL THIS?

I KNOW HE HAD TWO VETOES OVERRIDDEN RECENTLY.

HE'S HAD HIS DISAGREEMENTS, BUT COULD HE BE A PEACEMAKER HERE?

IS HE GOING TO LET THEM WORK IT OUT?

>> YEAH, I THINK HE'S GOING TO LET THEM WORK IT OUT.

IT DOESN'T PARTICULARLY BENEFIT HIM TO GET IN THE MIDDLE OF THIS FIGHT.

AND THERE'S JUST LIKE NOT A LOT OF WINNERS IN IT.

SO I THINK HE IS GOING TO TRY TO WORK WITH WHOEVER WANTS TO WORK WITH HIM ON THE ISSUES THAT HE IS EXCITED ABOUT.

>> WE HAVE ALL THIS MONEY, THIS SUPER-DUPER FUND, $700 MILLION OF ONETIME MONEY FOR PROJECTS ALL AROUND THE STATE.

>> YEP.

>> THE REGULAR CAPITAL BUDGET COMING.

>> YEP.

>> REPUBLICANS HAVE ALL THE POWER.

YOU'D THINK THEY'D BE BASKING IN IT AND -- >> IT'S ABOUT THE PROCESS.

EVERYBODY'S GOING TO GET THEIR -- I THINK EVERYBODY WILL GET WHAT THEY WANT FOR THEIR DISTRICT IN THE END.

WE GOT TO GO THROUGH THE MECHANICS OF GETTING IT DONE, AND THAT'S PLAYING INTO ALL OF THIS THAT'S GOING ON WITH THE PRIMARY.

>> A BIT LIKE WATCHING TWO DIVORCED PARENTS AT CHRISTMAS TIME AND THEY BOTH ARE BATTLING OVER WHO GIVES THE BIG XBOX GIFT TO THE KIDS.

RIDICULOUS -- >> THE THIRD PERSON IN THAT TRIANGLE WHO BROKE UP THE MARRIAGE.

>> WELL, ALL THE DEMOCRATS' FAULT.

>> I WILL SAY THOSE DEMOCRATS ARE IN THE SUPER MINORITY NOW, AND THE SUREST WAY TO MAKE THEM RELEVANT IS TO GET MORE UNIFIED ON THE GOP SIDE.

>>> LET'S GET TO OUR NEXT TOPIC.

FORMER HOUSE SPEAKER LARRY HOUSEHOLDER AND HIS ATTORNEYS HAVE APPEALED HIS RACKETEERING CONVICTION.

THEY BASICALLY SAY THE JUDGE WAS BIASED AGAINST HOUSEHOLDER AND DID LOTS OF THINGS WRONG AND CLAIM THE PROSECUTION NEVER PROVED THE $60 MILLION HOUSEHOLDER AND HIS ALLIES RECEIVED TO PASS A LAY TO BAIL OUT THE NUCLEAR POWER PLANTS WAS A BRIBE, A QUID PRO QUO.

AS THIS AND OTHER CASES MOVE THROUGH THE HOUSE, ETHICS REFORMS, REMEMBER THEM, AT THE STATE HOUSE HAVE GONE NOWHERE.

JESSIE BALMERT, FIRST TO THE APPEAL.

IT SEEMS THAT HOUSEHOLDER IS THROWING EVERYTHING AGAINST THE WALL HOPING THAT ONE OR TWO THINGS STICK.

>> YEAH, I THINK THAT'S RIGHT.

HE HAS MAINTAINED THAT HE WAS INNOCENT THIS ENTIRE TIME, HAS NEVER REALLY ADMITTED ANY CULPABILITY FOR THIS LARGE PAY-TO-PLAY SCANDAL AT THE OHIO STATE HOUSE.

AND SO IT REALLY COMES AS NO SURPRISE THAT THE APPEAL REFLECTS THAT.

THERE ARE A NUMBER OF THINGS HE'S SAYING THAT THE PROSECUTORS WERE OVERZEALOUS IN THEIR CHARGING, HE'S SAYING THE JUDGE IS BIASED BECAUSE OF RACE THAT HE WAS IN A COUPLE DECADES AGO.

SO WE'LL SEE IF THE SIXTH CIRCUIT TAKES UP WITH THIS OR THE WAY IT WAS HANDLED.

>> DIDN'T PUT ANYTHING IN WRITING, HOUSEHOLDER AND FIRST ENERGY, WHICH OF COURSE NEVER HAPPENS AND IS THE CASE.

BUT THERE WERE NO ENVELOPES STUFFED WITH CASH, THERE WAS NO BRIEFCASE WITH GOLD BARS.

>> NO, ONLY CASH IS, YOU KNOW, CONSUMERS THAT HAVE TO PAY FOR THIS.

>> RIGHT.

HOUSEHOLDER'S ARGUING I WAS FOR REFORMING UTILITIES OR CHANGING THESE -- HELPING THESE POWER PLANTS, AND IT JUST SO HAPPENED THAT HE GOT THIS MONEY FROM FIRST ENERGY.

>> WELL OBVIOUSLY THE LAW, THE.

>> -- THE LAW, THE JUDGE, AND JURY DIDN'T AGREE.

IF HE WERE SMART HE WOULD HAVE CUT HIS DEAL BEFOREHAND, AS WOULD BORGES, THE FORMER REPUBLICAN OF FRANKLIN COUNTY -- OHIO REPUBLICAN PARTY CHIEF.

THEY DIDN'T CUT THEIR DEAL, SO NOW HE'S STUCK AND STEWING IN HIS OWN, YOU KNOW, SOUP THERE.

>> BUT ELECTED OFFICIALS HAVE WON ON APPEAL ON THIS TYPE OF -- IT'S HARDER AND HARDER TO WIN CORRUPTION CASES FOR A PROSECUTOR BECAUSE THERE IS NO SMOKING GUN, NO ENVELOPE WITH CASH.

>> AND I THINK, MIKE, DIDN'T THAT HAPPEN IN VIRGINIA WITH THE GOVERNOR OF VIRGINIA WHERE THAT GOT OVERTURNED.

HEY, I MEAN, HE -- I WAS INVOLVED IN THE LAST WHOLE PRIMARY THING THAT HAPPENED.

WE JUST TALKED ABOUT WHAT'S GOING ON THIS YEAR.

I WAS INVOLVED IN THE ONE IN 2018.

I WAS ON THE SIDE OPPOSITE OF LARRY HOUSEHOLDER.

I SAW THIS GROUP THAT POPPED UP CALLED GENERATION NOW THAT DUMPED ALL THIS MONEY INTO HIS CANDIDATES AGAINST MY CANDIDATES IN THE PRIMARY.

THAT WAS ALL MONEY THAT FIRST ENERGY PROVIDED.

AND THEN WHAT HAPPENS, HE GETS ELECTED SPEAKER, AND THEY PASS HOUSE BILL 6.

THAT'S NOT BRIBERY, COME ON.

>> IS IT JUST HIGH BROW POLITICS, THAT'S WHAT HE'S GOING TO ARGUE.

>> HE SAYS THAT'S JUST THE WAY THINGS ARE DONE.

YOU KNOW WHAT, JUST BECAUSE THOSE THINGS ARE DONE THAT WAY DOESN'T MEAN THEY'RE LEGAL.

THE ONE THING THAT SURPRISED ME ABOUT ALL OF THIS WAS THE FACT THE FEDS ACTUALLY DID SOMETHING.

THEY ACTUALLY BROUGHT CHARGES, THEY ACTUALLY TRIED HIM.

IN A WAY HE IS RIGHT.

A LOT OF THE THINGS THAT WERE DONE WERE THINGS THAT HAVE BEEN DONE FOR A LONG TIME.

>> AND TO THAT POINT, JESSIE, THE REFORM EFFORT HAS STALLED.

THERE'S BEEN REALLY NO MOVEMENT ON IT.

THERE WAS BIG CALLS FOR REFORMS WHEN THIS BROKE WHEN HOUSEHOLDER WAS INDICTED AND WE SAW HIM IN COURT, BUT SINCE THEN, NOTHING REALLY.

>> YEAH.

I WOULD SAY SHORTLY AFTER HIS ARREST THERE WERE BOTH REPUBLICANS AND DEMOCRATS INCLUDING FRANK LaROSE, WHO'S RUNNING FOR U.S. SENATE, SAID LET'S HAVE SOME TRANSPARENCY ON CAMPAIGN FINANCE, PARTICULARLY THESE GROUPS THAT DON'T HAVE TO DISCLOSE THEIR DONORS AT THE FEDERAL LEVEL.

BUT IF THERE'S SOME WAY THAT IF YOU ARE ENGAGING IN A BALLOT ISSUE IN OHIO, THAT PEOPLE WILL KNOW THAT IT'S JUST NOT LIKE CITIZENS FOR BUTTERFLIES AND PUPPIES.

IT'S ACTUALLY A COMPANY THAT WOULD LIKE TO INFLUENCE THE RESULT OF THIS ELECTION.

AND SO BUT REALLY THAT ALL FELL APART IN PART BECAUSE EVERYONE BENEFITS FROM DARK MONEY.

>> SO THERE'S MORE LAYERS TO THIS, TOO.

THE FOLKS FROM FIRST ENERGY, THEY'RE UP, THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE TO DECIDE WHETHER THEY'RE GOING TO TAKE THE PATH OF HOUSEHOLDER AND FIGHT THIS THING, OR THEY'RE GOING TO TALK MORE ABOUT IT.

BUT THE ETHICS REFORM ISSUE -- AND WE WENT THROUGH THE ETHICS REFORMS IN THE '90s OVER THE PANCAKE SCANDAL -- >> YEAH -- >> -- YOU NEED REACT SO THAT THE PUBLIC HAS SOME FAITH IN IT.

AND I THINK RIGHT NOW JUST BETWEEN WASHINGTON AND DONALD TRUMP AND THE STUFF HERE IN OHIO, THERE'S JUST A CYNICAL VOTING PUBLIC THAT THINKS THAT ELECTED OFFICIALS ARE OUT FOR THEMSELVES, NOT FOR THOSE PUBLIC OFFICEHOLDERS.

>> IS IT BECAUSE OF THAT ATTITUDE, BOB, THAT THE PUBLIC IS NOT DEMANDING REFORMS AND LAWMAKERS CAN KEEP THINGS THE WAY THEY ARE?

>> THE PUBLIC'S LOOKING -- LET'S TALK ABOUT LARRY HOUSEHOLDER AND ON THIS WHOLE THING.

THE PUBLIC IS LOOKING AND GOING WAIT A SECOND, HE GOT ARRESTED.

HE WAS BROUGHT TO TRIAL, HE WAS FOUND GUILTY, AND HE'S IN JAIL.

ISN'T THAT THE WAY THE SYSTEM'S SUPPOSED TO WORK?

I DON'T SEE WHERE THEY'RE THINKING, OH, WELL, WE SHOULD TRY TO DO SOMETHING TO PREVENT THIS.

THEY'RE THINKING MORE LIKE, WELL, IF YOU TRY TO DO THAT AGAIN YOU'RE GOING TO GET CAUGHT AND BE THROWN IN JAIL.

>> NOT NECESSARILY UNLESS YOU'RE CAUGHT ON A TAPE LIKE, YOU KNOW, THE TAPES THAT NEIL CLARK HAD.

>> ALL RIGHT.

>>> DONALD TRUMP CAME TO OHIO THIS WEEK TO CAMPAIGN.

DONALD TRUMP JR., THAT IS, ALONG WITH FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE VIVEK RAMASWAMY.

THEY STUMPED FOR DONALD TRUMP SR.'S CHOSEN CANDIDATE, BERNIE MORENO IN HIS BID TO WIN THE REPUBLICAN U.S. SENATE PRIMARY.

THE CLEVELAND BUSINESSMAN FACES STATE SENATOR MATT DOLAN AND FRANK LaROSE FOR A CHANCE TO TAKE ON SHERROD BROWN.

BRIAN ROTHENBERG, EARLY VOTING UNDER WAY, IN PERSON VOTING IS UP, ABSENTEE BALLO REQUESTS ARE A LITTLE DOWN.

WHAT'S THE ENTHUSIASM LEVEL?

>> MOSTLY ON THE REPUBLICAN SIDE BECAUSE OF THE REPUBLICAN PRIMARY THAT IT'S UP.

I THINK THIS ELECTION IS GOING TO BE DOWN FOR DEMOCRATS, UNLESS THEY START ASKING FOR BALLOTS FOR THEIR LOCAL PRIMARIES.

YOU KNOW, LOOK, IT'S ALL ABOUT DONALD TRUMP.

THIS ISN'T ABOUT BERNIE MORENO, IT'S ABOUT DONALD TRUMP.

AND HE WON THE ROSE, HE'S GOT THE ROSE NOW AND NOW HE'S GOT PEOPLE COMING OVER TO HELP HIM OUT.

IT REMAINS TO BE SEEN IS DONALD TRUMP GOING TO CARRY THIS FORWARD.

HE DID WITH VANCE.

SO WE'LL SEE.

>> ANY WORD, BOB, HAS THERE BEEN TALK ABOUT POLLING -- HASN'T BEEN -- VERY LITTLE PUBLIC POLLING, SHOWING WHO MIGHT HAVE AN ADVANTAGE?

>> I HAVEN'T HEARD ANYTHING.

I FIND IT INTERESTING, WE REALLY HAVEN'T HAD HARDLY ANY -- I THINK WE'VE HAD MAYBE ONE POLL SINCE PRESIDENT TRUMP DID HIS ENDORSEMENT, AND IT SHOWED THAT MORENO, WHO HAD BEEN IN THIRD PLACE, HAD JUMPED ALL THE WAY TO FIRST.

BUT I THINK HE WAS ONLY UP BY A POINT OR TWO OVER FRANK LaROSE.

>> BASICALLY TIED.

>> YOU KNOW, BUT WE'VE HAD MORE TIME.

AND MORE MONEY BEING SPENT BY BERNIE MORENO.

YOU'VE SEEN HIS AD ON TV, IT'S -- DONALD TRUMP, DONALD TRUMP, DONALD TRUMP, BERNIE MORENO.

YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN?

I MEAN, SMART.

>> WHEN YOU GET TO A GENERAL ELECTION, IF HE WINS, IF TRUMP GETS INDICTED WHICH IT SHOWS THAT SOME INDEPENDENTS AND OTHERS ARE GOING TO PEEL OFF, THEN HOW IS HE GOING TO SHED THE ROSE?

>> HE'S GOING TO WIN OHIO BY OVER TEN POINTS.

SO THE PROBLEM SHERROD BROWN'S GOT IS HOW CAN HE TAKE THAT ANCHOR OFF HIS NECK CALLED JOE BIDEN.

>> IF WILL BE DIFFERENT IF HE GETS CONVICTED -- >> COME ON.

THAT'S DREAMING.

>> ALL THREE CANDIDATE LAST WEEK, QUICKLY, DONALD TRUMP DID, AS WELL, THE FORMER PRESIDENT, SAID THEY SUPPORT IN VITRO FERTILIZATION.

SO THAT KIND OF -- DOES THAT TAKE THE ISSUE OFF THE TABLE FOR THIS RACE ANYWAY?

BECAUSE THE ABORTION ISSUE IS SORT OF IN THE BACKGROUND OF THIS RACE AND HEADING INTO NOVEMBER.

>> I SUPPOSE THEM HAVING A SIMILAR POSITION ON THE ISSUE, IT'S HARD TO PARSE THE DIFFERENCES.

CERTAINLY STATE SENATOR MATT DOLAN HAS TAKEN SOME VOTES ON THIS THAT ARE MORE MODERATE THAN REPUBLICANS MIGHT LIKE ON SOME OF THEM.

AND THEN I MEAN, I GUESS WE'LL SEE.

THIS ISSUE WILL COME UP IN THE NOVEMBER ELECTION PROBABLY MORE THAN THE MARCH ONE.

>> YOU DON'T EXPECT ANY MARCH SURPRISES HERE IN THE LAST THREE WEEKS?

JUST MORE ADS OF DONALD TRUMP ENDORSING BERNIE MORENO?

>> I'D BE SURPRISED.

YOU MIGHT SEE TRUMP COME HERE ONCE.

BUT I DON'T EVEN -- WE'RE NOT A PRIORITY STATE ANYMORE.

AND -- >> YEAH.

>> HE'LL BE UP IN MICHIGAN, IN ARIZONA, THAT'S WHERE ALL THE FIGHTING'S GOING TO BE.

>> YEAH.

I THINK HE'LL PROBABLY WRAP IT UP BY THE TIME WE GET TO OHIO.

>> SUPER TUESDAY IS THIS COMING WEEK.

>> YEAH.

I THINK HE'S GOING TO SWEEP THAT PRETTY HANDILY.

SO WE MAY OR MAY NOT EVEN BE RELEVANT ON THAT RACE.

>> DOES MORENO NEED DONALD TRUMP SR. TO COME TO OHIO FOR ONE RALLY TO SEAL THE DEAL?

>> I DON'T THINK HE DOES.

I MEAN, I THINK THE ENDORSEMENT -- WE SAW WHAT HAPPENED LAST TIME WITH J.D.

VANCE, AND I MEAN IT'S A PRETTY POWERFUL ENDORSEMENT.

>> YEAH.

>> DONALD TRUMP DID COME IN THE LATE DAYS OF THAT CAMPAIGN TO RALLY WITH J.D.

VANCE.

>> ONE THING IS CLEAR ABOUT THIS WHOLE ELECTION, IT'S ALL ABOUT DONALD TRUMP.

IT'S NOT ABOUT OHIOANS, NOT ABOUT OHIO ISSUES, IT'S NOT ABOUT OHIO VOTERS AND THEIR NEEDS.

EVERYTHING'S GOING TO BE ABOUT DONALD TRUMP.

>> WHICH IS GOING TO BE A PROBLEM FOR SHERROD BROWN.

>> NOT IF HE'S CONVICTED.

>> PERHAPS THE MOST INTERESTING PRIMARY THIS YEAR IS IN NORTHWEST OHIO.

IT IS THE REPUBLICAN FIGHT TO TAKE ON LONGTIME CONGRESSWOMAN MARCY KAPTUR.

FOUR REPUBLICANS ARE VYING FOR THE OPPORTUNITY.

THEY ARE FORMER NAPOLEON MERRITT STEVE LANKENAU, J.R. MAJEWSKI WHO LOST TO KAPTUR TWO YEARS AGO, STATE REP DERRICK MERRIN WHO NEARLY BECAME HOUSE SPEAKER, AND FORMER STATE REP MIKE THOMPSON -- AND THE FEARS BECAME A PANIC A FEW WEEKS AGO WHEN APPEARING ON A PODCAST MAJEWSKI CALLED SPECIAL OLYMPICS ATHLETES EFFING "R" WORDS.

BOB CLEGG, YOU ARE A TOLEDO AREA NATIVE.

>> YES, I AM.

>> HOW WORRIED ARE MAINSTREAM REPUBLICANS THAT MAJEWSKI WINS?

>> I THINK THEY WENT OUT AND GOT DERRICK MERRIN TO RUN FOR THAT VERY REASON BECAUSE THEY DON'T WANT J.R. MAJEWSKI TO BE THE NOMINEE.

JUST A PERSONAL NOTE, I WAS THE -- POLITICAL DIRECTOR FOR THE LAST REPUBLICAN CONGRESSMAN IN NORTHWEST OHIO WHO IS THE ONLY ONE AND ONLY SERVED TWO YEARS, IN MY LIFETIME, AND MARCY KAPTUR RAN AGAINST AND SHE WON.

THE DIFFERENCE -- THIS IS MARCY'S PROBLEM WITH WHAT'S BEEN GOING ON, THAT DISTRICT, WHEN SHE RAN THE FIRST TIME, WAS 85% LUCAS COUNTY.

NOW BECAUSE OF POPULATION DECLINE IT'S 55%.

AND THAT PART OF LUCAS IS EVEN GETTING MORE REPUBLICAN, LESS DEMOCRAT.

EVENTUALLY SHE WILL LOSE.

I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S GOING TO BE THIS YEAR, THOUGH.

>> I MEAN, SHE'S A FORCE.

SHE -- AND SHE'S NOT A TRADITIONAL DEMOCRAT.

BACK IN THE PEROT YEARS, PEROT EVEN WAS TALKING ABOUT MAKING HER A VICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE BECAUSE OF HER -- AND ALWAYS HAD THAT SORT OF STRONG BLUE-COLLAR MEN LABOR SORT OF SUPPORT.

AND THAT TRANSLATES EVEN DOWN IN THE LIME AREA AND OTHER AREAS -- LIMA AREA AND OTHER AREAS OF THE STATE.

YOU KNOW, SHE'S JUST A VERY FORMIDABLE PERSON TO RUN AGAINST, AND THAT IS WHY SHE HAS BEEN IN CONGRESS AND IS THE DEAN OF ALL WOMEN IN CONGRESS.

>> THIS MAJEWSKI'S COMMENTS, JESSIE, HAVE BECOME ISSUES IN OTHER CAMPAIGNS.

PEOPLE -- J.D.

VANCE HAS ENDORSED J.R. MAJEWSKI IN OHIO.

OTHER CANDIDATE ARE BEING ASKED WHAT THEY THINK OF HIS COMMENTS ABOUT THE SPECIAL OLYMPIC ATHLETES.

AND REPUBLICANS DON'T HAVE AN ANSWER FOR IT.

>> YEAH.

SO STATE SENATOR MATT DOLAN WHO'S RUNNING FOR U.S. SENATE HAS COME OUT AND, YOU KNOW, CONDEMNED THE COMMENTS.

I DON'T BELIEVE AS OF TAPING THAT THE OTHER TWO SENATE CANDIDATES HAVE DONE SO.

YOU ALREADY HAD MORENO WHO INITIALLY WAS ENDORSING CRAIG RIEDEL WHO SWAPPED FROM HIM AFTER SOME COMMENTS NEGATIVE TO TRUMP CAME OUT, AND THEN HE SWAPPED TO MAJEWSKI.

WE'LL SEE IF THAT SWAPPING CONTINUES.

>> BUT THIS IS THE KIND OF PROBLEM THAT'S GOING AROUND THE COUNTRY LIKE THIS -- I DON'T KNOW IF YOU NOTICED, BUT THERE'S A MISSOURI CANDIDATE RUNNING FOR GOVERNOR THAT JUST WAS FOUND TO BE IN A PICTURE WITH THE KKK.

I MEAN, THE REPUBLICAN PARTY HAS THIS REALLY REACTIONARY, STRONG RIGHT PROBLEM RIGHT NOW, AND IT'S GOING TO COST THEM.

>> AND THE DEMOCRAT PARTY'S GOT THAT ANTI-SEMITIC PROBLEM THAT THE WAR IN ISRAEL AND PALESTINE IS -- >> I DON'T THINK THAT'S A FAIR STATEMENT -- >> IT IS -- >> YOU SAW THE FAR RIGHT AND FAR LEFT, BUT GETTING TO THE DERRICK MERRIN AND CRAIG RIEDEL, ARE THEY GOING TO SUPPLEMENT THE CONVENTIONAL VOTE?

>> THAT'S -- SPLIT THE CONVENTION AT VOTE?

>> THAT'S WHAT HAPPENED TWO YEARS AGO.

TERESA GAVARONE, STATE SENATOR, RUNNING AND THEY SPLIT.

IT THAT'S HOW MAJEWSKI GOT THE NOMINATION.

AND NOW WE EVEN HAVE A FOURTH PERSON THAT COULD EVEN SPLIT IT MORE.

THAT'S GOING TO BE THE ONLY WAY HE'S GOING TO HAVE A CHANCE OF WINNING THAT NOMINATION.

>> THERE'S A REASON WHY MANY PEOPLE ARE GRAVITATING TO A PERSON LIKE J.R. MAJEWSKI OR DONALD TRUMP, BRIAN, IT'S THEY FEEL DISENFRANCHISED, THEY FEEL BOTH PARTIES HAVE LEFT THEM BEHIND.

IS THAT HAPPENING IN NORTHWEST OHIO?

>> I DO THINK THERE'S A FINITE AMOUNT OF PEOPLE THAT THAT HAPPENS WITH, AND I DO THINK THAT PART OF THE PROBLEM IS DONALD TRUMP HAS MADE IT SOMETHING NO POLITICIAN WOULD EVER TALK ABOUT AGAIN BECAUSE OF THINGS LIKE WHAT HE DID IN CHARLOTTESVILLE.

ALL THE SUDDEN IT'S OKAY TO BE OUTRAGEOUS AND SAY RIDICULOUS THINGS.

I DON'T THINK THE MAJORITY OF VOTERS ARE GOING TO GO FOR IT.

I THINK INDEPENDENTS ARE GOING TO PLAY A BIG ROLE EVEN IN THAT DISTRICT.

>> WHAT'S HAPPENING IN OHIO AND ACROSS THE COUNTRY IS THAT THESE BLUE COLLAR WORKING CLASS AREAS AROUND TOLEDO AND YOUNGSTOWN AND CLEVELAND ARE BECOMING REPUBLICAN.

AND THAT'S BECOMING THE REPUBLICAN BASE.

THE DEMOCRATS THAT USED TO HAVE THAT NOW HAVE THE WEALTHIER WHITE, LIBERAL BASE.

SO IT'S ALMOST LIKE THEY'VE SWITCHED BASES FROM WHAT IT WAS MAYBE 40, 50 YEARS AGO.

>> YEAH.

THE QUESTION IS, IS IT PERMANENT?

THAT'S A TRUMP THING, AND THE REAL QUESTION IS, YOU KNOW, SHERROD BROWN AND MARCY KAPTUR HAVE ALWAYS DONE WELL WITH THOSE FOLKS.

DO THEY PEEL OFF ENOUGH?

>> JESSIE, THIS DISTRICT COULD BE A PREVIEW OF WHAT COULD LIE AHEAD IN OHIO -- IT'S A VERY COMPETITIVE DISTRICT.

TRUMP WOULD HAVE WON THE DISTRICT BY THREE POINTS IN 2020.

IF REDISTRICTING REFORM GETS ON THE BALLOT AND IF VOTERS OKAY IT, WE'RE GOING TO HAVE MORE DISTRICTS LIKE THIS THAT ARE MORE OR LESS TOSS-UPS.

>> YEAH.

IT WILL BE INTERESTING TO SEE.

THIS DISTRICT IS CERTAINLY LESS DEMOCRATIC THAN MARCY KAPTUR'S PREVIOUS DISTRICT WHICH SWAPPED TO CLEVELAND, THE INFAMOUS SNAKE ON THE LAKE.

SO THIS IS A RACE THAT REPUBLICANS COULD BE COMPETITIVE IN IF THEY HAVE THE RIGHT CANDIDATE.

BUT THE LAST TIME THEY DIDN'T.

SO WE'LL SEE IF THEY LEARN FROM THAT MISTAK.

>>> SINCE THE 1960s AND '70s THE TRANSPORTATION STRATEGY FOR DOWNTOWN COLUMBUS HAS BEEN GET WORKERS AND THEIR CARS IN AND OUT AS FAST AND AS EASY AS POSSIBLE.

THUS, THE MULTITUDE OF ONE-LANE, MULTILANE BOULEVARDS.

THAT THINKING IS CHANGING, AND THIS WEEK THE CITY ANNOUNCED A HUGE PROJECT TO BREAK UP SOME OF THOSE MINI HIGHWAYS.

THE CAPITAL LINE TRAIL WOULD CREATE A TWO-MILE BIKE AND PEDESTRIAN PATH THAT WOULD ENCIRCLE THE HEART OF DOWNTOWN.

IT WOULD REPLACE CAR LANES WITH BIKE LANES AND WIDER SIDEWALKS, SEPARATED IN SOME CASES BY TREE LINES.

THE $100 MILLION COST WOULD BE SHARED BETWEEN PUBLIC AND PRIVATE ENTITIES.

BRIAN ROTHENBERG, YOU USED TO LIVE IN THE DETROIT AREA.

THERE'S THE JOE LEWIS GREENWAY, A BIKE PATH THAT CIRCLES DETROIT.

>> IT IS.

THAT'S PARTIALLY BECAUSE OUR CITIES ARE BECOMING MUCH MORE RESIDENTIAL.

EVEN HERE IN COLUMBUS, NOT ONLY THE NEW BUILDING THEY'VE BUILT BUT SOME OF THE OLD BUILDINGS WE USED TO VISIT PEOPLE IN IN BUSINESS MEETINGS ARE HOMES.

IT MAKES MORE SENSE TO DO THAT THAT WAY, AND IT'S PROBABLY WHERE CITIES ARE GOING.

BECAUSE YOU CAN DO SO MUCH THERE HOME.

YOU CAN WORK FROM YOUR CAR.

>> THE BIKE LANE ON SUMMIT AVENUE CAUSED A MINI FIRESTORM.

MAYBE IT'S STILL BURNING IN THE SORT OF THE UNIVERSITY DISTRICT, CLINTONVILLE AREA, PARK AREA.

THIS IS GOING TO BE DOWNTOWN, WHAT KIND OF FIRESTORM IS THIS GOING TO HAVE?

IF YOU LOSE PARKING SPACES OR TRAFFIC'S TIGHTERING GETTING OUT OF TOWN?

>> I THINK THEY HAVE ALREADY SAID PART OF THE REASON WHY THEY'RE DOING THIS IS THE WHOLE FACE OF DOWNTOWN IS CHANGING.

I MEAN, WE DON'T HAVE THE PEOPLE COMING DOWNTOWN ANYMORE FOR BUSINESS OR FOR OFFICES OR FOR WORK.

AND YOU HAVE MUCH LESS TRAFFIC.

SO WHAT YOU'RE SEEING IS THESE PARKING LOTS ARE TURNING INTO LAND WHERE BUILDINGS ARE -- APARTMENT BUILDINGS ARE BEING BUILT, AND LIKE GAY STREET.

THEY'RE GOING TO LEAVE ENOUGH TO DO TWO LANES, ONE GOING EITHER -- YOU KNOW WHAT, I THINK IT'S GOING TO BE MORE THAN ENOUGH BECAUSE WE JUST DON'T HAVE THAT MUCH TRAFFIC DOWNTOWN ANYMORE.

>> OUTDOOR DINING REALLY WAS KIND OF POPULAR, BUT COVID CAME, AND EVERYONE WANTED TO EAT OUTSIDE.

AND NOW IT'S -- SIDEWALKS THAT WANT THESE RESTAURANTS OUT BY SIDEWALKS NOW.

>> YEAH.

I MEAN, I THINK IT WILL BE AN INTERESTING CONCEPT AND WE'LL SEE HOW IT PLAYS OUT.

I GREW UP IN THE COLUMBUS, BUT I'VE VISITED CINCINNATI AND CLEVELAND, AND A LOT OF THEIR DOWNTOWN SCENES ARE -- THERE'S MORE LIFE TO IT FROM TIME TO TIME.

MORE CENTRAL.

WE'RE LIKE THE CENTRAL POINTS OF THOSE CITIES ARE.

SO PERHAPS THIS ADD AN ELEMENT OF THAT FOR COLUMBUS.

>> WILL IT WORK?

WILL IT SPUR DEVELOPMENT AND BRING PEOPLE DOWNTOWN?

>> I DO THINK IT WORKED, AND IT'S WORKING IN SOME WAYS IN DETROIT.

IT GOT SLOWED DOWN BY THE -- COVID, BUT GRADUALLY IT'S STARTING TO CHANGE.

YOU KNOW, DAN GILBERT, OWNER OF THE CAVALIERS, HAS BEEN DOING A LOT OF THAT WORK IN DETROIT.

BUT IT IS STARTING TO SHIFT SOME OF THE DOWNTOWN INFRASTRUCTURE.

>> WE DON'T KNOW EXACTLY WHAT THE HOUSE -- HOW IT'S GOING TO BREAK DOWN, PUBLIC MONEY, PRIVATE MONEY.

WHAT SHOULD BE THE RATIO, BOB?

THIS SOUNDS LIKE A PUBLIC PROJECT, SIDEWALKS AND ROAD.

>> YOU KNOW ME.

I THINK PRIVATE MONEY SHOULD BE THE VAST MAJORITY HERE.

NOW I THINK THE STATE IS GOING TO DROP IN $10 MILLION WHICH I THINK IS GREAT.

I'M OKAY WITH THAT.

BUT I WONDER IF, YOU KNOW, IN DOING THIS THEY'RE GOING TO HELP A LOT OF BUSINESSES ON GAY STREET, 4th, ALL THAT.

AND YOU KNOW, IS THE CITY GOING TRY TO DO ASSESSMENTS TO PROPERTY OWNERS?

>> ACTIVITY -- >> YOU KNOW, YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE A MAINTENANCE ISSUE WITH ALL OF THIS, TOO.

YOU KNOW, ONCE IT IS BUILT.

SO MAYBE THEY COULD GO DOWN THAT ROAD.

>> MINNESOTA WHEN THEY BUILT THE LIGHT RAIL, THE BUSINESSES THAT BENEFITED ALONG THE RAIL LINE, THEY HAVE TO PAY MORE IN TAXES.

THEY BENEFIT FROM THE TRAFFIC.

>>> ALL RIGHT.

TIME FOR OUR WEEKLY "OFF-THE-RECORD" PARTING SHOTS.

BRIAN ROTHENBERG, YOU GO FIRST.

>> THE MAJOR ISSUE THIS FALL IS GOING TO BE GETTING AFRICAN AMERICAN MALES OUT TO VOTE.

IT'S NOT -- NOT VOTE SHIFTING, IT GETTING THEM TO VOTE AND FINDING THEM WHERE THEY'RE AT.

BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT ALL JUST IN THE CITY ANYMORE, AND SO THIS IS GOING TO BE A MAJOR ISSUE FOR DEMOCRATS.

>> BOB?

>> I'M GOING TO TELL YOU SOMETHING YOU ALREADY KNOW, MIKE, BUT I'M GOING TO SAY IT ANYWAYS.

MARCH 4th IS NATIONAL SNACK DAY.

AND HUB SCORE WENT OUT AND DID A NATIONWIDE SURVEY TO FIND THE MOST POPULAR SNACK IN EVERY 50 STATES -- ALL 50 STATES.

NUMBER ONE WAS RICE KRISPIE TREATS IN 18 STATES.

NUMBER TWO WAS DORITOS IN 16 STATES, INCLUDING OHIO.

I AGREE WITH THAT.

>> DORITOS IN OHIO.

>> YES.

DORITOS IN OHIO.

>> THAT'S SURPRISING.

>> YEAH.

>> FOR SOME REASON.

JESSIE?

>> SO THE GROUP THAT'S TRYING TO MAKE A CHANGE TO HOW REDISTRICTING IS DONE IS GOING TO HAVE AN EVENT WITH FORMER GOVERNOR SCHWARZENEGGER TO TERMINATE GERRYMANDERING.

AND IF YOU'LL RECALL THE LAST TIME THE GOVERNOR CAME AND TOOK SOME SHOTS OF SCHNAPPS WITH GOVERNOR KASICH WHEN THE LAST REDISTRICTING PROPOSAL PASSED.

>> HE'LL BE BACK, AS HE SAID.

MY COMMENT IS WOSU ON MONDAY LAUNCHES A MY PODCAST, "UNTANGLED" WILL TAKE A COMPLICATED TOPIC AND UNTANGLE IT.

THIS SEASON WE'LL LOOK AT THE CENTRAL OHIO HOUSING CRISIS.

YOUNG PEOPLE CAN'T FIND HOUSES THEY COULD AFFORD, BABY-BOOMERS FIND THEMSELVES PRICED OUT BY RISING PROPERTY TAXES.

HOSTED BY WOSU'S ANNA STAVER.

AVAILABLE WHENEVER YOU GET YOUR PODCASTS.

IT'S ON LEY MONDAYS AT 11:00 ON ALL SIDE WITH ANNA STAVER ON NPR NEWS.

CHECK IT OUT.

>>> THAT IS "COLUMBUS ON THE RECORD" FOR THIS WEEK.

CONTINUE THE CONVERSATION ON FACEBOOK, AND YOU CAN WATCH US ANY TIME AT WOSU.ORG, ON YOUTUBE, AND THE PBS VIDEO APP.

FOR THE CREW AND PANEL, I'M MIKE THOMPSON.

HAVE A GOOD WEEK.

♪♪